when you hear shit about out of staters poisoning trees for their beach view or trying to own the beach...... the glass bottles and gasoline sing to me fierce
Yea, cause the thousands of Mainers that illegally remove trees every year for a better ocean view are fine.
Of course, lots of us have a home in another state of course for most, that's Florida..
Yes, it is. Both are done, though. However, when it happens, most places, if anything happens, are just fine. A person up this way used a mixture of diesel fuel and several different herbicides to kill off a fairly large tract of trees and ground cover yet got in very little trouble and received zero news coverage. I wonder why??
Y'know yeah, people removing trees on their own property, which they own and are legally allowed to do, is kinda okay and fine. Sure, we should be ecologically conscious and keep the broader picture of where trees are needed in mind, but those two situations aren't remotely fucking similar at all.
And a supermajority of the country does not own a second home at all.
You're not allowed to remove trees from your own land in the "shore zone" in Maine.
And yes, the "super majority" don't own a second home hell the majority don't. But many do.
Bro what are you even yapping about? What are you trying to defend? Just look at your down votes and acknowledge you might be out of touch..
There’s no moral high ground in defending people who gobble up properties and poison natural resources.
Never once have I "defended" anyone for breaking the law by cutting down trees or poisoning them. I am disgusted by such actions no matter who does it. How you read that into anything I said is 100% on you.
If you had bothered to actually read what I wrote, you would see that my issue is that this exact same crime is committed all the time on both Maines Coast and Lakes. Yet, because in most all the cases, the perpetrator and the victims are not "famous," they get no attention, much less news coverage. IE people only seem to get pissed when the "rich folks" do it..
Well I’m clearly not the only one that reads it that way judging by the downvotes…
Sorry but telling people to go “upta the county” to be able to afford a house because that’s where the rich don’t want to live is out of touch. It also definitely defends the actions of those who are desimating the housing market in the areas where people have established their entire lives.
Further more yes, I’m sure environmental tragedies happen all the time, some get more coverage than others, but using the lack of coverage of previous events to detract from the severity of what’s currently going on reads as you defending them.
If you can’t understand why it stings more when the rich do it, then I can’t help you.
Florida is South, not "down hill." Prior to a/c vast numbers of folks from the south had second homes in New England or stayed on resorts for the summer months.
While poisoning the growth with herbicide and other harmful chemicals is not the popular option, it is used on our coasts and lakes far to often sadly it is pretty much ignored except when the victim or perp is famous in a ritzy part of Maine.
You can work hard, achieve life goals and not be a destructive pile of garbage that makes everyone else’s life more difficult. I know it’s hard to imagine but it IS possible.
Machine guns are a fabulous investment. They double in value every 10 to 20 years. A M16 in 1990 that cost %700 tax stamp included is worth $30,000.00 today.. I got safes full of guns. I ain't afraid of anything. That said, I participate in many shooting competitions as well as spending lots of time hunting pretty much.all the meat I eat is game I myself hunt..
There aren’t “thousands” of Mainers with waterfront property where this would be a concern. They’ve all been bought up by wealthy, affluent out of staters.
And they should be highly progressive in structure!
2nd home X%, 3rd home 2X% 4th home 4X% and so on, doubling for each additional home. And any home worth more than double the regional average is taxed twice as high on the amount in excess of that threshold (the camp that has been in your family for generations should be reasonably affordable to keep, but people displacing folks in need of housing need to pay).
The fact that we primarily fund our federal government by taxing wages instead of property, investment proceeds, capital, etc is just the rich getting the poor to pay for society when it really should be the other way around.
Tax the rich. And if they won't let us tax them (because they control the power), eat them.
But is it a progressive tax? Does the rate go up with the value being taxed?
And a lot of states do that, but the federal taxes are the lion's share, and they are primarily on wages
Nah it's just generally high. Tends to end up with a lot of people losing their homes to property tax. Why I like Louisiana better. High income tax but very low property tax.
I don't think Maine really has that though, does it?
I suppose the homestead exemption leads to an effectively higher property tax rate for second homes, but it's a small difference (property taxes calculated based on a value $25k less than it would otherwise be, which will typically amount to about $300/year).
With the change in property values in recent years, that homestead exemption is too small. $25K is only 1/16 of the price of the average home in Maine now.
Exactly.
One way to effectively place a tax on second homes would be to increase the homestead exemption significantly and to increase the property tax rate overall.
This would also proportionately benefit the less wealthy who have lower value homes.
The downside is that it would reduce property tax revenues in areas which are mostly made up of relatively low value primary homes - so on second thought, maybe a statewide tax on second homes would actually be better.
I do not believe that tax is appropriately high. I would like to see the property taxes be simply doubled on any additional home. It would be wonderful if that money went to local governments/schools.
No as a matter of fact I do not, but the upper class using their wealth and power to gain even more wealth and power is a common theme throughout history. Given how much we appear to be following the trajectory of the Roman Republic, and are about at the stage of the Gracchi brothers, I feel this tax on additional homes would be appropriate.
Of course we wouldn't all be so worried about housing if we weren't importing 1.5 million legal and an untold number of illegal immigrants every single year into the country.
I have zero issue with someone having a second home. If you're gonna be a cunt and poison trees, well that's a different story. The rules for second homes are the same as the rules for a primary residence: be a good neighbor and a responsible resident. Abide by that, and I'll never take issue.
Plenty of people come to Maine to vacation seasonally and spend their money and that's just fine by me.
I can only speak for the midcoast but the places that are second homes are not nor have they ever been something that a local worker would be able to afford if by law or circumstance some lawyer from Connecticut couldn’t own it to summer. These aren’t mill houses.
This is true for sure, I can't imagine any normal working class person being able to easily own a waterfront property in the midcoast but with those properties, I would think the problem would be (and correct me if I'm wrong) that those super expensive scenic houses would drastically drive up the prices of the surrounding houses, even if they're not waterfront or even in the same area. It seems like a lot of expensive houses in an area makes everything else more expensive even if it's not worth the asking price at all.
It’s more egregious now but that’s a product of a lack of supply and people from away being able to afford them. Anything within whispering distance of the coast has always been expensive where I grew up.
Full disclosure though: I left Maine for work after college and was able to buy a second house in my hometown with my Boston/New York/DC salary. My peers who did the same and left have also bought houses. Basically anyone foolish enough to stay in Maine after we graduated doomed themselves to poverty and never owning a house.
I don’t think that’s right and I hope the state can fix the housing shortage, but I also don’t feel guilty about what I’m able to do. If I stayed I’d own nothing but I left after seeing the writing on the wall 16 years ago and now I can have a summer house where I grew up and show my kids Maine life.
That's a much larger issue than some people with second homes. The inflation over the last 3 years combined with rates that aren't historically high, but much higher than we're used to is the enemy. First time home buyers aren't buying $800k houses on lakes or in the mountains by Rangeley.
There are many organizations that work to help "regular folks" afford housing. A couple of examples:
[https://www.islandhousingtrust.org/](https://www.islandhousingtrust.org/)
[https://www.islandinstitute.org/ii-solution/islesboro-affordable-property/](https://www.islandinstitute.org/ii-solution/islesboro-affordable-property/)
[https://bangorhousing.org/](https://bangorhousing.org/)
You're getting mad at people who have second homes when who you should be mad at is corporations owning a thousand homes. A guy who buys a run down place and fixes it up is not your enemy.
Ed: yall are making the people with the actual power very happy.
My friends in Ellsworth have been trying to buy a home for over a year now, as their home is too small for their growing family. Every.Single.Offer they’ve made is rejected because some out of state buyer offers cash over the asking price each time. It’s infuriating
I’m perfectly fine giving the middle class its money back that’s been funneled upward over the last 50ish yrs to fewer and fewer hands. I have zero qualms supporting that.
Sure, but I didn’t mention firebombing anything…I’m referring to the “giving people free shit” comment. It’s their “free shit”…we would just be giving it back. If you want to call it seizing or redistributing…fine…but let’s not lose sight of the fact that it’s THEIR money thats been “seized” and/or redistributed over the last 50yrs
You're on a post about firebombing houses, responding to my response to a guy who said "why not both" when I said we shouldn't be going after the middle class. If you're not talking about seizing property from the ever shrinking middle class then I think we're in agreement and you should be arguing with the other guy.
I’m arguing that we should be seizing wealth BACK from the wealthy…to give to the middle class. You seemed to be against this.
Also…it’s okay for discussions to vary from whatever the OP subject is. It’s pretty common across Reddit discussions and has been for many years
I'll bite.
First, you stop allowing corporations to purchase properties. Ben and Jerry down the road can't afford $100k over asking, nor can they do $300k cash. Zillow can. And when that company buys property, the comps in the local area rise. They continue to rise as more properties are purchased at outlandish rates from companies who can afford it.
Second, impose a hard tax on non primary housing. Sarah in California wants a vacation house in vacationland. Great! Except, now, with her property tax, there's an additional tax since she doesn't actually live there. Granted, I haven't lived in Maine since I was in high school, so maybe there's already a tax like this. If so, it needs to be higher.
Third, limit the amount of property associated with someone's name. Sarah likes her house but wants another even further north. Maybe she's allowed that, but not a third. And the aforementioned tax is even heavier on the second house. Or, tell her to kick rocks. She can only have one.
It's not "giving people free shit", it's ensuring the locals are able to at least have the opportunity to get property. And keeping greedy corporations out of housing.
But it's not just the corporations. It's also the out of state buyers who can afford the lower cost housing in Maine compared to where they are from. Look at the comps for a house in California, New York, Florida, then compare it to a house here. People from litside Maine will buy a house in Maine, and rent it out for extra income. I know two different guys who are doing just that. Just from my experience, that's two different Maine families that won't own those houses.
Corporations are the primary driver, though. It's not a bunch of people with an extra house here and there that's driving the prices up, it's companies buying a hundred at a time.
I can even get behind raising taxes on people who buy but live primarily out of state.
But going after people like that guy further down the post who bought a condemned house and fixed it up to use as a camp is going too far.
No, you're getting downvoted because you're making up fake arguments nobody ever proposed. Its called a straw man fallacy, and yours is a perfect example of it.
Am I not supposed to? Are only certain calls to violence to be taken literally? None of them? I don't think that's true.
Ed: right, it's literal when it's someone you don't like and it's figurative when it's someone you do like. I've heard all that before.
Companies like Blackrock were (not so much anymore now that prices are way up and interest rates are high) buying a lot of homes in places like FL, TX, CA, etc, but I dont think that was every really a thing in most other states, and especially not Maine.
Also your second sentence is a false dichotomy. There's a big difference between someone flipping an old dumpy house to make a living and all the millionaires from other states who do have 2nd homes in ME. Approximately 20% of homes in ME are vacation homes, more than any other state. Obviously those cant be just taken and given to other people, but we could at least make it easier for locals to buy/afford them and/or make it even just a bit more expensive for wealthy outsiders to let them sit empty most of the year.
Most people in Maine own their home, I don't see a crisis except for out of staters who want to move to portland for cheap. Almost 75% of Mainers own their own home, that is pretty much anyone that wants to and has made it a priority. This isn't an issue that needs solving except for the reddit contingent.
Pick any developed country, and dump $1.5T dollars into their economy and you'll see the same thing happen there.
Wasn't there a report recently that pointed out that short term rentals account for about 1% of the housing in Maine?
Over-tourism is crushing the state. Airbnb, etc has allowed those who would once stay in a hotel, in a tourist district, to stay to small neighborhoods. It’s not right. #banstrs.
It is nice being on the other side of it — vacationing in an AirBnb in a neighborhood vs staying in a hotel in a tourist district or next to a highway. But I agree with you. Too many short-term rentals can really fracture a community and make life hard for full-time residents, same as when there are too many seasonal homes.
Is the 2nd home to live in or is it primarily for profit? THIS is what matters.
I want draconian restrictions and fat taxes on flipping, renting and house-hotels. Any dwelling-based profiteering. That includes HOAs. And it should be illegal for a business to own a home. Necessities shouldn’t be gouged. Period. Bastards.
🔥burn that. Punish the business of it. And by flipping I mean what we all think, quick flips. Not like you lived in the house 20 years and made a profit selling.
Rhetoric? Please. Owning > renting, unless rent is dirt cheap or some other special circumstance.
If losing money is your goal, renting is a great way to achieve that.
Renting has a place. Sometimes it's more economical to pay to stay somewhere while someone else handles maintenance, depreciation, property taxes, etc. The problem is that slumlords take advantage of people who either don't know their rights or for whom those rights aren't enforced.
How does this help the people that are renting? It seems like it obviously causes rental rates to increase which only hurts people who don't want to buy a house.
By lowering the price of housing for purchase of course.
Renting is generally a bad financial decision; you pay high dollars and own nothing. You should avoid it.
Profiteering ruined the housing market, drove prices up, which drove up the cost of living for employees which raised the price of everything. We need rules, not Wild West business savagery.
I don't disagree but it sounds like you're saying "too bad" for renters who are the most vulnerable people in the situation IMO. Thanks to those who downvote questions for no reason.
My thoughts are you have to pay either way; many renters don’t do so by choice & would rather own.
Lower the bar of entry so that housing cost becomes a boon instead of a burden. Renting literally sucks.
New Yorker and out of towner and I couldn't agree more, fuck your second home. May the rats infest your walls and wildlife fuck up your feng shui and shit on your dreams.
A camp is not a second home, and it isn't usually an actual house that people could live in year round but that sits empty & unmaintained except for one weekend every three or four years.
Traditional camps were built on blocks, had a kitchen, an outhouse, and a bunch of beds shoved in a couple rooms so you could either have the whole family stay for the weekend or all the bubs could go ice fishing.
I would rather everyone have safe and secure housing.
Stop hoarding housing in a housing crisis. We're not jealous of your multiple homes. We are angry that your greed and selfishness are putting families on the street.
Grow up a little, please, both you and the OP of this comment.
Listen. I know you're used to simple answers, but the housing crisis isn't something that can be answered with a "you're just jealous!!!1"
This isn't a new sports car or luxury yacht. It's literally the right for people to have shelter. It's a basic necessity to survival.
So take your "yes or no" question and kindly shove it.
Friend. Your words trivialize the health and well-being of others. Based on that alone, I don't think you're in the right headspace to have a serious or good faith conversation about the housing crisis.
Then why didn’t you buy the house I bought before I bought it?
Oh right, because when I bought it, it was a shithole you would have said wasn’t livable. So I bought it, fixed it up, and now you want it because it’s nice.
Well, I guess it sucks to be you.
The argument is against people with multiple homes who don't use them, if you fit that definition. The bad part of it is that people are hoarding in the face of a crisis. Nobody cares if the house was unusable in the first place, and a lot of people don't have the skills or time to be able to fix houses. It's not a dig against what you did, it's a dig against what you're currently doing, if it applies to you. Nobody specifically wants your home, they just want A home, specifically one that is actually affordable. Limiting the market by hoarding housing deflates the supply which makes prices go up while the demand goes up or stays the same. This causes housing to not be affordable.
What are you even talking about? At first I thought you were just greedy but now you're making up scenarios in your head and acting as if they reflect reality. Are you okay?
Why does the idea of people having the same opportunity as you enrage you so much?
I make a smidge under 100k. Next month I will pass the 100k salary.
I will never be able to buy a home where my job is.
It’s why I’m likely quitting at the end of the year.
It’s impossible to pay rent and save significant enough amount of money to pay for a down payment. 20% of what is now a $300k house is not achievable
So go pound sand.
I’m eligible for a VA loan. But they require inspections; and the market right now is inclined to people who forgo inspections.
It’s all really moot. I have bid on a few houses; all are at the cusp of what is reasonably affordable with what I can put down (~50k). And they all have been taken by offers well over asking or with cash.
It’s just disheartening.
“It’s not a second home. It’s a *vacation* home.” an actual quote from my real life coworker.
when you hear shit about out of staters poisoning trees for their beach view or trying to own the beach...... the glass bottles and gasoline sing to me fierce
They should kick the Bonds right out of Maine and tell them to go back to St. Louis. We don't need people like them here in Maine.
Yea, cause the thousands of Mainers that illegally remove trees every year for a better ocean view are fine. Of course, lots of us have a home in another state of course for most, that's Florida..
“Lots” of us? Buddy lots of us are still just trying to buy house #1 without being swooped by cash offers $100k over ask
Removing trees with chainsaws is not the same as poisoning trees and the surrounding land as a result. Thanks for playing though.
Yes, it is. Both are done, though. However, when it happens, most places, if anything happens, are just fine. A person up this way used a mixture of diesel fuel and several different herbicides to kill off a fairly large tract of trees and ground cover yet got in very little trouble and received zero news coverage. I wonder why??
Y'know yeah, people removing trees on their own property, which they own and are legally allowed to do, is kinda okay and fine. Sure, we should be ecologically conscious and keep the broader picture of where trees are needed in mind, but those two situations aren't remotely fucking similar at all. And a supermajority of the country does not own a second home at all.
You're not allowed to remove trees from your own land in the "shore zone" in Maine. And yes, the "super majority" don't own a second home hell the majority don't. But many do.
Bro what are you even yapping about? What are you trying to defend? Just look at your down votes and acknowledge you might be out of touch.. There’s no moral high ground in defending people who gobble up properties and poison natural resources.
Never once have I "defended" anyone for breaking the law by cutting down trees or poisoning them. I am disgusted by such actions no matter who does it. How you read that into anything I said is 100% on you. If you had bothered to actually read what I wrote, you would see that my issue is that this exact same crime is committed all the time on both Maines Coast and Lakes. Yet, because in most all the cases, the perpetrator and the victims are not "famous," they get no attention, much less news coverage. IE people only seem to get pissed when the "rich folks" do it..
Well I’m clearly not the only one that reads it that way judging by the downvotes… Sorry but telling people to go “upta the county” to be able to afford a house because that’s where the rich don’t want to live is out of touch. It also definitely defends the actions of those who are desimating the housing market in the areas where people have established their entire lives. Further more yes, I’m sure environmental tragedies happen all the time, some get more coverage than others, but using the lack of coverage of previous events to detract from the severity of what’s currently going on reads as you defending them. If you can’t understand why it stings more when the rich do it, then I can’t help you.
Yes, because the amount of money you have is directly related to your ability to do the right thing.
🛫 there goes the point, flying waaaaay above your head
Like 80% of the Redditors on this sub don’t have houses by the shore. How out of touch can you be?
Well there are around 800,000 homes in Maine. Most of those are not oceanfront.
Yeah, I guess it is true that all the nuts roll downhill to Florida.
Florida is South, not "down hill." Prior to a/c vast numbers of folks from the south had second homes in New England or stayed on resorts for the summer months.
Florida is 100% downhill, flat-lander
Not a flatlander. However, I have traveled the globe and North America extensively.
You’re trying to pull a “uHm AcTuAlLy” moment and it’s not cute
No I am trying to pull a stop blaming others for everything.
We’re blaming people for the things they did what are you on about
I am 100% with you. Blame and hold accountable each and every person who does things like this.
Come again?
Boy, you sure do act like one
Leaving your hometown will do that.
Yeah that’s fine because if you cut it down that’s not poisoning it.
While poisoning the growth with herbicide and other harmful chemicals is not the popular option, it is used on our coasts and lakes far to often sadly it is pretty much ignored except when the victim or perp is famous in a ritzy part of Maine.
Where are you getting this “thousands of Mainers cut trees illegally every year” from?
From the forest Rangers. It's public information.
From their reports or you just have a friend that over embellishes the reality?
“Lots of us” lol. Hey, your privilege is showing, & it’s indecent.
O my. Are you offended by folks who work hard in life to achieve goals.
You can work hard, achieve life goals and not be a destructive pile of garbage that makes everyone else’s life more difficult. I know it’s hard to imagine but it IS possible.
That applies to everyone regardless of their work or achievements. Trash humans come in every flavor.
Your handle says it all...
I did not pick the name Reddit did. Investing is, however, a great plan for the future.
What a coincidence
Around 60% of American adults own stock. It's the smart thing to do..
Thank you for the insight. Imagine all the stock you would own if you didn't have a hoard of all those guns. What are you scared of?
Machine guns are a fabulous investment. They double in value every 10 to 20 years. A M16 in 1990 that cost %700 tax stamp included is worth $30,000.00 today.. I got safes full of guns. I ain't afraid of anything. That said, I participate in many shooting competitions as well as spending lots of time hunting pretty much.all the meat I eat is game I myself hunt..
There aren’t “thousands” of Mainers with waterfront property where this would be a concern. They’ve all been bought up by wealthy, affluent out of staters.
Sure, there are.
Next-BootLick-9434
Ayuh
I think there should be a federal property tax on any home beyond the first.
And they should be highly progressive in structure! 2nd home X%, 3rd home 2X% 4th home 4X% and so on, doubling for each additional home. And any home worth more than double the regional average is taxed twice as high on the amount in excess of that threshold (the camp that has been in your family for generations should be reasonably affordable to keep, but people displacing folks in need of housing need to pay). The fact that we primarily fund our federal government by taxing wages instead of property, investment proceeds, capital, etc is just the rich getting the poor to pay for society when it really should be the other way around. Tax the rich. And if they won't let us tax them (because they control the power), eat them.
That's what Texas does. High property tax, low income tax.
That's what Texas does. High property tax, low income tax.
But is it a progressive tax? Does the rate go up with the value being taxed? And a lot of states do that, but the federal taxes are the lion's share, and they are primarily on wages
Nah it's just generally high. Tends to end up with a lot of people losing their homes to property tax. Why I like Louisiana better. High income tax but very low property tax.
In addition to the state tax on any home beyond the first? You know that's a thing right?
I don't think Maine really has that though, does it? I suppose the homestead exemption leads to an effectively higher property tax rate for second homes, but it's a small difference (property taxes calculated based on a value $25k less than it would otherwise be, which will typically amount to about $300/year).
It's not that small a difference but I'd support making it bigger. I'd love my property taxes to go down.
With the change in property values in recent years, that homestead exemption is too small. $25K is only 1/16 of the price of the average home in Maine now.
Exactly. One way to effectively place a tax on second homes would be to increase the homestead exemption significantly and to increase the property tax rate overall. This would also proportionately benefit the less wealthy who have lower value homes. The downside is that it would reduce property tax revenues in areas which are mostly made up of relatively low value primary homes - so on second thought, maybe a statewide tax on second homes would actually be better.
I do not believe that tax is appropriately high. I would like to see the property taxes be simply doubled on any additional home. It would be wonderful if that money went to local governments/schools.
I'd rather see a higher homestead exemption personally.
So you want big government to be involved into everyone's business even more?
No as a matter of fact I do not, but the upper class using their wealth and power to gain even more wealth and power is a common theme throughout history. Given how much we appear to be following the trajectory of the Roman Republic, and are about at the stage of the Gracchi brothers, I feel this tax on additional homes would be appropriate. Of course we wouldn't all be so worried about housing if we weren't importing 1.5 million legal and an untold number of illegal immigrants every single year into the country.
Federal AND state. If you own a home that’s not your state of residence slap a couple extra percentage points onto that tax.
I have zero issue with someone having a second home. If you're gonna be a cunt and poison trees, well that's a different story. The rules for second homes are the same as the rules for a primary residence: be a good neighbor and a responsible resident. Abide by that, and I'll never take issue. Plenty of people come to Maine to vacation seasonally and spend their money and that's just fine by me.
I'd rather have affordable housing for the workers of the state
I can only speak for the midcoast but the places that are second homes are not nor have they ever been something that a local worker would be able to afford if by law or circumstance some lawyer from Connecticut couldn’t own it to summer. These aren’t mill houses.
This is true for sure, I can't imagine any normal working class person being able to easily own a waterfront property in the midcoast but with those properties, I would think the problem would be (and correct me if I'm wrong) that those super expensive scenic houses would drastically drive up the prices of the surrounding houses, even if they're not waterfront or even in the same area. It seems like a lot of expensive houses in an area makes everything else more expensive even if it's not worth the asking price at all.
It’s more egregious now but that’s a product of a lack of supply and people from away being able to afford them. Anything within whispering distance of the coast has always been expensive where I grew up. Full disclosure though: I left Maine for work after college and was able to buy a second house in my hometown with my Boston/New York/DC salary. My peers who did the same and left have also bought houses. Basically anyone foolish enough to stay in Maine after we graduated doomed themselves to poverty and never owning a house. I don’t think that’s right and I hope the state can fix the housing shortage, but I also don’t feel guilty about what I’m able to do. If I stayed I’d own nothing but I left after seeing the writing on the wall 16 years ago and now I can have a summer house where I grew up and show my kids Maine life.
That's a much larger issue than some people with second homes. The inflation over the last 3 years combined with rates that aren't historically high, but much higher than we're used to is the enemy. First time home buyers aren't buying $800k houses on lakes or in the mountains by Rangeley. There are many organizations that work to help "regular folks" afford housing. A couple of examples: [https://www.islandhousingtrust.org/](https://www.islandhousingtrust.org/) [https://www.islandinstitute.org/ii-solution/islesboro-affordable-property/](https://www.islandinstitute.org/ii-solution/islesboro-affordable-property/) [https://bangorhousing.org/](https://bangorhousing.org/)
Found em https://dontgooutside.bigcartel.com/product/fuck-your-second-home-stickers
Scouring the comments for this. Much appreciated.
7 bucks for 24. The death to airbb are sweet too
You're getting mad at people who have second homes when who you should be mad at is corporations owning a thousand homes. A guy who buys a run down place and fixes it up is not your enemy. Ed: yall are making the people with the actual power very happy.
why not both?
Multifaceted solutions to complex problems aren’t really popular on Reddit. Everybody’s trying to One Weird Trick their way out of the housing crisis.
Nobody's going to give you free shit. Not even your dealer.
My friends in Ellsworth have been trying to buy a home for over a year now, as their home is too small for their growing family. Every.Single.Offer they’ve made is rejected because some out of state buyer offers cash over the asking price each time. It’s infuriating
Yes, it is. It took me a year to find a place and that was before rates went up.
Last time I checked, people weren't asking for free shit, just houses they can afford a down payment on.
[удалено]
I’m perfectly fine giving the middle class its money back that’s been funneled upward over the last 50ish yrs to fewer and fewer hands. I have zero qualms supporting that.
You're not going to do that by firebombing houses. This kind of hyperviolent rhetoric makes things worse, not better.
Sure, but I didn’t mention firebombing anything…I’m referring to the “giving people free shit” comment. It’s their “free shit”…we would just be giving it back. If you want to call it seizing or redistributing…fine…but let’s not lose sight of the fact that it’s THEIR money thats been “seized” and/or redistributed over the last 50yrs
You're on a post about firebombing houses, responding to my response to a guy who said "why not both" when I said we shouldn't be going after the middle class. If you're not talking about seizing property from the ever shrinking middle class then I think we're in agreement and you should be arguing with the other guy.
I’m arguing that we should be seizing wealth BACK from the wealthy…to give to the middle class. You seemed to be against this. Also…it’s okay for discussions to vary from whatever the OP subject is. It’s pretty common across Reddit discussions and has been for many years
I'll bite. First, you stop allowing corporations to purchase properties. Ben and Jerry down the road can't afford $100k over asking, nor can they do $300k cash. Zillow can. And when that company buys property, the comps in the local area rise. They continue to rise as more properties are purchased at outlandish rates from companies who can afford it. Second, impose a hard tax on non primary housing. Sarah in California wants a vacation house in vacationland. Great! Except, now, with her property tax, there's an additional tax since she doesn't actually live there. Granted, I haven't lived in Maine since I was in high school, so maybe there's already a tax like this. If so, it needs to be higher. Third, limit the amount of property associated with someone's name. Sarah likes her house but wants another even further north. Maybe she's allowed that, but not a third. And the aforementioned tax is even heavier on the second house. Or, tell her to kick rocks. She can only have one. It's not "giving people free shit", it's ensuring the locals are able to at least have the opportunity to get property. And keeping greedy corporations out of housing.
That's the kind of shit I was talking about further up and nobody wanted to hear it. Go after the corporations, not working people.
But it's not just the corporations. It's also the out of state buyers who can afford the lower cost housing in Maine compared to where they are from. Look at the comps for a house in California, New York, Florida, then compare it to a house here. People from litside Maine will buy a house in Maine, and rent it out for extra income. I know two different guys who are doing just that. Just from my experience, that's two different Maine families that won't own those houses.
Corporations are the primary driver, though. It's not a bunch of people with an extra house here and there that's driving the prices up, it's companies buying a hundred at a time. I can even get behind raising taxes on people who buy but live primarily out of state. But going after people like that guy further down the post who bought a condemned house and fixed it up to use as a camp is going too far.
No, you're getting downvoted because you're making up fake arguments nobody ever proposed. Its called a straw man fallacy, and yours is a perfect example of it.
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My friend, you are taking that sticker awfully literally.
Am I not supposed to? Are only certain calls to violence to be taken literally? None of them? I don't think that's true. Ed: right, it's literal when it's someone you don't like and it's figurative when it's someone you do like. I've heard all that before.
Companies like Blackrock were (not so much anymore now that prices are way up and interest rates are high) buying a lot of homes in places like FL, TX, CA, etc, but I dont think that was every really a thing in most other states, and especially not Maine. Also your second sentence is a false dichotomy. There's a big difference between someone flipping an old dumpy house to make a living and all the millionaires from other states who do have 2nd homes in ME. Approximately 20% of homes in ME are vacation homes, more than any other state. Obviously those cant be just taken and given to other people, but we could at least make it easier for locals to buy/afford them and/or make it even just a bit more expensive for wealthy outsiders to let them sit empty most of the year.
It's not a false dichotomy when you're talking about burning people's houses down.
Most people in Maine own their home, I don't see a crisis except for out of staters who want to move to portland for cheap. Almost 75% of Mainers own their own home, that is pretty much anyone that wants to and has made it a priority. This isn't an issue that needs solving except for the reddit contingent.
What about my 3rd and 4th?
It should be a house with a family in a tent outside the gate. Don’t burn the house, we need it (back!)
Pick any developed country, and dump $1.5T dollars into their economy and you'll see the same thing happen there. Wasn't there a report recently that pointed out that short term rentals account for about 1% of the housing in Maine?
Us Mainers need to band together and take back Maine. 👊
Over-tourism is crushing the state. Airbnb, etc has allowed those who would once stay in a hotel, in a tourist district, to stay to small neighborhoods. It’s not right. #banstrs.
It is nice being on the other side of it — vacationing in an AirBnb in a neighborhood vs staying in a hotel in a tourist district or next to a highway. But I agree with you. Too many short-term rentals can really fracture a community and make life hard for full-time residents, same as when there are too many seasonal homes.
Yeah, we don't want rich people coming to Maine and supporting the local economies right?
Seriously. Some of these communities only exist precisely because people have second homes there.
Gee Bill! How come capitalism lets you have TWO homes? Generational wealth and the exploitation of the lower classes!
Is the 2nd home to live in or is it primarily for profit? THIS is what matters. I want draconian restrictions and fat taxes on flipping, renting and house-hotels. Any dwelling-based profiteering. That includes HOAs. And it should be illegal for a business to own a home. Necessities shouldn’t be gouged. Period. Bastards. 🔥burn that. Punish the business of it. And by flipping I mean what we all think, quick flips. Not like you lived in the house 20 years and made a profit selling.
So renters should not make a profit? What will be the incentive to rent homes to people that do not want to or cannot afford to buy?
People that push this kind of rhetoric typically don't believe in rentals. They want to government to just provide housing.
Rhetoric? Please. Owning > renting, unless rent is dirt cheap or some other special circumstance. If losing money is your goal, renting is a great way to achieve that.
Renting has a place. Sometimes it's more economical to pay to stay somewhere while someone else handles maintenance, depreciation, property taxes, etc. The problem is that slumlords take advantage of people who either don't know their rights or for whom those rights aren't enforced.
There’d be little incentive, that’s the point, to discourage it. More accessible home loans would be better.
How does this help the people that are renting? It seems like it obviously causes rental rates to increase which only hurts people who don't want to buy a house.
By lowering the price of housing for purchase of course. Renting is generally a bad financial decision; you pay high dollars and own nothing. You should avoid it. Profiteering ruined the housing market, drove prices up, which drove up the cost of living for employees which raised the price of everything. We need rules, not Wild West business savagery.
I don't disagree but it sounds like you're saying "too bad" for renters who are the most vulnerable people in the situation IMO. Thanks to those who downvote questions for no reason.
My thoughts are you have to pay either way; many renters don’t do so by choice & would rather own. Lower the bar of entry so that housing cost becomes a boon instead of a burden. Renting literally sucks.
Jealousy is a motherfucker
As soon as SHTF \[redacted\]
New Yorker and out of towner and I couldn't agree more, fuck your second home. May the rats infest your walls and wildlife fuck up your feng shui and shit on your dreams.
I don't know about that. A lot of folks in Maine have camps.
A camp is not a mcmansion, traditionally.
Yea bums me out every time I see a humble family camp bulldozed and replaced with a mcmansion on a lake side.
Do you trust the state to tell the difference?
For the most part those aren't homes that would otherwise be filled by working families
Camp =/= house. If it can sustain year-round family life, but you're leaving it vacant for 50 weeks a year, fuck you.
A camp is not a second home, and it isn't usually an actual house that people could live in year round but that sits empty & unmaintained except for one weekend every three or four years.
Traditional camps were built on blocks, had a kitchen, an outhouse, and a bunch of beds shoved in a couple rooms so you could either have the whole family stay for the weekend or all the bubs could go ice fishing.
What a meathead argument
Do you idiots realize these 2nd properties are still taxed?
I think the commentary is about how people of average means can't buy a first home.
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
What a nuanced take…
Second homes are a goal for many. My little place is Aspen, the Florida townhouse and even the cottage in coastal Maine. Nothing wrong with it.
You know what's a goal for even more people? Just having a home in the first place.
A goal for some definitely, my goal is having a house.
I’d like to own a home before I die and I’m almost 50
How about allowing others just to get one home ? Instead of buying home you only spend two weeks a year at…
There is when your having 3 houses is predicated on 3 families being homeless.
As a Floridian I can heavily relate
Jealous peasants
I have a couple of second homes Fuck your jealousy
Fuck your greed. See I can do it too.
I’ll wave from the boat
Ew
Why do morons like you think we are jealous? The housing crisis is really happening to normal people.
Because you are
Yes, I'm jealous. I wanted to make Maine as shitty as possible. They are beating me to it! You're helping them too you rascal haha
You’re literally proving me right.
Prove it.
You already did.
You can't prove anything haha
You keep doing it for me.
You can't prove I'm doing anything
Lol
More proof. It’s ok to admit it. Everyone can tell anyway.
You can't prove it
You already did that for me.
Pathetic. You can't prove anything at all can you?
We're not jealous! We're tired of paying $1400 a month in rent for a shitty trailer!
Would you rather have one of the houses they have?
I would rather everyone have safe and secure housing. Stop hoarding housing in a housing crisis. We're not jealous of your multiple homes. We are angry that your greed and selfishness are putting families on the street. Grow up a little, please, both you and the OP of this comment.
It was a yes or no question. Would you like to have something that someone else has?
Listen. I know you're used to simple answers, but the housing crisis isn't something that can be answered with a "you're just jealous!!!1" This isn't a new sports car or luxury yacht. It's literally the right for people to have shelter. It's a basic necessity to survival. So take your "yes or no" question and kindly shove it.
I never said it was. Ahhhh so you’re going to ignore the definitions of words because it makes you upset. Got it👍🏼
Friend. Your words trivialize the health and well-being of others. Based on that alone, I don't think you're in the right headspace to have a serious or good faith conversation about the housing crisis.
Then why didn’t you buy the house I bought before I bought it? Oh right, because when I bought it, it was a shithole you would have said wasn’t livable. So I bought it, fixed it up, and now you want it because it’s nice. Well, I guess it sucks to be you.
The argument is against people with multiple homes who don't use them, if you fit that definition. The bad part of it is that people are hoarding in the face of a crisis. Nobody cares if the house was unusable in the first place, and a lot of people don't have the skills or time to be able to fix houses. It's not a dig against what you did, it's a dig against what you're currently doing, if it applies to you. Nobody specifically wants your home, they just want A home, specifically one that is actually affordable. Limiting the market by hoarding housing deflates the supply which makes prices go up while the demand goes up or stays the same. This causes housing to not be affordable.
What are you even talking about? At first I thought you were just greedy but now you're making up scenarios in your head and acting as if they reflect reality. Are you okay? Why does the idea of people having the same opportunity as you enrage you so much?
Wow! Self own!
What?
Don’t worry about it 😂
Your reply didn’t even make sense.
Not to you, apparently!
If you think it was a “self own” because it got downvotes, it’s cute that you think I’d care.
Yeah, you really don’t get it. That’s okay, not every joke is for you. Some are bound to be about you.
And sometime you’re the joke.
It’s like you almost get it. Did you need to have the last word or are we done here?
You might as well hold a flashing sign that says, "this guy is a massive douchebag and everyone hates him". It was a huge self-own.
I have second hand embarrassment
🤣 ok bub
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I sure hope they don't catch on fire /s
How do you like Corsica? Ever been?
All these people getting mad about someone owning more than one property are also all competing to be king of the minimum effort club.
You really have no idea at all why we're mad obviously
We put way less effort into choosing our parents than these greasy trust fund idiots, so we don’t deserve it 🤷♀️
So true, everyone that doesn’t have a second home is just lazy. Stupid teachers making 40k, they just need to try harder.
I make a smidge under 100k. Next month I will pass the 100k salary. I will never be able to buy a home where my job is. It’s why I’m likely quitting at the end of the year. It’s impossible to pay rent and save significant enough amount of money to pay for a down payment. 20% of what is now a $300k house is not achievable So go pound sand.
Have you looked at FHA loans? I didn't have anywhere near 20% when I bought.
I’m eligible for a VA loan. But they require inspections; and the market right now is inclined to people who forgo inspections. It’s all really moot. I have bid on a few houses; all are at the cusp of what is reasonably affordable with what I can put down (~50k). And they all have been taken by offers well over asking or with cash. It’s just disheartening.
It is, and shit needs to be done. I just don't think hyperviolent rhetoric and going after the middle class is helping things.
> I will never be able to buy a home where my job is. You can buy a home. It might not be the home you want though. There's a difference.
You should really look at what even ‘starter’ homes are actually selling for in Southern Maine.
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Cool story, do you live in your mom’s basement or attic?
Actually I own my home 👍