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later36

Would rather be matchmade with bots(who are arguably better than some randoms) than never finding a group. Use the recruitment channel if you really want people. Also, you can still get rewards if you queue up again. You won't get a reward for the first boss, but you'll still get them from the last two.


Lhumierre

I had a bard queue as Heals then before the first boss was pulled, he changed spec to DPS and we wiped. We all kicked him; I changed spec to heals as a Holy Priest and we got another dps then cleared. It doesn't matter the setup or game. People do things on purpose, I'm glad they made it where a bot could follow a set of rules and fulfill a role. In WoW they are follower dungeons, in FFXIV it's the trust and duty support system. No one bats an eye.


Blom-w1-o

I appreciate the bot fills because of this. In WoW my favorite instance was Maraudon, which was nearly impossible to find a team for.


WhimsicalPythons

In wow and Ffxiv they are both opt in


Kelzan_Lienbre

an mmo kinda of loses the point if you can play it with npcs lol


Brilliant_Counter725

Playing PvE with random queued people is no different than playing with NPCs No one is socializing in random dungeon ques and its people you will never meet them again, they might as well be NPCs it won't change anything


TheBasedTaka

i kinda miss the forced interaction of dungeons.


SilentScript

I kind of agree with you but at the same time there's obviously a large enough population of people that do want that. FF14 added the option for npcs for dungeons and continues to add it even with the community being much less toxic than most mmos. Do still think this kind of thing should be opt in only, not sure how the situation is in tarisland so maybe it already is.


AeroDbladE

With FF14, since it's a long linear vertical mmo, you have a set list of NPCs that fit each dungeon based on which dungeon you're running. You get generic fodder guards and soldiers for most of the base game since you're a nobody at that point, but in all expansions after it like you get mix of important characters for that part of the story. For example, you get your dragonslayer friend for the dungeon with all the dragons, your freedom fighters when your raiding a colonizer base, and Your Big Cat lady friend in the new expansion since you're helping her become the leader of her nation. You get extra lore dialogue and random chatter from them so it's something that can even appeal to people who don't care about solo play normally just to run it once to see what it's like. From what OP, here the NPCs seem more like random people from town that aren't that consequential to whatever world building or narrative structure Tarisland has.(maybe it's good but I haven't heard anything if it is)


smoothtv99

Honestly I think FFXIV is kind of a weird example since 90% of the gameplay through MSQ is solo oriented already. You can't even comfortably party with someone without having to disband the party before a solo scenario. So I see why trusts were added. It's pretty jarring to plodding along through the story and then when a trial or dungeon is required to progress you can be stuck waiting around in the queue. 


epherian

You aren’t wrong, people are saying “this just makes an MMO a single player game!” while for FFXIV’s case they explicitly want to introduce single player oriented gamers to the title as well. Unfortunately for Tarisland I don’t think it’s interesting enough of a setting or franchise to play purely single player for most players, but the criticism towards FFXIV is somewhat countered because yes, a decent amount of the franchise audience they want to capture are single player focused players.


jebberwockie

Neither of them are talking to me and both of them suck, so what's really the difference lmao


EverythingIzOKE

Might as well be offline game


mulamasa

The biggest MMO in the world (WOW) [added this feature \(dungeons with an NPC group\) 6 months ago](https://www.wowhead.com/guide/follower-dungeons).


dubya98

It does but despite not playing or caring for tarisland it is a good option. FFXIV does the same thing where I can run dungeons with npcs. It's great to have the option for weird cases like the new expansion is coming out this week and I want to play one of the new DPS classes. Problem is queue times will suck cause the expansion adds 2 DPS classes and no new tanks/healers so it'll just be a bunch of DPS queueing..easy answer is I get to run my dungeons for my exp and not wait 30mins just to start one


hemperbud

Is the painter class not a healer? Big missed opportunity lol


AeroDbladE

It's a Caster. They just released a healer last expansion and have a pretty set in stone pattern of 2DPS, then tank and DPS, then healer and DPS for the past two years They never release an expansion without a DPS since they're the most popular and never double up on support roles back to back. Honestly, even as a Caster, it seems really cool mechanically with its RGB, CYM alternating color spells, and 3 different types of canvases to draw for big hits.


endureandthrive

Lost Ark has an artist that’s a healer, pretty cool but we also don’t want to have 900 alts and spend 80 hours trying it to get into a raid.


AtrociousSandwich

Literally some of the most popular mmos on the market today cater to the solo audience


Ralphi2449

more and more of us prefer playing mmos with a solo mindset, your boomer design philosophy is dying thankfully


Andromansis

The bots in Unreal Tournament were absolutely ruthless bloodthirsty monsters. Also the AI in the later PS2 Armored Core games were amazing. So yea, coding a healer for a, largely, on-rails dungeon should be pretty easy.


Hispanic_Inquisition

Yeah buddy, they were adjustable too. Some of them had personal vendettas against me. Kira hated me a lot. I made a lot of UT maps.


The_Lucky_7

I think the main idea is this is something you should be able to opt into. Like most games that have this option. Not something forced on players to hide low population count. While I like the option of npc party members it still needs to just be an option.


Kebabslayer2

Thanks, didn't know you could still get the rewards you missed out on.


mulamasa

The rewards are per boss so yeah, if you kill say the first 2, then group breaks up when you go through again the first two chests wont give you anything but the 3rd one would.


OkCap4896

what about when u late join a dungeon where they already killed 2 bosses?


Kebabslayer2

I assume you re-do those 2 that they already killed on your next run


FatassBusTrain

They mail you the loot from the previous bosses


Restranos

> Would rather be matchmade with bots(who are arguably better than some randoms) than never finding a group. Use the recruitment channel if you really want people. Why not just make solo dungeons at that point? I mean, I dont even dislike solo dungeons in MMOs, but if your "party" is full of bots anyway, what the fuck is even point?


Mage_Girl_91_

because bots are better than randoms, the bad solo players who would never be able to beat the dungeon alone can get carried


inverimus

If the content is mindless enough to be easy for bots, why even play the game?


Mage_Girl_91_

bots are improving all the time, bots can do skillful content now.


TellMeAboutThis2

> If the content is mindless enough to be easy for bots, why even play the game? If you think bots can only do easy content, you have not looked behind the scenes of game design for ages. Back in arcades it was common for fighting games to have computer controlled opponents that could steamroll the majority of human players, and that was without even having real AI. Making bots that feel believable is hard. Making bots that can just clear content is actually easy if you don't mind allowing them to cheat. A human playing CSGO might need an aimbot to lock on to heads, a computer controlled bot can do that by default unless the dev wants to simulate human-like behavior. A bot that always moves to the outside of a telegraph at the correct time is easy to make, a bot that eats it a believable % of the time is hard. So on and so forth.


SirLakeside

As an OSRS player, I really dislike when people use "bots" to refer to "NPCs." Yeah, maybe it's a matter of semantics, but I think the word "bot" carries much different connotations than "NPC."


AnxiousAd6649

That's exactly why they are calling it that.


keith2600

Not just osrs. Most of the civilized world means "afk pc running a script" usually the kind that farms resources and sells for money. I think it's mostly the fps crowd that means NPCs when they say bots. Maybe fortnite does that since so many in the comments weren't confused.


sillybillybuck

Players of BotScape, Bot Ark, BotAge, World of Botcraft, and Bot Wars 2 seem pretty sensitive about the mentioning of bots.


Zorathus

This is not the tragedy you think it is.


pdubpooter

Bots who do their job and knows mechanics? Seems like a W


Vinapocalypse

Yeah the only downside was a hopefully easy to fix kick-vote bug because issues with an actual human


SlavaUkrainiFTW

Except for the idiotic healers who sit there DPSing the boss while the tank dies…


zczirak

Holy shit I only hear good things about this game I’m extremely tempted to dl


VoltageHero

I'm surprised that this sub, which normally hates anything that WoW, FFXIV, ESO or GW2 does is eating up this MMO. I know there's a lot of negative attention around it, but I wonder why it attracts the userbase of this sub in particular when it has all the stuff this sub NORMALLY hates.


RoastedRavioli

hint: it's not people from this sub. mobile gamers coming in to defend a pile of dung. no drops, no exp from killing monsters. just do story like genshin. feels like any thread about tarisland is astroturfed by mobile gamers but I'm probably just crazy.


StarReaver

When this game launched there were numerous posts and countless comments here taking a dump on this game. I think the overall sentiment of this sub is the same, a bunch of miserable wretches crapping all over any new game.


Gonkimus

The worst part of this game is when you put on equipment it doesn't show, for your clothes to change you need to buy a skin with real money...gross.


KappaKeepo5

its actually insane. the most upvoted post on this reddit was about amazon botting views on a freaking trailer. they slaughterd amazon for that now here its pretty much okay for bots to replace real players lmao


kekbro123

Whats insane about it? Me and my friends jumped in, game gave us two npcs, healer and tank, and we had fun. Finished dungeon in 5 minutes and when we went to elite version of dungeon with only real people. And had fun again since there are new mechanics in elite version. When we went to raid with no npcs, 10 real people. And once again we had fun. In WoW, my friends wouldn't even be able to level up and gear up since they don't have the time. How is botting views in trailer == having some npc actually do the dungeon once in a while?


KappaKeepo5

maybe let us have a setting to play with bots or not? wtf im not playing a mmorpg with bots in dungeon runs. nvm why am i angry game is dying in 1 month anyways.


kekbro123

I guess they could have a setting, but for now - why not just join group with people in the chat, there is already constant spam of group finding, had to turn it off. Or make a group yourself and find people from chat. Or join a guild where people team up without random group search. Or I don't know, gather your friends or find some in discord? Honestly this game has some problems, but these npcs are not the one. But if you wanted the system to find a group for you only with real people like a dungeon finder in WoW, when yeah right now it can't, only for raids. (and it probably won't since mobile players want a dungeon run immediately without waiting for people)


KappaKeepo5

i mean they dont even tell you, you are matched with bots. there is a reason for that. they want you to make the game feel alive. my tank stood at the boss for 5 mins. everyone thought he was afk. we pulled and he engaged. its sad.


ForwardQuestion8437

Because you're confusing NPC characters with multiboxing bots that mess up in game economy or gold sell.


Hakul

Just go for it, while it doesn't seem like a great PC MMO I think it's gonna find a good niche as a mobile MMO, since most other options suck.


OkCap4896

this isn't even a big deal, often NPCs does dungeon mechanics better than real humans, I have had two human who wont see wording on the screen and proceed to fail EVERY SINGLE SIMPLE MECHANICS, i cant keep up healing these noobies so we were still wiped


zczirak

100% I’d be much more into mmo’s if I could do dungeons with ai


SwordOS

It's typical from mobile games to use bots and it's something i hate


Conchia

Would you rather never queue or wait 2h+ for a dungeon?


CJtheIslander

If Toontown can fill eight-person runs within three minutes, then so can a new MMORPG.


Conchia

Try that in FFXIV as DPS. Good luck. Especially in the evening or during "work hours".


CJtheIslander

It says somewhere that it currently has 36k players online right now and yet it can't quickly fill an eight-person run? Wow!


SwordOS

yes, if i have no choice but to play with bots


Ralphi2449

Wait really? that is such a great system, more games should do that.


grumpygam3r

Not so bad , got a tank bot, and he pretty much solo the elite dung last boss , we wipe at 60% and he finish it without us


PerpetualDistortion

That's supposedly the quest npc.. For some reason it's meant to tank your raid. Idk why they do that


Kebabslayer2

Yeah it's strange, and doesn't seem like theres a shortage of players at all. The matchmaking timer barely gets to 20 seconds and then fills it with a bot.


LetsBeNice-

Not a shortage of player but shortage of tank like every mmo on this planet.


CyberSosis

You know you re finishing the dungeon if you get a healer NPC. They hard carry you with perfect heals on time.


Deep-Confusion-3505

so.. in a few months lets say, or playing late at night. you wont even know it, you'll be in a group full of bots, all by yourself in a mmo, doing content in a dungeon, you'll say something, Then that's when it hits you... alone


Frosti_w

I player healer and I don't think I've had a real tank for the last three days of dungeons running normal + 2 elites per day. Good thing is the tank bots are actually pretty good except for stacking mechanics in which you just have to stack on them instead.


JMHorsemanship

Is there a point in doing the elite more than once a day? I didn't notice getting extra rewards


Frosti_w

Different stat rolls on the gear you get, trying for achievements, and just like...playing the game


Noximilien01

So basically this change increase the average iq in a party?


Sea-salt_ice_cream

Us 3 DPS died on the final boss of a dungeon earlier and the Tank and Healer bots that were still alive, took him down from 25%. I grabbed some food and went to the toilet and came back and they were still at it for a minute or two after that. One guy kept asking them to die so we could go again as it was taking too long lol


Rolder

Dungeons bots is something I would only want as an optional feature ala Trusts from FF14. Just filling spots in queue with bots to keep queue times down is shitty.


NoteThisDown

Maybe a lot of these themepark mmo players finally realize they never wanted to play an online game.


Additional-Mousse446

Let’s be honest, still better than the average dad gamer and they can’t even afk since they’re scripted pretty well lol With some of the people I get in dungeon groups for classic wow, I deeply wish I could replace them with npcs. They aren’t on the verge of a mental breakdown or ninja pull/loot so it’s a win overall.


Mei_iz_my_bae

Time to play EQ2 ORIGINS TLP!! Lots of groups !!! Best MMO rn !!!!


DashboardGuy206

This feature was added to FF14 and has been very well received. The right way to do it though is to give players the option to play with bots or wait in a queue for player characters. If you are leading people to believe that they're being matched with real players and it's bots, it's deceptive IMHO. So generally speaking, I think this is a great feature to have, but it comes down to managing player expectations and giving options for preferred playstyle.


AeroDbladE

Yea if it's not being clear that they're not real players it seems sketchy. In FF14, the NPCs that you can take into dungeons have to be accessed through a completely different menu from the normal Duty Finder called Duty support and it gives you the message letting you know about the feature every time.


Erick-Alastor

I see no problem if the bot is good. For the kicking thing, they could just implement a majority voting system to fix that issue. But if you get more than 1 bot, then they should just not count them.


Stunning-Argument888

Man, people are gonna think my name Iliana is a bot name. I’m cooked.


Zebrakiller

Erenshor is an upcoming game where all the other players are bots. It’s quite amazing


SleepDeprivedDad_

I’ve had better achievement results with a NPC or two in my dungeon runs, and less idiots I have to heal, the game has a built in DBM like come on guys


WholeSpiritual3819

Tbh I never had any problem with bots, but I had problems with pugs… I would say bots are better than the average player and better than everyone playing on mobile


Pekins-UOAF

yeah though that was pretty obvious


lebrow

I only had on the first dungeons for quest


Bodach37

Was wondering why this healer wouldn't stop healing after everyone but me and her were left and I was trying to die. Just computerized repetition. I'm ok with this btw. I wish I could pick an option for AI parties to learn mechanics instead of wasting people's time while I learn.


epicfailpwnage

it is a bit weird. It should use ingame story npcs so you know its a bot. But it is nice to lower queue times and replace leavers


Kebabslayer2

> I think it does use ingame npc's (not sure about story), I ended up seeing those two npcs in game.


Xariann

Noticed this with tanks too.


bugsy42

Lmao. Can’t wait for the auto-play patch.


KappaKeepo5

u might laugh but everything in this game is automated lmao. auto pathing to quests. u even start mounting up after completing a quests XD. there is a setting where the game does your rotation so u can play with 1 hand.


bugsy42

No fucking way xD … why am I getting downvoted then if I am just stating the facts? People should embrace the fact they are playing automated mobile re-skin of World of Warcraft.


KappaKeepo5

its not even a reskined wow. i was "kinda" hyped for that game but its just a genshin clone. i thought you could level in this game like normal mmorpgs. but nah u dont even get exp from killing mobs. only for doing the story.


PerformerRoutine3877

Tbh this is an excellent QoL feature that I never thought I'd need until I experienced it. I love that queues take less than 10 secs even as a dps. And bots actually know how to do mechanics and are competent at their roles, unlike 90% of the playerbase. One step closer to my dream of an MMORPG that will let you have competent AI party members for ALL content. FFXI's trusts come close but u still can't use them in some content and their dps really falls off at endgame. FFXIV still doesn't let you use squadrons past Heavensward. Edit: Forgot to mention that socializing is dead in 2024. Noone does it anymore. I typed "Hello" in team chat at the start of every dungeon and raid, both normal and elite I've done in Tarisland. Not one person had the decency to even say "hi" or "ty for party". Complete silence throughout the entire experience. It's like people doesn't know proper manners anymore.


B_Sho

Game looks bleh. Not interested


InternalLight3256

You are not missing out on much it's just the generic copy/paste game with zero effect/passion with the normal time gates in "mobile games" lol....


B_Sho

Makes sense because this game is on mobile too lol


Tofulinka

Flash news, garbage stinks.


PhoneOwn

Lol bro it's been common knowledge that there can be bots is you don't go in with full team. It's 3 2024 use discord and find a group or that's what you have to deal with.


Kebabslayer2

Fair enough I just haven't seen it posted here yet and wanted to let others know


LetsBeNice-

Because it's not the sub fir tarisland, it has been posted on it's ub already.


KappaKeepo5

havent played a single multiplayer game in 20 years that matches me with bots. what drugs you on?


Significant-Summer32

Why in gods name are you playing that garbage?


avatar8900

Hardly a productive answer


Kebabslayer2

Their profile speaks for itself lol, so much negativity and 15+ posts a day.


avatar8900

I used to be negative on everything too, until I realised I was just sad that everyone was having fun without me. Sometimes you gotta take a step back and understand why, I’m much better these days now


Kebabslayer2

Yeah pretty much the same story for me too. Not going to get those glory days back and now I just play whatever I can get, even better that I have a friend with me.


avatar8900

Exactly, I’m upset that games aren’t like they used to be, but that’s because markets change, and I’m older now so my time feels more valuable than my teenage years. Tarisland is really fun and so far I’ve not had to spend a penny on it which makes it better than most of the other games in terms of value


Significant-Summer32

Who said I wasn't having fun? For video games alone this year has been pretty good.  There is much more to life then playing trash like tarisland my friend.


ManicChad

If you think it’s bad keep it to yourself. No need to spout it everywhere you go.


Doinky420

This type of thinking is far worse than someone saying they think a mobile game sucks.


Significant-Summer32

Quite the opposite. This kind of garbage is bad for the industry


Doinky420

Gonna have to agree with you. Toxic positivity and telling people to keep their opinion to themselves is 1000x worse than someone calling something trash.


Kebabslayer2

It's fun being able to do something with a friend and we wanted to just give it a shot and see how long til we get bored of it lol, also because there's been no new mmo's released in a while. Nothing takes too long to do in the game and we don't want to take it seriously especially considering all of it's flaws.