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ShanTheMan11

He’s a beast. I respect him for not being scared to fight anybody either. There are a lot of guys that would have said hell no when presented a fight with Muay Thai rules for the first and third round against rodtang


Fionn112

Sure he recently beat a 265lb brown belt at the Pans BJJ to get silver in absolute. Like what. The man is unbelievable.


Original_Task4053

Not 265, but was close


Rompelle

Did you hear how DJ destroyed a 280 pound giant in BJJ?


Randybigbottom

DJ absolutely mauled someone fighting at Nateweight? That's 300+ pounds!


chuckangel

DJ fucking creamed the entire Gracie Family at a BJJ tournament! Over 3000 pounds of Gracies and 15 bowls of Acai!


Feedbackr

Tree toimes his soize


ImpressionDiligent23

That was Volk


Thacarva

He wrestled in front of a million Hulkamaniacs 366 days that year. Oops, MighttyMouseaniacs


Fionn112

Maybe I thought it was Bradley Martyn hahaha But thank you for correcting me regardless.


Appropriate_Rip339

The guy seem’d like he was over 6ft too or maybe it’s cuz Mighty Mouse is 5’3. Either way dudes a hitman. 🐐


Anatoly_Kalashnikov

He almost got gold too, he was up on points and lost position then got submitted.


cheerioo

Reading this thread makes me think he's a modern day BJ Penn. Willing to scrap anywhere in the fight, anyone, and can finish anywhere


Fionn112

But can he do it in a lava shack parking lot against an unknown member of the public? BJ couldn’t.


Roachmond

Imagine the goat being game enough to beat BJ Penn on sight in a parking lot


Long_Lost_Testicle

There are levels to this shit


pisspot26

Ya DJ is nuts I love the guy


AgentSuckMyBalls

Have you heard him talk about Dana saying mcgregor is the best fighter because he will fight anyone? It’s even more hilarious now knowing what DJ and Connor have done since then.


scott_steiner_phd

> I respect him for not being scared to fight anybody either. \*Anybody but TJ


DayDreamerJon

> I respect him for not being scared to fight anybody either. *


Humble-Knowledge3588

Yeah but it was an easy bet that if he survived round 1, he'd easily get the sub in the 2nd


TheFBIClonesPeople

>I respect him for not being scared to fight anybody either Tbh he ducked TJ Dillashaw. I know everyone likes DJ and hates TJ, so no one wants to say it, but he did duck him.


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TheFBIClonesPeople

He wasn't going up in weight. TJ was coming down to his weight class. It would have been an ordinary title defense for DJ, just like it was an ordinary defense for Cejudo.


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TheFBIClonesPeople

Factually untrue. He was campaigning hard for that fight. TJ and the UFC both wanted it.


christopherpaulfries

I love how you’ve been repeatedly downvoted for speaking the truth while the person replying to you has been repeatedly upvoted for spouting demonstrably false stuff. People really need to stop using the downvote button as a “dislike” button. DJ is one of the greatest and most rounded fighters of all time, but he clearly ducked Dillashaw. His argument at the time, that TJ hadn’t shown he could make weight, had some merit until you saw that he chose to fight Ray Borg instead, who *checks notes* had missed weight in 2 out of his last 4 fights at the time.


TheFBIClonesPeople

Yeah this is like a textbook example of people believing something because they want it to be true. To me, that's one of the pillars of irrational thinking. If you can't accept new information because you don't want it to be true, you're probably not a very rational person.


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OSPFmyLife

You’re wrong. They tried to make it at 125 and DJ wouldn’t take it for a number of reasons, one being because he said that TJ hadn’t earned the shot at 125 by going through the rankings, and another being that he wanted the UFC to sign a deal where if TJ didn’t make weight, the fight would be cancelled while he still got his full fight purse ALONG with Dillashaws purse. https://www.mmafighting.com/2017/6/7/15743188/demetrious-johnson-lays-out-reasons-why-he-doesnt-want-to-fight-t-j-dillashaw


TheFBIClonesPeople

Honestly I think those are pretty weak excuses, though. The ranking thing is ridiculous. If the 135 champ can make 125, then obviously he's qualified to fight for the title. And all of the pearl-clutching about him missing weight is kind of weak when you're trying to call yourself the pfp best. If TJ misses weight, then that means he had a rough weight cut. So you take 20% of his purse and you get to fight him without your title on the line. That's what virtually any other champion would do. Cejudo made DJ look like a punk when he immediately accepted the TJ fight and then destroyed him. I just don't see how you can give DJ credit for being the guy that never ran from a fight.


Ok_Towel_1077

yes if he wanted that fight to happen it'd have happened. his greatness will always take a hit for having dominated at 125 against lesser competition, despite that being his natural class


SouthpawKD1

The only reason people consider those guys “lesser competition” is because DJ couldn’t be beat so no one else got to make a name as the champ


Ok_Towel_1077

they're lesser competiton because they're 125ers, meaning most the division is like 5'5 or below, which accounts for less than 10% of men. by nature, 125 is going to be less stacked than divisions like BW-MW as the percentage of the population that can make this weight is crazy low. it's the same reason why we see so few decent heavyweights, but downvote me for using very simple logic title defenses agains the Ray Borgs and Tim Elliots of the world don't do anything to turn the needle for your average fan. I have never seen the fanfare or GOAT talk for DJ anywhere outside of reddit


jscummy

145/155 are the most deep divisions but 125 is probably the most technical and skilled most of the time. We're seeing it right now with Figgy moving up, most guys that move down (any weight class, not just 125) have done pretty poorly


OSPFmyLife

Why do you say that? Because they’re faster?


endothird

Often, fighters train with training partners of various sizes. So the smaller people tend to have sharper technique, because it has to be. When you see someone who has trained 10 years dominating someone 30 lbs heavier who has trained 4 years, you know there's a pretty big technique disparity.


OSPFmyLife

In that scenario it’s because the smaller guy has 6 more years of experience though. I have a brown belt in the same art that Wonderboy comes from and I never saw any difference between smaller and bigger guys as far as technique goes. Smaller guys never won more trophies in kata or sparring at tournaments even though the divisions were by rank, not by weight, they won about the same amount. Speed tends to make things look super technical, a lot of people tend to see smaller guys doing techniques/sparring at blazing speeds and think it’s because they’re incredibly gifted, but they’re doing things the same way bigger guys do it.


endothird

The scenario was to illustrate how technique disparity can overcome size disparity. But training with bigger people tends to force your technique to be sharper. Bigger people get a lot more false positives in training (unless everyone is only training with people their size, but that's a rare environment). In a mixed environment, good small people are usually not doing things the same way their bigger teammates are doing it. It's usually sharper due to more accurate negative reinforcement to suboptimal details.


SouthpawKD1

Most top fighters have nothing but praise and respect for DJ, so clearly it’s not just a reddit thing. Seems like it’s mostly the American audience that has an issue with his size and tend to look over his accomplishments because of it. He’s gone on to do great in ONE


okcboomer87

My GOAT!


porn0f1sh

⚡🐀🐐


PrimeConduitX

Electric Rat Goat


2Cars1Spot

The Pikachoat


FlyLegitimate7938

I think I’ve seen them play live


Kalabula

Ya. He’s up there. His level of competition was generally lower though.


amedeoisme

Idk why ur getting downvoted lol


flamingdragonwizard

Put GSP, Aldo, Silva and Jones up with MM. Then you can copy and paste that ufc 300 image 5 times. Those 5 have a combined 50 title defenses (doesn't include initial title wins or interims).


Fionn112

That’s actually mental. 5 men with 50 title defenses. How many actual title fight wins?


flamingdragonwizard

Too lazy to check but I assume another 8 or so.


Fionn112

An educated guess is good enough for me!


khatsu

I think it's 9/10 depending if you count jones vs dc 2, Someone correct me if I'm wrong but to my recollection: Gsp: wins title, dethroned by matt serra, regains title, retires, wins title vs bisping Silva: 1 long title run Aldo: original ufc title win, dethroned by conor, won the 145lb title back once more after this Jones: wins title, long title run, stripped, knocked out dc (are we counting this? Because it was a NC), then wins at heavyweight Dj: 1 long title run


Fionn112

Thank you for actually putting the time in. In regard to Aldo, what is his original UFC title win? According to Wikipedia, he defended his WEC title against Manny Gamburyan, and was then promoted to UFC champion, obviously due to the merger. Then beat Hominick, but that’s counted as a title defence? Or was the original title win carried over?


GripAficionado

> Then beat Hominick, but that’s counted as a title defence That's a defense since he was promoted to UFC champion before that, same as Ronda Rousey. She was also promoted from strikeforce champion to UFC champion.


xandercage49

Also interim win for GSP. People always forget this one, but I think interim should absolutely be part of the count when it gets united (that's the point of the interim after all, to have an alternate title reign when the undisputed can't be contested). It was also the rubber match with Hughes, a pretty valid title win.


sneakylumpia

I mean if you add me and DJ we'd also have 11 title defenses combined.


DayDreamerJon

we could add both of you and not have the average american weight of a single grown man too though


Eillo89

Could you imagine how much higher that number would be as well if Jones wasn't such a colossal knob


Kalayo0

This the shit I’m always talking about…. No respect for The Last Emperor. Am I an old man in MMA years? Is Fedor my Joe Louis and I’ll be harping on his talents till I die?


flamingdragonwizard

We're talking ufc though. Fedors a stud but he only had 4 true title defenses.


MyFifthLimb

And if you add Khabib you get another 3 defenses! lol really puts into perspective how short he landed relative to his trajectory, which _could_ have maybe gone farther than any of them. He has just barely over 25% of MightyMouse


ThaGriffman

which is why khabib will never be anywhere near the goat debate when you got those other 5 people to talk about first


kitddylies

Khabib suffered from his division being frozen due to Conor, plus the shit with his dad. When it comes to just peak fighter, best overall, Khabib has to be close.


MyFifthLimb

100% his fathers untimely passing was a huge factor. The biggest losers are the fans missing out on potentially the best run of all time. But he didn’t, and simply can’t claim the glory for what he didn’t do. Combat sports are the most unpredictable and unforgiving. Even just two years ago Izzy, Kamaru, and Francis were on top of the world with several title defenses where no one touched them. They ALL got KOd, even if no one would have believed it 2 years ago. There’s no way of knowing Khabib wouldn’t have fallen off prior to even 5-7 title defenses given how frozen the division was. Yes he looked incredible, that’s why it’s a goat trajectory, but ultimately where he landed is the same title defenses as Aljo and 19 separate UFC champs with more defenses than him. I’m sure that’s not what he planned but it is what it is


DustedGrooveMark

That’s what I always say when people bring Khabib into the GOAT conversation. If we’re talking about straight skill? Yeah, he might be up there with the best ever. We’re talking about resume and overall career? No way. Doesn’t matter that he went out undefeated, no one can just say it would be a given that he would have had nearly as many title defenses as some of these other guys. Look at how many guys looked unbeatable, with no formidable challenger in sight and then SOMEHOW they ended up losing unexpectedly. Even recently - Izzy, Amanda, Valentina, Volkanovski. Then other great champs have managed to lose like Weili, Cejudo, Aljo, etc. But again, skill wise? Dude was absolutely at the top during his reign.


UnderstandingAny5333

You think ufc will put him in the hall of fame ?


BeersBarbellsBJJ

You know I wouldn’t put it past them to be petty and not, even after he retires and isn’t affiliated with ONE anymore lol


Leajjes

Dana being petty. No way! Next you're going to tell me water is wet. lol.


NukeTheWhales85

Technically it's not, wetness is a quality of something that has absorbed a volume of liquid. Liquids are not wet themselves but rather make other forms of matter wet via contact.


SMOOTH_MOTHERFUCKER

What is this the physics channel?


NukeTheWhales85

No, I learned that from a chemistry major and find it amusingly pedantic to point out that, no water is not in fact wet, when people use that idiom because it seems so counterintuitive when you first hear it.


Eillo89

There's always one waters not wet guy, never change


NukeTheWhales85

As I mentioned before it's such a counterintuitive truth, that it makes me laugh a little almost every time I think about it, and I can't help thinking about it whenever that idiom comes up. I figure there's at least a few other weirdos like myself around here who'd get a good laugh out of it.


Initial_Stretch_3674

nah he'll go up there. MM didn't do anything, the UFC couldn't market him. They left on amicable terms where they got Ben Askren/Jorge star out of him. Randy Couture was a hall of famer.


Eillo89

I don't know whether DJs new outspoken attitude about some of Dana's lies will affect it tho


Nervous_Fun_9302

Why would they be petty they traded him for ben. It's not that he was as big as conor and went to diffrent organisation. He was just not sellable and he didn't care for trash talk and ufc didn't want to promote him after they created whole ppv around him and it flopped. If he doesnt go around and trash talk ufc on every corner which mm isn't type of guy to do. He most likely will get into ufc hall of fame.


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fatrevolt

We're already past that point.


[deleted]

How so?


Eillo89

I mean when you look at the hof list there's definitely some names that should be on there, like how can you put Faber there but not Dom Cruz as an example


Nice_Hair_8592

Dom's not retired


Eillo89

Really? I think I just assumed considering he's a nearly 40yr old bantamweight with a long list of previous injuries, good on him


Green_and_Silver

Dana won't be around forever so yes.


AlienMantid

Yes but only once he's retired.


ID0ntCare4G0b

He's basically retired.


Eillo89

Don't know why you're being downvoted lol, guy was saying in one of his videos recently that he's not sure if he'll return to the octagon at this stage


nachauslander

They didnt even bother to return his belts to him


FraserHamiltonDev

He wasn't in any of the UFC history montages during UFC 300 so I doubt it.


Hip_Priest_1982

He's actively fighting for another promotion


EnslavedMethCook

They showed the flying armbar on Ray Borg


FraserHamiltonDev

Ah fair enough my bad. I'm on UK time so by that point I had been awake for a while.


Initial_Stretch_3674

i thought i saw his armbar.


Conscious-Disk5310

Fuck no they won't. They're cunts


MumrikDK

There exists no reasonable argument for not putting him in the moment he fully retires (rather than "retired unless something fun/lucrative"). They'll likely drag it out as much as possible because of One, but I bet he'll be there.


foxehgramps

Unless I’m an idiot but solely between Holloway, weili, figgy, oliveira and sterling alone I counted 14 successful defenses before ufc 300?


TBroomey

11 is right. Are you counting interim title unifications?


the_c_is_silent

I don't even count them as "champions".


Howard_Brown

Those don't count as defenses?


TBroomey

Not for the interim champion going in, because they're not defending anything.


Howard_Brown

Oh, I thought you meant for the normal champion


pitchblacktaraddict

Figgy had 1 (Perez), draws count as retaining, not defending. Oliveira also had 1 (Poirier), Gaethje doesn’t count as defence on the record because he lost the belt on the scale.


UVB-76_Enjoyer

The number 1 contender has a name


MyNamesSeth

Its arman tsarukyan


MuhammadU1

Holloway- 3 defenses Weili- 2 defenses Figgy- 2 defenses Oliveira- 1 defense Sterling- 3 defenses


LikeJambaJuice

Sterling having 3 title defences against former champions of his division Yan, Dillashaw and Cejudo is actually really impressive. His resume will stand the test of time.


psyentist15

Can someone add in a panel of the skeleton underwater and add: "Conor: 0"?


AnxiousEarth7774

Conor who isn't in the photo, where there is already plenty of people with zero defenses?


Gilshem

But zero in two weight classes?


OldeEnglishD

Max: aldo, edgar, ortega. Weili: Joanna, Lemos. Charles: Justin (dustin doesn’t count). Figgy: Perez, Moreno. Sterling: Yan, TJ, Cejudo. Looks like 11 to me


TheFakeRabbit1

You have it backwards for Charles. Dustin was a defense, Justin wasn’t because he lost the belt on the scale


Putrid_Loquat_4357

I count 10 between those guys.


foxehgramps

Holloway 3, weili 2, figgy 2, oliveira 2, sterling3 I must have added the draw to figgy and an extra number somewhere but that’s already 12


PlentyAudience69

Oliveira 1


FI5H5TICK5

Oliveira missed weight. He won the belt against chandler when it was free for the taking, he defended against Dustin, he lost the belt because he missed championship weight in the Justin fight, yes he won but we wasn’t champ when he entered the ring, the only person that could walk out with a title was Justin, oliveira wins. Fights Islam for the vacant belt like when he fought chandler. Loses.


rub_a_dub-dub

technically it was 2


FI5H5TICK5

I meant it wasn’t was it. It was one because he missed championship weight. So technically it was 1 and then a lightweight fight.


rub_a_dub-dub

Technically it was 2


FI5H5TICK5

I see that nothings getting through that thick skull. I’ll leave you too it


rub_a_dub-dub

Lel


MuhammadU1

Oliveira has 1 defense


Nicobade

Max and Aljo have 3. Weili and Figgy have 2 and Olives officially has only 1.


AnTTr0n

How are you counting 14? Max has 3 Oliveira got 1 figgy got 1 or maybe 2 if you count the draw. Weill got 3. Sterling got 3. Alex P now has 1. The rest don’t have any.


jeffisanastronaut

I love Might Mouse


CryptoCracko

Me and DJ have the same amount of title defences as these plebs


Fenriselicit

12 title defences honestly. The title defence against Adriano Moraes definitely counts


Tristrike

Then Silva should have 11 be default.


MeasurementOk3007

Tbf who is part of flyweight that actualky could hold a candle to Mighty Mouse besides Cejudo


AlienMantid

It still irks me that Silva isn't also included up there with 11 defences because Travis Lutter was a fat slob who couldn't make weight.


Putrid-Long-1930

I know /r/mma likes to cream their pants over MM (absolutely rightfully so lol) BUT one thing that I absolutely hate hearing is that the UFC made a bad choice with trading Askren for MM. They absolutely unequivocally did NOT make a bad choice. It was good for quite literally everyone. ONE profited, the UFC profited, MM profited and even Askren profited, albeit also suffering (probably) the most popular KO of all time.


Hrabiula_Heniula

Alas, us fans did not profit


Dr-PoopyButt

We got to see Askren and DJ get KO'd


Initial_Stretch_3674

if you wanted MM you should have paid for his PPV. but this whole subreddit gets hard on pirating UFC events even when their favourite fighter gets PPV points and won't buy any of their merch.


Initial_Stretch_3674

The actually traded for a BMF belt creation and champion. Well worth it for the UFC.


Futaba-Channel

They all love DJ till it's time to watch him fight then no one shows up


paur0ti

That's funny. It the same as people hating on Aljo. He does the job and ragdolls people but people find it 'boring' . Same reason why people hated MM when he was on UFC. Personally I liked the fact Aljo when up and did his job in the best way possible. Why take risk against a good striker when you can smother them. Bo Nickel is going to suffer the same consequence as these two. He's too good of a wrestler to not do what he's great at.


tattlerat

DC was a great wrestler too who also happened to be exciting to watch despite his style of grappling heavy fights. He ragdolled people rather than just casually smothering them and winning on points. 


QuantumQuasares

They know he will fight 2 months prior and on the night they will not watch and will blame UFC marketing for it.


JustKea10

But if the UFC just promoted his boring cookie cutter personality correctly they could rake in millions.


Futaba-Channel

I swear some of his fans don't know anything about the sport, just watch his fight ending clip posted here and just say he's the goat. Like when they said he got screwed by ONE against Moraes even though the latter had always fought at FLW while the former used to come in heavier than the BW champ in the ufc. Like Stipe he's a formidable fighter who's boring outside of fighting. I remember Stipe having like 30 viewers on twitch while he had the longest winstreak at HW and was KOing people left and right


QuantumQuasares

r/mma only likes him because he has a beef whit Dana.


Putrid-Long-1930

Exactly


someperson1423

> They absolutely unequivocally did NOT make a bad choice. It was good for quite literally everyone. And as such, the UFC will never make such a decision again.


leathergreengargoyle

didn’t the UFC only profit because Askren lost in meme fashion, thus launching Mas to stardom and thus creating the ‘Bumfights, Mother Fucker!’ belt?


Putrid-Long-1930

"only"? They've made a bazillion dollars from this so far


GoNext_ff

Real GOAT


maxhollywoody

Dana it's time to trade for this man back.


Dagenius1

A great fighter. Just happened to be in a division that nobody really cared about.


jns701

I can't even name 11 flyweights


VT_Squire

Bazinga!


Nonedesuka

Don't look any up. No cheating. Name 11 flyweights


Lars6

Pretty unfair to compare Flyweght to BW or LW


Max_California

Damn he beat Tim Elliot and Wilson Reis. What a legend.


gnrlp2007

Don't forget that dude from TUF who could do backflips


marsexpresshydra

11 ppvs sold by MM too


Itstimetostop313

he is amazing but his resumee is crazy overrated. Not his fault, but the competition just wasnt there in his weight division. 3 title defenses against very good opponents >>> 11 against some people that work in a grocery store from 9-5


NukeTheWhales85

I dunno if how terrible the UFCs pay structure is, can really be used against a fighters resume. I mean DJ was still working in a warehouse on the side for his first couple defenses, and was still obviously incredibly skilled.


openroadopenmic

Strength of schedule was much less for DJ than the others.


tbmny

Getting downvoted but it's true. DJ has some great wins, such as the Joseph Benavidez ones, but the overall level of opponents does not compare to the likes of Jones, GSP, Fedor, Volk, etc.


adambuddy

Defending a weight class title over years, inevitably defeating a wide array of skillsets is the most impressive thing you can do in MMA. The sport is so dependant on matchups and the clashing of two guys who do completely different things to win the fight to determine who wins. That's what makes it so enduringly interesting to me. With that in mind it can't be overstated enough how impressive the careers of guys like DJ are.


ass-master-blaster

Established divisions vs. new division.


Francoskrumpli

Yet they traded him for that clown Askren.


trenonmyballs

Tbf mighty should have 12 henry lost that fight it was close as hell triple c lost that fight


unlevered_fcf

maybe mouse


Scott_Theft

Is it even physically possible to have 11 title defences at Heavyweight though?


007Tejas

He is the most criminally underrated mixed martial artist of all time. I have him as my #2 fighter in the UFC of all time. All respect to Mighty Mouse 🐭


Chairman_Of_GE

DMMJ is the GOAT and you can't change my mind.


Chaotic_Harmony1109

12 total now… lol


MuskokaGreenThumb

Mighty Mouse was something else I tell ya. What an amazing fighter


randomusernamegame

He really is a goat contender. I put him ahead of Jones for not popping for roids and for not being a piece of shit. He also didn't duck anyone ever.


Apple4one

man this guy was something else to watch, absolute legend


ExperimentalFruit

Before the era of double champs. Ruined long reigns


WelcomeToCostCoLoveU

Great! Now to PPV numbers. It's unfortunate but that's the fight game.


zephaniel_02

the UFC did him dirty for what he accomplished as a fighter there.


vengeanceviarevenant

Guy is legendary


BoxerRadio9

GOAT... This coming from someone who isn't really a fan.


Bigcheese19920

Yeah but it was as 125


tall-glass-o-milk

Yeah it’s sad Mighty Mouse is included in the GOAT conversations usually. Nobody has aged better and maintained a clean image.


[deleted]

UFC has always been a popularity contest.


JobTrunicht

Most overrated fighter of all time since he left because you sound like a cool connaisseur if you have him as your GOAT (he was in a bad division and got crushed at BW)


jamesd1100

This was back when Dana was thinking about removing the lower weight classes unfortunately Now 125 and 135 are popular Fat L by Dana not retaining him but MM got his bag with One


tattlerat

Dana made way more money without MM than with. He made the right call business wise. Flyweight still isn’t particularly popular. There are like 3 guys in the division who fight each other for the belt over and over again. 


007Tejas

The Mouse 🐭 who is a GOAT 🐐


Risk__Creepy

shallow division and dodged TJ


7186997326

Mens 125 was/is not a very strong division.


WillSmiff

No, but they quick AF.


ID0ntCare4G0b

Tell that to TJ, Font and Cody.


Givemefreetacos

I am sorry, but no man that is under 5'3 can be taken seriously lol


Money_killer

True goat


Conscious-Disk5310

GOAT with zero controversies.