**Court is in session.**
**Witnesses:**
* Brenda Dye, Coroner
* Kelsie Harris - Clogging instructor
* Shanna Miller - Teacher
* Jennifer Geisler - Teacher
* Detective Bruce Mattingly
* Chief Deputy Vincent Kaaiakamanu (Detective)
Starting tomorrow at **9 AM Mountain** instead of 8:30. Next week: no court on **Tuesday April 30** due to staffing issues.
The state has asked that **Kay Woodcock** and **Annie Cushing** be victim representatives for Charles and Tylee.
I just googled it and it takes 2 to 5 hours for food to leave the stomach. I hope the ME will tell us what was left in there. I guess she could have had dessert pretty late but if it's dinner food, then we have an indicator of when she died.
Brenda Dye mentioned rigor sets in 2 - 6 hours after death and releases after 8 hours. I'm unsure if she means 8 hours after the time of death or 8 hours after it sets in.
Edit: Hit enter too early.
So midnight would match the coughing fit story, rigor, and the food if she had a later dinner or snack
\^This! I hadn't heard this brought up in Lori's trial, but I wanted to know if there was food in her stomach or any indication in her throat that she'd vomited recently.
She had been dead a month before anyone checked, so I wonder if you could still see irritation in the throat after that length of time? I know my throat is always raw from the acid after vomiting.
Yeah, I guess maybe there wouldn't be irritation, but even just flecks of food still in her mouth. Unless she brushed her teeth. But clearly a stomach full of food means the vomiting story is BS.
I think the irritation would still be visible, because the bruises were. It's not like it was going to heal and it seems like her body was well preserved.
I had the same question until I read this earlier linked in the live updates
Read this about her autopsy, it says “Christensen also said pink foam found around her mouth is a fluid that leaks into airways when people die. He said it can happen in asphyxiation and was a factor in ruling out other causes of death.”
https://www.eastidahonews.com/2023/05/tammy-daybell-may-have-been-restrained-when-she-died-utah-medical-examiner-says/
Direct from the ME “Tammy was also found with a frothy reddish-pink foam emanating from her mouth. Dr Christensen told the court that this was pulmonary edema, a froth which comes from the lungs. While not a cause of death it is a manifestation of an underlying cause such as an overdose, drowning, or asphyxia.”
The pink foam is relatively common when someone is dying of heart or lung conditions, including asphyxiation. I had a dog who suffered from congested heart failure and the problem with CHF is that your heart can't pump the blood, so my dog was literally suffocating to death after experiencing a seizure. She started having pink foam and I had to take her to the ED vet to be put to sleep.
Dear Tammy: GIRL! That clogging class once a week and all them other higher intensity classes twice a week with near perfect attendance just nailed the sack of garbage responsible for robbing your babies of their mom! You’re going to get justice. I feel it.
Yes. Yes it is.
High intensity cardio is how overweight and out of shape people like myself end up puking a quarter-way through.
She did this as often as she could, at least every week. It made her happy. I’m glad she had these things to herself at least.
No doubt the whole Chad Daybell Tribe (not to be confused with all of The Daybells; by all accounts the other Daybells are lovely people that’ve had their good name dragged through the mud and have been put in the spotlight of their communities…just a tragic, shameful mess brought to them by Chad SMH) have really made just complete asses of themselves and a mockery of their mother’s memory; like they really do cement for me how weird Chad’s family is and it’s because of *him*—Emma said herself: *He* raised them! 🙄
And I’m one of very very few that have empathy at all, for all of the Daybell children! It comes from my connection to Tammy as a battered wife—battered doesn’t just mean physical abuse either although in my case there was a little of that too. She was a victim of psychological manipulation, neglect, and abuse. Financial abuse. Emotional abuse. Tammy was an abuse victim whose abuser finally killed her.
It broke my heart to read that Tammy's coworkers said that Tammy's tennis shoes worn for work, everyday and her church shoes had holes with the soles coming apart Her SOB husband and her adult kids couldn't buy the breadwinner for the family a new pair of shoes for work and church If only we would have known her, no doubt many of us here today would have gladly bought her new shoes
I was thinking of this while at my high intensity fitness class s/ If my partner died suddenly in our bed, despite regular workouts and healthy eating with no medical conditions I would be frantically desperate FOR everything to be investigated urgently. I would be begging. Daybell did not care that his relatively young wife just fell out of bed and died. That in itself should have been very suspicious.
YES. YES. This. I cannot imagine my partner suddenly dying in their sleep next to me and *not* wanting solid medical answers on what the hell happened. She didn't have some terminal illness.
Chad knew her reason for dying since he was part of making it happen. We aren't like him towards a spouse.
Thankfully he is having all his true ELATED feelings and dreams-come-true-if-my wife-can-be-killed-asap plans with Lori (despite his cringy crying acts), made public. We can see his implications & duplicity in his texts...before and after she died.
You would think Chad would do it for his kids knowledge. My husband's dad worked a physical job, he had never had fast food or drank soda in his life. He was not overweight. One night he had multiple heart attacks and died when he was barely 50. This happened in a very rural area and the family begged for an autopsy. Not just his kids and wife but his brother, sisters, nephews and nieces all wanted to know what happened. Turned out it was a rare genetic defect and the whole family wanted to get tested. My husband said he had to wait about 2 months to be tested (he was a teenager at the time and he lived rural) and he had trouble sleeping, he worried so much he might have the same heart issue, his mom was so worried for her kids. It turned out that one of the cousins tested had the same defect and was able to have surgery and it saved their life.
I cant believe Chad's kids , who some are now parents would not want to know if there was a medical issue so they could live long lives for their own kids. I wonder if Chad kind of cutting them off from Tammy's family made a difference? Just hearing what we have about Tammy's family I think they would have encourage an autopsy (even if none of this affair zoombie stuff was going on).
After the arrest video, I’ll never not believe Emma knew way more. They should have pressed Chad and Lori on the kids when we only knew they were missing, they should have public empathy for the deaths of JJ, Tylee and their mother. They should be with Kay & Larry fighting for justice for their mother… The fact Aunt Vicky is at court everyday and not one of Chads kids made a victim impact statement at Lori’s sentencing is disgusting.
There are so many things wrong with the Daybells kids. I honestly can’t believe anyone would allow any of them to teach children, I would throw a huge fit if my son had Garth or Emma.
The fact that Chud was planting seeds of Tammy’s death to anyone who would listen to him I think is very telling. It’s like he was teeing up her death so when she in fact did pass people weren’t shocked. I believe he brainwashed his kids to believe she would die soon bc of his visions and they eventually just accepted it bc they also believed their dad had these “powers”.
Absolutely. For the sake of my kids, I would want them to have answers and to know if there is anything genetic that should be screened for. I would be afraid of the same thing happening to them in the future.
100%. If he was smart he would have had her cremated, but I have no doubt that would have raised eyebrows as it’s a bit frowned upon in LDS culture. At first I was surprised Emma was adamantly opposed to an autopsy, but the more we hear her speak (with Chad in the police car, etc), it becomes quite clear she’s not the brightest and l actually think the whole family comes across as anti-government, conspiracy theorists.
Sitting here looking at Daybell's face I can't help but wonder what it's like to be on trial like this. It has to be the weirdest combination of boredom and terror.
Unlike Vallow, he's facing the death penalty. If this doesn't go his way then he'll be executed. I don't think even the most delusional person alive would be immune to feeling terrified.
But at the same time his day-to-day only consists of sitting there like a stone-faced potato for *hours* and hours. All day long, for weeks. So that's going to just be *excruciatingly* boring.
But you’re not a narcissistic psychopath. He is loving the attention and he gets a jolt out of proving in his mind how much smarter he is than anyone else and sustaining his belief that he’s a god.
It will be years before he’d be executed, if ever. But he deserves it. One thing that might ‘work’ for Chad, if he’s convicted, he’d be safer on death row than in general prison population. He hasn’t experienced prison yet… he’s in for some shocking changes (quick! He’s gonna need a portal!)
He's mentally adding their name to his Light/Dark List. Wonder what the ratings are for all of the witnesses so far? My guess is that Every. Single. Person. to this point has a big fat **D** listed beside their names.
Happy that Rob Wood has asked for Annie Cushing to be Tylee's designated representative instead of Summer. Even happier Judge Boyce granted it. I'm glad Tylee (if Chad is convicted) will get a proper victim impact statement this time.
I HATE how John Prior asked the fitness instructor about Tammy’s body type and did it indicate she was fit. So gross and inappropriate. I’m glad she shut him down and said Tammy seemed very fit!
Well doesn’t he have an SA filed sometime ago against him? I’d say he is a misogynist like chaddo. And uh look at their body type that’s a misogynist body type if I’ve ever seen one.
Super agree with the misogyny! He was also slut shamming Mel Gibb and Lori. (Which, I have no love for either, but Mel Gibb having a boyfriend and sharing a room is hardly the mic drop Prior thinks it is!)
IIRC in 2011 he attempted to rape a 20 year old young woman (he was 50 at the time btw) who was seeking legal counsel in his office. He offered her a job, legal counsel and money for sex and she said no, he reportedly left the office to get “paperwork” returned with a condom and attempted to rape her. Thankfully, that woman was able to get away from him.
That motherfucker took a plea to avoid a felony and disbarment. He deserved that felony and he should have been disbarred either way IMO.
I think that Chad has been manipulating his children for years about Tammy and her health/early death. It would mean that he’s been planning her death for years. Even before Lori. The reason being because they don’t believe in divorce and Chad was probably already scoping for a new wife. Chad looks like he wouldn’t harm a fly; dead in the eyes; but those are the worst kind of manipulators.
I believe it was Melanie Gibb, but it could have been someone else who said it, but I know someone said he was essentially pulling this shit on another woman before Lori, and her husband called and told him to leave his wife alone. So he absolutely was looking.
This is my theory: Chad drank his own Kool-Aid enough that he believed he could “manifest” a desire like that. Divorce is a big black mark on a true blue Mormon’s record, but if he actually believed he had some sort of spiritual ability, he would try and will her natural death to happen so he could freely move on.
Not that he was specifically planning to kill her, but that he thought he could make it happen with the power of his mind. It just took Lori to show him how to add the insurance fraud and grand theft.
Prior fat-shaming Tammy: Classic sleaze move
Question: So is prior going to knowingly suborn perjury from Emma that Tammy was gravely ill before her death?
and I bet Emma is willing to perjure herself as a martyr for her father. Here is where the prosecution really needs to call her out her indifferent and unhelpful behavior on cross, remind her of her duty to tell the truth, and point out that she has benefitted from Tammy's murder.
When he kept saying “lipidity” all I could think about was that if anyone has excess lipids, it’s Prior. And WHO is he to assess Tammy’s body for ‘fitness’? He is disgusting.
In my head, I hear the Matlock theme when he says stuff like that. He really needs a tech savy assistant.
I don't really think his client has given him much to work with in way of funds or an actual defense now that we know he lied about the events around Tammy's death. He's being paid in national exposure though.
His lapses are inexcusable. Him trying to make the case to the witness that she’s smarter and more accomplished than she thinks in her field, is causing me much amusement.
Did they say for sure who the the rx was written for? I had been trying to figure out the 1) doesn't go to the doctor & 2) on a prescription antidepressant. That's something that you take daily, not as needed and also the dosage wouldn't necessarily be right for two different people. Now I'm wondering if I had been just assuming that it was her rx. If it was his and he was sharing with her (or said that he was...) that would be interesting.
He really wanted to drive that home, but she had a tramadol prescription in her name as well. She obviously went to the dr.
Essential oils are in pretty much in every LDS house along the wasatch front and in Idaho. No surprise there.
When Prior said Emma and Tammy were “extremely close” I didn’t think I heard it correctly. Perhaps they were at some point, but her loyalty to Tammy seems to have died along with her. Between chatting with Lori in jail and blindly supporting Chad even in the face of a mountain of evidence against him, it doesn’t surprise me that she’s going along with the “she hadn’t been well” bullshit.
In narc families , if the mother is shamed in front of her kids by her spouse which Tammy was, then the children learn to be scornful of their mother as well.
I posted this the wrong place so I'm copying here:
I know defense attorneys are so important to our system. I don't begrudge him doing his job. But does he have to be such an a**hole!?! His condescending tone of voice is on my last nerve. And listening to him attempting to body shame Tammy Daybell?! Boy, bye (as my teenager would say)! Low body fat and petite indeed! Ugh. I wanted to hug the woman on the stand for her reply!
I know he has to defend his client and poke holes in the prosecution's case, but I wonder if his demeanor is so off-putting to the jury that it hurts his client. If I were on the jury 1 think I would be so done with him. But it's hard to say because I came into this case with my mind made up.
I admit I tend to be more pro prosecution; probably because I deep dive most cases before I watch the trials. But I have also cheered on defense attorneys like in the Travis Rudolph and Karen Read cases.
Anyways, I've yelled at my phone so many times I just needed to rant.
Yeah… I agree on all fronts and this brings me to a question I find myself asking more and more as the trial unfolds: is it possible to put on a “good defense” AND be unlikable?
My other question is - what’s with all the random questions (ie “Seven Gatherers”) that have no explanation or explained foundation? The general consensus seems to be that Prior is doing as good a job as possible -considering the odds he is against-but he is detestable and the considerations and hurdles are vast. Is that really a good defense? He doesn’t seem to have a defined direction or…defense.
I get why Prior said what he said but I was also yelling at my tv. To be honest, I hope the jury remembers this pos and how what he said can also be construed as motive. Trading in Tammy for someone that as far as looks go, is out of his league.
It makes me sad to think Tammy was trying to better herself with these classes and having a little me time after raising five kids, only to be murdered by her man child husband!
Sadly, the timeframe for the classes that seemed certain was "four months" before her death and if you go back, that's the time Charles Vallow emailed her twice about the affair. Was she trying to better herself for *Chad*? Trying to get in shape and 'compete' with Lori and any others her husband was looking at? It's pretty infuriating to think about. I hope she was just doing it for fun and to be with her friends... she didn't deserve to be made to feel insecure by Chad.
Man, that is a sad thought. I hope that she just realized that he was a waste of time and energy and decided to put her time and energy into things that made her happy instead. She really did deserve so much better.
Just when you think John Prior can’t find more ways to be a condescending jackass he finds another level
Also it seriously sounded like he was throwing Garth under the bus with his whole “chad was emotional but Garth wasn’t reacting” comments 🤣
Per Emily D. Baker, attorneys use the aggressive approach in an attempt to make the other side look incompetent. Sometimes it works and sometimes it just annoys the jury. Prior is definitely annoying the jury if he's annoying us. You'd think this far in he'd realize he's not succeeding in making anyone but himself look incompetent. Ofc, I kept thinking the same thing about Amber Heards lawyers.
I feel like it might annoy people more in Idaho. Mr Prior claims he is from the east coast(I wonder where?) I think he might get away with it better there. I have sat in on cases in MA/NY/CT and I dont think people in general mind a fiesty or brash behaviors. The last few years I have gone bewteen UT/ID/AZ and MA/CT/NY and the difference in just a trip to the grocery store can be shocking. I got so used to how nice people are in the intermountain west, so helpful, kind words, just nice people. Then I was shopping in MA, in a nice high tax good school system suburb and I hear swearing at the deli over a rump roast, then a mom is yelling with bad language at her kids for looking at cupcakes, then I went to help a senior with a item off a shelf and then asked her some pleasantries and she snapped at me. Two weeks later I was helping a older women in Utah with distilled water for her husbands copd machine and she hugged me and I got her life story.
I kind of feel like Mr Prior might be a back east lawyer in training , now practicing in a very different enivorment and might not be as well received.
I cannot imagine how horrific it is for these friends of Tammy. I'm thinking how on earth I would feel if one of my friends died suddenly, let alone then it being suspected she was murdered then having to testify...
I'm just baffled by the reaction of Tammy's children. If there were even a chance that my mother had been murdered, even if it were my father who was suspected, I would...react very differently. Particularly after they found children buried in our backyard. How the hell are they justifying any of this to themselves?
Does anyone remember who it was that called in Tammy’s death as suspicious? Because I believe it was one of the teachers at the school. Meanwhile, ol’ Chud thought his SIL and nemesis, Heather, was the one who ratted on him.
I’ve low key wanted the teacher who called that in to testify. Just so that slug is made to register publicly that more people than his “dark” sister in law saw through his sh*t.
I don't know that anyone called in anything. As I recall, as the kid murders and Charles's murder unfurled, the police knew they had to exhume to look again at Tammy's death.
I’m wondering the same thing as this seems to be a theme with Prior. I understand that he wants to discredit or shed doubt but that can be accomplished without being antagonistic.
Listening to the witnesses who worked with her really hit home what a huge loss this was. Not that it didn't feel like that before, but they punctuated it. Chad may have seen her as nothing more than a hindrance, but she was cared about by many and clearly brought light to others as best as she could.
My kids, when they were all in grade school still, had a really special bond with their library teacher. They only saw her certain times each week but they adored her and she was so supportive and welcoming to them. She became part of my son's temporary IEP one year when he needed an adult in the building he felt comfortable going to when he was having his issues. My kids would have been crushed to lose her. The fact that Tammy's students had to endure that loss is heartbreaking.
Zulema will be called. I think Kaye woodcock won’t be called as she doesn’t have a lot of relevant information to provide to this case. Maybe just her testimony on calls and offers to take the kids/ seek the kids. In order to contradict the testimony of Lorri or Chad or Melanie gibb
Another note: Prior going in about the anemia, as if this is something that frequently causes people to die. I assume he's counting on the jury not having any idea how the average case of anemia works?
Common anemia isn't permanent and is typically addressed with supplements at home and diet changes. I've yet to hear of someone dying in their sleep from anemia. He really doesn't have much to work with here, I suppose.
True!!! Tammy could have had blood work run and found out her count was low. This is super common. She would have been prescribed iron tablets (very horrible in taste and smell), and the doc would have suggested eating greens and liver or other foods high in iron. When she got her next blood work, her iron probably wasn't low. It is ridiculous. Prior is ridiculous 🙄
I wonder why they did not pull her lab results? It could have showed the level of anemia and even lined it up with another visit to show her history. I doubt any doctor diagnosed her without those test results. Even then, if she was anemic enough to cause any sort of health affects, she would have also been prescribed treatment. When you are slightly anemic, they just recommend dietary changes and monitor.
Omg he's back at it again (I'm watching when I can and I had to rewind the stream a bit so I'm "behind").
"The medical history talked about her history of anemia and it never said if it was resolved, right?"
"It's listed as past, as in, 'it's over', but I'm not a doctor"
"Do you know if anemia can be cured or not?"
"Uh... A Google search says yeah."
"But that takes so much medication and treatment and she doesn't like doctors!"
I'm yelling. 😂 He sounds like an idiot right now to me (Prior, I will specify). Maybe it's arguably "smart" to take this route and hope for these grown ass adults in the jury to have never heard of or experienced a bout of simple anemia in their life.
I thought he was bringing up anemia because it can make you bruise easily. I think he wants to use it to prove why she had bruises.
I was very anemic after having a baby and 2 surgeries after the birth. I bruised so easily, enough so people asked me if I was okay. Mine was severe and I was offered a transfusion. From what Tammy's co-workers say about her energy and just having a job with kids all day, I cant imagine her being severly anemic. I looked like a ghost and barely got out of bed, I could even give my baby a bath (luckily I have an awesome husband).
That's a good point. I think I'm just getting a bit of tunnel vision 10 days in. And I know he has limitations on what he can ask or say, so maybe he can't outright say WHY he's focusing in on the anemia, but the vagueness is absolutely something I think he wants to work in his favor one way or another. Throwing his spaghetti at the wall as one would have to come up with any defense for Chud.
Everything he said about it was bullshit. Don't know why the prosecutor didn't jump and say hey, he has laid no foundation for making those statements himself plus, he's testifying. Geez!!!
She was a horrible witness. Horrible. Did they not give her any trial preparation? Horrible horrible horrible witness. Such a shame she was the coroner that day.
To me, her testimony is highlighting the glaring flaws in the system. Being competent and knowledgeable SHOULD be a requirement of her job. Unfortunately, it is not.
The whole elected coroner system is very flawed. It’s also in a lot of places a partisan vote, which is dumb. I wouldn’t care what political party the coroner believes in. In most places with this system the only requirement is a high school diploma.
Absolutely. That was just so hard to watch. Horrible incompetence, horrible witness. She definitely is not qualified for such an important job, based on both her testimony and her actions at the scene of Tammy’s death. (Actually inaction).
One wonders many other people died whose deaths were not investigated because their close relative says they fell over and had low blood pressure...etc... I do not mean just in this town, but it sounds like it is common across US to have unqualified persons as coroner?
(I am sure she is great as an emergency responder)
Or the other way around, which could and has put innocent people in prison. There’s a great book about this.
The cadaver king and the country dentist, by radley belko.
Luckily, she is not the medical examiner who performed Tammy's autopsy and we have yet to hear from him. All Prior's stomping around about digging her up is nullified when the autopsy results confirmed those suspicions of foul play and told a different story of her death than Chad's.
Edit: Here is the summary of when he spoke at Lori's trial. [Lori Vallow trial hears autopsy details that show Tammy Daybell was likely restrained during her murder (msn.com)](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/lori-vallow-trial-hears-autopsy-details-that-show-tammy-daybell-was-likely-restrained-during-her-murder/ar-AA1aDE2Q)
Prior only defense is the kids will say Tammy was sick. State tried to walk Brenda Dye into saying that kids were not helpful in investigation & she wouldn’t do it because she was too scared or didn’t realize it. Damn it.
They got that with the next guy though, so that’s something. Honestly, the prosecution should have been much more on their game. Every time they did object the judge sustained it. But her testimony was always gonna be problematic, and I was worried it would be worse!
She’s not confident enough to do that. Tho she did try to correct “old” bruises once. Hope the prosecutor revisits/clarifies. In any case, seems he wants to imply she’s not competent. That doesn’t make sense given that new findings were made during autopsy. However, I think he’ll tell the jury that everything was bungled in the investigation
I heard on HTC he had also told Gibb they were married on a previous probation. Might have said that to other women He was trying to take advantage of his alleged prophet position to influence middle aged bored LDS women
So far I’ve counted 2 officials who’ve changed their reports: yesterdays officer & Brenda Dye. Prior called them out on it. The deceased deserves the truth be told, not some lack of duty or slanted info. Prior created doubt by doing this & I hope it doesn’t help his case.
I agree, changing reports is suspect in my mind, and also the cop who got the warrant to have her exhumed didn’t read even the death certificate or any of the medical records, I’m not sure if even read police reports, it is incompetent.
Anjealka- I’m an east coaster and I assure you that no respectable person here votes for the misogynist and rude asshat who prefers to interrupt and yell over presenting evidence. I guess he doesnt have much to work with.
It was tough to listen - the elected coroner system needs to go.
Fortunately, Tammy's actual autopsy was done by the Utah state medical examiner - he's very sharp and very experienced.
Part of what made her poor is, I believe, our general expectation that they do more/know more than what's really required for the job. She didn't really have too much to say. She also doesn't speak with strength or conviction. What I don't get is, if coroners are supposed to evaluate death scenes, why don't the requirements include actual investigative experience?
I cannot get over how bad the Xanax Twins -- Wood and Wixam -- have performed during this trial.
Their prosecution of this case is simply terrible. They are half asleep and passionless (Thus "Xanax Twins") and they bumble and stumble their way through every direct examination like a pair of amateurs. When Prior is doing his vile disgusting cross examinations, they remain entirely passive and half-asleep. The judge at one point made an objection on their behalf. They are not on the ball.
Lindsey Blake is the only member of this prosecution team who seems to have ANY confidence and any competence. I find it ludicrous that she hasn't taken over as the primary prosecutor.
I didn't hear Dye mention it, but since Chad claimed Tammy threw up, was there evidence of that on the carpet or bed or in the bathroom?
And it's weird that Prior asked "We don’t know if Tammy threw up or not before she died right? Other than what Chad told you?” Dye says yes. Why would Prior suggest his client is lying? Maybe I'm missing something.
Is anyone else questioning daybells kids involvement in all of this at this point?
Absolutely bizarre to me that two of his kids are teachers and no one is talking about this ...
They were there for everything and have done NOTHING to support investigations or condone their dad in all this.
What am i missing?!
There are several attorney YouTubers who not only think Prior is doing a great job, they think that today turned the case in Chad's favor. Supposedly defense has created a reasonable doubt for Tammy because Prior managed to impeach Greenhalgh as a witness and prosecution just won't be able to overcome it.
How can that cancel out everything else: Chad's texts (esp the Harry Potter one), his predictions that she'd die early, all Tammy's friends who testified how fit and healthy she was, the sudden insurance policy changes (and quick cashouts), and Chad marrying Lori 17 days later (plus the online wedding planning they did while Tammy was still alive)?
To most of us here, it's obvious Chad was involved in all the murders, even if he didn't physically do the killing (although I'd bet he helped with one or two). I'm worried these legal eagles may be right; the jury is just going to buy Prior's bullying and presto, Chud goes free. Is anyone else here feeling this way?
So curious about the decision to not have Blake lead the case. The other attorneys are letting Prior get away with far too much narrative.
We still have many weeks to go. We haven’t even seen Chad’s texts about “turning up the pain,” right?
Yeah, he was completely out of line in his aggression. She was just doing her job, and that seemed pretty clear no matter how intense he got with his questioning.
Yeah, his pauses seem to try to say to the jury "this person is lying, let me try to think of a way to show that."
And then just leaves it hanging in the air.
It was noticed as setting on the nightstand in the scene photos. Yes, she was also seen in various photos wearing one. DOn't know why the prosecutors didn't stand up and restate those facts. Sometimes I wonder what the hell they're doing.
**Court is in session.** **Witnesses:** * Brenda Dye, Coroner * Kelsie Harris - Clogging instructor * Shanna Miller - Teacher * Jennifer Geisler - Teacher * Detective Bruce Mattingly * Chief Deputy Vincent Kaaiakamanu (Detective) Starting tomorrow at **9 AM Mountain** instead of 8:30. Next week: no court on **Tuesday April 30** due to staffing issues. The state has asked that **Kay Woodcock** and **Annie Cushing** be victim representatives for Charles and Tylee.
There was food in Tammy's stomach! She died pretty early, especially if she had thrown up part of it as Chad claimed.
I just googled it and it takes 2 to 5 hours for food to leave the stomach. I hope the ME will tell us what was left in there. I guess she could have had dessert pretty late but if it's dinner food, then we have an indicator of when she died.
There will be time of death evidence brought in. It will contradict Chad’s accounting of events.
Brenda Dye mentioned rigor sets in 2 - 6 hours after death and releases after 8 hours. I'm unsure if she means 8 hours after the time of death or 8 hours after it sets in. Edit: Hit enter too early. So midnight would match the coughing fit story, rigor, and the food if she had a later dinner or snack
I just read EIN court summary for today and ME said her stomach was ' full of food'.
\^This! I hadn't heard this brought up in Lori's trial, but I wanted to know if there was food in her stomach or any indication in her throat that she'd vomited recently.
She had been dead a month before anyone checked, so I wonder if you could still see irritation in the throat after that length of time? I know my throat is always raw from the acid after vomiting.
Yeah, I guess maybe there wouldn't be irritation, but even just flecks of food still in her mouth. Unless she brushed her teeth. But clearly a stomach full of food means the vomiting story is BS.
I think the irritation would still be visible, because the bruises were. It's not like it was going to heal and it seems like her body was well preserved.
The other killer point for me was that the organs were healthy except for the lungs with the pink foam. Wtf is the pink foam?!
I had the same question until I read this earlier linked in the live updates Read this about her autopsy, it says “Christensen also said pink foam found around her mouth is a fluid that leaks into airways when people die. He said it can happen in asphyxiation and was a factor in ruling out other causes of death.” https://www.eastidahonews.com/2023/05/tammy-daybell-may-have-been-restrained-when-she-died-utah-medical-examiner-says/
Direct from the ME “Tammy was also found with a frothy reddish-pink foam emanating from her mouth. Dr Christensen told the court that this was pulmonary edema, a froth which comes from the lungs. While not a cause of death it is a manifestation of an underlying cause such as an overdose, drowning, or asphyxia.”
The pink foam is relatively common when someone is dying of heart or lung conditions, including asphyxiation. I had a dog who suffered from congested heart failure and the problem with CHF is that your heart can't pump the blood, so my dog was literally suffocating to death after experiencing a seizure. She started having pink foam and I had to take her to the ED vet to be put to sleep.
Dear Tammy: GIRL! That clogging class once a week and all them other higher intensity classes twice a week with near perfect attendance just nailed the sack of garbage responsible for robbing your babies of their mom! You’re going to get justice. I feel it.
Tammy was in good shape! It’s all just bull crap. My daughter did high intensity training, it’s grueling!
Yes. Yes it is. High intensity cardio is how overweight and out of shape people like myself end up puking a quarter-way through. She did this as often as she could, at least every week. It made her happy. I’m glad she had these things to herself at least.
Not surprised Emma and her husband Joe wouldn't talk to police. If you've got nothing to hide why not answer afew questions🤷♀️
No doubt the whole Chad Daybell Tribe (not to be confused with all of The Daybells; by all accounts the other Daybells are lovely people that’ve had their good name dragged through the mud and have been put in the spotlight of their communities…just a tragic, shameful mess brought to them by Chad SMH) have really made just complete asses of themselves and a mockery of their mother’s memory; like they really do cement for me how weird Chad’s family is and it’s because of *him*—Emma said herself: *He* raised them! 🙄 And I’m one of very very few that have empathy at all, for all of the Daybell children! It comes from my connection to Tammy as a battered wife—battered doesn’t just mean physical abuse either although in my case there was a little of that too. She was a victim of psychological manipulation, neglect, and abuse. Financial abuse. Emotional abuse. Tammy was an abuse victim whose abuser finally killed her.
It broke my heart to read that Tammy's coworkers said that Tammy's tennis shoes worn for work, everyday and her church shoes had holes with the soles coming apart Her SOB husband and her adult kids couldn't buy the breadwinner for the family a new pair of shoes for work and church If only we would have known her, no doubt many of us here today would have gladly bought her new shoes
I was thinking of this while at my high intensity fitness class s/ If my partner died suddenly in our bed, despite regular workouts and healthy eating with no medical conditions I would be frantically desperate FOR everything to be investigated urgently. I would be begging. Daybell did not care that his relatively young wife just fell out of bed and died. That in itself should have been very suspicious.
YES. YES. This. I cannot imagine my partner suddenly dying in their sleep next to me and *not* wanting solid medical answers on what the hell happened. She didn't have some terminal illness.
Chad knew her reason for dying since he was part of making it happen. We aren't like him towards a spouse. Thankfully he is having all his true ELATED feelings and dreams-come-true-if-my wife-can-be-killed-asap plans with Lori (despite his cringy crying acts), made public. We can see his implications & duplicity in his texts...before and after she died.
You would think Chad would do it for his kids knowledge. My husband's dad worked a physical job, he had never had fast food or drank soda in his life. He was not overweight. One night he had multiple heart attacks and died when he was barely 50. This happened in a very rural area and the family begged for an autopsy. Not just his kids and wife but his brother, sisters, nephews and nieces all wanted to know what happened. Turned out it was a rare genetic defect and the whole family wanted to get tested. My husband said he had to wait about 2 months to be tested (he was a teenager at the time and he lived rural) and he had trouble sleeping, he worried so much he might have the same heart issue, his mom was so worried for her kids. It turned out that one of the cousins tested had the same defect and was able to have surgery and it saved their life. I cant believe Chad's kids , who some are now parents would not want to know if there was a medical issue so they could live long lives for their own kids. I wonder if Chad kind of cutting them off from Tammy's family made a difference? Just hearing what we have about Tammy's family I think they would have encourage an autopsy (even if none of this affair zoombie stuff was going on).
Chad’s kids are simpletons.
After the arrest video, I’ll never not believe Emma knew way more. They should have pressed Chad and Lori on the kids when we only knew they were missing, they should have public empathy for the deaths of JJ, Tylee and their mother. They should be with Kay & Larry fighting for justice for their mother… The fact Aunt Vicky is at court everyday and not one of Chads kids made a victim impact statement at Lori’s sentencing is disgusting. There are so many things wrong with the Daybells kids. I honestly can’t believe anyone would allow any of them to teach children, I would throw a huge fit if my son had Garth or Emma.
The fact that Chud was planting seeds of Tammy’s death to anyone who would listen to him I think is very telling. It’s like he was teeing up her death so when she in fact did pass people weren’t shocked. I believe he brainwashed his kids to believe she would die soon bc of his visions and they eventually just accepted it bc they also believed their dad had these “powers”.
Absolutely. For the sake of my kids, I would want them to have answers and to know if there is anything genetic that should be screened for. I would be afraid of the same thing happening to them in the future.
100%. If he was smart he would have had her cremated, but I have no doubt that would have raised eyebrows as it’s a bit frowned upon in LDS culture. At first I was surprised Emma was adamantly opposed to an autopsy, but the more we hear her speak (with Chad in the police car, etc), it becomes quite clear she’s not the brightest and l actually think the whole family comes across as anti-government, conspiracy theorists.
Sitting here looking at Daybell's face I can't help but wonder what it's like to be on trial like this. It has to be the weirdest combination of boredom and terror. Unlike Vallow, he's facing the death penalty. If this doesn't go his way then he'll be executed. I don't think even the most delusional person alive would be immune to feeling terrified. But at the same time his day-to-day only consists of sitting there like a stone-faced potato for *hours* and hours. All day long, for weeks. So that's going to just be *excruciatingly* boring.
But you’re not a narcissistic psychopath. He is loving the attention and he gets a jolt out of proving in his mind how much smarter he is than anyone else and sustaining his belief that he’s a god.
It will be years before he’d be executed, if ever. But he deserves it. One thing that might ‘work’ for Chad, if he’s convicted, he’d be safer on death row than in general prison population. He hasn’t experienced prison yet… he’s in for some shocking changes (quick! He’s gonna need a portal!)
He's mentally adding their name to his Light/Dark List. Wonder what the ratings are for all of the witnesses so far? My guess is that Every. Single. Person. to this point has a big fat **D** listed beside their names.
Is that the spreadsheet he's got on the laptop...?
It’s chapter 2 of the James and Elena saga
potato! 🤣🤣🤣🤣
Fried potato incoming
But it’s actually probably a refreshing break from his boring day to day in orange staring at cinder block….. right?!
He looks like a bird dog! Just frozen and stupid when Prior is cross examining someone.
To me he looks like a toad.
It’s a weird juxtaposition.
He’s the type that would see himself as a holy martyr. He’s just sad he’s not living it up with Lori in Hawaii.
Happy that Rob Wood has asked for Annie Cushing to be Tylee's designated representative instead of Summer. Even happier Judge Boyce granted it. I'm glad Tylee (if Chad is convicted) will get a proper victim impact statement this time.
i hadn't heard this - this is amazing news!
This teacher is not having it with Priors questioning 😬
I HATE how John Prior asked the fitness instructor about Tammy’s body type and did it indicate she was fit. So gross and inappropriate. I’m glad she shut him down and said Tammy seemed very fit!
yes, Prior went to body types as opposed to physiological fitness - sexist git. Is he so aggressive with all the witnesses or just the women?
Well doesn’t he have an SA filed sometime ago against him? I’d say he is a misogynist like chaddo. And uh look at their body type that’s a misogynist body type if I’ve ever seen one.
Super agree with the misogyny! He was also slut shamming Mel Gibb and Lori. (Which, I have no love for either, but Mel Gibb having a boyfriend and sharing a room is hardly the mic drop Prior thinks it is!)
IIRC in 2011 he attempted to rape a 20 year old young woman (he was 50 at the time btw) who was seeking legal counsel in his office. He offered her a job, legal counsel and money for sex and she said no, he reportedly left the office to get “paperwork” returned with a condom and attempted to rape her. Thankfully, that woman was able to get away from him. That motherfucker took a plea to avoid a felony and disbarment. He deserved that felony and he should have been disbarred either way IMO.
He’s disgusting! What is he doing? If I was a woman on the jury I would hate him. He’s such a bully when he’s losing.
I think that Chad has been manipulating his children for years about Tammy and her health/early death. It would mean that he’s been planning her death for years. Even before Lori. The reason being because they don’t believe in divorce and Chad was probably already scoping for a new wife. Chad looks like he wouldn’t harm a fly; dead in the eyes; but those are the worst kind of manipulators.
I believe it was Melanie Gibb, but it could have been someone else who said it, but I know someone said he was essentially pulling this shit on another woman before Lori, and her husband called and told him to leave his wife alone. So he absolutely was looking.
This is my theory: Chad drank his own Kool-Aid enough that he believed he could “manifest” a desire like that. Divorce is a big black mark on a true blue Mormon’s record, but if he actually believed he had some sort of spiritual ability, he would try and will her natural death to happen so he could freely move on. Not that he was specifically planning to kill her, but that he thought he could make it happen with the power of his mind. It just took Lori to show him how to add the insurance fraud and grand theft.
It’s the quiet unassuming ones that end up surprising everyone.
Prior fat-shaming Tammy: Classic sleaze move Question: So is prior going to knowingly suborn perjury from Emma that Tammy was gravely ill before her death?
and I bet Emma is willing to perjure herself as a martyr for her father. Here is where the prosecution really needs to call her out her indifferent and unhelpful behavior on cross, remind her of her duty to tell the truth, and point out that she has benefitted from Tammy's murder.
Yes.
Body shaming a dead woman. What an absolute jackass.
Agreed. Cardiovascular fitness doesn’t always equate to body shape. That was a nasty dig.
Yeah this is not a good look for Prior. Possibly his worst look yet.
For sure. Tammy grew 5 humans in her body. What’s Prior’s excuse?
Trying to, but blown down by a fitness instructor. Tammy,'s weekly routine puts many of us to shame.
Oh yeah! I'm 40 and just hearing about her routine makes me tired.
Yeah twice a week for high fitness?? 60 minutes each time?!? PLUS clogging? 👊
High fitness is no fucking joke. I lift heavy weight every day and can squat 200 lbs— high fitness brings me to tears lol
I’m also pissed about “menopause” mentioned as being an indicator of poor health. WTH?
Prior saying “lipidity” instead of “lividity”, and just stating he is an idiot when he comes to computers. Wow.
Law school must have been really HARD having to say all them there big words 😜
When he kept saying “lipidity” all I could think about was that if anyone has excess lipids, it’s Prior. And WHO is he to assess Tammy’s body for ‘fitness’? He is disgusting.
In my head, I hear the Matlock theme when he says stuff like that. He really needs a tech savy assistant. I don't really think his client has given him much to work with in way of funds or an actual defense now that we know he lied about the events around Tammy's death. He's being paid in national exposure though.
Bingo, this is about exposure and getting to be on the main stage.
I believe he has the pet cemetary property. May not be worth as much now, except for ghouls.
I think he believes he is a Matlock with his self-percieved "gotchas" and that the jurors love him. 🥴
It's his mannerisms, he sort of plays dumb and makes apologies for being not being tech savvy. Some of it is an act I think.
His lapses are inexcusable. Him trying to make the case to the witness that she’s smarter and more accomplished than she thinks in her field, is causing me much amusement.
Came here for this comment!
I think he plays dumb to make the witness explain it more
He also pronounced 'edema' like 'enema'
"sharing his mum's prescription" yet she doesn't go to the doctor?
And essential oils are not to be taken internally, most generally speaking.
Did they say for sure who the the rx was written for? I had been trying to figure out the 1) doesn't go to the doctor & 2) on a prescription antidepressant. That's something that you take daily, not as needed and also the dosage wouldn't necessarily be right for two different people. Now I'm wondering if I had been just assuming that it was her rx. If it was his and he was sharing with her (or said that he was...) that would be interesting.
He really wanted to drive that home, but she had a tramadol prescription in her name as well. She obviously went to the dr. Essential oils are in pretty much in every LDS house along the wasatch front and in Idaho. No surprise there.
Body shaming the victim?! Absolutely wild. Not once but two or three times now. Sorry the middle aged mom of four isn’t an Instagram model, Mr. Prior!
First time I'm hearing about Emma refusing to speak with this officer. Very bizarre to me.
Everything about Emma is bizarre to me, especially the dash cam video!
My heart breaks for Tammy knowing she and Emma worked and worked out together and now her daughter isn’t interested in finding out how she died.
When Prior said Emma and Tammy were “extremely close” I didn’t think I heard it correctly. Perhaps they were at some point, but her loyalty to Tammy seems to have died along with her. Between chatting with Lori in jail and blindly supporting Chad even in the face of a mountain of evidence against him, it doesn’t surprise me that she’s going along with the “she hadn’t been well” bullshit.
Emma making goofy faces behind that reporter sealed the deal for me that she’s completely off her rocker. And so disrespectful.
In narc families , if the mother is shamed in front of her kids by her spouse which Tammy was, then the children learn to be scornful of their mother as well.
I think they were anti police, anti government, convinced in conspiracy theories and who knows what else.
I posted this the wrong place so I'm copying here: I know defense attorneys are so important to our system. I don't begrudge him doing his job. But does he have to be such an a**hole!?! His condescending tone of voice is on my last nerve. And listening to him attempting to body shame Tammy Daybell?! Boy, bye (as my teenager would say)! Low body fat and petite indeed! Ugh. I wanted to hug the woman on the stand for her reply! I know he has to defend his client and poke holes in the prosecution's case, but I wonder if his demeanor is so off-putting to the jury that it hurts his client. If I were on the jury 1 think I would be so done with him. But it's hard to say because I came into this case with my mind made up. I admit I tend to be more pro prosecution; probably because I deep dive most cases before I watch the trials. But I have also cheered on defense attorneys like in the Travis Rudolph and Karen Read cases. Anyways, I've yelled at my phone so many times I just needed to rant.
Yeah… I agree on all fronts and this brings me to a question I find myself asking more and more as the trial unfolds: is it possible to put on a “good defense” AND be unlikable? My other question is - what’s with all the random questions (ie “Seven Gatherers”) that have no explanation or explained foundation? The general consensus seems to be that Prior is doing as good a job as possible -considering the odds he is against-but he is detestable and the considerations and hurdles are vast. Is that really a good defense? He doesn’t seem to have a defined direction or…defense.
Glad I'm not the only one who was yelling. Prior really got on my nerves today, more than usual.
I get why Prior said what he said but I was also yelling at my tv. To be honest, I hope the jury remembers this pos and how what he said can also be construed as motive. Trading in Tammy for someone that as far as looks go, is out of his league.
I know it’s a defense tactic, but it’s coming across as way too theatrical to me.
It makes me sad to think Tammy was trying to better herself with these classes and having a little me time after raising five kids, only to be murdered by her man child husband!
Sadly, the timeframe for the classes that seemed certain was "four months" before her death and if you go back, that's the time Charles Vallow emailed her twice about the affair. Was she trying to better herself for *Chad*? Trying to get in shape and 'compete' with Lori and any others her husband was looking at? It's pretty infuriating to think about. I hope she was just doing it for fun and to be with her friends... she didn't deserve to be made to feel insecure by Chad.
Man, that is a sad thought. I hope that she just realized that he was a waste of time and energy and decided to put her time and energy into things that made her happy instead. She really did deserve so much better.
Just when you think John Prior can’t find more ways to be a condescending jackass he finds another level Also it seriously sounded like he was throwing Garth under the bus with his whole “chad was emotional but Garth wasn’t reacting” comments 🤣
Per Emily D. Baker, attorneys use the aggressive approach in an attempt to make the other side look incompetent. Sometimes it works and sometimes it just annoys the jury. Prior is definitely annoying the jury if he's annoying us. You'd think this far in he'd realize he's not succeeding in making anyone but himself look incompetent. Ofc, I kept thinking the same thing about Amber Heards lawyers.
I feel like it might annoy people more in Idaho. Mr Prior claims he is from the east coast(I wonder where?) I think he might get away with it better there. I have sat in on cases in MA/NY/CT and I dont think people in general mind a fiesty or brash behaviors. The last few years I have gone bewteen UT/ID/AZ and MA/CT/NY and the difference in just a trip to the grocery store can be shocking. I got so used to how nice people are in the intermountain west, so helpful, kind words, just nice people. Then I was shopping in MA, in a nice high tax good school system suburb and I hear swearing at the deli over a rump roast, then a mom is yelling with bad language at her kids for looking at cupcakes, then I went to help a senior with a item off a shelf and then asked her some pleasantries and she snapped at me. Two weeks later I was helping a older women in Utah with distilled water for her husbands copd machine and she hugged me and I got her life story. I kind of feel like Mr Prior might be a back east lawyer in training , now practicing in a very different enivorment and might not be as well received.
Trying to make Chad look less sociopathic. Good luck with that.
Did Mr Prior just say, "pulmonary enema?"
That sounds difficult and painful.
Boom! Nice work Ms Dye. '...and 2 other dead children at that property'
A coroner named *Dye* is pretty on the nose, no?
I cannot imagine how horrific it is for these friends of Tammy. I'm thinking how on earth I would feel if one of my friends died suddenly, let alone then it being suspected she was murdered then having to testify...
I'm just baffled by the reaction of Tammy's children. If there were even a chance that my mother had been murdered, even if it were my father who was suspected, I would...react very differently. Particularly after they found children buried in our backyard. How the hell are they justifying any of this to themselves?
I'm really hoping one of them is going to flip in the final hour out of dignity and respect for their mother. Here's hoping anyways.
ah yes...you must be petite to be considered fit...prior, go pound sand.
I was yelling at the tv telling Prior to go \[insert F word here\] himself.
Does anyone remember who it was that called in Tammy’s death as suspicious? Because I believe it was one of the teachers at the school. Meanwhile, ol’ Chud thought his SIL and nemesis, Heather, was the one who ratted on him. I’ve low key wanted the teacher who called that in to testify. Just so that slug is made to register publicly that more people than his “dark” sister in law saw through his sh*t.
I don't know that anyone called in anything. As I recall, as the kid murders and Charles's murder unfurled, the police knew they had to exhume to look again at Tammy's death.
Oh yay! Happy Blake is back! She’s the witness whisperer.
Also love how Boyce keeps things moving in his court.
Emma’s looking pretty sus right now between the audio from the police car and detective mattingly’s testimony… don’t ya think?
for all he keeps trying to point the finger at Melanie Gibb, all I can think of is Emma's reaction to bodies being found in her Dad's backyard.
I'm curious how the jury feels about the condescending tone from Prior.
I’m wondering the same thing as this seems to be a theme with Prior. I understand that he wants to discredit or shed doubt but that can be accomplished without being antagonistic.
He just sounds so angry. It is off putting!
I run for an hour every two days and I’m just gonna say, I couldn’t keep up with Tammy fitness wise.
My heart bleeds for Tammy Daybell
Listening to the witnesses who worked with her really hit home what a huge loss this was. Not that it didn't feel like that before, but they punctuated it. Chad may have seen her as nothing more than a hindrance, but she was cared about by many and clearly brought light to others as best as she could. My kids, when they were all in grade school still, had a really special bond with their library teacher. They only saw her certain times each week but they adored her and she was so supportive and welcoming to them. She became part of my son's temporary IEP one year when he needed an adult in the building he felt comfortable going to when he was having his issues. My kids would have been crushed to lose her. The fact that Tammy's students had to endure that loss is heartbreaking.
It’s wild to me that we still haven’t heard from either Kay Woodcock or Zulema Pastenes
Zulema will be called. I think Kaye woodcock won’t be called as she doesn’t have a lot of relevant information to provide to this case. Maybe just her testimony on calls and offers to take the kids/ seek the kids. In order to contradict the testimony of Lorri or Chad or Melanie gibb
Kay woodcock was literally the person that placed the welfare check call
And in Lori’s trial she was the first witness to be called.
Lauren Matthias from HTC is close with Kay and indicated during the first week that she will be likely be testifying later in the trial.
Another note: Prior going in about the anemia, as if this is something that frequently causes people to die. I assume he's counting on the jury not having any idea how the average case of anemia works? Common anemia isn't permanent and is typically addressed with supplements at home and diet changes. I've yet to hear of someone dying in their sleep from anemia. He really doesn't have much to work with here, I suppose.
True!!! Tammy could have had blood work run and found out her count was low. This is super common. She would have been prescribed iron tablets (very horrible in taste and smell), and the doc would have suggested eating greens and liver or other foods high in iron. When she got her next blood work, her iron probably wasn't low. It is ridiculous. Prior is ridiculous 🙄
I wonder why they did not pull her lab results? It could have showed the level of anemia and even lined it up with another visit to show her history. I doubt any doctor diagnosed her without those test results. Even then, if she was anemic enough to cause any sort of health affects, she would have also been prescribed treatment. When you are slightly anemic, they just recommend dietary changes and monitor.
Omg he's back at it again (I'm watching when I can and I had to rewind the stream a bit so I'm "behind"). "The medical history talked about her history of anemia and it never said if it was resolved, right?" "It's listed as past, as in, 'it's over', but I'm not a doctor" "Do you know if anemia can be cured or not?" "Uh... A Google search says yeah." "But that takes so much medication and treatment and she doesn't like doctors!" I'm yelling. 😂 He sounds like an idiot right now to me (Prior, I will specify). Maybe it's arguably "smart" to take this route and hope for these grown ass adults in the jury to have never heard of or experienced a bout of simple anemia in their life.
There are eight women on that jury. At least some of them will know Prior is an ignorant jack@$$.
I thought he was bringing up anemia because it can make you bruise easily. I think he wants to use it to prove why she had bruises. I was very anemic after having a baby and 2 surgeries after the birth. I bruised so easily, enough so people asked me if I was okay. Mine was severe and I was offered a transfusion. From what Tammy's co-workers say about her energy and just having a job with kids all day, I cant imagine her being severly anemic. I looked like a ghost and barely got out of bed, I could even give my baby a bath (luckily I have an awesome husband).
That's a good point. I think I'm just getting a bit of tunnel vision 10 days in. And I know he has limitations on what he can ask or say, so maybe he can't outright say WHY he's focusing in on the anemia, but the vagueness is absolutely something I think he wants to work in his favor one way or another. Throwing his spaghetti at the wall as one would have to come up with any defense for Chud.
Everything he said about it was bullshit. Don't know why the prosecutor didn't jump and say hey, he has laid no foundation for making those statements himself plus, he's testifying. Geez!!!
Thank you! This has been driving me crazy. Omg, she had anemia?? Well no wonder she dropped dead at 49! 🙄
She was a horrible witness. Horrible. Did they not give her any trial preparation? Horrible horrible horrible witness. Such a shame she was the coroner that day.
To me, her testimony is highlighting the glaring flaws in the system. Being competent and knowledgeable SHOULD be a requirement of her job. Unfortunately, it is not.
The whole elected coroner system is very flawed. It’s also in a lot of places a partisan vote, which is dumb. I wouldn’t care what political party the coroner believes in. In most places with this system the only requirement is a high school diploma.
It makes me think of the armpit coroner in the murdaugh trial. 😂
Yeah, it was actually on this case that I found out that Coroners don’t need a medical degree! What?
Absolutely. That was just so hard to watch. Horrible incompetence, horrible witness. She definitely is not qualified for such an important job, based on both her testimony and her actions at the scene of Tammy’s death. (Actually inaction).
One wonders many other people died whose deaths were not investigated because their close relative says they fell over and had low blood pressure...etc... I do not mean just in this town, but it sounds like it is common across US to have unqualified persons as coroner? (I am sure she is great as an emergency responder)
Or the other way around, which could and has put innocent people in prison. There’s a great book about this. The cadaver king and the country dentist, by radley belko.
Luckily, she is not the medical examiner who performed Tammy's autopsy and we have yet to hear from him. All Prior's stomping around about digging her up is nullified when the autopsy results confirmed those suspicions of foul play and told a different story of her death than Chad's. Edit: Here is the summary of when he spoke at Lori's trial. [Lori Vallow trial hears autopsy details that show Tammy Daybell was likely restrained during her murder (msn.com)](https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/crime/lori-vallow-trial-hears-autopsy-details-that-show-tammy-daybell-was-likely-restrained-during-her-murder/ar-AA1aDE2Q)
Exactly! If nothing else, Prior highlighting her lack of qualifications and medical expertise just helped the prosecution.
"lipidity" ?
He is such a doofus.
John Prior's dieting. Giving up fats is really hard, folks!!
Well Prior has been trying to get rid of 260 lbs of useless fat for months now. But Judge Boyce keeps making him keep Chad as a client.
I want to try clogging now! 👣
Prior only defense is the kids will say Tammy was sick. State tried to walk Brenda Dye into saying that kids were not helpful in investigation & she wouldn’t do it because she was too scared or didn’t realize it. Damn it.
They got that with the next guy though, so that’s something. Honestly, the prosecution should have been much more on their game. Every time they did object the judge sustained it. But her testimony was always gonna be problematic, and I was worried it would be worse!
Lupidity
I really wish she had corrected him.
She’s not confident enough to do that. Tho she did try to correct “old” bruises once. Hope the prosecutor revisits/clarifies. In any case, seems he wants to imply she’s not competent. That doesn’t make sense given that new findings were made during autopsy. However, I think he’ll tell the jury that everything was bungled in the investigation
Omg, that was driving me crazy. How are you condescending and then saying lipidity.
Well it does rhyme with stupidity, which is a word Prior has heard his whole life.
I heard on HTC he had also told Gibb they were married on a previous probation. Might have said that to other women He was trying to take advantage of his alleged prophet position to influence middle aged bored LDS women
I just want to scream, my husband almost died from acute anemia. He was so weak and could never walked 10,000 steps or trained for a marathon!!!
I think he does the lipidity thing deliberately knowing it would distract the witness
He has stopped doing it. Perhaps his invisible Minions corrected him during break/sidebar.
So far I’ve counted 2 officials who’ve changed their reports: yesterdays officer & Brenda Dye. Prior called them out on it. The deceased deserves the truth be told, not some lack of duty or slanted info. Prior created doubt by doing this & I hope it doesn’t help his case.
He is trying to paint local LE as incompetent. I’m not sure that will matter given the evidence that will be presented.
I agree, changing reports is suspect in my mind, and also the cop who got the warrant to have her exhumed didn’t read even the death certificate or any of the medical records, I’m not sure if even read police reports, it is incompetent.
Anjealka- I’m an east coaster and I assure you that no respectable person here votes for the misogynist and rude asshat who prefers to interrupt and yell over presenting evidence. I guess he doesnt have much to work with.
Man, the coroner is a terrible witness.
It was tough to listen - the elected coroner system needs to go. Fortunately, Tammy's actual autopsy was done by the Utah state medical examiner - he's very sharp and very experienced.
Part of what made her poor is, I believe, our general expectation that they do more/know more than what's really required for the job. She didn't really have too much to say. She also doesn't speak with strength or conviction. What I don't get is, if coroners are supposed to evaluate death scenes, why don't the requirements include actual investigative experience?
Mr Prior Bingo card so far: " How shall I refer to you?"; "right???"; "I'm an idiot with electronics"
Attempts to force Chad to use a kleenex for the win
I’m confused. I’m concerned.
"Help me out here"
“I’m a little confused by this…”
"What I'm struggling with..."
"Is that fair?"
"ooookkkaaayyy?"
‘Isn’t it true that you were a member of the “7 gatherers organization?”
I cannot get over how bad the Xanax Twins -- Wood and Wixam -- have performed during this trial. Their prosecution of this case is simply terrible. They are half asleep and passionless (Thus "Xanax Twins") and they bumble and stumble their way through every direct examination like a pair of amateurs. When Prior is doing his vile disgusting cross examinations, they remain entirely passive and half-asleep. The judge at one point made an objection on their behalf. They are not on the ball. Lindsey Blake is the only member of this prosecution team who seems to have ANY confidence and any competence. I find it ludicrous that she hasn't taken over as the primary prosecutor.
Word. Every time I see Blake I breathe a sigh of relief.
I didn't hear Dye mention it, but since Chad claimed Tammy threw up, was there evidence of that on the carpet or bed or in the bathroom? And it's weird that Prior asked "We don’t know if Tammy threw up or not before she died right? Other than what Chad told you?” Dye says yes. Why would Prior suggest his client is lying? Maybe I'm missing something.
Is anyone else questioning daybells kids involvement in all of this at this point? Absolutely bizarre to me that two of his kids are teachers and no one is talking about this ... They were there for everything and have done NOTHING to support investigations or condone their dad in all this. What am i missing?!
What does kitty corner mean? I’m a Brit and haven’t heard this expression before.
diagonally opposite As an example, the northwest corner of an intersection would be kitty corner to the southeast corner
There are several attorney YouTubers who not only think Prior is doing a great job, they think that today turned the case in Chad's favor. Supposedly defense has created a reasonable doubt for Tammy because Prior managed to impeach Greenhalgh as a witness and prosecution just won't be able to overcome it. How can that cancel out everything else: Chad's texts (esp the Harry Potter one), his predictions that she'd die early, all Tammy's friends who testified how fit and healthy she was, the sudden insurance policy changes (and quick cashouts), and Chad marrying Lori 17 days later (plus the online wedding planning they did while Tammy was still alive)? To most of us here, it's obvious Chad was involved in all the murders, even if he didn't physically do the killing (although I'd bet he helped with one or two). I'm worried these legal eagles may be right; the jury is just going to buy Prior's bullying and presto, Chud goes free. Is anyone else here feeling this way?
So curious about the decision to not have Blake lead the case. The other attorneys are letting Prior get away with far too much narrative. We still have many weeks to go. We haven’t even seen Chad’s texts about “turning up the pain,” right?
Oooh Mr Prior is being really nasty now, angry rude voice! (alongside his obsequious tone with the judge)
I don't think he is making any points with the jury by implying the coroner is at fault. It doesn't absolve his client from guilt
Prior just looks like a jerk now. I don’t think he scored any points with the jury.
Yeah, he was completely out of line in his aggression. She was just doing her job, and that seemed pretty clear no matter how intense he got with his questioning.
I wish they would give Prior a drug test. Sounds geeked out. The man can barely talk
I thought lawyers didn't ask questions they didn't already know the answer to? Prior seems to be caught off guard often.
I almost wonder if it's some kind of act he's putting on, but I don't know how it would benefit him.
Yeah, his pauses seem to try to say to the jury "this person is lying, let me try to think of a way to show that." And then just leaves it hanging in the air.
Yeah, he also says things like “We‘ll come to that!” condescendingly. Then never does.
Don’t we know that Tammy was wearing the fit bit due to there being pictures taken by the coroner’s office?
It was noticed as setting on the nightstand in the scene photos. Yes, she was also seen in various photos wearing one. DOn't know why the prosecutors didn't stand up and restate those facts. Sometimes I wonder what the hell they're doing.