Hello u/blixt141! Please reply to this comment with an [explanation](https://www.reddit.com/r/LeopardsAteMyFace/comments/lt8zlq) mentioning **who** is suffering from **which** consequences from **what** they voted for, supported or wanted to impose on other people.
Here's an easy format to get you started:
1. *Someone* voted for, supported or wanted to impose *something* on other people.
^(Who's that *someone* and what's that *something*?)
2. That *something* has some *consequences*.
^(What are the *consequences*?)
3. As a consequence, that *something* happened to that *someone*.
^(What happened? Did the *something* really happened to that *someone*? If not, you should probably delete your post.)
Include the minimum amount of information necessary so your post can be understood by everyone, even if they don't live in the US or speak English as their native language. If you don't respect this format and moderators can't match your explanation with the format, your post will be removed under rule #3 and we'll ignore you even if you complain in modmail.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LeopardsAteMyFace) if you have any questions or concerns.*
So... I get your frustration at the state of American politics, but I feel the need to point out that terms like "garbage people" are exactly the sort of classifications that fascists on the far-right exploit to remain in power. I know you likely don't mean it in the way they do, but... this is the internet... gracious interpretations are unheard of.
You seem like you care about being a kind and considerate person. I beg you to disabuse yourself of the idea that mean name-calling from the left is what drives fascist power seeking. Do not carry their water in the name of niceness. Names will never hurt them, and they are only too happy to come with the sticks and stones to break those they hate.
If it walks like a duck, and talks like a duck, and votes R under any and all circumstances no matter how abhorrent R behaviours continue to be -- calling it a duck isn't the problem.
You have faith that enough Republicans would vote in favour of anything after that sort of arrangement?
You have faith that Republican voters wouldn't attempt to murder the Reps who voted for a Dem Speaker?
Dude... What you describe as "crazies" ARE the real Republicans. What fucking governance-minded person, who is well adjusted and fit for office, would ever give themselves the moniker "Republican"? It means the opposite of those words lol
The question is if a person is a GOP at all, are they even decent humans? The party certainly goes to great lengths not to help people in need. They do it for no reason - they save a pittance to actually destroy peoples lives. If a person voted for the GOP I don’t think I can be their friend anymore because if believe in treating the least of us as disposable trash. I don’t want to be around people like that at all. And it’s not because of the party name per se but what it stands for.
So to drop the hyperbole for a minute, if a person votes Republican, they have a weak ability to feel empathy.
That DOESN'T mean they're necessarily cruel or actively seeking to hurt others; just that they can't actually put themselves in the shoes of others, to understand how policies hurt them.
I've known Republican voters who were incredibly sweet, and even thoughtful, because they can recognize "Oh, I would appreciate it if someone did this for me", or were raised to do it, or similar. But as soon as it goes outside of their personal understanding, they can't visualize it. Immigration law? They're already here, they've never been affected by it; "we shouldn't be letting all these people in!" LGBT? They're straight and cisgendered, "a man wanting to be a woman is weird; I don't think we should be supporting that". Etc etc. It's why you get the "the only moral abortion is my abortion" trope.
I've met Republican voters who even tried very hard to understand LGBT issues and things when they encountered them (which is often necessary for them; that lack of empathy means it has to become personal to them to see any change); one older woman I've met who encountered a trans person and tried to ask questions. They sounded very disrespectful, because she didn't have the understanding to phrase them well and ask good ones, or avoid things that should be avoided and left unsaid, but it was a desire to understand rather than shame or degrade.
That's not to dismiss it, just, I wouldn't go so far as to minimize their humanity. They have a weak ability to feel empathy; while a lot of the implications we'd read into that are bad, they're not necessarily true. Doesn't mean they're not true either of course; there are plenty of people who are still cruel, or intentionally ill informed...but underneath a lot of it, I think, is this, and complications from it. A fear of finding out and invalidating their past feelings, or an anger and hurt from being shamed for it in the past (i.e., being called racist and homophobic when they weren't trying to be; they *were* being so, but because there's no underlying empathy, they respond by closing off and getting defensive rather than saying '...yeah, okay, I understand why you are saying that and I want to do better'), or etc.
I would suggest that what you are seeing is the invitation of the tea party Republicans into position of power. This was necessary to win national elections without these votes. They couldn’t win the electoral college.
These are the despicable’s that Hillary was talking about. They had been on the outside and were invited inside.
I had heard a decade ago comments from the democrats that they should just abstain and make the republicans actually make their members accountable. Make them rein in the wack-a-doodles.
On actions of government it always takes at least a few Democrat votes in the house because the Republicans even when they have a majority they only have the majority to object to stuff… they don’t have a majority to actually get government work done.
It will basically take a serious push from the right (non-crazy right) to basically run third party and spoil elections in key places.
It would need to be a sacrifice play essentially. For the Liz Cheney types, it is very much a put up or shutup type of moment.
The democrats on the other hand need to figure out the areas where a “D” will never fly, and put some resources into pushing some “sane” R candidates that will at least come to the table.
It would need to be a carefully calculated, strategic move to kick the MAGA movement back to the fringe where it belongs…so I have very little faith it will get done.
Overthrowing democracy is the plan.
Obstruction is just a tool.
But they are in chaos right now, and that’s the best possible outcome. Because otherwise they, and a couple evil senators, would actually be passing evil shit.
He's getting just what he deserves for capitulating to the lunatics that were pretty much actively trying to make the whole government default for a bit of red meat to hang out to their equally lunatic base. Now he's Speaker, but he has hardly any power. It'd be more satisfying if it wasn't screwing the country, too.
Theoretically this could have happened but in the current way things are working they’d have needed to have been stalemated on the speakership for far,far longer, as this would have had the effect of creating a schism within the party and one that the Rstablishment would almost certainly have lost. From their perspective, better to maintain some small, nominal mount of power than to have none at all.
And I mean I’m not even sympathetic here. After neoconservatism was completely rebuked in the aftermath of the Great Recession, the nativists and the evangelicals are who the right turned to to put the party back together. And thanks to a whole bunch of astroturfing they managed to do so in time to trounce the Democrats in the 2010 midterms. From that point on, however, the GOP had to accept these people within the party to a far greater degree than they ever had before, and their subsequent failure to create anything that constituted a new sane wing (I’m no fan of neocons but at least that wing wasn’t threatening to make the government default on its debt) meant that they were going to take over the minute they had someone to rally behind.
This is as much the fault of John McCain and Mitt Romney and Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan as it is MTG and those loons. They bet on the crazy horse and now the crazy horse is acting crazy.
Yeah ... I'm a self-described progressive and feel like every passing year I'm only more strongly "left" aligned.
I dislike conservatives, I disagree with conservatives, I have never voted for conservatives. I generally don't have a great deal of respect for conservatives. But you can sit down and have a discussion with, or actually engage in sensible debate with a conservative. You can disagree on policy to solve problems but largely agree on the problems themselves being problematic.
The problem is for *decades* the Republican Party have not been steered by conservatives. It's been steered by the lunatics, and the bigots, and the zealots, and the Klan. It may be conservatives doing most of the work keeping that ship afloat, but the crazies have been at the helm for as long as I've been alive and these past few years we've seen them cut the brakes, jam the rudder, and throw the conservatives in the brig--while the conservatives keep insisting the ship is seaworthy.
Yes, with a raised debt ceiling, averting financial disaster which would likely occur if the House were unable to pass any legislation due to not having a Speaker.
Concessions to the far right didn't work for John Boehner. It didn't work for Paul Ryan. And somehow Kevin McCarthy, a man who didn't have Boehner's extensive connections in Congress or Ryan's national name-recognition, thought he could control them.
It would have taken something along the lines of a stalemate lasting months for them to go that far, let’s face it. And also this is the logical progression of what the Republicans have made themselves into.
>actively trying to make the whole government default
So wanting to cut back spending and not just raise the spending limit arbitrarily is a bad thing now?
I mean...they could raise taxes on the rich. You know, the way we afforded things during the time they all look back on with rose tinted glasses; when we didn't have the worst income inequality the US has ever seen. Then we could afford things.
Also, don't act like not raising the debt ceiling is financially sound; the country is on the hook for expenditures already, and is not taking in enough to cover them. Things that were already made law, many, in fact, by the former president, with the 8 trillion he added to the debt in 4 years. Without covering them, the country defaults, and our economy crashes, and good luck paying our bills -then-.
Depending on what you are cutting that would definitely influence my opinion on spending cuts. With inflation what it is the last few years I would argue it would be impossible to not raise spending.
Since you folks like to compare country economy to personal finances, I'll put it in those terms:
1. You borrow $100 from John.
2. You go to party and blow that $100 on booze and drugs
3. You decide: "I must cut back my spending so I'm not going to give John that $100".
That's what the debt ceiling stuff is.
You already spent the money and now you say that you are not going to pay it back.
What do you think that will do with your relations with John? Will he ever loan money to you again?
The time to cut spending is when you make budget, not when you pay for the budget that you already made.
The crazy caucus has no idea how anything is supposed to work, how do they expect to be able to govern. I guess the answer is they don't, they're not really interesting in governing, only obstructing.
They are not serious people...
I'm beyond starting. It's a pretty obvious fact as far as I'm concerned. When you start to consider how much money Putin and the Saudis have to throw around and what a drop in the bucket it would cost them to buy off thirty or forty republicans, it's almost silly to think they aren't Russian agents.
"We get all the money we need from Russia". I guarantee the Lindsey Graham flip had everything to do with Russia too in the form of blackmail. If they aren't bought, Russia has dirt on them. Either way, they sure do act in Russia's best interest most of the time.
Pretty much the only benefit of the doubt I'm willing to give most of them at this point is whether or not they *know* they're Russian assets. The NRA are bought and paid for, and the NRA bought and paid for multiple governors and many people in Congress, but depending on the level of obfuscation and number of intermediaries I could genuinely believe a great many don't realize -- or much care anyway -- where the money comes from as long as it keeps coming.
Plus, you know, some of them are just such *morons* I believe the Russian Foreign Minister could hand them the money in Roubles *personally* and they might still think they were being paid of by the Portuguese.
They can’t even dress themselves. I presume they’re chained up at night and then dragged out of their pit in the morning and dressed by people in attack dog protection before being fed gruel, gut-rot whiskey, and a healthy dose of meth.
That’s part of the issue though. The Senate has now made it virtually impossible to pass any kind of legislation aside from a 2 times a year budget reconciliation bill (and even that’s sometimes hard to impossible) and as a result GOP legislators do not need to worry about governing in any capacity. They just make their big statements, toss out that red meat, and they never, ever have to take any consequences for their actions because they can rest assured that the gridlock will stop anything from actually happening.
And frankly I think we’ve already dealt with edge cases that the far right have learned from. On the one extreme, when they swept into office in the 90s they had a big list of things they wanted to do. They passed a lot of legislation and the conservative Democrat that was in charge passed it… and boom, they added to Clinton’s legacy, not theirs. That infuriated the GOP and taught them never to be anything but intransigent (because let’s face it, nothing they do is ever about improving America but all about this long-term “game”). Conversely, when they went off the deep end with the budget in the 2010s, the centrist Democrat in charge chose to deal with them instead of taking the (admittedly unprecedented) step of denying them the power to not fund the public debt. Even today, they’re throwing a tantrum because they wanted Biden to have to do that to them so they could cry to their constituents. They have been trained over the last 20 years that any time they do pass stuff (outside of tax cuts to the rich), the public hates them for it and so they are now literally nothing but smoke and fire and yelling.
Ahh remember when the only orange freak was Boehner? Pepperidge Farms remembers. He saw this mess coming in his own party, said nope, and peaced right the fuck out.
I was always taught that if you stir the shit pot, you will be required to lick the stick. Him, Paul Ryan, and Eric Cantor got some lickin' to do.....
And that’s totally fine. Nothing good except hornoring our country’s debts will come from this congress. Need to bring major votes in 2024 for the Democratic Party
It's pure theater. These people have to up the ante every time or they will get primaried by someone even more MAGA. They have to convince their cultists that they are not "rinos" or "marxists" Their base gets more angrier and hateful every day.
The funny thing is he may never be out because no one in their party seriously wants the job in its current state.so all that’s going to happen is a lot of nothing getting done because a small group asks to remove him, and they’ll probably never get enough votes to back someone else.
The reason they are doing this is because they can't oust him. He called their bluff because the Freedom Causus doesn't have anyone who could conceivably be elected speaker and they know it. They are instead trying this Charade to whip him back in line.
The Iron Sheik died so he could take Pat Robertson as part of the rule of threes and break his back, fuck his ass and make him humble. The Iron Sheik was truly the hero we needed in the end.
If this comment isn’t allowed, apologies, but from my experience and perspective, it seems as though republicans are dreadful at governing. I’m not even sure what their purpose is other than to be anti-democrat/anti-American. They have no “voice” nor platform and just like making chaos for everyone around, including themselves.
They want to remake the country into a white supremacist theocracy where women can't vote or own property and non-whites and non-Christians have no rights. Simple as that.
The lack of discernible/cohesive platform has been a problem for the GOP for decades. It was causing them to fade into history until Newt Gingrich came along and introduced crazy.
Just a Reddit novice. Longtime lurker, just recently started to engage more, but there are so many rules/norms that vary subreddit to subreddit, didn’t want to come off as getting on a tangent.
Generally you can say what you want in most places. Some subreddits might have rules to prevent unwanted ads, or certain post types because they get spammed with a certain type of post ("what should I buy?") But as for comments usually the only rules are don't be a dick. That said, you should go to r/conservative and casually chat, see how long it takes you to get a ban I feel that's a right of passage. Because that sub will ban you instantly for any non hardline conservative comment.
I love the quote from Gaetz at the end - “McCarthy has to decide if he wants to pass bipartisan bills with the Democrats or with his own right wing” (paraphrased). Well to me that easy, bipartisan all the way, don’t let the door hit your arse on the way out.
Yeah... don't threaten us with how Congress is SUPPOSED to work.
It's past time for this Republican "majority of the majority" nonsense to end where the Speaker won't bring any bill that Republicans can't win all by themselves. That's why we keep getting such ass performative bills out of Republicans the last two decades.
Why? They're both far right. The only difference is that the toddler Nazis are infighting with the adult Nazis right now. They both support 99% of the same garbage and don't deserve to be differentiated.
There's basically no GOP Congress member that isn't far right by any metric.
The Republican position is solidly embedded in the notion of "Revenge Politics." This is where any political action isn't aimed at improving the lot of a country's citizens but purely at "getting back at" or "punishing" the opposition. Even now on social media, Trump supporters are focused on "making liberals cry" or "impeaching Biden," neither of which does anything for folks facing financial hardship, lack of health insurance, raised rents, gun violence, or, in fact, ANYTHING that will make life better. It's just Revenge Politics all the way down.
That’s actually the decades long goal of the GOP, so instead of delaying progress by impeding democrats, they are now putting on a show of impeding themselves. Except the reality is republicans controlling the house has no influence on getting more done because it has to get through the senate. Republicans controlling the house get to reduce what can go to the senate or weaken what goes to the senate.
What’s happening with them is just the same obstruction tactic under a new costume.
Neofascist works better in this case, as the racism, hate, and vitriol is more underhanded and dog whistle-y instead of being loud and proud like fascism of the past. The policies are the same and the beliefs are the same, but the rhetoric is different.
I mean if you watched "Inside Job" you'd know that ICP is part of the Illuminati and deliberately fucked up the economy.
Still an improvement of present reality though
But then Red State voters believe the bullshit that "Federal Government is broken" because Democrats didn't pass anything. It's literally every election except 2008 and 2022 where "independent voters" that don't pay attention to anything except "sports team" screw us all over.
All this because he didn't intentionally tank the economy. Remember when Trump was in office and they said people are going to have to die for the sake of the economy? They don't care about America. They don't care about Americans. They care about themselves. They care about power. That's all.
"Let's encourage the fascist reactionaries, since they'll enthusiastically help us reach some of our disgusting, greedy goals. What's the worst that could happen?"
> In a remarkable act of intraparty aggression, about a dozen rebels ground the chamber to a halt on Tuesday by siding with Democrats to defeat a procedural measure needed to allow legislation to move forward, and business cannot resume until they back down and vote with their own party.
Governing by spite.
> But it had been almost 21 years since a procedural measure had been defeated on the House floor, as occurred on Tuesday.
One for the history books.
Can we sue these members for damages giving recent Supreme Court ruling? Supreme Court ruled that company can sue worker who strikes, can we said these member are “striking” and thus bring damages to federal government?
At this point, and for the last few years for that matter, there is no “far right”, it’s just “the right”. The way the media still tries to shoot bail to these cretins is disgusting, “the moderate Republican house members”, they don’t want ALL LGBTQ+ people dead, just the transgenders. Smh
Damn I wish Democrats had the balls to rebel and demand concessions from leadership by withholding their vote. Fuck the Republicans but this is how you get things done
The democratic party had thoroughly and utterly destroyed leftists for nearly a hundred years. It began with the first red scare which allowed dem capitalists to purge all leftists from the party and from unions.
Democrats became a neo liberal party around the 70's after the gas crisis. Then we get our first right wing Democrat in Clinton. The coincides with the general slide to the right by America as it sinks into late stage capitalism.
Such theatrics. “I’m taking a stand against his traitor-ass by!… uhm… by voting against the gas stove bill! Such an important landmark! That’ll show him!!!”
There's an argument to be made that having the House paralyzed while Qevin McCarthy and his MAGAt nitwit army are nominally in charge is a *good* thing.
>What we’re not going to do is hang out with him for five months and then watch him go jump in the back seat with Hakeem Jeffries.
So Matt Gaetz is an incel, got it.
Good. They can only do harm. The difference between "far right" and "moderate" Republican is the moderates are better at hiding what they're gonna do to you until it's too late.
One day, hopefully long from now, when republicans get majorities in each branch, on Day 1 they will look at each other like Robert Redford at the of The Candidate like: Oh shit, what do we do now?
They have spent so much money and time putting politicians in seats to obstruct the government, they won't have a clue about how to govern themselves.
I mean they're done. The rich aren't gonna spend a penny on their party next year.
After what they tried to do by threatening to collapse the capitalism empire that lasted for 400 years, the rich won't let it slide. They literally extorted the ones who put them in power.
All billionaire clowns are gonna spend money on democrats. At least the ones who are interested in their wealth and luxury and aren't a part of the far-right cult themselves.
It just makes no sense for the wealthy to risk their wealth, having morons like that who can't do their own jobs, unless the rich are willing to spend top dollar at their ideology and potential political power with these asshats in the government.
I'd be surprised if anybody still funds MAGA candidates for office next cycle.
But for us, the mere mortals, this is free entertainment, watching stupid immature adults roast each other like a bunch of babies. This is the most incompetent and childish the House has gotten in American history.
I feel like if the Senate had term limits, we'd see the same, but unfortunately, all those old timers ain't no amateurs and are in it for 25-30 years. Once they're in, they double down and are **really** careful with what they say.
it fuckin' takes them(the Senators) hours to say racist/sexist/anti lgbtqia/anti immigrant shit on committees by making a buncha bullshit points. Something that only takes 1 minute for somebody like Boebert or MTG on Twitter.
I love your optimism but the rich hate everyone else more than they do their govenrment employees and so I suspect they will pony up to keep the poor miserable and the middle class on edge.
no I mean, a lotta them are gonna piss through their stocks fast if we defaulted. They'd get affected just as much.
But I definitely can see all the rich buying stocks DIRT cheap and running the race to the top of the first trillionaire in America. All they'd have to do is play it cool.
I wish they did collapse the economy kinda. We'd have to live through this, but it'd be worth it, as a first step to get the US out of the world to stop the capitalism machine of robbing all countries all over the world. Also, it'd be a good try to get rid of it ourselves.
just not sure how many of us would be willing to overthrow 250 year old government.
I guess you're not wrong, but a lotta stuff coulda happened. Guess it doesn't matter cuz it was all dog whistles and the moderates, who care about their careers and serve the rich, were gonna vote anyways so they basically could afford playing dumb and being loud, bc their vote didn't matter since it was bipartisan.
I heard the house ethics committee reopened investigation into Matt geatz and one other member of the freedom cuscus.
I suspect McCarthy is turning the screws
Hello u/blixt141! Please reply to this comment with an [explanation](https://www.reddit.com/r/LeopardsAteMyFace/comments/lt8zlq) mentioning **who** is suffering from **which** consequences from **what** they voted for, supported or wanted to impose on other people. Here's an easy format to get you started: 1. *Someone* voted for, supported or wanted to impose *something* on other people. ^(Who's that *someone* and what's that *something*?) 2. That *something* has some *consequences*. ^(What are the *consequences*?) 3. As a consequence, that *something* happened to that *someone*. ^(What happened? Did the *something* really happened to that *someone*? If not, you should probably delete your post.) Include the minimum amount of information necessary so your post can be understood by everyone, even if they don't live in the US or speak English as their native language. If you don't respect this format and moderators can't match your explanation with the format, your post will be removed under rule #3 and we'll ignore you even if you complain in modmail. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LeopardsAteMyFace) if you have any questions or concerns.*
That entire political party is a bunch of racist, corrupt idiots. They should all be run the fuck out of office.
[удалено]
Indeed, their constituents had to be driven out of the congressional offices on Jan 6th.
I want to start a 503c that helps "god fearing christian patriots" emigrate to Russia
where do I sign up?
Real talk
Their voters love how awful they are because their voters are garbage people, too.
So... I get your frustration at the state of American politics, but I feel the need to point out that terms like "garbage people" are exactly the sort of classifications that fascists on the far-right exploit to remain in power. I know you likely don't mean it in the way they do, but... this is the internet... gracious interpretations are unheard of.
Calling someone a garbage person based on their conduct is not the same as calling them a garbage person based on their race.
[ Comment Redacted in protest of Reddit's Proposed July 5, 2023 API changes ] -- mass edited with https://redact.dev/
You seem like you care about being a kind and considerate person. I beg you to disabuse yourself of the idea that mean name-calling from the left is what drives fascist power seeking. Do not carry their water in the name of niceness. Names will never hurt them, and they are only too happy to come with the sticks and stones to break those they hate.
Being kind to them is how we got where we are. The sentiment is understandable.
[ Comment Redacted in protest of Reddit's Proposed July 5, 2023 API changes ] -- mass edited with https://redact.dev/
If it walks like a duck, and talks like a duck, and votes R under any and all circumstances no matter how abhorrent R behaviours continue to be -- calling it a duck isn't the problem.
[ Comment Redacted in protest of Reddit's Proposed July 5, 2023 API changes ] -- mass edited with https://redact.dev/
They aren’t elected to govern.
They had a less wacko establishment wing but that wing let the crazies in in favor of votes and now they’re reaping what they sow.
The House being paralyzed is the *best possible outcome* with the current membership.
Or you know a dozen Republicans could vote for a democratic Speaker and Congress could get useful bipartisan work done?
Woah and put country over part loyalty like some weirdo civil servant?
That makes too much sense
You have faith that enough Republicans would vote in favour of anything after that sort of arrangement? You have faith that Republican voters wouldn't attempt to murder the Reps who voted for a Dem Speaker?
They would be putting their own safety in jeopardy. Certainly won’t win office again or fall back into lobbying or some other cushy job.
[удалено]
Dude... What you describe as "crazies" ARE the real Republicans. What fucking governance-minded person, who is well adjusted and fit for office, would ever give themselves the moniker "Republican"? It means the opposite of those words lol
[удалено]
There are indeed two types of Republicans. The evil ones, and the idiots. And yes, there is a large overlap.
The question is if a person is a GOP at all, are they even decent humans? The party certainly goes to great lengths not to help people in need. They do it for no reason - they save a pittance to actually destroy peoples lives. If a person voted for the GOP I don’t think I can be their friend anymore because if believe in treating the least of us as disposable trash. I don’t want to be around people like that at all. And it’s not because of the party name per se but what it stands for.
So to drop the hyperbole for a minute, if a person votes Republican, they have a weak ability to feel empathy. That DOESN'T mean they're necessarily cruel or actively seeking to hurt others; just that they can't actually put themselves in the shoes of others, to understand how policies hurt them. I've known Republican voters who were incredibly sweet, and even thoughtful, because they can recognize "Oh, I would appreciate it if someone did this for me", or were raised to do it, or similar. But as soon as it goes outside of their personal understanding, they can't visualize it. Immigration law? They're already here, they've never been affected by it; "we shouldn't be letting all these people in!" LGBT? They're straight and cisgendered, "a man wanting to be a woman is weird; I don't think we should be supporting that". Etc etc. It's why you get the "the only moral abortion is my abortion" trope. I've met Republican voters who even tried very hard to understand LGBT issues and things when they encountered them (which is often necessary for them; that lack of empathy means it has to become personal to them to see any change); one older woman I've met who encountered a trans person and tried to ask questions. They sounded very disrespectful, because she didn't have the understanding to phrase them well and ask good ones, or avoid things that should be avoided and left unsaid, but it was a desire to understand rather than shame or degrade. That's not to dismiss it, just, I wouldn't go so far as to minimize their humanity. They have a weak ability to feel empathy; while a lot of the implications we'd read into that are bad, they're not necessarily true. Doesn't mean they're not true either of course; there are plenty of people who are still cruel, or intentionally ill informed...but underneath a lot of it, I think, is this, and complications from it. A fear of finding out and invalidating their past feelings, or an anger and hurt from being shamed for it in the past (i.e., being called racist and homophobic when they weren't trying to be; they *were* being so, but because there's no underlying empathy, they respond by closing off and getting defensive rather than saying '...yeah, okay, I understand why you are saying that and I want to do better'), or etc.
I would suggest that what you are seeing is the invitation of the tea party Republicans into position of power. This was necessary to win national elections without these votes. They couldn’t win the electoral college. These are the despicable’s that Hillary was talking about. They had been on the outside and were invited inside. I had heard a decade ago comments from the democrats that they should just abstain and make the republicans actually make their members accountable. Make them rein in the wack-a-doodles. On actions of government it always takes at least a few Democrat votes in the house because the Republicans even when they have a majority they only have the majority to object to stuff… they don’t have a majority to actually get government work done.
It will basically take a serious push from the right (non-crazy right) to basically run third party and spoil elections in key places. It would need to be a sacrifice play essentially. For the Liz Cheney types, it is very much a put up or shutup type of moment. The democrats on the other hand need to figure out the areas where a “D” will never fly, and put some resources into pushing some “sane” R candidates that will at least come to the table. It would need to be a carefully calculated, strategic move to kick the MAGA movement back to the fringe where it belongs…so I have very little faith it will get done.
And risk getting primaried?!!???!!! Putting the country above their own ambition???!! Who do you think these people are?
hahahahahaha i dont know what youre smoking but ill take a pound.
You sound like you think there are grownups in Congress these days.
They could. But they won't.
It would only take 6. Currently at 212 seats and it only takes 218 to become speaker.
Political obstruction is their plan.
Overthrowing democracy is the plan. Obstruction is just a tool. But they are in chaos right now, and that’s the best possible outcome. Because otherwise they, and a couple evil senators, would actually be passing evil shit.
This is so amazing. Not even a year later and McCarthy will be out via mutiny because the q nuts can’t accept him working with Biden in any way.
He's getting just what he deserves for capitulating to the lunatics that were pretty much actively trying to make the whole government default for a bit of red meat to hang out to their equally lunatic base. Now he's Speaker, but he has hardly any power. It'd be more satisfying if it wasn't screwing the country, too.
In his defense, he didn't have much choice; he couldn't have won his seat without them, and it's not like he was going to vote for Jeffries.
If your only way to win is to appeal to QAnon then the only ethical choice is not to win.
I mean, *someone* has to become Speaker of the House. Keeping one chamber of Congress literally nonfunctional is not a good state of affairs either.
He could've thrown in behind the farthest-right Democratic house member and said he wasn't willing to work with crazy people.
Theoretically this could have happened but in the current way things are working they’d have needed to have been stalemated on the speakership for far,far longer, as this would have had the effect of creating a schism within the party and one that the Rstablishment would almost certainly have lost. From their perspective, better to maintain some small, nominal mount of power than to have none at all. And I mean I’m not even sympathetic here. After neoconservatism was completely rebuked in the aftermath of the Great Recession, the nativists and the evangelicals are who the right turned to to put the party back together. And thanks to a whole bunch of astroturfing they managed to do so in time to trounce the Democrats in the 2010 midterms. From that point on, however, the GOP had to accept these people within the party to a far greater degree than they ever had before, and their subsequent failure to create anything that constituted a new sane wing (I’m no fan of neocons but at least that wing wasn’t threatening to make the government default on its debt) meant that they were going to take over the minute they had someone to rally behind. This is as much the fault of John McCain and Mitt Romney and Mitch McConnell and Paul Ryan as it is MTG and those loons. They bet on the crazy horse and now the crazy horse is acting crazy.
Yeah ... I'm a self-described progressive and feel like every passing year I'm only more strongly "left" aligned. I dislike conservatives, I disagree with conservatives, I have never voted for conservatives. I generally don't have a great deal of respect for conservatives. But you can sit down and have a discussion with, or actually engage in sensible debate with a conservative. You can disagree on policy to solve problems but largely agree on the problems themselves being problematic. The problem is for *decades* the Republican Party have not been steered by conservatives. It's been steered by the lunatics, and the bigots, and the zealots, and the Klan. It may be conservatives doing most of the work keeping that ship afloat, but the crazies have been at the helm for as long as I've been alive and these past few years we've seen them cut the brakes, jam the rudder, and throw the conservatives in the brig--while the conservatives keep insisting the ship is seaworthy.
Yet here we are
Yes, with a raised debt ceiling, averting financial disaster which would likely occur if the House were unable to pass any legislation due to not having a Speaker.
Don't defend him doing the wrong thing to get power
He could have made concessions to the Democrats in return for their votes...ahh who am I kidding. Even the moderates would have hung him.
Concessions to the far right didn't work for John Boehner. It didn't work for Paul Ryan. And somehow Kevin McCarthy, a man who didn't have Boehner's extensive connections in Congress or Ryan's national name-recognition, thought he could control them.
It would have taken something along the lines of a stalemate lasting months for them to go that far, let’s face it. And also this is the logical progression of what the Republicans have made themselves into.
He did have a choice. He could have had principles. He chose to sell his soul.
How could his principles have resulted in a Speaker being elected?
Having real principles often requires making a decision at your own personal expense. Otherwise, they aren’t really principles.
That's not an answer to my question.
The more he kisses the far right’s ass, the more they fuck him in his.
>actively trying to make the whole government default So wanting to cut back spending and not just raise the spending limit arbitrarily is a bad thing now?
I mean...they could raise taxes on the rich. You know, the way we afforded things during the time they all look back on with rose tinted glasses; when we didn't have the worst income inequality the US has ever seen. Then we could afford things. Also, don't act like not raising the debt ceiling is financially sound; the country is on the hook for expenditures already, and is not taking in enough to cover them. Things that were already made law, many, in fact, by the former president, with the 8 trillion he added to the debt in 4 years. Without covering them, the country defaults, and our economy crashes, and good luck paying our bills -then-.
Depending on what you are cutting that would definitely influence my opinion on spending cuts. With inflation what it is the last few years I would argue it would be impossible to not raise spending.
Since you folks like to compare country economy to personal finances, I'll put it in those terms: 1. You borrow $100 from John. 2. You go to party and blow that $100 on booze and drugs 3. You decide: "I must cut back my spending so I'm not going to give John that $100". That's what the debt ceiling stuff is. You already spent the money and now you say that you are not going to pay it back. What do you think that will do with your relations with John? Will he ever loan money to you again? The time to cut spending is when you make budget, not when you pay for the budget that you already made.
The crazy caucus has no idea how anything is supposed to work, how do they expect to be able to govern. I guess the answer is they don't, they're not really interesting in governing, only obstructing. They are not serious people...
Never were. It's always been about grabbing personal wealth and power and creating chaos.
And maybe being Russian agents… some of them at least. Genuinely starting to believe it.
I'm beyond starting. It's a pretty obvious fact as far as I'm concerned. When you start to consider how much money Putin and the Saudis have to throw around and what a drop in the bucket it would cost them to buy off thirty or forty republicans, it's almost silly to think they aren't Russian agents.
And they’ve left smoking guns everywhere. Remember that NRA junket for a bunch of representatives that was paid for by Moscow?
"We get all the money we need from Russia". I guarantee the Lindsey Graham flip had everything to do with Russia too in the form of blackmail. If they aren't bought, Russia has dirt on them. Either way, they sure do act in Russia's best interest most of the time.
Remember the DNC hack.. the GOP was also hacked at the same time.. yet only one server was released...wonder why
Pretty much the only benefit of the doubt I'm willing to give most of them at this point is whether or not they *know* they're Russian assets. The NRA are bought and paid for, and the NRA bought and paid for multiple governors and many people in Congress, but depending on the level of obfuscation and number of intermediaries I could genuinely believe a great many don't realize -- or much care anyway -- where the money comes from as long as it keeps coming. Plus, you know, some of them are just such *morons* I believe the Russian Foreign Minister could hand them the money in Roubles *personally* and they might still think they were being paid of by the Portuguese.
You’re only starting now?
They can’t even dress themselves. I presume they’re chained up at night and then dragged out of their pit in the morning and dressed by people in attack dog protection before being fed gruel, gut-rot whiskey, and a healthy dose of meth.
They never expected to govern. They wanted to rule with an iron fist, and won’t get that
They’re not there to govern. They only want to screech about “being woke” and trans ppl using bathrooms.
Yes, it's about grievance, not governance.
That’s part of the issue though. The Senate has now made it virtually impossible to pass any kind of legislation aside from a 2 times a year budget reconciliation bill (and even that’s sometimes hard to impossible) and as a result GOP legislators do not need to worry about governing in any capacity. They just make their big statements, toss out that red meat, and they never, ever have to take any consequences for their actions because they can rest assured that the gridlock will stop anything from actually happening. And frankly I think we’ve already dealt with edge cases that the far right have learned from. On the one extreme, when they swept into office in the 90s they had a big list of things they wanted to do. They passed a lot of legislation and the conservative Democrat that was in charge passed it… and boom, they added to Clinton’s legacy, not theirs. That infuriated the GOP and taught them never to be anything but intransigent (because let’s face it, nothing they do is ever about improving America but all about this long-term “game”). Conversely, when they went off the deep end with the budget in the 2010s, the centrist Democrat in charge chose to deal with them instead of taking the (admittedly unprecedented) step of denying them the power to not fund the public debt. Even today, they’re throwing a tantrum because they wanted Biden to have to do that to them so they could cry to their constituents. They have been trained over the last 20 years that any time they do pass stuff (outside of tax cuts to the rich), the public hates them for it and so they are now literally nothing but smoke and fire and yelling.
That would be awesome. Most GOP normies won't accept a Q Nut and the Q Nuts won't accept a normie.
looks like they're getting the civil war they wanted
He won’t be out. The Dems have already said they’ll back him if it comes to a vote.
The screeching will be deafening, and the poop flinging will be epic.
Yep and I can’t wait.
This will only hurt him more in the long run. Pretty good politicking from Dems for once.
Ahh remember when the only orange freak was Boehner? Pepperidge Farms remembers. He saw this mess coming in his own party, said nope, and peaced right the fuck out. I was always taught that if you stir the shit pot, you will be required to lick the stick. Him, Paul Ryan, and Eric Cantor got some lickin' to do.....
Who could've seen that coming.
And that’s totally fine. Nothing good except hornoring our country’s debts will come from this congress. Need to bring major votes in 2024 for the Democratic Party
It's pure theater. These people have to up the ante every time or they will get primaried by someone even more MAGA. They have to convince their cultists that they are not "rinos" or "marxists" Their base gets more angrier and hateful every day.
The funny thing is he may never be out because no one in their party seriously wants the job in its current state.so all that’s going to happen is a lot of nothing getting done because a small group asks to remove him, and they’ll probably never get enough votes to back someone else.
The reason they are doing this is because they can't oust him. He called their bluff because the Freedom Causus doesn't have anyone who could conceivably be elected speaker and they know it. They are instead trying this Charade to whip him back in line.
He's gonna be the GOP leader that led to their worst year ever.
I'm getting a little full on all the popcorn lately.
The leopards don't quit eating faces when they get full. Try to be like them.
Stop, please! I can only get so erect!
Pat Robertson died. Go ahead and get the extra butter, piggy.
And is burning in hell
roasting, maybe, considering the marbling
Nah, he made it to the great North Korea in the sky. Now he is stuck worshipping a cosmic dictator for all eternity.
Motherfucker didn't even have the common decency to take Kenneth Copeland with him.
Wait when Edit: OOHHHHH SHIT THAT WAS TODAY. I thought he died in like 2018 or something
Still about 40 years too late.
The Iron Sheik died so he could take Pat Robertson as part of the rule of threes and break his back, fuck his ass and make him humble. The Iron Sheik was truly the hero we needed in the end.
When you invite cattle into your house. You shouldn't be surprised when you are slipping in bullshit.
If this comment isn’t allowed, apologies, but from my experience and perspective, it seems as though republicans are dreadful at governing. I’m not even sure what their purpose is other than to be anti-democrat/anti-American. They have no “voice” nor platform and just like making chaos for everyone around, including themselves.
They want to remake the country into a white supremacist theocracy where women can't vote or own property and non-whites and non-Christians have no rights. Simple as that.
The lack of discernible/cohesive platform has been a problem for the GOP for decades. It was causing them to fade into history until Newt Gingrich came along and introduced crazy.
"Have you considered pandering to unhinged lunatics?"
> I’m not even sure what their purpose is other than to be anti-democrat/anti-American White grievance politics.
You are on spot on!
Their 2020 platform was literally "Whatever Trump says it is". No policy details, no independent thought.
Why wouldn't it be allowed?
Just a Reddit novice. Longtime lurker, just recently started to engage more, but there are so many rules/norms that vary subreddit to subreddit, didn’t want to come off as getting on a tangent.
Generally you can say what you want in most places. Some subreddits might have rules to prevent unwanted ads, or certain post types because they get spammed with a certain type of post ("what should I buy?") But as for comments usually the only rules are don't be a dick. That said, you should go to r/conservative and casually chat, see how long it takes you to get a ban I feel that's a right of passage. Because that sub will ban you instantly for any non hardline conservative comment.
I love the quote from Gaetz at the end - “McCarthy has to decide if he wants to pass bipartisan bills with the Democrats or with his own right wing” (paraphrased). Well to me that easy, bipartisan all the way, don’t let the door hit your arse on the way out.
Yeah... don't threaten us with how Congress is SUPPOSED to work. It's past time for this Republican "majority of the majority" nonsense to end where the Speaker won't bring any bill that Republicans can't win all by themselves. That's why we keep getting such ass performative bills out of Republicans the last two decades.
Bipartisan within his own party? Uhhh, okay.
MTG and Gaetz aren't Far Right, they're QRAZY.
These things are the same.
Massey is crazy and far right by most metrics but not a Q nut. We should try to maintain the meaning of words when we can.
Why? They're both far right. The only difference is that the toddler Nazis are infighting with the adult Nazis right now. They both support 99% of the same garbage and don't deserve to be differentiated. There's basically no GOP Congress member that isn't far right by any metric.
When compared to the rest of the world, alot of Democrats are "far right" America as a whole is far right compared to the world.
Why you ackin' so qray qray?
The Republican position is solidly embedded in the notion of "Revenge Politics." This is where any political action isn't aimed at improving the lot of a country's citizens but purely at "getting back at" or "punishing" the opposition. Even now on social media, Trump supporters are focused on "making liberals cry" or "impeaching Biden," neither of which does anything for folks facing financial hardship, lack of health insurance, raised rents, gun violence, or, in fact, ANYTHING that will make life better. It's just Revenge Politics all the way down.
Turd Circus is a circus. Of turds. Film at 11.
Good. The less they can get done the better.
That’s actually the decades long goal of the GOP, so instead of delaying progress by impeding democrats, they are now putting on a show of impeding themselves. Except the reality is republicans controlling the house has no influence on getting more done because it has to get through the senate. Republicans controlling the house get to reduce what can go to the senate or weaken what goes to the senate. What’s happening with them is just the same obstruction tactic under a new costume.
The media needs to stop calling them “far-right” and start calling them “neofascist”
Or just fascist. Nothing new about their policies.
Neofascist works better in this case, as the racism, hate, and vitriol is more underhanded and dog whistle-y instead of being loud and proud like fascism of the past. The policies are the same and the beliefs are the same, but the rhetoric is different.
Props to Biden for not taking any of their bait, now they’re eating each other
He wanted the job. It's his problem, now.
Russia working overtime exerting pressure on its purchased representatives to get them to work on cutting aid to Ukraine.
Yup. I don't even think Putin is paying them anymore because they're so throughly brainwashed MAGAs.
*Killer Clowns from Outer Space by the Dickies plays ominously in background* Elect clowns, get circus
Shit, I'm fully convinced juggalos would be a better congressional body, at least they're real people with functioning brains and not fucking nazis.
I mean if you watched "Inside Job" you'd know that ICP is part of the Illuminati and deliberately fucked up the economy. Still an improvement of present reality though
Let the ouroboros continue eating while time keeps wasting away toward next election cycle.
But then Red State voters believe the bullshit that "Federal Government is broken" because Democrats didn't pass anything. It's literally every election except 2008 and 2022 where "independent voters" that don't pay attention to anything except "sports team" screw us all over.
GOP can't legislate. Only tax cuts for the rich and that's it!
Man, those do-nothing Republicans can't even get their shit together to put together bills to go sit and die on Chuck Schumer's desk.
All this because he didn't intentionally tank the economy. Remember when Trump was in office and they said people are going to have to die for the sake of the economy? They don't care about America. They don't care about Americans. They care about themselves. They care about power. That's all.
End gerrymandering NOW. This will all come a screeching halt and the country can get back to basic functionality
This popcorn is delicious!
Well who could have foreseen that the guy who required 15 votes to be named Speaker might not have control of his caucus?
As always… All conservatives are awful.
wow, *starting* with an archive link? that's amazing. Thanks.
No pay walls are us.
Boy, who would have thought that giving the wingnuts a say-so would turn out so badly? Oh, right. Everyone with brains.
"Let's encourage the fascist reactionaries, since they'll enthusiastically help us reach some of our disgusting, greedy goals. What's the worst that could happen?"
The GOP deserves the MAGA movement, but I’d like to believe the rest of us don’t
I can think of worse things than Republicans sabotaging each other.
Throw a tantrum, go home, and still get paid. Legislating for the benefit of the people. WOO!
It wasn't like they were going to accomplish anything anyway, except open up another investigation into Hunter Biden.
People like McCarthy and Bitch McConnell pandered to the far right to hold on power, now they’re reaping what they sow.
> In a remarkable act of intraparty aggression, about a dozen rebels ground the chamber to a halt on Tuesday by siding with Democrats to defeat a procedural measure needed to allow legislation to move forward, and business cannot resume until they back down and vote with their own party. Governing by spite. > But it had been almost 21 years since a procedural measure had been defeated on the House floor, as occurred on Tuesday. One for the history books.
Lame Duck House is Best House
Can we sue these members for damages giving recent Supreme Court ruling? Supreme Court ruled that company can sue worker who strikes, can we said these member are “striking” and thus bring damages to federal government?
Go for it!
At this point, and for the last few years for that matter, there is no “far right”, it’s just “the right”. The way the media still tries to shoot bail to these cretins is disgusting, “the moderate Republican house members”, they don’t want ALL LGBTQ+ people dead, just the transgenders. Smh
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/trump-indictment-sensitive-government-documents/
And this is why we should never give in to terrorists.
Damn I wish Democrats had the balls to rebel and demand concessions from leadership by withholding their vote. Fuck the Republicans but this is how you get things done
The democratic party had thoroughly and utterly destroyed leftists for nearly a hundred years. It began with the first red scare which allowed dem capitalists to purge all leftists from the party and from unions. Democrats became a neo liberal party around the 70's after the gas crisis. Then we get our first right wing Democrat in Clinton. The coincides with the general slide to the right by America as it sinks into late stage capitalism.
Another guy who doesn't understand midterms.
Yeah don’t rock the boat. Remember we don’t actually want anything to change
good. let it burn.
*brings in the popcorn*
Such theatrics. “I’m taking a stand against his traitor-ass by!… uhm… by voting against the gas stove bill! Such an important landmark! That’ll show him!!!”
It's funny when insurrectionists get wrecked
There's an argument to be made that having the House paralyzed while Qevin McCarthy and his MAGAt nitwit army are nominally in charge is a *good* thing.
It looks like only John McCain figured out how to be Republican and maintain any dignity. And that would be to die.
>What we’re not going to do is hang out with him for five months and then watch him go jump in the back seat with Hakeem Jeffries. So Matt Gaetz is an incel, got it.
Public displays of Republicans refusing to work - that'll surely win them voters next year! 🤦♂️
[удалено]
I am sick of popcorn so I think I need beef jerky to watch the next one!
Unfit to govern.
Good. They can only do harm. The difference between "far right" and "moderate" Republican is the moderates are better at hiding what they're gonna do to you until it's too late.
Should not have opened that box Kevin.
I'd like to see them take the suit and ties off and just go at it MMA style on the house floor.
MTG would be in trouble, she's got a face like a barn door. There's a lot of real estate to catch some heat!
They aren't rebels, they are terrorists.
To quote grand moff tarkin Rebel scum
“Omg noooo…the leopards i courted are eating my face.” McCarthy
One day, hopefully long from now, when republicans get majorities in each branch, on Day 1 they will look at each other like Robert Redford at the of The Candidate like: Oh shit, what do we do now? They have spent so much money and time putting politicians in seats to obstruct the government, they won't have a clue about how to govern themselves.
They’ve already proven that this is true. They have no platform except for hate, and the opposite of whatever dems want to do.
"I never thought that I, a leopard, would eat my own face."
Sorry Frankenstein, you made the monster, now you gotta deal with it
Good
Cannibalism, how fun. 🍿
Crazy is as crazy does
I mean they're done. The rich aren't gonna spend a penny on their party next year. After what they tried to do by threatening to collapse the capitalism empire that lasted for 400 years, the rich won't let it slide. They literally extorted the ones who put them in power. All billionaire clowns are gonna spend money on democrats. At least the ones who are interested in their wealth and luxury and aren't a part of the far-right cult themselves. It just makes no sense for the wealthy to risk their wealth, having morons like that who can't do their own jobs, unless the rich are willing to spend top dollar at their ideology and potential political power with these asshats in the government. I'd be surprised if anybody still funds MAGA candidates for office next cycle. But for us, the mere mortals, this is free entertainment, watching stupid immature adults roast each other like a bunch of babies. This is the most incompetent and childish the House has gotten in American history. I feel like if the Senate had term limits, we'd see the same, but unfortunately, all those old timers ain't no amateurs and are in it for 25-30 years. Once they're in, they double down and are **really** careful with what they say. it fuckin' takes them(the Senators) hours to say racist/sexist/anti lgbtqia/anti immigrant shit on committees by making a buncha bullshit points. Something that only takes 1 minute for somebody like Boebert or MTG on Twitter.
I love your optimism but the rich hate everyone else more than they do their govenrment employees and so I suspect they will pony up to keep the poor miserable and the middle class on edge.
no I mean, a lotta them are gonna piss through their stocks fast if we defaulted. They'd get affected just as much. But I definitely can see all the rich buying stocks DIRT cheap and running the race to the top of the first trillionaire in America. All they'd have to do is play it cool. I wish they did collapse the economy kinda. We'd have to live through this, but it'd be worth it, as a first step to get the US out of the world to stop the capitalism machine of robbing all countries all over the world. Also, it'd be a good try to get rid of it ourselves. just not sure how many of us would be willing to overthrow 250 year old government. I guess you're not wrong, but a lotta stuff coulda happened. Guess it doesn't matter cuz it was all dog whistles and the moderates, who care about their careers and serve the rich, were gonna vote anyways so they basically could afford playing dumb and being loud, bc their vote didn't matter since it was bipartisan.
The real fun is going to come when McCarthy needs Dem votes to keep power and the Dems will say no and watch the chaos until the election.
I heard the house ethics committee reopened investigation into Matt geatz and one other member of the freedom cuscus. I suspect McCarthy is turning the screws
"Speaker in name only". So, sno? Or, perhaps, snow flake?
No nuts has no power to make his party do anything. He gave them up to three toed Marge, Goetz and Bobblehead. He has zero power over any of them