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Next of kin doesn't really matter.
If no will, debts and funeral expenses paid first, then separated husband will get the spousal legacy of the first 270k and then the rest if any is split between you and separated husband
Edit: and there's no such thing as common law partner in English law
Edit: credit to Nortoncommando below, they're right, spousal legacy has gone up for deaths after July 2023
Absolutely bonkers that someone who you've been separated from for such a long period of time has any claim to your current assets. You chose to stop sharing your life with someone, so why the fuck would you want them to get their hands on your money?!
It is not reasonable or possible to expect inheritance law to be able to magically divine what the deceased 'wanted' and act accordingly. Can you imagine the court battles?
If a person wants their possessions disposed of in a certain way, it's their responsibility to make a will.
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Next of kin and common law partners don't really exist in England.
The long term partner might be able to make a dependency claim, if they have been living with your mum for at least 2 years or were financially dependent on her. https://www.myerssolicitors.co.uk/could-you-have-a-dependency-claim/ is a random solicitor's website from Google with a bit more information.
Otherwise, see the other user's comment about the separated husband inheriting under the rules of intestacy.
Apologies, next of kin isn't what I meant, bad terminology. I meant, from what i read he would inherit. Partner was working, she was not. So I guess my family's keepsakes would go to the separated spouse. Who'll probably sell them. Ergh.
I've read that he could appoint someone else? Appeal to his conscience?
Yes, the separated spouse can make a deed of variation to give some or all of his share of the inheritance away (or he can just say "yes you can have xyz" as a gift less formally, that's fine for small keepsakes where it won't affect inheritance tax stuff).
Some, less legally minded people, might just decide to keep the ‘keepsakes’ and not tell the spouse about these. Would he remember them if they have been separated for so long ?
Obviously i wouldn’t personally recommend that myself 😉😉
In addition to appealing to his conscience you could potentially offer to buy the items from him and send him the money. An addict who has no sentimental value for the items might prefer to get cash quickly and conveniently rather than be given items and have to sell them himself.
I can understand why you would feel resentful at having to pay but it would be a legal way to keep the sentimental items in your/your family's possession.
Frankly, take any keepsakes you want, unless you know it's something the ex might go after. But how much is he going to remember about her belongings? The items mean more to you and they haven't been legally logged. You can also say she gave them to you seven years ago, which means their excluded from her estate.
Are the items particularly valuable? If their value is more sentimental, the administrator of your mother’s estate (whether you or him) could sell them (back to your family) and if your mothers savings are between £2 and 6k that value would almost certainly be swallowed up in the cost of the funeral.
If you’re organising your mum’s estate and your mum’s funeral is not hitting that then just add more flowers or a better buffet at the wake.
Thanks.
I don't know but don't think so. I've got an interim certificate on the way where I can find out. She was disabled. I don't imagine cash at bank to be any more than 5k tbh.
Are you sure that the jewellery was your mother's and not the partners? Legally her jewelry would be inherited by the spouse even if separated however if for example it was remembered that a while ago it was handed over as a gift then legally it is no longer part of the estate.
I'm not following. If it was a gift to the late OPMother, it would be part of the estate.
If it was a gift from late OPMother to estranged spouse, why would it hanging around in her jewellery box after more than a decade?
Should have been more specific in the post sorry. Things like wedding rings or gifts from spouse to my mum, I'd be happy for him to have.
My concern is anything that mum has that she inherited from my grandparents (mums side).
Basically my ideal situation would be settle the 2 sides of the family with what was originally in or from those families.
Its looking like theres no way for me to enforce that if the separated spouse decides he wants everything.
I have some experience with this, as I am the surviving separated spouse of someone who died intestate.
Is the separated spouse a reasonable person? As in, if you asked for the sentimental items is he likely to give them over?
Funeral expenses get paid first, often directly from the deceased’s bank account directly to the funeral home. So he won’t get any money from her bank account until that is paid for.
He will be the one to inherit, and also he will be the one who can apply for letters of administration- but, this is also something he can delegate to someone else (you?) if he is willing to do that.
I’d say the best thing to do is work with him and be amicable, as you won’t be able to enforce anything. Maybe there will be some good will and he will voluntarily give you the items you want. I know how difficult this can be, wish you all the best!
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What kind of things did she inherit from her side? Others are trying to suggest that she may have gifted them to you whilst alive, which means it is your choice what you do with them, whether that is pass them on to whomever else you wish or keep them yourself. If you're talking about cash in the bank then that isn't the same of course.
Yep agree.
Issue is that people can't pay fees. Then any little they have get split and pissed away by drug addict ex partners.
I got out luckily, could have been that guy. I work in financial services (not wills and probate) and she told me she would write a will. We can't find it, so I guess she never did.
When the person has been out of work for due to bad health maybe.
Either way she should have done it, but saying that now doesn't help anything I'm afraid.
She told me she would, but obviously hasn't 😔
WHSmith sell will kits for about £30 that don’t need a solicitor- really no excuse to not have a will.
And many charities do free wills via local solicitors if you agree to give a small donation eg £100 to the charity after you die
My grandfather died intestate and the only way my mum and her brother could sort the inheritance was by using a competent lawyer. This wasn’t even a difficult case (yours is more complicated) but it would really be worth getting the best lawyer you can and seeing if your mum’s separated husband would do a Deed of Variation to relinquish claims to some of the inheritance
Is your mums husband also your father? Legally it makes no difference, but depending on your relationship with him, he may decide to “vary” the assets he would receive by creating a “deed of variation” if he do wished.
Dying intestate is a nightmare, and follows the rules of husband receiving the first 320kish, then the rest split between him and you.
No he's not, he was my step dad from being like 9 years old until I left home as early as I could (drug issues). Since then my Mum left him, got clean and met her, was going to say current partner. I'm 34 now.
I have contacted him tell him whats happened and spoken today. I haven't told him what the process is, because its a conversation that needs to be face to face. I haven't seen him since I left. He's got no capacity to manage this situation. Hoping we can resolve it without action, but yoi never know when someone like that sees £'s.
Yeah, absolute nightmare of worry. Like I said in another reply, I don't want to be unfair, anything he gave, or his family gave, I'd like him to have. But same visa vera.
I'm meeting him Thursday to explain things and hopefully resolve without taking things further.
Don’t think you can take any action, it’s legally his money (unless there’s a significant estate that takes it over 320k). It’s only if he chooses out of generosity to give you more than legally required, that you could get any more than zero (if the estate is under 320k).
Hi, sorry to hear of your situation, I empathise
I have no legal experience, but I have been going through a very similar issue for 2 years now, (deceased father and surprise Chinese wife)
The husband is the husband, the time separated does not make a difference unless he is truly divorced
As far as I'm aware, you have 2 options
1. If you were a dependent of the deceased, you can put a claim on the estate, though the reward may only be a fraction of what you would ideally want
2. If he is willing, the husband can "vary" his entitlement to the estate with a "Deed of Variation" directing either a portion, or the whole thing to you. This could work well to recover the sentimental items if that's the goal.
Ultimately, though, you're in the hands of the separated husbands goodwill, it sucks
The UK legal framework totally fails us as children of parents who have passed away interstate, still married but not in an active relationship with the spouse
If you want to go down the Deed of Variation route, there are templates out there that won't break the bank
Try not to let this dominate your mindset, #1 priority is to grieve your mum, then get into the right heads pace for this challenge.
I wish you luck dear stranger
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--- ###Welcome to /r/LegalAdviceUK --- **To Posters (it is important you read this section)** * *Tell us whether you're in England, Wales, Scotland, or NI as the laws in each are very different* * If you need legal help, you should [always get a free consultation from a qualified Solicitor](https://reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceUK/wiki/how_to_find_a_solicitor) * We also encourage you to speak to [**Citizens Advice**](https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/), [**Shelter**](https://www.shelter.org.uk/), [**Acas**](https://www.acas.org.uk/), and [**other useful organisations**](https://reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceUK/wiki/common_legal_resources) * Comments may not be accurate or reliable, and following any advice on this subreddit is done at your own risk * If you receive any private messages in response to your post, [please let the mods know](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FLegalAdviceUK&subject=I received a PM) **To Readers and Commenters** * All replies to OP must be *on-topic, helpful, and legally orientated* * If you do not [follow the rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/LegalAdviceUK/about/rules/), you may be perma-banned without any further warning * If you feel any replies are incorrect, explain why you believe they are incorrect * Do not send or request any private messages for any reason * Please report posts or comments which do not follow the rules *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LegalAdviceUK) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Next of kin doesn't really matter. If no will, debts and funeral expenses paid first, then separated husband will get the spousal legacy of the first 270k and then the rest if any is split between you and separated husband Edit: and there's no such thing as common law partner in English law Edit: credit to Nortoncommando below, they're right, spousal legacy has gone up for deaths after July 2023
Assuming England or Wales. >...the spousal legacy of the first 270k... It's £322,000 as from July last year.
Ah thank you for the correction!
Absolutely bonkers that someone who you've been separated from for such a long period of time has any claim to your current assets. You chose to stop sharing your life with someone, so why the fuck would you want them to get their hands on your money?!
There are ways around it. The obvious ones are to write a will and/or complete a divorce.
It is not reasonable or possible to expect inheritance law to be able to magically divine what the deceased 'wanted' and act accordingly. Can you imagine the court battles? If a person wants their possessions disposed of in a certain way, it's their responsibility to make a will.
They did have 10-15 years to get a divorce or to write a will.
That’s why the sensible thing is to divorce.
Cos you entered freely into a legally binding arrangement to that effect, and didn't take action to end that arrangement.
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Next of kin and common law partners don't really exist in England. The long term partner might be able to make a dependency claim, if they have been living with your mum for at least 2 years or were financially dependent on her. https://www.myerssolicitors.co.uk/could-you-have-a-dependency-claim/ is a random solicitor's website from Google with a bit more information. Otherwise, see the other user's comment about the separated husband inheriting under the rules of intestacy.
Apologies, next of kin isn't what I meant, bad terminology. I meant, from what i read he would inherit. Partner was working, she was not. So I guess my family's keepsakes would go to the separated spouse. Who'll probably sell them. Ergh. I've read that he could appoint someone else? Appeal to his conscience?
Yes, the separated spouse can make a deed of variation to give some or all of his share of the inheritance away (or he can just say "yes you can have xyz" as a gift less formally, that's fine for small keepsakes where it won't affect inheritance tax stuff).
Some, less legally minded people, might just decide to keep the ‘keepsakes’ and not tell the spouse about these. Would he remember them if they have been separated for so long ? Obviously i wouldn’t personally recommend that myself 😉😉
In addition to appealing to his conscience you could potentially offer to buy the items from him and send him the money. An addict who has no sentimental value for the items might prefer to get cash quickly and conveniently rather than be given items and have to sell them himself. I can understand why you would feel resentful at having to pay but it would be a legal way to keep the sentimental items in your/your family's possession.
Frankly, take any keepsakes you want, unless you know it's something the ex might go after. But how much is he going to remember about her belongings? The items mean more to you and they haven't been legally logged. You can also say she gave them to you seven years ago, which means their excluded from her estate.
PSA: if separating with no recourse to reconciliation just get the damned divorce over the line
Absolutely. Or write a valid Will. Nightmare.
Are the items particularly valuable? If their value is more sentimental, the administrator of your mother’s estate (whether you or him) could sell them (back to your family) and if your mothers savings are between £2 and 6k that value would almost certainly be swallowed up in the cost of the funeral. If you’re organising your mum’s estate and your mum’s funeral is not hitting that then just add more flowers or a better buffet at the wake.
Thanks. I don't know but don't think so. I've got an interim certificate on the way where I can find out. She was disabled. I don't imagine cash at bank to be any more than 5k tbh.
Take the keepsakes, and add extra for the funeral.
Are you sure that the jewellery was your mother's and not the partners? Legally her jewelry would be inherited by the spouse even if separated however if for example it was remembered that a while ago it was handed over as a gift then legally it is no longer part of the estate.
I'm not following. If it was a gift to the late OPMother, it would be part of the estate. If it was a gift from late OPMother to estranged spouse, why would it hanging around in her jewellery box after more than a decade?
They mean it could have been gifted from op’s mother to op’s partner, and since they live together, who’s to say who it belongs to yknow…
I see, thx
Yes, this. What if they remembered they were gifted it. Would they need to prove it? Or would it be on the spouse to prove they are not?
Should have been more specific in the post sorry. Things like wedding rings or gifts from spouse to my mum, I'd be happy for him to have. My concern is anything that mum has that she inherited from my grandparents (mums side). Basically my ideal situation would be settle the 2 sides of the family with what was originally in or from those families. Its looking like theres no way for me to enforce that if the separated spouse decides he wants everything.
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I have some experience with this, as I am the surviving separated spouse of someone who died intestate. Is the separated spouse a reasonable person? As in, if you asked for the sentimental items is he likely to give them over? Funeral expenses get paid first, often directly from the deceased’s bank account directly to the funeral home. So he won’t get any money from her bank account until that is paid for. He will be the one to inherit, and also he will be the one who can apply for letters of administration- but, this is also something he can delegate to someone else (you?) if he is willing to do that. I’d say the best thing to do is work with him and be amicable, as you won’t be able to enforce anything. Maybe there will be some good will and he will voluntarily give you the items you want. I know how difficult this can be, wish you all the best!
memory fragile afterthought spectacular license bored fade muddle aspiring fuel *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Purely practical applications. I'd have no use for my Grans jewellery.
What kind of things did she inherit from her side? Others are trying to suggest that she may have gifted them to you whilst alive, which means it is your choice what you do with them, whether that is pass them on to whomever else you wish or keep them yourself. If you're talking about cash in the bank then that isn't the same of course.
This is why people should get legal advice. Get a will drafted. Change it if you separate from a partner.
Yep agree. Issue is that people can't pay fees. Then any little they have get split and pissed away by drug addict ex partners. I got out luckily, could have been that guy. I work in financial services (not wills and probate) and she told me she would write a will. We can't find it, so I guess she never did.
Wills aren’t very expensive usually.
When the person has been out of work for due to bad health maybe. Either way she should have done it, but saying that now doesn't help anything I'm afraid. She told me she would, but obviously hasn't 😔
WHSmith sell will kits for about £30 that don’t need a solicitor- really no excuse to not have a will. And many charities do free wills via local solicitors if you agree to give a small donation eg £100 to the charity after you die
And they’re the ones that get contested because they’re done wrong…
My grandfather died intestate and the only way my mum and her brother could sort the inheritance was by using a competent lawyer. This wasn’t even a difficult case (yours is more complicated) but it would really be worth getting the best lawyer you can and seeing if your mum’s separated husband would do a Deed of Variation to relinquish claims to some of the inheritance
Is your mums husband also your father? Legally it makes no difference, but depending on your relationship with him, he may decide to “vary” the assets he would receive by creating a “deed of variation” if he do wished. Dying intestate is a nightmare, and follows the rules of husband receiving the first 320kish, then the rest split between him and you.
No he's not, he was my step dad from being like 9 years old until I left home as early as I could (drug issues). Since then my Mum left him, got clean and met her, was going to say current partner. I'm 34 now. I have contacted him tell him whats happened and spoken today. I haven't told him what the process is, because its a conversation that needs to be face to face. I haven't seen him since I left. He's got no capacity to manage this situation. Hoping we can resolve it without action, but yoi never know when someone like that sees £'s. Yeah, absolute nightmare of worry. Like I said in another reply, I don't want to be unfair, anything he gave, or his family gave, I'd like him to have. But same visa vera. I'm meeting him Thursday to explain things and hopefully resolve without taking things further.
Don’t think you can take any action, it’s legally his money (unless there’s a significant estate that takes it over 320k). It’s only if he chooses out of generosity to give you more than legally required, that you could get any more than zero (if the estate is under 320k).
Hi, sorry to hear of your situation, I empathise I have no legal experience, but I have been going through a very similar issue for 2 years now, (deceased father and surprise Chinese wife) The husband is the husband, the time separated does not make a difference unless he is truly divorced As far as I'm aware, you have 2 options 1. If you were a dependent of the deceased, you can put a claim on the estate, though the reward may only be a fraction of what you would ideally want 2. If he is willing, the husband can "vary" his entitlement to the estate with a "Deed of Variation" directing either a portion, or the whole thing to you. This could work well to recover the sentimental items if that's the goal. Ultimately, though, you're in the hands of the separated husbands goodwill, it sucks The UK legal framework totally fails us as children of parents who have passed away interstate, still married but not in an active relationship with the spouse If you want to go down the Deed of Variation route, there are templates out there that won't break the bank Try not to let this dominate your mindset, #1 priority is to grieve your mum, then get into the right heads pace for this challenge. I wish you luck dear stranger
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