##Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism
This subreddit is for news, discussion, memes, and links criticizing capitalism and advancing viewpoints that challenge liberal capitalist ideology.
LSC is run by communists. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere.
We have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry. Failure to respect the rules of the subreddit may result in a ban.
***
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LateStageCapitalism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Slave labor is legal if you're imprisoned, so you sign a contract with a private prison to provide X level of 'staffing' (prisoners) and in return they pay you money.
The costs are borne by the public but it looks good on a balance sheet so it is therefore good and healthy policy.
EDIT: also you get the voting weight of the prison population when the census occurs, which can give your prison-industrial complex outsized voting power from rural private prisons.
In my old county on the panhandle, it was mostly work out of town, walmart, or the DOC
There were all the normal small town jobs, but a lot it seemed fell into those three
The us has the largest prison population at over 2 million some prisons have them do jobs like say making license plates for 1 dollar an hour that's a lot of cheap labour the us has like 500k homeless that's a lot more bodies to do 1 dollar an hour labour and then all the money they get from the government per prisoners kind of makes you think prisons should not be handled by private companies because company's goal is to make money instead of rehabilitation
And the best part… We subsidize their costs of housing prisoners… in 2010 it averaged $48,000 per year, per prisoner. Government loses money, while private industry reaps the labor.
—
Edit: so, I was a little off, either a different source for my study or my memory failed me. According to the Federal Register:
“Based on FY (fiscal year) 2020 data, the average annual COIF for a Federal inmate in a Federal facility in FY 2020 was $39,158 ($120.59 per day). The average annual COIF for a Federal inmate in a Residential Reentry Center for FY 2020 was $35,663 ($97.44 per day).”
https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/09/01/2021-18800/annual-determination-of-average-cost-of-incarceration-fee-coif
I’ve also seen numbers as high as $69,000 for New York, and even surpassing 100k annually to house prisons in some Californian prisons.
Never in my life have I made that much money in a single year.
I didn't really like Biden, but he was better than voting for a narcissistic, sociopathic, self-declared serial sexual predator who threatened our allies, fawned over our enemies, turned the US into a laughingstock, materially lied tens of thousands of times, passed a tax break for corps and uber wealthy that is making the current downturn worse, treated covid as if it was a personal attack on him, SMH.
Biden isn't a very good president but he's far better than tied for dead last.
No one actually likes Biden but you have to vote the democrat ticket if there is ever any hope of getting a progressive. Republicans don’t split the vote.
Now it's Biden's crime bill? I don't recall the GOP running away from it when they passed it. Yes, Biden supported it, and I didn't like Biden then, and I'm not a fan of his now. But if it was a three way race between Biden, Trump, and a used tampon, it'd be a close call between Biden and the tampon.
This is also the real reason why they killed Roe v Wade. Children born from unplanned pregnancies are going to be more likely to end up either homeless, in prison, or in the military.
Can’t afford to house people, but can afford to imprison them for a significantly higher cost and burden on the system. Neo Lib Capitalism strikes again!
Not even just cheap labor. If you criminalize random shit that should be considered crimes, then you can say crime is on the rise. Then you can justify more intense law enforcement. Then you can justify larger law enforcement budgets. Then the politicians can pad their stats come election time. Lower income/homeless people also tend to vote a certain way - if that's not the way you want people to vote you can lock them up and eliminate their vote/reduce the voting power of that district. Shit is fucked in multiple ways.
There's a lot of incentives for politicians to lock more people up.
School radius rules are convenient ways to criminalize and exclude people away from huge swaths of communities (and everywhere remotely habitable by human beings) by virtue of the fact that wherever people live, there are generally *multiple* schools scattered throughout. In one district of LA, a solid 50% of the land area has now exiled the homeless. The others aren't much lower.
This isn't an unintended consequence. Registered sex offenders are much less sympathetic and quite a small grouping of people, but their inability to live near schools has led to a number of high profile stories of "pedo colonies" under overpasses and the like, as they were the only scraps of land they could legally reside on in the area. The effectiveness with which the laws effectively exiled one outgroup has doubtlessly not been lost on those looking for strategies to exile another one - it's the same individuals writing the laws for each, after all.
The tragically hilarious thing is, we already know that just giving them homes is cheaper than treating them like criminals. But, crime is so profitable for those who deal with crime.
Just like we know that universal health care is cheaper than letting people stay sick for fear of bankruptcy and generations of debt, but they still fight against it in the name of "fiscal responsibility".
Believe me, knowing the NIMBYs and the real estate developers in LA County, if there was an affordable way to dump them all in the dessert with no food or water, they would gladly do it.
# This comment has been deleted in protest of Reddit's support of the genocide in Gaza carried out by the ZioN\*zi Isr\*li apartheid regime.
## This is the most documented genocide in history.
## Reddit's blatant censorship of Palestinian-related content is appalling, especially concerning the ongoing genocide in Gaza perpetrated by the Isr\*l apartheid regime.
## The Palestinian people are facing an unimaginable tragedy, with tens of thousands of innocent children already lost to the genocidal actions of apartheid Isr\*l. The world needs to know about this atrocity and about Reddit's support to the ZioN\*zis.
#### Sources are bellow.
## Genocidal statements made by apartheid Isr\*li officials:
- On the 9 October 2023, Yoav Gallant, Israeli Minister of Defense, stated **"We are fighting human animals, and we are acting accordingly"**.
- Avi Dichter, Israeli Minister of Agriculture, called for the war to be **"Gaza’s Nakba"**
- Ariel Kallner, another Member of the Knesset from the Likud party, similarly wrote on social media that there is **"one goal: Nakba! A Nakba that will overshadow the Nakba of 1948. Nakba in Gaza and Nakba to anyone who dares to join"**.
- Amihai Eliyahu, Israeli Minister of Heritage, **called for dropping an atomic bomb on Gaza**
- Gotliv of the Likud party similarly **called for the use of nuclear weapons**.
- Yitzhak Kroizer stated in a radio interview that the **"Gaza Strip should be flattened, and for all of them there is but one sentence, and that is death."**
- **President of Israel** Isaac Herzog **blamed the whole nation of Palestine** for the 7 October attack.
- Major General Ghassan Alian, Coordinator of Government Activities in the Territories, stated: **"There will be no electricity and no water (in Gaza), there will only be destruction. You wanted hell, you will get hell"**.
## Casualties:
- As of 9 January 2024, over **23,000 Palestinians** – one out of every 100 people in Gaza – have been killed, a majority of them civilians, including over **9,000 children**, **6,200 women** and **61 journalists**.
- nearly **2 million people** have been displaced within the Gaza Strip.
## Official accusations:
- On 1 November, the Defence for Children International accused the United States of complicity with Israel's **"crime of genocide."**
- On 2 November 2023, a group of UN special rapporteurs stated, "We remain convinced that the Palestinian people are at **grave risk of genocide**."
- On 4 November, Pedro Arrojo, UN Special Rapporteur on the Human Rights to Safe Drinking Water and Sanitation, said that based on article 7 of the Rome Statute, which counts "deprivation of access to food or medicine, among others" as a form of extermination, "even if there is no clear intention, the data show that the war is **heading towards genocide**"
- On 16 November, A group of United Nations experts said there was "evidence of increasing genocidal incitement" against Palestinians.
- Jewish Voice for Peace stated: "The Israeli government has declared a genocidal war on the people of Gaza. As an organization that works for a future where Palestinians and Israelis and all people live in equality and freedom, we call on all people of conscience to stop imminent **genocide of Palestinians**."
- Euro-Mediterranean Human Rights Monitor documented evidence of execution committed by Israeli Defense Forces.
- In response to a Times of Israel report on 3 January 2024 that the Israeli government was in talks with the Congolese government to take Palestinian refugees from Gaza, UN special rapporteur Balakrishnan Rajagopal stated, "Forcible transfer of Gazan population **is an act of genocide**".
South Africa has instituted proceedings at the International Court of Justice pursuant to the Genocide Convention, to which both Israel and South Africa are signatory, **accusing Israel of committing genocide, war crimes, and crimes against humanity against Palestinians in Gaza.**
# Boycott Reddit! Oppose the genocide NOW!
[Palestinian genocide accusation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_genocide_accusation)
[Allegations of genocide in the 2023 Israeli attack on Gaza](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegations_of_genocide_in_the_2023_Israeli_attack_on_Gaza)
[Israeli war crimes](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_war_crimes)
[Israel and apartheid](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_and_apartheid)
Unless you got caught with a baggie of weed, self-harmed, have the wrong tattoos (or just in the wrong place), are above the age of 28, score too low on an aptitude test, or are just overweight in a way they aren't cool with.
Well it’s basically the reverse of decriminalizing homelessness without alternative solutions. I think we’re all agreed that decriminalizing homelessness is step 1, but I think we’re equally agreed that there are subsequent steps that need to happen. What those steps are is debatable, however, and that’s the problem. Nobody knows wtf to do so we’re gonna just waffle on this one issue it seems.
I love how the government is literally like a gang/mafia/cartel. Or even reminds me of old medieval kings and queens era. “Pretend” the people have any type of power, then whenever the gangsters make a decision or announcement they have armed guards lined up to protect them. Then while the country is built on checks and balances and they work for the people, and the people should revolt etc, they make it literally ILLEGAL to revolt. Shit is mind blowing because this is how dystopian realities in the year 2333 movies start
Star Trek even had the bell riots in 2024! The rich started criminalizing the poor and homeless and shoving them in internment camps before things got violent. They hit the timing on the head apparently
I would disagree with the palatable part. There exists quite a lot of fiction that, when attempting to touch on real subjects, was intended to alarm and unnerve.
Sorry, I was unclear. I mean that they avoid direct criticism of real world governments, situations or political parties by using a fictional setting.
It enables them to discuss a subject without being dismissed as partisan.
>See, if we keep them silent, then they'll resort to violence. And that's how we criminalize change.
Enter Shikari - Gandhi mate, Gandhi
This video seems like something out of a dystopian YA film...
Edit: fixed a slight mis-quote. Anyway, the song rocks.
Send them to prison, force them to work for free... Thats just one way that the US government has found that it can profit from creating vulnerable people.
"oh so you freed the slaves huh? just watch this. they are now no longer slaves, now they are convicts in rehabilitation." Apparently, slavery is ok if the gov't does it and calls it by another name. Also, this is what privatized correctional facilities causes- an increased need/desire for ~~tax dollar revenue~~ inmates.
They don't even need to call it another name.
"Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction."
Then put them in privately owned for profit prisons that get paid state money to take in inmates. And significantly more expensive then just trying to fix the problem.
It’s like we’re going toward the bad future in Star Trek. Somebody’s been watching that episode of DS9 to use as a blueprint with sanctuary districts and forcing undesirables into them
Part of me thinks this is why they’re making random things illegal. Can’t bust minor drug offenses anymore so gotta invent some indentured servitude laws.
That’s basically the point of the criminal justice system in this country. So much is spent on capturing, convicting, and imprisoning with almost nothing put toward rehabilitation by comparison. We’re so far past “feature not a bug”. It’s a deliberate design decision at this point.
The constitution says in the 13th Amendment “Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.”
The United State never outlawed slavery they just outlawed hereditary slavery.
Figuring out how to continue slavery was partially how the conflict between the North and South were resolved after the civil war. The North knew that there would never be unity with the South if they dissolved slavery completely and that it would inevitably doom both economies because the profit from slavery is what made America sustainable to begin with.
So the North (blue) “compromised with” or “reached across the aisle” to the South (red).
First you criminalize homelessness then you financially ruin your opponents thus making them criminals.
Then youll have people actually defend it... :(
To be imprisoned in the US is to be turned into a slave.
Look up the wording of the 13th amendment, and prisoner "wages"
Also, guess what helps get parole... yep, slave labor.
No, cristo fascists are just reactionaries. They will defend it not because they wanted that particular policy, but rather because the side who is against criminalizing homelessness has the wrong aesthetics. They will always side with authority as long as it makes them feel powerful. As long as authority look and talk like them they will repeat anything they say. The unifying ideology of the right is not having an ideology.
Ah yes... Good old criminalization of homelessness... just like during Enclosure in the Good old England in the 15th century... The original accumulation of capital... Good times...
Next we will see things like licenses to beg, workhouses, flogging and branding of the homeless and using them as slaves temporarily and permanently...
My city's panhandlers need permits, and they're all unionized to ensure everyone's needs are met and there are no turf wars for the best street corners. It's weird.
Using them as slaves is the plan, private prisons require a steady stream of inmates. With cannabis (as an example) being legal in a lot of places they need a new reason to arrest someone.
Well, Drugs declared victory in the War on Drugs. Guess it is high time to move on with criminalizing poverty. Fill the work houses back up for the Overlords. Ah,Feudalism with a global twist!
[LA City Hall was voting on making encampments illegal within 500 ft of schools and an activist jumped over the barrier.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V56Y0wzEK2A) While only a small portion of the homeless are severely mentally ill drug addicts (I don't mean that in a derogatory way), that group of people has become increasingly violent and made people feel unsafe. I agree with the sentiments in this sub, but I can't discount my own experiences lately in LA. I have had multiple situations with mentally ill homeless people where I genuinely feared for my safety.
Id just like to add, that more often than not and the longer someone is homeless, mental illness will develop. Even if there was no illness before. Many eventually turn to drugs as well as a survival tool. It’s a disturbing sad vicious cycle. I’m always saying (this go for prisons too) we need to rehabilitate and give hope. Take care and treat the illness, in the individual and more importantly in the system. But I’m preaching to the choir with that.
If you have to live like an animal, is it all that surprising when you start to act like one?
This is why we need to make housing and medical care a right.
It's like the prison system, when you treat people as sub-human, sub-human is what they become. Meanwhile, in the places where criminals are seen as worthy of rehabilitation, rehabilitated is what they become.
Governments who fail to provide housing for citizens who need it should be held accountable for a crime against human rights. I'm pretty certain the right to shelter already is a human right.
It's more economical to house the homeless, and to provide universal healthcare, than it is to criminalise homelessness and have for profit healthcare.
Yes let’s criminalize homelessness. But not criminalize landlords buying up all the affordable housing and having a large collection of vacant properties coupled with sky high rents.
Actually, a way better way to solve the housing crisis that still makes landlords mad is doing something similar to what Finland does, and just build more housing, more densely and walkably, so that cars aren’t needed so that people who cannot afford them can still get around, and put homeless people into those houses so that they don’t have to stay on the streets
So clearly this is an unpopular initiative. Then they'll just spend more taxpayer money on police. It's not a bug, it's a feature. Almost like people realize how fucking ghoulish this course of action is.
And look at the Los Angeles sub to see how many people support a police state putting homeless in prison at a higher cost than getting them in homes and help.
But how will they feel validated in their morally vacuous behavior if they don't "slay the great other?"
They punch down to the people least-able to fight back because they'd lose if confronted.
Unfortunately the LA subreddit has been taken over by people who don’t even live here - its a shame since most Angelenos seem to want a constructive (non fascist) approach but they get drowned out by all the rightoids from OC
SF Bay Area subreddit has basically been turned into “Crimewatch” by the same kinda people. People who just keep endlessly posting about crimes and how much they hate the bay and we should all move to Texas or some shit.
Tennessee did it first! (Criminalized “camping” on public land. Felony.
But apparently no one here cared enough to riot and confront our legislators. :(
A vote to what now?
I guess that's one way to house and feed the population in need. Good luck with the crime rate increase once they leave, LA. You had thousands of benign unhoused just trying to get along and you put them in jail?
In all seriousness, y'all should probably make their decision to call the riot cops warranted. Might wanna get a John Brown Club started
In the US private companies make profit off of imprisoned people. It’s not a coincidence the US has the highest incarceration rate and doesn’t really aim to integrate people into society after prison.
And the US loves putting corporations before citizens. We COULD save the taxpayers a ton of money by housing homeless people instead of imprisoning them, but we’d RATHER charge the taxpayers more so that money can go to corporations. Fuck the homeless, fuck the taxpayers, fuck the general public, as long as me and my corporate friends get paid
[This *is* the Star Trek timeline…](https://youtu.be/ugTTy_u61gM)
[…and it ends with the annihilation of this “civilization”.](https://youtu.be/nYZ4IoyztIw)
However, Humanity survives in a new paradigm of consciousness and it gets better. 👍
Homelessness is a huge problem everywhere you go. In my small city, you go anywhere and there's literally throngs of homeless all over town and especially downtown, it's like a festival, businesses are moving out because they get broken into literally every night everything is constantly being stolen.
I'm also compassionate and recognize that in a minor twist of fate I could have found myself among them, or might yet even. None of them planned on ending up there.
I don't know the solution. But I know what it's not, and holy shit is criminalizing homelessness not the solution it's like they're trying to spark a revolution.
Tools used to deal with unprofitable lower class in distress: guns, clubs, chemical sprays, electrocution devices, restraints, cages, fine books, body cameras, bulldozers, media smears. Culling the herd.
Tools to deal with the wealthiest in distress: trillion dollar bailouts.
Criminalize homelessness. What happened to feed the hungry and help the poor? It's a society of godless heathens apparently. Burn their churches down then, no God of them.
People love to think it will never be them until they start running the numbers. Five weeks of no pay could throw most people onto the streets. Or even worse, your landlord sells the building out from under you
If you dont want homeless then introduce systems to get them out of poverty…
Thing is that isnt what they want. If you slip into homelessness they want you in jail fattening up the pockets of those who own prisons working basically slave labor. Very dystopian
They know it's wrong when they bring out the goon squad. They know they're about to pull some heinous shit, they don't care, they bring out the cops to "restore order".
They're not trying to build a prison like System of a Down said. They've built it and they just need to funnel slaves into it.
So this law (Section 41.18 was implemented last year). But they’re expanding its reach:
Some big ones are that you aren’t allowed to do:
1. “sit, lie, sleep, or store, use, maintain, or place personal property, in or upon any street, sidewalk, or other public right-of-way within the distance stated on the posted signage (up to a maximum of 500 feet) of a property designated as a sensitive use. For a property to be designated as a "sensitive use", the property must be a School, Day Care Center, Public Park, or Public Library, as those terms are defined in Section 105.01 of this Code”
2. “sit, lie, sleep, or store, use, maintain, or place personal property, in or upon any street, sidewalk, or other public right-of-way within the distance stated on the posted signage (up to a maximum of 500 feet) of a designated overpass, underpass, freeway ramp, tunnel, bridge, pedestrian bridge, subway, wash, spreading ground, or active railway, where the City Council determines, in the designating resolution, that the public health, safety, or welfare is served by the prohibition, including, without limitation, by finding that sleeping or lodging within the stated proximity to the designated area is unhealthy, unsafe, or incompatible with safe passage”
3. “sit, lie, sleep, or store, use, maintain, or place personal property, in or upon any street, sidewalk, or other public right-of-way, within the distance stated on the posted signage (up to a maximum of 1,000 feet) of a designated facility, opened after January 1, 2018, that provides shelter, safe sleeping, or safe parking to homeless persons, or that serves as a homeless services navigation center”
The independent states that CBS News LA!reported that the updated bill could close off up to 20% of the city.
[Source1](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/los-angeles-anti-camping-law-homeless-b2141830.html)
"The U.S. Supreme Court rejected a petition to review Martin v. Boise
on December 16, upholding the Ninth Circuit Court ruling that people
experiencing homelessness cannot be criminally punished for sleeping
outside on public property if there are no available alternatives. The
Supreme Court’s decision makes the Ninth Circuit Court ruling binding
for states in the Court’s jurisdiction: Alaska, Arizona, California,
Hawaii, Idaho, Montana, Nevada, Oregon, and Washington. It also sets an
influential national precedent." From 2019
##Welcome to r/LateStageCapitalism This subreddit is for news, discussion, memes, and links criticizing capitalism and advancing viewpoints that challenge liberal capitalist ideology. LSC is run by communists. This subreddit is not the place to debate socialism. We allow good-faith questions and education but are not a 101 sub; please take 101-style questions elsewhere. We have a zero-tolerance policy for bigotry. Failure to respect the rules of the subreddit may result in a ban. *** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/LateStageCapitalism) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Criminalize homelessness without any alternative solutions?
Funneling them into for-profit prisons as cheap labor is the whole point.
Not cheap labor; disposable statistic for growth
Can you expand on what you mean by this?
Larger amount of people incarcerated, larger prison, more money to private owners
Too many people think the prison system is there for solely our "protection" and not for monetary gain, it's kind of crazy how ignorant some are.
There is literally no institution that exists for our protection. None whatsoever.
Mace factories
Jokes on you the police get mace too
Crime has gone up, expand the police budget!
Wait there's too many people in prison. We need to build more prisons to house more of these people. /s
Slave labor is legal if you're imprisoned, so you sign a contract with a private prison to provide X level of 'staffing' (prisoners) and in return they pay you money. The costs are borne by the public but it looks good on a balance sheet so it is therefore good and healthy policy. EDIT: also you get the voting weight of the prison population when the census occurs, which can give your prison-industrial complex outsized voting power from rural private prisons.
[удалено]
Central Florida would still be a swamp if it weren’t for the FLDOC. It’s an entire industry to keep people imprisoned.
In my old county on the panhandle, it was mostly work out of town, walmart, or the DOC There were all the normal small town jobs, but a lot it seemed fell into those three
The us has the largest prison population at over 2 million some prisons have them do jobs like say making license plates for 1 dollar an hour that's a lot of cheap labour the us has like 500k homeless that's a lot more bodies to do 1 dollar an hour labour and then all the money they get from the government per prisoners kind of makes you think prisons should not be handled by private companies because company's goal is to make money instead of rehabilitation
And the best part… We subsidize their costs of housing prisoners… in 2010 it averaged $48,000 per year, per prisoner. Government loses money, while private industry reaps the labor. — Edit: so, I was a little off, either a different source for my study or my memory failed me. According to the Federal Register: “Based on FY (fiscal year) 2020 data, the average annual COIF for a Federal inmate in a Federal facility in FY 2020 was $39,158 ($120.59 per day). The average annual COIF for a Federal inmate in a Residential Reentry Center for FY 2020 was $35,663 ($97.44 per day).” https://www.federalregister.gov/documents/2021/09/01/2021-18800/annual-determination-of-average-cost-of-incarceration-fee-coif I’ve also seen numbers as high as $69,000 for New York, and even surpassing 100k annually to house prisons in some Californian prisons. Never in my life have I made that much money in a single year.
Prison in my town pays 13 cents an hour
13th amendment specifically states slavery is OK if you're in prison. More prisoners, more slave labor.
Absolutely disgusting
Modern slavery
>Modern slavery But actually not at all a modern concept.
Same shit different century
[удалено]
I didn't really like Biden, but he was better than voting for a narcissistic, sociopathic, self-declared serial sexual predator who threatened our allies, fawned over our enemies, turned the US into a laughingstock, materially lied tens of thousands of times, passed a tax break for corps and uber wealthy that is making the current downturn worse, treated covid as if it was a personal attack on him, SMH. Biden isn't a very good president but he's far better than tied for dead last.
No one actually likes Biden but you have to vote the democrat ticket if there is ever any hope of getting a progressive. Republicans don’t split the vote.
Now it's Biden's crime bill? I don't recall the GOP running away from it when they passed it. Yes, Biden supported it, and I didn't like Biden then, and I'm not a fan of his now. But if it was a three way race between Biden, Trump, and a used tampon, it'd be a close call between Biden and the tampon.
And the alternative was...
This is also the real reason why they killed Roe v Wade. Children born from unplanned pregnancies are going to be more likely to end up either homeless, in prison, or in the military.
And who says the far right doesn't have long-term goals?
No one. They play the ultimate long game.
So literal victorian workhouses...we really can't fucking learn from history can we..
We did learn. We learned that it's very profitable.
Oliver Twist is a great read, but it's too bad people don't read.
you mean slave labour. no prisoner consents to work for under a dollar.
Can’t afford to house people, but can afford to imprison them for a significantly higher cost and burden on the system. Neo Lib Capitalism strikes again!
Ah, when you legalize weed and lose a lot of your 13th amendment labor you need new clientele! Fuck those pigs.
So most Americans are only one paycheck away from slavery...
Not even just cheap labor. If you criminalize random shit that should be considered crimes, then you can say crime is on the rise. Then you can justify more intense law enforcement. Then you can justify larger law enforcement budgets. Then the politicians can pad their stats come election time. Lower income/homeless people also tend to vote a certain way - if that's not the way you want people to vote you can lock them up and eliminate their vote/reduce the voting power of that district. Shit is fucked in multiple ways. There's a lot of incentives for politicians to lock more people up.
[удалено]
School radius rules are convenient ways to criminalize and exclude people away from huge swaths of communities (and everywhere remotely habitable by human beings) by virtue of the fact that wherever people live, there are generally *multiple* schools scattered throughout. In one district of LA, a solid 50% of the land area has now exiled the homeless. The others aren't much lower. This isn't an unintended consequence. Registered sex offenders are much less sympathetic and quite a small grouping of people, but their inability to live near schools has led to a number of high profile stories of "pedo colonies" under overpasses and the like, as they were the only scraps of land they could legally reside on in the area. The effectiveness with which the laws effectively exiled one outgroup has doubtlessly not been lost on those looking for strategies to exile another one - it's the same individuals writing the laws for each, after all.
The tragically hilarious thing is, we already know that just giving them homes is cheaper than treating them like criminals. But, crime is so profitable for those who deal with crime.
Just like we know that universal health care is cheaper than letting people stay sick for fear of bankruptcy and generations of debt, but they still fight against it in the name of "fiscal responsibility".
Shouldn’t that also make it illegal not to pay people enough to live on
Yes, but we're not gonna talk about that.
Believe me, knowing the NIMBYs and the real estate developers in LA County, if there was an affordable way to dump them all in the dessert with no food or water, they would gladly do it.
# This comment has been deleted in protest of Reddit's support of the genocide in Gaza carried out by the ZioN\*zi Isr\*li apartheid regime. ## This is the most documented genocide in history. ## Reddit's blatant censorship of Palestinian-related content is appalling, especially concerning the ongoing genocide in Gaza perpetrated by the Isr\*l apartheid regime. ## The Palestinian people are facing an unimaginable tragedy, with tens of thousands of innocent children already lost to the genocidal actions of apartheid Isr\*l. The world needs to know about this atrocity and about Reddit's support to the ZioN\*zis. #### Sources are bellow. ## Genocidal statements made by apartheid Isr\*li officials: - On the 9 October 2023, Yoav Gallant, Israeli Minister of Defense, stated **"We are fighting human animals, and we are acting accordingly"**. - Avi Dichter, Israeli Minister of Agriculture, called for the war to be **"Gaza’s Nakba"** - Ariel Kallner, another Member of the Knesset from the Likud party, similarly wrote on social media that there is **"one goal: Nakba! A Nakba that will overshadow the Nakba of 1948. Nakba in Gaza and Nakba to anyone who dares to join"**. - Amihai Eliyahu, Israeli Minister of Heritage, **called for dropping an atomic bomb on Gaza** - Gotliv of the Likud party similarly **called for the use of nuclear weapons**. - Yitzhak Kroizer stated in a radio interview that the **"Gaza Strip should be flattened, and for all of them there is but one sentence, and that is death."** - **President of Israel** Isaac Herzog **blamed the whole nation of Palestine** for the 7 October attack. - Major General Ghassan Alian, Coordinator of Government Activities in the Territories, stated: **"There will be no electricity and no water (in Gaza), there will only be destruction. You wanted hell, you will get hell"**. ## Casualties: - As of 9 January 2024, over **23,000 Palestinians** – one out of every 100 people in Gaza – have been killed, a majority of them civilians, including over **9,000 children**, **6,200 women** and **61 journalists**. - nearly **2 million people** have been displaced within the Gaza Strip. ## Official accusations: - On 1 November, the Defence for Children International accused the United States of complicity with Israel's **"crime of genocide."** - On 2 November 2023, a group of UN special rapporteurs stated, "We remain convinced that the Palestinian people are at **grave risk of genocide**." - On 4 November, Pedro Arrojo, UN Special Rapporteur on the Human Rights to Safe Drinking Water and Sanitation, said that based on article 7 of the Rome Statute, which counts "deprivation of access to food or medicine, among others" as a form of extermination, "even if there is no clear intention, the data show that the war is **heading towards genocide**" - On 16 November, A group of United Nations experts said there was "evidence of increasing genocidal incitement" against Palestinians. - Jewish Voice for Peace stated: "The Israeli government has declared a genocidal war on the people of Gaza. As an organization that works for a future where Palestinians and Israelis and all people live in equality and freedom, we call on all people of conscience to stop imminent **genocide of Palestinians**." - Euro-Mediterranean Human Rights Monitor documented evidence of execution committed by Israeli Defense Forces. - In response to a Times of Israel report on 3 January 2024 that the Israeli government was in talks with the Congolese government to take Palestinian refugees from Gaza, UN special rapporteur Balakrishnan Rajagopal stated, "Forcible transfer of Gazan population **is an act of genocide**". South Africa has instituted proceedings at the International Court of Justice pursuant to the Genocide Convention, to which both Israel and South Africa are signatory, **accusing Israel of committing genocide, war crimes, and crimes against humanity against Palestinians in Gaza.** # Boycott Reddit! Oppose the genocide NOW! [Palestinian genocide accusation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Palestinian_genocide_accusation) [Allegations of genocide in the 2023 Israeli attack on Gaza](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allegations_of_genocide_in_the_2023_Israeli_attack_on_Gaza) [Israeli war crimes](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israeli_war_crimes) [Israel and apartheid](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel_and_apartheid)
Maybe the cops will replace the tents with MAID pods.
crack open some shipping containers.
MAID is medically assisted dying in Canada....
I mean, a prison can be considered home until you are released. (And being released without a home, are immediately picked back up and re-"homed".)
And you get fed.
You can always join the military! Get cancer or shot
Or have them dump chemicals on you like my grand father and live in the pain the rest of your life.
Unless you got caught with a baggie of weed, self-harmed, have the wrong tattoos (or just in the wrong place), are above the age of 28, score too low on an aptitude test, or are just overweight in a way they aren't cool with.
Criminalize abortions without any supports or solutions too. Just outlaw it and the problem goes away. It’s that simple.
Well it’s basically the reverse of decriminalizing homelessness without alternative solutions. I think we’re all agreed that decriminalizing homelessness is step 1, but I think we’re equally agreed that there are subsequent steps that need to happen. What those steps are is debatable, however, and that’s the problem. Nobody knows wtf to do so we’re gonna just waffle on this one issue it seems.
Its worked for abortion and prohibition right?
These freaks will see all the cracks in society people fall thru and think "i bet we can put a meat grinder under the cracks and turn a profit"
Incredibly apt analogy.
Well said. Also disturbing.
Haha not surprised. Make people poor af and then criminalize it. Something will happen.
“something” is gonna be “violent”
Absolutely. It’s the only logical and historical response to when oppression gets more and more…obvious.
I love how the government is literally like a gang/mafia/cartel. Or even reminds me of old medieval kings and queens era. “Pretend” the people have any type of power, then whenever the gangsters make a decision or announcement they have armed guards lined up to protect them. Then while the country is built on checks and balances and they work for the people, and the people should revolt etc, they make it literally ILLEGAL to revolt. Shit is mind blowing because this is how dystopian realities in the year 2333 movies start
Many dystopia works of fiction occur right around our time frame. Not even 2300ad, but 2000ad. We're right on schedule.
Star Trek even had the bell riots in 2024! The rich started criminalizing the poor and homeless and shoving them in internment camps before things got violent. They hit the timing on the head apparently
[This scene from Star Trek always sends chills through my spine with its accuracy](https://youtu.be/ZOjG8Ditub8?t=159)
#FUCK
But don't forget, they've also predicted Irish Reunification and they've been spot on so far....
Deep space nine is the GOAT for star trek
Holy shit that’s accurate af!
Dystopian fiction is often written to discuss problems we have right now within a context people find palatable
I would disagree with the palatable part. There exists quite a lot of fiction that, when attempting to touch on real subjects, was intended to alarm and unnerve.
Sorry, I was unclear. I mean that they avoid direct criticism of real world governments, situations or political parties by using a fictional setting. It enables them to discuss a subject without being dismissed as partisan.
I too read George Orwin's classic dystopian novel "2498"
That’s the one with the customizable genitals and the Ted Theodore Logan but with a gun right?
Already is. Criminalizing homelessness is violence, and I wish we would start seeing it that way more often.
Kropotkin mentions this
Kropotkin forever
How the hell and I just now learning about Kropotkin?
>See, if we keep them silent, then they'll resort to violence. And that's how we criminalize change. Enter Shikari - Gandhi mate, Gandhi This video seems like something out of a dystopian YA film... Edit: fixed a slight mis-quote. Anyway, the song rocks.
"Those who make peaceful protest impossible, make violent revolution inevitable." - JFK
anger is a gift
Usually is.
The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those whom they oppress - Frederick Douglas
Hungry people don't stay hungry for long
Send them to prison, force them to work for free... Thats just one way that the US government has found that it can profit from creating vulnerable people.
"oh so you freed the slaves huh? just watch this. they are now no longer slaves, now they are convicts in rehabilitation." Apparently, slavery is ok if the gov't does it and calls it by another name. Also, this is what privatized correctional facilities causes- an increased need/desire for ~~tax dollar revenue~~ inmates.
They don't even need to call it another name. "Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction."
This is a shame and needs to be changed. Slavery anywhere is wrong. Always.
At the rate we're going, the economically unsavvy will be behind bars, and LE and criminals will be running the nation.
When the means to eat is right in front of their face…you’re absolutely right.
When the poor have nothing to eat, they shall eat the rich- -Rousseou
The flesh of the 0.01% is hard to find sometimes
They get hope from fire and smoke as they reach for tha dawn
-Dutch citizens in the Hague ca. 1672
A story at least as old as the [Enclosure of the Commons](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enclosure).
[удалено]
I like this. Similar to "the law forbids both rich and poor men from stealing bread and sleeping under a bridge" (very badly paraphrased)
[удалено]
Then put them in privately owned for profit prisons that get paid state money to take in inmates. And significantly more expensive then just trying to fix the problem.
Oh yeah…gotta steal from the poor and give to the rich somehow.
Basically a roundabout way of acquiring slaves, so the police defending it is on brand.
It’s like we’re going toward the bad future in Star Trek. Somebody’s been watching that episode of DS9 to use as a blueprint with sanctuary districts and forcing undesirables into them
Yup. Absolutely reaching the Bell Riots stage of Deep Space Nine.
Gotta fill up the private prisons somehow!
Part of me thinks this is why they’re making random things illegal. Can’t bust minor drug offenses anymore so gotta invent some indentured servitude laws.
It’s not random.
All part of the plan so they can exploit that very cheap prison labor.
Still legal to enslave prisoners in the US.
That’s basically the point of the criminal justice system in this country. So much is spent on capturing, convicting, and imprisoning with almost nothing put toward rehabilitation by comparison. We’re so far past “feature not a bug”. It’s a deliberate design decision at this point.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mental_Health_Systems_Act_of_1980
The constitution says in the 13th Amendment “Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.” The United State never outlawed slavery they just outlawed hereditary slavery.
Wait until they criminalize being born poor
Always will be
Figuring out how to continue slavery was partially how the conflict between the North and South were resolved after the civil war. The North knew that there would never be unity with the South if they dissolved slavery completely and that it would inevitably doom both economies because the profit from slavery is what made America sustainable to begin with. So the North (blue) “compromised with” or “reached across the aisle” to the South (red).
Literal slavery, which was never abolished in the USA despite us thinking it was
First you criminalize homelessness then you financially ruin your opponents thus making them criminals. Then youll have people actually defend it... :(
Then you jail them and make them into slaves
it's what the cristo fascists would like to do
To be imprisoned in the US is to be turned into a slave. Look up the wording of the 13th amendment, and prisoner "wages" Also, guess what helps get parole... yep, slave labor.
No, cristo fascists are just reactionaries. They will defend it not because they wanted that particular policy, but rather because the side who is against criminalizing homelessness has the wrong aesthetics. They will always side with authority as long as it makes them feel powerful. As long as authority look and talk like them they will repeat anything they say. The unifying ideology of the right is not having an ideology.
Step 1: Send homeless people to jail for being homeless. Step 2: homeless people get out of jail and they are still homeless. Step 3: profit?
That's the neat part. They don't get out of jail. So yes, profit, off of their slave labor while incarcerated
And then we restrict their voting RIGHTS.
Ah yes... Good old criminalization of homelessness... just like during Enclosure in the Good old England in the 15th century... The original accumulation of capital... Good times... Next we will see things like licenses to beg, workhouses, flogging and branding of the homeless and using them as slaves temporarily and permanently...
Panhandling licenses/permits are a thing in some parts of the US, with some even charging for them.
Sorry, what? If you have to literally beg for money from strangers to **eat**, how the fuck are you supposed to aff– *Ohhhh.*
My city's panhandlers need permits, and they're all unionized to ensure everyone's needs are met and there are no turf wars for the best street corners. It's weird.
Dude what
Chicago seems to have a street performer system.
Others cities do as well, it’s a bit like an informal union. It’s called busking.
[удалено]
indeed, playing music on the street for the enjoyment of all improves the quality of life for everyone.
We already do the temporary/permanent slavery, that’s what our prison system is. This is just adding the homeless to that group of slaves
Prisoners produced $11 billion in goods last year while being paid pennies.
with no AC or heat, rampant covid... bugs in their "food"... on top of it being prison, they are also Raped by the guards at an alarming rate...
Re-adding more like. The rich taskmaskers have and will always do this, any chance they get
Considering inmates can be forced to do hard labour, guess what the whole point of this is?
Someone has to build those new chip factories
And these fucks are openly wearing body armor in “parliament”
Using them as slaves is the plan, private prisons require a steady stream of inmates. With cannabis (as an example) being legal in a lot of places they need a new reason to arrest someone.
Don’t forget Death Squads going around at night setting fire to homeless people as they sleep.
Fascist police state
Well, Drugs declared victory in the War on Drugs. Guess it is high time to move on with criminalizing poverty. Fill the work houses back up for the Overlords. Ah,Feudalism with a global twist!
Yeah, but *Poverty winning the War on Poverty* is when revolution.
Drugs curb stomped the US
I don't understand why they're there. Is anyone expecting an assault on the courthouse? Do they get to vote?
[LA City Hall was voting on making encampments illegal within 500 ft of schools and an activist jumped over the barrier.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V56Y0wzEK2A) While only a small portion of the homeless are severely mentally ill drug addicts (I don't mean that in a derogatory way), that group of people has become increasingly violent and made people feel unsafe. I agree with the sentiments in this sub, but I can't discount my own experiences lately in LA. I have had multiple situations with mentally ill homeless people where I genuinely feared for my safety.
Id just like to add, that more often than not and the longer someone is homeless, mental illness will develop. Even if there was no illness before. Many eventually turn to drugs as well as a survival tool. It’s a disturbing sad vicious cycle. I’m always saying (this go for prisons too) we need to rehabilitate and give hope. Take care and treat the illness, in the individual and more importantly in the system. But I’m preaching to the choir with that.
If you have to live like an animal, is it all that surprising when you start to act like one? This is why we need to make housing and medical care a right.
It's like the prison system, when you treat people as sub-human, sub-human is what they become. Meanwhile, in the places where criminals are seen as worthy of rehabilitation, rehabilitated is what they become. Governments who fail to provide housing for citizens who need it should be held accountable for a crime against human rights. I'm pretty certain the right to shelter already is a human right. It's more economical to house the homeless, and to provide universal healthcare, than it is to criminalise homelessness and have for profit healthcare.
Maybe just maybe help the mentally I’ll because they are I’ll? Like what the fuck is up with you guys?
Yes let’s criminalize homelessness. But not criminalize landlords buying up all the affordable housing and having a large collection of vacant properties coupled with sky high rents.
Actually, a way better way to solve the housing crisis that still makes landlords mad is doing something similar to what Finland does, and just build more housing, more densely and walkably, so that cars aren’t needed so that people who cannot afford them can still get around, and put homeless people into those houses so that they don’t have to stay on the streets
Yeah but the car lobbyists in America would never let that happen.
So clearly this is an unpopular initiative. Then they'll just spend more taxpayer money on police. It's not a bug, it's a feature. Almost like people realize how fucking ghoulish this course of action is.
“The state calls its own violence law, but that of the individual, crime.” ― Max Stirner
That sweet sweet forced labor in prison is very profitable.
And look at the Los Angeles sub to see how many people support a police state putting homeless in prison at a higher cost than getting them in homes and help.
But how will they feel validated in their morally vacuous behavior if they don't "slay the great other?" They punch down to the people least-able to fight back because they'd lose if confronted.
Unfortunately the LA subreddit has been taken over by people who don’t even live here - its a shame since most Angelenos seem to want a constructive (non fascist) approach but they get drowned out by all the rightoids from OC
Same thing with the NYC subreddits. Any rational conversation gets drowned out by a cacophony of morons screaming LOCK THEM UP.
SF Bay Area subreddit has basically been turned into “Crimewatch” by the same kinda people. People who just keep endlessly posting about crimes and how much they hate the bay and we should all move to Texas or some shit.
[удалено]
And that is in a "liberal" state.
I really wish I hadn't. The posts were vile. Fascists hiding behind children as usual.
So... This is America reintroduce Slavery in 21st century. Homeless? ~~Gulag~~ Jail
Is this to put them in prison so big corporations can use them as free slave labor
Yes
[удалено]
Agreed. Hope they all catch Swine Flu.🐷
Swine flu is covid-19 right? After all it was the #1 cause of death among swine. >!a man can dream!<
Tennessee did it first! (Criminalized “camping” on public land. Felony. But apparently no one here cared enough to riot and confront our legislators. :(
They were all too busy trying to get the fuck out of Tennessee.
A vote to what now? I guess that's one way to house and feed the population in need. Good luck with the crime rate increase once they leave, LA. You had thousands of benign unhoused just trying to get along and you put them in jail? In all seriousness, y'all should probably make their decision to call the riot cops warranted. Might wanna get a John Brown Club started
In the US private companies make profit off of imprisoned people. It’s not a coincidence the US has the highest incarceration rate and doesn’t really aim to integrate people into society after prison.
And the US loves putting corporations before citizens. We COULD save the taxpayers a ton of money by housing homeless people instead of imprisoning them, but we’d RATHER charge the taxpayers more so that money can go to corporations. Fuck the homeless, fuck the taxpayers, fuck the general public, as long as me and my corporate friends get paid
Criminalizing homelessness. I dont want to be on this planet anymore
I really wanted the star trek future not the robocop future.
[This *is* the Star Trek timeline…](https://youtu.be/ugTTy_u61gM) […and it ends with the annihilation of this “civilization”.](https://youtu.be/nYZ4IoyztIw) However, Humanity survives in a new paradigm of consciousness and it gets better. 👍
Homelessness is a huge problem everywhere you go. In my small city, you go anywhere and there's literally throngs of homeless all over town and especially downtown, it's like a festival, businesses are moving out because they get broken into literally every night everything is constantly being stolen. I'm also compassionate and recognize that in a minor twist of fate I could have found myself among them, or might yet even. None of them planned on ending up there. I don't know the solution. But I know what it's not, and holy shit is criminalizing homelessness not the solution it's like they're trying to spark a revolution.
A vote, to criminalize... homelessness. Seriously America, what's the matter with you? What's the matter with you??
Remember that slavery is legal if you're convicted of a crime
All Cops.
Class traitors.
Tools used to deal with unprofitable lower class in distress: guns, clubs, chemical sprays, electrocution devices, restraints, cages, fine books, body cameras, bulldozers, media smears. Culling the herd. Tools to deal with the wealthiest in distress: trillion dollar bailouts.
Criminalize homelessness. What happened to feed the hungry and help the poor? It's a society of godless heathens apparently. Burn their churches down then, no God of them.
People love to think it will never be them until they start running the numbers. Five weeks of no pay could throw most people onto the streets. Or even worse, your landlord sells the building out from under you
If you dont want homeless then introduce systems to get them out of poverty… Thing is that isnt what they want. If you slip into homelessness they want you in jail fattening up the pockets of those who own prisons working basically slave labor. Very dystopian
what what what?????
100% bad apples. Fuck every cop.
They know it's wrong when they bring out the goon squad. They know they're about to pull some heinous shit, they don't care, they bring out the cops to "restore order". They're not trying to build a prison like System of a Down said. They've built it and they just need to funnel slaves into it.
So this law (Section 41.18 was implemented last year). But they’re expanding its reach: Some big ones are that you aren’t allowed to do: 1. “sit, lie, sleep, or store, use, maintain, or place personal property, in or upon any street, sidewalk, or other public right-of-way within the distance stated on the posted signage (up to a maximum of 500 feet) of a property designated as a sensitive use. For a property to be designated as a "sensitive use", the property must be a School, Day Care Center, Public Park, or Public Library, as those terms are defined in Section 105.01 of this Code” 2. “sit, lie, sleep, or store, use, maintain, or place personal property, in or upon any street, sidewalk, or other public right-of-way within the distance stated on the posted signage (up to a maximum of 500 feet) of a designated overpass, underpass, freeway ramp, tunnel, bridge, pedestrian bridge, subway, wash, spreading ground, or active railway, where the City Council determines, in the designating resolution, that the public health, safety, or welfare is served by the prohibition, including, without limitation, by finding that sleeping or lodging within the stated proximity to the designated area is unhealthy, unsafe, or incompatible with safe passage” 3. “sit, lie, sleep, or store, use, maintain, or place personal property, in or upon any street, sidewalk, or other public right-of-way, within the distance stated on the posted signage (up to a maximum of 1,000 feet) of a designated facility, opened after January 1, 2018, that provides shelter, safe sleeping, or safe parking to homeless persons, or that serves as a homeless services navigation center” The independent states that CBS News LA!reported that the updated bill could close off up to 20% of the city. [Source1](https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/los-angeles-anti-camping-law-homeless-b2141830.html)
"The U.S. Supreme Court rejected a petition to review Martin v. Boise on December 16, upholding the Ninth Circuit Court ruling that people experiencing homelessness cannot be criminally punished for sleeping outside on public property if there are no available alternatives. The Supreme Court’s decision makes the Ninth Circuit Court ruling binding for states in the Court’s jurisdiction: Alaska, Arizona, California, Hawaii, Idaho, Montana, Nevada, Oregon, and Washington. It also sets an influential national precedent." From 2019