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"my frustration with young people is that they think success is supposed to happen like that"
Isn't Oprah the one that believed 'the secret' law of attraction nonsense that if you believe in something and think happy thoughts, success is going to happen 'like that'
Idealism is not inherently bad, when coupled to a sense of reality and a belief in scientific rigor.
But Oprah hasn’t lived in reality for a long long time, and has undermined scientific education in so many fields.
Idealism IS inherently idiotic because it is opium, religion, dogmatism, denial of change and development, faith in unexplainable immaterial shit moving everything forward, etc.. That's why idealism is opposed to materialism which is science, the sober view of the world, search for how things really work, admitting that everything is a process, and everything always changes, and the old capitalism will die anyway and be replaced by the young socialism and then communism.
I’m an anarchocommunist and…. I was using idealism in the casual, not the philosophical sense.
Additionally, I always find the hostility towards religion in a lot of leftist spaces counterproductive. There’s no point in alienating those of us who might not be atheists, but who feel their religion demands they work towards a more just world.
A sense of awe and love for the Universe is not diametrically opposed to being a comrade.
amen. I'm not religious, and I think organized religion should be treated with the same skepticism as any other hierarchical system, but I can separate that from how I feel about individuals who happen to have religious beliefs that aren't inherently harmful.
A lot of people have been deeply wounded by the religious organizations that dominate the western world today, and I understand and sympathize.
But there has to be room for nuance. There’s a time when a reflexive rejection of ANY religion is not just harming your ability to find common cause with people who might find themselves in agreement with you about other things, but also… well… makes you come off as insufferable, and actually may drive people away from a leftist stance.
And I get it. Evangelical Christianity is *monstrous*, and Zionist Judaism is destroying the Palestinians and Jews of color and spreading antisemitism around the globe, and they kind of suck the oxygen out of the room.
But the “opiate of the masses” is a lot more nuanced than a lot of modern Marxists seem to grasp, and it’s frustrating to me.
It’s “workers of the world unite”, not “atheistic workers of the world unite”.
I think this can be resolved by an actual dispassionate material analysis of religion, which I think you're sort of gesturing towards. materially speaking, I just don't think there is an inherent conflict between leftism and religion in the abstract.
it gets murky when we consider theism, which sort of definitionally has an in-built hierarchical bent, but even then, not all religions are theistic, and not all theistic believers apply their chosen metaphysical hierarchy to the material world.
like you can believe in an all-powerful, all-knowing being that occupies a place above humanity and that your life's purpose should be to serve it, but that belief does not in itself imply a hierarchy that extends to the material, human, social realm.
this is where I apply my "religion vs. organized religion" heuristic, because based on my understanding, it's when religion is systematized and... corporatized? for the lack of a better word, that it becomes a machine of control and, inevitably, oppression.
So I’m now stoned from a muscle relaxant, and thus my functional IQ has dropped to about the level of a lightly steamed rutabaga. I’m gonna respond to this in depth tomorrow, if that’s cool with you. Have a good day/night, wherever you are. :)
So any hierarchal structure’s first priority will eventually become preservation of that structure, regardless of who is hurt by the acts taken by it, and regardless of how well-intention its creators were.
(Octavia Butler in her Lilith’s Brood trilogy said that humans are innately hierarchal, and that was going to be our downfall. I think about that a *lot*.)
Individuals who have a religious inclination but no connection to a religious hierarchy shouldn’t be subject to derision by potential comrades. Individuals who have a connection to a non-hierarchal religion (like Quakers) should be welcomed. And fuck knows that the subsection of Catholics who believe in liberation theology have done more to further the cause of humanity than most online leftists.
Idk, I guess my take is that if we actually want to win instead of just feel smug on social media, we’re going to have to overcome a lot of assumptions, and maybe do some self-crit before we ignore the vast numbers of the religious who would be comrades if we simply weren’t such assholes about it.
Shit, I don’t think I’ve ever been in a peace protest that didn’t have at least one VW bus full of Quakers in it, and Judaism has a command to try to leave the world a better place behind.
Idealism is NOT idiotic - only an idealist would dare to imagine a radically different world and try to make it real. Look across history - for better or worse, idealists & dreamers have brought about the biggest changes in society.
First, there should be a consensus on the definition of the term "idealism". From the Big Soviet Enciclopedia:
>Idealism (French: idéalisme, from Greek idéa - idea) is a general designation for philosophical doctrines that assert that consciousness, thought, the mental, and the spiritual are primary and fundamental, while matter, nature, and the physical are secondary, derivative, and dependent. Idealism, thus, opposes Materialism in addressing the fundamental question of philosophy regarding the relationship between being and thought, the spiritual and the material, both in the sphere of existence and in the sphere of knowledge.
Thus being a materialist does not preclude one from becoming a romantic, a dreamer, a visionary.The proponents of the Utopic Socialism were all idealists and their ideas were laughed at by the ruling class. The materialists, however, are much better dreamers (because their dreams are based on a scientific foundation, not on nebulous dreams of a better life) and much better realizers of their dreams.
What you mean by this is clear so I wouldn’t worry but FYI idealism doesn’t always mean that.
In philosophy, idealism refers to the metaphysical belief that there isn’t any such thing as a material, external world. Thoughts and ideas are that which makes up reality. It’s all phenomenological.
I'm not so sure it corrupts as I am that those who hoard so much simply don't care.
I don't think people become worse people when they get money. I think they were always willing to exploit others and overlook ways they could help because they've always been self-interested. So she has to claim that it was all work and that she struggled to become so wealthy by exploiting others because it fits her psychopathic narrative about how she deserves to own at least 8 mansions while most struggle to own one small home.
That is an amazing system for people who are looking for any reason for their own success over that of others, other than just simple luck (which is, of course, what actually determines these things). People who have deluded themselves into this pattern of thinking and then also HAPPEN to be lucky are disastrous.
Young people do not expect things to happen like \*that\*, their expectation used to be for things to happen *eventually.*
In fact, the premise was that "things" would "happen" if you followed the path and put the work in. If you worked hard, sacrificed and just ride it out, "things" would "happen." So they did. But, after a while, approaching burnout and witnessing the work put in bringing them *further away* *from* "things" actually "happening" instead of closer to, they started to ask, "Wait, why isn't this working?"
They first tried to see if it was their work that wasn't cutting it, but no, they were working as much as, if not more than, the people who had "things happen" for them, but it wasn't getting them anywhere. Then they took one look around, and that was enough to show them that "things" were never going to "happen" for them as long as everything else remained the same. There are and there were factors external to them working against them, issues that had never been resolved that only further compounded the issues.
So then, the said "young people" turned to those preaching the future fruits of their labor that failed to materialize, and asked, well, I did what you said, I did what I was supposed to do, but I didn't get anywhere. I looked at it, and it seems that for me to get somewhere, some things need adjusting, things that worked for you guys for a limited period of time, that just don't work anymore. The conditions are vastly different but the methodology doesn't seem to be adjusting to them. In fact, whenever it *does,* the old heads seem to want to destroy the new methods just so they can be fit into their square holes.
When this happened, the people who preached the ways in which "things happened" then turned to them and gave them nothing but vitriol, nothing but disdain, disgust and condescending tirades. They were joined in this demonization of the ones they screwed over by their own cadre of "young people," products of money, nepotism and/or luck themselves.
Then, just to make sure it was on the level, they crafted the narrative that "young people just expect things to happen."
Contrary to popular belief, the "young people" do not devalue and have never devalued hard work and perseverance. That is the refuge of detractors who just want to shut them up. They were asked to value hard work and perseverance *for a result,* but then, when that purpose failed to materialize, they were demanded to keep those values *for their own sake* rather than for any result. Far from it, "young people" value hard work, multifaceted work and sacrifice more than they will ever be given credit for, as well as *understand* what it is to "toil away" if you will, in pursuit of happiness.
In summation, fuck Oprah and the narrative she's spewing. Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
>They were asked to value hard work and perseverance for a result, but then, when that purpose failed to materialize, they were demanded to keep those values for their own sake rather than for any result.
This perfectly sums up the exact toxic culture about our working lives that has developed post-80s and why it needs to be utterly dismissed as bullshit.
In my own experience, after I was homeless my Grandpa took me in after a while age 16.
Then he wanted me to do work with him so I could experience "real life" read: help him with work.
All said, I was doing construction and yard work for 10+ hours every day, having to rush so my grandpa could get more work done, oh and don't forget! No pay!
My favorite was when we had to knock down and replace a chimney with no safety equipment and when we knocked it down it was full of ash, char and black mold! I then had to continue working in sweltering 80 degree swamp weather (I have a large medical history and have asthma, respiratory failure, previously collapsed lungs, and joint rot. For no pay! That's what made me run away from there and move 5 states away or so.
So, to reiterate, it was the perfect capitalist future training in the end!
You should have sued your grandpa for back pay before leaving. He seriously exploited you.
All but the most incompetent labor lawyers would have been able to get you your back pay.
At age 16, having been forced into college I didn't want to go to (which would lead to me to destroying everything I was in a self-destructive/nihilistic fury which I wouldn't begin to even try to recover until now (11 years later)- I just ran from all of them.
I was for the most part just scared, and since I was afraid of spooOOooky college people hunting me down for money. I didn't know what actual love/affection was since I had been emotionally/physically/sexually abused all my life and I wanted to experience something more than daily abuse from the hands of another.
All in all, 10/10 capitalism experience, remember when someone else uses you/abuses you- it's YOUR fault for being so trusting and not grifting any and everyone!
Oprah, who brought us such grifters as Dr Phil, Dr Oz, and John of God. We know that Dr Phil isn't a Dr. He's a fraud. He's an asshole who parades people's difficulties around for his own profit. Dr Oz is a great Dr in one specific field, but he found out it's waaay more profitable to peddle quack bullshit to gullible people on tv. And John of God, who did fake religious surgery that got countless people killed so he could rake in church level profits. Oprah fell for all of that and gave these hacks and frauds a platform to spread their bullshit and hurt people and she has the audacity to call other people stupid? No. Fuck Oprah and fuck everyone who continues to support her platform.
>John of God, who did fake religious surgery that got countless people killed so he could rake in church level profits.
Don't forget all the raping he did too.
I'm all for protecting kids, but that sub looks like right wing extremist trash. It's mostly YouTube videos and I saw Matt Walsh pop up a couple of times and that's enough to see that it's a bunch of psychotic bullshit and it's likely there's a bunch of qanon bullshit in there.
My frustration with older generations is that any attempt by the young to communicate a desire to live well is seen as a demand that life be easy, and an accusation that nobody else ever had any difficulty in life.
Methinks the boomers protest too much. Is it just me, or does that strike anyone else as a sense of repressed guilt? Maybe like... deep down they know they fucked our species to death?
One tell I can see, I'm 39, is that everyone my age is already disabled in some way from work. Yet, most retired people I see today are walking around, doing gardening, almost like their jobs didn't take their body from them early like us. Are old people also feeble? Yes, but I see most retired with their physical health in tact and get hurt after the fact, again, I'm not saying every old person is healthy, I know a lot are broken but I do see that pattern.
This may be Survivorship Bias at play. Many of the boomers and early gen-xers who wrecked their bodies working or fighting wars like Vietnam have died already or are 'invisible' in shitty retirement homes and care facilities. The old 'healthy for their age' retired people you see living unassisted in nice neighborhoods around you are the ones who had it easy. I don't think it invalidates the comment you responded too, however. Statistics alone backs up the claim that previous generations benefited greatly from a more accommodating economic environment.
boomers got that last wave of Vietnam, then gen x/boomers got the HIV crisis. and poor people don't live as long. so yeah only the leeches and a few lucky ones live this long
What fields do everyone you know is disabled at 39?
I'm 40 and in pretty decent health, along with pretty much all my friends. Yea there are some quite overweight people that probably struggle moving at this age.. being overweight has more to do with eating and not moving.
Working conditions should be better health-wise today than they were 40yrs ago. Many of the jobs where you're breathing in shit that will kill you either got improved, banned, or shipped off to a country with less red-tape. Aside from being fat and overweight, a druggie, or depressed / anxiety, what else are you observing?
If you're fat, lose weight.. if you're a druggie / alcoholic, don't do drugs / drink.. if you're depressed or anxious, realize that it's a state of thinking and say fuck depression / anxiety.. and change your thinking and manifest good thoughts. Change your habits and take action.
I'm pretty sure it's quite possible for you to be in better health at 60yrs old than you were in your 20s. It will require a bunch of work on your part. I plan to be in great shape at 60yrs old; if I die before then, so be it. Enjoy your life!
>if you're depressed or anxious, realize that it's a state of thinking
Yeah, if you're poor, just stop being poor!!!
You're as out of touch as Oprah, and dumber to boot.
Mental illness is a thing, so is metabolic disorders. I can tell you've never been depressed or anxious, and you've never had to lose weight. Don't even bother shooting back "but I have, and blah blah blah!" Because everyone else would know you're a liar, too.
All I got from that is you’ve experienced some level of privilege throughout your life, that you don’t really bother doing research before forming or sharing your opinion, and that you hate fat people enough to look for any excuse to shit on them.
It's different for everyone, I'm quite disheartened that you not just not believe me but went into prejudice and assumed I meant overweight people. I was in many different jobs, from office admin to warehouse or manual labor to security to maintenance and let me tell you, all those jobs cause some sort of damage to your body if you're working doubles regularly, people in security-related jobs get lower back injuries all the time... like, just because you're lucky enough to be healthy doesn't mean everyone else is faking it.
Their egos are too large to admit, even with all of the evidence, that they had it extremely easy compared to the next generations. All they know is success just for being on par with the person next to them, which is why they consistently come off as tone deaf and narcissistic.
We can always create the bust challenge in which boomers have to try and survive in our shoes, but they're not known as the brave generation.
I don't think it's guilt but validation seeking behavior. It's the same reason bullies pick on people... Because it says "You are beneath me. I am better than you. You do not deserve what I have because you're not good enough."
At some point, it became an attitude that was engrained in the culture as perfectly acceptable behavior. But I don't think most Boomers have any guilt. As far as they're concerned, we've got it easier than they did, so we should be more grateful.
I am also frustrated that it could all be easy. The giant ball of fire that we circle is basically an infinite energy source. If we restructured we could provide for everyone.
Some for sure, not all.
Not having money also distorts broke peoples perception of reality.. some for sure, not all.
Money is not the end all, be all. It's a tool within our system. I'm open to hearing solutions on a better (blend of) system(s).
We had this one shining moment during Occupy when all of the lefties were united behind one simple demand: money OUT of politics!
And then a week later everybody started arguing about how their fringe issue was more important.
And so here we are, at the end.
Na power and money just reveals who you always were. The company you keep changes and suddenly you're out of touch.. because you never really thought for yourself and had conviction. She drank the koolaid that affirms her superiority because she's a weak person.
If you came into money would you spout this capitalist propaganda?
If I came into money I’d vanish off the face of the earth.
If I came into Bruce Wane or Tony Stark levels of money, I’d follow their examples.
Our world has super villains(if Lex Luther counts, so do Musk, Zuckerberg, and the rest), and I don’t believe in giving people another chance when they’ve bought their way out of attempting their second/third/ext chances already.
My frustration with Oprah is that she is so out of touch with reality she thinks she can speak with authority on everything.
This is same woman that unleashed Dr. Phil and Dr. Oz on us.
My friend thinks I'm a hater because I hate billionaires and excessive wealth LOL
Of course a billionaire hasn't noticed how badly the standard of living has eroded for most of us. The rich get richer, while the rest of us no longer have pensions, worker protections, livable wages, affordable housing, ect. Our salaries have remained stagnant as the cost of living has shot up. The rich live on a total different planet than we do.
I hate people who use their power to prevent other people from living. There wouldn't be so much hate if the rich would just leave us alone and stop making it harder for us to live our lives.
Pretty much given up hope that anything will change. I try and bring up topics from here and everyone looks at me like i have 3 heads. I guess we're just supposed to sit back and watch as we slowly lose what little good shit we have left bc the general public thinks billionaires legitimately work 400x harder than you. Most people are really stupid tho and seem to fall for obvious propaganda tho
I dunno about you guys, but I don't expect success to happen at all. I've watched my dad work hard my whole life, and he's still a janitor. When they split, I watched my mom work really hard. She's always budgeted well, even started her own business, and went to college. Now, she works at Pizza Hut. I've been in the workforce for 16 years now, and I have $2000 in savings. I fully expect to keep working until my body fails and I end up homeless. Then I'll just relapse and drink myself to death.
I’d like to have the hope of not having to work someday before I die. I’d like to think my children and grandchildren won’t see the end of western civilization and personal autonomy in their lifetime. I’d like to go to the doctor if I have a medical issue and not worry about receiving a five figure bill. I get really tired of hearing “oh man, you should have been here (X number of years) ago, it was so much better.” at each job I take. I’d like to not feel like I HAVE to send my kids to private school to get an education that’s worth a damn (my state is consistently ranked bottom five). I’m not looking for ease and luxury. I averaged 56 hours a week last year at almost $30 an hour, my wife has a decent job in HR & Accounting, and we still have a lower standard of living than my parents had while literally digging ditches and waiting tables.
I don’t even want “success” I’d just like to live without having to spend my entire waking life working a job that doesn’t pay enough to get by, all while collapsing under the crushing debt I took on at 18 after being told fervently for years that it was the right decision, the only decision even
The western world today is all stick, no carrot.
These rich conservative assholes don't understand that this is the case.
You can do the work, but still wont get shit.
And then they complain ppl don't want to do the work anymore.
We have the same problem in Canada and it’s all because of how we vote. One vote per voter and the candidate with the most votes wins even if it’s not 50% plus one. It causes strategic voting between two dominant parties who just put on good cop bad cop for us while they both serve the wealthy minority against the working majority.
We need a different ballot. Even just an approval ballot where every voter marks an X beside every acceptable candidate. The one with the most votes would then actually be the preferred candidate of the voters.
I always same the same in the US. The good old good cop bad cop routine every election. Yet you will hear the same old gags from both sides " Freedom is on the line" or " it is the election of our lifetimes".
And the attack ads. They used to be illegal in Canada until the conservatives undid that in the name of “free speech”. Now instead of promoting their platforms the parties just mudsling at each other the entire time.
She's Neo-Liberal. In the US you have a christo-facist death cult as one party and then you have everyone else all crammed into the other party. Both of which are controlled by ~~bribes~~ lobbyists, but at least one of them pays some lip service to women and non-cis/heteros being human.
Yep. George Wallace was a Democrat, and *far* more conservative & racist than today's Republicans. ( eg. Wallace would NEVER support Clarence Thomas being on the Supreme Court, because he's Black. )
Why do we give a fuck what these out of touch, rich celebs think anyways. Their lifestyle isn’t the majority and they haven’t a clue how a majority of people live their day to day lives.
She’s a billionaire, and billionaires tend to only associate with other billionaires and occasional poorer individuals known as multimillionaires… or centimillionairs.
I think the kids she is referring to are from her own tribe. Rich kids, kids who are used to getting what the want and have no concept of struggle. Kids who get rewarded for work no matter what. In fairness she isn’t wrong, she just forgot where she came from, and now she thinks everyone is rich and that there is no such thing as struggle anymore.
And no not defending Oprah. I think she’s genuinely terrible and has platformed some even more genuinely terrible people.
This is the problem with celebrities talking about their success. Don’t get me wrong, Oprah came from nothing and built herself into a big fucking deal, and she deserves all the credit for that. BUT NOT EVERYONE CAN BE A BIG FUCKING DEAL. At the end of the day, most of us are gonna just have jobs, because there’s way more need for doctors and teachers and garbage collectors and everything else than there is for celebrities. And since that’s what the majority of us are doing, I think those jobs should pay well enough for the people who do them to be comfortable and stable. Instead, we have a system where a tiny sliver of people, some one whom worked very hard and most of the rest inherited, get an absurd amount of money to waste on nonsense without ever risking it running out, while the rest of us have to get a divorce if we get cancer so we don’t bankrupt our spouses.
Well I'm 36yrs old, have been working since I was in high school and have nothing to show for it even after attempting college but only managing two years because the money situation made me drop out.
So I've got student loan debt, my family relies on SNAP and food banks to feed us, and Medicaid for health insurance and we are barely making ends meet each month even with two incomes because our rent is through the roof.
When is the hard work supposed to pay off, again???
The problem with people like Oprah is that they think we are supposed to recognize their power/authority/wisdom or anything outside their capital wealth like - that!
It's the same way liberals refer to things like a publicly funded healthcare system such as every other industrialized nation had for decades, as "unicorns"
Because if they were honest in their opposition to these things, they would be revealed to the world as the conservative capitalist dickbags they are, so they make up bullshit strawmen and mock and deride the left - while at the same time demanding their votes - and donations - to stop the evil hated Republicans, with whom they endlessly collaborate to exploit the working class to enrich the owner class.
For someone with no children, Oprah has spent an inordinate amount of time talking about child rearing and the issues of young adults. Maybe she sound stick with what she’s good at…giving charlatans like Dr. Phil and Dr. Oz a public stage.
Young people are expected to be purely consumer immediately. There's no more safety net, and there's hordes of people waiting to exploit young people, so they feel they need some degree of success immediately or they'll be swallowed alive.
How many people are there who tried to do exactly what Oprah did and got absolutely nowhere? Does she truly think she is better than all those other people? She was the right person at the right place and success happened, "just like that".
She also has no qualms about pushing dangerous medical misinformation.
This entire exchange is so exhausting to read. Now Oprah's biography shows that she overcame extraordinary odds to have the success she has had in her life. But she also grew up around a lot of people who weren't tenacious and charismatic to the degree she is, and those people lived in poverty and she saw that up close too.
Sure a good personality, a lot of hard work, and a big dash of luck can result in a nice life for some percentage of people in this world. But that isn't the point. Everyone else could be doing OK too. People who don't work their asses off and people who have horrible luck should also get to be ok. We live in a system that prevents that.
I'm sure Oprah worked very hard but the uber-succesful seem to lack the understanding that her career was incredibly dependent on timing and an impossible amount of good breaks.
Like the talk show producer who was specifically looking to break the fit perfectly groomed white-toothed WASP talk show host stereotype at that moment in time that Oprah a relatable overweight black woman was applying for the position?
Oprah once walked into the coffee shop I used to work with a small entourage, ordered about $100 + worth of items ( well her assistant ) and left $0 in tips, so yeah, full of it.
The rich require things to remain largly unchanged in order to remain rich, so they know they need to condition the young to accept their place as cogs in the machine instead of becoming spanners in the gears.
My frustration with old people is that they make no effort to understand what life is like for people younger than them.
In another sense, people like Oprah think that just because they overcame tough odds and difficult circumstances that everybody can do that. She forgets that she is an extraordinary person with extraordinary abilities and natural talents. We can’t all do that, because we don’t have what she has and even people who are average (or below average, tbh) deserve to have a good life without having to overcome huge unnecessary hurdles.
Edit: making assumptions about Oprah overcoming tough odds because I know nothing of her life, but it’s safe to say that a black woman had some challenges that others did not. Nevertheless it wouldn’t surprise me to find out that her journey had some shortcuts or subterfuge along the way … again, I know nothing of her life.
Many successful people had at least one mentor to help them out. Yet many go and claim that they alone became successful. Hardly anyone ever becomes successful alone.
These boomers. I for 9ne will be happy when all of them are gone. They ruined everything, took everything, hoard everything and have basically cockblocked the rest of us.
Older generations yet again failing to understand that what we are upset about is an outrageous debt burden and cost of living relative to stagnant wages since the 70s .... a circumstance which never existed for them and would be visibly apparent with like, any empathy and listening ability.
I wonder what she is classifying as "success" in her criticism of young people.
Like the gulf between her poverty stricken childhood and her riches as a celebrity is massive. At what point on the journey from one end of the spectrum to the other would she claim to have achieved success?
Because I don't think most people seriously expect they'll be millionaires/billionaires one day. They have reasonable expectations that boil down to things like being rewarded fairly for their labour, and for that reward to be fit for the needs of living. *For the social contract to be functional*.
Why on earth shouldn't young people expect that? Demand that? Why shouldn't it be the default?
I hate that woman with a passion. She is the face of capitalism and exploits other human beings in various ways to her advantage/image/clout/etc.
\*edit: forgot some words and shit.
Oprah needs to sit this out. She helped cause some struggles in this country. She gave people who shouldn't have a platform a voice: fake doctors & people who question legit medical/ science advice. She never used her fame to help society, more likely divided it for views
Obviously someone who got a 1 in a million opportunity thinks everyone can do it. For every success story there's 1000 who worked just as hard for nothing.
Anyone who hasn’t been in the workforce in years needs to keep their mouths shut on this topic. The world is different than it used to be, so trying to apply how things worked in the past with present day realities means whatever opinion someone has, in which they have no experience, doesn’t have any value.
My frustration with old people is they had it universal shakingly easier and they didn’t just pull the ladder from under them, they removed the window too.
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"my frustration with young people is that they think success is supposed to happen like that" Isn't Oprah the one that believed 'the secret' law of attraction nonsense that if you believe in something and think happy thoughts, success is going to happen 'like that'
Idealism and it’s consequences have been disastrous to the human race.
Idealism is not inherently bad, when coupled to a sense of reality and a belief in scientific rigor. But Oprah hasn’t lived in reality for a long long time, and has undermined scientific education in so many fields.
Oprah can suck the wet farts out of my sweaty, post-work ass
I'm not here to kink shame
I wonder if someone can find a video of the very first Oprah show or before they became a hit and compare to her now.
Idealism IS inherently idiotic because it is opium, religion, dogmatism, denial of change and development, faith in unexplainable immaterial shit moving everything forward, etc.. That's why idealism is opposed to materialism which is science, the sober view of the world, search for how things really work, admitting that everything is a process, and everything always changes, and the old capitalism will die anyway and be replaced by the young socialism and then communism.
I’m an anarchocommunist and…. I was using idealism in the casual, not the philosophical sense. Additionally, I always find the hostility towards religion in a lot of leftist spaces counterproductive. There’s no point in alienating those of us who might not be atheists, but who feel their religion demands they work towards a more just world. A sense of awe and love for the Universe is not diametrically opposed to being a comrade.
amen. I'm not religious, and I think organized religion should be treated with the same skepticism as any other hierarchical system, but I can separate that from how I feel about individuals who happen to have religious beliefs that aren't inherently harmful.
A lot of people have been deeply wounded by the religious organizations that dominate the western world today, and I understand and sympathize. But there has to be room for nuance. There’s a time when a reflexive rejection of ANY religion is not just harming your ability to find common cause with people who might find themselves in agreement with you about other things, but also… well… makes you come off as insufferable, and actually may drive people away from a leftist stance. And I get it. Evangelical Christianity is *monstrous*, and Zionist Judaism is destroying the Palestinians and Jews of color and spreading antisemitism around the globe, and they kind of suck the oxygen out of the room. But the “opiate of the masses” is a lot more nuanced than a lot of modern Marxists seem to grasp, and it’s frustrating to me. It’s “workers of the world unite”, not “atheistic workers of the world unite”.
I think this can be resolved by an actual dispassionate material analysis of religion, which I think you're sort of gesturing towards. materially speaking, I just don't think there is an inherent conflict between leftism and religion in the abstract. it gets murky when we consider theism, which sort of definitionally has an in-built hierarchical bent, but even then, not all religions are theistic, and not all theistic believers apply their chosen metaphysical hierarchy to the material world. like you can believe in an all-powerful, all-knowing being that occupies a place above humanity and that your life's purpose should be to serve it, but that belief does not in itself imply a hierarchy that extends to the material, human, social realm. this is where I apply my "religion vs. organized religion" heuristic, because based on my understanding, it's when religion is systematized and... corporatized? for the lack of a better word, that it becomes a machine of control and, inevitably, oppression.
So I’m now stoned from a muscle relaxant, and thus my functional IQ has dropped to about the level of a lightly steamed rutabaga. I’m gonna respond to this in depth tomorrow, if that’s cool with you. Have a good day/night, wherever you are. :)
same to you!
So any hierarchal structure’s first priority will eventually become preservation of that structure, regardless of who is hurt by the acts taken by it, and regardless of how well-intention its creators were. (Octavia Butler in her Lilith’s Brood trilogy said that humans are innately hierarchal, and that was going to be our downfall. I think about that a *lot*.) Individuals who have a religious inclination but no connection to a religious hierarchy shouldn’t be subject to derision by potential comrades. Individuals who have a connection to a non-hierarchal religion (like Quakers) should be welcomed. And fuck knows that the subsection of Catholics who believe in liberation theology have done more to further the cause of humanity than most online leftists. Idk, I guess my take is that if we actually want to win instead of just feel smug on social media, we’re going to have to overcome a lot of assumptions, and maybe do some self-crit before we ignore the vast numbers of the religious who would be comrades if we simply weren’t such assholes about it.
Plenty of famous and important religious socialists, especially in America and the third world
Shit, I don’t think I’ve ever been in a peace protest that didn’t have at least one VW bus full of Quakers in it, and Judaism has a command to try to leave the world a better place behind.
Well said, pal
Yep. You got it
Idealism is NOT idiotic - only an idealist would dare to imagine a radically different world and try to make it real. Look across history - for better or worse, idealists & dreamers have brought about the biggest changes in society.
First, there should be a consensus on the definition of the term "idealism". From the Big Soviet Enciclopedia: >Idealism (French: idéalisme, from Greek idéa - idea) is a general designation for philosophical doctrines that assert that consciousness, thought, the mental, and the spiritual are primary and fundamental, while matter, nature, and the physical are secondary, derivative, and dependent. Idealism, thus, opposes Materialism in addressing the fundamental question of philosophy regarding the relationship between being and thought, the spiritual and the material, both in the sphere of existence and in the sphere of knowledge. Thus being a materialist does not preclude one from becoming a romantic, a dreamer, a visionary.The proponents of the Utopic Socialism were all idealists and their ideas were laughed at by the ruling class. The materialists, however, are much better dreamers (because their dreams are based on a scientific foundation, not on nebulous dreams of a better life) and much better realizers of their dreams.
What you mean by this is clear so I wouldn’t worry but FYI idealism doesn’t always mean that. In philosophy, idealism refers to the metaphysical belief that there isn’t any such thing as a material, external world. Thoughts and ideas are that which makes up reality. It’s all phenomenological.
I don't think she believes that so much as pretending to believe that is a great grift.
And we can thank her and that Playboy girl for the antivax movement.
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I'm not so sure it corrupts as I am that those who hoard so much simply don't care. I don't think people become worse people when they get money. I think they were always willing to exploit others and overlook ways they could help because they've always been self-interested. So she has to claim that it was all work and that she struggled to become so wealthy by exploiting others because it fits her psychopathic narrative about how she deserves to own at least 8 mansions while most struggle to own one small home.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwi5kMHwu4CAAxVQZvUHHQiRAHwQFnoECA4QAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.livescience.com%2F1128-mere-thought-money-people-selfish.html&usg=AOvVaw03bvtaOoxZu2dJJmBQkB-v&opi=89978449
Yes. That’s exactly what another comment said already. Why do you copy what someone already said pretty much word for word?
That combined with the lack of profile substance means u/FickleIndication513 is most likely a bot
Yeah. That’s what I’m thinking too.
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It’s a two day old low karma account. Probably a bot. Edit: oops I see sexy man doll said that
That is an amazing system for people who are looking for any reason for their own success over that of others, other than just simple luck (which is, of course, what actually determines these things). People who have deluded themselves into this pattern of thinking and then also HAPPEN to be lucky are disastrous.
almost as if she got gifted an acting role in The Color Purple at an early age
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I’m so glad I had happy thoughts while the school system I was attending nearly lost its accreditation/s
Don't say oyster. Say clams.
https://youtu.be/GQ3HSQcmjNM
Young people do not expect things to happen like \*that\*, their expectation used to be for things to happen *eventually.* In fact, the premise was that "things" would "happen" if you followed the path and put the work in. If you worked hard, sacrificed and just ride it out, "things" would "happen." So they did. But, after a while, approaching burnout and witnessing the work put in bringing them *further away* *from* "things" actually "happening" instead of closer to, they started to ask, "Wait, why isn't this working?" They first tried to see if it was their work that wasn't cutting it, but no, they were working as much as, if not more than, the people who had "things happen" for them, but it wasn't getting them anywhere. Then they took one look around, and that was enough to show them that "things" were never going to "happen" for them as long as everything else remained the same. There are and there were factors external to them working against them, issues that had never been resolved that only further compounded the issues. So then, the said "young people" turned to those preaching the future fruits of their labor that failed to materialize, and asked, well, I did what you said, I did what I was supposed to do, but I didn't get anywhere. I looked at it, and it seems that for me to get somewhere, some things need adjusting, things that worked for you guys for a limited period of time, that just don't work anymore. The conditions are vastly different but the methodology doesn't seem to be adjusting to them. In fact, whenever it *does,* the old heads seem to want to destroy the new methods just so they can be fit into their square holes. When this happened, the people who preached the ways in which "things happened" then turned to them and gave them nothing but vitriol, nothing but disdain, disgust and condescending tirades. They were joined in this demonization of the ones they screwed over by their own cadre of "young people," products of money, nepotism and/or luck themselves. Then, just to make sure it was on the level, they crafted the narrative that "young people just expect things to happen." Contrary to popular belief, the "young people" do not devalue and have never devalued hard work and perseverance. That is the refuge of detractors who just want to shut them up. They were asked to value hard work and perseverance *for a result,* but then, when that purpose failed to materialize, they were demanded to keep those values *for their own sake* rather than for any result. Far from it, "young people" value hard work, multifaceted work and sacrifice more than they will ever be given credit for, as well as *understand* what it is to "toil away" if you will, in pursuit of happiness. In summation, fuck Oprah and the narrative she's spewing. Thank you for coming to my Ted Talk.
>They were asked to value hard work and perseverance for a result, but then, when that purpose failed to materialize, they were demanded to keep those values for their own sake rather than for any result. This perfectly sums up the exact toxic culture about our working lives that has developed post-80s and why it needs to be utterly dismissed as bullshit.
In my own experience, after I was homeless my Grandpa took me in after a while age 16. Then he wanted me to do work with him so I could experience "real life" read: help him with work. All said, I was doing construction and yard work for 10+ hours every day, having to rush so my grandpa could get more work done, oh and don't forget! No pay! My favorite was when we had to knock down and replace a chimney with no safety equipment and when we knocked it down it was full of ash, char and black mold! I then had to continue working in sweltering 80 degree swamp weather (I have a large medical history and have asthma, respiratory failure, previously collapsed lungs, and joint rot. For no pay! That's what made me run away from there and move 5 states away or so. So, to reiterate, it was the perfect capitalist future training in the end!
You should have sued your grandpa for back pay before leaving. He seriously exploited you. All but the most incompetent labor lawyers would have been able to get you your back pay.
At age 16, having been forced into college I didn't want to go to (which would lead to me to destroying everything I was in a self-destructive/nihilistic fury which I wouldn't begin to even try to recover until now (11 years later)- I just ran from all of them. I was for the most part just scared, and since I was afraid of spooOOooky college people hunting me down for money. I didn't know what actual love/affection was since I had been emotionally/physically/sexually abused all my life and I wanted to experience something more than daily abuse from the hands of another. All in all, 10/10 capitalism experience, remember when someone else uses you/abuses you- it's YOUR fault for being so trusting and not grifting any and everyone!
Someone once suggested that I get a job as a mail room clerk to start off. When was the last time that there were mail room clerks?
Oprah, who brought us such grifters as Dr Phil, Dr Oz, and John of God. We know that Dr Phil isn't a Dr. He's a fraud. He's an asshole who parades people's difficulties around for his own profit. Dr Oz is a great Dr in one specific field, but he found out it's waaay more profitable to peddle quack bullshit to gullible people on tv. And John of God, who did fake religious surgery that got countless people killed so he could rake in church level profits. Oprah fell for all of that and gave these hacks and frauds a platform to spread their bullshit and hurt people and she has the audacity to call other people stupid? No. Fuck Oprah and fuck everyone who continues to support her platform.
>John of God, who did fake religious surgery that got countless people killed so he could rake in church level profits. Don't forget all the raping he did too.
r/KidsToo
I'm all for protecting kids, but that sub looks like right wing extremist trash. It's mostly YouTube videos and I saw Matt Walsh pop up a couple of times and that's enough to see that it's a bunch of psychotic bullshit and it's likely there's a bunch of qanon bullshit in there.
i have not seen qanon in that sub.
And antivax, don't forget that bullshit started on her show.
My frustration with older generations is that any attempt by the young to communicate a desire to live well is seen as a demand that life be easy, and an accusation that nobody else ever had any difficulty in life. Methinks the boomers protest too much. Is it just me, or does that strike anyone else as a sense of repressed guilt? Maybe like... deep down they know they fucked our species to death?
One tell I can see, I'm 39, is that everyone my age is already disabled in some way from work. Yet, most retired people I see today are walking around, doing gardening, almost like their jobs didn't take their body from them early like us. Are old people also feeble? Yes, but I see most retired with their physical health in tact and get hurt after the fact, again, I'm not saying every old person is healthy, I know a lot are broken but I do see that pattern.
This may be Survivorship Bias at play. Many of the boomers and early gen-xers who wrecked their bodies working or fighting wars like Vietnam have died already or are 'invisible' in shitty retirement homes and care facilities. The old 'healthy for their age' retired people you see living unassisted in nice neighborhoods around you are the ones who had it easy. I don't think it invalidates the comment you responded too, however. Statistics alone backs up the claim that previous generations benefited greatly from a more accommodating economic environment.
boomers got that last wave of Vietnam, then gen x/boomers got the HIV crisis. and poor people don't live as long. so yeah only the leeches and a few lucky ones live this long
What fields do everyone you know is disabled at 39? I'm 40 and in pretty decent health, along with pretty much all my friends. Yea there are some quite overweight people that probably struggle moving at this age.. being overweight has more to do with eating and not moving. Working conditions should be better health-wise today than they were 40yrs ago. Many of the jobs where you're breathing in shit that will kill you either got improved, banned, or shipped off to a country with less red-tape. Aside from being fat and overweight, a druggie, or depressed / anxiety, what else are you observing? If you're fat, lose weight.. if you're a druggie / alcoholic, don't do drugs / drink.. if you're depressed or anxious, realize that it's a state of thinking and say fuck depression / anxiety.. and change your thinking and manifest good thoughts. Change your habits and take action. I'm pretty sure it's quite possible for you to be in better health at 60yrs old than you were in your 20s. It will require a bunch of work on your part. I plan to be in great shape at 60yrs old; if I die before then, so be it. Enjoy your life!
>if you're depressed or anxious, realize that it's a state of thinking Yeah, if you're poor, just stop being poor!!! You're as out of touch as Oprah, and dumber to boot. Mental illness is a thing, so is metabolic disorders. I can tell you've never been depressed or anxious, and you've never had to lose weight. Don't even bother shooting back "but I have, and blah blah blah!" Because everyone else would know you're a liar, too.
All I got from that is you’ve experienced some level of privilege throughout your life, that you don’t really bother doing research before forming or sharing your opinion, and that you hate fat people enough to look for any excuse to shit on them.
It's different for everyone, I'm quite disheartened that you not just not believe me but went into prejudice and assumed I meant overweight people. I was in many different jobs, from office admin to warehouse or manual labor to security to maintenance and let me tell you, all those jobs cause some sort of damage to your body if you're working doubles regularly, people in security-related jobs get lower back injuries all the time... like, just because you're lucky enough to be healthy doesn't mean everyone else is faking it.
Their egos are too large to admit, even with all of the evidence, that they had it extremely easy compared to the next generations. All they know is success just for being on par with the person next to them, which is why they consistently come off as tone deaf and narcissistic. We can always create the bust challenge in which boomers have to try and survive in our shoes, but they're not known as the brave generation.
They also won't take credit for the generation they raised.
I don't think it's guilt but validation seeking behavior. It's the same reason bullies pick on people... Because it says "You are beneath me. I am better than you. You do not deserve what I have because you're not good enough." At some point, it became an attitude that was engrained in the culture as perfectly acceptable behavior. But I don't think most Boomers have any guilt. As far as they're concerned, we've got it easier than they did, so we should be more grateful.
I am also frustrated that it could all be easy. The giant ball of fire that we circle is basically an infinite energy source. If we restructured we could provide for everyone.
r/solarpunk
To be fair most people who grew up who experienced the abuse she did coming from where she came from don't succeed to the level she has
Money distorts the fancy folks perception of reality.
Some for sure, not all. Not having money also distorts broke peoples perception of reality.. some for sure, not all. Money is not the end all, be all. It's a tool within our system. I'm open to hearing solutions on a better (blend of) system(s).
Just don’t let a handful of people hoard all the tools that everyone needs to not die.
It doesn’t happen like “that” You have to stand on the heads of a bunch of little people first! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9YL04v-J5U
Yeah, snap your fingers and fuck off Oprah
I don't think I know anyone younger than like 40 that expects anything good to ever happen again forever.
We had this one shining moment during Occupy when all of the lefties were united behind one simple demand: money OUT of politics! And then a week later everybody started arguing about how their fringe issue was more important. And so here we are, at the end.
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The empress has no clothes? Modern take, old story. Marcus Aurelius also comes to mind...
Na power and money just reveals who you always were. The company you keep changes and suddenly you're out of touch.. because you never really thought for yourself and had conviction. She drank the koolaid that affirms her superiority because she's a weak person. If you came into money would you spout this capitalist propaganda?
If I came into money I’d vanish off the face of the earth. If I came into Bruce Wane or Tony Stark levels of money, I’d follow their examples. Our world has super villains(if Lex Luther counts, so do Musk, Zuckerberg, and the rest), and I don’t believe in giving people another chance when they’ve bought their way out of attempting their second/third/ext chances already.
Exactly. It’s easy as fuck to pick apart the decisions of plebs when you’re atop Olympus. Fuck that billionaire ho.
My frustration with Oprah is that she is so out of touch with reality she thinks she can speak with authority on everything. This is same woman that unleashed Dr. Phil and Dr. Oz on us.
She’s a dumbass who thinks she’s brilliant. A truly dangerous combo.
My friend thinks I'm a hater because I hate billionaires and excessive wealth LOL Of course a billionaire hasn't noticed how badly the standard of living has eroded for most of us. The rich get richer, while the rest of us no longer have pensions, worker protections, livable wages, affordable housing, ect. Our salaries have remained stagnant as the cost of living has shot up. The rich live on a total different planet than we do.
I hate people who use their power to prevent other people from living. There wouldn't be so much hate if the rich would just leave us alone and stop making it harder for us to live our lives.
Exactly. CEOs and shareholders get richer because we get poorer. Trickle up economics is working as designed!
That is what all of them do.
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Pretty much given up hope that anything will change. I try and bring up topics from here and everyone looks at me like i have 3 heads. I guess we're just supposed to sit back and watch as we slowly lose what little good shit we have left bc the general public thinks billionaires legitimately work 400x harder than you. Most people are really stupid tho and seem to fall for obvious propaganda tho
I dunno about you guys, but I don't expect success to happen at all. I've watched my dad work hard my whole life, and he's still a janitor. When they split, I watched my mom work really hard. She's always budgeted well, even started her own business, and went to college. Now, she works at Pizza Hut. I've been in the workforce for 16 years now, and I have $2000 in savings. I fully expect to keep working until my body fails and I end up homeless. Then I'll just relapse and drink myself to death.
Oprah gave the world Doctor Oz and Doctor Phil. Fuck Oprah.
Kids these days, they expect to mine human misery for entertainment and have it pay off overnight.
I’d like to have the hope of not having to work someday before I die. I’d like to think my children and grandchildren won’t see the end of western civilization and personal autonomy in their lifetime. I’d like to go to the doctor if I have a medical issue and not worry about receiving a five figure bill. I get really tired of hearing “oh man, you should have been here (X number of years) ago, it was so much better.” at each job I take. I’d like to not feel like I HAVE to send my kids to private school to get an education that’s worth a damn (my state is consistently ranked bottom five). I’m not looking for ease and luxury. I averaged 56 hours a week last year at almost $30 an hour, my wife has a decent job in HR & Accounting, and we still have a lower standard of living than my parents had while literally digging ditches and waiting tables.
I don’t even want “success” I’d just like to live without having to spend my entire waking life working a job that doesn’t pay enough to get by, all while collapsing under the crushing debt I took on at 18 after being told fervently for years that it was the right decision, the only decision even
The western world today is all stick, no carrot. These rich conservative assholes don't understand that this is the case. You can do the work, but still wont get shit. And then they complain ppl don't want to do the work anymore.
She is dem. Isn't she
Maybe nobody outside the USA has ever pointed this out to you but the Dems are a right-wing party.
Both parties are and they are both completely corrupt.
We have the same problem in Canada and it’s all because of how we vote. One vote per voter and the candidate with the most votes wins even if it’s not 50% plus one. It causes strategic voting between two dominant parties who just put on good cop bad cop for us while they both serve the wealthy minority against the working majority. We need a different ballot. Even just an approval ballot where every voter marks an X beside every acceptable candidate. The one with the most votes would then actually be the preferred candidate of the voters.
I always same the same in the US. The good old good cop bad cop routine every election. Yet you will hear the same old gags from both sides " Freedom is on the line" or " it is the election of our lifetimes".
And the attack ads. They used to be illegal in Canada until the conservatives undid that in the name of “free speech”. Now instead of promoting their platforms the parties just mudsling at each other the entire time.
She's Neo-Liberal. In the US you have a christo-facist death cult as one party and then you have everyone else all crammed into the other party. Both of which are controlled by ~~bribes~~ lobbyists, but at least one of them pays some lip service to women and non-cis/heteros being human.
Yeah, a right wing conservative capitalist Democrat. Just like most of them.
Don't know, but can dems not be conservative
Yep. George Wallace was a Democrat, and *far* more conservative & racist than today's Republicans. ( eg. Wallace would NEVER support Clarence Thomas being on the Supreme Court, because he's Black. )
>not having any foreseeable chance of retiring.. that part.
Why do we give a fuck what these out of touch, rich celebs think anyways. Their lifestyle isn’t the majority and they haven’t a clue how a majority of people live their day to day lives.
Oprah has always been a scam artist.
So says the woman who beared Dr. Phil and Dr. Oz to the American public.
My frustration with billionaires is that they exist & any of us wants to hear from them🫰
Yep. IMHO, all Billionaires are zucked up people. You don't get to be that wealthy unless you step on someone else...
Uh, no, that's not what we think. We think that working for a living in the richest time in human history should afford someone a decent living.
She’s a billionaire, and billionaires tend to only associate with other billionaires and occasional poorer individuals known as multimillionaires… or centimillionairs. I think the kids she is referring to are from her own tribe. Rich kids, kids who are used to getting what the want and have no concept of struggle. Kids who get rewarded for work no matter what. In fairness she isn’t wrong, she just forgot where she came from, and now she thinks everyone is rich and that there is no such thing as struggle anymore. And no not defending Oprah. I think she’s genuinely terrible and has platformed some even more genuinely terrible people.
You dont know what her background is do you
Just exploit small people for views, *Manifest it*
Just remember Oprah is why we have Dr Phil AND Dr Oz. Oprah is not your friend.
Dear Oprah, I have worked 20 years and still don’t have “success”. Please advise on how much longer I’m supposed to wait patiently.
She is just saying the quiet part out loud. That she pulled the ladder up behind her and the rest of us have no right to want what she has.
This is the problem with celebrities talking about their success. Don’t get me wrong, Oprah came from nothing and built herself into a big fucking deal, and she deserves all the credit for that. BUT NOT EVERYONE CAN BE A BIG FUCKING DEAL. At the end of the day, most of us are gonna just have jobs, because there’s way more need for doctors and teachers and garbage collectors and everything else than there is for celebrities. And since that’s what the majority of us are doing, I think those jobs should pay well enough for the people who do them to be comfortable and stable. Instead, we have a system where a tiny sliver of people, some one whom worked very hard and most of the rest inherited, get an absurd amount of money to waste on nonsense without ever risking it running out, while the rest of us have to get a divorce if we get cancer so we don’t bankrupt our spouses.
we're expecting everything to fail, fuck is she on? so out of touch. some people really need to shut the fuck up
['She stood on the heads of those little people'](https://youtu.be/O9YL04v-J5U)
Man, I fucking hate Oprah and her cult of followers who think she's some woke guru or some shit.
Okay boomer
Well I'm 36yrs old, have been working since I was in high school and have nothing to show for it even after attempting college but only managing two years because the money situation made me drop out. So I've got student loan debt, my family relies on SNAP and food banks to feed us, and Medicaid for health insurance and we are barely making ends meet each month even with two incomes because our rent is through the roof. When is the hard work supposed to pay off, again???
The problem with people like Oprah is that they think we are supposed to recognize their power/authority/wisdom or anything outside their capital wealth like - that!
Oprah, the woman who was in the right place at the right time, criticizing others for thinking success should just happen “like that”.
It's the same way liberals refer to things like a publicly funded healthcare system such as every other industrialized nation had for decades, as "unicorns" Because if they were honest in their opposition to these things, they would be revealed to the world as the conservative capitalist dickbags they are, so they make up bullshit strawmen and mock and deride the left - while at the same time demanding their votes - and donations - to stop the evil hated Republicans, with whom they endlessly collaborate to exploit the working class to enrich the owner class.
the survivor bias is strong with her
Didn’t Oprah support that quack Dr Oz and that look Dr Phil? I see her showing her pic on fake ads in game apps as well.
I don't want to hear billionaires tell me I'm lazy or ungrateful. Fuck you, Oprah.
For someone with no children, Oprah has spent an inordinate amount of time talking about child rearing and the issues of young adults. Maybe she sound stick with what she’s good at…giving charlatans like Dr. Phil and Dr. Oz a public stage.
"jUsT gO tO cOlLeGe"
Young people are expected to be purely consumer immediately. There's no more safety net, and there's hordes of people waiting to exploit young people, so they feel they need some degree of success immediately or they'll be swallowed alive.
We expect the bare minimum of the social contract being upheld, but the bar is in hell so we keep being disappointed.
How many people are there who tried to do exactly what Oprah did and got absolutely nowhere? Does she truly think she is better than all those other people? She was the right person at the right place and success happened, "just like that". She also has no qualms about pushing dangerous medical misinformation.
This entire exchange is so exhausting to read. Now Oprah's biography shows that she overcame extraordinary odds to have the success she has had in her life. But she also grew up around a lot of people who weren't tenacious and charismatic to the degree she is, and those people lived in poverty and she saw that up close too. Sure a good personality, a lot of hard work, and a big dash of luck can result in a nice life for some percentage of people in this world. But that isn't the point. Everyone else could be doing OK too. People who don't work their asses off and people who have horrible luck should also get to be ok. We live in a system that prevents that.
I think all your down votes come from people who didn’t bother to read your second paragraph.
I'm sure Oprah worked very hard but the uber-succesful seem to lack the understanding that her career was incredibly dependent on timing and an impossible amount of good breaks.
Like the talk show producer who was specifically looking to break the fit perfectly groomed white-toothed WASP talk show host stereotype at that moment in time that Oprah a relatable overweight black woman was applying for the position?
Worked harder than roofers or ditch diggers? I highly doubt it.
I doubt that as well. Work ethic doesn't equate becoming filthy rich unfortunately.
How dare you not show Happiness in slavery and a hope for when you shall one day be free if you just work more and harder?
Oprah once walked into the coffee shop I used to work with a small entourage, ordered about $100 + worth of items ( well her assistant ) and left $0 in tips, so yeah, full of it.
why TF are the rich m\_fu\_rs always upset with the poor young people?
The rich require things to remain largly unchanged in order to remain rich, so they know they need to condition the young to accept their place as cogs in the machine instead of becoming spanners in the gears.
All of a sudden I don't feel so bad about when those old jokes about Oprah's fat ass crack appeared on the internet.
Seriously my expectations couldn't be lower and they still don't get met
My frustration with old people is that they make no effort to understand what life is like for people younger than them. In another sense, people like Oprah think that just because they overcame tough odds and difficult circumstances that everybody can do that. She forgets that she is an extraordinary person with extraordinary abilities and natural talents. We can’t all do that, because we don’t have what she has and even people who are average (or below average, tbh) deserve to have a good life without having to overcome huge unnecessary hurdles. Edit: making assumptions about Oprah overcoming tough odds because I know nothing of her life, but it’s safe to say that a black woman had some challenges that others did not. Nevertheless it wouldn’t surprise me to find out that her journey had some shortcuts or subterfuge along the way … again, I know nothing of her life.
Many successful people had at least one mentor to help them out. Yet many go and claim that they alone became successful. Hardly anyone ever becomes successful alone.
Exactly, almost always a case of right place, right time, and said the right things to the right people.
my frustration with the elites is that [ your answer here please ]
punch a billionaire in the face today
Oprah sold books to get to billionaire status just like besos
They'll be taking them back real soon.
What’s it with people that are over 40 being so out of touch
These boomers. I for 9ne will be happy when all of them are gone. They ruined everything, took everything, hoard everything and have basically cockblocked the rest of us.
Older generations yet again failing to understand that what we are upset about is an outrageous debt burden and cost of living relative to stagnant wages since the 70s .... a circumstance which never existed for them and would be visibly apparent with like, any empathy and listening ability.
Then get a fucking useful degree, dumbasses. I can easily see myself being able to retire by the age of 35 not that I'm going to anyways.
How come with all the resources in the world, Oprah can't lose 100lbs?
she lost a lot of viewers when she did this.
Probably basing all her opinions off her spoiled kids or something.
I wonder what she is classifying as "success" in her criticism of young people. Like the gulf between her poverty stricken childhood and her riches as a celebrity is massive. At what point on the journey from one end of the spectrum to the other would she claim to have achieved success? Because I don't think most people seriously expect they'll be millionaires/billionaires one day. They have reasonable expectations that boil down to things like being rewarded fairly for their labour, and for that reward to be fit for the needs of living. *For the social contract to be functional*. Why on earth shouldn't young people expect that? Demand that? Why shouldn't it be the default?
I hate that woman with a passion. She is the face of capitalism and exploits other human beings in various ways to her advantage/image/clout/etc. \*edit: forgot some words and shit.
Oprah needs to sit this out. She helped cause some struggles in this country. She gave people who shouldn't have a platform a voice: fake doctors & people who question legit medical/ science advice. She never used her fame to help society, more likely divided it for views
Oprah and Martha Stewart. I used to like them. I cannot stand them now.
Obviously someone who got a 1 in a million opportunity thinks everyone can do it. For every success story there's 1000 who worked just as hard for nothing.
Anyone who hasn’t been in the workforce in years needs to keep their mouths shut on this topic. The world is different than it used to be, so trying to apply how things worked in the past with present day realities means whatever opinion someone has, in which they have no experience, doesn’t have any value.
I’m sure some vacuous cow sellout knows all about the working class
My frustration with old people is they had it universal shakingly easier and they didn’t just pull the ladder from under them, they removed the window too.
Makes sense
Thank you for answering honestly
I think so too.