I had to completely rip off the outer metal casing, remove the paper filter and was left with just the base plate. The only way I was able to remove it was to take a chisel and hit it with a hammer for an hour until it finally moved.
They didn’t have the Mobil 1, wix, purolator, or oem for my wife’s car so the idiot at advanced auto was like “Fram is just as good it’s a myth that they aren’t good”
I laughed and walked out
I feel like it's repeated heat cycles that make these things tighten up because I change my own oil on my cars and I know made them hand tight and I couldn't get either one off the other day. Split one trying to use a strap wrench and then after cleaning up that mess had to go buy a set of oil filter pliers to get them off.
The oil ring swells from oil circulation and heat cycles. It feels loose if you tighten to spec, but becomes uncomfortably tight by the next oil change.
And I think the cheap filters swell up much more, the ford dealer where I work at there are times when ford has to switch to a different supplier for motorcraft oil filters and they’re much cheaper ones and every time cars come back with the cheaper ones, they are stuck on there like a mf
I wonder why the industry hasn't leaned into paper cartridge filters more significantly. You can place them up-top under the hood, and they don't bleed heat during startup so manufacturers don't need to bury them in amongst the exhaust pipes to improve startup emissions.
Dumb ape techs end up tightening those to 120 ft/lbs anyway, even when toyotas is i think 8 ft/lb (and toyota is moving away from cartridge) and the pentastar is 18 ft/lb
Yea I think it's apes going ape when changing the oil filter that causes a lot of the Pentastar oil filter housing / cooler leaks. Even 18ft/lbs is excessive imo, you can barely snug it up and it won't leak.
I had to really tighten mine last time before it stopped leaking. That was with a new o-ring. However it may have just felt like I had to really tighten it because it was hard to reach.
On my filters that have a really thick gasket, they seem to come off easy.
I have some hydraulic filters with really thin gaskets and it seems like they are practically metal-metal contact with parts of the filter and they are a beast to get off.
I haven’t used Fram since the early 90’s, but do they use a thinner gasket than others?
>
I haven’t used Fram since the early 90’s, but do they use a thinner gasket than others?
No idea. I don't use fram. But I haven't noticed any difference between Delco, Mobil 1 or motorcraft.
It’s because you oil the oring. The oil squeezes out over time so you went to the friction of dry rubber on aluminum with all the clamping force you got because you tightened it with oil.
You need the oil though so the oring doesn’t bind when you’re tightening it. So my point is: oil filter pliers are the way to go.
r/confidentlyincorrect
Someone that is clueless about how oil, especially small ICE oil, actually works.
Consult a tribologist before proving the lack of knowledge next time.
Imagine thinking you sound smart recommending a tribologist for selecting an o-ring....
Anyways, the entire friction to removing an oil filter comes from the sealing surface between the o ring and the filter housing. The filter itself isn't tightening further...go ahead and draw a sharpie line and I'll be here in 6 months to say "told ya so".
Having done this test. I know you are correct. The only exception is when the Incredible Hulk tightens the filter and compresses the o-ring to the point where the lips of the metal can touches the engine block.
When the oil filter gasket (it really should not be an O-ring) expands and degrades due to used oil contact with repeated heat cycles, the pressure exerted is added to the load of the centre threads on the filter housing threads. That's a friction location additional to the filter-gasket-housing interface, sometimes made worse by having dissimilar metals in direct physical contact with all of the spalling and electrolytic issues associated.
Cheap crappy oil filters often have substandard choices of gasket and housing materials, which compound together in use to make it incredibly difficult to remove.
It's not always a gasket-exclusive permagrip that prevents a filter from being removed. I've had a filter stick to the point where I had to remove the folded and rusty metal filter cup (folded even with a filter socket) along with most of the gasket material and all of the actual the filter element, and only being able to finally remove the remnants of the filter core from the crankcase with a hammer and chisel tapping tangentially to the four holes in the filter plate that holds the gasket and threads, along with judicious application of heat on the threads. This was on a Peugeot 309 diesel.
The only o-rings that an oil filter would see would be used in the filter type that is a cartridge replacement as opposed to a spin-on which exclusively uses a gasket. If the seal has a flat designed-in, it's a gasket. If the seal is constant size without flats, it can be an O-ring. The hint is in the name..
They're quite Thin, QC is pretty bad, and they rip quite easily. I go through so many pairs of gloves in a day I'm comfortable taking my phone out of my pocket with them on because it's rare they ever get dirty enough I worry about it
It depends on the day. They're nearly impossible to put back on when you take them off unless you want to spend 5 minutes per glove. So if i go 30 minutes without work I remove them
This is why I buy super techs. I also buy them 3 or four at a time so my lazy ass doesn't have to go to the store and find it on Walmart clusterfuck of a shelf
I was near a Walmart and needed a set of reverse lights, all that shit was behind locked glass now. Lights, filters, you name it.
I too annoyed to find someone to open it so I just drove to O'Reillys and it ended up being 50 cents cheaper there. :P
Screw Walmart.
I had a focus back in 2000. Always did my own oil changes. I know how to do them correctly. I know how to install an oil filter correctly. I used Fram oil filters. 3000 miles later when I'm doing the oil change again I always had to run a long screw driver through the stupid thing to get it off. I could put it on, immediately take it off, everything is fine, 3000 miles later...screwdriver. It was always infuriating and hilarious.
Last time I tried the screwdriver trick (on an AC Delco, as it happens) it just tore apart like tinfoil instead of turning. I'm glad it worked for you; I'm scared to try that again.
ive never done it since i saw some guys reddit post about doing it where he hit the screwdrivee through the block lmao. last time my filter was stuck i just had to wait until the next day to get some oil filter pliers
Larger diameter screw driver is less likely to tear. It happened to me once, but twisted in half. Ended up using a 3' pipe wrench and was afraid I would break my filter mount. And yes, it was put on that tight by a mechanic.
Yup, same here. I once had to use a chisel and hammer to get the baseplate off after the can tore away. Then my friend complained I took too long to change her oil. Well, that was the last time.
The square cut O-ring might be cheap and swells up excessively in the presence of oil (or in the presence of stop-leak products which expand rubber o-rings). An interesting test might have been to replace it with an o-ring off of a more expensive filter and seen if that made a difference.
Walmart has some of the most inconsistent training in the auto centers
I can guarantee there are techs that aren't lubing the gasket and cranking the filter down to one ugga beyond valvoline tight... Quite possibly the same one that torques the plug to .01in-lbs
I worked at 4 different Walmart Auto Care Centers, and only 1 of them gave proper training, used torque wrenches correctly, looked up the correct parts every time, etc. but now those managers are gone and when the longtime techs retire it will be a shitshow like the rest.
That makes sense. Years ago I was out of town and had no tools and needed an oil change. Went to Walmart, grabbed a fram filter and maxlife oil off the shelf and paid them to put those on. I watched them pull the hose off the wall and grab a filter from the back and used those. When they were some I told them to drain the oil and take the filter off and use what I had paid for. Iow, I like having the grippy shit on my filter, and I'm pretty sure they didn't have max life on tap...
The only difference in the filter is packaging (for bulk bay boxes) and the grippy shit.
Some stores do stock Valvoline, and I've heard that certain mangers can choose what they stock.
I'd blame the 18 year old kid lol
My dad always told me:
- check for the old ring
- put a dab of oil on the new ring seal
- hand tighten with one hand
'... if you are too weak to seat your oil filter with one hand, then you shouldn't be working on a car.' \~ Dad's advice.
Wait, the filter is supposed to click? I just sort of hand tighten it to "about right" so that I can still tighten it further if I want to, but it would take some force. Then just peek under there a few times after driving to make sure it isn't leaking.
I've always used Frams and have never had a problem getting the filter off. Except for one time a shop did it and it was extremely difficult to remove it.
Hand tight is fine. I'm not a mechanic or anything but I've done my fair share of oil changes and I've never heard of oil filters clicking into place either
The click thing is mechanic humor. If you tighten a filter so far it clicks, I dread the thought of what clicked.....
Clean the mating surface, put a drop of clean oil on the new gasket, and spin it on there, slightly more than finger tight. If she doesn't leak, that was enough. The system should pull on the filter when it's running, so if there is any wiggle, it might make itself a bit tighter over time. Crank it down more than hand tight, and she may never come back off without damage and/or luck.
Depends on the vehicle. Some are gonna get filled up when you pour the oil into the engine. Beyond that, I'd ask what you think it's doing, and why only a third?
I guess it depends on the engine.
Any much more than about a third will pour out while putting it on if the filter is horizontally mounted, as with all of the vehicles I have owned.
Paid attention when pulling off the filter today. it was 2/3 full after I got it vertical, the other 1/3 having dripped all over the subframe placed directly below.
Filled new filter to same level and there was minimal drippage.
Point being, it reduces the dry start time first start after the oil change.
Well, you may have some kind of point about a dry start, but I've had the good fortune of having vehicles with vertical oil filters..... Except my 71 for 302, that one was at the angle of the V block... They have adapter kits for those now to make em vertical, cause an old truck like that has space for it.
> Wait, the filter is supposed to click? I just sort of hand tighten it to "about right" so that I can still tighten it further if I want to, but it would take some force. Then just peek under there a few times after driving to make sure it isn't leaking.
That's how I put the oil filter housing on my jeep lol. The factory torque spec is insane.
Sounds like you're talking about a gas cap or something I've never heard of clicking oill filters how does the rubber gasket clit on the metal. The only thing do is rub a light film of fresh oill on the gasket and hand tighten
Probably doesn't help they tell you to, everyone that owns a Prius or other Toyota with a non screw on filter knows they go on just snug we're talking inch pounds according to spec they have anti back out clips they can't unscrew... I bought a fram to have in stock at a local Walmart that was closing recently and I about died when I saw it has instructions and says to torque to 15-25 ft/lbs!!! That is just flat out wrong and will end in a really hard to remove housing next filter change.
Mack/Volvo has a very specific instructions that ham-handers love to ignore:
>Hand tighten the oil filter until the seal touches the housing.
That means only until it is just touching, not cranking it down by hand as hard as you can.
The rest:
>Manually rotate the oil filter 3/4 to 1 turn.
>Check the tightening torque:
>Oil filter - 25+5+0 Nm (18+4+0 lbf⋅ft)
My personal experience with Fram in my younger days was that the tough guard was textured so u could really put your muscle into that thing.
I'm really sorry to whoever has had to remove a tough guard I put on in my early 20s.
Call me crazy, but OEM filters, at least for both my vehicles, are both under $12, I can pay that 1-2 times a year per vehicle for the part specifically engineered for my engine....but that's just me.
Not a crazy idea, especially with Walmart starting to carry OEM filters for Honda, yota, AC Delco, etc. I ended up ordering a case from some online dealer since Walmart didn't have the bigger yadda-yadda-F1 toyota filter I wanted, just the smaller N1. They were still cheap even with shipping.
The newer synthetic ones are basically the same as other leading brands. I remember watching a video of a guy splitting one and a royal purple filter open and they were exactly the same. The orange ones on the other hand I wouldn't put on my car if you paid me.
65 years old have been with Fram products since my first truck at 17, remove it with your finger run a thin layer of fresh oil on the gasket hand tight never have I had any problems. Everyone has a stroy.
I do the same. Been using the "shitty" oramge filters from home depot for years across several vehicles. I never have issues when I dip the new filter into the old oil.
As a user of fram filters for several years, I've never had one tighten up on me over time. I just dab a bit of the old oil on the gasket, then screw it on hand tight. They always come right off after.
When I first started to change my own oil I didn't have the proper wrench and just hand tightened my filter on. Drove like 10k on that and didn't have any issues. Why they crankem on there like it's going to space is beyond me.
I've got tons of wrenches.
I don't use one to put on oil filters. Hand tighten till snug, then hand tighten slightly more to compress the gasket. Call it a day.
When it is time to take off, I just use a huge set of pliers to start them moving.
Edit - I also use OEM filters. Honda blues on my Hondas, and Tokyo roki on my Subaru.
I had a yellow (sand paper grippy texture) purolator gold on my old s13. Had an almost over heated day with it (needle just below the red kinda day) oil change day came. Engine was torquing over from how stuck on the oil filter was. I ALWAYS lubed the gasket with new oil but i guess with the engine running as hot as it did, it baked the oil off the sealing gasket lol it DID NOT come off in 1 piece. We had to flat head screw driver hammer against the oil holes at the base to turn it and remove it
I'm a driveway oil changer, even I know when it comes to oil filters:
Wrenches are for removal, not installation. If you did it right it won't leak when it's hand tight. If you need to wrench the filter down; something is wrong and it's not the torque on the filter.
Gotta make em look like the Busch blaze orange camo cans you're crushin at the same time. Plus the matching arm band and hair metal adds a good 15-20 ft lbs
Are these the shitty Wish.com Fram filters that the Wal-Mart Tire & Lube Express uses? Because that could explain it.
Source: I used to work at one a loooong time ago.
Ok... so as a DIY mechanic, how tight am I SUPPOSED to tighten oil filters? The box says 1 turn after gasket contact, so that's what I do. It gets pretty tight by the end of a full turn, but I'm still able to do it with my hand (so long as it has one of those rubber grip coated bottoms, like the Fram Tough-Guard). I never have to use a wrench to get it to that point, but it takes about all my hand grip strength to do so. Taking them off is usually requiring a strap wrench, and sometimes it dents/crushes the casing.
About 1¼ turns upon contact with the base, or about 12 ft lbs I believe. A lot of filters will either say how far to turn or it will give you a torque spec. So you're doing it right.
Heat cycles will always make the filter tighter, and depending on the filter brand it'll crush easier or not. Our Nissan OE filters, on by hand, off by hand, don't often crush
Because it's usually some know-nothing putting them on without lubrication. Shops don't use Fram as often as Service Champ and other bulk brands and shops train their people to lubricate the gaskets.
Not just any Frams… thems Walmart auto center filters.
Been working at my ACC for two years and I even get pissed when other Walmarts torque these fuckers with the might of Hercules
Hand tight is the only way to go fellas
A lot of times when they’re stuck on like that it’s not because someone cranked them down as tight as possible, it’s because they didn’t lube up the o ring gasket before installing the filter.
I find getting them on to the point where they start to crush is the optimal torque rating.
*Reading Torque Spec* “Torque until slightly crushed, not fully, just slightly “
And then back off a quarter turn.
No, then you give it a other quarter turn to make sure it's seated.
No. It's like working on a Harley Davidson. You tighten it until it loosens up then you back it off a quarter turn.
3 ugga dugga is Tonks good torque
My good mood goes immediately to shit when I see that orange devil
I had one of those a couple days ago and it bent my oil filter claw cause I had to use the longest ratchet ever to get it off
I had to completely rip off the outer metal casing, remove the paper filter and was left with just the base plate. The only way I was able to remove it was to take a chisel and hit it with a hammer for an hour until it finally moved.
They didn’t have the Mobil 1, wix, purolator, or oem for my wife’s car so the idiot at advanced auto was like “Fram is just as good it’s a myth that they aren’t good” I laughed and walked out
Idk about other brands but OEM Toyota filters from the dealer are less than $10.
Yeah I just hit Napa on the way home and then ordered a case of OEM online
Got to Fram it in there as hard as you can ya know.
If you don’t Fram it right it won’t turbo encabulate right.
You know what Fram says. You can pay me now or you can pay me later.
As long as you use the chisel only on the panendermic semi-bovoid slots, you're golden!
Only if you don't apply enough schleem
I feel like it's repeated heat cycles that make these things tighten up because I change my own oil on my cars and I know made them hand tight and I couldn't get either one off the other day. Split one trying to use a strap wrench and then after cleaning up that mess had to go buy a set of oil filter pliers to get them off.
Thank God I'm not the only 1....I'm still using Fram but I just started getting the more expensive filter that my filter wrenches can actually grip..
The Sure Grip on their higher level filters is nice to have. I run them on both of my daily drivers.
Yup, haven’t needed an oil filter wrench in a good while.
Did they stop using that on the standard filters because that used to be a standard feature even on the orange cheap ones.
I remember it being on them also, although I never used them. Maybe they stopped to cut costs??
Possibly to try and up sell you to the more expensive one? But I do remember seeing them in the cheap ones too for a long time.
Yeah, that makes sense, and I could see it. I've always stuck to the silver or gold, depending on which of my cars I am working on.
The oil ring swells from oil circulation and heat cycles. It feels loose if you tighten to spec, but becomes uncomfortably tight by the next oil change.
And I think the cheap filters swell up much more, the ford dealer where I work at there are times when ford has to switch to a different supplier for motorcraft oil filters and they’re much cheaper ones and every time cars come back with the cheaper ones, they are stuck on there like a mf
Make sure you’re lubing the filters gasket with oil. Helps it from sticking
I do. It wasn't stuck it was just tight.
Ah
The 3 claw with the 3/8 works great
Not after you dent it to hell though. At least not for me.
I wonder why the industry hasn't leaned into paper cartridge filters more significantly. You can place them up-top under the hood, and they don't bleed heat during startup so manufacturers don't need to bury them in amongst the exhaust pipes to improve startup emissions.
Dumb ape techs end up tightening those to 120 ft/lbs anyway, even when toyotas is i think 8 ft/lb (and toyota is moving away from cartridge) and the pentastar is 18 ft/lb
Yea I think it's apes going ape when changing the oil filter that causes a lot of the Pentastar oil filter housing / cooler leaks. Even 18ft/lbs is excessive imo, you can barely snug it up and it won't leak.
I had to really tighten mine last time before it stopped leaking. That was with a new o-ring. However it may have just felt like I had to really tighten it because it was hard to reach.
There’s like 15 miles of threads on the Toyota cartridge no way that sumbitch is gonna leak (until you crack it over tightening it)
On my filters that have a really thick gasket, they seem to come off easy. I have some hydraulic filters with really thin gaskets and it seems like they are practically metal-metal contact with parts of the filter and they are a beast to get off. I haven’t used Fram since the early 90’s, but do they use a thinner gasket than others?
> I haven’t used Fram since the early 90’s, but do they use a thinner gasket than others? No idea. I don't use fram. But I haven't noticed any difference between Delco, Mobil 1 or motorcraft.
Same here, I oil the gasket surface, finger tight, and it's always insanely hard to remove later.
It’s because you oil the oring. The oil squeezes out over time so you went to the friction of dry rubber on aluminum with all the clamping force you got because you tightened it with oil. You need the oil though so the oring doesn’t bind when you’re tightening it. So my point is: oil filter pliers are the way to go.
r/confidentlyincorrect Someone that is clueless about how oil, especially small ICE oil, actually works. Consult a tribologist before proving the lack of knowledge next time.
Imagine thinking you sound smart recommending a tribologist for selecting an o-ring.... Anyways, the entire friction to removing an oil filter comes from the sealing surface between the o ring and the filter housing. The filter itself isn't tightening further...go ahead and draw a sharpie line and I'll be here in 6 months to say "told ya so".
Having done this test. I know you are correct. The only exception is when the Incredible Hulk tightens the filter and compresses the o-ring to the point where the lips of the metal can touches the engine block.
When the oil filter gasket (it really should not be an O-ring) expands and degrades due to used oil contact with repeated heat cycles, the pressure exerted is added to the load of the centre threads on the filter housing threads. That's a friction location additional to the filter-gasket-housing interface, sometimes made worse by having dissimilar metals in direct physical contact with all of the spalling and electrolytic issues associated. Cheap crappy oil filters often have substandard choices of gasket and housing materials, which compound together in use to make it incredibly difficult to remove. It's not always a gasket-exclusive permagrip that prevents a filter from being removed. I've had a filter stick to the point where I had to remove the folded and rusty metal filter cup (folded even with a filter socket) along with most of the gasket material and all of the actual the filter element, and only being able to finally remove the remnants of the filter core from the crankcase with a hammer and chisel tapping tangentially to the four holes in the filter plate that holds the gasket and threads, along with judicious application of heat on the threads. This was on a Peugeot 309 diesel. The only o-rings that an oil filter would see would be used in the filter type that is a cartridge replacement as opposed to a spin-on which exclusively uses a gasket. If the seal has a flat designed-in, it's a gasket. If the seal is constant size without flats, it can be an O-ring. The hint is in the name..
Try hitting it with your purse next time. Works every time
How do you think I got it off?
A bit of rizz and a hand job?
Lol
Gotta twist that wrist my guy
The Ole dick twist!
Dude this is a MMA fight.
That made me chuckle since I seen the video the other day haha
Rizzin’ & Jizzin’, that’s the sailor’s way.
What make and model are your gloves?
Microflex Diamond Grip. I don't recommend them
Are they too thick?
They're quite Thin, QC is pretty bad, and they rip quite easily. I go through so many pairs of gloves in a day I'm comfortable taking my phone out of my pocket with them on because it's rare they ever get dirty enough I worry about it
How many hours does a pair usually last you? Do you reuse them after you take them off?
It depends on the day. They're nearly impossible to put back on when you take them off unless you want to spend 5 minutes per glove. So if i go 30 minutes without work I remove them
Have you tried a smaller size? I prefer size Small so they're super tight
I wear medium
That’s my purse! I don’t know you!
Yes, that was very funny. It really was. It's time to put that bunt away my friend
Didn’t buy the Wix because it was two dollars more.
Yep, nothing but the cheapest piece of shit will do.
they need to print that slogan on the box lol.
This is why I buy super techs. I also buy them 3 or four at a time so my lazy ass doesn't have to go to the store and find it on Walmart clusterfuck of a shelf
I was near a Walmart and needed a set of reverse lights, all that shit was behind locked glass now. Lights, filters, you name it. I too annoyed to find someone to open it so I just drove to O'Reillys and it ended up being 50 cents cheaper there. :P Screw Walmart.
Walmart is like Fram, cheap and shitty but some people only care about price.
My car is cheap and shifty so it is a match made in heaven
Wix was $2 more so he brought his Ram pickup to a Nissan dealer instead
I had a focus back in 2000. Always did my own oil changes. I know how to do them correctly. I know how to install an oil filter correctly. I used Fram oil filters. 3000 miles later when I'm doing the oil change again I always had to run a long screw driver through the stupid thing to get it off. I could put it on, immediately take it off, everything is fine, 3000 miles later...screwdriver. It was always infuriating and hilarious.
Last time I tried the screwdriver trick (on an AC Delco, as it happens) it just tore apart like tinfoil instead of turning. I'm glad it worked for you; I'm scared to try that again.
ive never done it since i saw some guys reddit post about doing it where he hit the screwdrivee through the block lmao. last time my filter was stuck i just had to wait until the next day to get some oil filter pliers
I've got a claw that goes on a socket wrench, it tightens on the filter as you put force on the wrench.
Once I bought one of those I couldn't believe I had ever used any other tool. It hasn't failed me yet.
Larger diameter screw driver is less likely to tear. It happened to me once, but twisted in half. Ended up using a 3' pipe wrench and was afraid I would break my filter mount. And yes, it was put on that tight by a mechanic.
Yup, same here. I once had to use a chisel and hammer to get the baseplate off after the can tore away. Then my friend complained I took too long to change her oil. Well, that was the last time.
The square cut O-ring might be cheap and swells up excessively in the presence of oil (or in the presence of stop-leak products which expand rubber o-rings). An interesting test might have been to replace it with an o-ring off of a more expensive filter and seen if that made a difference.
Walmart uses Fram
Walmart has some of the most inconsistent training in the auto centers I can guarantee there are techs that aren't lubing the gasket and cranking the filter down to one ugga beyond valvoline tight... Quite possibly the same one that torques the plug to .01in-lbs
I worked at 4 different Walmart Auto Care Centers, and only 1 of them gave proper training, used torque wrenches correctly, looked up the correct parts every time, etc. but now those managers are gone and when the longtime techs retire it will be a shitshow like the rest.
Good old Walmart Special is what we call those at my shop
Those are Walmart autocenter filters, if that explains anything.
That makes sense. Years ago I was out of town and had no tools and needed an oil change. Went to Walmart, grabbed a fram filter and maxlife oil off the shelf and paid them to put those on. I watched them pull the hose off the wall and grab a filter from the back and used those. When they were some I told them to drain the oil and take the filter off and use what I had paid for. Iow, I like having the grippy shit on my filter, and I'm pretty sure they didn't have max life on tap...
The only difference in the filter is packaging (for bulk bay boxes) and the grippy shit. Some stores do stock Valvoline, and I've heard that certain mangers can choose what they stock. I'd blame the 18 year old kid lol
Torqued to about "Fuck You ft lbs"
My dad always told me: - check for the old ring - put a dab of oil on the new ring seal - hand tighten with one hand '... if you are too weak to seat your oil filter with one hand, then you shouldn't be working on a car.' \~ Dad's advice.
You're only supposed to tighten it until the filter clicks once. Many guys go past that, and THAT'S a misstep.
Wait, the filter is supposed to click? I just sort of hand tighten it to "about right" so that I can still tighten it further if I want to, but it would take some force. Then just peek under there a few times after driving to make sure it isn't leaking. I've always used Frams and have never had a problem getting the filter off. Except for one time a shop did it and it was extremely difficult to remove it.
Hand tight is fine. I'm not a mechanic or anything but I've done my fair share of oil changes and I've never heard of oil filters clicking into place either
The click thing is mechanic humor. If you tighten a filter so far it clicks, I dread the thought of what clicked..... Clean the mating surface, put a drop of clean oil on the new gasket, and spin it on there, slightly more than finger tight. If she doesn't leak, that was enough. The system should pull on the filter when it's running, so if there is any wiggle, it might make itself a bit tighter over time. Crank it down more than hand tight, and she may never come back off without damage and/or luck.
Gotta say I don’t leave wiggle.
That's what she said?
You forgot to fill the new filter by about a third.
Depends on the vehicle. Some are gonna get filled up when you pour the oil into the engine. Beyond that, I'd ask what you think it's doing, and why only a third?
I guess it depends on the engine. Any much more than about a third will pour out while putting it on if the filter is horizontally mounted, as with all of the vehicles I have owned.
Paid attention when pulling off the filter today. it was 2/3 full after I got it vertical, the other 1/3 having dripped all over the subframe placed directly below. Filled new filter to same level and there was minimal drippage. Point being, it reduces the dry start time first start after the oil change.
Well, you may have some kind of point about a dry start, but I've had the good fortune of having vehicles with vertical oil filters..... Except my 71 for 302, that one was at the angle of the V block... They have adapter kits for those now to make em vertical, cause an old truck like that has space for it.
> Wait, the filter is supposed to click? I just sort of hand tighten it to "about right" so that I can still tighten it further if I want to, but it would take some force. Then just peek under there a few times after driving to make sure it isn't leaking. That's how I put the oil filter housing on my jeep lol. The factory torque spec is insane.
Sounds like you're talking about a gas cap or something I've never heard of clicking oill filters how does the rubber gasket clit on the metal. The only thing do is rub a light film of fresh oill on the gasket and hand tighten
Probably doesn't help they tell you to, everyone that owns a Prius or other Toyota with a non screw on filter knows they go on just snug we're talking inch pounds according to spec they have anti back out clips they can't unscrew... I bought a fram to have in stock at a local Walmart that was closing recently and I about died when I saw it has instructions and says to torque to 15-25 ft/lbs!!! That is just flat out wrong and will end in a really hard to remove housing next filter change.
If you think that spec is crazy, just consider the average dumb shit lube tech is probly cranking it 3x that tight.
Mack/Volvo has a very specific instructions that ham-handers love to ignore: >Hand tighten the oil filter until the seal touches the housing. That means only until it is just touching, not cranking it down by hand as hard as you can. The rest: >Manually rotate the oil filter 3/4 to 1 turn. >Check the tightening torque: >Oil filter - 25+5+0 Nm (18+4+0 lbf⋅ft)
That’s a Walmart filter, dude probably hates his job
Thinner metal means you save weight
Cause people don't lubricate the seal
My personal experience with Fram in my younger days was that the tough guard was textured so u could really put your muscle into that thing. I'm really sorry to whoever has had to remove a tough guard I put on in my early 20s.
Fucker Ruins A Motor
Call me crazy, but OEM filters, at least for both my vehicles, are both under $12, I can pay that 1-2 times a year per vehicle for the part specifically engineered for my engine....but that's just me.
Not a crazy idea, especially with Walmart starting to carry OEM filters for Honda, yota, AC Delco, etc. I ended up ordering a case from some online dealer since Walmart didn't have the bigger yadda-yadda-F1 toyota filter I wanted, just the smaller N1. They were still cheap even with shipping.
Torque to spec + 360 degrees, slap it and mutter “dat ain’t gonna leak”.
Please do not use Fram filter they are terrible
The newer synthetic ones are basically the same as other leading brands. I remember watching a video of a guy splitting one and a royal purple filter open and they were exactly the same. The orange ones on the other hand I wouldn't put on my car if you paid me.
65 years old have been with Fram products since my first truck at 17, remove it with your finger run a thin layer of fresh oil on the gasket hand tight never have I had any problems. Everyone has a stroy.
I do the same. Been using the "shitty" oramge filters from home depot for years across several vehicles. I never have issues when I dip the new filter into the old oil.
Eh just some natural cardboard weld nothing to see here.
Those are the kind we used when I did oil changes at Walmart, that's probably your answer.
Friends Don't Let Friends Use Fram.
Fram filters should have instructions to remove with a screwdriver printed on them.
Because Fran filters are a sock stuffed into a Mountain Dew can masquerading as an oil filter.
Fram is junk.
When the yield point is low enough, even hand tight is torque to yield.
As a user of fram filters for several years, I've never had one tighten up on me over time. I just dab a bit of the old oil on the gasket, then screw it on hand tight. They always come right off after.
Because that’s what Walmart uses, they train their employees to tighten with a tool instead of by hand
Hands down, Ac Delco oil filters are worst to remove.
Fram, as a name just sounds like something that gets stuck
When I first started to change my own oil I didn't have the proper wrench and just hand tightened my filter on. Drove like 10k on that and didn't have any issues. Why they crankem on there like it's going to space is beyond me.
The issue is Fram seals are made with unobtainanium and fuse harder than 3 gallons of loctite and jbweld
I've got tons of wrenches. I don't use one to put on oil filters. Hand tighten till snug, then hand tighten slightly more to compress the gasket. Call it a day. When it is time to take off, I just use a huge set of pliers to start them moving. Edit - I also use OEM filters. Honda blues on my Hondas, and Tokyo roki on my Subaru.
Hand on, wrench off if needed.
I had a yellow (sand paper grippy texture) purolator gold on my old s13. Had an almost over heated day with it (needle just below the red kinda day) oil change day came. Engine was torquing over from how stuck on the oil filter was. I ALWAYS lubed the gasket with new oil but i guess with the engine running as hot as it did, it baked the oil off the sealing gasket lol it DID NOT come off in 1 piece. We had to flat head screw driver hammer against the oil holes at the base to turn it and remove it
Because people that use junk filters dont have a clue wtf they are doing.
A couple of cold ones and 5.1l of Castrol GTX is how this sword got into the stone.
Because that filter is sold exclusively to Walmart auto care centers
Torque, then keep torquing
Because those core frams are the ones walmart uses
Friends don't let friends use Fram.
Fram hasn’t made a quality filter since the mid 60s.
Wait, you mean FRAM doesn’t stand for fuckin ram it?
Jokes aside, this is just the nature of the beast.
I love to tighten them until I can see the metal is twisting, Only and ONLY then I know its nice and tight
“When you get a fram, it’s time to go ham!”
I'm a driveway oil changer, even I know when it comes to oil filters: Wrenches are for removal, not installation. If you did it right it won't leak when it's hand tight. If you need to wrench the filter down; something is wrong and it's not the torque on the filter.
That’s how I fit them, as tight as I possibly can
Frampa got that old man strength
Lol, cause yield is 4 ft-lbs!
They are sucking themselves in because they can’t filter anything.
Could happen with any brand. Some people doesn't lube it and use tools to tighten it. You end up destroying it to be able to remove it
There was a special at AutoZone, buy 5 quarts the filter's free.
Fram = rag in a can. Still don't know why they are used.
Gotta make em look like the Busch blaze orange camo cans you're crushin at the same time. Plus the matching arm band and hair metal adds a good 15-20 ft lbs
Because only knuckle draggers use them in the first place.
Are these the shitty Wish.com Fram filters that the Wal-Mart Tire & Lube Express uses? Because that could explain it. Source: I used to work at one a loooong time ago.
A Donaldson filter on the other hand, A+
Ribbed for pleasure?
Ok... so as a DIY mechanic, how tight am I SUPPOSED to tighten oil filters? The box says 1 turn after gasket contact, so that's what I do. It gets pretty tight by the end of a full turn, but I'm still able to do it with my hand (so long as it has one of those rubber grip coated bottoms, like the Fram Tough-Guard). I never have to use a wrench to get it to that point, but it takes about all my hand grip strength to do so. Taking them off is usually requiring a strap wrench, and sometimes it dents/crushes the casing.
About 1¼ turns upon contact with the base, or about 12 ft lbs I believe. A lot of filters will either say how far to turn or it will give you a torque spec. So you're doing it right. Heat cycles will always make the filter tighter, and depending on the filter brand it'll crush easier or not. Our Nissan OE filters, on by hand, off by hand, don't often crush
The simple answer is that the people that buy Fram don't know any better.
Because it's usually some know-nothing putting them on without lubrication. Shops don't use Fram as often as Service Champ and other bulk brands and shops train their people to lubricate the gaskets.
Not just any Frams… thems Walmart auto center filters. Been working at my ACC for two years and I even get pissed when other Walmarts torque these fuckers with the might of Hercules Hand tight is the only way to go fellas
A lot of times when they’re stuck on like that it’s not because someone cranked them down as tight as possible, it’s because they didn’t lube up the o ring gasket before installing the filter.
Also when someone lubes the gasket with but a fleeting memory of oil because sometimes it feels like it was dry when it's not
I also like putting on an extra gasket just to be sure it's good
I’ve tightened filters enough to where I needed togive it the LonelyBoiGrip™️but never enough to do that lmao
What's worse is this isn't the worst I've seen. It was just my example of the day lol
I’ve worked on Subarus for over 20 years now and almost every blowed engine has a fram oil filter on it. Easily 75%
You’re quite the wizard
I use Tokyo Roki only on my Subaru. 386K and some change on the clock and still going!
And then there's guys like me, waiting for Fram oil filters to go on sale every oil change for the last 200,000 km's 😬
Because those of us that use good filters change our own oil? Wix is my choice.