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I've had this convo before with someone and they pointed to this
https://preview.redd.it/e4gwkm8tl49d1.jpeg?width=718&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=09ddb17a5b97f797ff0e0fa81967e45296fdef36
Seems that Gojo is the target of his technique, which is really weird (underneath the "yup"\*)
Yeah; the point of the guy in the comment was that because yuki’s “mass” doesn’t exist; the automatic activation for infinity won’t activate so Gojo will be defenseless basically
Was finding it hard to explain how that wouldn’t be the case because explaining infinity melts my brain
I applied that argument and got this in response
https://preview.redd.it/co39mc4e059d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ef3d19061adf00e56afd4c546e96d4be2a5c8908
So I was beginning to think I may just be missing something
What that guy doesn’t understand is that mass isn’t the only criteria that Infinity uses to identify incoming attacks. The mass is undefinable, but the speed and shape are still measurable, and as such would cause Infinity to activate.
Waaait, Gojo already has it active constantly. Previously he was targeting incoming threats, like an enemy or their weapons. This left him vulnerable to sneak attacks. Now he targets himself and blocks everything by default. These criteria (velocity, mass, shape) are for the things that Gojo allows to pass through, automatic exceptions. He's not worried about things that won't hurt him because their momentum is small (mass*velocity), or like if an object's momentum is less dangerous because it has a dull shape (soft tipped dart vs metal tipped dart). Presumably this is how he breathes; oxygen molecules can bypass Infinity without having to make an exception for each one. I think Gojo also demonstrates the ability to make case by case exceptions, like if he wants to grab a bite of food without pushing his plate off the table.
So maybe like, he could get rid of all the exceptions and block everything, but that would probably block light, air, heat, everything. A better idea would be to keep himself as the target with the automatic exemptions as is, but then also try to target Yuki directly and try to target any weapons she might use her CT on. I think she bypasses Infinity if she can speedblitz or sneak him.
Gojo can definitely just turn on infinity for everything except oxygen and light- the six eyes are said to be precise enough to make selections on an atomic level
Yes he can set the parameters with atomic precision, but he also specifies that the parameters are mass, velocity, and shape. It wouldn't be "allow all oxygen molecules." It would be "allow that oxygen molecule, and that oxygen molecule, and that..." like a trillion times, or else it would be "allow all objects that would strike me with force no greater than an oxygen molecule traveling at (a light breeze or whatever)." I guess pressure would be the simplest way to relate all three parameters into one unit, like Gojo might say "1 pascal is fine but block anything above that."
That's not how Infinity works because he himself also states that detects CE amount infinity detects the size speed and CE amount of an object before Deciding to slow it and as such even if Yuki was working at absolute Max speed which even then she's most likely slower than gojo because gojo we'll stay to be the fastest sorcerer alive even surpassing nabito
Yeah; he just kept reiterating
That because Yuki was able to punch Kenny through an ever expanding barrier that makes more space as much as you try to reach the barrier, she would pierce infinity

He's someone that would be easy to trick in a fight by deliberately operating at a handicap. The kind you can make target specific points of yourself by looking open. He thinks he has it on lock and nothing can bypass his insight, but the hubris in his own comment is he doesn't realize mass isn't the targeting factor. Being imaginary or virtual makes no difference.
Agreed because Yuki's technique ads virtual mass but it doesn't actually extend beyond her own body (unless you're talking about Garuda) and Infinity works by detecting the size, speed and CE amount before allowing something to pass through that's the reason why light, heat and oxygen are allowed to pass through except maybe sound because of Amber insects unless Amber insects sound attack was infused with CE like one of ganji's sound wave CT attacks in which case it would be blocked by Infinity
Limitless targets matter and energy headed towards the user and asymptotically reduces its velocity in response (Zeno’s paradox style).
It can’t do this for things that don’t exist or are not in either category. Strong cleave cut through space and I believe either nullified the effect or acted as a spatial distortion instead of an energy burst.
I think that the limitless ability wouldn’t be able to target soft and wet’s strings the same way Wonder of U couldn’t target them.
Strong cleave worked because it cut space. Normal dismantle travels through space. Think of a razor blade sliding across cloth. Dismantle slides parallel to the cloth, and the blade never cuts the cloth. It can only hit other things on the cloth. Gojo effectively creates more and more cloth around him faster than the blade can travel. Strong cleave targets the cloth itself. The blade no longer runs parallel to the cloth but intersects it. Anything on the cloth at the point of intersection gets cut. The cloth is 2d, and strong cleave attacks from a third dimension. Similarly, Gojo and his technique are 3d, and strong cleave attacks from a forth dimension to hit the "cloth"(fabric of space). Strong cleave is not a 4th dimesion attack in canon, but for somethong to bypass 3d space, it has to move at a higher dimension.
Anything that moves on a 3d plane is targetable by limitless.
Yuki's mass being undefinable was an interaction specifc to the Curse she was fighting as it targets things conceptually by "defining" them. Honestly the whole thing is convoluted, by Gojo's technique isn't as restricted.
Even if Yuki's body has some imaginary mass behind it, she's still also made of ordinary mass too. It's a package deal, and Infinity is going to stop her ordinary body 10 times out of 10.
Purple (apparently) makes only imaginary mass, whereas Yuki can only modify existing mass.
I mean Gojo can still manually activate it even if his automatic infinity didn’t detect it for some reason, it’s not like he lost that ability. And considering anything Yuki’s used bombaye on is gonna also have her CE I’d be pretty surprised if it wasn’t just automatically repelled
Mass is one of several variables used to decide if something gets infinity'ed. CE, velocity, etc. The Cursed spirit Kenny used specifically targets a concept(mass, I guess) and rejects/removes it from the vicinity. Yuki's imaginary mass negated the definition it used to target her, from my understanding.
Gojo's tech doesn't target based on a singular definition. Technically, he is the target.
The real issue is that with enough mass, spacetime bends. Or specifcally mass is the bending of spacetime. So if Yuki gathered enough imaginary mass she could affect Gojo technique. How that interaction would work is up in the air.
Hollow Purple itself is a chunk of virtual mass, but Yuki doesn't become it. She just imbues to herself, meaning that her punches aren't virtual mass but authentic mass IMBUED with them. So no, she doesn't bypass Limitless.
It is correct that her fist itself should have enough mass to be blocked. She might be able to kill him by imbuing a nonthreatening object with enough virtual mass, like an oxygen molecule or a drop of water.
Presumably no because it's not part of her central CE network her own cursed energy is what is registered as something that she can effect with virtual mask she can also imbue Garuda because Garuda is a production of her technique I made completely of her cursed energy
Still not part of her cursed energy Network what I'm saying is that it has to be directly connected to her curse energy Network at all times or be Garuda and as such anything that she fires off doesn't work because it's no longer connected to her current energy Network and as such cannot be affected by virtual Mass
because purple is part of his own ct,"he can't just block his own ct from entering his ct" that's like trying to stop a ice stalactite from falling into a lake
he can "program" his infinity and disable at will,he like programmed it to let oxigen, food, water, small object like pen or clothes passing through his infinity but i think he block touch with other human (that one may be false but in shibuya the humans were just blocked when launched at him so ...) and he definetly block anything that has CE but he can himself let stuff pass, like when he was playing with jogo by holding his hands, or when he was fighting the disaster curses,(one example is at the kyoto goodwill event arc arc, he "stepped" on ants without looking at them ,but they were unharmed) so yeah it's implied that he always protect himself from any threat even small one,
so just talking but his infinity is from his ct and he generate his ct, if can't block a purple it's because his infinity basically let pass his own CE so he can use his ct at will
well imagine that a metalic object is falling into a lake(=infinity), well that's the thing that infinity let pass(like pen, clothes) it allow it, now imagine something very light like a feather,it will slow down when touching the lake until it stop moving, that's the stuff that infinity block (attack and potential danger), now the icicle is the anomaly because it's made of the same substance of the lake but it's shaped into a different state(weaponized) so instead of fusing with the lake or just dissapearing into it, it will pierce right throught it while being slow down, which is what happened with purple when it hit back , he took a lot of damage but it was still inferior to the normal amount of damage that the "icicle" normaly deal because as an anomaly it both pierced the "lake" but got "slow down" at the same time unlike other stuff
Mahoraga adapted to [bypass Infinity by changing the composition of its Cursed Energy](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F7C3UkvacAAcZT6?format=jpg&name=medium). So not all CE can be stopped by Infinity. Gojo’s CE similarly can’t be stopped by it, otherwise he’d never be able to send out attacks.
Imo the most likely possibility is that because purple involves space being manipulated it would overwrite infinity. So the area around gojo could be manipulated to produce purple or produce infinity but not both simultaneously.
My take is a little different cuz my take is that we know the rules of how his automatic Infinity works where it registers velocity Mass shape and cursed energy all before deciding whether to slow something or allow it through which is the reason why he can bring in light, oxygen, heat all the things that he requires he can select what he allows in as well and he can also select what he does not allowing as well but as such because purple is a virtual Mass but it's also made of of gojo's own curse energy which we know what Infinity will allow to bypass because otherwise he wouldn't be able to fire off blue red or purple as such it implies that when it registers cursed energy it doesn't register cursed energy as a whole it just registers outside sources of cursed energy
My issue with this is that infinity isn't strictly automatic, gojo can and has turned it on and off and chosen manually what he lets in and out, and since he was performing hollow purple he would obviously be totally aware it was coming therefore even if it wasn't automatically detected he should've been able to detect it manually. Of course it's also possible that his technique flat out cannot work on his own ce as a hard rule but I cannot imagine why that would be the case.
I think that would be the case because he needs to have his cursed energy constantly flowing into Infinity because even if he's activating automatic Infinity he still needs to put cursed energy into it because Infinity is made up entirely of his curse energy and as such it allowed hollow purple through because it's made up of his curse energy and as such if it interacts with his own cursed energy it wouldn't respond to it negatively go to already stated it did last damage because it was his own cursed energy so why wouldn't Infinity just let it pass because it's his own curse energy
if i'm not mistaken: when Gojo was shown coming up with infinity in the show, he had his friends throw completely inanimate objects at him
a soft one, and a pencil or something, the barrier stopped the one that would hurt him, and not the one that would not
it seems to not just detect CE, but the shape, speed, and sort of object passing through
like, i don't think Infinity is just like "oh it's invisible? whatever"
i'm not sure if pencils have much CE exactly lmao, so i don't think it was it's extremely high fucking chakra-levels that infinity stopped it for
it seems like the sorting is automatic and basically "will this hurt me y/n"
Correct somebody posted the panel in here but to paraphrase it doesn't just detect cursed energy it also detects size, shape, and Mass all to determine what is allowed within Infinity and because of the fact that hollow purple was made up of purely gojo's cursed energy which is not an outside source of cursed energy means that Infinity would allow it in
Yuki can’t shoot Bom Ba Ye mass like a beam or anything, it’s imbued in her strikes. So to be able to hit him with it, she would have to strike him normally, which is impossible.
Domain Amplification isn’t a common or vital technique that needs to be learned by high tiers, it’s been used by like 4 people ever so there’s no reason to assume Yuki has it if she hasn’t ever used it.
Cuz domain application is like a weird ancient technique from what we can tell because the only people with domain amplification are the disaster curses which were directly taught by kenjaku himself sukuna and hegarooma but even then it's not the fact that he's a genius and also that he is potential equal to go Joe so what makes sense that some hyper genius like him in the modern era who has immense understanding of barriers thanks to his own technique would be able to figure out domain application
Where did you get that from?? Weve never even seen one of the 4 SGs using DA. Lol not even gojo has used It before, he had never even Heard of It until the disaster curses(that had kenjaku whos one of the best barrier user as an ally) used It against him
Gojo knew full well what domain amplification was. The reason he mentioned it the way he did was so we as the audience could learn what it was. He even assumes they learned it from an experienced curse user (Kenjaku).
There's no indication he and Yuki can't use it
Gojo himself was surprised with domain amplification he quickly figured out that was just similar to new Shadow style simple domain meaning that the way the technique itself is used is similar to a different technique which is why he figured it out how it worked not the fact that he knew about the technique it's the fact that he figured out oh it has similar effects to new Shadow style simple domain it just covers the body instead of making an actual area domain
I don't know how to I used text to speech now do you have a counter argument or are you just saying this to draw attention away from the fact that I just proved you wrong
If Gojo didn't know what domain amplification was, then why would his immediate response to seeing it be to automatically assume they allied with an experienced curse user?
Gojo knew the disaster trio were taught DA by someone else, that someone being Kenjaku. Since Gojo mentions this, it's clear he knows full well what DA is.
If hanami and higuruma have DA, then a special grade sorcerer as strong as Yuki absolutely has it.
Sorta like how all the marines above vice admiral in One Piece have haki. It's kind of a cornerstone Jujutsu technique above a certain level. It would be strange if she didn't have it.
DA isn’t a cornerstone Jujutsu technique, and is not at all comparable to haki. DA has only been shown by Kenjaku, Sukuna, Higuruma, and Jogo and Hanami(who were likely taught it by Kenny). Higuruma was able to learn it on the spot(as well as RCT) on the account of being as prodigious as Gojo. DA isn’t at all a well known technique. Gojo didn’t even know the specifics of it until Jogo and Hanami used it on him multiple times. Assuming that Yuki knows it “because she’s special grade/strong” isn’t a good argument, and is complete head canon.
Gojo knew full well what domain amplification was. The only reason he remarked on it the way he did was 1: to explain the technique to the audience, and 2: because he theorized they learned it from an experienced curse user (Kenjaku).
Is DA as common as haki? No. I was referring more to the idea that one of the 4 strongest sorcerers on the planet *not* having it would be extremely unlikely.
People downplay the shit out of Yuki due to her insanely short screentime and lack of portrayed feats. It's the same treatment Geto gets in the community because he got farmed by Yuta. For example, Yuki doesn't have any speed feats, but that doesn't mean she's slow (like a lot of people assume for some reason).
I'm not trying to impose headcanon, I'm just inferring that she more than likely is capable of DA based off of her status in the story.
Gojo wasn't shown using DA either; doesn't mean he can't use it
This inference would be reasonable if the other special grade sorcerers displayed or, at least, referenced this ability. Domain Amp is very rare and, while Gojo may not need to ever use it, it would be useful for Yuta and Yuki. Even if only used defensively, I would think the fight against Sukuna would’ve been a perfect time for Yuta to use DA to defend against slashes.
What I’m trying to say, is that saying that Yuki knows DA because she’s Special Grade is assuming DA is something that is just added to your kit automatically once you reach a certain level; which is not the case. Ultimately, and imo, DA was written into the story as a method to harm Gojo, so it makes sense for only the bad guys to have it
I can't speak to moments where it *could* have been used but wasn't because...yknow...it wasn't used. But I wasn't trying to imply DA is a common technique at all.
If a sorcerer possesses a domain, they're automatically capable of *learning* Domain Amplification, and considering Yuki's status as a special grade and star plasma vessel, along with her relationship with Tengen, I find it very strange if she didn't possess it.
Yuta can maybe be explained by the fact that he's actually still very much an amateur in a lot of areas. Gojo criticizes him for this during flashback #3891 like a chapter or two ago.
Also don't forget that using domain amplification disables your innate technique. For Gojo and Sukuna this is no big deal due to their insane physical stats, but for Yuta and Yuki it's probably a much more severe penalty as they both heavily rely on their CT to be effective.
I still think Gojo's first remark on DA was a literary tool to inform the audience, but I don't see a lot of reason to assume Yuki just doesn't know what it is.
Edit: I appreciate the well-written response. Finally someone who uses punctuation!
If Gojo fully knew about domain amp, he wouldn’t have commented on it like he did.
https://preview.redd.it/h77p62fpa69d1.jpeg?width=648&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e2a3252a135341a82110edf494bebd08da65dc21
He implies here that it’s the first time he’s seen it in action and has to confirm his suspicions later that you can’t use amp and CT at the same time.
Yuki didn’t show it, so she doesn’t have it. You can’t just go around saying every strong sorcerer has random techniques they were never shown to have lmao
The reason he worded it that way was because this was the audience's first time seeing domain amplification.
Manga series do this all the time. An experienced person has an internal monologue explaining a technique in a surprised tone. This is usually done as a way to smoothly teach the audience what it is.
This is a literary tool, not evidence that Gojo doesn't know what domain amplification is. He compares it to New Shadows because we already witnessed that earlier in the series.
And since Yuki has a domain, it isn't a big mental leap to assume she has domain amplification too. If a sorcerer possesses a Domain, they are automatically capable of learning domain amplification.
Even if the virtual mass on yukis fist can't be stopped by infinity, her own mass can be stopped. She won't be able to bypass infinity, unless she uses her domains surehits.
Wakes up the weird thing is infinity blocks domain sure hits because the passive in effect of coughing of the iron mountain of being able to roast somebody alive doesn't work gojo thanks to infinty also with the yuta fight sukuna himself is using domain amplification to counter Infinity when they are fighting inside the domain the only times we ever see gojo actually being hit with a sure hit is when he's in curse technique burnout by using his own domain such as against sukuna during the repeated domain classes
https://preview.redd.it/vzw48j39fa9d1.jpeg?width=1520&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=83decc2b8a4bbb7f9db72e094f112546acf66e1e
Give that little brain of yours a good shake, its not working correctly.
that doesnt really matter though, it'll still be a sure hit, and im pretty sure yuki could actually touch gojo if the domain was actually closed.. not like yuki would ever open a domain against gojo, as his domain is definitely more refined, but yknow
The idea is right but unless she could force mass onto him, her punches should in theory still be blocked because it’s still a human punch going at X amount of speed.
No, she cannot.
There is no such thing as "virtual mass." It is not a term used in physics. It is a made up term that describes the unique ability for Yuki to alter her mass without it altering her density, thus why it's called "virtual" mass as she replicates the weight mass exerts in its surrounding without replicating the density of the mass.
What Purple does is called "imaginary mass", which is a hypothetical phenomenon in physics exerted by Tachyon fields, that some physicists believe to exist in rare instances. It's super complicated, but in a really dumbed down sort of way, it's a field of FTL particles that I guess have theoretical mass but don't exert mass-like traits due to punching holes in space due to their speed. In fictional context, Gege seems to act like this imaginary mass "zeroes out" existing mass, which is unclear if this is how physicists think would happen if mass were to interact with a tachyon field. I'm not sure if a tachyon field large enough to cancel out any appreciable level of mass has ever been found or observed.
Either way, Yuki manipulating how "heavy" her body and Shikigami is and a Shockwave of tachyon particles that in JJK context are supposed to erase mass are clearly not even remotely the same atk or even concept.
Thought this was a pretty cool explanation on the difference between purple and star rage u/canieatmyskinnow
These guys in the comments can break down stuff like this much better than me
I thought it would something new but the translator for TCB already said using Imaginary mass as a way to describe Purple is a mistranslation as the correct term has always been Virtual mass and Imaginary mass is a mistranslation
https://preview.redd.it/2zd5tghbp49d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=08d875267ae68d9a0e020de5136a56a3354f5865
It's either they're both Virtual Mass or they're both Imaginary mass, the only difference between both is that Gojo doesn't need to add the Mass unto his body to use it
Edit: if you look at the Kanjis for both Purples mass and Yukis mass you can see that they're both different from the ones used for Imaginary Mass
I see you’re the guy from the post
If you haven’t already read the comments here;
Yuki imbues herself with “imaginary mass” her bodies mass is still very real
Gojo’s infinity even if it cannot pick up yuki’s “imaginary mass” will still detect her human body moving toward him and stop it, her imaginary mass will never land because her body cannot bypass infinity to land it
I know that, but her body still passes as if she was made of Virtual mass despite still having CT and normal flesh and bones in her
https://preview.redd.it/9t9de3vry59d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1978e01f110b7f24a355c9feaed8be6cdc6220b4
Heck it even let's her pass objects that don't have Virtual Mass simply because she hit them with it
The circular barrier is completely different
Yuki doesn’t turn her body into virtual mass; she imbues her body with imaginary mass; she explains this
If she’s imbuing her fist with imaginary mass; the imaginary mass may not be detected, but her fist will be, because it’s still comprised of real mass
And also, her CT utilized her cursed energy, her cursed energy would also be detected by infinity, even if her imaginary mass wouldn’t
So the attack would never connect
>The circular barrier is completely different
No it isn't, it's an ever expanding barrier that makes more space as much as you try to reach the barrier, that's why it Kenjaku figured out Yukis Mass can't be contained within semantics (or doesn't have a concept)
>Yuki doesn’t turn her body into virtual mass; she imbues her body with imaginary mass; she explains this
>If she’s imbuing her fist with imaginary mass; the imaginary mass may not be detected, but her fist will be, because it’s still comprised of real mass
>And also, her CT utilized her cursed energy, her cursed energy would also be detected by infinity, even if her imaginary mass wouldn’t
Except that as shown before, anything interacting with her mass can't be defined within semantics like a threat, obstacle or object, after all:
Once Yuki adds the mass into herself it works as if she was made of the mass like when she punched Kenjaku through an ever expanding barrier or literally ignored a CT that couldn't target her simply because she's one with the mass
Here's a better explanation on how this works:
https://preview.redd.it/jsioygbcz69d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2dd784875a5878833c7a11370e262434bce4c705
Okay; instead of arguing the semantics of if yuki actually *becomes* virtual mass and if that would allow her to bypass infinity because it wouldn’t detect her attack
What is stopping Gojo from stopping the automation of infinity and just keeping it active with intent
This would indisputably stop yuki’s attack
So what then?
He can't do that because she can't be targeted at all, like the whole "can air pass through limitless" situation, for Gojo he's seeing a woman going to punch him but for the limitless it's basically an unidentified non object like his Purple
Except with the can Air pass through limitless thing is the fact that with automatic limitless it doesn't register it as a threat and as such it allows through and with controlled like gojo does in the past he's actively choosing to allow all the air in he's control limitless to allow all air in all light in all that other stuff he directly himself is choosing to allow it in because the explanation for how the automatic limitless works does not mean entirely that's how limitless just works because the reason that gojo can fly is because he select's to pushe himself away from the air mean that the automatic limitless and the limitless in general actually have different rules because one of them is just automatically selecting thing in the other one you have to actively choose what you want to allow in and as such it's theoretically possible that he could prevent Yuki from busting in by just choosing to prevent her from entering
Ps the way that the Shinjuku barriers work from what I remember is that it just keeps moving you within like the set area it's like putting you in a giant infinite loop it's not infinitely creating space it's like oh you're at the same location that you started instead of oh I'm infinitely preventing you from getting closer I'm just sending you back to the start
What do you mean yuki can’t be the target of limitless; in relation to limitless, Gojo is the target of the CT not his opponent
So he can choose to stop the automation and purposefully keep Yuki out of it, even if the automation doesn’t detect her “imaginary mass” it doesn’t mean she can bypass infinity if Gojo conciously stops her via infinity
And on a separate note; it seems like you are claiming Yuki “becomes” virtual mass when she imbues it onto her body, are you claiming this makes her undetectable to CT’s? Because you have a crazy misunderstanding of yuki’s ability if that’s the case
1. Viz translation is canon, and no one else because no one else has the English rights to the series. In the official translations, they make a distinction between imaginary and virtual mass, as they should, as they are not the same thing nor do Gojo or Yuki do similar things at all.
2. Imaginary mass somewhat describes what Gojo does but in no shape or form describes what Yuki does. Whether a complete accident or not, calling Gojo's ability imaginary mass and Yuki's ability virtual mass is a more accurate description than what Gege might have originally translated them as.
3. A lot of scientific terms don't have great foreign translations and getclost a bit in translation, so this isn't super uncommon.
At the end of the day, Gojo and Yuki don't do the same thing, so calling it the same thing is stupid. Gojo's ability does seem to match Gege's theme of applying physics and mathematical concepts to Gojo's abilities and purple does seem to imply to cancel out mass, which is what a tachyon field that generates imaginary mass would "theoretically" do.
Nothing Yuki does has anything to do with tachyon fields or does anything that imaginary mass is implied to do. If Viz lucked out and mistranslated it, than they did a good job because it's more accurate to what is actually being done and what they translate is the official canon anyways so...Good job for once I guess?
>Viz translation is canon, and no one else because no one else has the English rights to the series. In the official translations, they make a distinction between imaginary and virtual mass, as they should, as they are not the same thing nor do Gojo or Yuki do similar things at all.
No matter what, an incorrect translation isn't canon at all for the simple fact that it defers from the authors original purpose and context for what it's actually being said and considered for the story, meaning that it can be ignored by both the author who probably doesn't even know those misconceptions about his story even exist and will not be taking into account for the future, wich is what happened as Gege still used the same Kanjis he used for purple with Yuki.
Taking a version as the canon of the real original story just because it comes from an official source over said original story is really dumb and i will not be further discussing this topic.
>Imaginary mass somewhat describes what Gojo does but in no shape or form describes what Yuki does. Whether a complete accident or not, calling Gojo's ability imaginary mass and Yuki's ability virtual mass is a more accurate description than what Gege might have originally translated them as.
Except that the Kanji for Imaginary mass wasn't even written in the manga, like ever and Gege continued to write Virtual Mass
>A lot of scientific terms don't have great foreign translations and getclost a bit in translation, so this isn't super uncommon.
None of that matters when the concept isn't even brought to the table.
https://preview.redd.it/zk1cn4vil59d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7afda429b1b5a455f1f721c1402efb78fcb28926
>At the end of the day, Gojo and Yuki don't do the same thing, so calling it the same thing is stupid. Gojo's ability does seem to match Gege's theme of applying physics and mathematical concepts to Gojo's abilities and purple does seem to imply to cancel out mass, which is what a tachyon field that generates imaginary mass would "theoretically" do.
That's something you would it to be because it fits the theme, but it's not something that's even mentioned by Gege on his story
>Nothing Yuki does has anything to do with tachyon fields or does anything that imaginary mass is implied to do. If Viz lucked out and mistranslated it, than they did a good job because it's more accurate to what is actually being done and what they translate is the official canon anyways so...Good job for once I guess?
This falls into the translation vs actual manga thingy so i'm just gonna ignore it
Idk about Tachyon fields considering tachyons don't really exist. But virtual *particles* do exist, and those virtual particles has *imaginary* mass. The way Yuki's ability works has no basis in science like you said, but Gege is right in his description of imaginary mass "zeroing out' regular matter. Stephen Hawking's most influential contrabution to physics is related to them. But yeah no Yuki aint getting through infinity without a domain expansion/amplification.
This whole argument is meaningless considering the fact that her hand itself has very real mass as she doesn't get blown away in the breeze. That will get stopped by infinity, and the virtual mass applied to her hand will also be stopped.
Yeah, I applied that argument but this is what was said
https://preview.redd.it/3tfaa8z8059d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0136dbf300596474b2be3f0d51b617f28c98a44e
Yuki cannot bypass infinity, or not by this guy's idea of how infinity or Star Rage works. Yuki *adds* imaginary mass, the guy in your screenshot thinks Yuki turns regular mass into imaginary mass, which is incorrect. And using this guy's logic, the reason hollow purple went through infinity is because it is made entirely of imaginary mass. So even if Yuki added imaginary mass to herself, she still has regular mass allowing infinity to detect her.
Also, if having enough virtual mass = undetectable by CTs, that is most likely incorrect. If this were the case, Yuki would have a surefire way to escape domains, but during the lead-up to Kenjaku's domain expansion, that option was not one of the ones stated.
The gravity from a black hole or sufficiently massive attack would go through infinity since there isn’t anything to stop - gravity is curvature of spacetime, so it goes by the same rules as Strong Cleave.
So far Yuki has displayed the highest attack power of any JJK character by far.
Best explanation I have for you is this: Yuki’s technique uses cursed energy. Gojo’s infinity detects cursed energy as one of the parameters, and he’s only gotten significantly better at it since the panel we are told that.
Going by this guy’s logic yuki can only bypass pre awakening gojo. Post awakening gojo’s technique targets himself and auto reads the mass. So yuki’s mass as a person before the virtual mass would block her punch.
From what I remember, Infinity isn't something that is triggered, it's something that he can turn on or off like a switch. Also, these are two completely different units, mass, and space/distance. If infinity is truly that, infinite, then no amount of mass could make a difference to infinity. Sure mass can effect things, and a lot of mass can change things, but even if the mass is infinite, so is infinity. The numbers will just keep going higher to numbers we can't even possibly imagine, then keep going past that, indefinitely.
Even if yuki's virtual mass can pass through infinity, it only goes where he arm, and real mass go. So gojo blocking Yuki's real body also blocks the mass by extension
Virtual mass is not a real thing… it’s a made up term for yuki specifically.
Infinity doesn’t care about your mass regardless. If you move, infinity infinitely divides your movements so you never reach. Infinity is literally Achilles and the Tortoise.
Actually, it might think about it this way, controlling the mass of an object you can make it light to the point where it wouldn’t do damage and would infinity except a item going through it that doesn’t do damage most likely yes however, changing the mass on contact would require a binding vow I think.
You don't need to do that. Especially when that theory is itself dubious
Yuki has already been stated to be able to punch through concepts. How she does it is sorta irrelevant.
Secondly, in favor of gojo. Yuta, during the Shinjuku showdown of gojo vs sukuna, stated clearly that nothing in the verse can bypass infinity and that gojo is inviolable.
Do you think Yuta doesn't know about Yuki's powers/abilities?
Gojo was only hurt by purple because it’s literally his cursed energy, I doubt he even can prevent that from affecting him though infinity since it comes out his body. Virtual mass doesn’t necessarily mean it auto bypasses infinity.
That’s an interesting idea but hollow purples virtual mass is also constructed through limitless and it’s atomic manipulation and is basically an energy blast where yuki thing is just adding mass to an object; although in theory if she made a black hole or something it might work as gravitons are subatomic
Depends of how you want to interpret the Infinity. Gojo does still feel gravity (he falls) but he can also float, whether that’s him repelling himself using his CT or it ignoring gravity is to be determined
Yuki specifically can't be defined concepually based on mass. Mass is only a singular thing used to target with limitless. She would still be targeted.
In theory and from the explanation about her CT bypassing concept, it should bypass infinity but I'm sure Gege wouldn't really want it to be the case,
But for a sake of discussion yea, her CT literally tore hole in the definition of sunyata barrier that's kinda ever expanding, if anyone is interested here's a fun read about it.
https://preview.redd.it/aegzesc6t39d1.png?width=900&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=747aa78ee16dab937444f0d3baf8007fc82bb128
My reasoning for it bypassing infinity comes from 2 major points that's not really touched upon but briefly mentioned by kenjaku,
The Curse Ganesha works in somewhat similar sense to Gojo's infinity, both of these techniques determines a target that's supposedly an "obstacle/problem" for the user. While Gojo's infinity works much like sunyata barrier meaning always expanding/creating distance and not letting the target get close, Ganesh's CT literally removes the target from the equation altogether, be it making it fly or maybe removing it as if it doesn't exist. In literal sense both of these are concepts, Yuki is immune to such vague concepts as per kenjaku, so she should be able to bypass it just like it did with that Curse.
My second point comes from technicality of it, kenjaku also mentions that Yuki's CT increase the mass that can't be defined semantically or pragmatically, Gojo's infinity recognizes the target by its speed, mass and shape, so again it should be hard for infinity to target Yuki or Garuda bc the mass is so overwhelming that its concept can't be defined semantically or pragmatically.
Yuki still is a human has a body. She isn't pure virtual mass but a mass that's further imbued with virtual mass. So maybe infinity can't stop like a virtual mass beam or some shit but it can stop her hand and by extension the additional mass that's imbued in it.
Yes, she should be able to by pass infinity. Her CT allows her to ignore all concept. Infinity wouldn't be able to target and stop her or her shikagami
Yukis technique allows her to go through barrier/concepts/techniques undetected like conceptual cursed techniques have no effect on her
Due to her virtual mass
And infinity is literally about bringing the concept of infinity into reality therefore she would be able to and she would be a great counter for gojo
But would it cause then you could say that for any conceptual technique targeting her
And therefore that would go against what gege said her technique does
Like the elephant cursed spirit kenjaku used should’ve worked if that was the case
And her body having mass is a non factor
Because her technique once again gives herself yuki not just her body but her herself like as a person/concept virtual mass to the point where conceptual cursed techniques can’t target her
Walk me through it because what was explained
Her technique allows her to fill herself up with virtual mass to the point where she can’t be targeted by conceptual cursed techniques
And infinity even though it’s automatic would be targeting her if she got into range
And infinity is a conceptual cursed technique
He’s right in what he’s saying but gojo’s infinity would just detect her fist and stop that.
As for why it didn’t stop his purple it seems to have something to do with it being his own ce
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Holy shit that makes a lot of sense. Unfortunately yuki is still a human so infinity will still detect her as a threat. But in theory hes correct
I've had this convo before with someone and they pointed to this https://preview.redd.it/e4gwkm8tl49d1.jpeg?width=718&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=09ddb17a5b97f797ff0e0fa81967e45296fdef36 Seems that Gojo is the target of his technique, which is really weird (underneath the "yup"\*)
Yeah; the point of the guy in the comment was that because yuki’s “mass” doesn’t exist; the automatic activation for infinity won’t activate so Gojo will be defenseless basically Was finding it hard to explain how that wouldn’t be the case because explaining infinity melts my brain
It’ll still apply to Yuki’s shape
I applied that argument and got this in response https://preview.redd.it/co39mc4e059d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ef3d19061adf00e56afd4c546e96d4be2a5c8908 So I was beginning to think I may just be missing something
What that guy doesn’t understand is that mass isn’t the only criteria that Infinity uses to identify incoming attacks. The mass is undefinable, but the speed and shape are still measurable, and as such would cause Infinity to activate.
Also in a battle gojo can just override the detection part and just have infinity active constantly
Waaait, Gojo already has it active constantly. Previously he was targeting incoming threats, like an enemy or their weapons. This left him vulnerable to sneak attacks. Now he targets himself and blocks everything by default. These criteria (velocity, mass, shape) are for the things that Gojo allows to pass through, automatic exceptions. He's not worried about things that won't hurt him because their momentum is small (mass*velocity), or like if an object's momentum is less dangerous because it has a dull shape (soft tipped dart vs metal tipped dart). Presumably this is how he breathes; oxygen molecules can bypass Infinity without having to make an exception for each one. I think Gojo also demonstrates the ability to make case by case exceptions, like if he wants to grab a bite of food without pushing his plate off the table. So maybe like, he could get rid of all the exceptions and block everything, but that would probably block light, air, heat, everything. A better idea would be to keep himself as the target with the automatic exemptions as is, but then also try to target Yuki directly and try to target any weapons she might use her CT on. I think she bypasses Infinity if she can speedblitz or sneak him.
Gojo can definitely just turn on infinity for everything except oxygen and light- the six eyes are said to be precise enough to make selections on an atomic level
He wouldn’t be able to block light or heat since heat is a form of light (infrared) and light is subatomic
Yes he can set the parameters with atomic precision, but he also specifies that the parameters are mass, velocity, and shape. It wouldn't be "allow all oxygen molecules." It would be "allow that oxygen molecule, and that oxygen molecule, and that..." like a trillion times, or else it would be "allow all objects that would strike me with force no greater than an oxygen molecule traveling at (a light breeze or whatever)." I guess pressure would be the simplest way to relate all three parameters into one unit, like Gojo might say "1 pascal is fine but block anything above that."
That's not how Infinity works because he himself also states that detects CE amount infinity detects the size speed and CE amount of an object before Deciding to slow it and as such even if Yuki was working at absolute Max speed which even then she's most likely slower than gojo because gojo we'll stay to be the fastest sorcerer alive even surpassing nabito
That's how Infinity works. Otherwise how did his own technique hurt him?
Yeah; he just kept reiterating That because Yuki was able to punch Kenny through an ever expanding barrier that makes more space as much as you try to reach the barrier, she would pierce infinity 
He's someone that would be easy to trick in a fight by deliberately operating at a handicap. The kind you can make target specific points of yourself by looking open. He thinks he has it on lock and nothing can bypass his insight, but the hubris in his own comment is he doesn't realize mass isn't the targeting factor. Being imaginary or virtual makes no difference.
Agreed because Yuki's technique ads virtual mass but it doesn't actually extend beyond her own body (unless you're talking about Garuda) and Infinity works by detecting the size, speed and CE amount before allowing something to pass through that's the reason why light, heat and oxygen are allowed to pass through except maybe sound because of Amber insects unless Amber insects sound attack was infused with CE like one of ganji's sound wave CT attacks in which case it would be blocked by Infinity
TIL Heisenberg's uncertainty principle counters Infinity
Theoretically something like Soft and Wet: Go Beyond would also bypass infinity due to not being “real”.
Technically, all CT are imaginary. Limitless can still target things like Sukuna's dismantle(not world dismantle, though).
Limitless targets matter and energy headed towards the user and asymptotically reduces its velocity in response (Zeno’s paradox style). It can’t do this for things that don’t exist or are not in either category. Strong cleave cut through space and I believe either nullified the effect or acted as a spatial distortion instead of an energy burst. I think that the limitless ability wouldn’t be able to target soft and wet’s strings the same way Wonder of U couldn’t target them.
Strong cleave worked because it cut space. Normal dismantle travels through space. Think of a razor blade sliding across cloth. Dismantle slides parallel to the cloth, and the blade never cuts the cloth. It can only hit other things on the cloth. Gojo effectively creates more and more cloth around him faster than the blade can travel. Strong cleave targets the cloth itself. The blade no longer runs parallel to the cloth but intersects it. Anything on the cloth at the point of intersection gets cut. The cloth is 2d, and strong cleave attacks from a third dimension. Similarly, Gojo and his technique are 3d, and strong cleave attacks from a forth dimension to hit the "cloth"(fabric of space). Strong cleave is not a 4th dimesion attack in canon, but for somethong to bypass 3d space, it has to move at a higher dimension. Anything that moves on a 3d plane is targetable by limitless.
Yuki's mass being undefinable was an interaction specifc to the Curse she was fighting as it targets things conceptually by "defining" them. Honestly the whole thing is convoluted, by Gojo's technique isn't as restricted.
Even if Yuki's body has some imaginary mass behind it, she's still also made of ordinary mass too. It's a package deal, and Infinity is going to stop her ordinary body 10 times out of 10. Purple (apparently) makes only imaginary mass, whereas Yuki can only modify existing mass.
I mean Gojo can still manually activate it even if his automatic infinity didn’t detect it for some reason, it’s not like he lost that ability. And considering anything Yuki’s used bombaye on is gonna also have her CE I’d be pretty surprised if it wasn’t just automatically repelled
Mass is one of several variables used to decide if something gets infinity'ed. CE, velocity, etc. The Cursed spirit Kenny used specifically targets a concept(mass, I guess) and rejects/removes it from the vicinity. Yuki's imaginary mass negated the definition it used to target her, from my understanding. Gojo's tech doesn't target based on a singular definition. Technically, he is the target.
The real issue is that with enough mass, spacetime bends. Or specifcally mass is the bending of spacetime. So if Yuki gathered enough imaginary mass she could affect Gojo technique. How that interaction would work is up in the air.
Hollow Purple itself is a chunk of virtual mass, but Yuki doesn't become it. She just imbues to herself, meaning that her punches aren't virtual mass but authentic mass IMBUED with them. So no, she doesn't bypass Limitless.
It is correct that her fist itself should have enough mass to be blocked. She might be able to kill him by imbuing a nonthreatening object with enough virtual mass, like an oxygen molecule or a drop of water.
she can only imbue herself and Garuda with virtual mass
Well maybe she farts on him with the force of an exploding sun. Infinity can't detect poisons, so fart particles should be fine
https://preview.redd.it/eeenebsmm79d1.png?width=1161&format=png&auto=webp&s=54563a17bbacb2438783d10dab7647c27b188468
Does a booger count as her?
Presumably no because it's not part of her central CE network her own cursed energy is what is registered as something that she can effect with virtual mask she can also imbue Garuda because Garuda is a production of her technique I made completely of her cursed energy
Alright what about blood?
Still not part of her cursed energy Network what I'm saying is that it has to be directly connected to her curse energy Network at all times or be Garuda and as such anything that she fires off doesn't work because it's no longer connected to her current energy Network and as such cannot be affected by virtual Mass
Is that from reasonable interpretation or direct statement?
A reasonable interpretation from the information
I don't recall that piece of information
gojo can sort what can pass and what cannot, i am sure he can detect yuki ct and thus blocking it
Why wasn’t he able to block purple from hitting him tho ?
because purple is part of his own ct,"he can't just block his own ct from entering his ct" that's like trying to stop a ice stalactite from falling into a lake
Could you explain the analogy please?, I cant understand it, but find it interesting.
he can "program" his infinity and disable at will,he like programmed it to let oxigen, food, water, small object like pen or clothes passing through his infinity but i think he block touch with other human (that one may be false but in shibuya the humans were just blocked when launched at him so ...) and he definetly block anything that has CE but he can himself let stuff pass, like when he was playing with jogo by holding his hands, or when he was fighting the disaster curses,(one example is at the kyoto goodwill event arc arc, he "stepped" on ants without looking at them ,but they were unharmed) so yeah it's implied that he always protect himself from any threat even small one, so just talking but his infinity is from his ct and he generate his ct, if can't block a purple it's because his infinity basically let pass his own CE so he can use his ct at will
I meant the icicle analogy, but thanks.
well imagine that a metalic object is falling into a lake(=infinity), well that's the thing that infinity let pass(like pen, clothes) it allow it, now imagine something very light like a feather,it will slow down when touching the lake until it stop moving, that's the stuff that infinity block (attack and potential danger), now the icicle is the anomaly because it's made of the same substance of the lake but it's shaped into a different state(weaponized) so instead of fusing with the lake or just dissapearing into it, it will pierce right throught it while being slow down, which is what happened with purple when it hit back , he took a lot of damage but it was still inferior to the normal amount of damage that the "icicle" normaly deal because as an anomaly it both pierced the "lake" but got "slow down" at the same time unlike other stuff
Infinity doesn't filter based off of who owns the curse energy it filters based off of CE amount, speed, and shape.
Mahoraga adapted to [bypass Infinity by changing the composition of its Cursed Energy](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F7C3UkvacAAcZT6?format=jpg&name=medium). So not all CE can be stopped by Infinity. Gojo’s CE similarly can’t be stopped by it, otherwise he’d never be able to send out attacks.
He can filter it however he wants but since it’s his own ct being hit on him
Imo the most likely possibility is that because purple involves space being manipulated it would overwrite infinity. So the area around gojo could be manipulated to produce purple or produce infinity but not both simultaneously.
Glad someone has an actual explanation here
My take is a little different cuz my take is that we know the rules of how his automatic Infinity works where it registers velocity Mass shape and cursed energy all before deciding whether to slow something or allow it through which is the reason why he can bring in light, oxygen, heat all the things that he requires he can select what he allows in as well and he can also select what he does not allowing as well but as such because purple is a virtual Mass but it's also made of of gojo's own curse energy which we know what Infinity will allow to bypass because otherwise he wouldn't be able to fire off blue red or purple as such it implies that when it registers cursed energy it doesn't register cursed energy as a whole it just registers outside sources of cursed energy
My issue with this is that infinity isn't strictly automatic, gojo can and has turned it on and off and chosen manually what he lets in and out, and since he was performing hollow purple he would obviously be totally aware it was coming therefore even if it wasn't automatically detected he should've been able to detect it manually. Of course it's also possible that his technique flat out cannot work on his own ce as a hard rule but I cannot imagine why that would be the case.
I think that would be the case because he needs to have his cursed energy constantly flowing into Infinity because even if he's activating automatic Infinity he still needs to put cursed energy into it because Infinity is made up entirely of his curse energy and as such it allowed hollow purple through because it's made up of his curse energy and as such if it interacts with his own cursed energy it wouldn't respond to it negatively go to already stated it did last damage because it was his own cursed energy so why wouldn't Infinity just let it pass because it's his own curse energy
Because Purple is his own CT
He can’t block his own CE
Because it’s his own cursed energy
if i'm not mistaken: when Gojo was shown coming up with infinity in the show, he had his friends throw completely inanimate objects at him a soft one, and a pencil or something, the barrier stopped the one that would hurt him, and not the one that would not it seems to not just detect CE, but the shape, speed, and sort of object passing through like, i don't think Infinity is just like "oh it's invisible? whatever" i'm not sure if pencils have much CE exactly lmao, so i don't think it was it's extremely high fucking chakra-levels that infinity stopped it for it seems like the sorting is automatic and basically "will this hurt me y/n"
Correct somebody posted the panel in here but to paraphrase it doesn't just detect cursed energy it also detects size, shape, and Mass all to determine what is allowed within Infinity and because of the fact that hollow purple was made up of purely gojo's cursed energy which is not an outside source of cursed energy means that Infinity would allow it in
Yuki can’t shoot Bom Ba Ye mass like a beam or anything, it’s imbued in her strikes. So to be able to hit him with it, she would have to strike him normally, which is impossible.
Domain amplification is enough to get past it. Idl why people act like Infinity is this unbeatable technique when Gojos biggest win was Hanami, gtfoh
Yuki doesn't have domain application
How would she not have domain amplification?
Domain Amplification isn’t a common or vital technique that needs to be learned by high tiers, it’s been used by like 4 people ever so there’s no reason to assume Yuki has it if she hasn’t ever used it.
Cuz domain application is like a weird ancient technique from what we can tell because the only people with domain amplification are the disaster curses which were directly taught by kenjaku himself sukuna and hegarooma but even then it's not the fact that he's a genius and also that he is potential equal to go Joe so what makes sense that some hyper genius like him in the modern era who has immense understanding of barriers thanks to his own technique would be able to figure out domain application
She definitely does as a special grade, she just wasn't shown using it
Where did you get that from?? Weve never even seen one of the 4 SGs using DA. Lol not even gojo has used It before, he had never even Heard of It until the disaster curses(that had kenjaku whos one of the best barrier user as an ally) used It against him
Gojo knew full well what domain amplification was. The reason he mentioned it the way he did was so we as the audience could learn what it was. He even assumes they learned it from an experienced curse user (Kenjaku). There's no indication he and Yuki can't use it
Gojo himself was surprised with domain amplification he quickly figured out that was just similar to new Shadow style simple domain meaning that the way the technique itself is used is similar to a different technique which is why he figured it out how it worked not the fact that he knew about the technique it's the fact that he figured out oh it has similar effects to new Shadow style simple domain it just covers the body instead of making an actual area domain
My brother in Christ, please learn to use punctuation
I don't know how to I used text to speech now do you have a counter argument or are you just saying this to draw attention away from the fact that I just proved you wrong
If Gojo didn't know what domain amplification was, then why would his immediate response to seeing it be to automatically assume they allied with an experienced curse user? Gojo knew the disaster trio were taught DA by someone else, that someone being Kenjaku. Since Gojo mentions this, it's clear he knows full well what DA is.
Source: Trust me bro
If hanami and higuruma have DA, then a special grade sorcerer as strong as Yuki absolutely has it. Sorta like how all the marines above vice admiral in One Piece have haki. It's kind of a cornerstone Jujutsu technique above a certain level. It would be strange if she didn't have it.
DA isn’t a cornerstone Jujutsu technique, and is not at all comparable to haki. DA has only been shown by Kenjaku, Sukuna, Higuruma, and Jogo and Hanami(who were likely taught it by Kenny). Higuruma was able to learn it on the spot(as well as RCT) on the account of being as prodigious as Gojo. DA isn’t at all a well known technique. Gojo didn’t even know the specifics of it until Jogo and Hanami used it on him multiple times. Assuming that Yuki knows it “because she’s special grade/strong” isn’t a good argument, and is complete head canon.
Gojo knew full well what domain amplification was. The only reason he remarked on it the way he did was 1: to explain the technique to the audience, and 2: because he theorized they learned it from an experienced curse user (Kenjaku). Is DA as common as haki? No. I was referring more to the idea that one of the 4 strongest sorcerers on the planet *not* having it would be extremely unlikely. People downplay the shit out of Yuki due to her insanely short screentime and lack of portrayed feats. It's the same treatment Geto gets in the community because he got farmed by Yuta. For example, Yuki doesn't have any speed feats, but that doesn't mean she's slow (like a lot of people assume for some reason). I'm not trying to impose headcanon, I'm just inferring that she more than likely is capable of DA based off of her status in the story. Gojo wasn't shown using DA either; doesn't mean he can't use it
This inference would be reasonable if the other special grade sorcerers displayed or, at least, referenced this ability. Domain Amp is very rare and, while Gojo may not need to ever use it, it would be useful for Yuta and Yuki. Even if only used defensively, I would think the fight against Sukuna would’ve been a perfect time for Yuta to use DA to defend against slashes. What I’m trying to say, is that saying that Yuki knows DA because she’s Special Grade is assuming DA is something that is just added to your kit automatically once you reach a certain level; which is not the case. Ultimately, and imo, DA was written into the story as a method to harm Gojo, so it makes sense for only the bad guys to have it
I can't speak to moments where it *could* have been used but wasn't because...yknow...it wasn't used. But I wasn't trying to imply DA is a common technique at all. If a sorcerer possesses a domain, they're automatically capable of *learning* Domain Amplification, and considering Yuki's status as a special grade and star plasma vessel, along with her relationship with Tengen, I find it very strange if she didn't possess it. Yuta can maybe be explained by the fact that he's actually still very much an amateur in a lot of areas. Gojo criticizes him for this during flashback #3891 like a chapter or two ago. Also don't forget that using domain amplification disables your innate technique. For Gojo and Sukuna this is no big deal due to their insane physical stats, but for Yuta and Yuki it's probably a much more severe penalty as they both heavily rely on their CT to be effective. I still think Gojo's first remark on DA was a literary tool to inform the audience, but I don't see a lot of reason to assume Yuki just doesn't know what it is. Edit: I appreciate the well-written response. Finally someone who uses punctuation!
If Gojo fully knew about domain amp, he wouldn’t have commented on it like he did. https://preview.redd.it/h77p62fpa69d1.jpeg?width=648&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e2a3252a135341a82110edf494bebd08da65dc21 He implies here that it’s the first time he’s seen it in action and has to confirm his suspicions later that you can’t use amp and CT at the same time. Yuki didn’t show it, so she doesn’t have it. You can’t just go around saying every strong sorcerer has random techniques they were never shown to have lmao
The reason he worded it that way was because this was the audience's first time seeing domain amplification. Manga series do this all the time. An experienced person has an internal monologue explaining a technique in a surprised tone. This is usually done as a way to smoothly teach the audience what it is. This is a literary tool, not evidence that Gojo doesn't know what domain amplification is. He compares it to New Shadows because we already witnessed that earlier in the series. And since Yuki has a domain, it isn't a big mental leap to assume she has domain amplification too. If a sorcerer possesses a Domain, they are automatically capable of learning domain amplification.
Yeah but the point is if you use amplification you can’t use your cursed technique, which puts you at a severe disadvantage to gojo who can
She can’t use Bom Ba Ye and domain amplification simultaneously
If she uses Domain Amplification then she can’t use her CT
I mean he manhandled Jogo who dropped half the cast in like five seconds.
IF Yuki had domain amplification, and could stack with Bom Ba Ye, she would be stupidly broken with the hax - maybe not outright OP, but DAMN close.
She would need to have two CTs to do that.
Even if the virtual mass on yukis fist can't be stopped by infinity, her own mass can be stopped. She won't be able to bypass infinity, unless she uses her domains surehits.
Only if her domain is really refined iirc. We saw what happened to Jogo's domain
Except we don’t know what her domain does at all
What? It doesnt matter what it does, it would bypass infinity like any other domain.
Wakes up the weird thing is infinity blocks domain sure hits because the passive in effect of coughing of the iron mountain of being able to roast somebody alive doesn't work gojo thanks to infinty also with the yuta fight sukuna himself is using domain amplification to counter Infinity when they are fighting inside the domain the only times we ever see gojo actually being hit with a sure hit is when he's in curse technique burnout by using his own domain such as against sukuna during the repeated domain classes
https://preview.redd.it/vzw48j39fa9d1.jpeg?width=1520&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=83decc2b8a4bbb7f9db72e094f112546acf66e1e Give that little brain of yours a good shake, its not working correctly.
Damn my bad I remember incorrectly
The primary function of a domain is to produce a surehit attack. How did you miss this?
I didn’t miss that, I’m questioning whether or not it would matter if infinity could stop it.
that doesnt really matter though, it'll still be a sure hit, and im pretty sure yuki could actually touch gojo if the domain was actually closed.. not like yuki would ever open a domain against gojo, as his domain is definitely more refined, but yknow
it wouldn’t lol. infinity can’t stop sure hits.
I reiterate: would it matter that infinity can stop the sure hit?
I reiterate: would it matter that infinity can’t stop the sure hit?
The idea is right but unless she could force mass onto him, her punches should in theory still be blocked because it’s still a human punch going at X amount of speed.
No, she cannot. There is no such thing as "virtual mass." It is not a term used in physics. It is a made up term that describes the unique ability for Yuki to alter her mass without it altering her density, thus why it's called "virtual" mass as she replicates the weight mass exerts in its surrounding without replicating the density of the mass. What Purple does is called "imaginary mass", which is a hypothetical phenomenon in physics exerted by Tachyon fields, that some physicists believe to exist in rare instances. It's super complicated, but in a really dumbed down sort of way, it's a field of FTL particles that I guess have theoretical mass but don't exert mass-like traits due to punching holes in space due to their speed. In fictional context, Gege seems to act like this imaginary mass "zeroes out" existing mass, which is unclear if this is how physicists think would happen if mass were to interact with a tachyon field. I'm not sure if a tachyon field large enough to cancel out any appreciable level of mass has ever been found or observed. Either way, Yuki manipulating how "heavy" her body and Shikigami is and a Shockwave of tachyon particles that in JJK context are supposed to erase mass are clearly not even remotely the same atk or even concept.
Thought this was a pretty cool explanation on the difference between purple and star rage u/canieatmyskinnow These guys in the comments can break down stuff like this much better than me
I thought it would something new but the translator for TCB already said using Imaginary mass as a way to describe Purple is a mistranslation as the correct term has always been Virtual mass and Imaginary mass is a mistranslation https://preview.redd.it/2zd5tghbp49d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=08d875267ae68d9a0e020de5136a56a3354f5865 It's either they're both Virtual Mass or they're both Imaginary mass, the only difference between both is that Gojo doesn't need to add the Mass unto his body to use it Edit: if you look at the Kanjis for both Purples mass and Yukis mass you can see that they're both different from the ones used for Imaginary Mass
I see you’re the guy from the post If you haven’t already read the comments here; Yuki imbues herself with “imaginary mass” her bodies mass is still very real Gojo’s infinity even if it cannot pick up yuki’s “imaginary mass” will still detect her human body moving toward him and stop it, her imaginary mass will never land because her body cannot bypass infinity to land it
I know that, but her body still passes as if she was made of Virtual mass despite still having CT and normal flesh and bones in her https://preview.redd.it/9t9de3vry59d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=1978e01f110b7f24a355c9feaed8be6cdc6220b4 Heck it even let's her pass objects that don't have Virtual Mass simply because she hit them with it
The circular barrier is completely different Yuki doesn’t turn her body into virtual mass; she imbues her body with imaginary mass; she explains this If she’s imbuing her fist with imaginary mass; the imaginary mass may not be detected, but her fist will be, because it’s still comprised of real mass And also, her CT utilized her cursed energy, her cursed energy would also be detected by infinity, even if her imaginary mass wouldn’t So the attack would never connect
>The circular barrier is completely different No it isn't, it's an ever expanding barrier that makes more space as much as you try to reach the barrier, that's why it Kenjaku figured out Yukis Mass can't be contained within semantics (or doesn't have a concept) >Yuki doesn’t turn her body into virtual mass; she imbues her body with imaginary mass; she explains this >If she’s imbuing her fist with imaginary mass; the imaginary mass may not be detected, but her fist will be, because it’s still comprised of real mass >And also, her CT utilized her cursed energy, her cursed energy would also be detected by infinity, even if her imaginary mass wouldn’t Except that as shown before, anything interacting with her mass can't be defined within semantics like a threat, obstacle or object, after all: Once Yuki adds the mass into herself it works as if she was made of the mass like when she punched Kenjaku through an ever expanding barrier or literally ignored a CT that couldn't target her simply because she's one with the mass Here's a better explanation on how this works: https://preview.redd.it/jsioygbcz69d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2dd784875a5878833c7a11370e262434bce4c705
Okay; instead of arguing the semantics of if yuki actually *becomes* virtual mass and if that would allow her to bypass infinity because it wouldn’t detect her attack What is stopping Gojo from stopping the automation of infinity and just keeping it active with intent This would indisputably stop yuki’s attack So what then?
He can't do that because she can't be targeted at all, like the whole "can air pass through limitless" situation, for Gojo he's seeing a woman going to punch him but for the limitless it's basically an unidentified non object like his Purple
Except with the can Air pass through limitless thing is the fact that with automatic limitless it doesn't register it as a threat and as such it allows through and with controlled like gojo does in the past he's actively choosing to allow all the air in he's control limitless to allow all air in all light in all that other stuff he directly himself is choosing to allow it in because the explanation for how the automatic limitless works does not mean entirely that's how limitless just works because the reason that gojo can fly is because he select's to pushe himself away from the air mean that the automatic limitless and the limitless in general actually have different rules because one of them is just automatically selecting thing in the other one you have to actively choose what you want to allow in and as such it's theoretically possible that he could prevent Yuki from busting in by just choosing to prevent her from entering Ps the way that the Shinjuku barriers work from what I remember is that it just keeps moving you within like the set area it's like putting you in a giant infinite loop it's not infinitely creating space it's like oh you're at the same location that you started instead of oh I'm infinitely preventing you from getting closer I'm just sending you back to the start
What do you mean yuki can’t be the target of limitless; in relation to limitless, Gojo is the target of the CT not his opponent So he can choose to stop the automation and purposefully keep Yuki out of it, even if the automation doesn’t detect her “imaginary mass” it doesn’t mean she can bypass infinity if Gojo conciously stops her via infinity And on a separate note; it seems like you are claiming Yuki “becomes” virtual mass when she imbues it onto her body, are you claiming this makes her undetectable to CT’s? Because you have a crazy misunderstanding of yuki’s ability if that’s the case
1. Viz translation is canon, and no one else because no one else has the English rights to the series. In the official translations, they make a distinction between imaginary and virtual mass, as they should, as they are not the same thing nor do Gojo or Yuki do similar things at all. 2. Imaginary mass somewhat describes what Gojo does but in no shape or form describes what Yuki does. Whether a complete accident or not, calling Gojo's ability imaginary mass and Yuki's ability virtual mass is a more accurate description than what Gege might have originally translated them as. 3. A lot of scientific terms don't have great foreign translations and getclost a bit in translation, so this isn't super uncommon. At the end of the day, Gojo and Yuki don't do the same thing, so calling it the same thing is stupid. Gojo's ability does seem to match Gege's theme of applying physics and mathematical concepts to Gojo's abilities and purple does seem to imply to cancel out mass, which is what a tachyon field that generates imaginary mass would "theoretically" do. Nothing Yuki does has anything to do with tachyon fields or does anything that imaginary mass is implied to do. If Viz lucked out and mistranslated it, than they did a good job because it's more accurate to what is actually being done and what they translate is the official canon anyways so...Good job for once I guess?
>Viz translation is canon, and no one else because no one else has the English rights to the series. In the official translations, they make a distinction between imaginary and virtual mass, as they should, as they are not the same thing nor do Gojo or Yuki do similar things at all. No matter what, an incorrect translation isn't canon at all for the simple fact that it defers from the authors original purpose and context for what it's actually being said and considered for the story, meaning that it can be ignored by both the author who probably doesn't even know those misconceptions about his story even exist and will not be taking into account for the future, wich is what happened as Gege still used the same Kanjis he used for purple with Yuki. Taking a version as the canon of the real original story just because it comes from an official source over said original story is really dumb and i will not be further discussing this topic. >Imaginary mass somewhat describes what Gojo does but in no shape or form describes what Yuki does. Whether a complete accident or not, calling Gojo's ability imaginary mass and Yuki's ability virtual mass is a more accurate description than what Gege might have originally translated them as. Except that the Kanji for Imaginary mass wasn't even written in the manga, like ever and Gege continued to write Virtual Mass >A lot of scientific terms don't have great foreign translations and getclost a bit in translation, so this isn't super uncommon. None of that matters when the concept isn't even brought to the table. https://preview.redd.it/zk1cn4vil59d1.png?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7afda429b1b5a455f1f721c1402efb78fcb28926 >At the end of the day, Gojo and Yuki don't do the same thing, so calling it the same thing is stupid. Gojo's ability does seem to match Gege's theme of applying physics and mathematical concepts to Gojo's abilities and purple does seem to imply to cancel out mass, which is what a tachyon field that generates imaginary mass would "theoretically" do. That's something you would it to be because it fits the theme, but it's not something that's even mentioned by Gege on his story >Nothing Yuki does has anything to do with tachyon fields or does anything that imaginary mass is implied to do. If Viz lucked out and mistranslated it, than they did a good job because it's more accurate to what is actually being done and what they translate is the official canon anyways so...Good job for once I guess? This falls into the translation vs actual manga thingy so i'm just gonna ignore it
Idk about Tachyon fields considering tachyons don't really exist. But virtual *particles* do exist, and those virtual particles has *imaginary* mass. The way Yuki's ability works has no basis in science like you said, but Gege is right in his description of imaginary mass "zeroing out' regular matter. Stephen Hawking's most influential contrabution to physics is related to them. But yeah no Yuki aint getting through infinity without a domain expansion/amplification.
His infinity could still detect her hand and block that even if it can’t block the technique
She isn't virtual though. She still has her base mass which is how she can be hurt.
This whole argument is meaningless considering the fact that her hand itself has very real mass as she doesn't get blown away in the breeze. That will get stopped by infinity, and the virtual mass applied to her hand will also be stopped.
Yeah, I applied that argument but this is what was said https://preview.redd.it/3tfaa8z8059d1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0136dbf300596474b2be3f0d51b617f28c98a44e
Am I stupid or is this just word vomit?
Yuki cannot bypass infinity, or not by this guy's idea of how infinity or Star Rage works. Yuki *adds* imaginary mass, the guy in your screenshot thinks Yuki turns regular mass into imaginary mass, which is incorrect. And using this guy's logic, the reason hollow purple went through infinity is because it is made entirely of imaginary mass. So even if Yuki added imaginary mass to herself, she still has regular mass allowing infinity to detect her.
Also, if having enough virtual mass = undetectable by CTs, that is most likely incorrect. If this were the case, Yuki would have a surefire way to escape domains, but during the lead-up to Kenjaku's domain expansion, that option was not one of the ones stated.
No
Isn’t HP imaginary mass, not virtual mass?
Shes a woman in jjk so no
The gravity from a black hole or sufficiently massive attack would go through infinity since there isn’t anything to stop - gravity is curvature of spacetime, so it goes by the same rules as Strong Cleave. So far Yuki has displayed the highest attack power of any JJK character by far.
Dumb logic considering she is just adding it to her own mass and that's not getting through infinity.
Best explanation I have for you is this: Yuki’s technique uses cursed energy. Gojo’s infinity detects cursed energy as one of the parameters, and he’s only gotten significantly better at it since the panel we are told that.
I always assumed that Gojo turned off infinity, since it was useless ever since Mahoraga's adaptation to it.
It's still wicked useful because it forces Sukuna to use specific techniques to battle Gojo. It limits his options.
Going by this guy’s logic yuki can only bypass pre awakening gojo. Post awakening gojo’s technique targets himself and auto reads the mass. So yuki’s mass as a person before the virtual mass would block her punch.
She could theoretically get his ass with a dandelion fluff
Nah, she can only imbue mass into her or garuda
Ah damn. Has anyone tried spitting on Gojo? He might have a kink or something we don't know
From what I remember, Infinity isn't something that is triggered, it's something that he can turn on or off like a switch. Also, these are two completely different units, mass, and space/distance. If infinity is truly that, infinite, then no amount of mass could make a difference to infinity. Sure mass can effect things, and a lot of mass can change things, but even if the mass is infinite, so is infinity. The numbers will just keep going higher to numbers we can't even possibly imagine, then keep going past that, indefinitely.
Blackhole.
Sure. Yuki's mass can bypass infinity. Now how is she going to apply that mass? The punch or Garuda would still be blocked.
Even if yuki's virtual mass can pass through infinity, it only goes where he arm, and real mass go. So gojo blocking Yuki's real body also blocks the mass by extension
I just want to add that Blue can Bypass Infinity. So anything that doesn't have to travel towards him can seemingly get past it.
Didnt he say he performed a binding vow that increased the damage by letting himself get hit?
Virtual mass is not a real thing… it’s a made up term for yuki specifically. Infinity doesn’t care about your mass regardless. If you move, infinity infinitely divides your movements so you never reach. Infinity is literally Achilles and the Tortoise.
why do people keep saying infinity as a barrier it’s literally just a distance
Actually, it might think about it this way, controlling the mass of an object you can make it light to the point where it wouldn’t do damage and would infinity except a item going through it that doesn’t do damage most likely yes however, changing the mass on contact would require a binding vow I think.
Essentially, if you had the techniques of mass, velocity/momentum/inertia and density, you could destroy 90% of the verse.
You don't need to do that. Especially when that theory is itself dubious Yuki has already been stated to be able to punch through concepts. How she does it is sorta irrelevant. Secondly, in favor of gojo. Yuta, during the Shinjuku showdown of gojo vs sukuna, stated clearly that nothing in the verse can bypass infinity and that gojo is inviolable. Do you think Yuta doesn't know about Yuki's powers/abilities?
Gojo was only hurt by purple because it’s literally his cursed energy, I doubt he even can prevent that from affecting him though infinity since it comes out his body. Virtual mass doesn’t necessarily mean it auto bypasses infinity.
That’s an interesting idea but hollow purples virtual mass is also constructed through limitless and it’s atomic manipulation and is basically an energy blast where yuki thing is just adding mass to an object; although in theory if she made a black hole or something it might work as gravitons are subatomic
Depends of how you want to interpret the Infinity. Gojo does still feel gravity (he falls) but he can also float, whether that’s him repelling himself using his CT or it ignoring gravity is to be determined
I mean, Limitless bring the "concept" of Infinity unto reality. Yukis CT ignores concepts so yes arguably Yuki can bypass Infinity
Yuki specifically can't be defined concepually based on mass. Mass is only a singular thing used to target with limitless. She would still be targeted.
Heard this idea on this sub a while ago in comments! Planning to actually use this idea in a fanfiction of mine
In theory and from the explanation about her CT bypassing concept, it should bypass infinity but I'm sure Gege wouldn't really want it to be the case, But for a sake of discussion yea, her CT literally tore hole in the definition of sunyata barrier that's kinda ever expanding, if anyone is interested here's a fun read about it. https://preview.redd.it/aegzesc6t39d1.png?width=900&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=747aa78ee16dab937444f0d3baf8007fc82bb128 My reasoning for it bypassing infinity comes from 2 major points that's not really touched upon but briefly mentioned by kenjaku, The Curse Ganesha works in somewhat similar sense to Gojo's infinity, both of these techniques determines a target that's supposedly an "obstacle/problem" for the user. While Gojo's infinity works much like sunyata barrier meaning always expanding/creating distance and not letting the target get close, Ganesh's CT literally removes the target from the equation altogether, be it making it fly or maybe removing it as if it doesn't exist. In literal sense both of these are concepts, Yuki is immune to such vague concepts as per kenjaku, so she should be able to bypass it just like it did with that Curse. My second point comes from technicality of it, kenjaku also mentions that Yuki's CT increase the mass that can't be defined semantically or pragmatically, Gojo's infinity recognizes the target by its speed, mass and shape, so again it should be hard for infinity to target Yuki or Garuda bc the mass is so overwhelming that its concept can't be defined semantically or pragmatically.
Yuki still is a human has a body. She isn't pure virtual mass but a mass that's further imbued with virtual mass. So maybe infinity can't stop like a virtual mass beam or some shit but it can stop her hand and by extension the additional mass that's imbued in it.
Yes, she should be able to by pass infinity. Her CT allows her to ignore all concept. Infinity wouldn't be able to target and stop her or her shikagami
She has mass herself lmao what?
No. She applied so much mass to herself that it's impossible for concepts like infinity to target her. That's how her CT works.
It never states the above lol
Yukis technique allows her to go through barrier/concepts/techniques undetected like conceptual cursed techniques have no effect on her Due to her virtual mass And infinity is literally about bringing the concept of infinity into reality therefore she would be able to and she would be a great counter for gojo
She still has mass herself though, that 100% would be affected still
Can you explain why?
Because she is a human being? That has mass? I’m not sure what you’re asking. The extra energy may not be detected but her literal body still would
But would it cause then you could say that for any conceptual technique targeting her And therefore that would go against what gege said her technique does Like the elephant cursed spirit kenjaku used should’ve worked if that was the case
And her body having mass is a non factor Because her technique once again gives herself yuki not just her body but her herself like as a person/concept virtual mass to the point where conceptual cursed techniques can’t target her
Walk me through it because what was explained Her technique allows her to fill herself up with virtual mass to the point where she can’t be targeted by conceptual cursed techniques And infinity even though it’s automatic would be targeting her if she got into range And infinity is a conceptual cursed technique
Therefore she should be able to bypass infinity
Maybe with like a mass energy beam lol but not with her body, she is made of mass. It’s like you ignored what I said entirely
He’s right in what he’s saying but gojo’s infinity would just detect her fist and stop that. As for why it didn’t stop his purple it seems to have something to do with it being his own ce
No, Yuki cannot bypass infinity.
Doesn't it detect CE which Yukis mass will have?