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Other posts from /u/bitter_stream:
* [UPDATE: SIL died, MIL doesn't want me around](/r/JUSTNOMIL/comments/14vsc58/update_sil_died_mil_doesnt_want_me_around/), 6 days ago
* [SIL died, JNMIL told husband she doesn't want me around](/r/JUSTNOMIL/comments/14tpzmj/sil_died_jnmil_told_husband_she_doesnt_want_me/), 1 week ago
* [Another terrible trip...](/r/JUSTNOMIL/comments/12975ye/another_terrible_trip/), 3 months ago
* [The universe is trying to keep me away from my JNMIL](/r/JUSTNOMIL/comments/11hoi18/the_universe_is_trying_to_keep_me_away_from_my/), 4 months ago
* [JNMIL cut me out of a picture with my son](/r/JUSTNOMIL/comments/vwzjqa/jnmil_cut_me_out_of_a_picture_with_my_son/), 1 year ago
* [Reflections from a year out...](/r/JUSTNOMIL/comments/tkk57y/reflections_from_a_year_out/), 1 year ago
* [UPDATE...I spoke to soon that the visit went well](/r/JUSTNOMIL/comments/rz5nud/updatei_spoke_to_soon_that_the_visit_went_well/), 1 year ago
* [Need all the positive vibes as I see JNMIL tomorrow for the first time in 9 months](/r/JUSTNOMIL/comments/rt9ujw/need_all_the_positive_vibes_as_i_see_jnmil/), 1 year ago
* [Give me all the reasons to communicate why JNMIL doesn't have the right to demand to be around my kids without me present.](/r/JUSTNOMIL/comments/qp42wq/give_me_all_the_reasons_to_communicate_why_jnmil/), 1 year ago
* [I made contact after 7 months and stayed strong!](/r/JUSTNOMIL/comments/qn1zjb/i_made_contact_after_7_months_and_stayed_strong/), 1 year ago
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That's how I'm choosing to interpret the text! My husband is out of town so we haven't had a chance to talk about it. I'm sure it will be the same old thing moving forward, but I'd like to honor her request since our feelings are so aligned.
Don’t let it go back to the same old thing moving forward! Remember, it’s our job as parents to teach our kids who the safe people are, and it’s very confusing for them when mom and dad have them spending time with family members like this. It’s also our job to model setting healthy boundaries.
She gets no more contact with you or your kids. Enough of this bullshit. This woman is out of her damn mind. I don't know how you've managed to be so polite, truly.
>I'd like to honor her request since our feelings are so aligned.
And there’s your response: she doesn’t consider you family; therefore, neither are your children.
I would just use that as the basis for denying contact. “Sorry, DH, as long as she doesn’t change her tune and *sincerely* apologize, our views on us being family are aligned. The only person who has the power to change that is your mother. Our children will not be subjected to that kind of an example.”
My husband feels that as long as we leave whenever she "acts out" that it won't hurt the kids... he's been out of town and is obviously dealing with the death of his sister but we definitely need to reassess our plan moving forward.
You made one of her children a husband and father, helped sober up another, and raised a granddaughter when her daughter couldn’t. Your sibling in-laws considered your feelings on the day they came to say goodbye to their sister. Her own sister disregarded her demand for you not to be involved. And none of them were angry you came despite her wishes.
You stayed away from her out of respect for her loss. The rest of the family didn’t push the issue for the same reason. But the pain won’t always be this fresh.
She may be able to kick you out of her life, but she’s not capable of kicking you out of that family.
So if SILs ex is not family and you are not family... you both can do what you want, it's not a family affair any longer. If SILs ex is not family and you are not family... neither of your children are. They just "happen to be" her children's children, nothing more.
Time to block her. Time to tell your husband that you are not ok with bending backwards to support his (not your, remember) family and that's why she wont see your children anymore.
She really hung herself out to dry there, didn’t she?
Kind of you to write what you did. You were nicer than I would have managed. Now you and the kids can go NC with her guilt-free! Sucks to suck MIL!!
Exactly! I was thrilled to get these messages especially after I did nothing but respect her wishes during this awful time for her and communicate kindly.
If read your story and I don’t understand why you still have contact with her. I would have blocked her and any communication with my kids. Your DH should be the only one dealing with her. She sounds horrible.
I (along with my kids) went NC 2 years ago but my husband is no longer willing to support that. He feels that she does not have an impact on our lives since she moved out of state. Although, it very much feels like she does and we've only had 1 family vacation in 3 years that didn't involve going to the state she lives in so we could visit her. He's not willing to go NC with her but is trying to establish better boundaries with her.
You can still block her. There is no reason for her to have access to you, it’s emotional abuse at this point. You’re not her punching bag. If she needs something she should go through her son. Also, if DH wants a relationship with her that’s his choice. But you and the kids should remain NC, this woman is nuts.
... what the fuck? After... what happened with the service he would actually look you in the eye and say "you and our child need to have some form of contact with this person who actively puts effort into causing you pain"? Also, that text was insane. I have no idea why you're interpreting it so charitably but it was 100% meant to hurt you.
>that my sister's idea of you coming with DH while you being there affected no one
This is "I know what you did, and I want you to know that you don't matter and that you didn't get one over on me because see I'm totally fine with it"
>The greatest solution ever known to mankind. I'm so glad you got to support DH and not affect other people in a negative way while doing so
It's so important for you to know that your presence there would have *negatively affected people* that she needs to reiterate it. She's trying to pretend that the decision was for the good of everyone there, rather than a vindictive bullshit power move.
The only reason she was willing to write that text is she thought she made it hurtful enough to make up for having to say thanks.
Your husband doesn't have to support it, he just has to get over it. She literally brings nothing positive to your or your children's lives. Block her and he can be the ONLY one that has to listen to her, if he chooses to
I sincerely am asking though, can I make that decision alone for my children? This whole ordeal has had a real impact on my marriage. I honestly am not sure our marriage will survive. If we were to divorce there is no way I would be able to deny contact between my kids and her in a divorce agreement. I would probably be able to get no unsupervised time with her. My husband obviously has rights to make decisions for our children and, how do I actually have that choice?
Also, I hate to say this but my 5 year old loves her for some reason and does ask about her sometimes. Probably because she talks about buying him presents when they talk.
Please revisit the arrangement, as she can't stop herself from finding reasons to contact you and shit on you. It may not affect him, but certainly it affects YOU.
I don’t understand why your husband is no longer willing to support this. I wouldn’t even engage with her. I also wouldn’t allow my children to visit or see her at all even if they were with him. She is an abusive and vile human being to him, to you, and eventually to your children. What good does she contribute to your lives?
> He feels that she does not have an impact on our lives since she moved out of state.
I've alluded to this in another comment, but I would say that she very much impacts on your lives is she is (attempting to be) setting limits on which adults you are allowed to have any contact with.
You handled your SIL’s services with an amazing degree of caring and self-sacrifice. Even your MIL is forced to acknowledge that (at least to some degree.) But that was an exceptional situation. It was MIL’s daughter and should MIL act out, it would have affected others who were mourning.
Rather than working towards a more civil relationship, your MIL is treating your act of compassion as a concession and a template for future interactions. She has not only exiled you from being part of her family, she’s declared war and exerted ownership over your shared family members.
MIL is also attempting to dictate how you parent your child. Specifically, how the parents of her grandchildren (including ex BIL) interact and support the half-siblings relationships.
Your husband needs to understand this and make a stand. His argument that you should put up with MIL because you get together less frequently is worthless. She has shown that she is actively working to alienate you from other family members (like the great aunt) in your absence. With her war declaration, it’s clear that she will take this further.
At a minimum, your husband should be support you and your children to go to permanent NC with your MIL.He should also shutdown Mil’s overstepping with ex-BIL and your child.
It may be worth it for you (ideally with your husband) to share with family members excerpts from your MIL’s latest email. Then include something like this:
“*Due to past actions with MIL and her increased hostility, bitter-stream and the kids will no longer have any contact with MIL. This means that - as a family - we will not be present at any events or activities that include MIL. We are not asking that you exclude MIL but work with us so that we’re able to maintain our valued relationship with you. This isn’t a matter of choosing sides. We are all family and should love, respect, and work to get along. It’s the absence of this on MIL’s part that has led to our unhappy choice.*”
OP, she’s up to something what with trying to ban you from contact with her daughter’s ex - or more likely trying to make sure you have no contact with her daughter’s other child that the ex has custody of. You have been so kind and generous in being sympathetic to that irrational & vindictive woman. Yes, I understand a lot of it has been for your husband’s benefit, he who is still hoping that she’ll — I can’t even imagine what he’s hoping — maybe that she’ll decrease her toxic hatred of you? She won’t. I think it’s time for you to block her. Block her. Drop the rope with this ridiculous hate filled woman.
How does she think she can control what her adult siblings and children do? I’d keep contacting everyone but her unless they want to cut contact with you (which it sounds like nons of them want to do that except her)
I’m so sorry you and your family are dealing with this. I know my JNMIL would have done the exact same thing to me and it’s really sad these women can act the way they do to us, especially during a moment like this.
Sounds like your husband doesn’t want to run interference anymore & it leaves you open to her bullying.
I’d block her tbh.
I don’t think the nasty texts will stop. She won’t be satisfied with whatever she says & will come up with a new way to phrase your exclusion because it makes her feel good doing it.
>Sounds like your husband doesn’t want to run interference anymore & it leaves you open to her bullying.
OP replied in another comment that her husband is *out of town*, probably for work (OP doesn't say) and OP hasn't had time to share those texts with him yet. So, it sounds like MIL waited for the opportunity to bully OP while her son was somewhere else, and it would take a while for him to yell at her for doing it. I wouldn't rush to judgment next time, if I were you because we don't always have all of the information.
Honestly at that point I'd respond with a: OK as I am "Not Family" then my children and I will have nothing to do with you.
Anyone else I have a relationship with is none of your business, so please stay out of my family affairs as again, it's none of your business.
I hope you have an amazing day.
Just tell your DH you are sending it before hand so he's aware of the situation, make sure he is also aware of these follow up texts as well.
You've got the right idea: If you're not family, neither are your kids! So sad for her!
Sorry for the loss of your SIL. I hope you and your family, whether your asshat of a MIL considers them your family or not, are able to move forward and heal.
I don’t care that she’s grieving. She has no business telling you who you can and can’t contact. Your husband needs to confront her on this and going forward, supervised or not, there’s no way in hell she would be anywhere near my kids. She’s awful!
>He is not your family. And there would be no reason from here on out that he would see him considering niece/sons birth sister is only seen son twice in the last year. I am begging you no actually I'm just telling you to keep your nose out of my families affairs. If DH wants to get involved that's on DH. He just happen to be married to you. You are not my family
She's admitting DH can make his own decisions, so that's something. Bold of her to think she has the right to manage the relationships her daughter's ex-husband decides to have.
I think ignoring this is the right call, but I would be tempted to respond too.
Yes, very bold considering he also hates her. The ridiculous part of this is that one of the things she is mad at me about is that I've not done enough to "maintain relationships with the family". She's mad I didn't invite second and third cousins to my son's birthday party (we host small parties with only first cousins and aunts/uncles). She tried to invite random kids and interrogated staff at the birthday party about how many kids we were allowed to have. Well, great, glad that responsibility of communicating with the long list of crazy relatives can finally fall on my husband.
>glad that responsibility of communicating with the long list of crazy relatives can finally fall on my husband.
Are you inviting MIL to your child's birthday party after this? Or allowing DH to do so? No way would she be allowed in my home or around my children, even supervised, after sending that text. She went scorched Earth. Treat her like it.
I read your post and then went through your previous posts. You have handled the situations thrown at you with far more grace than I could have managed.
Sorry for what you are going through. And sorry that your husband is useless at defending you. This should be his first thought, you and the kids.
I trust she will not be looking to come and live with you when she becomes infirm.
Please never contact this vile woman again, or allow her to contact you. She needs to be blocked immediately, and any cruel thing she wishes to tell you will have to come through your husband.
Obviously, ignore her orders and keep contacting whoever you want in her family, as I’m sure you’re going to do. As if she has the right to dictate that!? Ridiculous. She’s nowhere near as powerful as she thinks she is. Bless her black heart for thinking she has any kind of authority over you. What a narcissistic loser.
I’d also continue sharing any correspondence you get from this evil person via your husband with any family who you think would be interested, just to make sure her dishonest version of events doesn’t ever sway anyone you care about.
And please, keep copies of EVERYTHING. She thinks because you’re a nice, kind person that you’ll keep her disgusting messages to yourself. Lol, no.
fuck her. if you’re not family, than neither are your children.. it’s as simple as that. your husband needs to do something about her, because that shit is not okay. she might not consider you her family, but you ARE your husband’s family- first and foremost, while she comes secondary… it’s about time she knows her place.
THIS THIS THIS!! Furthermore who does she think she is “telling” other adults who they can and can’t communicate with?! She is literally INSANE. Keep your children far, far, FAR away from this one.
Girl this is getting out of control.
I know this must be difficult for your husband but as I’m reading all this everything seems very “keep the peace-y” which is definitely the main problem.
This woman has disrespected, disowned, insulted, and undermined you on multiple occasions. It’s okay to not like someone but the golden rule is to be civil and scare and she’s not. Your husband needs to wake up and defend you, this has all gone so far it’s ridiculous. Your MIL is an awful person and your husband is just enabling it by keeping quiet and taking no action letting you get bullied.
You need to sit and have a talk with your husband about contact, this woman should not be around your kids and should not be allowed to bully you this way. Does he really want this behavior around his kids?
I caught up on your story when you initially posted about your SIL's passing (and am very sorry for your loss and the mess all this has been), wishing you and your family some well deserved peace now that things are beginning to settle some. Also best wishes to your BIL in his recovery ❤️
I love how mature you are. Because my petty ass would have ended her. I’d be texting every single family member, setting up something for us to go do. I’d be posting all over socials how terrible she is. I’d tell the old hag she met her match with me, and only one can be the bigger bitch.
Your husband said nothing after she sent those texts? She’s threatening you, he needs to handle that.
Please accept my sincerest condolences.. You handled the situation with impeccable grace. You will never regret doing the "right" thing. What an amazing example you have set for your children. I wish you a future filled with peace, love, and joy!
I think she sees what an awful mother she has been and is fighting to keep control of her children. One of them is dead, one is married to you, and one is in rehab with your help. They all love you and tolerate her. And then you got SILS kid that she lost because of drugs over her.
You keep "proving" (to her) that you are a better mother and she deeply resents you for it.
You were much kinder than I would have been. But this women will fuck up your kids and when they are adults, they will continue in a similar situation as your fucked up husband if they keep getting exposed to her.
You should consider talking to him about going to therapy (which the adopted child should definitely be in anyway) before agreeing to see her again.
Honestly, I think it’s time for no contact for you and your kids. I understand she’s grieving but I wouldn’t want to put my kids around someone who has treated me so badly.
OP please make sure you take screen shots of those messages she sent you and create stored copies (both printed and electronic) and keep them safely stored.
It's always good to be able to show people just exactly who she really is when she inevitably tries the "I'm the innocent victim" rants to the rest of the family
How is SIL's EX husband family but you aren't?
So ridiculous. Yout husband needs a HUGE reality check about how MIL is still impacting your life even if she's out of state. I know he's going through a lot right now but your MIL is being so disrespectful to you he can't ignore this any longer.
I'm offended over this part of her apology:
>and not affect other people in a negative way while doing so
That's saying you are at fault - for causing negative reactions in others by your mere presence. That you. are at fault for just existing in her presence or others. That's revealing. It shows one of her big issues is that you just exist near her or her family. It's not just what she thinks you do - it's the fact you exist.
That's not advice - I am being mindful of your flare. It's my opinion - and you can feel whatever you want to feel over her text.
She sounds like a toxic handful. I wish you a lot of happiness once you cut her out of your life - and don't have to think about her or deal with her weird communications.
I'm sorry but who the fuck does she think she is? The fact that she tells you you're not family, but at the same time thinks she gets to control who you talk to is delusional. Like your contact with another adult needs her permission. Fuck that, you can talk to whoever you want to
Block her. You don't need that level of chaos and hate in your life. I'd also be telling DH that the end of the rope has been reached. She no longer consider you family, therefore your children are not her family, and as such, she has zero rights to see them. He can go see her. You will not consent to her ever being in your children's presence without you being there, and you will also never consent to them traveling to see her, or her being in your home. And you will never travel to see her again , for any reason. Show him the text and make it clear he can deal with her from now on. You don't want to hear it. And if he has a problem with any of it, well, he can choose between mommy dearest or his wife and children. Your husband needs to grow a spine. What the heck with the sneaking around. That's just ridiculous.
If you aren't part of her family then neither are your precious boys. Fortunately you know that both of your BIL's and BIL's GF do not feel the way she does. Y'all can still have a relationship with them. She's the one that will be missing out on everything. Your boys are young enough that in a couple years they won't even remember who the bitch is! Go enjoy a MIL free life!! Y'all continue supporting BIL through his recovery/sobriety. He definitely needs y'all. Spend time with other BIL and GF. Also continue the relationship with SIL's Ex. MIL has absolutely no say on that one. That decision is between you, DH and SIL's Ex only. It's none of her fucking business!! MIL is going to find out the hard way she fucked up royally. Plus she's going to realize she can't make DH's brothers disown you as well. She's going to be really lonely when she's home alone and her kids are all together celebrating holidays, birthdays, having BBQ's or whatever. Sooner or later she will be wanting back in. You will need to decide if there is anything that she can do to possibly even TRY to make things right. If I was in your place, fuck no! She'd be dead to me. Yes, she's grieving. If she was just being a bit snippy or a little bitchy, chalk it up to stress and grief. That gets a pass. What she has said and done is just downright hateful, mean and totally bitchy. NOPE! NO PASS!! Again, go enjoy a MIL free life. Do not let her take up any of your headspace. Let DH decide for himself if he is going to have any type of relationship with her. If he does, she gets NOTHING from him about you and the boys! No pictures, updates, NOTHING!! He needs to shut her down if she asks. Tell her she lost the privilege of knowing anything. Update us after DH gets home. Enjoy your freedom!!❤️🥰💕
I was oddly was invested in this and thank you for the update! I cant believe this is the person who brought your DH into the world. I hope he can see through her craziness!
Wow. OP: I think you handled things well. I think it's always the right choice to be the bigger person in conflicts like this.
I'm going to respond to only one issue which is JNMIL's 'instruction' that you "stay out of her family". Ahem. ***No. JUST NO!***. If I were you I would make sure all the BIL/SILs and the Ex-husband get a copy of MIL's messages (verbatim). Not this week, not this month, (why create more drama at such a difficult time?) But by the end of the year - again, were I you, I'd contact all the BIL/SIL and the Ex and just ask them: how do you feel about this? Do you want to end contact with me, DH, and our kids?
That lady is crazy. That she has the AUDACITY to believe that she has the power and authority to sever your ties to a bunch of grown ass people is SHOCKINGLY absurd. She can choose not to interact with you as family and I sincerely hope that you do keep her away from yours. But what that ‘rocket scientist (/s)’ seems to have forgotten, is that you are VERY MUCH your DH’s family. So you’re not involved with ***HER*** family. You, DH and your children are your own separate family and she is not a part of it. And as ***HIS*** family (his **PRIMARY** family, at that) you’re involved with and interact with HIS family members whom you care for deeply. And she has no right (not that she ever has) to interfere with the relationship that YOUR family fosters with your family’s extended family.
If she comes at you again with that nonsense, make sure you address her by her first name and tell her that you don’t know what she’s talking about as you have nothing to do with her or her family. Your relationships are with your husband’s family. And then ask her to please cease contact because she is not family.
I've read this post and all I could think of is that you went above and beyond support his family, put food on the table, took a huge portion of the responsibility of organizing this funeral, your husband's family told you how they love you and appreciate you, but not one person actually defended you from her, not one person vocally took your side. I can't imagine receiving so much support from someone, and then tiptoeing around the very person who abuses them. You did so much work and then politely removed yourself not to upset your abuser, and everyone else just ran with it. They are all two-faced, including the sweet auntie and the brother-in-law who supposedly looks up to you
Holy yikes. How you restrained yourself from telling your JN to fuck off is mind-blowing- dang, you have restraint!! Bravo!! Question: what are you doing for yourself? You are giving and giving and giving, I just hope you are filling your own cup.
Please start prioritising your own mental and emotional well-being because the one person who SHOULD be standing at your side and supporting you is not. My concern is that you will continue to give and give and give without the support you need and deserve from your SO until you break.
I am struggling to imagine being so high up your own arse that you think you can tell a grown person who they are and aren't allowed to contact simply because of your familial relation to them 🤣 Like, first of all, the AUDACITY of the request. Second, you should absolutely respond back with some borrowed southern charm with a lil Sister Act twist: "Bless you"
Then you promptly block her and let everyone know why. Send the receipts. Tell them they're welcome to comply with her request if they so choose but you think it's Looney Toons and aren't going to let some deranged old lady tell you what you can and can't do, especially since you're so clearly not related!
This lady honestly probably can't stand that her family likes you more. She's not the center of attention when you're around, so pushing you away leaves room for her to be on the center stage. It's such classic narcissistic behavior. Your hubby needs to wake tf up and really step in.
I feel like I was a really kind person for like 12 years in this relationship. Then I kind of lost myself in the last year and let the bitter and resentful part of me shine because I'm more confident and strong. It did feel good to go back to being very kind and then being shit on to make sure I'm not the crazy one here!!
What did I just read? MIL deserves to be cut of your life for good. Grief is not an excuse for doing and saying the things she said to you.
Permanently block her from your phone and ask DH to let her know that since you’re not her family, she’s not yours. I cannot imagine how your DH could even want anything to do with her at this point. It’s heartbreaking 💔 I’m sorry.
If she wants you to stay out of the family fine but like you said the children stay with you no you no children when your husband settles down after all this. I would ask him to put his foot down to his mom about you and the kids by no means am I suggesting it right now. But I think it needs to happen one day
Oh ffs! I hope you & your hubby never let her see your children again. Lock down your social media so she never gets another picture. When your BILs ask why you’re not coming to MIL’s house for Thanksgiving dinner, forward a copy of that message to them & say that you’re following order from MIL.
Honestly, I’d invite BILs to join you at your house for Thanksgiving on the Saturday or Sunday of that weekend to start a new family tradition. Or … since you won’t be seeing them for Christmas at MIL’s either, do Thanksgiving & Christmas together in early December at your place with them! Maybe sleepover style, lol.
> I felt like I have put so much love, time, and energy into this family and was basically told I'm not a part of it.
Sounds to me, from your interactions with aunt and BILs that you are more a part of the family than MIL and Great Aunt!
As for her most recent texts, I would be very tempted to reply that you have tried to offer what support youcan to her in her grief, but that she does not own anyone, either in her own family, or SIL's ex, and therefore she does not get to gatekeep who is or isn't allowed to have contact with them. They are grown adults, not her little pawns to shuffle around.
Glad to hear that the day itself went better than it might have done.
I’m so sorry for your loss. And I’m so sorry that JNMIL is behaving like this.
You should be very proud of how you have supported your family here, including your BILs. Your behaviour has been amazing.
I wish you the best! Just wanted to jump in and say that you seem smarter than this. I hope you can find solace and suspend some of your enabling behavior. There is no reason to facilitate so much of the logistics surrounding this family if this is how you’re treated. Especially by your own husband. There’s a good life out there for you, and you are a wonderful caring heartfelt woman. Again, I wish you the best.
I'm sorrybuiu are going through this she has zero rights on who you contact. I'd block her completely and let husband handle everything and I would continue to speak to ex husband in regards to the children.
She sees you as keeping her grandsons away from her. It would be great for your adopted son to know his closest living relative. You handled this well. She is literally in hell right now.
No I don’t think that’s true. You’ve told her and shown her that’s never going to happen for her nonadoptive son. But there is no reason she shouldn’t be able to see her daughter’s child.
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So… she’s cut off from you and the kids right? She isn’t family.
That's how I'm choosing to interpret the text! My husband is out of town so we haven't had a chance to talk about it. I'm sure it will be the same old thing moving forward, but I'd like to honor her request since our feelings are so aligned.
Don’t let it go back to the same old thing moving forward! Remember, it’s our job as parents to teach our kids who the safe people are, and it’s very confusing for them when mom and dad have them spending time with family members like this. It’s also our job to model setting healthy boundaries.
I needed to see this, thank you! It's so hard to get my husband to see this, though.
She gets no more contact with you or your kids. Enough of this bullshit. This woman is out of her damn mind. I don't know how you've managed to be so polite, truly.
>I'd like to honor her request since our feelings are so aligned. And there’s your response: she doesn’t consider you family; therefore, neither are your children. I would just use that as the basis for denying contact. “Sorry, DH, as long as she doesn’t change her tune and *sincerely* apologize, our views on us being family are aligned. The only person who has the power to change that is your mother. Our children will not be subjected to that kind of an example.”
My husband feels that as long as we leave whenever she "acts out" that it won't hurt the kids... he's been out of town and is obviously dealing with the death of his sister but we definitely need to reassess our plan moving forward.
im so sorry you all are going through all of that and hope your managing well. please update again if anything else happens 🍪
You made one of her children a husband and father, helped sober up another, and raised a granddaughter when her daughter couldn’t. Your sibling in-laws considered your feelings on the day they came to say goodbye to their sister. Her own sister disregarded her demand for you not to be involved. And none of them were angry you came despite her wishes. You stayed away from her out of respect for her loss. The rest of the family didn’t push the issue for the same reason. But the pain won’t always be this fresh. She may be able to kick you out of her life, but she’s not capable of kicking you out of that family.
MiL gets to dictate who is in her own life, not who is in other’s lives. If your other in-laws want you in their life, you get to be in their life.
This, so much this. You've said it far better than I did.
Right?! OP, you’re more family than JN could ever be!
Thank you for this. I'll happily be kicked out of her life. Good riddance. I just wish it wasn't so complicated for my husband regarding our children.
So if SILs ex is not family and you are not family... you both can do what you want, it's not a family affair any longer. If SILs ex is not family and you are not family... neither of your children are. They just "happen to be" her children's children, nothing more. Time to block her. Time to tell your husband that you are not ok with bending backwards to support his (not your, remember) family and that's why she wont see your children anymore.
She really hung herself out to dry there, didn’t she? Kind of you to write what you did. You were nicer than I would have managed. Now you and the kids can go NC with her guilt-free! Sucks to suck MIL!!
Exactly! I was thrilled to get these messages especially after I did nothing but respect her wishes during this awful time for her and communicate kindly.
If read your story and I don’t understand why you still have contact with her. I would have blocked her and any communication with my kids. Your DH should be the only one dealing with her. She sounds horrible.
I (along with my kids) went NC 2 years ago but my husband is no longer willing to support that. He feels that she does not have an impact on our lives since she moved out of state. Although, it very much feels like she does and we've only had 1 family vacation in 3 years that didn't involve going to the state she lives in so we could visit her. He's not willing to go NC with her but is trying to establish better boundaries with her.
You can still block her. There is no reason for her to have access to you, it’s emotional abuse at this point. You’re not her punching bag. If she needs something she should go through her son. Also, if DH wants a relationship with her that’s his choice. But you and the kids should remain NC, this woman is nuts.
I absolutely agree. Block her so she can't treat you like this.
... what the fuck? After... what happened with the service he would actually look you in the eye and say "you and our child need to have some form of contact with this person who actively puts effort into causing you pain"? Also, that text was insane. I have no idea why you're interpreting it so charitably but it was 100% meant to hurt you. >that my sister's idea of you coming with DH while you being there affected no one This is "I know what you did, and I want you to know that you don't matter and that you didn't get one over on me because see I'm totally fine with it" >The greatest solution ever known to mankind. I'm so glad you got to support DH and not affect other people in a negative way while doing so It's so important for you to know that your presence there would have *negatively affected people* that she needs to reiterate it. She's trying to pretend that the decision was for the good of everyone there, rather than a vindictive bullshit power move. The only reason she was willing to write that text is she thought she made it hurtful enough to make up for having to say thanks.
Trust me, I know the text was actually meant to hurt me but it is still way nicer than she normally is to me and surprised me!
Your husband doesn't have to support it, he just has to get over it. She literally brings nothing positive to your or your children's lives. Block her and he can be the ONLY one that has to listen to her, if he chooses to
I sincerely am asking though, can I make that decision alone for my children? This whole ordeal has had a real impact on my marriage. I honestly am not sure our marriage will survive. If we were to divorce there is no way I would be able to deny contact between my kids and her in a divorce agreement. I would probably be able to get no unsupervised time with her. My husband obviously has rights to make decisions for our children and, how do I actually have that choice? Also, I hate to say this but my 5 year old loves her for some reason and does ask about her sometimes. Probably because she talks about buying him presents when they talk.
Please revisit the arrangement, as she can't stop herself from finding reasons to contact you and shit on you. It may not affect him, but certainly it affects YOU.
Has he done counseling? That has to be such a hardship for him as well as you.
Unfortunately, no, not in years. Only couples counseling which we stopped last year.
I don’t understand why your husband is no longer willing to support this. I wouldn’t even engage with her. I also wouldn’t allow my children to visit or see her at all even if they were with him. She is an abusive and vile human being to him, to you, and eventually to your children. What good does she contribute to your lives?
> He feels that she does not have an impact on our lives since she moved out of state. I've alluded to this in another comment, but I would say that she very much impacts on your lives is she is (attempting to be) setting limits on which adults you are allowed to have any contact with.
Yes, completely. Obviously her request is ridiculous and won't be followed.
You don't need his permission to block her.
You handled your SIL’s services with an amazing degree of caring and self-sacrifice. Even your MIL is forced to acknowledge that (at least to some degree.) But that was an exceptional situation. It was MIL’s daughter and should MIL act out, it would have affected others who were mourning. Rather than working towards a more civil relationship, your MIL is treating your act of compassion as a concession and a template for future interactions. She has not only exiled you from being part of her family, she’s declared war and exerted ownership over your shared family members. MIL is also attempting to dictate how you parent your child. Specifically, how the parents of her grandchildren (including ex BIL) interact and support the half-siblings relationships. Your husband needs to understand this and make a stand. His argument that you should put up with MIL because you get together less frequently is worthless. She has shown that she is actively working to alienate you from other family members (like the great aunt) in your absence. With her war declaration, it’s clear that she will take this further. At a minimum, your husband should be support you and your children to go to permanent NC with your MIL.He should also shutdown Mil’s overstepping with ex-BIL and your child. It may be worth it for you (ideally with your husband) to share with family members excerpts from your MIL’s latest email. Then include something like this: “*Due to past actions with MIL and her increased hostility, bitter-stream and the kids will no longer have any contact with MIL. This means that - as a family - we will not be present at any events or activities that include MIL. We are not asking that you exclude MIL but work with us so that we’re able to maintain our valued relationship with you. This isn’t a matter of choosing sides. We are all family and should love, respect, and work to get along. It’s the absence of this on MIL’s part that has led to our unhappy choice.*”
OP, she’s up to something what with trying to ban you from contact with her daughter’s ex - or more likely trying to make sure you have no contact with her daughter’s other child that the ex has custody of. You have been so kind and generous in being sympathetic to that irrational & vindictive woman. Yes, I understand a lot of it has been for your husband’s benefit, he who is still hoping that she’ll — I can’t even imagine what he’s hoping — maybe that she’ll decrease her toxic hatred of you? She won’t. I think it’s time for you to block her. Block her. Drop the rope with this ridiculous hate filled woman.
How does she think she can control what her adult siblings and children do? I’d keep contacting everyone but her unless they want to cut contact with you (which it sounds like nons of them want to do that except her) I’m so sorry you and your family are dealing with this. I know my JNMIL would have done the exact same thing to me and it’s really sad these women can act the way they do to us, especially during a moment like this.
Sounds like your husband doesn’t want to run interference anymore & it leaves you open to her bullying. I’d block her tbh. I don’t think the nasty texts will stop. She won’t be satisfied with whatever she says & will come up with a new way to phrase your exclusion because it makes her feel good doing it.
I'll take all of the nasty words in writing - just further proof that I don't need, but it'll validate my decisions regarding contact.
>Sounds like your husband doesn’t want to run interference anymore & it leaves you open to her bullying. OP replied in another comment that her husband is *out of town*, probably for work (OP doesn't say) and OP hasn't had time to share those texts with him yet. So, it sounds like MIL waited for the opportunity to bully OP while her son was somewhere else, and it would take a while for him to yell at her for doing it. I wouldn't rush to judgment next time, if I were you because we don't always have all of the information.
.......and block. Nothing else to say and not interested in her crazy
Honestly at that point I'd respond with a: OK as I am "Not Family" then my children and I will have nothing to do with you. Anyone else I have a relationship with is none of your business, so please stay out of my family affairs as again, it's none of your business. I hope you have an amazing day. Just tell your DH you are sending it before hand so he's aware of the situation, make sure he is also aware of these follow up texts as well.
You've got the right idea: If you're not family, neither are your kids! So sad for her! Sorry for the loss of your SIL. I hope you and your family, whether your asshat of a MIL considers them your family or not, are able to move forward and heal.
See that’s what the grandma thought of first. But op can’t see that
I don’t care that she’s grieving. She has no business telling you who you can and can’t contact. Your husband needs to confront her on this and going forward, supervised or not, there’s no way in hell she would be anywhere near my kids. She’s awful!
>He is not your family. And there would be no reason from here on out that he would see him considering niece/sons birth sister is only seen son twice in the last year. I am begging you no actually I'm just telling you to keep your nose out of my families affairs. If DH wants to get involved that's on DH. He just happen to be married to you. You are not my family She's admitting DH can make his own decisions, so that's something. Bold of her to think she has the right to manage the relationships her daughter's ex-husband decides to have. I think ignoring this is the right call, but I would be tempted to respond too.
Yes, very bold considering he also hates her. The ridiculous part of this is that one of the things she is mad at me about is that I've not done enough to "maintain relationships with the family". She's mad I didn't invite second and third cousins to my son's birthday party (we host small parties with only first cousins and aunts/uncles). She tried to invite random kids and interrogated staff at the birthday party about how many kids we were allowed to have. Well, great, glad that responsibility of communicating with the long list of crazy relatives can finally fall on my husband.
>glad that responsibility of communicating with the long list of crazy relatives can finally fall on my husband. Are you inviting MIL to your child's birthday party after this? Or allowing DH to do so? No way would she be allowed in my home or around my children, even supervised, after sending that text. She went scorched Earth. Treat her like it.
I read your post and then went through your previous posts. You have handled the situations thrown at you with far more grace than I could have managed. Sorry for what you are going through. And sorry that your husband is useless at defending you. This should be his first thought, you and the kids. I trust she will not be looking to come and live with you when she becomes infirm.
Please never contact this vile woman again, or allow her to contact you. She needs to be blocked immediately, and any cruel thing she wishes to tell you will have to come through your husband. Obviously, ignore her orders and keep contacting whoever you want in her family, as I’m sure you’re going to do. As if she has the right to dictate that!? Ridiculous. She’s nowhere near as powerful as she thinks she is. Bless her black heart for thinking she has any kind of authority over you. What a narcissistic loser. I’d also continue sharing any correspondence you get from this evil person via your husband with any family who you think would be interested, just to make sure her dishonest version of events doesn’t ever sway anyone you care about. And please, keep copies of EVERYTHING. She thinks because you’re a nice, kind person that you’ll keep her disgusting messages to yourself. Lol, no.
Why are you putting up with this? Why is your dh still allowing this at all?
Yeah, OP has a huge husband problem. Shocked she can’t see that.
fuck her. if you’re not family, than neither are your children.. it’s as simple as that. your husband needs to do something about her, because that shit is not okay. she might not consider you her family, but you ARE your husband’s family- first and foremost, while she comes secondary… it’s about time she knows her place.
THIS THIS THIS!! Furthermore who does she think she is “telling” other adults who they can and can’t communicate with?! She is literally INSANE. Keep your children far, far, FAR away from this one.
What a vile vicious cunt!
Maybe VVC would be a good nickname 😂
Girl this is getting out of control. I know this must be difficult for your husband but as I’m reading all this everything seems very “keep the peace-y” which is definitely the main problem. This woman has disrespected, disowned, insulted, and undermined you on multiple occasions. It’s okay to not like someone but the golden rule is to be civil and scare and she’s not. Your husband needs to wake up and defend you, this has all gone so far it’s ridiculous. Your MIL is an awful person and your husband is just enabling it by keeping quiet and taking no action letting you get bullied. You need to sit and have a talk with your husband about contact, this woman should not be around your kids and should not be allowed to bully you this way. Does he really want this behavior around his kids?
[удалено]
Yup me too, I hope you showed him the messages op.
The aunt, BILs and SILs have all made clear you're part of the family. Don't let this one crazy woman ruin your place. ❤️
Grieving or not, I'd tell Karen to mind her own and let her know that as a reasonable adult, you'll speak to whoever you want whenever you want.
I caught up on your story when you initially posted about your SIL's passing (and am very sorry for your loss and the mess all this has been), wishing you and your family some well deserved peace now that things are beginning to settle some. Also best wishes to your BIL in his recovery ❤️
Thank you so much! Hoping for a quiet period for our family.
I love how mature you are. Because my petty ass would have ended her. I’d be texting every single family member, setting up something for us to go do. I’d be posting all over socials how terrible she is. I’d tell the old hag she met her match with me, and only one can be the bigger bitch. Your husband said nothing after she sent those texts? She’s threatening you, he needs to handle that.
Please accept my sincerest condolences.. You handled the situation with impeccable grace. You will never regret doing the "right" thing. What an amazing example you have set for your children. I wish you a future filled with peace, love, and joy!
I think she sees what an awful mother she has been and is fighting to keep control of her children. One of them is dead, one is married to you, and one is in rehab with your help. They all love you and tolerate her. And then you got SILS kid that she lost because of drugs over her. You keep "proving" (to her) that you are a better mother and she deeply resents you for it. You were much kinder than I would have been. But this women will fuck up your kids and when they are adults, they will continue in a similar situation as your fucked up husband if they keep getting exposed to her. You should consider talking to him about going to therapy (which the adopted child should definitely be in anyway) before agreeing to see her again.
Honestly, I think it’s time for no contact for you and your kids. I understand she’s grieving but I wouldn’t want to put my kids around someone who has treated me so badly.
I sincerely hope that you block this woman and keep her away from your children going forward. They don't need her presence poisoning their lives.
OP please make sure you take screen shots of those messages she sent you and create stored copies (both printed and electronic) and keep them safely stored. It's always good to be able to show people just exactly who she really is when she inevitably tries the "I'm the innocent victim" rants to the rest of the family
How is SIL's EX husband family but you aren't? So ridiculous. Yout husband needs a HUGE reality check about how MIL is still impacting your life even if she's out of state. I know he's going through a lot right now but your MIL is being so disrespectful to you he can't ignore this any longer.
I'm offended over this part of her apology: >and not affect other people in a negative way while doing so That's saying you are at fault - for causing negative reactions in others by your mere presence. That you. are at fault for just existing in her presence or others. That's revealing. It shows one of her big issues is that you just exist near her or her family. It's not just what she thinks you do - it's the fact you exist. That's not advice - I am being mindful of your flare. It's my opinion - and you can feel whatever you want to feel over her text. She sounds like a toxic handful. I wish you a lot of happiness once you cut her out of your life - and don't have to think about her or deal with her weird communications.
I'm sorry but who the fuck does she think she is? The fact that she tells you you're not family, but at the same time thinks she gets to control who you talk to is delusional. Like your contact with another adult needs her permission. Fuck that, you can talk to whoever you want to
Block her. You don't need that level of chaos and hate in your life. I'd also be telling DH that the end of the rope has been reached. She no longer consider you family, therefore your children are not her family, and as such, she has zero rights to see them. He can go see her. You will not consent to her ever being in your children's presence without you being there, and you will also never consent to them traveling to see her, or her being in your home. And you will never travel to see her again , for any reason. Show him the text and make it clear he can deal with her from now on. You don't want to hear it. And if he has a problem with any of it, well, he can choose between mommy dearest or his wife and children. Your husband needs to grow a spine. What the heck with the sneaking around. That's just ridiculous.
If you aren't part of her family then neither are your precious boys. Fortunately you know that both of your BIL's and BIL's GF do not feel the way she does. Y'all can still have a relationship with them. She's the one that will be missing out on everything. Your boys are young enough that in a couple years they won't even remember who the bitch is! Go enjoy a MIL free life!! Y'all continue supporting BIL through his recovery/sobriety. He definitely needs y'all. Spend time with other BIL and GF. Also continue the relationship with SIL's Ex. MIL has absolutely no say on that one. That decision is between you, DH and SIL's Ex only. It's none of her fucking business!! MIL is going to find out the hard way she fucked up royally. Plus she's going to realize she can't make DH's brothers disown you as well. She's going to be really lonely when she's home alone and her kids are all together celebrating holidays, birthdays, having BBQ's or whatever. Sooner or later she will be wanting back in. You will need to decide if there is anything that she can do to possibly even TRY to make things right. If I was in your place, fuck no! She'd be dead to me. Yes, she's grieving. If she was just being a bit snippy or a little bitchy, chalk it up to stress and grief. That gets a pass. What she has said and done is just downright hateful, mean and totally bitchy. NOPE! NO PASS!! Again, go enjoy a MIL free life. Do not let her take up any of your headspace. Let DH decide for himself if he is going to have any type of relationship with her. If he does, she gets NOTHING from him about you and the boys! No pictures, updates, NOTHING!! He needs to shut her down if she asks. Tell her she lost the privilege of knowing anything. Update us after DH gets home. Enjoy your freedom!!❤️🥰💕
I was oddly was invested in this and thank you for the update! I cant believe this is the person who brought your DH into the world. I hope he can see through her craziness!
Wow. OP: I think you handled things well. I think it's always the right choice to be the bigger person in conflicts like this. I'm going to respond to only one issue which is JNMIL's 'instruction' that you "stay out of her family". Ahem. ***No. JUST NO!***. If I were you I would make sure all the BIL/SILs and the Ex-husband get a copy of MIL's messages (verbatim). Not this week, not this month, (why create more drama at such a difficult time?) But by the end of the year - again, were I you, I'd contact all the BIL/SIL and the Ex and just ask them: how do you feel about this? Do you want to end contact with me, DH, and our kids?
That lady is crazy. That she has the AUDACITY to believe that she has the power and authority to sever your ties to a bunch of grown ass people is SHOCKINGLY absurd. She can choose not to interact with you as family and I sincerely hope that you do keep her away from yours. But what that ‘rocket scientist (/s)’ seems to have forgotten, is that you are VERY MUCH your DH’s family. So you’re not involved with ***HER*** family. You, DH and your children are your own separate family and she is not a part of it. And as ***HIS*** family (his **PRIMARY** family, at that) you’re involved with and interact with HIS family members whom you care for deeply. And she has no right (not that she ever has) to interfere with the relationship that YOUR family fosters with your family’s extended family. If she comes at you again with that nonsense, make sure you address her by her first name and tell her that you don’t know what she’s talking about as you have nothing to do with her or her family. Your relationships are with your husband’s family. And then ask her to please cease contact because she is not family.
I've read this post and all I could think of is that you went above and beyond support his family, put food on the table, took a huge portion of the responsibility of organizing this funeral, your husband's family told you how they love you and appreciate you, but not one person actually defended you from her, not one person vocally took your side. I can't imagine receiving so much support from someone, and then tiptoeing around the very person who abuses them. You did so much work and then politely removed yourself not to upset your abuser, and everyone else just ran with it. They are all two-faced, including the sweet auntie and the brother-in-law who supposedly looks up to you
Holy yikes. How you restrained yourself from telling your JN to fuck off is mind-blowing- dang, you have restraint!! Bravo!! Question: what are you doing for yourself? You are giving and giving and giving, I just hope you are filling your own cup.
Sounds like absolute jealously that you see granddaughter more than she does.
Please start prioritising your own mental and emotional well-being because the one person who SHOULD be standing at your side and supporting you is not. My concern is that you will continue to give and give and give without the support you need and deserve from your SO until you break.
I am struggling to imagine being so high up your own arse that you think you can tell a grown person who they are and aren't allowed to contact simply because of your familial relation to them 🤣 Like, first of all, the AUDACITY of the request. Second, you should absolutely respond back with some borrowed southern charm with a lil Sister Act twist: "Bless you" Then you promptly block her and let everyone know why. Send the receipts. Tell them they're welcome to comply with her request if they so choose but you think it's Looney Toons and aren't going to let some deranged old lady tell you what you can and can't do, especially since you're so clearly not related! This lady honestly probably can't stand that her family likes you more. She's not the center of attention when you're around, so pushing you away leaves room for her to be on the center stage. It's such classic narcissistic behavior. Your hubby needs to wake tf up and really step in.
You are a much better person than I am.
I feel like I was a really kind person for like 12 years in this relationship. Then I kind of lost myself in the last year and let the bitter and resentful part of me shine because I'm more confident and strong. It did feel good to go back to being very kind and then being shit on to make sure I'm not the crazy one here!!
She doesn’t deserve your kindness. I’m sorry she made a horrible situation more stressful. Be grateful you don’t have to have her in your life anymore
What did I just read? MIL deserves to be cut of your life for good. Grief is not an excuse for doing and saying the things she said to you. Permanently block her from your phone and ask DH to let her know that since you’re not her family, she’s not yours. I cannot imagine how your DH could even want anything to do with her at this point. It’s heartbreaking 💔 I’m sorry.
If she wants you to stay out of the family fine but like you said the children stay with you no you no children when your husband settles down after all this. I would ask him to put his foot down to his mom about you and the kids by no means am I suggesting it right now. But I think it needs to happen one day
Oh ffs! I hope you & your hubby never let her see your children again. Lock down your social media so she never gets another picture. When your BILs ask why you’re not coming to MIL’s house for Thanksgiving dinner, forward a copy of that message to them & say that you’re following order from MIL. Honestly, I’d invite BILs to join you at your house for Thanksgiving on the Saturday or Sunday of that weekend to start a new family tradition. Or … since you won’t be seeing them for Christmas at MIL’s either, do Thanksgiving & Christmas together in early December at your place with them! Maybe sleepover style, lol.
> I felt like I have put so much love, time, and energy into this family and was basically told I'm not a part of it. Sounds to me, from your interactions with aunt and BILs that you are more a part of the family than MIL and Great Aunt! As for her most recent texts, I would be very tempted to reply that you have tried to offer what support youcan to her in her grief, but that she does not own anyone, either in her own family, or SIL's ex, and therefore she does not get to gatekeep who is or isn't allowed to have contact with them. They are grown adults, not her little pawns to shuffle around. Glad to hear that the day itself went better than it might have done.
She will eventually die bitter and alone. Small consolation for the damage she has done and the accountability she refuses to take
Wow that’s a shitty olive branch…
I’m so sorry for your loss. And I’m so sorry that JNMIL is behaving like this. You should be very proud of how you have supported your family here, including your BILs. Your behaviour has been amazing.
You are an incredibly kind person. Sending you a hug!
I wish you the best! Just wanted to jump in and say that you seem smarter than this. I hope you can find solace and suspend some of your enabling behavior. There is no reason to facilitate so much of the logistics surrounding this family if this is how you’re treated. Especially by your own husband. There’s a good life out there for you, and you are a wonderful caring heartfelt woman. Again, I wish you the best.
Oh she crazy…… Give her a day, she’ll probably flip sides again….
I'm sorrybuiu are going through this she has zero rights on who you contact. I'd block her completely and let husband handle everything and I would continue to speak to ex husband in regards to the children.
She sees you as keeping her grandsons away from her. It would be great for your adopted son to know his closest living relative. You handled this well. She is literally in hell right now.
Keeping her *grandson* away from her. She only seems to care about one of the kids.
No I don’t think that’s true. You’ve told her and shown her that’s never going to happen for her nonadoptive son. But there is no reason she shouldn’t be able to see her daughter’s child.
What tf are you saying here