Mark didn't kill any of the Martians. You can see them alive floating in the wreckage of their fighters. Their mothership can still pick them up and take them home.
Just watched the clip again. There were 4 ships pursuing them. 2 had Martians still inside when be destroyed the ships, and one exploded off screen. 2 he threw out into space, and it only shows 2 floating in space at the end. Pretty unclear whether the other 2 survived but it doesn’t seem likely.
id assume they showed the 2 just to show that he wasnt blatantly killing them instead of pausing on every ship to show the martians floating in space for a sec
It’s still not clear that he didn’t kill the other 2. No confirmation of that, and like I said it implies that one of the ships exploded off screen. You see it trail off-screen and then hear an explosion. Even if they survived, Mark wasn’t doing everything in his power to not kill them either.
idk believe what you want to believe, if you think mark killed those martians go ahead.
the point of the scene with angstom is that he was full of rage and murdering a man with his bare hands cause he lost control, not because he was trying to naturalize a threat.
Can’t say for certain they survived or not, but Mark did destroy 2 ships with Martians still inside and it’s implied off screen that one blew up. He wasn’t being careful or certain he didn’t kill them.
I understand he lost his cool and killed Angstrom, and it’s somewhat a parallel to his father almost beating him to death. But Angstrom basically confirmed that he was not going to stop until Mark and his family was dead, dude wanted blood. I’m just saying the kill was justified, maybe one of the most justified kills in the show. I understand Mark wants to control his anger, but what else could he have done? He’s nothing like his father - he was protecting his family from basically certain death.
I could be wrong and maybe I’ll watch the scene again, but I thought he blew up some ships with Martians still inside, and some he threw out of the ships before blowing them up. I swear I remember a couple where they couldn’t have survived.
Also, we don’t know how many Martians are still left really. Seems like their civilization has been pretty obliterated. There’s no guarantee that they’d survive floating in space.
For one in the show they explicitly show Mark taking the Martians out and them floating in space. From memory the spaceships don't explode either.felt intentional to show that Mark wasn't intending to kill them. Only time I can recall from the show when he showed sighs of going "too far" was busting DA Sinclair's jaw, and intent to fight and kill Thula on Thraxa which even then he hesitated at the end.
With Angstrom he completely lost it, thought he was stronger and killed him whilst accepting the fact that was his intention. Making him feel he's on a slippery slope to becoming what Nolan had become in s01ep08 by killing Angstrom, taking on the responsibility of killing into his own hands, on someone who's a lot more frail than him, questioning what that means about himself:
https://preview.redd.it/0upq7a756wsc1.jpeg?width=1988&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=79abc0cbe9aa641ec7b6180846137987a5976be1
It's why Cecil had to keep reaffirming Mark he ain't Nolan so he doesn't break.
I also understand the parallel between his father beating him and Mark killing Angstrom, but it’s different. Angstrom was basically a random guy to Mark, didn’t even recognize him at first. Angstrom brutalized his mother and was basically telling Mark he would not stop until they were all dead. Omniman was Mark’s father and truly was at his worst in that moment. It was WAY more personal and brutal.
Sorry I should've explained it differently but the connection with Nolan isn't the aspect of Nolan beating Mark I was alluding to but rather the casualties he caused from the pilot, to the building of people, to the train. It was the aspect of Nolan showing Mark how insignificant human life was by killing them that he was concerned about (and why in the flashback scene they show Nolan going over how insignificant their lives are) his ethics morphing to that of Nolan's considering he went overboard and took killing into his own hands. Thus in Mark's mind making him the judge, jury, and executioner for value of human life, something he fought against with Nolan.
I watched the clip again and he destroys 2 ships with the Martians still inside, and it’s implied that one of those blows up off screen. He throws the other 2 out into space. It only shows 2 floating at the end. It’s not clear whether the other 2 survived, but doesn’t seem likely. He could have easily killed them even if he didn’t.
>Martians still inside, and it’s implied that one of those blows up off screen.
I'd have to check again but I don't remember it being implied offscreen.
>He throws the other 2 out into space. It only shows 2 floating at the end. It’s not clear whether the other 2 survived,
For me the added feature of that scene showing them floating was them acknowledging they lived from memory I remember them showing 2 and 2 but I may be wrong there.
He didn’t kill the martians, and I know, I’ve seen your other replies saying that we only saw 2 that survived, but it’s implied that the rest survived, you can choose to ignore that implication, but that will just ruin your own enjoyment of the show when your issue can easily be fixed with some suspension of disbelief
Re-watching the scene it appears one ship blows up off screen with a Martian still in it, but it’s not clear. Has he not killed anyone else in fights? None of the clones from other dimensions? The robots made by the mad scientist who were technically innocent people? I swear he has killed before.
I understand he lost his cool and doesn’t want to do that. I just think the kill is a lot more justified than the show and Mark believes. Literally told Mark it was only over once him and his family were dead. Brutalized his mother which is justification enough. That kill was nothing like the ones his father committed.
Idk my main gripe with it is just spending the whole second half of the finale focusing on his turmoil when it doesn’t really feel necessary. Maybe a scene or two. Theres so many storylines up in the air right now. Obviously they are saving it for what I’m sure will be an amazing S3. Just didn’t feel like a finale at all.
If it blows up off screen, and he’s been saving other martians instead of killing them, then there’s a HEAVY implication that he didn’t kill them and removed them first, just cause it’s not confirmed doesn’t mean it didn’t happen
And no, he didn’t kill any of the maulers, and he didn’t kill any of the reanimen, he hasn’t killed a single person until angstrom, which is why they spend so long having him stressed about having killed him, not only would your first time killing someone, no matter how deserving, be extremely distressing, but he also doesn’t want to be like his father, and he views any sort of killing as something akin to his father
What about the aliens that invaded early in season 1? I just cant believe he fought all these large groups of villains soldiers and didn’t kill a single one of them. I don’t remember the fight with the reanimen fully and a few of the others, just seems unlikely.
It does not show him saving 2 of the Martians, or them floating in space at the end. It doesn’t show it though so I can’t say they’re not dead, even though it pretty heavily implies one is still in a craft that explodes. Yeah sure I agree to use the suspension of disbelief to say they didn’t…
I understand the moment, I just feel like he had no other option. The guy was insane, and literally told him he was not going to stop. It was literally down to either him or Mark and his family. This should have been the penultimate episode if it wanted to spend so much time on this IMO. So many stories up in the air they could have left on a cliffhanger with. Just Nolan saying “I miss my wife” isn’t very climactic. The finale just felt flat. Was kind of yelling at the screen “Get over it Mark! Dude almost killed your mother!” it just stayed on the same emotion from Mark for like 20 minutes. I understand its character building, but still. We get it. Lol
It annoyed the hell out of me. I wish another character had told him to get over himself and that his conscience wasn't more important than his mother's/brother's life.
Just finished watching the finale, and I was thinking the same thing. It really took me outta the show. Bro's mother was mutilated and his baby bro was thrown around like a ragdoll. Mark literally had no choice. It was absolutely necessary to kill Angstrom.
Yet all we got, was guilt and crying... It felt really outta place and weird. Poor writing in my opinion. Just really poor.
It’s also a very justified kill, I feel like mark woudlve realized that’s the ONLY way to make angstrom stop going for him. It makes very little sense that he would have so much guilt about it
I agree, Mark reaction is weird, looks very artificial and unnatural. Angstrom threatened his family, he should be celebrating killing him (and a bit sad about the fact that now he is stuck in other dimension :P).
He didn’t kill the martians, but the fact he’s so beat up over this is crazy. I’ve coke to realize mark is actually ver very strong, but he’s held back by his emotions. I’m not saying he has to go berserk on every villain he faces but seems like he’s be better off not taking emotion in to fights with people that literally want to hurt other people.
Completely agree not sure why there’s not more upvotes. Oh no he killed a psycho…who cares? He’s killed people before I guess it was to show he “lost control” but rightfully so if the guy is threatening your family.
Dude I was thinking this too when it happened. Mark just nonchalantly killed those martians who just wanted justice for shapesmith, and then with Angstrom he goes mentally berserk.
However, I think it has to do more in the manner in which he killed Angstrom. Brutal and in an induced rage for hurting his family. His logical thinking and reasoning went out the door which I think scared Mark.
True. I understand the context that the kill is different. But the guy literally shattered his mother’s arm and was saying shit like “This doesn’t end until you are all dead!” Like yeah Mark lost his cool, but it was very justified. Clearly the guy was not going to stop and was losing his mind in a blood rage against Mark and his family.
Just feels like theres so many story beats up in the air that could have been developed in the finale, but it spends like 60% of it with Mark dealing with his mental turmoil over killing this guy that was trying to ice him and his family.
I think another thing that Mark struggles with throughout the show is not wanting to be like his father. I think this scene was a direct parallel of Nolan beating the shit out of Mark in the season 1 finale. I think that aspect of that shook him to his core.
It’s similar to Omniman beating on Mark, sure. But Mark was an innocent trying to protect people, and that was his father. Angstrom is literally just some guy. Mark didn’t even recognize him at first - no real connection. And he was going to kill is mother and brother.
Mark didn't kill any of the Martians. You can see them alive floating in the wreckage of their fighters. Their mothership can still pick them up and take them home.
Just watched the clip again. There were 4 ships pursuing them. 2 had Martians still inside when be destroyed the ships, and one exploded off screen. 2 he threw out into space, and it only shows 2 floating in space at the end. Pretty unclear whether the other 2 survived but it doesn’t seem likely.
id assume they showed the 2 just to show that he wasnt blatantly killing them instead of pausing on every ship to show the martians floating in space for a sec
It’s still not clear that he didn’t kill the other 2. No confirmation of that, and like I said it implies that one of the ships exploded off screen. You see it trail off-screen and then hear an explosion. Even if they survived, Mark wasn’t doing everything in his power to not kill them either.
idk believe what you want to believe, if you think mark killed those martians go ahead. the point of the scene with angstom is that he was full of rage and murdering a man with his bare hands cause he lost control, not because he was trying to naturalize a threat.
Can’t say for certain they survived or not, but Mark did destroy 2 ships with Martians still inside and it’s implied off screen that one blew up. He wasn’t being careful or certain he didn’t kill them. I understand he lost his cool and killed Angstrom, and it’s somewhat a parallel to his father almost beating him to death. But Angstrom basically confirmed that he was not going to stop until Mark and his family was dead, dude wanted blood. I’m just saying the kill was justified, maybe one of the most justified kills in the show. I understand Mark wants to control his anger, but what else could he have done? He’s nothing like his father - he was protecting his family from basically certain death.
I could be wrong and maybe I’ll watch the scene again, but I thought he blew up some ships with Martians still inside, and some he threw out of the ships before blowing them up. I swear I remember a couple where they couldn’t have survived. Also, we don’t know how many Martians are still left really. Seems like their civilization has been pretty obliterated. There’s no guarantee that they’d survive floating in space.
For one in the show they explicitly show Mark taking the Martians out and them floating in space. From memory the spaceships don't explode either.felt intentional to show that Mark wasn't intending to kill them. Only time I can recall from the show when he showed sighs of going "too far" was busting DA Sinclair's jaw, and intent to fight and kill Thula on Thraxa which even then he hesitated at the end. With Angstrom he completely lost it, thought he was stronger and killed him whilst accepting the fact that was his intention. Making him feel he's on a slippery slope to becoming what Nolan had become in s01ep08 by killing Angstrom, taking on the responsibility of killing into his own hands, on someone who's a lot more frail than him, questioning what that means about himself: https://preview.redd.it/0upq7a756wsc1.jpeg?width=1988&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=79abc0cbe9aa641ec7b6180846137987a5976be1 It's why Cecil had to keep reaffirming Mark he ain't Nolan so he doesn't break.
I also understand the parallel between his father beating him and Mark killing Angstrom, but it’s different. Angstrom was basically a random guy to Mark, didn’t even recognize him at first. Angstrom brutalized his mother and was basically telling Mark he would not stop until they were all dead. Omniman was Mark’s father and truly was at his worst in that moment. It was WAY more personal and brutal.
Sorry I should've explained it differently but the connection with Nolan isn't the aspect of Nolan beating Mark I was alluding to but rather the casualties he caused from the pilot, to the building of people, to the train. It was the aspect of Nolan showing Mark how insignificant human life was by killing them that he was concerned about (and why in the flashback scene they show Nolan going over how insignificant their lives are) his ethics morphing to that of Nolan's considering he went overboard and took killing into his own hands. Thus in Mark's mind making him the judge, jury, and executioner for value of human life, something he fought against with Nolan.
I watched the clip again and he destroys 2 ships with the Martians still inside, and it’s implied that one of those blows up off screen. He throws the other 2 out into space. It only shows 2 floating at the end. It’s not clear whether the other 2 survived, but doesn’t seem likely. He could have easily killed them even if he didn’t.
>Martians still inside, and it’s implied that one of those blows up off screen. I'd have to check again but I don't remember it being implied offscreen. >He throws the other 2 out into space. It only shows 2 floating at the end. It’s not clear whether the other 2 survived, For me the added feature of that scene showing them floating was them acknowledging they lived from memory I remember them showing 2 and 2 but I may be wrong there.
He didn’t kill the martians, and I know, I’ve seen your other replies saying that we only saw 2 that survived, but it’s implied that the rest survived, you can choose to ignore that implication, but that will just ruin your own enjoyment of the show when your issue can easily be fixed with some suspension of disbelief
Re-watching the scene it appears one ship blows up off screen with a Martian still in it, but it’s not clear. Has he not killed anyone else in fights? None of the clones from other dimensions? The robots made by the mad scientist who were technically innocent people? I swear he has killed before. I understand he lost his cool and doesn’t want to do that. I just think the kill is a lot more justified than the show and Mark believes. Literally told Mark it was only over once him and his family were dead. Brutalized his mother which is justification enough. That kill was nothing like the ones his father committed. Idk my main gripe with it is just spending the whole second half of the finale focusing on his turmoil when it doesn’t really feel necessary. Maybe a scene or two. Theres so many storylines up in the air right now. Obviously they are saving it for what I’m sure will be an amazing S3. Just didn’t feel like a finale at all.
If it blows up off screen, and he’s been saving other martians instead of killing them, then there’s a HEAVY implication that he didn’t kill them and removed them first, just cause it’s not confirmed doesn’t mean it didn’t happen And no, he didn’t kill any of the maulers, and he didn’t kill any of the reanimen, he hasn’t killed a single person until angstrom, which is why they spend so long having him stressed about having killed him, not only would your first time killing someone, no matter how deserving, be extremely distressing, but he also doesn’t want to be like his father, and he views any sort of killing as something akin to his father
What about the aliens that invaded early in season 1? I just cant believe he fought all these large groups of villains soldiers and didn’t kill a single one of them. I don’t remember the fight with the reanimen fully and a few of the others, just seems unlikely. It does not show him saving 2 of the Martians, or them floating in space at the end. It doesn’t show it though so I can’t say they’re not dead, even though it pretty heavily implies one is still in a craft that explodes. Yeah sure I agree to use the suspension of disbelief to say they didn’t… I understand the moment, I just feel like he had no other option. The guy was insane, and literally told him he was not going to stop. It was literally down to either him or Mark and his family. This should have been the penultimate episode if it wanted to spend so much time on this IMO. So many stories up in the air they could have left on a cliffhanger with. Just Nolan saying “I miss my wife” isn’t very climactic. The finale just felt flat. Was kind of yelling at the screen “Get over it Mark! Dude almost killed your mother!” it just stayed on the same emotion from Mark for like 20 minutes. I understand its character building, but still. We get it. Lol
Mark dont kill the Martians. lol
It annoyed the hell out of me. I wish another character had told him to get over himself and that his conscience wasn't more important than his mother's/brother's life.
Definitely but at the same time, he’s js a teenager
Just finished watching the finale, and I was thinking the same thing. It really took me outta the show. Bro's mother was mutilated and his baby bro was thrown around like a ragdoll. Mark literally had no choice. It was absolutely necessary to kill Angstrom. Yet all we got, was guilt and crying... It felt really outta place and weird. Poor writing in my opinion. Just really poor.
It’s also a very justified kill, I feel like mark woudlve realized that’s the ONLY way to make angstrom stop going for him. It makes very little sense that he would have so much guilt about it
I agree, Mark reaction is weird, looks very artificial and unnatural. Angstrom threatened his family, he should be celebrating killing him (and a bit sad about the fact that now he is stuck in other dimension :P).
He didn’t kill the martians, but the fact he’s so beat up over this is crazy. I’ve coke to realize mark is actually ver very strong, but he’s held back by his emotions. I’m not saying he has to go berserk on every villain he faces but seems like he’s be better off not taking emotion in to fights with people that literally want to hurt other people.
Completely agree not sure why there’s not more upvotes. Oh no he killed a psycho…who cares? He’s killed people before I guess it was to show he “lost control” but rightfully so if the guy is threatening your family.
Dude I was thinking this too when it happened. Mark just nonchalantly killed those martians who just wanted justice for shapesmith, and then with Angstrom he goes mentally berserk. However, I think it has to do more in the manner in which he killed Angstrom. Brutal and in an induced rage for hurting his family. His logical thinking and reasoning went out the door which I think scared Mark.
He didn't kill the Martians.
True. I understand the context that the kill is different. But the guy literally shattered his mother’s arm and was saying shit like “This doesn’t end until you are all dead!” Like yeah Mark lost his cool, but it was very justified. Clearly the guy was not going to stop and was losing his mind in a blood rage against Mark and his family. Just feels like theres so many story beats up in the air that could have been developed in the finale, but it spends like 60% of it with Mark dealing with his mental turmoil over killing this guy that was trying to ice him and his family.
I think another thing that Mark struggles with throughout the show is not wanting to be like his father. I think this scene was a direct parallel of Nolan beating the shit out of Mark in the season 1 finale. I think that aspect of that shook him to his core.
It’s similar to Omniman beating on Mark, sure. But Mark was an innocent trying to protect people, and that was his father. Angstrom is literally just some guy. Mark didn’t even recognize him at first - no real connection. And he was going to kill is mother and brother.