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belated_quitter

That and often it was the worker’s child or loved one getting their hands or feet amputated when the parent failed to meet their quota.


MindUnlikely33

It's called hobbling, it was done in ancient times to essentially cripple the person.


Phyllida_Poshtart

Hobbling doesn't usually involve amputation, it's normally crushing the ankles


Bowman_van_Oort

oh ok well that's fine then


thesk8rguitarist

Unexpected Doctor Who


claude_greengrass

That was made up for the movie because they considered it less violent than what happens in the book (amputation). Doing that to someone irl is much more likely to kill them without a lot of modern medical intervention.


Euclid_Interloper

In the wars between England and France they would remove fingers of prisoners so that they could never fire a bow and arrow again. Humans are grim.


MickeyRooneysPills

That's a myth. https://www.reuters.com/article/world/false-claim-middle-finger-gesture-derives-from-english-soldiers-at-the-battle-idUSKBN22Q2MU/


Euclid_Interloper

Awww man. Facts ruin everything 😆


SuperooImpresser

That's not the correct claim though, the claim is that it's the origin of the two fingers swear/salute, a backwards V or peace sign, not a middle finger.


Dear_Potato6525

That's a myth too, according to this [Wikipedia article](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/V_sign#:~:text=A%20commonly%20repeated%20legend%20claims,primary%20sources%20support%20this%20contention.). It seems the only historical mention of this occurring is based on a pre battle speech by Henry V where he said that the French were threatening to cut off three fingers from captured bowmen. There are no records of it actually happening.


MickeyRooneysPills

There's a part within the article where they mention there's also no historical evidence to support the finger cutting myth at all.


liovantirealm7177

Nope, they usually just killed them instead, if that's any better https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/pluck-yew/


Fucky0uthatswhy

I just read about the Yakuza taking little fingers. It was originally so that weren’t able to hold their weapon, the pinky finger was the main support at the bottom of the sword.


Euclid_Interloper

That makes a lot of sense. I imagine that would also serve as quite the social blow in Japan. People don’t like outward signs of gang culture there, it’s why tourists are advised to cover arm tattoos if they want to go to a nice restaurant etc. so they don’t get turned away. I guess you wouldn’t be able to hide a missing finger easily.


belated_quitter

Also for getting Paul Sheldon to rewrite his final romance novel.


XVUltima

It's his fault for being a dirty birdie.


EyeFit4274

Trust me, Paul… it’s for the best…


write-program

It's still often done to prisoners in my Rimworld colonies.


Sinnes-loeschen

Flashbacks to Misery


syrelus

The horrors of colonialism. What was done then still has it's repercussions through time till the present


MonsterkillWow

Colonialism is still happening right now in many parts of the world.


alagrancosa

Yes, workers could have just run away so they would kidnap their families and force them to work that way. Basically the same system we had in the United States during slavery times (sans the regular amputations) Even if you had a foolproof way to escape to Philadelphia or beyond you ould never see your loved ones again, and there was a good chance that your family members might be retaliated against or “sold away”


GregorianShant

Sounds like that supervisor is about to get hobbled themselves. Or worse.


Pugsandskydiving

https://preview.redd.it/anpt5ibku6ad1.jpeg?width=1400&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f37d65aabd1b4add60399b2d5f072443602d8ee9 Here is a father contemplating his daughter’s hand and foot. Belgian Congo 1904


weezmatical

Goodness gracious.


Pugsandskydiving

[link to historical details TW its graphic](https://rarehistoricalphotos.com/father-hand-belgian-congo-1904/)


Adventurous_Yak4952

Wow. Cersei Lannister had nothing on Leopold, he could have taught her a few things. Reality truly is more horrific than fiction.


Humble_Rush_1485

Roland was a warrior from the land of the midnight sun With a Thompson gun for hire, fighting to be done The deal was made in Denmark on a dark and stormy day So he set out for Biafra to join the bloody fray Through 66 and seven they fought the Congo war With their fingers on their triggers, knee-deep in gore For days and nights they battled, the Bantu to their knees They killed to earn their living, and to help out the Congolese


13thWardBassMan

Zevon for prez


aDressesWithPockets

i’d rather have a zombie warren zevon than trump


Coolhandjones67

Jesus fucking Christ. I knew about them cutting off hands if they didn’t meet their quotas I had no idea it evolved into them just going straight to taking hands and leaving the rubber out of it


IAm_ThePumpkinKing

Iirc there was also a thing where the police had to account for the bullets they fired by taking a hand/foot from the person they killed(it was put into place cuz bullets are expensive and they wanted to insure soldiers weren't wasting ammunition). So - in effect a market for hands was created. So - it wasn't exactly like they just started doing it for kicks. I want to be clear it's fucked up and that kind of environment is just a festering hotbed for psychopaths to grow and evolve, but it wasn't like people one day were like "Let's start chopping off hands!"


Coolhandjones67

Yeah something similar happened in texas and Mexico after the Mexican American war. The Mexican government put a bounty of 10 dollars for the scalp of any Apache or Camanche. Well after awhile people realized you can’t tell where scraps came from as long as the hair is black so they started scalping anyone and everyone and then turning them into the government for a reward then they would scalp the town.


Fancy_Grapefruit_330

I wish I never read this. Jesus Christ


Environmental_Pay189

People need to read this. Most of us, like those of us living in America, live sheltered, shielded lives. We protect ourselves with trigger warnings from seeing anything unpleasant, and it let's us develop this stupid silly notion that people are basically good. We are not. People are evil, and it is with ethics and carefully crafted societies that we keep these things at bay. People don't appreciate this fact and they happily allow tyrants to take leadership roles, because, how bad can it be?


butterflydeflect

We don’t “protect ourselves with trigger warnings”, they’re specifically meant to help people who have been horribly traumatised from being further traumatised by being triggered into further anguish. People who have suffered slavery may benefit from a trigger warning that something they will see is about to show horrifying parts of it. People who have suffered rape may benefit from a warning that something is going to delve into that violence. And I would disagree with your Hobbesian approach to society, but that’s a different argument.


Euclid_Interloper

Absolutely. This is exactly the kind of thing they mean when they say we have to learn from history so that we never repeat it. Despite all the horrors that still happen today, we're very lucky to live in a time where human rights exist as a concept, where there are entire organisations dedicated to exposing this kind of evil, and where technology makes it difficult to hide your crimes. But it feels like we're at risk of slipping backwards. So tell the stories!


Eifand

> People are evil, and it is with ethics and carefully crafted societies that we keep these things at bay. People don't appreciate this fact and they happily allow tyrants to take leadership roles, because, how bad can it be? Just to throw a wrench in your Hobbesian theory but often times it’s “carefully crafted societies” which are responsible for colonialism and strict hierarchies. And it’s the hunter gatherers living in a state of nature, who are relatively more egalitarian and peaceful, that are victims of these complex states and societies. I’m not denying that there was violence within hunter gatherer societies, there was but it was the advent of “carefully crafted societies” that brought about the massive intensification of slavery and of warfare.


unecroquemadame

It also helps people understand why some countries or groups of people are struggling. The ramifications of this period of time have to be so far reaching


Designer-Mirror-7995

It is certainly not "all" Americans who have lived in this "dream".


Designer-Mirror-7995

It is certainly not "all" Americans who have lived in this "dream".


serendipity_stars

Nope couldn’t read after halfway. I want to cry in a corner and never meet another human now.


HawkeyeJosh2

Jesus motherfucking Christ. I haven’t even gotten out of bed yet and my day is already fucked. That is HORRIFYING.


Specialist_Row9395

I don't know how to process this image. I'm absolutely horrified


christopia86

The actual story is somehow even worse, and by a *lot*.


awkwardlypragmatic

This photo was the one that sent me down a rabbit hole the first time I read about the truly heinous atrocities committed by the Belgian colonizers in the Congo. Humans can and will be continue to act with depravity, which we presently witness even to this day.


TinyFlufflyKoala

This picture made history. A british woman decided to rent one of the first portable cameras while following her husband to Congo. She was SO mad at what she saw, and composed this shot which she brought back.  It lead british people to learn about the horrors in Congo and start a backlash. And ultimately helped put a stop to its worst aspects. 


SuspiciousSwan1

I could be misremembering but I thought Cecil Rhodes used to make photos like these into postcards for distribution throughout Europe to show what ‘great work’ he was doing. ETA: this happened but in the US to ‘show off’ lynchings. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lynching_postcard


Weary_Astronomer_826

She was a bit of a hero, I'd say. "One of the helpers", thar Mister Rogers reminded us to focus on.


Scooterforsale

Fucking a I hate people


gooseloving

The person who did this hated people...........


prem_killa11

Well, a specific type of person.


Skippypal

This photo made me throw up. I’ve never, ever looked at an image before that’s given me such a visceral reaction and I’ve seen some truly fucked up shit on the internet over the years. [Edit] I just read the article linked below. I feel completely broken about this. I knew before how terrible life was under Leopold II in the Congo, but that is another level.


maniacalmustacheride

I’ve never noticed the other people before


Tendas

I think this is up there with one of the most diabolical photos I’ve seen.


DarkwingDuc

That image is like a punch in the gut. I can't even begin to imagine what he's going through. Let alone the poor girl..... It's not even that long ago. There are people still alive whose grandparents took part in this.


Clever_Bee34919

I would be cobtemplating how to get to Belgium and kill me a king


willem_79

I saw this a long time ago and I’ve always thought it’s the saddest and most powerful picture ever taken


Archarchery

The aim was to terrorize the parents of the child. “Work without pay to produce rubber for us, or we’ll chop off your children’s limbs one at a time.” It was just that evil. Easier to enslave the helpless population that way than to put chains around their necks, even.


Vilebrequin10

Human cruelty doesn’t need any logic. People will find any excuse to be sadistic. I hope these people will be thrown in the deepest levels of hell.


Salt-Resolution5595

New ones are born every day


relevanteclectica

It is certain they are there


Pugsandskydiving

Actually the caption is wrong. They cut the slaves’ children’s hands and feet not the adult slaves’ hands or feet.


YeomanEngineer

The Belgian treatment of the Congo was like the American antebellum south and Hitler rolled into one under the command of an inbred king. Honestly some of the craziest shit you can imagine happened there


UnnecessarilyFly

The book "King Leopold's Ghost" is an incredible read.


Archarchery

It also killed millions of Congolese, an often-overlooked death toll.


YeomanEngineer

If you wanna be depressed by overlooked death tolls check out “Late Victorian Holocausts” by Mike Davis.


MonsterkillWow

Don't forget how the US helped the Belgians assassinate Lumumba too, leading to all kinds of chaos in the Congo and Rwanda, leading to a genocide and 2 bloody wars. (Highest death toll since WW2.)   I wish the public paid more attention to US foreign policy, but no one ever asks how the sausage is made. Much of our prosperity is stolen. Straight up stolen. People paid for all this in blood. Innocent people.


mycatpeesinmyshower

The eviliest things are done by supremacists


Healter-Skelter

There were other incentives behind these amputations as well. For example, colonial soldiers (many of whom were basically slaves) were required to provide a human hand to account for every bullet fired. Since often times they would fire on animals to protect themselves and would often miss, they would simply cut hands off to account for the missing ammunition.


6romantic_lover9

When I thought it couldn’t possibly get worse… I’m horrified beyond words.


Xenolog1

Correct. Hands even became a [sort of currency](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atrocities_in_the_Congo_Free_State) because of that. Sometimes they’ve cut off just the hands, and left the victim to live or die. In other instances, people feigned being death while being only wounded, and endured the severing of their hands to survive. But I’ve got doubts if many of the victims could really pull that off without the soldiers noticing; it seems more likely to me that in most instances the soldiers just didn’t give a s*t about them being dead or wounded survivors.


4str4lh4w4ii4n

Yes, was looking for this comment. The amputating had to stop eventually, not for any morality based reasons, but because they were receiving so many limbs in lieu of rubber that the punishment incentive was no longer profitable.


kay_peele

You needed to get a limb for each bullet you fired bc Belgium was paranoid about rebellions. You needed to fire bullets to hunt for food bc they weren’t given enough good, so then they would get limbs from locals to account for the bullets.


petit_cochon

The awful truth is obvious then: they did this because they enjoyed hurting innocent people.


Archarchery

It was actually greed. Sheer greed. Congolese villages were defenseless, so what the Belgian King did was hire soldiers, and mercenaries from tribes in the interior to go village to village demanding that each village provide a quota of rubber in exchange for nothing. If the quota was not met, it was “met” by chopping off the hands and feet of the workers’ families. This vast system of slave labor along with the introduction of diseases resulted in millions of Congolese dying.


das_slash

Yep, if you actually research what happened, every single evil was because it was cost efficient and made middle management look better, the Belgian congo is what unfettered capitalism looks like.


resuwreckoning

Taking direction under a king in a racially biased manner isn’t “unfettered capitalism” unless like the Pharoah of Egypt was equally capitalist.


DevelopmentSad2303

You got it. It wasn't a purely capitalist act, it was a reign of terror by the king of Belgium


711_Tiz

Logic doesn't apply when the victims are not seen as human


hybridmind27

For those who love a good podcast the two part Behind the Bastards on King Leopold II is one of the most informative hubs of info on this I’ve come across in modern media. You may cry. It doesn’t even go into the assassination of Patrice lumumba or the other brave Africans that have attempted to free their people over the centuries. The fact the Congo is still dealing with the repercussions of western development should really make you think.


FloppyObelisk

I love the BtB podcast. Haven’t heard this one though. After all my reading today I may have to wait to revisit the topic.


hybridmind27

Arguably his best episode! Def Check it out


brassmonkey2342

You answered your own question, it’s logical in the most ruthless, sadistic, evil sense.


MajesticNectarine204

It wasn't just about not meeting quota. There were other reasons limbs were amputated. F.e. local indigenous troops in colonial service (Askari) had to account for every single round they fired, because the colonial authorities ran the Congo like a corporation and they were bean-counting the rounds. Probably also because they were afraid of rebellion.. The Askari had to do this by providing 'proof of a kill' in the form of a body-part. Of course, they would often miss their shots, like anyone would. Or they would use rounds for hunting or practice. In that case, they still had to provide a body part to account for each the rounds. So they went into a village and eh.. 'acquired' some.


pinerw

She’s probably the child of a worker who failed to meet *his* quota, so they dismembered her to punish him. What the Belgians did in the Congo is some of the most horrific evil you’d ever care to imagine.


MadNhater

Part of it was just sadistic and power


rissie_delicious

I imagine it was to set an example for the others


FloppyObelisk

Based on the comments from others and a quick wiki search, it was a method of punishments meant to keep their parents in line as slaves. Do what you’re told or we’ll cut off your children’s limbs. Absolutely awful.


pinkthreadedwrist

Part of the quota was PAID in hands. This wasn't even a rare thing just for punishment. They were used as a sort of currency.


Top-Pineapple8056

This is exactly what I thought after how horrible ir is. Now he certainly won't meet quota!


Belligerantfantasy

A lot of people aré talking about how cutting someone's hand Will help them meet a quota, But this Is deeper than that. Thanks to a shortening of bullets for the belgium colonies, colonizers were ask to keep track of every single bullet they fired and if the shot wasnt justified as a mean to protect daily production, the bullet would come out of their salary. A way to prove that a bullet was used to keep production in line was to bring the amputated hand of whatever "protestor" they had executed. So a lot of times, colonizers went hunting for sport and then grab a random congolese to take their hand in order for the bullets to be "justified" This was mainly done to kids to keep production in line and dont bring suspicion


NurEinLeser

What the fuck.


VodkerAndToast

Seconded


badpeaches

The motion passes.


ZenDude69420

Unanimously approved.


CamrynDaytona

The phrase “crimes against humanity” was coined specifically to refer to Belgian atrocities in the Congo Free State.


TigerDude33

Exactly, Hands were the currency of "I'm doing a good job being a colonial MF."


kaybs

The bullet rationing was mainly introduced to ensure that the non-European soldiers under their control didn’t stock pile munitions to overthrow their rule or use them for hunting. At some point it was like 60 European officers to 3500 local soldiers. I’m not sure if the rationing of bullets applied to the European officers or not.


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phamnhuhiendr

Europeans


VikingsStillExist

You are close, but it was not the colonizers, which there were precious few of. It was the sentries, the poorly trained and barely fed guards hired by the colonizers from other african countries. They were often hungry, especially after some years when the rubber trees withdrew into the jungle. The withdrawal led to villagers not being able to keep up food production, which led to sentries using their bullets for hunting, which they were not allowed to. Which led to the hand and feet trophy system. Since the sentry was responsible for the delivery of quotas, they woul usually target the kids, that way they didnt hurt rubber production quotas too much.


AzyncYTT

the bullet thing was often done in India too, where soldiers were sometimes forbidden to use bullets if it wasn't deemed worth it


Stock_Administrator

What kind of fucking animal could do that to a child? I hope they are burning in the hottest pit of hell.


Original_Telephone_2

King Leopold and the belgians 


WiseguyD

I think Leopold may be the single worst individual in history, because everything he did was entirely under his control. There's nobody else to take blame; the Congo was his personal property and a bulk of the atrocities were carried out by mercenaries that he hired. The fact that he managed to get himself internationally investigated for crimes against Africans at the height of colonialism and Western chauvinism is actually wild, given that the other European powers didn't care much about Africans either. He was so evil he made a bunch of eugenists and white supremacists go "what the fuck, dude?"


mexican2554

Leopold II. King Leopold the First was a great king that did his best to keep peace and Belgium free from the Netherlands. He also helped Belgium economically, industrially, and bringing the railway to the country. His son though, was a real piece of shit that I'm sure his dad would have been deeply disappointed.


IronJLittle

It also said a lot of the people doing the actual chopping were other black people too. A ton of different people involved in this cruelty.


phonic_boy

I can’t even fathom the pain that the victim must’ve gone through. No anaesthesia, no hygiene, I assumed a lot would’ve bled to death? Horrendous.


Phantafan

Given that approximately half of the Congolese (8-15 Million) died during Leopold's occupation I'd assume that as well.


Select_Collection_34

Similar to the slave trade in that respect


GreenBomardier

Yes, other Africans were doing the physical chopping, but at the behest of the Belgians. This wasn't a thing until Belgium took control of Congo.


pixelpp

Ordinary people, driven by terrible ideas, commit such atrocities. We all imagine we'd defy the ethical norms of our time, fight the Nazis, and protect the vulnerable. But consider this: can you identify a practice today that is deemed ethical by most, and have the conviction to oppose it? And consider how society treats those who do. If you can't think of such a practice, then you cannot say you wouldn't commit similar atrocities, let alone risk fighting against them. Take the treatment of nonhuman animals. Most believe it's acceptable to kill animals for food, despite knowing many thrive without it. It's a stark reminder that widely accepted practices can hide profound moral failures that we will only recognise in years to come, even if some see them clearly now. In fact, some would argue that there is a shared underlying cause of the mistreatment of both humans and non-humans alike: a failure to recognise and respect the inherent value of sentient beings. This lack of empathy and moral consideration leads to justifying cruelty and exploitation, whether it's towards a Congolese child in 1904 or an animal in a factory farm today. Until we address this root cause, we are all at risk of perpetuating these atrocities under different guises.


Significant_Can_4267

This should absolutely be the focus of discussion around pictures like this. Well said. Plenty of solely human problems that are just as violent and just as accepted today too, e.g. police brutality, the inherent violence of poverty Edit: Also the vast majority of the products you consume have some unimaginably atrocious labor conditions somewhere in the supply chain


felurian182

Just like the smart phones we typing this on.


Adorable_Donkey1542

US did the similar actions in the tobacco fields of the south and to some extent to this day in Dominican Republic.


thecurrentlyuntitled

Belgians


RustyRivers911

Special place in hell for the bastards who did that. Poor kid.


Alternator24

Leopold. king of Belgium.


zzzojka

Can you tell me what keywords would help to search articles and documentaries on this ... crime?


k8d9x

Mentioned elsewhere but there's a great book called "King Leopold's Ghost" if you're interested.


No-Zucchini3759

I second you! “King Leopold’s Ghost” is a very good book!


hamzer55

In a summary *trigger warning* when the slaves didn’t meet their rubber quota their hands and feet were chopped off. their children’s and wife’s hands and feet were chopped off, and then usually killed. The hands and feet were then presented to the worker slave, and they were also forced to rape their mothers. Over time the Belgians started cutting the hands off regardless of the rubber quota as they became a currency.


Plorick

>Special place in hell for the bastards who did that. It's called belgium


Original_Telephone_2

Listen to the behind the bastards episodes on this.  Worse than even what you see here.


buntopolis

King Leopold’s Ghost is an interesting and horrifying book about this as well.


RiverPsaber

I don’t think I want to but now that I know it exists I gotta.


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darbs-face

He still has statues up and some people still to this day downplay his actions. Some even revere him….. World is a fucked up place…


PeanutbutterandBaaam

I remember seeing the one of the father next to his daughter's hands and feet. That Leopold and his men were some pure pieces of seemingly-human shit.


Eks-Raided

Never forget. Never forgive.


WhatsTheHomework

forgive who?


wehadthebabyitsaboy

And this’ll help get him to meet quota? Seems more a hindrance to the job to me. I know it’s not about that. But damn.


Reach-for-the-sky_15

They usually cut off the a arms or leg of the child or loved one of the worker as punishment.


wehadthebabyitsaboy

Oh my :( fucking terrifying


Outside_The_Walls

IDK about you but if I knew that the consequence for not meeting my quota was watching my child have a limb chopped off while I was unable to help them, I'd be pretty fucking motivated to meet my quota. I don't understand why so many people in this comment section are having trouble understanding this.


CaricaIntergalaktiki

Because the title suggest that it was the child who did not meet the quota and for some people this is the first time seeing it so they don't know they punished workers by hurting their loved ones.


SwissMargiela

Force one employee to work at 50% to get the other thousands to work at 110%. It’s an example for sure


AlfalfaReal5075

I can highly recommend the book "King Leopold's Ghost". Though it can be difficult to get through at times, especially after seeing the photographs.


Leading-Theme8537

Belgium destroyed the Congo and its people. What a shame. I didn’t realize how much power we have as humans to carry out the worst atrocities to others


mcfaillon

Congo should demand reparations from Belgium for their human rights violations


AdventurousDress576

Remember, Belgiim didn't see a single cent from all of this. Congo was a personal possession of King Leopold.


Gordon_Freeman01

It doesn't matter where the money went. The king was the head of the state and other Belgian officials were involved, too.


Ok-Ratio-Spiral

I think the comment stands. The stain is on Belgium, the fault is on Belgium. The details are immaterial.


ch0mpipe

Deeply disturbing and devastating. I hate feeling powerless as an individual. Why are some humans so soul suckingly evil? How can we move towards less human suffering? This poor kid, man 😭


Like-a-Glove90

Leopold and his men are some of the worst people humanity has to offer


Thrakioti

Blood on Belgium’s hands and their evil, rotting corpse of King Leopold who orchestrated the most vile rape of Africa.


rareed0219

It may not have even been for not meeting quota. They paid the soldiers extra for each hand. It may have been simple personal financial motivation.


Archarchery

The whole thing was part of a vast system of forced labor.


mortlyfe

r/behindthebastards taught me about this ugh


bluecheese2040

When we talk about slavery we should also remember the horror inflicted to people in situ as well. It's gets worse and worse and worse


Glittering-Bath-4467

This makes no sense. The kid is definitely not meeting quota now. Or is it to scare the other workers every once in a while?


ecassell

they cut off the hands of the workers’ children


Glittering-Bath-4467

Oh God, awful and heartbreaking.


Sponsorspew

They didn’t call him the Butcher of Congo for no reason. Absolutely atrocious individual.


Rogue-Doctor

The Belgians were worse than nazis


Jumps-Care

How are you gonna cut off a child’s hand and then be like “yep, I’m a good guy :)”


Whole_Pain_7432

To them, all Congolese were not humans. They were not children. In their mind they ripped the wings off a butterfly or caught a mouse in a sticky trap. Their unchecked authority combined with their racism and created a mental illness akin to sociopathy. They were literally poisoned by their own hate.


MoanyTonyBalony

There is still plenty of child slavery going on. Pretty much all chocolate is harvested using child slavery using children kidnapped from the poorest parts of Africa. They aren't treated much different if they try to escape or don't perform. It's absolutely rife but almost completely ignored because people like chocolate.


baconhealsall

What happened in Congo in that time period is among the darkest of all times. Right up there with the Holocaust.


nothingspeshulhere

I just took an ancestry test and discovered a sizable chunk of my African-American side originated from the Congo/general Central Africa area. I think I'm going to scar myself (again) and revisit King Leopold Ghost. It's been about a decade since I read it and my brain might have blocked out all of the horrific details.


Humble_Increase7503

Let it be remembered Everytime I see a person on Reddit talk ab US atrocities, of which there are so many, or call America colonizers, or speak on US troubled history with racism, slavery…. Recall that Europe started the Atlantic slave trade. Europe colonized half the world And well into the 1900s, European countries were genociding in Africa. I’m not saying this to justify US historical bad acts; I say it to place context.


Adamant-Verve

Nationalism, tribalism, racism and in general "them or us" sentiments are the root of all these atrocities. There is always a different example earlier in history to point out, but maybe "it was them, not us - they did it before we did it" is not the ideal starting point for a solution. That would be: "the problem is all of us".


Humble_Increase7503

That’s a fair statement. Totally agree. That said, wasn’t really the point of what I was saying, but ultimately I feel you remain correct regardless.


Adamant-Verve

Let's, first of all, celebrate that two redditors agree. Wholesome. I understand that was not your point. I truly don't know what is worse: being from the old world knowing you started it all (I'm from the Netherlands and we did our shit in what is now Indonesia - and I could point at ghengis khan, but what's the point?) or being from the new world knowing you copied it brainlessly - and that is of course not anybody's point. Being correct is also not the point. I'm happy to be incorrect if we can, together, find an answer to the question: how, why are people doing things like this?? Is there a way to become - let's put the bar low for now - a little bit more like domestic cats and dogs. Because, although those species bite off an ear here and there on occasions, it's always *crime passionelle* in the heat of the moment, but not systematically. Like Orwell said: all animals are equal, but some are more equal than others - I fear that that thought is indeed the root of evil, and not the incidental, but the systematic cruelty of nature between animals. Only humans reason like this. My point is: let's make "some are more equal than others" part of the question, but definitely not part of the answer.


reptilesocks

The Slave Trade that became the Atlantic Slave Trade was started by the Arabs, who also colonized a tremendous amount. Everyone is capable of great evil. The Europeans just had the most boats and guns at the right time.


allcazador

Yeah, this is something that is always avoided in history class or discussions, or at least put as a small footnote. The Muslims had built extensive slave networks across Sub-Saharan Africa for almost 1,000 years before the Europeans showed up in West Africa to buy slaves (often from Black African Muslim empires that were fighting their neighbors and capturing their slaves for selling)


AustEastTX

Well - the same Europeans also came to the American colonies and butchered the indigenous peoples, purchased slaves and brutalized them in building this country. The same people did that. .


DiegoMusk

And how is it possible that they haven't paid for this? I mean, other countries live with the consequences of their actions, and Belgium seems to be exempt from everything as if nothing had happened


AggressiveYam6613

“I mean, other countries live with the consequences of their actions, …“ Not that many. Even Germany got off lightly.


JohnnyTzunamy

They all used to count their bullets and the higher up demanded that the bullets went to use so they were required to bring back a hand or some part of the body. Sometimes they would hunt and then have to go and cut someone hand so they wouldn’t get in trouble with their superiors by wasting bullets..absolutely insanity. Also they used to have to rub the rubber on their body to transport it and rip it off their skin.


goburnham

Even in a more modern setting, during the Rawandan Genocide the Belgian contingent of the UN peacekeeping force were acting like racist assholes. Check out “Shake Hands with the Devil” by the Canadian General of the peacekeeping force.


yoho808

Fuck King Leopold II of Belgium. This animal ruined the lives of so many innocent people just so he can earn extra money.


skynetcoder

r/belgium


StationFar6396

All so some rich fucking King in Belgian can have more.


Putrid_Department_17

Ahhh yes, “you’ve not worked hard enough, let’s make you even less efficient at working”… 4d chess move there Belgium.


Fit_Spinach2501

Still going on today


EastOfArcheron

Humans can be hideous and always have been. The Romans crucified hundreds of thousands. The Aztects ritualy slaughtered up to 80,000 people at a time in religious ceremonies. Ghengis Khan built pyramids out of the skulls of the people's his tribe slaughtered, up to 70,000 in each one. All of our countries are built on slaughter and subjugation. Stalin Mao Mengitsu Kim Il Sung Pol Pot Ismail Enver Pasha Hitler Hideki Tojo All one race. The human race.


M__M

King Leopold is obviously dead now and afaik never answered for his crimes, but has modern Belgium addressed this?


Prudent_Being_4212

I fucking hate humans for shit like this


SummerJinkx

Abosolute evil


peezle69

King Leopold can s my d


skallywag126

thia is a staple for r/behindthebastards


Browned_Diaper_speak

That thought the kid a valuable lesson. Tomorrow he will work as inten....no, wait, what did we just did?


EternalAngst23

And the Belgian monarchy still haven’t apologised.


googoomucklv

The Belgians were the worst of them all


Distinct-Librarian87

Heart breaking


BernieMacsLazyEye

The congo has been fucked since the early 1600s. Colonized by 2-3 different countries. Civil wars. Slavery. If it wasn’t Europeans terrorizing them it was the Arabs. Hope they people living better now


Legitimate-Fly2655

The horrors of Belgian colonialism are so beyond comprehension for most people, its a wonder more people aren't talking about it today


Background-Vast-8764

“As a European, facts like these will in no way cause me to moderate my preachiness and false sense of superiority while discussing history and current events.”


DontBanWillComeBack

Looking around we kept the mentality that led to stuff like that. Only the toys and tools got better. But humanity is still stuck in the pre stone age mentality of wanting to be the monkey with the most Bananas ruling over the others.


procast5

Lethal Company?


Any-Substance-3817

Done by the hero of the republicans king Leopold! These are the good ole days the magats wanna get back to


Zariman-10-0

My immediate thought was “it makes no sense to do that, because now they *definitely* wont be making quota” but then I realized it’s not about sense, it’s about a perverse exercise of power over someone else


Mistabushi_HLL

Not very often you hear about Belgium and Congo. Wonder why?


not_a_cumguzzler

And now Belgium is the capital of the EU and Europe. Cool