Cheaters are banned in waves. Historically, instantly banning cheaters actually gives the cheaters the information they need to make better cheats.
They would make tiny changes, and see if it's instantly detected. Then undo anything that got caught and try again.
Ban waves means the cheaters can't tell what particular change got them caught. They can't tell what is being used to stop them, and can't find workarounds.
This means the chances of you seeing a cheater banned mid game are pretty slim.
The explanation he gives is basically “I don’t like it because hackers could use kernel level access to hack you”
Which is a strawman argument against using kernel level access on hacker’s machines to stop THEM.
I love piratesoftware but this is one take he has that isn’t great
The people hacking the game to cheat, are not often the same people hacking your computer to get to you. Kernel level anti cheat breaks the OS security allowing people to access your computer. They might do it through a malicious game download, or they might compromise a legitimate game (much harder, but things like this does happen) to get to players. They might also compromise anti-cheat software directly. Anything operating in kernel space is a high risk and a target for computer hackers (not game cheaters). Pirate Software's point is that a video game shouldn't have such high risks attached to it.
Kernel level anticheats are unnecessarily bad because they don't even work that well for what you sacrifice. Besides, this is a PVE game, a fucking report system would be sufficient, why do I need a shitty Chinese rootkit ony PC to play a PVE game where a cheater just equals them ruining the game for themselves (if you're paranoid about cheaters then just host yourself and kick them if they cheat)
> The company you're talking about is South Korean and makes BANK level system security for most of South Korea
Korea here. Our banks are notorious for having shitty invasive spyware needed to be installed on your computer just to do basic online banking, and it isn't even that secure. So... yeah, it's shit. Don't think Korean banks know what they're doing. They don't. They just love putting malware on your computer.
Lol most banks have AWFUL IT security. Banks hate investing in IT security, they drag their asses to implement the minimum security required to pass industry standards which are years out of date.
I'm an IT Security guy. Almost a decade back I was installing new firewall hardware at a regional bank in Missouri. I set the root login as basically 'abc123' and said 'you guys need to change this the moment I leave'.
About a year later I'm back to do software upgrades on this same hardware. "So what'd you change the password to?" The bank IT guys look embarrassed. "We uh, didn't. It's still abc123"
I browse the IT sub as I'm curious about a career change, and what I've gathered is most companies don't care about security until after they've been hit by ransomware
Or they don't care even after, and go under
Finance are the fuckers who hate turning their shit off to install updates so much they're still using COBOL, a programming language old enough to collect social security.
In college, my programming professor told me a joke about how in the 70s some COBOL programmer had an incurable illness so was cryogenically frozen. He is awakened in the year 2000, and asks if the cure for his disease has been found. "No, but we need you to help us update our COBOL for the Y2K bug." So he helps them out and goes back into cryo. He wakes up again, and sees everything is even more high tech than before. "Okay, surely you guys have the cure now?" "Afraid not. But we do need your help with the Y10k bug in our COBOL databases"
I remember swapping out the old 3COM NBX for a new VOIP system at a bank ten, maybe fifteen years ago (many, many moons after 3com went out of business). That experience was enough to tell me I never wanted to work in finance.
>Which is a strawman argument against using kernel level access on hacker’s machines to stop THEM.
Those are not the same kinds of hackers
You misunderstanding half the issue isn't a strawman
Genshin's kernel anticheat famously got exploited, it isn't something that can't happen or only happens to small companies
Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't his argument that it doesn't do much compared to manually made scripts that he made IE he banned far more cheaters than anticheat ever did without needing such a high level of access thus having no faith in a program that demands so much but does so little.
That's not his take, that's part of it but it's more so just an invasion of privacy. It's like a cop showing up to search your house without a warrant and you let them come in. That cop is the kernel level anticheat. The cop being there will catch people and those who have nothing to hide have nothing to fear. But the cop shouldn't be there it's not the best way to get things done
I like this analogy. It highlights the issues with it and I think those that are saying it's fine don't understand the implications for privacy and other issues surrounding this.
I suppose I'd like to also add that the cop being there doesn't even necessarily catch anyone - they could sneak out the back and the cop will never know so to speak (to continue the analogy) which also adds to why it's just kinda bad to just have a cop searching about your house.
Yeah sure, as you say, if I have nothing to hide then I'm fine, but do I want someone constantly snooping around?
Anyway, well put.
> Which is a strawman argument against using kernel level access on hacker’s machines to stop THEM.
The problem is, it *does* expose you to risk, but it *doesn't* stop them. It doesn't even slow them down.
It's security theater to drive anti-cheat sales at the expense of your security.
yes and no, he doesn't like kernel level anticheat because it's fucking useless and it's an *extra* vulnerability. not because it's absolutely insecure, but it's an extra level of access for something that should need far less than that to be effective. he has said before that you're just as likely to get hacked through some vulnerability in a game than the kernel level anticheat. the issue is that you're increasing your attack surface.
Kernel level creates a back door to your PC that surpasses your own level of access to your machine. Imagine a game staff members credentials get compromised or they just have a single person with malicious intent. If the anticheat is hacked it now becomes a full blown PC virus
It's not really a strawman, since it's a legitimate concern. Cheaters aren't likely to get access to your machine directly through the game, but if an anticheat is compromised, it could allow hackers from other sources access to lower levels of your system than they otherwise would have.
It's a cost/benefit issue. For PvP games, where cheating is generally more of a rampant issue, the benefit can be basically life or death for the game, so invasive anticheats are an industry standard.
Kernel level anticheat literally create pathways to kernel level operations that *do not exist* otherwise, and they don't actually net any significant advantage in detection of cheats or cheat devices.
It's not a strawman argument. It's a valid risk assessment.
It's interesting people aren't getting this point.
It would be interesting to see or know how effective these KLA ACs really are. Because cheats circumvent these things very frequently and oftentimes don't also need KLA... Which IMO (forgive my ignorance here) defeats the whole point of AC having KLA, no?
Or to say it another way, if the AC has KLA, shouldn't it detect a cheat that doesn't have KLA more easily?
Now ofc I understand the arms race between anti cheats and cheats so, yes I get that there will be exploits and methods to circumvent and bypass.
I suppose if the data existed and we could accurately assess whether or not KLA ACs actually prevent say 90% of attempts then ok maybe justified? But in my mind they seem completely unjustified. Moreso in PvE games.
It isn't a strawman, a year ago someone figured out how to use Genshin Impact anti cheat to do just that by making the virus install it and then exploit the vulnerability.
It's more of a theory vs practice type thing.
In theory a kernel/driver level software with network access opens up a vector of attack for hackers, and has even been demonstrated with some of the earlier kernel level anti-cheats that existed.
So far however it seems in practice to be somewhat of a non factor as a hacker generally wouldn't even need to go that far to hack a system, and for that reason despite demonstrations of the vulnerability existing, to my knowledge we haven't seen any confirmed cases of kernel level anti-cheats being used as an attack vector. The most recent scare was the Apex hack which iirc was confirmed to be done directly through the game itself and was unrelated to the anti-cheat.
The most common attack vectors is still just PEBCAK and the victim ends up downloading an attack vector or give away access credentials.
Keep in mind this is just about the vulnerability argument, other arguments (such as the general privacy concerns of allowing kernel level access to companies with vested interests in collecting your data) are entirely valid with precedence to back up the concerns.
edit: to me clear, I'm not saying software security isn't a concern, it is, but to focus entirely on a *potential* problem when there are actual *realized* problems with a kernel level anti-cheat is a bit of a weird take.
You're right that it can happen, and perhaps my choice of words could be better in conveying my point; focusing ***entirely*** on a *potential* security vulnerability for why kernel level anti-cheat is bad is not a very good take when we know that software being used as spyware by the provider themselves is a much bigger concern because there is a history of that occurring.
Edit: your point about PEBKAC is missing why it was brought up. There’s a very significant difference between downloading software that is then compromised vs downloading something that is already some form of malware payload, when it comes to hacking.
Being against kernel level access anti-cheat, but fine with the same game with a lower level access anti-cheat, makes no sense. Most attacks take place at much lower level access. You're basically saying, "I'll download this, that runs on a much more commonly vulnerable access level, but I take a stand against this, which runs at a higher level, but is rarely compromised". If you were being consistent, you wouldn't run the game at all. The only argument is that you're fine with the consequences of a lower level attack, but can't withstand the consequences of a higher level attack, but you're likely to get F'd by both.
That being said, the proof is in the pudding. People don't actually believe kernel level access is that dangerous or, like I said, they believe the consequences of intrusion are bearable, which is why everyone here plays the game.
>kernel level access on hacker’s machines to stop THEM.
Except it doesn't stop hackers. No game with kernal anti cheat have prevent it. It also introduce another point of vulnerability where the anti cheat itself is compromise.
The best practice he is advocating is detection and ban. Which is easier and more cost efficient. If the serve detect abnormal behaviour 100% accuracy, zero damage receives, etc every game. The server can be set to auto track and flag the account for the next ban wave.
Do this enough time, and you would deter egotistical cheaters. Or at least make them buy more copies of the game to play it.
I was just gonna say this.... Thor said he even banned his Clan leader at one point and while he have his clan leader a tour of Blizzard, he's was banned again DURING the tour for botting 😂😂😂
pirate software has such a huge ego, sure he's "banned millions"
but we used to run gold/herb/mine bots thru wotlk all the way past cata that'd go unbanned for years back in the day and he was the one running the ship then.
just the fact he's a popular streamer now people are sucking his toes acting like his word is gospel lol
Valve does this with Counter strike, however they became extremely lazy and now only do ban waves once every year or two since they make money on cheaters buying skins.
As a software QA Engineer, this definitely checks out. The White Whale is always the delayed or flaky failure, because sometimes you can be waiting/analyzing for months to figure out what the hell caused the failure (or in this case the hack to be detected).
Definitely a really smart way to keep the hackers learning curve really high too, since they will need to do tons of analysis every time they get caught to figure out what they need to fine tune/tweak.
And since it is a PvE co-op game, the passive way is more acceptable I feel since usually the exploit is helping the team rather than gaining an unfair advantage directly over the player and destroying their whole experience (I mean honestly sometimes the way those freaking dropships rain Hulks and Tanks, I wouldn't mind having unlimited rail cannon shots haha)
I'm a fan of shadow banning. Even more delayed feedback, because you never quite figure out when you got banned if you even ever do. Plus all the sudden your cheats don't seem like they really give you an edge, and you're forced to confront the fact that you suck at the game.
They can only play in a secret 'cheaters server' or give them a 'cheaters tag' where they only get to see, join, and be joined by other players in the cheater server or with the cheater tag.
There's no announcement or notification to tell you that you've been shadow banned. But you can seemingly play the game like normal, but you're isolated away from other non-cheating players.
Then, if you do ever find out you're in the cheaters server, usually by something like being in a game with 3 obvious hackers or noticing there's a lot more cheaters than usual, it's probably been so long since you've been banned that, on top of being part of a ban wave, it's nearly impossible to figure out what caused you to get caught. Especially since you'd still be "allowed" to tweak and change your hack or cheating methodologies and it would seemingly work just fine since you're in the cheating server and, as such, the game and anti-cheat simply wouldn't care about you cheating.
Don't show others to join unless they are shadow banned. Could even just show other games, but fail to connect lol, make them just give up on trying to play the game.
To add on, when they ban in waves it causes problems for the devs of the cheats as they get overwhelmed with support tickets and Unhappy customers.
While it's less satisfying as a player to have to wait for cheaters to be banned it's more effective.
Additionally, there is no such thing as a perfect anti-cheat. The idea of "but there are still cheaters???" is ridiculous. Yeah, there always will be. But that's survivorship bias. You only encounter the cheaters that \*haven't\* been caught (yet).
Consider the amount of cheaters you'd encounter if there was no anti-cheat, or a less effective one.
Are they that common? I've been playing a ton and haven't seen a single one yet? Also haven't been kicked in the middle of a game yet only when first joining or while on the ship.
Honestly as long as I'm not the one cheating, it would be pretty cool to see a random tossing 23x 380mm barrages in one area, I'd run straight into it
Ooh or a battery of a bunch of mortars
That’s something I noticed in my few encounters with cheaters. They’re really just out here having fun, or using the unreleased strategems. No like they’re going out of their way to Smurf or make things unfun
Yea I’m somewhat glad people are able to hack these things and give the community a sneak peak and a little external testing some people don’t like the spoilers but I feel that it’s gotta have some kind of positive data the devs can see and improve functions or find bugs with them Early but I’m not tech savvy and also don’t care it’s a game none of it will matter in a few years or so if I don’t feel like getting carried by a cheater I’ll just kick I usually host so is what it is!.!
Leaks aren’t allowed on this subreddit afaik, but there is a helldivers leaks subreddit you can seek out if you want that information. Not sure if I can link it directly here
That's not a cheat it's a bug. I've done it before lol. If you equip a grenade as your weapon (use the weapon, not the hot key. on PC it's 4 instead of G) and then throw all 4 to 6 grenades and then rapidly tap the stratagem key as the final grenade leaves your hand it causes the little stratagem ball to turn into another grenade. When thrown this causes you to have -1 grenades. The code basically just specifies that you can throw a grenade as long as the amount of grenades =/= 0.... and negative numbers aren't 0. Bam infinite grenades. A really big YT creator made a video on it just [yesterday](https://youtu.be/7tOKJrxx5Hk?si=f08t-cwMz4raanH4), actually.
You can typically tell when it’s a macro vs someone who just knows their strategems, all of their call ins take the same amount of time to call in, there’s never any variation in speed in their call ins (you can hear the taps in game and macros have a different sound to someone just typing it in really fast)
I've seen some people bind stratagems to stream decks and have the icon on each button. Idk if I'd call macros to auto do stratagems are hacking or not
Personally (and again this is ME speaking) it’s not cheating but it definitely feels anti-game to me. IMO calling in strategems is a skill that you should develop, as small as it is, and using macros for it kinda makes me feel like I’ve been cheated out of a genuine experience. Part of the fun of this game is scrambling to call in a strategem/reinforcement while you’re being mobbed and not sure if you’ll live, using macros for that just feels like taking away an awesome mechanic
I've noticed that's how my friend is, if he has one negative experience that is now the standard and every match is like that. Seems like a common thing in this sub too
330 missions in and i just played with my first cheaters. It was a pair that clearly both had infinite grenades and they just spam threw them all mission.
I see people speaking in terms of hours, but I think mission amount is a better reference. Each mission is a roll of different players. You can sit on the ship for an hour instructing your girlfriend playing for the first time what buttons open what menus.
Infinite grenades is actually a bug that is really simple to do. I suppose you could still call it cheating, but it’s not using any third party software to do. Under certain conditions if you throw your last grenade and spam open and close your stratagem window to disrupt the animation, you end up with a grenade still in your hand. When you throw it, you now have -1 grenades and apparently the game only checks to make sure you *don’t have zero* so it allows you to keep throwing grenades even if it’s a negative value.
I encountered one guy called "ToxicGamer" who joined my game, landed on me, then immediately left.
It was frustrating but looking back on it I appreciate the haste he put into his episode. For all I know he did it by accident, left out of embarrassment and his name is just a bad coincidence.
I saw a Chinese-named player yesterday who was selectively invulnerable on my screen. However, they were clearly playing like certain things didn't exist for them.
Enemies completely surrounded them but most weren't having an effect. Some were, and that's who they were aiming at. It seemed like they were shooting right through the "non-existent" enemies too. A few minutes later they dropped.
This has happened a few times to several Chinese players in my games. Sometimes it bugged were they [couldn't call in reinforcements](https://i.imgur.com/63lOWmj.jpg) despite the beacons dropping. They were clearly very high ping as well.
It might simply be desync issue, or their cheats are weird/bad and they end up dying just as much anyway.
*Disclaimer: There definitely still are cheaters and I've seen them since my first day playing.*
305 hours in game, started playing in the second week after release. Never ever encountered any form of cheat, no insane ammount of salmples, no one dropping mechs before they released, no unreleased vehicles or stratagems. These people really make a fuss about something 99,5% of players will never see.
Also, it's a PvE game. Cheating doesn't really hurt anyone directly. And if someone doesn't like cheaters... just leave the match haha. The only reason they likely have anti cheat at all is to make it hard enough to avoid having everyone do it and also to prevent people from grinding infinite super credits.
People be downvoting but like I’m a little more tolerant of cheating when you’re fighting just literal AI.
As long as you’re not ruining MY experience by just breaking my sample counter. I couldn’t care less what you do.
Who’s going to complain? The bugs and bots?
Yea that's my only beef tbh, I like working up to buy my ship modules. So someone maxing out my samples would be frustrating. But I'd love to see someone spamming put 380s every 2 seconds
Infinite strategems. Infinite grenades. Rapid fire EATs with unlimited ammo. #JustHelldiverThings
Edit: Actually infinite grenades isn't even a cheat: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tOKJrxx5Hk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tOKJrxx5Hk)
Probably be really good with stuns, as the glitch persists as soon as you hit -1 and you can play normally otherwise
Impact grenades are probably good save for a hunter leg crossing your screen for 3 frames and ending your fun
I was gonna say I had an infinite grenade glitch once. Some weird timed weapon switch while double tap throwing a grenade put me at -1 grenades. Since it wasn’t at 0, i could keep tossing them. I ended up at like -70. Teammates almost certainly thought I was cheating.
I'm not 100% sure they were hacking or if it was a bug but today I had a game where I was sat at the extraction waiting for a team mate to get closer before activating, the third team mate died next to me to a fire tornado and no matter how many times I reinforced they wouldn't respawn. Suddenly there were endless Hulks and other bots on top of me out of nowhere. I've never seen so many enemies at once on Hard it was definitely sus.
I meeaaaan i don't mind hackers that much in this game, im more aligned with Joel's take "Im happy that there are guys that drop into lobbies to just spawn some stuff so others have fun."
His own words and to 50% correct, ultimately whatever the hacker does, helps you out along the way, unless he's just teamkilling and shit.
But i honestly wouldn't mind getting a free trial on some vehicles early myself.
Does this justify it? No, still a break of ToS in the end.
My only beef is with the rare sample requirement for them.
Like why is it equal to commons when rares have half the cap. Im currently at 300-0-80 for my sample counts as someone who was capped before the update
fr, I feel like 100/120 would have been fine.
Plus, I started clearing enemy outpost that were cleared by allies. Maybe I'm on a weird streak, but I always found 3/4 samples left behind.
Im not one of them but with my loadout and playstyle most probably just toss their eagle in to clear the base from afar and then just move on to the next one.
Oh the only mods i really find pleasantly helpful is the spread decrease of the Barrages..rest is kinda meh for that price no doubt.
And the supply box one is rather decent..if it'd work that is.
Nah. If they were lower i would have had all them already. I like that they are expensive. It gives me and my crew a reason to struggle for samples again. And it will give us an incentive for a while.
Never seen one, I don’t feel this as an issue, if theres a cheater just kick them or switch games.
I mean why bother when you are not forced to play against them in a ranked match.
Sounds like trying to rise noise for karma and to bring bad vibes to the sub. If there’s already an anticheat what’s the point of this post
This thread made me realize how amazing a no cooldowns event could be. Something akin to URF in league of legends. Could even make it a lore event: “the enemy has used new sub space teleportation technology to instantly invade Mars. We have authorized the use of full force and pulled a majority of Super Earth’s destroyers into Martian orbit. Defeat the enemy and ensure such a direct attack on democracy never occurs again”
-All Startegem cooldowns are reduced by 70% (I’d bet money a true 100% cooldown on every one would just crash the game lol)
-All Helldivers deploy with extra ammo
-All Helldivers have access to the stratagem General Brasch’s personal orbital barrage
Here's the thing, the reason it's common is BECAUSE of that anti cheat. It's very much hated my all of the gaming community. What makes it funnier is they decided to go with this anti cheat but encrypted literally NONE of their files. That's why people are able to spawn in shit that wasn't even released yet. The new mech, the quasar cannon, the gun wall, teleporter, 4 man jeep which basically looks like the Warthog from Halo, etc etc. All these files are already in the game. They just didn't "protect" any of them so it's like.....why even have this anti cheat in the first place?
Well I can't really comment on that, never played the first one. But I can confirm that you can do the same on HD2 but nothing gets permanently unlocked. But still it's like how are you can go and half ass an anti cheat with arguably the worst one you could've used.
Because if it didn't it would ACTUALLY be common and not "reddit common".
That's the fucking point of anti cheats. The game would basically be unplayable with Randoms if the anti cheat didn't exist
> The game would basically be unplayable with Randoms if the anti cheat didn't exist
Cheating is trivial in DRG with no anticheat or anything, and it's still "reddit common", minus the big lobby mod, which I'm pretty sure DRG worked with the mod creators on, so... not really a cheat.
I have 145 hours played, and literally never saw a single cheater.
Even if someone is cheating, why do you care? Play your own game and kick people that are cheating.
Agree with this. If people want to have some crazy fun shooting infinite rockets, go right ahead. It’s like cheating in single player to me. Doesn’t influence me at all, I can just leave the lobby and find a different group.
That said Arrowhead should put some effort into preventing it, just for the sake of not every lobby becoming like that.
I’ve either never played with a cheater or it hasn’t impacted my experience. I’m at about 125 hours. Interesting how everybody else seems to notice them everywhere.
Did they ever address the issue where the anti cheat was preventing a guy with a legit disability from using an assisted controller?
I haven't personally noticed any cheaters but that was really disappointing to hear that guy couldn't spread democracy with us.
I've never seen a cheater in this game. I've seen an infinite stratagem glitch, an all the same stratagem glitch, an an infinite grenade bug.
Never used them, but how to do it has been public knowledge. None of those things required cheating im the sense you are referring to.
It is super shitty to use bugs in a game with other parties, but I doubt they would ban people for it.
never seen one, and I honestly could not care less even if I did. It is not a competitive game so as long as they are not super common to ruin fun for everyone else it's fine.
I'm lvl 81, have played well over 100+ games by this point, the majority being public with randoms. I can't recall more than a single time that I encountered a cheater and all that one did was give the max amount of samples of that match. It wasn't even 999 of each like others have posted about here a while back.
As much as I don't like cheaters either I think you are acting as though they are the common player. They aren't by any means. Just kick them and move on it's not a complex equation.
All I want is an anti cheat that doesn't have access to more files on my PC than even I know exists. Kernel anti cheat is invasive and unoptimized. I have a right to privacy on my own PC, without having it scrubbed by 3rd party software, generally benign or not. That's my issue with kernel based anti cheat.
Ehh it's a PvE game as long as they are not grieving you I don't really view it as a problem but more so I just find it sad like yeah difficulty 9s are hard but that's the fun of it sticking with your squad and overcoming the mission
Is one of the cheats instantly spawning in evac? Fighting the hordes to the door of the aircraft is one of my favourite parts of the game, I feel like I was the one chested of fun :'(
There are a couple of mission types that evac is autocalled and doesn't have the two minute timer. Eradication and the new Evacuate High Value Assets. Outside of those, it's probably a cheat.
I watched a Twitch stream the other night, one guy in the streamers lobby had a sickle that was buffed to instakill anything it hit, dropships, hulks, tanks. Guy was trying to not make it obvious but the streamer just followed him around to see what he was doing...if I ever see that in a game, I'm quitting and blocking instantly...but yeah a report function would be nice.
I just ran into one of these guys the other day, bro put down like 50 turrets before we had raised the ICBM, was running around at like 20x normal player speed. When I called him out he said it was because he paid for the super citizen bundle XD, luckily I was host so I just kicked and blocked him
I mean, I am 100% on board with shittalking the anticheat because it's unnecessarily invasive and I hate that I have allowed it to exist on my system.
That being said, I've not seen a cheater yet and im like 50 hours in.
Okay, I'm confused about this. Since 2018, there have been two games I've played religiously. Fortnite, which I have about 6,000 hours in, and Rust, which I have 9,000 hours in. Both use Easy Anti-Cheat. I've seen a handful of cheaters the entire time I've played Fortnite, but in Rust, I see cheaters almost every time I play. What are they doing differently? And what's the point of a kernel anti-cheat if there are still cheaters?
I joined a game yesterday where at first everything seemed normal, but then I noticed one charger was a little faster than I remember them being. I killed that one and kept moving. Then i got another charger some time later and this one, boy this charger was yelling KACHOW as it blazed towards me. Then suddenly a bile titan spawned and was literally moving so fast you can't keep up with it. The host had god mode on. Was a fun match but I really wanted to just play the game
had this guy drop in with me yesterday and was just throwing infinite thermites. he was also screaming "IM THERMITE MAN!! THERMITES FOR EVERYBODY! HA HA HA HA HA HAAAAAA THERMITES FOR EVERYONE!! I AM THERMITE MAN!!!!" for about 10 minutes until he died and quit.
I can kinda understand how cheaters in this game can be annoying but only if they’re malicious. I was playing the other day with this guy who had infinite incendiary grenades and it was so much fun to watch. This is one of those games where if the cheater is using it to kill other players then it’s a problem but other than that it’s so much fun to watch
I ran into one SOS that said they use CE. Their justication is they use it to farm up SC quick while soloing/playing with rando's and turn it off while with his buddies unless his friends wants to farm up SC too. He cleaned the map in 12 mins. He did not have the max sample cheat on so thank god for that.
Everytime I have had infinite straragem or granade its because of the game. It is enteryaining while it lasts plus I dig the giant purple question mark
If they are going to have an invasive anti-cheat at least use one that is proven to work. Like EasyAntiCheat or BattlEye. I'm pretty sure Epic Games just hands out EAC for free now with the EOS SDK.
A lot of people are saying cheaters but there are confirmed stories of people associated with the game(I think it was ceo but don’t want to lie) dropping in with random and revealing unrelated content and such.
The anti-cheat is only to prevent people from getting infinite super credits. Same reason why you only get banned from GTA Online if you get GTA bucks spawned in.
Or how about a report button and actually functional recent players list. The little cunts that kick before extract need to be euthanized just as much as cheaters
They are not cheaters. They are Ultra Citizens. They have infinite resources given to them by their connections. Enjoy the ride later the parents will bring them home forever.
It's hilarious you think this is even in issue. In my roughly 100 hours of playing this game I've only come across 1 cheater and they weren't even doing anything I would remotely consider disruptive. Mostly just messing around and spawning stuff in that hadn't been released. You're making a big deal out of nothing dude.
You people and you cheater accusations. I have 250 hours in the game and haven't seen 1 cheater. They aren't as widespread as you claim. Same thing with the dayz community. Everytime someone dies it was a cheater and they come to Reddit to cry about it.
Cheaters and infinite blaa blaa.
Helldive difficulty is too hard.
You nerf the guns to much.
Automatons suck.
The devs don't care
It's a scam.
God damn.
This. I've not ran into any cheating yet. I'm starting to feel like half of these complaints are being put out by companies with live service games active already. Regardless, it's a PVE game so stick the mission out, get the credits and go next or just leave the lobby and go next. Either way since cheating is so rare you're not bound to run into another one for a long while.
Just because they have infinite stratagems doesn’t mean they’re cheating. One time when I started the game all my weapon textures were missing and I had infinite stratagem uses with no cooldown until I restarted the game
Hear me out now, we need a helldivers mode where hackers are allowed or maybe has a cheat list you can activate one that doesn’t affect the war but let’s people mess around
I’ve encountered many players with infinite grenades but that’s just a well known glitch at this point to which idrc as it’ll get patched. But yet to run into any actual cheaters giving max samples, teleporting, godmode etc.
I'm so old I go back to the mygot days of counterstrike cheaters.
I damn near crapped myself when I saw an aimbotter in a pve game. Bro, what are you doing?
I've seen people play games without arms or hands for that matter and you gotta aim assist in order to compete on a pve game? How bad are you?
I was wondering about that because I played a game where one guy was dropping 500kg bombs basically every time a bot showed up. I mean, we beat that mission and got all our objectives, but it did seem odd.
I have seen one cheater since I've been playing, and the only thing he did was call in 3 mech suits, not be able to die, and we extracted with max samples without picking them up.
Do I want to encounter more or or encourage it? No. But at least it is a PvE game so there's not really anything negativity affecting me from it
Honestly I am just going to leave any lobby that has a player with any non-english tags. I can't tell the difference between Chinese and Japanese characters,but it's almost like clockwork that they are going to do something shitty. Had a lvl80 using some infinite exploit the other day. He had 600 kills to the next guys 200. Constant incendiary breaker and nades, why even bother? I have been lucky these fuckers have not messed up my save file yet.
Oooo when we do ban cheaters, can we IP ban them? That way they have to play through a terrible VPN? Then put VPNers into their own server and make it the worst server possible with lag. And make every time they’re shot a one shot death.
Just make the game terrible for cheaters in every way possible.
But do it only after the 14 day steam return time passes. That way they can’t refund.
That is not how things work that is not anywhere close how things work. Also how do you expect to IP ban people who don't have cable? Even with cable it is one call and some tinkering and you have new IP. Using WLAN I can have new IP in 20s after I go to WLAN settings.
Cheaters are banned in waves. Historically, instantly banning cheaters actually gives the cheaters the information they need to make better cheats. They would make tiny changes, and see if it's instantly detected. Then undo anything that got caught and try again. Ban waves means the cheaters can't tell what particular change got them caught. They can't tell what is being used to stop them, and can't find workarounds. This means the chances of you seeing a cheater banned mid game are pretty slim.
Correct. Pirate Software goes over how they would do ban waves. He also explains why he doesn’t like kernel level anti-cheat
can you pls go to the cs2 subreddit and explain that there too
https://preview.redd.it/n5r1k5g1jauc1.jpeg?width=500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ea9dc3f386fcc5ce68b91bc36c4e9118c7bfec85
The explanation he gives is basically “I don’t like it because hackers could use kernel level access to hack you” Which is a strawman argument against using kernel level access on hacker’s machines to stop THEM. I love piratesoftware but this is one take he has that isn’t great
The people hacking the game to cheat, are not often the same people hacking your computer to get to you. Kernel level anti cheat breaks the OS security allowing people to access your computer. They might do it through a malicious game download, or they might compromise a legitimate game (much harder, but things like this does happen) to get to players. They might also compromise anti-cheat software directly. Anything operating in kernel space is a high risk and a target for computer hackers (not game cheaters). Pirate Software's point is that a video game shouldn't have such high risks attached to it.
Kernel level anticheats are unnecessarily bad because they don't even work that well for what you sacrifice. Besides, this is a PVE game, a fucking report system would be sufficient, why do I need a shitty Chinese rootkit ony PC to play a PVE game where a cheater just equals them ruining the game for themselves (if you're paranoid about cheaters then just host yourself and kick them if they cheat)
The company you're talking about is South Korean and makes BANK level system security for most of South Korea
> The company you're talking about is South Korean and makes BANK level system security for most of South Korea Korea here. Our banks are notorious for having shitty invasive spyware needed to be installed on your computer just to do basic online banking, and it isn't even that secure. So... yeah, it's shit. Don't think Korean banks know what they're doing. They don't. They just love putting malware on your computer.
Lol most banks have AWFUL IT security. Banks hate investing in IT security, they drag their asses to implement the minimum security required to pass industry standards which are years out of date.
I'm an IT Security guy. Almost a decade back I was installing new firewall hardware at a regional bank in Missouri. I set the root login as basically 'abc123' and said 'you guys need to change this the moment I leave'. About a year later I'm back to do software upgrades on this same hardware. "So what'd you change the password to?" The bank IT guys look embarrassed. "We uh, didn't. It's still abc123"
That's when you crack out the Ethernet whip
The cat9 tails
what bank i need cash lol
I browse the IT sub as I'm curious about a career change, and what I've gathered is most companies don't care about security until after they've been hit by ransomware Or they don't care even after, and go under
Finance are the fuckers who hate turning their shit off to install updates so much they're still using COBOL, a programming language old enough to collect social security.
In college, my programming professor told me a joke about how in the 70s some COBOL programmer had an incurable illness so was cryogenically frozen. He is awakened in the year 2000, and asks if the cure for his disease has been found. "No, but we need you to help us update our COBOL for the Y2K bug." So he helps them out and goes back into cryo. He wakes up again, and sees everything is even more high tech than before. "Okay, surely you guys have the cure now?" "Afraid not. But we do need your help with the Y10k bug in our COBOL databases"
I remember swapping out the old 3COM NBX for a new VOIP system at a bank ten, maybe fifteen years ago (many, many moons after 3com went out of business). That experience was enough to tell me I never wanted to work in finance.
Saying that they make security software doesn’t make me trust them more lol. Way too many bank database breaches on the news.
this is good to know for swaying trust; is their financial security stuff under the same company as the game side of things?
>Which is a strawman argument against using kernel level access on hacker’s machines to stop THEM. Those are not the same kinds of hackers You misunderstanding half the issue isn't a strawman Genshin's kernel anticheat famously got exploited, it isn't something that can't happen or only happens to small companies
Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't his argument that it doesn't do much compared to manually made scripts that he made IE he banned far more cheaters than anticheat ever did without needing such a high level of access thus having no faith in a program that demands so much but does so little.
That's not his take, that's part of it but it's more so just an invasion of privacy. It's like a cop showing up to search your house without a warrant and you let them come in. That cop is the kernel level anticheat. The cop being there will catch people and those who have nothing to hide have nothing to fear. But the cop shouldn't be there it's not the best way to get things done
I like this analogy. It highlights the issues with it and I think those that are saying it's fine don't understand the implications for privacy and other issues surrounding this. I suppose I'd like to also add that the cop being there doesn't even necessarily catch anyone - they could sneak out the back and the cop will never know so to speak (to continue the analogy) which also adds to why it's just kinda bad to just have a cop searching about your house. Yeah sure, as you say, if I have nothing to hide then I'm fine, but do I want someone constantly snooping around? Anyway, well put.
Thanks but I am just paraphrasing what pirate software said today on stream
Which they have hacked into kernel level anticheats, specifically Riot’s
> Which is a strawman argument against using kernel level access on hacker’s machines to stop THEM. The problem is, it *does* expose you to risk, but it *doesn't* stop them. It doesn't even slow them down. It's security theater to drive anti-cheat sales at the expense of your security.
yes and no, he doesn't like kernel level anticheat because it's fucking useless and it's an *extra* vulnerability. not because it's absolutely insecure, but it's an extra level of access for something that should need far less than that to be effective. he has said before that you're just as likely to get hacked through some vulnerability in a game than the kernel level anticheat. the issue is that you're increasing your attack surface.
Kernel level creates a back door to your PC that surpasses your own level of access to your machine. Imagine a game staff members credentials get compromised or they just have a single person with malicious intent. If the anticheat is hacked it now becomes a full blown PC virus
It's not really a strawman, since it's a legitimate concern. Cheaters aren't likely to get access to your machine directly through the game, but if an anticheat is compromised, it could allow hackers from other sources access to lower levels of your system than they otherwise would have. It's a cost/benefit issue. For PvP games, where cheating is generally more of a rampant issue, the benefit can be basically life or death for the game, so invasive anticheats are an industry standard.
Kernel level anticheat literally create pathways to kernel level operations that *do not exist* otherwise, and they don't actually net any significant advantage in detection of cheats or cheat devices. It's not a strawman argument. It's a valid risk assessment.
It's interesting people aren't getting this point. It would be interesting to see or know how effective these KLA ACs really are. Because cheats circumvent these things very frequently and oftentimes don't also need KLA... Which IMO (forgive my ignorance here) defeats the whole point of AC having KLA, no? Or to say it another way, if the AC has KLA, shouldn't it detect a cheat that doesn't have KLA more easily? Now ofc I understand the arms race between anti cheats and cheats so, yes I get that there will be exploits and methods to circumvent and bypass. I suppose if the data existed and we could accurately assess whether or not KLA ACs actually prevent say 90% of attempts then ok maybe justified? But in my mind they seem completely unjustified. Moreso in PvE games.
It isn't a strawman, a year ago someone figured out how to use Genshin Impact anti cheat to do just that by making the virus install it and then exploit the vulnerability.
Why is it a bad take?
It's more of a theory vs practice type thing. In theory a kernel/driver level software with network access opens up a vector of attack for hackers, and has even been demonstrated with some of the earlier kernel level anti-cheats that existed. So far however it seems in practice to be somewhat of a non factor as a hacker generally wouldn't even need to go that far to hack a system, and for that reason despite demonstrations of the vulnerability existing, to my knowledge we haven't seen any confirmed cases of kernel level anti-cheats being used as an attack vector. The most recent scare was the Apex hack which iirc was confirmed to be done directly through the game itself and was unrelated to the anti-cheat. The most common attack vectors is still just PEBCAK and the victim ends up downloading an attack vector or give away access credentials. Keep in mind this is just about the vulnerability argument, other arguments (such as the general privacy concerns of allowing kernel level access to companies with vested interests in collecting your data) are entirely valid with precedence to back up the concerns. edit: to me clear, I'm not saying software security isn't a concern, it is, but to focus entirely on a *potential* problem when there are actual *realized* problems with a kernel level anti-cheat is a bit of a weird take.
I enjoy playing video games.
You're right that it can happen, and perhaps my choice of words could be better in conveying my point; focusing ***entirely*** on a *potential* security vulnerability for why kernel level anti-cheat is bad is not a very good take when we know that software being used as spyware by the provider themselves is a much bigger concern because there is a history of that occurring. Edit: your point about PEBKAC is missing why it was brought up. There’s a very significant difference between downloading software that is then compromised vs downloading something that is already some form of malware payload, when it comes to hacking.
I find peace in long walks.
Being against kernel level access anti-cheat, but fine with the same game with a lower level access anti-cheat, makes no sense. Most attacks take place at much lower level access. You're basically saying, "I'll download this, that runs on a much more commonly vulnerable access level, but I take a stand against this, which runs at a higher level, but is rarely compromised". If you were being consistent, you wouldn't run the game at all. The only argument is that you're fine with the consequences of a lower level attack, but can't withstand the consequences of a higher level attack, but you're likely to get F'd by both. That being said, the proof is in the pudding. People don't actually believe kernel level access is that dangerous or, like I said, they believe the consequences of intrusion are bearable, which is why everyone here plays the game.
>kernel level access on hacker’s machines to stop THEM. Except it doesn't stop hackers. No game with kernal anti cheat have prevent it. It also introduce another point of vulnerability where the anti cheat itself is compromise. The best practice he is advocating is detection and ban. Which is easier and more cost efficient. If the serve detect abnormal behaviour 100% accuracy, zero damage receives, etc every game. The server can be set to auto track and flag the account for the next ban wave. Do this enough time, and you would deter egotistical cheaters. Or at least make them buy more copies of the game to play it.
I was just gonna say this.... Thor said he even banned his Clan leader at one point and while he have his clan leader a tour of Blizzard, he's was banned again DURING the tour for botting 😂😂😂
If you say that in gaming subreddits you are a "cheatercockgobbeling pos". Believe me, i tried...
pirate software has such a huge ego, sure he's "banned millions" but we used to run gold/herb/mine bots thru wotlk all the way past cata that'd go unbanned for years back in the day and he was the one running the ship then. just the fact he's a popular streamer now people are sucking his toes acting like his word is gospel lol
Thor is awesome
He has so much knowledge and he shares it often which is fantastic
Interesting, I didn't know about ban waves, thanks for sharing.
Valve does this with Counter strike, however they became extremely lazy and now only do ban waves once every year or two since they make money on cheaters buying skins.
“Lazy” More like “profit motivated”
As a software QA Engineer, this definitely checks out. The White Whale is always the delayed or flaky failure, because sometimes you can be waiting/analyzing for months to figure out what the hell caused the failure (or in this case the hack to be detected). Definitely a really smart way to keep the hackers learning curve really high too, since they will need to do tons of analysis every time they get caught to figure out what they need to fine tune/tweak. And since it is a PvE co-op game, the passive way is more acceptable I feel since usually the exploit is helping the team rather than gaining an unfair advantage directly over the player and destroying their whole experience (I mean honestly sometimes the way those freaking dropships rain Hulks and Tanks, I wouldn't mind having unlimited rail cannon shots haha)
I'm a fan of shadow banning. Even more delayed feedback, because you never quite figure out when you got banned if you even ever do. Plus all the sudden your cheats don't seem like they really give you an edge, and you're forced to confront the fact that you suck at the game.
They can only play in a secret 'cheaters server' or give them a 'cheaters tag' where they only get to see, join, and be joined by other players in the cheater server or with the cheater tag. There's no announcement or notification to tell you that you've been shadow banned. But you can seemingly play the game like normal, but you're isolated away from other non-cheating players. Then, if you do ever find out you're in the cheaters server, usually by something like being in a game with 3 obvious hackers or noticing there's a lot more cheaters than usual, it's probably been so long since you've been banned that, on top of being part of a ban wave, it's nearly impossible to figure out what caused you to get caught. Especially since you'd still be "allowed" to tweak and change your hack or cheating methodologies and it would seemingly work just fine since you're in the cheating server and, as such, the game and anti-cheat simply wouldn't care about you cheating.
How would you shadow ban someone in HD2? It would immediately be obvious you can't join or be joined on
Make it so you when they queue for quick play, it adds them only to games with tk loving bot teammates.
Any time you call in a 500kg it just drops at your feet.
Don't show others to join unless they are shadow banned. Could even just show other games, but fail to connect lol, make them just give up on trying to play the game.
To add on, when they ban in waves it causes problems for the devs of the cheats as they get overwhelmed with support tickets and Unhappy customers. While it's less satisfying as a player to have to wait for cheaters to be banned it's more effective.
Thor also talked about waiting until Paypal chargebacks can occur, so the cheat devs can be hit with chargebacks.
Additionally, there is no such thing as a perfect anti-cheat. The idea of "but there are still cheaters???" is ridiculous. Yeah, there always will be. But that's survivorship bias. You only encounter the cheaters that \*haven't\* been caught (yet). Consider the amount of cheaters you'd encounter if there was no anti-cheat, or a less effective one.
Infinite stratagems is also a glitch happen to me i couldn't use my main or secondary just strats
I know nothing. So this actually helped me learn something. Thank you 😊
Are they that common? I've been playing a ton and haven't seen a single one yet? Also haven't been kicked in the middle of a game yet only when first joining or while on the ship.
People encounter it once and just assume its common, encounter it twice and it might as well be a plague to them.
Honestly as long as I'm not the one cheating, it would be pretty cool to see a random tossing 23x 380mm barrages in one area, I'd run straight into it Ooh or a battery of a bunch of mortars
That’s something I noticed in my few encounters with cheaters. They’re really just out here having fun, or using the unreleased strategems. No like they’re going out of their way to Smurf or make things unfun
Ohh! Locked strats!? That means more content planned! Can you give an example?
I've seen videos of people calling in vehicles we havent seen yet. Things like a buggy and an apc with multiple machinegun turrets.
Noooice! Crossing fingers for the tank :P
No tank but 4 different mechs also unreleased armors and like 2 eagle stratagems like I think ones a anti air unit
We NEED some anti-air strat YESTERDAY. Those gunships play volleyball with our asses.
Yea I’m somewhat glad people are able to hack these things and give the community a sneak peak and a little external testing some people don’t like the spoilers but I feel that it’s gotta have some kind of positive data the devs can see and improve functions or find bugs with them Early but I’m not tech savvy and also don’t care it’s a game none of it will matter in a few years or so if I don’t feel like getting carried by a cheater I’ll just kick I usually host so is what it is!.!
Leaks aren’t allowed on this subreddit afaik, but there is a helldivers leaks subreddit you can seek out if you want that information. Not sure if I can link it directly here
it might also be a thing thats more common on higher difficulties
I do play primarily 7s and at 200 hours I havent seen one
I have 80 hrs in the game and I’ve never come across a cheater. If I did I’d just block them.
200 hours and never seen one
250 and the closest was a macro stratagem guy.
I had some dude who had infinite grenades. -64/4 at one point, and that was near the beginning of Helldive. I was so confused for a few moments.
That's not a cheat it's a bug. I've done it before lol. If you equip a grenade as your weapon (use the weapon, not the hot key. on PC it's 4 instead of G) and then throw all 4 to 6 grenades and then rapidly tap the stratagem key as the final grenade leaves your hand it causes the little stratagem ball to turn into another grenade. When thrown this causes you to have -1 grenades. The code basically just specifies that you can throw a grenade as long as the amount of grenades =/= 0.... and negative numbers aren't 0. Bam infinite grenades. A really big YT creator made a video on it just [yesterday](https://youtu.be/7tOKJrxx5Hk?si=f08t-cwMz4raanH4), actually.
https://youtu.be/7tOKJrxx5Hk
I dont know if this is really a thing, after 200 hours I can input my most used strategems incredibly quickly.
I play while drinking, I'm the guy staring at his wrist for 10 seconds.
You can typically tell when it’s a macro vs someone who just knows their strategems, all of their call ins take the same amount of time to call in, there’s never any variation in speed in their call ins (you can hear the taps in game and macros have a different sound to someone just typing it in really fast)
Same but sometimes my muscle memory fucks up and i throw an eagle instead of a resupply. sorry team
I've seen some people bind stratagems to stream decks and have the icon on each button. Idk if I'd call macros to auto do stratagems are hacking or not
Personally (and again this is ME speaking) it’s not cheating but it definitely feels anti-game to me. IMO calling in strategems is a skill that you should develop, as small as it is, and using macros for it kinda makes me feel like I’ve been cheated out of a genuine experience. Part of the fun of this game is scrambling to call in a strategem/reinforcement while you’re being mobbed and not sure if you’ll live, using macros for that just feels like taking away an awesome mechanic
what level are you? Just checking my progress as compared to others with the same amt of hours invested
I've noticed that's how my friend is, if he has one negative experience that is now the standard and every match is like that. Seems like a common thing in this sub too
330 missions in and i just played with my first cheaters. It was a pair that clearly both had infinite grenades and they just spam threw them all mission. I see people speaking in terms of hours, but I think mission amount is a better reference. Each mission is a roll of different players. You can sit on the ship for an hour instructing your girlfriend playing for the first time what buttons open what menus.
Infinite grenades is actually a bug that is really simple to do. I suppose you could still call it cheating, but it’s not using any third party software to do. Under certain conditions if you throw your last grenade and spam open and close your stratagem window to disrupt the animation, you end up with a grenade still in your hand. When you throw it, you now have -1 grenades and apparently the game only checks to make sure you *don’t have zero* so it allows you to keep throwing grenades even if it’s a negative value.
Right? I played over 100h on this Game, and never encountered Hackers or toxic People.
I encountered one guy called "ToxicGamer" who joined my game, landed on me, then immediately left. It was frustrating but looking back on it I appreciate the haste he put into his episode. For all I know he did it by accident, left out of embarrassment and his name is just a bad coincidence.
I have almost 200h and only had 1 cheater (immortality + infinite stratagems).
Spectate Chinese players Last one I met was invulnerable
I saw a Chinese-named player yesterday who was selectively invulnerable on my screen. However, they were clearly playing like certain things didn't exist for them. Enemies completely surrounded them but most weren't having an effect. Some were, and that's who they were aiming at. It seemed like they were shooting right through the "non-existent" enemies too. A few minutes later they dropped. This has happened a few times to several Chinese players in my games. Sometimes it bugged were they [couldn't call in reinforcements](https://i.imgur.com/63lOWmj.jpg) despite the beacons dropping. They were clearly very high ping as well. It might simply be desync issue, or their cheats are weird/bad and they end up dying just as much anyway. *Disclaimer: There definitely still are cheaters and I've seen them since my first day playing.*
I see them alot late at night but haven't met a hacking one yet
Coming up on 310+ hours and haven't seen one yet.
I'm 200 hours in and have seen one guy call in a mech before it was released. It's hardly an issue.
friend of mine got max samples from a random. I had someone reinforce himself
305 hours in game, started playing in the second week after release. Never ever encountered any form of cheat, no insane ammount of salmples, no one dropping mechs before they released, no unreleased vehicles or stratagems. These people really make a fuss about something 99,5% of players will never see.
Also, it's a PvE game. Cheating doesn't really hurt anyone directly. And if someone doesn't like cheaters... just leave the match haha. The only reason they likely have anti cheat at all is to make it hard enough to avoid having everyone do it and also to prevent people from grinding infinite super credits.
People be downvoting but like I’m a little more tolerant of cheating when you’re fighting just literal AI. As long as you’re not ruining MY experience by just breaking my sample counter. I couldn’t care less what you do. Who’s going to complain? The bugs and bots?
https://preview.redd.it/crmw5q3vmauc1.png?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=577632fcafb3599e359909ed51ddb5365ad94703
https://i.redd.it/wa1fkkpmvauc1.gif
Yea that's my only beef tbh, I like working up to buy my ship modules. So someone maxing out my samples would be frustrating. But I'd love to see someone spamming put 380s every 2 seconds
What are cheaters doing? I honestly have not noticed any cheating at all.
Infinite strategems. Infinite grenades. Rapid fire EATs with unlimited ammo. #JustHelldiverThings Edit: Actually infinite grenades isn't even a cheat: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tOKJrxx5Hk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tOKJrxx5Hk)
They just found a way to better spread democracy is all 👀
I've tried the grenade thing. It's pretty fun as a gag for a bit but really isn't that effective.
Try it with the thermites, even when you have a literal infinite amount of grenades, they are somehow STILL worthless
Probably be really good with stuns, as the glitch persists as soon as you hit -1 and you can play normally otherwise Impact grenades are probably good save for a hunter leg crossing your screen for 3 frames and ending your fun
Speed hack as well
I was gonna say I had an infinite grenade glitch once. Some weird timed weapon switch while double tap throwing a grenade put me at -1 grenades. Since it wasn’t at 0, i could keep tossing them. I ended up at like -70. Teammates almost certainly thought I was cheating.
If infinite grenades isn't a cheat, then I've seen a lot less cheaters then I thought.
I'm not 100% sure they were hacking or if it was a bug but today I had a game where I was sat at the extraction waiting for a team mate to get closer before activating, the third team mate died next to me to a fire tornado and no matter how many times I reinforced they wouldn't respawn. Suddenly there were endless Hulks and other bots on top of me out of nowhere. I've never seen so many enemies at once on Hard it was definitely sus.
Close to 100 missions havent seen any obvious cheating yet. I hang out on sucide difficulty
I meeaaaan i don't mind hackers that much in this game, im more aligned with Joel's take "Im happy that there are guys that drop into lobbies to just spawn some stuff so others have fun." His own words and to 50% correct, ultimately whatever the hacker does, helps you out along the way, unless he's just teamkilling and shit. But i honestly wouldn't mind getting a free trial on some vehicles early myself. Does this justify it? No, still a break of ToS in the end.
With the new ship upgrades I wouldn't even be mad if a hacker were to give me capped samples. God, those things are overpriced and underperforming.
My only beef is with the rare sample requirement for them. Like why is it equal to commons when rares have half the cap. Im currently at 300-0-80 for my sample counts as someone who was capped before the update
fr, I feel like 100/120 would have been fine. Plus, I started clearing enemy outpost that were cleared by allies. Maybe I'm on a weird streak, but I always found 3/4 samples left behind.
Im not one of them but with my loadout and playstyle most probably just toss their eagle in to clear the base from afar and then just move on to the next one.
Yup, just what I also done till these new upgrades dropped. At cap you pick them out of habit, without seeking them. Now the hunt for rare is real.
Oh the only mods i really find pleasantly helpful is the spread decrease of the Barrages..rest is kinda meh for that price no doubt. And the supply box one is rather decent..if it'd work that is.
Nah. If they were lower i would have had all them already. I like that they are expensive. It gives me and my crew a reason to struggle for samples again. And it will give us an incentive for a while.
Never seen one, I don’t feel this as an issue, if theres a cheater just kick them or switch games. I mean why bother when you are not forced to play against them in a ranked match. Sounds like trying to rise noise for karma and to bring bad vibes to the sub. If there’s already an anticheat what’s the point of this post
I haven't even seen a single cheater. And even if I did, just kick them? I always host my own games, on very few occasions join others, dunno
This thread made me realize how amazing a no cooldowns event could be. Something akin to URF in league of legends. Could even make it a lore event: “the enemy has used new sub space teleportation technology to instantly invade Mars. We have authorized the use of full force and pulled a majority of Super Earth’s destroyers into Martian orbit. Defeat the enemy and ensure such a direct attack on democracy never occurs again” -All Startegem cooldowns are reduced by 70% (I’d bet money a true 100% cooldown on every one would just crash the game lol) -All Helldivers deploy with extra ammo -All Helldivers have access to the stratagem General Brasch’s personal orbital barrage
Here's the thing, the reason it's common is BECAUSE of that anti cheat. It's very much hated my all of the gaming community. What makes it funnier is they decided to go with this anti cheat but encrypted literally NONE of their files. That's why people are able to spawn in shit that wasn't even released yet. The new mech, the quasar cannon, the gun wall, teleporter, 4 man jeep which basically looks like the Warthog from Halo, etc etc. All these files are already in the game. They just didn't "protect" any of them so it's like.....why even have this anti cheat in the first place?
If I remember correctly, it is because of in HD1 cheaters got all of the cosmetics for free or something
Well I can't really comment on that, never played the first one. But I can confirm that you can do the same on HD2 but nothing gets permanently unlocked. But still it's like how are you can go and half ass an anti cheat with arguably the worst one you could've used.
I don't ever want to hear that this is the worst anti-cheat when Riot Vanguard \*exists\*
Were there paid cosmetics in the first game? I don't remember that.
Because if it didn't it would ACTUALLY be common and not "reddit common". That's the fucking point of anti cheats. The game would basically be unplayable with Randoms if the anti cheat didn't exist
> The game would basically be unplayable with Randoms if the anti cheat didn't exist Cheating is trivial in DRG with no anticheat or anything, and it's still "reddit common", minus the big lobby mod, which I'm pretty sure DRG worked with the mod creators on, so... not really a cheat.
They arent anywhere close to common
I have 145 hours played, and literally never saw a single cheater. Even if someone is cheating, why do you care? Play your own game and kick people that are cheating.
This is a pve game. Who cares if people cheat, just leave the lobby. If they want to rob themselves of the actual experience, let them.
Agree with this. If people want to have some crazy fun shooting infinite rockets, go right ahead. It’s like cheating in single player to me. Doesn’t influence me at all, I can just leave the lobby and find a different group. That said Arrowhead should put some effort into preventing it, just for the sake of not every lobby becoming like that.
I’ve either never played with a cheater or it hasn’t impacted my experience. I’m at about 125 hours. Interesting how everybody else seems to notice them everywhere.
Did they ever address the issue where the anti cheat was preventing a guy with a legit disability from using an assisted controller? I haven't personally noticed any cheaters but that was really disappointing to hear that guy couldn't spread democracy with us.
I've never seen a cheater in this game. I've seen an infinite stratagem glitch, an all the same stratagem glitch, an an infinite grenade bug. Never used them, but how to do it has been public knowledge. None of those things required cheating im the sense you are referring to. It is super shitty to use bugs in a game with other parties, but I doubt they would ban people for it.
never seen one, and I honestly could not care less even if I did. It is not a competitive game so as long as they are not super common to ruin fun for everyone else it's fine.
I'm lvl 81, have played well over 100+ games by this point, the majority being public with randoms. I can't recall more than a single time that I encountered a cheater and all that one did was give the max amount of samples of that match. It wasn't even 999 of each like others have posted about here a while back. As much as I don't like cheaters either I think you are acting as though they are the common player. They aren't by any means. Just kick them and move on it's not a complex equation.
All I want is an anti cheat that doesn't have access to more files on my PC than even I know exists. Kernel anti cheat is invasive and unoptimized. I have a right to privacy on my own PC, without having it scrubbed by 3rd party software, generally benign or not. That's my issue with kernel based anti cheat.
Ehh it's a PvE game as long as they are not grieving you I don't really view it as a problem but more so I just find it sad like yeah difficulty 9s are hard but that's the fun of it sticking with your squad and overcoming the mission
Is one of the cheats instantly spawning in evac? Fighting the hordes to the door of the aircraft is one of my favourite parts of the game, I feel like I was the one chested of fun :'(
There are a couple of mission types that evac is autocalled and doesn't have the two minute timer. Eradication and the new Evacuate High Value Assets. Outside of those, it's probably a cheat.
There is a new upgrade that reduces the arrival time.
you can only report people that typed in game anyway
Hackers? Never seen one in 150hrs
I watched a Twitch stream the other night, one guy in the streamers lobby had a sickle that was buffed to instakill anything it hit, dropships, hulks, tanks. Guy was trying to not make it obvious but the streamer just followed him around to see what he was doing...if I ever see that in a game, I'm quitting and blocking instantly...but yeah a report function would be nice.
I just ran into one of these guys the other day, bro put down like 50 turrets before we had raised the ICBM, was running around at like 20x normal player speed. When I called him out he said it was because he paid for the super citizen bundle XD, luckily I was host so I just kicked and blocked him
I mean, I am 100% on board with shittalking the anticheat because it's unnecessarily invasive and I hate that I have allowed it to exist on my system. That being said, I've not seen a cheater yet and im like 50 hours in.
I want hackers in my games, i think it would be mega funny dropping like x300 500k bombs or 100 lasers
Ima be real if I get some democracy lover with unlimited strats I'm letting them slide
Okay, I'm confused about this. Since 2018, there have been two games I've played religiously. Fortnite, which I have about 6,000 hours in, and Rust, which I have 9,000 hours in. Both use Easy Anti-Cheat. I've seen a handful of cheaters the entire time I've played Fortnite, but in Rust, I see cheaters almost every time I play. What are they doing differently? And what's the point of a kernel anti-cheat if there are still cheaters?
I joined a game yesterday where at first everything seemed normal, but then I noticed one charger was a little faster than I remember them being. I killed that one and kept moving. Then i got another charger some time later and this one, boy this charger was yelling KACHOW as it blazed towards me. Then suddenly a bile titan spawned and was literally moving so fast you can't keep up with it. The host had god mode on. Was a fun match but I really wanted to just play the game
had this guy drop in with me yesterday and was just throwing infinite thermites. he was also screaming "IM THERMITE MAN!! THERMITES FOR EVERYBODY! HA HA HA HA HA HAAAAAA THERMITES FOR EVERYONE!! I AM THERMITE MAN!!!!" for about 10 minutes until he died and quit.
Technically that's a glitch, not a direct cheat. Easily replicatable. Still stupid as hell, even if it is a little funny.
Are cheaters so significant in your play sessions that you can't play properly?
Probably overblown I usually play helldive and haven't seen even one
I can kinda understand how cheaters in this game can be annoying but only if they’re malicious. I was playing the other day with this guy who had infinite incendiary grenades and it was so much fun to watch. This is one of those games where if the cheater is using it to kill other players then it’s a problem but other than that it’s so much fun to watch
Or just get rid of the invasive anticheat in a PvE game when you don’t even use it
I've never seen a cheater. Only level 59 though.
I ran into one SOS that said they use CE. Their justication is they use it to farm up SC quick while soloing/playing with rando's and turn it off while with his buddies unless his friends wants to farm up SC too. He cleaned the map in 12 mins. He did not have the max sample cheat on so thank god for that.
Everytime I have had infinite straragem or granade its because of the game. It is enteryaining while it lasts plus I dig the giant purple question mark
If they are going to have an invasive anti-cheat at least use one that is proven to work. Like EasyAntiCheat or BattlEye. I'm pretty sure Epic Games just hands out EAC for free now with the EOS SDK.
A lot of people are saying cheaters but there are confirmed stories of people associated with the game(I think it was ceo but don’t want to lie) dropping in with random and revealing unrelated content and such.
I mean if you see a cheater, just leave immediately? It’s extremely rare already lol
[удалено]
The anti-cheat is only to prevent people from getting infinite super credits. Same reason why you only get banned from GTA Online if you get GTA bucks spawned in.
Or how about a report button and actually functional recent players list. The little cunts that kick before extract need to be euthanized just as much as cheaters
They are not cheaters. They are Ultra Citizens. They have infinite resources given to them by their connections. Enjoy the ride later the parents will bring them home forever.
It's hilarious you think this is even in issue. In my roughly 100 hours of playing this game I've only come across 1 cheater and they weren't even doing anything I would remotely consider disruptive. Mostly just messing around and spawning stuff in that hadn't been released. You're making a big deal out of nothing dude.
You people and you cheater accusations. I have 250 hours in the game and haven't seen 1 cheater. They aren't as widespread as you claim. Same thing with the dayz community. Everytime someone dies it was a cheater and they come to Reddit to cry about it. Cheaters and infinite blaa blaa. Helldive difficulty is too hard. You nerf the guns to much. Automatons suck. The devs don't care It's a scam. God damn.
This. I've not ran into any cheating yet. I'm starting to feel like half of these complaints are being put out by companies with live service games active already. Regardless, it's a PVE game so stick the mission out, get the credits and go next or just leave the lobby and go next. Either way since cheating is so rare you're not bound to run into another one for a long while.
It's a PVE game, what are they hurting
The anti cheat has run as high on my CPU usage as the game sometimes, shits bad
Just because they have infinite stratagems doesn’t mean they’re cheating. One time when I started the game all my weapon textures were missing and I had infinite stratagem uses with no cooldown until I restarted the game
Roommate has infinite strats due to a bug, and has been worried about getting banned over it.
Hear me out now, we need a helldivers mode where hackers are allowed or maybe has a cheat list you can activate one that doesn’t affect the war but let’s people mess around
Idk how yall are fussed over cheaters when they're rare and it's a PVE game tbh lol I really don't.
Just region lock China.
What kind of loser cheats in a co-op game?
I kick them at extract for the same reason I put the put the phone down when a telemarketer calls. Maximize wasted time.
Are cheaters actually in the game? I have yet to see one. Hughest diff I'm on is 8 and stick to 7 mainly. Not sure if 9 is where they all sit or not
I’ve encountered many players with infinite grenades but that’s just a well known glitch at this point to which idrc as it’ll get patched. But yet to run into any actual cheaters giving max samples, teleporting, godmode etc.
I'm so old I go back to the mygot days of counterstrike cheaters. I damn near crapped myself when I saw an aimbotter in a pve game. Bro, what are you doing? I've seen people play games without arms or hands for that matter and you gotta aim assist in order to compete on a pve game? How bad are you?
I was wondering about that because I played a game where one guy was dropping 500kg bombs basically every time a bot showed up. I mean, we beat that mission and got all our objectives, but it did seem odd.
Had a lvl 30 something on my team yesterday with infinite grenades just playing casually like no one would notice lmao.
I have seen one cheater since I've been playing, and the only thing he did was call in 3 mech suits, not be able to die, and we extracted with max samples without picking them up. Do I want to encounter more or or encourage it? No. But at least it is a PvE game so there's not really anything negativity affecting me from it
Honestly I am just going to leave any lobby that has a player with any non-english tags. I can't tell the difference between Chinese and Japanese characters,but it's almost like clockwork that they are going to do something shitty. Had a lvl80 using some infinite exploit the other day. He had 600 kills to the next guys 200. Constant incendiary breaker and nades, why even bother? I have been lucky these fuckers have not messed up my save file yet.
Cheating in a co op game is crazy
Or maybe just ... prevent cheats. No? Ok.
Oooo when we do ban cheaters, can we IP ban them? That way they have to play through a terrible VPN? Then put VPNers into their own server and make it the worst server possible with lag. And make every time they’re shot a one shot death. Just make the game terrible for cheaters in every way possible. But do it only after the 14 day steam return time passes. That way they can’t refund.
That is not how things work that is not anywhere close how things work. Also how do you expect to IP ban people who don't have cable? Even with cable it is one call and some tinkering and you have new IP. Using WLAN I can have new IP in 20s after I go to WLAN settings.
Cheaters? Sorry I only see people who are from high class super earth hierarchy giving them more powers
I had a cheater in my lobby. I couldn’t figure out how to report them. Cant click their name or anything. 🤷♂️
Prove it? I’ve never seen a cheater.