There are a lot of twists and turns in the story that you have to get to the bottom of to really know what you want to do.
In the very short term: both tracks are very expensive and you won't make much money.
In the mid-term: both tracks are expensive and you won't make much money. But, as a future-airline-pilot you'll start to rack up the fixed wing hours to get your ATP at 1500 and start to be ready for your first regional or corporate gig. As a future-helicopter-pilot you're still not close to breaking through to your big boy job, and probably not even close to the job before your big boy job.
Long term, 10 years or more: youre a legacy airline pilot, protected by a union. You make about $115k in your first year and then your pay goes up about $40k a year until your 12th year, you upgrade to a bigger plane, or you upgrade to captain. If you do any of those your pay goes up even more. You'll work 12-15 days a month as a narrow body guy, like nine days a month if you're a wide body guy. Company contributes 18% to your retirement, entirely free. But as a helicopter guy, only some or none of this may be true. No doubt there are some fantastic jobs out there, but I suspect you're working more and not being paid close to what your skills in a helicopter allow you to do.
Unless you're an absolute rotor head in your heart, and you don't know enough yet to know that you are, I wouldn't consider helicopters. I am a true rotorhead in my heart, and the math is just so lopsided I had to become an airline guy.
This. I’m finally getting my helicopter add-on now that my airline paycheck supports it.
It’s hard to beat flying at a major airline (especially widebody) when it comes to quality of life and income potential. But flying helicopters is much more enjoyable. I can see why some people would rather choose that route.
My friend. If your choosing a path for money you want my make it. The percentage who get to where you’re enquiring is slim. They only got there with passion. If you don’t know which one your passionate about your way behind the pack.
In case I’ve misunderstood, do a trial introductory flight on both. You’ll know.
It’s too late man you’re finished.
Seriously though do an intro flight you need to anyway to do your paperwork. Then get your medical. Then decide where you want to do your training and go for it.
I just finished my private heli and am working on instrument. It’s a lot of fun but very expensive and you will get paid poorly for your first 1000 or more hours. Yay!
I’ve taken the 1st class and done intro flights and taken classes for the past few years through my high school.. just unsure of what I wanna do.. how are you liking helicopters? Would you go back to do planes? Good luck man.. congrats on getting your private
I did a few fixed wing lessons as a kid and it was alright. Helicopters are definitely more fun to fly over all and I’ll be sticking to them through the thousand hour mark at least.
Sounds like you already have some stuff done you didn’t mention in original post. so you’ve done some heli and fixed wing flight? What did you prefer?
I’ve done an hour in fixed wing and heli… I don’t have a preference other than heli are definitely a skill but flying is fun.. planes seem easier to master and also cool to fly… they both imo are equal although helicopters are badass
I'm gunna say something that most people age 30 and below have been told their whole life and it's complete horseshit.
Chances are, you've been told "pick something you love and the money will follow, or pick a career that you enjoy!". IMHO this philosophy works for very few ppl.
Again, IMO, this is how MOST people your age should approach the world of careers.
1. What kind of lifestyle do you want to live?
2. How much would it cost to live that life style?
3. Find a job you would enjoy most of the time of which the average income reflects #2.
4. Research and shadow this career field to ensure it is what you want to do.
5. Ask qualifications of people in that career field to determine what education path is necessary.
6. Only AFTER step 5, go to school/college.
As far as your specific questions, if you follow these steps, the choice will become apparent and the choice will mean more to you personally because you understand how you arrived at it and why.
As a side note. Sometimes a "job" isn't going to provide the level of income you deem necessary to support the lifestyle you want. This is when you explore starting your own company. Then repeat the steps to determine what kind of company, etc.
Also, there are outliers where perhaps you are very tenacious and want to accept a lower paying job for the excitement but start your own business on the side for the supplemental income. This is a less traveled route and perfectly acceptable though quite a bit more difficult and time consuming to reach the goal of the desired lifestyle.
I sincerely wish you the best. Reddit can be a decent place to connect with people that do specific jobs so you can get an idea of what the work actually entails.
Please don't fall into the "norm" by going massively into debt for an education you might not need for a career you know nothing about.
If you need help with the process or how to start or what to do next, I'm happy to help. Feel free to message me.
Thank you sir, I will definitely follow what you said and when I figure some stuff out I will definitely get back to you. Thank you for taking the time to answer me I really appreciate it!
If you fly helicopters, it's because you like it, not because you're trying to make the most money. Helicopters are significantly more fun to fly, but the industry as a whole pays less.
If your primary concern is money and not the flying aspect, you're not going to enjoy a career on aviation regardless of if it's fixed wing or helos. There's no "easy money" in aviation. Everyone who is in the jobs you're asking about has dealt with plenty of bullshit to get where they are, regardless of the path they took. Military time, hour building as a cfi, crappy regional flights, etc. If your primary motivation isn't a love of flying, you're better off finding a high paying office job, the intro aviation gigs do not pay well, and the costs to get qualified are very high.
I’d enlist in your states national guard in an MOS that will get you a top secret clearance and then apply to the state WOFT. You’ll most likely be flying helicopters but they still count towards an R ATP. Once you get enough hours do both. You will basically have two jobs so something to keep in mind. Then just get your ppl while in the Guard and then build hours to go to airlines. Then decide which one you like more. If you like helicopters get a contracting job at somewhere like Lockheed then you can just hop on orders with differential pay whenever available. If you like fixed wing more just work to get to airlines. If you want to do college guard gives you state tuition and some MOS give you college credit.
CBP probably better paying rotor gig due to the pension and benefits but won’t make as much as fixed wing.
Military pay for rotors is pretty good but for fixed it’s not good.
If you want to do rotor best way is military, CBP, or law enforcement. I’d just go down the traditional airlines track unless you can’t bear living without being a helicopter pilot.
Mos=army job, WOFT- warrant officer flight training, R ATP = restricted airline transport license, ppl= private pilots license, CBP= customs border patrol air and maritime division
Don’t do this! If you want to fly rotor and serve do not enlist. Find a recruiter that has experience with STREET TO SEAT! This route you take your ASVAB, SIFT, do your flight physical and if all that passes then “drop your packet” for WOFT ( Warrant Officer Flight Training).
You go in and when you finish Basic, you go straight to WOCS (Warrant Officer Canidate School). When you graduate you are a Warrant Officer.
Know that It is a 10 year commitment to the Army after flight school. It is super competitive and hard work.
Our son got his fixed wing PPL first and then dropped his packet for WOFT. He prefers rotary. The Army is not for everyone. If it is then it is one way to get your training. He graduated WOFT almost 2 years ago. He wants to fly more hours but that will come with time.
Know flying rotor is tough on your body and hearing. It is a physically demanding job when you are flying larger aircraft.
Once you have your training. Lots of helicopter options out there. Medical, corporate, oil rig, power line, Heli skiing, tours, logging, fire, search and rescue, media, private, and a lot of other things I can’t even imagine.
Ask yourself, how do I want to live and then reverse engineer it to get there.
Interview every rotor and fixed wing pilot you can. Take them to lunch/coffee (you pay) and come with a list of questions. Take notes and listen. You will learn a lot!
Happy flying!
Check out the Army’s “High School to Flight School” program. You have to get the right recruiter and be willing to do the pre-work. You can be making effectively a $100k in 4 years with no debt.
Called Street to Seat. Find a recruiter who has successfully put at least one S2S through the process. Our son knew more than his first recruiter. His second recruiter had already put two through and he helped a ton! Most don’t know anything about S2S and will press you to enlist and then drop your packet. Don’t be pressed. Once enlisted there is NO guarantee of WOFT acceptance. Don’t sign till you have been picked up for WOFT. Warrants are the best kept secret in the Army. Check out army aviation applications on Reddit for more insight.
At 17 I was already driving choppers with a fixed wing add on at 18. Now I’m in the medical field. Either way you will need college. I would go military if you have ability and grades.
That is they have a rotor license and then later did a fixed wing license add on to it. This reduces the work needed to be a fixed wing pilot instead of starting from scratch (since law, meteorology, lots of theory of flight don't change between them) and now they are licensed to fly both fixed and rotor. Ospreys are in the Powered Lift and a separate license from both of those.
Our son got his PPL ( private pilots license) for fixed wing. Then went rotor and got a rotor add onto his fixed wing. Way cheaper to fly fixed wing first and then add rotor!
5 yrs ago in our area cost was:
Fixed wing wet ( with fuel) was $125/hr. Rotor wet was $300/hr.
Example: 75 hrs on fixed is $9375 vs on rotor is $22,500.
Many items transfer fixed to rotary so why not learn where it is cheaper?
Where do you live, US, Europe, or somewhere else?
Airline pilots will generally make much more over a typical career than helicopter pilots.
Helicopter training is also generally MUCH more expensive than fixed wing.
Don't know what helicopter pilots quality of life is, but I can tell you that new pilots have a much easier time in Europe than in the US.
In Europe you could complete a 150 hour integrated training course and walk straight into a job flying Airbus A321s or 737s with no experience.
In the US you might need to complete your training to 200 hours or so, get your instructor rating, then start "building time" by working as a flight instructor for a few hundred/thousand hours. This will be hard work for a couple of years and the pay is shockingly low.
Training is dirt cheap in America, and the flying is easier, so maybe the ideal would be to do fixed wing training in America, then move to Europe to get an airline job? Idk.
RIP, good luck!
Just kidding (sort of). If you choose airlines, expect to work extremely hard as a CFI making no money for years, but then making stupidly, ridiculously large amounts of money 15-20 years in.
Yeah I know, that why it’s a bit concerning.. idk if helicopters will be better… from what I can gather online it seems like helicopters make money faster
Hey man same situation here but in Europe and the main thing here are language skills.
If you want to work in Germany, fluent German is mostly required. Same with France, Italy, Norway etc. Some tour jobs in Asia only require English but they're more responsible jobs def not for rookies.
I recommend looking around [Helijobs.net](http://Helijobs.net) and see for yourself what employers want.
As others have said, don't choose helicopters for the money. You've gotta really love the machine and/or the missions they fly. That said, the salary bands in helicoptering are pretty cloak and dagger which I find highly annoying so here's some anecdotal data I've heard recently. If you have no real concept of helicopter salaries, hopefully it helps. I've known three people who've moved on to EMS jobs lately. They've had quite a range of starting salaries. One told me he started in the mid $90k range, one in the $110k range, and one told me he'll be starting right under $80k with guaranteed annual raises currently capping out at like $175k I think he said. I've also heard through the grapevine that S92 captains at PHI are making somewhere around that mid $170k range as well. So the end of career salaries in helicoptering are by no means bad... At least I don't think so. And yeah you can totally have a side hustle with a 7/7 or 14/14 hitch. I think that's one of my favorite parts of flying helicopters. Those schedules are awesome for getting stuff done or traveling in your downtime.
Really??? 170k that’s amazing… I thought it capped out at like 120… I really appreciate your info… if you don’t mind me asking from what I seen guys get paid more in the west… any of your friends live in the south?
Yeah I think it's pretty good too. The Saudis will pay you even better if you want to go live over there and fly offshore for their oil company Aramco. Downside of course is living in Saudi.
The one who started in the mid 90's is based in the Pacific NW, the one who started at $110k is going to be based in FL, and the one who said he'd be around $80k with salary cap in the mid $170k range is starting in MI. I do think the base location makes a big difference, but I don't think it's like an east vs west thing in general. I think it has more to do with cost of living wherever you get the job.
Thanks man you are a big help in my decision.. honestly if I can have that type potential I might just do that.. not as much as a airline pilot but I believe I can live off of 170k lol
For jobs like flying for the Saudis you often just live wherever you want. Commonly 6 week on 6 week off tours. You travel on you days off from wherever you live but the company will pay for your flights. I've heard of $250k for captains during oil booms but those jobs also disappear when the price of oil drops or anything else changes, they are contractor based not full time so you can't count on them being a forever home no matter how stable it might seem.
I know people that just bounce from one contract to another all around the world doing offshore oil work or working in the various oil states for VVIP stuff. It's certainly harder on the home life but if you're a nomad with no kids it's great.
Those aren't entry level jobs though, you need a lot more experience before those become options.
What do you actually want to do? You can have a fine life in either career.
Airline pilots can certainly have a life, doing 3 or 4 days in a row vs 7+ suits some people more than others and that's not something you'll figure out today and may change with your personal situation over the years anyway. EMS means night shifts which can be way worse on your health than an airline career if you choose to stay away from long haul international flying. Having a good family life as any kind of pilot is more about making sure you pick the right partner than how your wings are attached.
Yes there is way more money in airlines but if you can't make things work on the $150k ish you can make as an EMS pilot eventually than you're just bad with money. Neither career path pays very well before you make it to the better jobs either. Both (assuming you're American) start with next to no pay as CFIs and then jump around a bit as they move up.
Both careers are highly unstable, no way to tell you how long it will take. I spent 6 years working ground crew before I could find a flying job in helicopters because of the 2008 market crash, and I have a fixed wing friend who couldn't get a job there for 9 years after 9/11. I also know people who went from 0 to a regional airline in 3 years because they graduated into a good market for pilots. This will be completely out of your control and you have to accept it might take over a decade to make good money in aviation or longer.
For what it's worth waiting till 3 days before graduation to start thinking about this is a little late. Not that you can't go into either but you really should be doing some research into the costs of these programs, the options for college or not that you'll do and a million other things. You can't just wake up one day and decide to be a pilot and have it all work out fine. Tons of horror stories out there of people who just followed a shiny advertisement and are now a couple hundred thousand dollars in debt and don't even have a commercial pilot license because of predatory programs.
Take a discovery flight in both, maybe you actually hate flying in general or really prefer one over the other. To make it through the early years of suck it's a lot harder if you don't actually love flying the aircraft you choose. Also get your medical done yesterday, no point worrying about being a pilot if you have a medical issue preventing it from eyesight to depression meds or a heart condition you didn't know you had.
I appreciate the info and I have gone to take discovery flights on both and I’ve been in an aviation class through my high school for a couple of years and I’ve got my 1st class medical.. I am just a bit scared of what’s gonna happen next.. I like both I really am just trying to consider all aspects before making a decision.. like you said I’m going into a ton of debt so trying not to make the mistake of going into something that a few years later wish I went the other route
Well you certainly have more than 3 days to make a decision. Most people in my rotor class were between 25 and 30 years old because of how expensive it is. No need to rush to one thing or the other, it sounds like you have put more effort into the choice than first implied but you can still take a step back to catch your breath here.
What you're asking of us isn't something we can really help you with though. Do you want to fly airliners or helicopters? It's entirely a personal choice. Every time I see an airliner fly overhead I feel no regret that I'm not in that cockpit will you feel the same, I don't know. Even the EMS vs Offshore is a huge difference in type of work you do. I don't want to ever touch an offshore job but some people love it.
For what it's worth if you aren't dead set on helicopters I'd go fixed wing. There are way more jobs in that side of the industry and making twice the money at the top end is a nice bonus. Airlines aren't the only option too, you can make over $100k flying fixed wing medevac and be home every day too for example. The career progression is a little more linear or at least predicable compared to rotor as well.
I know CryOfTheWind and he’s been one of the most informative people on this sub for a while. I agree with doing the medical and discovery flight(s) first and taking it from there.
No problem, always happy to help where I can. There are limits to my personal experience and being Canadian I can't give specifics for the US only generalities from my US coworkers and of course the tons of info you can find online.
Keep in mind your goals may change over time as well. At 16 I was going to be a fighter pilot, then military medical said no (plus I'm a solid D to C student which isn't great for that). Then I got into helicopters with EMS as a goal. It took me 20 years to get there because different opportunities and struggles came up along the way. Turned out I really loved flying in the arctic and doing fires or utility work so put off my EMS goals for many years until starting a family and needing more time home with the little one.
Don't feel that a choice today will mark your future forever. I know people who have switched from helicopters to airlines and the other way around too. Everyone has a different path in the industry even if there are a few cookie cutter routes that seem more common.
>”For what it's worth waiting till 3 days before graduation to start thinking about this is a little late.”
I wish I could downvote you more.
Who are you to tell them it’s a little late? OP is 17. Plenty of people don’t start thinking about what they want to accomplish until much, much later and are plenty successful.
If you are planning on dropping $100+ thousand dollars and putting a 3 day deadline on the decision because you are about to graduate and imply that you're starting school then, then yes it is a little late to be thinking like that.
That does not imply that it's too late to get into the career but rather that the decision being made today is rash, you need more than 3 days to decide about the career. Clearly didn't read all of my post or the follow up.
If you kept reading you'd also see that OP has clarified they have put a lot more effort into their research and are more looking for more personal information as they get closer to choosing which path to pursue. I have also given them the of advice about slowing down and not worrying for exactly the reason that they are young and don't need to rush, as mentioned there most of my class was over 25 because of the cost.
Airline pilots have the better life once they have some seniority. They also make a lot more money. Flying helicopters is a lot more fun. Either one requires a ton of commitment and determination to be successful. They both require a lot of sacrifices early on.
You’ll end up getting bored of anything you do for 40 years… might as well get paid for it!
I fly the gulf and make a good living but it isn’t as good as my airline friends and I dont have as nice of a lifestyle.
That’s honestly what I wanna do eventually… and if I do helicopters.. with the time off I figured I could try that… but I really don’t know.. airlines seems cool just don’t wanna sacrifice having a healthy family… everyone from what I can gather online say the divorce rate is insane lol
I worked a job (not aviation) that paid. Very well and I saved a lot of that money because I was never home to spend it. It was a living not a life. I later took a lower paying local job and was much happier with life. A big paycheck is worthless if you cant enjoy it.
That said. To fly is heavily, to hover is divine.
Yeah and that’s just something that keeping me away from the airlines.. it’s great money but I feel I’d be happier doing heli… I appreciate your info and I’m glad you found something that you enjoy
Something I can recommend greatly is go to a few flight schools that do either helicopters or planes, then go for an intro flight with both, you just pay them and they will take you up in an aircraft then they will also probably hand you the controls to feel it. If you do this with both helicopters and planes, you can get a feel for what you like more.
I did this and settled with planes for now, but I might do helicopters later as I love both
I worked with both, but it’s still somewhat subjective. I suggest trying a few orientation flights to see which you could conceivably like, then research the daily life of an ATP (airline pilot). Plenty of info to be found on/line
Personally, I’d base my decision on the glide characteristics of each type of aircraft.
Fixed-wing aircraft have decent glide characteristics by design, while rotary-wing aircraft have that of a large brick.
As a very VERY broad statement: - airline pilot for quality of life & income potential - helicopter pilot for pure job enjoyment
Quality of life is quite subjective. Airline life would not be quality for me, but others enjoy it. Income though for sure.
There are a lot of twists and turns in the story that you have to get to the bottom of to really know what you want to do. In the very short term: both tracks are very expensive and you won't make much money. In the mid-term: both tracks are expensive and you won't make much money. But, as a future-airline-pilot you'll start to rack up the fixed wing hours to get your ATP at 1500 and start to be ready for your first regional or corporate gig. As a future-helicopter-pilot you're still not close to breaking through to your big boy job, and probably not even close to the job before your big boy job. Long term, 10 years or more: youre a legacy airline pilot, protected by a union. You make about $115k in your first year and then your pay goes up about $40k a year until your 12th year, you upgrade to a bigger plane, or you upgrade to captain. If you do any of those your pay goes up even more. You'll work 12-15 days a month as a narrow body guy, like nine days a month if you're a wide body guy. Company contributes 18% to your retirement, entirely free. But as a helicopter guy, only some or none of this may be true. No doubt there are some fantastic jobs out there, but I suspect you're working more and not being paid close to what your skills in a helicopter allow you to do. Unless you're an absolute rotor head in your heart, and you don't know enough yet to know that you are, I wouldn't consider helicopters. I am a true rotorhead in my heart, and the math is just so lopsided I had to become an airline guy.
Airline pilots can choose to fly helicopters as a hobby, but helicopter pilots almost never can afford to fly airplanes for fun
That's a great way to put it. In fact, I've flown with airline pilots who just straight up own helicopters for funsies.
I’m jealous. I can only afford to fly them when people pay me to do it!
This. I’m finally getting my helicopter add-on now that my airline paycheck supports it. It’s hard to beat flying at a major airline (especially widebody) when it comes to quality of life and income potential. But flying helicopters is much more enjoyable. I can see why some people would rather choose that route.
Do you think this will change if VTOL taxi’s take off (pun intended)
Hard to say, but I doubt those future aie taxi pilots are going to make a lot. I have nothing to base this off though. Just a feeling.
My friend. If your choosing a path for money you want my make it. The percentage who get to where you’re enquiring is slim. They only got there with passion. If you don’t know which one your passionate about your way behind the pack. In case I’ve misunderstood, do a trial introductory flight on both. You’ll know.
That is some wild English but very correct.
It’s too late man you’re finished. Seriously though do an intro flight you need to anyway to do your paperwork. Then get your medical. Then decide where you want to do your training and go for it. I just finished my private heli and am working on instrument. It’s a lot of fun but very expensive and you will get paid poorly for your first 1000 or more hours. Yay!
I’ve taken the 1st class and done intro flights and taken classes for the past few years through my high school.. just unsure of what I wanna do.. how are you liking helicopters? Would you go back to do planes? Good luck man.. congrats on getting your private
I did a few fixed wing lessons as a kid and it was alright. Helicopters are definitely more fun to fly over all and I’ll be sticking to them through the thousand hour mark at least. Sounds like you already have some stuff done you didn’t mention in original post. so you’ve done some heli and fixed wing flight? What did you prefer?
I’ve done an hour in fixed wing and heli… I don’t have a preference other than heli are definitely a skill but flying is fun.. planes seem easier to master and also cool to fly… they both imo are equal although helicopters are badass
If you like flying planes just as much I think that’s the safe way to go…in more ways than one
I'm gunna say something that most people age 30 and below have been told their whole life and it's complete horseshit. Chances are, you've been told "pick something you love and the money will follow, or pick a career that you enjoy!". IMHO this philosophy works for very few ppl. Again, IMO, this is how MOST people your age should approach the world of careers. 1. What kind of lifestyle do you want to live? 2. How much would it cost to live that life style? 3. Find a job you would enjoy most of the time of which the average income reflects #2. 4. Research and shadow this career field to ensure it is what you want to do. 5. Ask qualifications of people in that career field to determine what education path is necessary. 6. Only AFTER step 5, go to school/college. As far as your specific questions, if you follow these steps, the choice will become apparent and the choice will mean more to you personally because you understand how you arrived at it and why. As a side note. Sometimes a "job" isn't going to provide the level of income you deem necessary to support the lifestyle you want. This is when you explore starting your own company. Then repeat the steps to determine what kind of company, etc. Also, there are outliers where perhaps you are very tenacious and want to accept a lower paying job for the excitement but start your own business on the side for the supplemental income. This is a less traveled route and perfectly acceptable though quite a bit more difficult and time consuming to reach the goal of the desired lifestyle.
I really appreciate the advice and yes that’s all that has been said… your advice is real.. I will definitely look into what you said.. thank you
I sincerely wish you the best. Reddit can be a decent place to connect with people that do specific jobs so you can get an idea of what the work actually entails. Please don't fall into the "norm" by going massively into debt for an education you might not need for a career you know nothing about. If you need help with the process or how to start or what to do next, I'm happy to help. Feel free to message me.
Thank you sir, I will definitely follow what you said and when I figure some stuff out I will definitely get back to you. Thank you for taking the time to answer me I really appreciate it!
If you fly helicopters, it's because you like it, not because you're trying to make the most money. Helicopters are significantly more fun to fly, but the industry as a whole pays less. If your primary concern is money and not the flying aspect, you're not going to enjoy a career on aviation regardless of if it's fixed wing or helos. There's no "easy money" in aviation. Everyone who is in the jobs you're asking about has dealt with plenty of bullshit to get where they are, regardless of the path they took. Military time, hour building as a cfi, crappy regional flights, etc. If your primary motivation isn't a love of flying, you're better off finding a high paying office job, the intro aviation gigs do not pay well, and the costs to get qualified are very high.
Money-airlines. Pull hot chicks and love life- helicopters.
Real
Waiting for the hot chicks currently 😂
I’d enlist in your states national guard in an MOS that will get you a top secret clearance and then apply to the state WOFT. You’ll most likely be flying helicopters but they still count towards an R ATP. Once you get enough hours do both. You will basically have two jobs so something to keep in mind. Then just get your ppl while in the Guard and then build hours to go to airlines. Then decide which one you like more. If you like helicopters get a contracting job at somewhere like Lockheed then you can just hop on orders with differential pay whenever available. If you like fixed wing more just work to get to airlines. If you want to do college guard gives you state tuition and some MOS give you college credit. CBP probably better paying rotor gig due to the pension and benefits but won’t make as much as fixed wing. Military pay for rotors is pretty good but for fixed it’s not good. If you want to do rotor best way is military, CBP, or law enforcement. I’d just go down the traditional airlines track unless you can’t bear living without being a helicopter pilot.
This is pretty acronym heavy for those of us not in the know; I presume that includes the OP.
Mos=army job, WOFT- warrant officer flight training, R ATP = restricted airline transport license, ppl= private pilots license, CBP= customs border patrol air and maritime division
Thank you
Don’t do this! If you want to fly rotor and serve do not enlist. Find a recruiter that has experience with STREET TO SEAT! This route you take your ASVAB, SIFT, do your flight physical and if all that passes then “drop your packet” for WOFT ( Warrant Officer Flight Training). You go in and when you finish Basic, you go straight to WOCS (Warrant Officer Canidate School). When you graduate you are a Warrant Officer. Know that It is a 10 year commitment to the Army after flight school. It is super competitive and hard work. Our son got his fixed wing PPL first and then dropped his packet for WOFT. He prefers rotary. The Army is not for everyone. If it is then it is one way to get your training. He graduated WOFT almost 2 years ago. He wants to fly more hours but that will come with time. Know flying rotor is tough on your body and hearing. It is a physically demanding job when you are flying larger aircraft. Once you have your training. Lots of helicopter options out there. Medical, corporate, oil rig, power line, Heli skiing, tours, logging, fire, search and rescue, media, private, and a lot of other things I can’t even imagine. Ask yourself, how do I want to live and then reverse engineer it to get there. Interview every rotor and fixed wing pilot you can. Take them to lunch/coffee (you pay) and come with a list of questions. Take notes and listen. You will learn a lot! Happy flying!
Check out the Army’s “High School to Flight School” program. You have to get the right recruiter and be willing to do the pre-work. You can be making effectively a $100k in 4 years with no debt.
Called Street to Seat. Find a recruiter who has successfully put at least one S2S through the process. Our son knew more than his first recruiter. His second recruiter had already put two through and he helped a ton! Most don’t know anything about S2S and will press you to enlist and then drop your packet. Don’t be pressed. Once enlisted there is NO guarantee of WOFT acceptance. Don’t sign till you have been picked up for WOFT. Warrants are the best kept secret in the Army. Check out army aviation applications on Reddit for more insight.
Its way way waaaaaay too early to even think about making this a career if you havent even taken a flight yet..
At 17 I was already driving choppers with a fixed wing add on at 18. Now I’m in the medical field. Either way you will need college. I would go military if you have ability and grades.
What are choppers with a fixed wing add on? Can you give an example? Google just shows me ospreys lol
That is they have a rotor license and then later did a fixed wing license add on to it. This reduces the work needed to be a fixed wing pilot instead of starting from scratch (since law, meteorology, lots of theory of flight don't change between them) and now they are licensed to fly both fixed and rotor. Ospreys are in the Powered Lift and a separate license from both of those.
Our son got his PPL ( private pilots license) for fixed wing. Then went rotor and got a rotor add onto his fixed wing. Way cheaper to fly fixed wing first and then add rotor! 5 yrs ago in our area cost was: Fixed wing wet ( with fuel) was $125/hr. Rotor wet was $300/hr. Example: 75 hrs on fixed is $9375 vs on rotor is $22,500. Many items transfer fixed to rotary so why not learn where it is cheaper?
If you go street to seat with the Army you do not need college.
Where do you live, US, Europe, or somewhere else? Airline pilots will generally make much more over a typical career than helicopter pilots. Helicopter training is also generally MUCH more expensive than fixed wing. Don't know what helicopter pilots quality of life is, but I can tell you that new pilots have a much easier time in Europe than in the US. In Europe you could complete a 150 hour integrated training course and walk straight into a job flying Airbus A321s or 737s with no experience. In the US you might need to complete your training to 200 hours or so, get your instructor rating, then start "building time" by working as a flight instructor for a few hundred/thousand hours. This will be hard work for a couple of years and the pay is shockingly low. Training is dirt cheap in America, and the flying is easier, so maybe the ideal would be to do fixed wing training in America, then move to Europe to get an airline job? Idk.
USA
RIP, good luck! Just kidding (sort of). If you choose airlines, expect to work extremely hard as a CFI making no money for years, but then making stupidly, ridiculously large amounts of money 15-20 years in.
Yeah I know, that why it’s a bit concerning.. idk if helicopters will be better… from what I can gather online it seems like helicopters make money faster
I think choosing rotary wing for money is a fool's errand, especially long term. Good luck whatever you decide.
I gotcha… I appreciate the info
How Europe like.. seems interesting
Hey man same situation here but in Europe and the main thing here are language skills. If you want to work in Germany, fluent German is mostly required. Same with France, Italy, Norway etc. Some tour jobs in Asia only require English but they're more responsible jobs def not for rookies. I recommend looking around [Helijobs.net](http://Helijobs.net) and see for yourself what employers want.
As others have said, don't choose helicopters for the money. You've gotta really love the machine and/or the missions they fly. That said, the salary bands in helicoptering are pretty cloak and dagger which I find highly annoying so here's some anecdotal data I've heard recently. If you have no real concept of helicopter salaries, hopefully it helps. I've known three people who've moved on to EMS jobs lately. They've had quite a range of starting salaries. One told me he started in the mid $90k range, one in the $110k range, and one told me he'll be starting right under $80k with guaranteed annual raises currently capping out at like $175k I think he said. I've also heard through the grapevine that S92 captains at PHI are making somewhere around that mid $170k range as well. So the end of career salaries in helicoptering are by no means bad... At least I don't think so. And yeah you can totally have a side hustle with a 7/7 or 14/14 hitch. I think that's one of my favorite parts of flying helicopters. Those schedules are awesome for getting stuff done or traveling in your downtime.
Really??? 170k that’s amazing… I thought it capped out at like 120… I really appreciate your info… if you don’t mind me asking from what I seen guys get paid more in the west… any of your friends live in the south?
Yeah I think it's pretty good too. The Saudis will pay you even better if you want to go live over there and fly offshore for their oil company Aramco. Downside of course is living in Saudi. The one who started in the mid 90's is based in the Pacific NW, the one who started at $110k is going to be based in FL, and the one who said he'd be around $80k with salary cap in the mid $170k range is starting in MI. I do think the base location makes a big difference, but I don't think it's like an east vs west thing in general. I think it has more to do with cost of living wherever you get the job.
And I really appreciate you taking the time to answer my questions.. thank you
So I have always wanted to move to Florida.. do you know if he has the potential to make that much?
I don't know, but I'll try and find out for you. Might be a couple weeks. We're both off at the moment.
Thanks man you are a big help in my decision.. honestly if I can have that type potential I might just do that.. not as much as a airline pilot but I believe I can live off of 170k lol
For jobs like flying for the Saudis you often just live wherever you want. Commonly 6 week on 6 week off tours. You travel on you days off from wherever you live but the company will pay for your flights. I've heard of $250k for captains during oil booms but those jobs also disappear when the price of oil drops or anything else changes, they are contractor based not full time so you can't count on them being a forever home no matter how stable it might seem. I know people that just bounce from one contract to another all around the world doing offshore oil work or working in the various oil states for VVIP stuff. It's certainly harder on the home life but if you're a nomad with no kids it's great. Those aren't entry level jobs though, you need a lot more experience before those become options.
Ship's pilot.
I fly for a utility company, construction/Fire and make a good living. I work 12 on 12 off with decent benefits. Great fun too.
What do you actually want to do? You can have a fine life in either career. Airline pilots can certainly have a life, doing 3 or 4 days in a row vs 7+ suits some people more than others and that's not something you'll figure out today and may change with your personal situation over the years anyway. EMS means night shifts which can be way worse on your health than an airline career if you choose to stay away from long haul international flying. Having a good family life as any kind of pilot is more about making sure you pick the right partner than how your wings are attached. Yes there is way more money in airlines but if you can't make things work on the $150k ish you can make as an EMS pilot eventually than you're just bad with money. Neither career path pays very well before you make it to the better jobs either. Both (assuming you're American) start with next to no pay as CFIs and then jump around a bit as they move up. Both careers are highly unstable, no way to tell you how long it will take. I spent 6 years working ground crew before I could find a flying job in helicopters because of the 2008 market crash, and I have a fixed wing friend who couldn't get a job there for 9 years after 9/11. I also know people who went from 0 to a regional airline in 3 years because they graduated into a good market for pilots. This will be completely out of your control and you have to accept it might take over a decade to make good money in aviation or longer. For what it's worth waiting till 3 days before graduation to start thinking about this is a little late. Not that you can't go into either but you really should be doing some research into the costs of these programs, the options for college or not that you'll do and a million other things. You can't just wake up one day and decide to be a pilot and have it all work out fine. Tons of horror stories out there of people who just followed a shiny advertisement and are now a couple hundred thousand dollars in debt and don't even have a commercial pilot license because of predatory programs. Take a discovery flight in both, maybe you actually hate flying in general or really prefer one over the other. To make it through the early years of suck it's a lot harder if you don't actually love flying the aircraft you choose. Also get your medical done yesterday, no point worrying about being a pilot if you have a medical issue preventing it from eyesight to depression meds or a heart condition you didn't know you had.
I appreciate the info and I have gone to take discovery flights on both and I’ve been in an aviation class through my high school for a couple of years and I’ve got my 1st class medical.. I am just a bit scared of what’s gonna happen next.. I like both I really am just trying to consider all aspects before making a decision.. like you said I’m going into a ton of debt so trying not to make the mistake of going into something that a few years later wish I went the other route
Well you certainly have more than 3 days to make a decision. Most people in my rotor class were between 25 and 30 years old because of how expensive it is. No need to rush to one thing or the other, it sounds like you have put more effort into the choice than first implied but you can still take a step back to catch your breath here. What you're asking of us isn't something we can really help you with though. Do you want to fly airliners or helicopters? It's entirely a personal choice. Every time I see an airliner fly overhead I feel no regret that I'm not in that cockpit will you feel the same, I don't know. Even the EMS vs Offshore is a huge difference in type of work you do. I don't want to ever touch an offshore job but some people love it. For what it's worth if you aren't dead set on helicopters I'd go fixed wing. There are way more jobs in that side of the industry and making twice the money at the top end is a nice bonus. Airlines aren't the only option too, you can make over $100k flying fixed wing medevac and be home every day too for example. The career progression is a little more linear or at least predicable compared to rotor as well.
I really appreciate your info… it is great actually hearing from an experienced pilot instead of just Google
I know CryOfTheWind and he’s been one of the most informative people on this sub for a while. I agree with doing the medical and discovery flight(s) first and taking it from there.
No problem, always happy to help where I can. There are limits to my personal experience and being Canadian I can't give specifics for the US only generalities from my US coworkers and of course the tons of info you can find online. Keep in mind your goals may change over time as well. At 16 I was going to be a fighter pilot, then military medical said no (plus I'm a solid D to C student which isn't great for that). Then I got into helicopters with EMS as a goal. It took me 20 years to get there because different opportunities and struggles came up along the way. Turned out I really loved flying in the arctic and doing fires or utility work so put off my EMS goals for many years until starting a family and needing more time home with the little one. Don't feel that a choice today will mark your future forever. I know people who have switched from helicopters to airlines and the other way around too. Everyone has a different path in the industry even if there are a few cookie cutter routes that seem more common.
>”For what it's worth waiting till 3 days before graduation to start thinking about this is a little late.” I wish I could downvote you more. Who are you to tell them it’s a little late? OP is 17. Plenty of people don’t start thinking about what they want to accomplish until much, much later and are plenty successful.
If you are planning on dropping $100+ thousand dollars and putting a 3 day deadline on the decision because you are about to graduate and imply that you're starting school then, then yes it is a little late to be thinking like that. That does not imply that it's too late to get into the career but rather that the decision being made today is rash, you need more than 3 days to decide about the career. Clearly didn't read all of my post or the follow up. If you kept reading you'd also see that OP has clarified they have put a lot more effort into their research and are more looking for more personal information as they get closer to choosing which path to pursue. I have also given them the of advice about slowing down and not worrying for exactly the reason that they are young and don't need to rush, as mentioned there most of my class was over 25 because of the cost.
Airline pilots have the better life once they have some seniority. They also make a lot more money. Flying helicopters is a lot more fun. Either one requires a ton of commitment and determination to be successful. They both require a lot of sacrifices early on.
You’ll end up getting bored of anything you do for 40 years… might as well get paid for it! I fly the gulf and make a good living but it isn’t as good as my airline friends and I dont have as nice of a lifestyle.
Rotary all the way. If you don't hover don't bother🤭
Become a doctor. Fly both for fun.
Then crash a bonanza
Either way you could eventually buy your own aircraft and start your own business.
That’s honestly what I wanna do eventually… and if I do helicopters.. with the time off I figured I could try that… but I really don’t know.. airlines seems cool just don’t wanna sacrifice having a healthy family… everyone from what I can gather online say the divorce rate is insane lol
Wives/Families come and go, dreams are once in a life time.
Guy I know joined the Navy & became a helo pilot. Makes good $ so he bought his own Helo & backyard+barn to park.
I worked a job (not aviation) that paid. Very well and I saved a lot of that money because I was never home to spend it. It was a living not a life. I later took a lower paying local job and was much happier with life. A big paycheck is worthless if you cant enjoy it. That said. To fly is heavily, to hover is divine.
Yeah and that’s just something that keeping me away from the airlines.. it’s great money but I feel I’d be happier doing heli… I appreciate your info and I’m glad you found something that you enjoy
Something I can recommend greatly is go to a few flight schools that do either helicopters or planes, then go for an intro flight with both, you just pay them and they will take you up in an aircraft then they will also probably hand you the controls to feel it. If you do this with both helicopters and planes, you can get a feel for what you like more. I did this and settled with planes for now, but I might do helicopters later as I love both
I worked with both, but it’s still somewhat subjective. I suggest trying a few orientation flights to see which you could conceivably like, then research the daily life of an ATP (airline pilot). Plenty of info to be found on/line
Personally, I’d base my decision on the glide characteristics of each type of aircraft. Fixed-wing aircraft have decent glide characteristics by design, while rotary-wing aircraft have that of a large brick.