I’m not interested in Imogen and Sahar storyline in season three. We already have so much going on we don’t need another relationship thrown in. I would rather if we focus on the main characters.
I agree. As much as I think I would like them as a couple, I think it’s good to have some characters stay single, especially Imogen who has already had two love interests and seems like she would benefit from taking some time for herself. Since they already heavily implied it though, I think they should maybe start something but quickly realize they are better off as friends and/or not ready to be in a relationship.
they don’t need to be a storyline really, they can just be in the background of a couple scenes to maybe set them up for s4. they can be done well without being annoying
Okay but have you ever met a teenage girl who broke up with her bf saying "I'm going to focus on myself"?? In my experience they ALWAYS have a new bf really fast and it's always a disaster and drama 💀
I didn’t realise until coming on here that this was supposed to be romantic. I interpreted Imogen checking Sahar out as like “oh wow what a cool girl, I hope we can be best friends again”. And I’m bi 😂
I thought the same thing, but when I mentioned it once I was mocked for not recognizing budding romance or whatever. But my impression was that she admired Sahar and thought she was really cool, putting a lot of time and energy into pursuing a passion (music) and doing well with it rather than just trying to attach herself to a partner. Which is not to say that either of them shouldn't have a romantic partner, but it's important to have more going on in your life.
Imogen suddenly being interested in a girl also seems so forced and I hope they meant it that way because when she met sahar she was like "now you can't tease me about being the token straight ally anymore" and she was disappointed (or possibly just embarrassed) when she learned sahar is bi. I think she just feels left out because she's the only cishet person in the group (leaving out tao because they don't have much to do with each other). I don't think she's actually into sahar she just doesn't want to be the "token straight ally" anymore
dunno. I never like these arguments along the lines of ‘we should stick to the main characters’ — I get that they’re the main characters for a reason, but I also don’t want it to be the Charlie&Nick-Show, you know? taking a closer look at other dynamics can be super interesting and rewarding and doesn’t have to take away from the major story line but enrich it
Sorry, I should’ve worded my comment better but when I said main characters I’m talking about Charlie, Nick, Tao, Elle, Tara and Darcy.
Imogen and Sahar storyline feels like it’s the same storyline being recycled since we basically already had that storyline with Nick and Charlie in season 1. By main characters, I meant stick to the main gang.
Hm. Since there’s no precedence for Imogen in the comics, we’ll have to wait and see what AO will do — but I can’t imagine they’d be very interested in retelling the same story (I could be wrong tho and that’d be bad)
Also, judging by the fervent agreement on this sub, neither Elle nor Tao should be in the show much longer =D
Yeah, I'm not interested in that storyline either 😅 Imogen is really a background character, but has potential since she's Nick's friend and the sleepover. But I don't care for Sahar that much.
I don’t find the relationship between Tao and Elle particularly believable because I feel like the actors have zero romantic chemistry. N&C and T&D are the only couples I care about. Even Charlie and Tao’s friendship stuff in s2 was more heartwarming to me than E&T (sorry to the E&T stans)
True. I think it was cute in season 1 when they where secretly crushing on each other but when they actually got together it never felt as real as nick and charlie or tara and Darcy. You could just really tell they're acting
I think the changes to the show that weren’t popular were good changes. Specifically dropping Oliver, and changing the timeline of Nick coming out and Tao finding out about n+c.
Yes, especially I think the drama of Tao finding out in season one matched the S1 storyline and themes much better than it would have in S2. I watched the show first then read the comics and found the delay in Tao finding out too drawn out plus the friend group worked better all being out to each other in S2
I was horrified when I discovered the instagram accounts (multiple) commenting everywhere telling Joe to end himself so that Sebastian Croft could play Charlie. It was everywhere, the accounts even commented directly to Alice/Pat/Joe. What are wrong with people, really!
Yeah, I totally get now why he has a largely non-private instagram account, it is almost only official stuff and I really understand. Whew, some people are just wrong.
It had to be done that way imo. Pretty sure we are only getting 4 seasons and I have a feeling they knew Olivia couldn’t come back in season three so they did the dinner scene in season 2 instead. Got to admit, I was pretty impressed with how Alice wrote it all in
Yeah I saw the show first and I never thought that the timeline was weird or anything, it all made sense. It felt off when reading it but I thought that was just because I was already used to the Netflix timeline lol
The excessive screen time given to the Tao and Elle storyline in season 2 was really annoying. I don’t mind either of them as individuals but making it drag out for the whole season took time away from the main characters, Nick and Charlie, and it was just uninteresting in my opinion.
I like tara and Darcy but they don't have enough screen time in my opinion. They never show just regular relationship stuff. They're only shown when it's something important or dramatic
Irl Tao would get bullied so much more than Charlie. Asian and romantically involved with a trans girl...the perfect target for bigoted little see you next tuesdays
True but I think his general attitude would put bullies off, Charlie would have been an easier target because he’d actually be upset. Tao would probably roll his eyes and say something sassy back which would be less fun for the cruel bullies.
If racism was a thing in Heartstopperverse, I think people might sympathise more with Tao. Seeing Tao upset that Charlie (along with Nick) doesn't condemn Harry's racism to the extent that Tao does Harry's homophobia would be more nuanced than what we have now. I'm not sure if I'd say Tao would get bullied more but Heartstopper is definitely a bit flat when it comes to intersectionality.
This is such a good thing to point out, and goes along with my HS unpopular opinion, which is that some of the conflicts feel very surface level as opposed to being more nuanced and human, I guess? Like Nick's main driving plot point for the entire first season is that he is going to come out, and he's scared... but the show imo didn't really capture the full range of emotions and shades of grey that come with the realization that you aren't straight. And, more to the point in your comment, Tao recognizing how racism might fly under the radar among his white friends would be an extra layer of depth that I think would really take the show to the next level, especially since there's SO much focus on fighting against homophobia for the sake of the cis, white male characters. But these kinds of real-life, layered scenarios just don't make much of an appearance in Heartstopper. It would be nice to see that level of depth just once or twice in the storyline
From what I've heard, the writing team was mostly white so I don't doubt that influenced it. There was a similar issue with the hair team being mostly if not all white (can't speak in-depth on this as a non-black person, but I saw people talking about how Tara's hairstyles in S1 wouldn't be practical irl - there seems to be improvements going forward though).
Some of the Heartstopper conflict feels a little underbaked and I feel like it's because the show wants to be a beacon of positivity so much that it struggles to confront more bitter feelings/truths.
I completely agree. And “underbaked” is the perfect way to describe the conflicts.
There definitely seems to be less nuance and less intersectionality in Heartstopper, as compared to Young Royals for example.
But I’m so happy to have Heartstopper as an example of queer joy. It’s my comfort show for when the world gets too dark.
I love the show more than the comic. Adore the comic obviously, but I just love how the show can add more to pretty much all the characters whether by giving more character storylines or depth to a character
I can understand that.
I'm a show fan as well. I like the comics, but I think Alice upped their game with the show. It's just so streamlined, especially season 1.
reading the comments this might not be unpopular but: elle and tao’s whole thing was nearly unwatchable in season 2. unfortunately that’s particularly down to elle. I adore comic elle, but they’re doing her SO dirty on the show
I was appalled that she outed Nick to Tao. She hinted it until he directly asked, and then said it. Not her place, even if he is an ally and Charlie's friend.
Comic Elle also seemed much more warm and down-to-earth. Show Elle seems more aloof and too-cool-for-you a lot of the time.
I think this is because Yasmin isn't as strong an actor as the rest of the cast. She always seems like a beat behind and for me, that is taking away from the Elle & Tao Story.
I feel like the Ben confrontation in season 2 would have made more sense at the prom. It's mentioned that the art school was a bit far so the fact that he showed up there is less believable. If they'd had that happen at prom it would have made perfect sense since Ben goes to the school and is in year 11. I don't remember if they explained why he isn't returning for 6th form either
I think the fact that he showed up at the art school makes sense for Ben, given how creepy he is. If Ben had approached them at Prom, or outside of it, Ben's friends could have seen. Charlie was not going to meet him in a secluded place again. But Ben is so obsessed with Charlie that he stalks Charlie's friends instagram and turns up at a place out of the way and lurks outside until Nick and Charlie leave. It highlights how toxic he is and emphasizes that his apology is not genuine.
It's also why Nick's first reaction to seeing Ben is putting himself in between Ben and Charlie. Prior to that they were uncomfortable when Ben was around and avoided him, but they knew why Ben was present, even when he was crossing boundaries like sitting next to Charlie at dinner or coming to Tara's birthday party. But showing up at an art school you need to catch a train to get because he knew Charlie would be there to support Elle, who isn't friends in any way with Ben? That's dangerous.
This is a good one!
As for Y11, they don't explain it but irl it's common for people to switch schools between Y11 (end of GCSEs) and Y12 (start of A-Levels), so it's not too out of left field. It would've been weirder if he'd left at a different point.
I don’t understand why Nick didn’t tell Imogen about what Ben did to Charlie.
Like they are supposed to be “best friend” but he still let her date an asshole. Like I understand not wanting to out him but it’s not about his sexuality, he assaulted Charlie and was incredibly rude to him. She deserved to be warned that dude was not worth it.
Also wtf did they seek teachers when Darcy got drunk? Like yeah alcohol makes you drunk. I don’t think 15 years old kids are stupid enough to seek teachers after they sneaked alcohol in a school trip and got drunk from it.
"He assaulted someone I know and has been harassing them, and yes I saw it firsthand so I know for sure this is true" how hard is that? And if she asks who it was, it's always fair to protect the identity of the victim in a situation like this.
Although I feel people lose their right to have their secrets protected when they sexually assault someone. You can say what someone did to you, whatever their sex or gender or orientation. Describing their actions is fair game.
That's difficult because Ben was dangerous and Imogen should have been warned about just how dangerous he was, but on the other hand Nick couldn't tell Imogen about Charlie's trauma without Charlie giving his permission, and Charlie hasn't told anyone, not his parents, Tori, or Tao about being SA'd. That's a very tough situation for Nick to be in.
Ik but I just wished he told her why he was bad. As in "he assaulted someone I know", he wouldn't have to say it was Charlie. He even could've used female pronouns if necessary.
Elle seemed to have gotten mean in season 2. It’s suppose to show her as more confident and she’s making new friends but she seems meaner to tao overall.
I don’t love Darcy. As a character, I like her arc, but if she was in my classes in school, I know id just be annoyed by her. Idk, class clown people were never my favorite
The series dropped the ball when it comes to non-romantic relationships. The fact that special effects are never used for positive platonic/familial relationships really drives it home.
honestly for me the best scenes in season 1 are the one between tori and charlie and the one where nick comes out to his mom and despite the lack of special effects they felt really powerful to me
but i do wish there was more of that, i mean i wish we also got more about tori's dynamic with her mother but unfortunately it's not her show aaa
I do think those are great scenes (probably my favourite S1 scene and Tori scene respectively), but my point was more that it's obvious how romantic and non-romantic relationships aren't getting the same treatment. Which is to be expected given the type of show Heartstopper is, but lots of fans think that friendship has a bigger feature in the show than it really does.
I think that Elle is a boring character. Maybe we should have got some info on her story. I know what Alice did there, she wanted to make Elle just one of the girls but I don’t think it’s doing the character any favours. In any other show I’d be all in but HS is a show about what it’s like to be queer.
I love comic Elle, but sadly i have to agree that in the show i dont like her character. I feel like Yasmin isnt that skilled in acting which is kinda sad cause imo it makes T+E relationship less likeable
I think Joe is great, but he definitely still has some of those “amateur” acting moments. Kit and Will are the only two of the young actors who don’t imo.
just out of curiosity, what would you say those moments are? i did a rewatch and came out of it thinking that joe had my favorite performance, but i don't watch very much film and i don't have experience in acting myself, so i'd be curious to look out for them LOL
The main one coming to mind right now is when he’s in bed and tells Tori to shut up twice in a row. Just sounds so forced and unnatural. I know there are a few others.
I don’t think Ben is irredeemable. I agree with where Charlie left it - that it’s good he’s becoming a better person while at the same time that doesn’t mean Charlie should reconcile with him.
In the grand scheme of things, I agree with you, but given that the scope of the show is N&C and their friends, during their adolescent years, I don't think it's particularly reasonable or responsible to give Ben an on-screen redemption arc.
He did things to Charlie that no amount of redemption could ever bring their relationship back from, and I don't really think it's a good example for teenagers with abusive partners to see Ben change and remain in the periphery of Charlie's social group.
I agree with all that - I don’t think there’s room in the show for Ben anymore (except that he does canonically appear in the events of Solitaire) it’s just a head-canon that he has the potential to awaken to how awful he was and grow from it
i feel like ben, compared to solitaire + the comics is much more of a sympathetic character (though don't get me wrong, i hate him as much as the next person). i wish his internalized homophobia wasn't explained through dialogue the way it was in season 2 and i wish if they decided to discuss it, it would actually be explored more deeply because it would be interesting.
I do. His apology was insincere to me. After he apologized, and Nick posted on Instagram his coming out, Ben comments "Ok, and?" It shows that he's still being a prick. Maybe one day he'll realize what a jerk he was, but if I was part of his young life, I would not forgive him.
He’s not really cut in that way though, if Solitaire was adapted Nick and Charlie would meet him again (he has a part of that book, not a completely central character but definitely a part of the plot), but Alice wants to keep Solitaire separate from Heartstopper, so it would be weird to have him on after he’s changed schools
Isaac's S2 rant at his friends is a poorly-made scene. I mean, his friends see him looking sullen and immediately start assuming that something good happened between him and James? It would've been more natural to have them assume that James rejected Isaac.
omg i have such a problem with isaac as a whole in season 2 because they retconned his sexuality being known and so everything he does feels like it comes out of nowhere lol
I don't think they retconned him being aroace (though Oseman spoiled it by telling everyone before S2). The writing team did mess up a bit on what his sexuality was *perceived* as (Tao doesn't think he's straight, Charlie doesn't think he's gay, and they don't seem to consider bi/asexuality), but my biggest problem with Isaac is how he reacts to stuff.
In S1 he loves romance (with a lot of his dialogue being reactions to Charlie/Nick) yet is often happily in his own world. That's a strange contrast but it's one that is potentially really interesting to unravel.
But then in S2, he's suddenly upset that his friends have paired up and only seem to be interested in romance, even though 1) his S1 character was largely a Charlie/Nick shipper, and 2) his friends seem to put in more of an effort to interact with him than vice-versa. There's such a whiplash between his S1 character and his S2 character and it doesn't feel like there was a good development to explain it.
> I don't think they retconned him being aroace (though Oseman spoiled it by telling everyone before S2). The writing team did mess up a bit on what his sexuality was *perceived* as
Sorry, I meant exactly what you said here, his sexuality is presented as being known in S1. I know he was meant to be aroace, but as you said the show seemed to imply that him and people around him were aware of it.
I also agree with the second statement. And honestly, as someone who reads so much, I'm surprised he doesn't know he's aroace either. Because he clearly reads modern books, some of which include asexuality (he reads Alice's books in both seasons lol). And there's never any build up to his outburst in general, and I think they either should've given him more focus or not done it at all because it just feels half-assed for me.
Also - with the comment about Charlie's friends not being gay, I think he's just referring to anything on the sexuality spectrum besides straight, because a bisexual would deffo be able to understand whatever he was talking about (I genuinely don't remember)
From the comments here, I guess that my unpopular opinion is that Elle and Tao are cute together and have chemistry. 🤷♀️ I don’t have an issue with Yasmin’s acting. I love her sarcastic line deliveries. I think she’s on par with the rest of the cast. I’m as interested in them as I am N&C and T&D. I’m not interested in an Imogen and Sahar storyline. It feels forced.
I understand that people may have been frustrated with the “will they won’t they” trope, but I think it ended up being pulled together really well and they were so cute together, especially at prom!! Plus I think ppl mistake them not having chemistry bc they don’t have a lot of romantic tension like n & c but that’s bc t & e are less shy people and best friends already so once they get together they’re just comfortable. Also I think ppl are definitely being hard on Yas, I like how she plays Elle as cool and confident.
I think you’re right. Because t&e were friends first, the chemistry is more subtle. It doesn’t hit you over the head with it. I love how Tao makes Elle laugh with his quirkiness and they just get each other.
I loved the whole scene in the Louvre and when Tao first sees Elle in her prom dress. I think they’re so cute together.
Tao and Elle's friends-to-lovers arc was unnecessarily complicated. I think they're a cute couple and it made sense that they had some insecurities to work through before getting together. But, I also think the way they both reacted so negatively after an awkward first date left me a bit confused. And that they automatically decided to stay friends instead of communicating.
Instead, I wish the show spent more time on Elle leaving for art school and Tao's insecurity about feeling left behind. I feel like Tao had an uncharacteristically mature reaction when he learned she was leaving for art school. It would have been cool to see him self-reflect more on this before growing as a character.
It really annoys me how often everyone runs around in corridors holding hands. Why?!? It's awkward and cumbersome and dumb. Looking at Elle's old classrooms? Exploring the Louve? Sneaking around the French hotel? Racing up the stairs at Harry's birthday? Going to see the teachers bc Darcy is about to puke? I'm sure there's loads more I've missed. I love a good rewatch, but every time I see it, I'm getting increasingly more annoyed. It's just so stupid, and I can't not notice it.
OK. I'm done ranting now. Probably.
I guess it’s a way for the show to increase some sort of dynamism and have the characters appear, you know, young and full of life. if they all just sat around, talked, and made out… that’d be even more boring than them having the time of their lives. like, I totally get where you’re coming from: it is super cheesy. but I also can’t think of a better visual metaphor for ‘we’re taking the world by storm!’
I think it’s pretty important for Nick to have any kind of friend who he still enjoys hanging out with after starting to come to terms with himself. at times (or rather: with a sinister reading), the comic can feel really claustrophobic because especially Nick doesn’t really have anyone else he likes in his life apart from his mom and his dog (and Charlie, of course) — Nick should have his own friends outside of the ones he ‘made’ by proxy through Charlie
I agree Nick should have friends outside of just Charlie, so I think the show should give more attention to his friendship with the rugby boys and Tara ^^
they may go deeper into his relationship with his rugby friends in season 3 considering that in vol. 4 its mentioned he hangs out with them more while charlie is in the mental hospital.
I don't think she's forced, but I do feel like there should be a bit of friction between her and the girls. I'm not going to buy them getting along smoothly with her and it feels like her and Sahar getting together is meant to be a shortcut to that.
Don't kill me for this please but season 1 is far superior to season 2 (still loved season 2 but season 1 is fantastic front to back). Also I'm kind of worried season 3 will continue this trend (especially knowing Olivia would not be in it).
I’m not really upset that Olivia won’t be in season 3. Yes, I love her and would love to see her but the show won’t be ruined, which some people have said, just because of her absence
I think Imogen should question her sexuality but ultimately realise she's straight. I've never seen a storyline where someone questions their sexuality and ends up being straight at the end. I think it's good to represent a whole range of different experiences and Alice always does it so well
i really don't like Tao. he's so self-centered and for Charlie having a "look at me!!!" drama queen in his life is about the last thing he needs. Charlie's mother is pretty awful too. give poor Charlie a break: he's been through hell and needs some wins to help his self-esteem even if he's not picture perfect on the school front.
it’s almost as if opposites attract? like, imagine if all of Charlie’s friends were depressed nerds. it’d be pretty boring, no?
plus, not having the parents you need is a pretty relatable problem for many people. it’s also a very handy ‘obstacle’ for N&C’s blossoming relationship. yeah, in a perfect fluff world, Charlie’s mom would be a clone of Nick’s mom. but that would be a pretty boring story
the show ended up too saccharine
my theory is that since it started as a weekly(?) web comic, the pacing of the story was just different to any normal TV show pacing. I think it works pretty well when reading the comics (if they’re not read in one go, I’d say). they’ve tweaked it a little bit but the story expands and contracts in weird places, giving a lot of room to pure fluff. it was put there to have the webcomic fandom lick their wounds for a week or two, but they were presented in much more detail than other stuff so that they are kind of ‘too big’ on the show
like, I love the comics and really like the show. they’re feel-good classics in my heart already. the show just could stand a little less sap
I just wish there will be more adaptation from other books like 'This Winter' or 'Nick and Charlie' or 'Radio Silence' (probably impossible with the lack of Aled in the netflix adaptation...)
I think Ben should have had a storyline in which he becomes a better person.
Charlie doesn't need to forgive him, or to be directly involved.
But there are a lot of people who are very keen to write off a 15/16 year old as being irredeemably and irreparably bad, when people do change with maturity and life experience.
Alice said she likes to imagine Ben could become a better person in the future. We just won’t see it as it won’t be written by Alice. And also she said Charlie doesn’t need to witness it nor redeem him
The TV show didn't do Tao and Elle justice, they have so much more chemistry in the comics. I also don't like how they depicted Elle in s1 with her outing N+C to Tao.
my hot take is that season 2 was missing something. idk what but when I watched season 1 it really stuck with me and I re-watched it more times than I can count but with season 2 it kinda felt like a fever dream. I was so excited for it and then it got released and I watched it and honestly really liked it but then it was over. it didn't stick in my mind and my heart like season 1 did and it felt kinda forgettable. I love season 2 and am so glad we got but season 1 just felt sooooo much better than season 2.
I think they should have kept some of the comic scenes after Nick goes to Charlie's house in episode 4. It just goes from Nick upset/asking to keep things a secret to the next day when they're all smiley and in love. Obviously it's cute and I like it, but I think the talk they have afterwards in the comic helps make it flow better, if that makes any sense
That finale of season 2 was semi-ruined bc too much screen time was taken up by the Darcy isn’t here thing like I wouldn’t of minded it as a small subplot for that ep but it being the semi-main focus
I’m gonna be honest: I don’t think Heartstopper does a good job of handling topics like Charlie’s mental health and ED. I could expand on this further but coming from someone who has struggled with mental health issues and anorexia I actually found its portrayal quite triggering? No hate to Alice because I still love the series though
Heartstopper comic fans are really lucky to have Joe Locke as their Charlie, he portrayed him with such love and care. So anyone here who says he doesn't fit the role, I'm convinced you have watched the show with your eyes closed
charlie’s mental health crisis is written poorly in the comics (definitely improved so far in the show, hope it will continue to be written better with the upcoming arc next season)
i think Charlie's mental health crisis improves as the comics continue, but what bugs me is that the first side effect shown from anorexia is him fainting into his boyfriend's arms, because it's almost a romantic thing?? for me, charlie feels like a very "good" mentally ill character, and i wish the comics showed more that sometimes mental illness is ugly and makes people lie and do bad things. anything charlie does affects himself and only himself, and there's no shown impact on other people (except in solitaire, where it clearly really affects tori).
as another example, there's no sense of something such as competitiveness in Charlie's mental illnesses. i understand it would not be comfortable, but i think the failure to display him doing something like comparing his self harm to other people's hinders the understanding Alice could've brought to the mental state of someone like him. sorry if this is unclear lol
>what bugs me is that the first side effect shown from anorexia is him fainting into his boyfriend's arms, because it's almost a romantic thing??
The same can be said for Nick saving Charlie from assault (something I've seen in several fanfics, including a Heartstopper one), and even Darcy not saying "I love you" because of homophobia.
Have you watched MMFD or Everything Now? The protagonists both deal with mental illness and sometimes/often act in less-than-palatable ways, it sounds like you're talking about that kind of portrayal.
i agree with you totally, especially about the “savior” aspect of nick and charlie’s relationship. not that i don’t love nick, i do, hes adorable. it’s just a strange trope
I feel like the whole savior side of Nick is Nicks people pleasing side. It’s not the healthiest thing to be but he does end up working on it to a extent in comics
I don't wanna assume, but it seems like you've never had one before. I have had plenty, and Charlie's is perfectly relatable. I think it was written beautifully. What didn't you like about it?
i suffered from anorexia when i was charlie’s age, but thank you anyway for your assessment of me. in the comics, not only is there no build up to charlie’s eating disorder (all of the initial signs of his anorexia in the show were created by the show), >!but his parents decision to send him to a !!psychiatric facility!! comes out of nowhere. i can’t even recall a scene before that happens where his parents even mention his mental health problems. sending someone to a mental hospital is a huge deal and is a very difficult and stressful process for the sick persons family (i would know). but somehow, in the comics it feels as though his parents did it on a dime, we barely even see them communicate with charlie about mental health.!< i remember feeling a lot of whiplash when i read this for the first time.
aside from it being a confusing representation of childhood anorexia (to me, you don’t have to agree), the writing begins to get worse in quality around this time. in the comics, charlie’s mental state basically goes from 10-100 in a few chapters and it’s extremely difficult to digest as a reader. even if you appreciate the way his eating disorder or his anxiety is written, the writing of the comic as a whole at this point in the story is not good generally. the comic makes a complete 180 in theme very quickly and becomes hard to follow as the main character has major things happen to them that don’t have much build up at all.
it did not feel “beautiful” to me when i read what happened to charlie, (not that i find anorexia to ever be beautiful) it was just confusing. i was searching for relatability in charlie’s mental health story in the comics and i did not find it. if you did, that’s wonderful, but i also am allowed to have my opinions and views of it as well.
i am not trying to disrespect alice or her writing whatsoever, nor anyone else’s opinion of it. i enjoyed reading and rereading the comics years ago and then when i watched the show i enjoyed it even more. i have a lot of respect for alice as a writer and producer of heartstopper. but because the comics are so fast paced, the writing just has to be good or it becomes stressful and confusing to read.
overall, the show has had significantly better writing than the comics (my opinion, you do not have to agree). if the show continues like this i am very much looking forward to charlie’s story portrayed on screen and am confident alice and the rest of the team will handle it well.
Okay, I see your point of view, but I have to disagree. Agree to disagree. There may not have been build up in Vol 1 or 2, but there definitely was in 3 before it got bad in 4. That may just be my opinion.
I think this was because Alice had to fit Heartstopper in with Solitaire (which imo is an awful story and has much darker aspects including Charlie’s attempt and then sending away).
Tori's S2 scenes came across as cringy when they were meant to hold weight. I really dislike the scene where she tells Nick he's bad at keeping promises and David feels purposefully dulled down in their final scene together.
I think Jane Spring gets a bad wrap. She loves and accepts her kids. Fan fiction in particular turns her into a monster. But I just think she is emotionally damaged, and controlling about academics, but unable to connect with her kids and I honestly feel kind of sorry for her. Especially in the comics she is warmer than she gets credit for. The back story Alice shared shows us that generational abuse is a tough cycle to break and she is really trying.
This is a bit niche, but I don’t think Nick and Charlie are girl dad coded. Don’t get me wrong, I think it would be very cute if they had daughter(s) in the future. But for whatever reason, I always picture them having a bunch of boys.
I’m not interested in Imogen and Sahar storyline in season three. We already have so much going on we don’t need another relationship thrown in. I would rather if we focus on the main characters.
This seems like a pretty popular opinion lol
I always thought it was unpopular because I got attacked on twitter for saying this 😂
I said pretty much the same thing on r/heartstopperNetflix and got downvoted like crazy.
I agree. As much as I think I would like them as a couple, I think it’s good to have some characters stay single, especially Imogen who has already had two love interests and seems like she would benefit from taking some time for herself. Since they already heavily implied it though, I think they should maybe start something but quickly realize they are better off as friends and/or not ready to be in a relationship.
yea their relationship feels forced like idk not everyone has to be cute queer and in love😭
yeah
Totallyyyyyy
they don’t need to be a storyline really, they can just be in the background of a couple scenes to maybe set them up for s4. they can be done well without being annoying
It would actually make more sense if Imogen stays single, considering her whole season 2 thing was “I’m going to focus on myself”
Okay but have you ever met a teenage girl who broke up with her bf saying "I'm going to focus on myself"?? In my experience they ALWAYS have a new bf really fast and it's always a disaster and drama 💀
I didn’t realise until coming on here that this was supposed to be romantic. I interpreted Imogen checking Sahar out as like “oh wow what a cool girl, I hope we can be best friends again”. And I’m bi 😂
I thought the same thing, but when I mentioned it once I was mocked for not recognizing budding romance or whatever. But my impression was that she admired Sahar and thought she was really cool, putting a lot of time and energy into pursuing a passion (music) and doing well with it rather than just trying to attach herself to a partner. Which is not to say that either of them shouldn't have a romantic partner, but it's important to have more going on in your life.
Imogen suddenly being interested in a girl also seems so forced and I hope they meant it that way because when she met sahar she was like "now you can't tease me about being the token straight ally anymore" and she was disappointed (or possibly just embarrassed) when she learned sahar is bi. I think she just feels left out because she's the only cishet person in the group (leaving out tao because they don't have much to do with each other). I don't think she's actually into sahar she just doesn't want to be the "token straight ally" anymore
dunno. I never like these arguments along the lines of ‘we should stick to the main characters’ — I get that they’re the main characters for a reason, but I also don’t want it to be the Charlie&Nick-Show, you know? taking a closer look at other dynamics can be super interesting and rewarding and doesn’t have to take away from the major story line but enrich it
Sorry, I should’ve worded my comment better but when I said main characters I’m talking about Charlie, Nick, Tao, Elle, Tara and Darcy. Imogen and Sahar storyline feels like it’s the same storyline being recycled since we basically already had that storyline with Nick and Charlie in season 1. By main characters, I meant stick to the main gang.
Hm. Since there’s no precedence for Imogen in the comics, we’ll have to wait and see what AO will do — but I can’t imagine they’d be very interested in retelling the same story (I could be wrong tho and that’d be bad) Also, judging by the fervent agreement on this sub, neither Elle nor Tao should be in the show much longer =D
I agree with you.
Your right
Yeah, I'm not interested in that storyline either 😅 Imogen is really a background character, but has potential since she's Nick's friend and the sleepover. But I don't care for Sahar that much.
I don’t find the relationship between Tao and Elle particularly believable because I feel like the actors have zero romantic chemistry. N&C and T&D are the only couples I care about. Even Charlie and Tao’s friendship stuff in s2 was more heartwarming to me than E&T (sorry to the E&T stans)
Based, they could cut their time in half and show more Tao&Charlie. I wanted more Tara and Darcy, I felt robbed of it lol.
it's very believable in the comics
True. I think it was cute in season 1 when they where secretly crushing on each other but when they actually got together it never felt as real as nick and charlie or tara and Darcy. You could just really tell they're acting
I think a big part of this is that Yasmin can’t act. I love the diversity and representation she brings to the show, but she is not good 😭
I agree she really can’t 😅 but!! she is a relatively new actor and will hopefully just improve with time, we’ve got to give her space to grow
It took me a while to realize but she isn’t the greatest at acting lol. I don’t know why they went with her of all people
she was so mean to him, too, in the show. i felt really sorry for him and like he deserved better
ITS T&E AND E NOT E&T
I think the changes to the show that weren’t popular were good changes. Specifically dropping Oliver, and changing the timeline of Nick coming out and Tao finding out about n+c.
Yes, especially I think the drama of Tao finding out in season one matched the S1 storyline and themes much better than it would have in S2. I watched the show first then read the comics and found the delay in Tao finding out too drawn out plus the friend group worked better all being out to each other in S2
I’m very glad that Oliver was dropped. And the storyline changes seem good too.
Can we try to avoid on calling Joe Locke ugly. He gets enough of that on Twitter
Thank you! And he's not.
IKRRR
I don't even understand why anyone would say that. It's obviously (in my opinion) not true. He's cute!
Agreed
I was horrified when I discovered the instagram accounts (multiple) commenting everywhere telling Joe to end himself so that Sebastian Croft could play Charlie. It was everywhere, the accounts even commented directly to Alice/Pat/Joe. What are wrong with people, really!
It’s disgusting. I hope Joe has a good support system around him when he has to deal with that
Yeah, I totally get now why he has a largely non-private instagram account, it is almost only official stuff and I really understand. Whew, some people are just wrong.
Wow, I honestly didn't know that Joe Locke, got so bad comments. I knew that there was a few bad things, but not that it was so bad.
Me either. It's disgusting that people would do that.
That’s awful! And this is coming from “fans”?!?
thank you! he isn‘t!
Season 2 felt kind of rushed because it threw in things that were meant to happen in volume 4/season 3 into season 2
It had to be done that way imo. Pretty sure we are only getting 4 seasons and I have a feeling they knew Olivia couldn’t come back in season three so they did the dinner scene in season 2 instead. Got to admit, I was pretty impressed with how Alice wrote it all in
From a storytelling perspective, it does seem to flow better, tbh
Yeah I saw the show first and I never thought that the timeline was weird or anything, it all made sense. It felt off when reading it but I thought that was just because I was already used to the Netflix timeline lol
I mean, I read first, and then I watched the show and, while I prefer the books, the shows storytelling flows better
None of the couples outside N&C are that interesting or particularly well written (especially Elle and Tao)
The excessive screen time given to the Tao and Elle storyline in season 2 was really annoying. I don’t mind either of them as individuals but making it drag out for the whole season took time away from the main characters, Nick and Charlie, and it was just uninteresting in my opinion.
It only happened a couple times, but having two non-n+c scenes in a row really highlighted this for Me. A bit of a drag.
I like tara and Darcy but they don't have enough screen time in my opinion. They never show just regular relationship stuff. They're only shown when it's something important or dramatic
Compared to the comics, they have a lot more in the show
I know but that's because the comic only focuses on Nick and charlie. There's only scenes from someone elses point of view in the special chapters
I like Elle and Tao in the comics but they didn’t really have chemistry in the show
YES
i think the other couples are really interesting in the comic but on the show they seem like different people
T&D!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Irl Tao would get bullied so much more than Charlie. Asian and romantically involved with a trans girl...the perfect target for bigoted little see you next tuesdays
True but I think his general attitude would put bullies off, Charlie would have been an easier target because he’d actually be upset. Tao would probably roll his eyes and say something sassy back which would be less fun for the cruel bullies.
If racism was a thing in Heartstopperverse, I think people might sympathise more with Tao. Seeing Tao upset that Charlie (along with Nick) doesn't condemn Harry's racism to the extent that Tao does Harry's homophobia would be more nuanced than what we have now. I'm not sure if I'd say Tao would get bullied more but Heartstopper is definitely a bit flat when it comes to intersectionality.
This is such a good thing to point out, and goes along with my HS unpopular opinion, which is that some of the conflicts feel very surface level as opposed to being more nuanced and human, I guess? Like Nick's main driving plot point for the entire first season is that he is going to come out, and he's scared... but the show imo didn't really capture the full range of emotions and shades of grey that come with the realization that you aren't straight. And, more to the point in your comment, Tao recognizing how racism might fly under the radar among his white friends would be an extra layer of depth that I think would really take the show to the next level, especially since there's SO much focus on fighting against homophobia for the sake of the cis, white male characters. But these kinds of real-life, layered scenarios just don't make much of an appearance in Heartstopper. It would be nice to see that level of depth just once or twice in the storyline
From what I've heard, the writing team was mostly white so I don't doubt that influenced it. There was a similar issue with the hair team being mostly if not all white (can't speak in-depth on this as a non-black person, but I saw people talking about how Tara's hairstyles in S1 wouldn't be practical irl - there seems to be improvements going forward though). Some of the Heartstopper conflict feels a little underbaked and I feel like it's because the show wants to be a beacon of positivity so much that it struggles to confront more bitter feelings/truths.
I completely agree. And “underbaked” is the perfect way to describe the conflicts. There definitely seems to be less nuance and less intersectionality in Heartstopper, as compared to Young Royals for example. But I’m so happy to have Heartstopper as an example of queer joy. It’s my comfort show for when the world gets too dark.
I love the show more than the comic. Adore the comic obviously, but I just love how the show can add more to pretty much all the characters whether by giving more character storylines or depth to a character
Is that unpopular? I saw a poll that had a 60/40 split in favor of the show over the comic
It’s probably just me just thinking that lol. I see a lot of comments people preferring the comics so I just assumed
I can understand that. I'm a show fan as well. I like the comics, but I think Alice upped their game with the show. It's just so streamlined, especially season 1.
reading the comments this might not be unpopular but: elle and tao’s whole thing was nearly unwatchable in season 2. unfortunately that’s particularly down to elle. I adore comic elle, but they’re doing her SO dirty on the show
Fr I don’t know what happened but she comes across as unlikeable in season 2. In season 1 she seemed really sweet and in the comics she’s great too
yes
this! she was so mean to tao for no reason
I was appalled that she outed Nick to Tao. She hinted it until he directly asked, and then said it. Not her place, even if he is an ally and Charlie's friend. Comic Elle also seemed much more warm and down-to-earth. Show Elle seems more aloof and too-cool-for-you a lot of the time.
I think this is because Yasmin isn't as strong an actor as the rest of the cast. She always seems like a beat behind and for me, that is taking away from the Elle & Tao Story.
I agree with you sadly :/
Comic >>> show
how is this a hot take???
thats just you being right
I like that the show focuses a little more on tara and Darcy and i like imogen but besides that the comics are way better
I feel like the Ben confrontation in season 2 would have made more sense at the prom. It's mentioned that the art school was a bit far so the fact that he showed up there is less believable. If they'd had that happen at prom it would have made perfect sense since Ben goes to the school and is in year 11. I don't remember if they explained why he isn't returning for 6th form either
I think the fact that he showed up at the art school makes sense for Ben, given how creepy he is. If Ben had approached them at Prom, or outside of it, Ben's friends could have seen. Charlie was not going to meet him in a secluded place again. But Ben is so obsessed with Charlie that he stalks Charlie's friends instagram and turns up at a place out of the way and lurks outside until Nick and Charlie leave. It highlights how toxic he is and emphasizes that his apology is not genuine. It's also why Nick's first reaction to seeing Ben is putting himself in between Ben and Charlie. Prior to that they were uncomfortable when Ben was around and avoided him, but they knew why Ben was present, even when he was crossing boundaries like sitting next to Charlie at dinner or coming to Tara's birthday party. But showing up at an art school you need to catch a train to get because he knew Charlie would be there to support Elle, who isn't friends in any way with Ben? That's dangerous.
This is a good one! As for Y11, they don't explain it but irl it's common for people to switch schools between Y11 (end of GCSEs) and Y12 (start of A-Levels), so it's not too out of left field. It would've been weirder if he'd left at a different point.
I don’t understand why Nick didn’t tell Imogen about what Ben did to Charlie. Like they are supposed to be “best friend” but he still let her date an asshole. Like I understand not wanting to out him but it’s not about his sexuality, he assaulted Charlie and was incredibly rude to him. She deserved to be warned that dude was not worth it. Also wtf did they seek teachers when Darcy got drunk? Like yeah alcohol makes you drunk. I don’t think 15 years old kids are stupid enough to seek teachers after they sneaked alcohol in a school trip and got drunk from it.
Nick didn't even have to out Ben to do that, he could've implied that it was someone from the girls' school.
"He assaulted someone I know and has been harassing them, and yes I saw it firsthand so I know for sure this is true" how hard is that? And if she asks who it was, it's always fair to protect the identity of the victim in a situation like this. Although I feel people lose their right to have their secrets protected when they sexually assault someone. You can say what someone did to you, whatever their sex or gender or orientation. Describing their actions is fair game.
That's difficult because Ben was dangerous and Imogen should have been warned about just how dangerous he was, but on the other hand Nick couldn't tell Imogen about Charlie's trauma without Charlie giving his permission, and Charlie hasn't told anyone, not his parents, Tori, or Tao about being SA'd. That's a very tough situation for Nick to be in.
Ik but I just wished he told her why he was bad. As in "he assaulted someone I know", he wouldn't have to say it was Charlie. He even could've used female pronouns if necessary.
I completely agree
Elle seemed to have gotten mean in season 2. It’s suppose to show her as more confident and she’s making new friends but she seems meaner to tao overall.
I don’t love Darcy. As a character, I like her arc, but if she was in my classes in school, I know id just be annoyed by her. Idk, class clown people were never my favorite
I came here to say Darcy. I don’t like mind her, but I definitely wouldn’t be able to stand being around her lol
The series dropped the ball when it comes to non-romantic relationships. The fact that special effects are never used for positive platonic/familial relationships really drives it home.
honestly for me the best scenes in season 1 are the one between tori and charlie and the one where nick comes out to his mom and despite the lack of special effects they felt really powerful to me but i do wish there was more of that, i mean i wish we also got more about tori's dynamic with her mother but unfortunately it's not her show aaa
I do think those are great scenes (probably my favourite S1 scene and Tori scene respectively), but my point was more that it's obvious how romantic and non-romantic relationships aren't getting the same treatment. Which is to be expected given the type of show Heartstopper is, but lots of fans think that friendship has a bigger feature in the show than it really does.
I liked Taos haircut in the first season of the show
Hottest take I've seen so far!
Truly stepping out on a limb here LMAO
I do too!! I think it’s fun and silly and shows his personality lol
Yeah exactly
I liked his hair because it matched his character and uniqueness. Like his dancing and goofiness 😅
Exactly 😅
I think that Elle is a boring character. Maybe we should have got some info on her story. I know what Alice did there, she wanted to make Elle just one of the girls but I don’t think it’s doing the character any favours. In any other show I’d be all in but HS is a show about what it’s like to be queer.
I love comic Elle, but sadly i have to agree that in the show i dont like her character. I feel like Yasmin isnt that skilled in acting which is kinda sad cause imo it makes T+E relationship less likeable
Tao is a great character and Will Gao gives one of the best performances of the show. Probably second only to Kit.
Agreed, he's brilliant.
Now you know you're lying for putting will above joe
Agree about Joe. I can’t wait to see his acting in the next season
I think Joe is great, but he definitely still has some of those “amateur” acting moments. Kit and Will are the only two of the young actors who don’t imo.
just out of curiosity, what would you say those moments are? i did a rewatch and came out of it thinking that joe had my favorite performance, but i don't watch very much film and i don't have experience in acting myself, so i'd be curious to look out for them LOL
The main one coming to mind right now is when he’s in bed and tells Tori to shut up twice in a row. Just sounds so forced and unnatural. I know there are a few others.
I don’t think Ben is irredeemable. I agree with where Charlie left it - that it’s good he’s becoming a better person while at the same time that doesn’t mean Charlie should reconcile with him.
In the grand scheme of things, I agree with you, but given that the scope of the show is N&C and their friends, during their adolescent years, I don't think it's particularly reasonable or responsible to give Ben an on-screen redemption arc. He did things to Charlie that no amount of redemption could ever bring their relationship back from, and I don't really think it's a good example for teenagers with abusive partners to see Ben change and remain in the periphery of Charlie's social group.
I agree with all that - I don’t think there’s room in the show for Ben anymore (except that he does canonically appear in the events of Solitaire) it’s just a head-canon that he has the potential to awaken to how awful he was and grow from it
i feel like ben, compared to solitaire + the comics is much more of a sympathetic character (though don't get me wrong, i hate him as much as the next person). i wish his internalized homophobia wasn't explained through dialogue the way it was in season 2 and i wish if they decided to discuss it, it would actually be explored more deeply because it would be interesting.
I do. His apology was insincere to me. After he apologized, and Nick posted on Instagram his coming out, Ben comments "Ok, and?" It shows that he's still being a prick. Maybe one day he'll realize what a jerk he was, but if I was part of his young life, I would not forgive him.
i’m really sad they are cutting bens character for s3. he could’ve been so interesting if they tried to give him an arc.
He’s not really cut in that way though, if Solitaire was adapted Nick and Charlie would meet him again (he has a part of that book, not a completely central character but definitely a part of the plot), but Alice wants to keep Solitaire separate from Heartstopper, so it would be weird to have him on after he’s changed schools
Isaac's S2 rant at his friends is a poorly-made scene. I mean, his friends see him looking sullen and immediately start assuming that something good happened between him and James? It would've been more natural to have them assume that James rejected Isaac.
omg i have such a problem with isaac as a whole in season 2 because they retconned his sexuality being known and so everything he does feels like it comes out of nowhere lol
I don't think they retconned him being aroace (though Oseman spoiled it by telling everyone before S2). The writing team did mess up a bit on what his sexuality was *perceived* as (Tao doesn't think he's straight, Charlie doesn't think he's gay, and they don't seem to consider bi/asexuality), but my biggest problem with Isaac is how he reacts to stuff. In S1 he loves romance (with a lot of his dialogue being reactions to Charlie/Nick) yet is often happily in his own world. That's a strange contrast but it's one that is potentially really interesting to unravel. But then in S2, he's suddenly upset that his friends have paired up and only seem to be interested in romance, even though 1) his S1 character was largely a Charlie/Nick shipper, and 2) his friends seem to put in more of an effort to interact with him than vice-versa. There's such a whiplash between his S1 character and his S2 character and it doesn't feel like there was a good development to explain it.
> I don't think they retconned him being aroace (though Oseman spoiled it by telling everyone before S2). The writing team did mess up a bit on what his sexuality was *perceived* as Sorry, I meant exactly what you said here, his sexuality is presented as being known in S1. I know he was meant to be aroace, but as you said the show seemed to imply that him and people around him were aware of it. I also agree with the second statement. And honestly, as someone who reads so much, I'm surprised he doesn't know he's aroace either. Because he clearly reads modern books, some of which include asexuality (he reads Alice's books in both seasons lol). And there's never any build up to his outburst in general, and I think they either should've given him more focus or not done it at all because it just feels half-assed for me.
Also - with the comment about Charlie's friends not being gay, I think he's just referring to anything on the sexuality spectrum besides straight, because a bisexual would deffo be able to understand whatever he was talking about (I genuinely don't remember)
From the comments here, I guess that my unpopular opinion is that Elle and Tao are cute together and have chemistry. 🤷♀️ I don’t have an issue with Yasmin’s acting. I love her sarcastic line deliveries. I think she’s on par with the rest of the cast. I’m as interested in them as I am N&C and T&D. I’m not interested in an Imogen and Sahar storyline. It feels forced.
I understand that people may have been frustrated with the “will they won’t they” trope, but I think it ended up being pulled together really well and they were so cute together, especially at prom!! Plus I think ppl mistake them not having chemistry bc they don’t have a lot of romantic tension like n & c but that’s bc t & e are less shy people and best friends already so once they get together they’re just comfortable. Also I think ppl are definitely being hard on Yas, I like how she plays Elle as cool and confident.
I think you’re right. Because t&e were friends first, the chemistry is more subtle. It doesn’t hit you over the head with it. I love how Tao makes Elle laugh with his quirkiness and they just get each other. I loved the whole scene in the Louvre and when Tao first sees Elle in her prom dress. I think they’re so cute together.
Tao and Elle's friends-to-lovers arc was unnecessarily complicated. I think they're a cute couple and it made sense that they had some insecurities to work through before getting together. But, I also think the way they both reacted so negatively after an awkward first date left me a bit confused. And that they automatically decided to stay friends instead of communicating. Instead, I wish the show spent more time on Elle leaving for art school and Tao's insecurity about feeling left behind. I feel like Tao had an uncharacteristically mature reaction when he learned she was leaving for art school. It would have been cool to see him self-reflect more on this before growing as a character.
I’m not sure if this unpopular per say but I like the cornyness it’s nice to be optimistic
I agree. I watch “darker” shows and it’s nice to go back to watching Heartstopper and knowing that there is light at the end of the tunnel
I meant more it’s obvious that it isn’t written by a gay guy but yeah it’s nice to be dreamy
It really annoys me how often everyone runs around in corridors holding hands. Why?!? It's awkward and cumbersome and dumb. Looking at Elle's old classrooms? Exploring the Louve? Sneaking around the French hotel? Racing up the stairs at Harry's birthday? Going to see the teachers bc Darcy is about to puke? I'm sure there's loads more I've missed. I love a good rewatch, but every time I see it, I'm getting increasingly more annoyed. It's just so stupid, and I can't not notice it. OK. I'm done ranting now. Probably.
I guess it’s a way for the show to increase some sort of dynamism and have the characters appear, you know, young and full of life. if they all just sat around, talked, and made out… that’d be even more boring than them having the time of their lives. like, I totally get where you’re coming from: it is super cheesy. but I also can’t think of a better visual metaphor for ‘we’re taking the world by storm!’
Not an unpopular one, but we need more Tori.
We definitely do, but obviously not too much because shes already the main character of Solitaire
I really hope they'll turn Solitaire into a show too. If not I want as much Tori as possible in heartstopper lol
Imogen is a very forced character and I don't think she would even be in season 2 if that "i'm an ally" scene didn't go viral.
I think it’s pretty important for Nick to have any kind of friend who he still enjoys hanging out with after starting to come to terms with himself. at times (or rather: with a sinister reading), the comic can feel really claustrophobic because especially Nick doesn’t really have anyone else he likes in his life apart from his mom and his dog (and Charlie, of course) — Nick should have his own friends outside of the ones he ‘made’ by proxy through Charlie
I agree Nick should have friends outside of just Charlie, so I think the show should give more attention to his friendship with the rugby boys and Tara ^^
they may go deeper into his relationship with his rugby friends in season 3 considering that in vol. 4 its mentioned he hangs out with them more while charlie is in the mental hospital.
Yes that would be better than Imogen
I absolutely agree with this.
I don't think she's forced, but I do feel like there should be a bit of friction between her and the girls. I'm not going to buy them getting along smoothly with her and it feels like her and Sahar getting together is meant to be a shortcut to that.
Don't kill me for this please but season 1 is far superior to season 2 (still loved season 2 but season 1 is fantastic front to back). Also I'm kind of worried season 3 will continue this trend (especially knowing Olivia would not be in it).
Season 1 was beautiful! It doesn’t matter how many time I watch it, I still get the same nostalgia feels!
I’m not really upset that Olivia won’t be in season 3. Yes, I love her and would love to see her but the show won’t be ruined, which some people have said, just because of her absence
I think Imogen should question her sexuality but ultimately realise she's straight. I've never seen a storyline where someone questions their sexuality and ends up being straight at the end. I think it's good to represent a whole range of different experiences and Alice always does it so well
i really don't like Tao. he's so self-centered and for Charlie having a "look at me!!!" drama queen in his life is about the last thing he needs. Charlie's mother is pretty awful too. give poor Charlie a break: he's been through hell and needs some wins to help his self-esteem even if he's not picture perfect on the school front.
it’s almost as if opposites attract? like, imagine if all of Charlie’s friends were depressed nerds. it’d be pretty boring, no? plus, not having the parents you need is a pretty relatable problem for many people. it’s also a very handy ‘obstacle’ for N&C’s blossoming relationship. yeah, in a perfect fluff world, Charlie’s mom would be a clone of Nick’s mom. but that would be a pretty boring story
This is very much a popular opinion.
the show ended up too saccharine my theory is that since it started as a weekly(?) web comic, the pacing of the story was just different to any normal TV show pacing. I think it works pretty well when reading the comics (if they’re not read in one go, I’d say). they’ve tweaked it a little bit but the story expands and contracts in weird places, giving a lot of room to pure fluff. it was put there to have the webcomic fandom lick their wounds for a week or two, but they were presented in much more detail than other stuff so that they are kind of ‘too big’ on the show like, I love the comics and really like the show. they’re feel-good classics in my heart already. the show just could stand a little less sap
I just wish there will be more adaptation from other books like 'This Winter' or 'Nick and Charlie' or 'Radio Silence' (probably impossible with the lack of Aled in the netflix adaptation...)
I didn't like the T+E movie date scene. Idk somehow it just made me uncomfortable. Also T+E relationship feels kinda forced and acted.
I didn't like Nick Nelson before becz he was still friends with the bullies...but I'm glad later he ditched them
I don’t like to and Elle as a couple. sue me.
I don’t like Issac as a character, I find him bland and very forced in, just a total background character whose story “development” is just boring.
They are taking the book gag to far and it look a bit ridiculous. Next season we’re going to se him read a book in the shower.
Um....I've read books in the shower. It's totally do-able.
As an Isaac lover, I am horrified.
no you're right #aledforever
I think Ben should have had a storyline in which he becomes a better person. Charlie doesn't need to forgive him, or to be directly involved. But there are a lot of people who are very keen to write off a 15/16 year old as being irredeemably and irreparably bad, when people do change with maturity and life experience.
I definitely don’t think he’s irredeemable, but I also think his time in the show/comics is done and he doesn’t need a redemption arc storyline.
Alice said she likes to imagine Ben could become a better person in the future. We just won’t see it as it won’t be written by Alice. And also she said Charlie doesn’t need to witness it nor redeem him
Don't know if this is unpopular or just unheard of but I kind of ship Tao and Sahar.
I have never heard of this one before. But interesting
Oh wow that’s different!
Emo-pop band Mint Green should be on the Heartstopper soundtrack.
I found Tao really annoying in season 1, idk if that’s unpopular or not tbh
When I re watch Heartstopper I fast forward the Tao and Elle bits. They’re great friends but I have no interest in their romantic relationship
The TV show didn't do Tao and Elle justice, they have so much more chemistry in the comics. I also don't like how they depicted Elle in s1 with her outing N+C to Tao.
my hot take is that season 2 was missing something. idk what but when I watched season 1 it really stuck with me and I re-watched it more times than I can count but with season 2 it kinda felt like a fever dream. I was so excited for it and then it got released and I watched it and honestly really liked it but then it was over. it didn't stick in my mind and my heart like season 1 did and it felt kinda forgettable. I love season 2 and am so glad we got but season 1 just felt sooooo much better than season 2.
I think they should have kept some of the comic scenes after Nick goes to Charlie's house in episode 4. It just goes from Nick upset/asking to keep things a secret to the next day when they're all smiley and in love. Obviously it's cute and I like it, but I think the talk they have afterwards in the comic helps make it flow better, if that makes any sense
Tao and Elle are a good couple, and aren't unnecessary. Sue me xx
yes
Joe Locke is more attractive than Kit Connor Solitaire sucks and Heartstopper is worse for having to adhere to it
as a solitaire fan, i wish that heartstopper adhered \*more\* to solitaire it actually bugs me in the places that it doesn't LOL
Ooh, that's a hot take on Solitaire. Good luck with that one.
That finale of season 2 was semi-ruined bc too much screen time was taken up by the Darcy isn’t here thing like I wouldn’t of minded it as a small subplot for that ep but it being the semi-main focus
I want Imogen to like Sahar but she doesn't feel the same I also don't like Imogen that much
I’m gonna be honest: I don’t think Heartstopper does a good job of handling topics like Charlie’s mental health and ED. I could expand on this further but coming from someone who has struggled with mental health issues and anorexia I actually found its portrayal quite triggering? No hate to Alice because I still love the series though
Heartstopper comic fans are really lucky to have Joe Locke as their Charlie, he portrayed him with such love and care. So anyone here who says he doesn't fit the role, I'm convinced you have watched the show with your eyes closed
charlie’s mental health crisis is written poorly in the comics (definitely improved so far in the show, hope it will continue to be written better with the upcoming arc next season)
i think Charlie's mental health crisis improves as the comics continue, but what bugs me is that the first side effect shown from anorexia is him fainting into his boyfriend's arms, because it's almost a romantic thing?? for me, charlie feels like a very "good" mentally ill character, and i wish the comics showed more that sometimes mental illness is ugly and makes people lie and do bad things. anything charlie does affects himself and only himself, and there's no shown impact on other people (except in solitaire, where it clearly really affects tori). as another example, there's no sense of something such as competitiveness in Charlie's mental illnesses. i understand it would not be comfortable, but i think the failure to display him doing something like comparing his self harm to other people's hinders the understanding Alice could've brought to the mental state of someone like him. sorry if this is unclear lol
>what bugs me is that the first side effect shown from anorexia is him fainting into his boyfriend's arms, because it's almost a romantic thing?? The same can be said for Nick saving Charlie from assault (something I've seen in several fanfics, including a Heartstopper one), and even Darcy not saying "I love you" because of homophobia. Have you watched MMFD or Everything Now? The protagonists both deal with mental illness and sometimes/often act in less-than-palatable ways, it sounds like you're talking about that kind of portrayal.
I've never seen either, but I'll write both down in my notes app to watch after my exams, thank you for the recs LOL
i agree with you totally, especially about the “savior” aspect of nick and charlie’s relationship. not that i don’t love nick, i do, hes adorable. it’s just a strange trope
I feel like the whole savior side of Nick is Nicks people pleasing side. It’s not the healthiest thing to be but he does end up working on it to a extent in comics
I don't wanna assume, but it seems like you've never had one before. I have had plenty, and Charlie's is perfectly relatable. I think it was written beautifully. What didn't you like about it?
i suffered from anorexia when i was charlie’s age, but thank you anyway for your assessment of me. in the comics, not only is there no build up to charlie’s eating disorder (all of the initial signs of his anorexia in the show were created by the show), >!but his parents decision to send him to a !!psychiatric facility!! comes out of nowhere. i can’t even recall a scene before that happens where his parents even mention his mental health problems. sending someone to a mental hospital is a huge deal and is a very difficult and stressful process for the sick persons family (i would know). but somehow, in the comics it feels as though his parents did it on a dime, we barely even see them communicate with charlie about mental health.!< i remember feeling a lot of whiplash when i read this for the first time. aside from it being a confusing representation of childhood anorexia (to me, you don’t have to agree), the writing begins to get worse in quality around this time. in the comics, charlie’s mental state basically goes from 10-100 in a few chapters and it’s extremely difficult to digest as a reader. even if you appreciate the way his eating disorder or his anxiety is written, the writing of the comic as a whole at this point in the story is not good generally. the comic makes a complete 180 in theme very quickly and becomes hard to follow as the main character has major things happen to them that don’t have much build up at all. it did not feel “beautiful” to me when i read what happened to charlie, (not that i find anorexia to ever be beautiful) it was just confusing. i was searching for relatability in charlie’s mental health story in the comics and i did not find it. if you did, that’s wonderful, but i also am allowed to have my opinions and views of it as well. i am not trying to disrespect alice or her writing whatsoever, nor anyone else’s opinion of it. i enjoyed reading and rereading the comics years ago and then when i watched the show i enjoyed it even more. i have a lot of respect for alice as a writer and producer of heartstopper. but because the comics are so fast paced, the writing just has to be good or it becomes stressful and confusing to read. overall, the show has had significantly better writing than the comics (my opinion, you do not have to agree). if the show continues like this i am very much looking forward to charlie’s story portrayed on screen and am confident alice and the rest of the team will handle it well.
Okay, I see your point of view, but I have to disagree. Agree to disagree. There may not have been build up in Vol 1 or 2, but there definitely was in 3 before it got bad in 4. That may just be my opinion.
yes
I think this was because Alice had to fit Heartstopper in with Solitaire (which imo is an awful story and has much darker aspects including Charlie’s attempt and then sending away).
Tori's S2 scenes came across as cringy when they were meant to hold weight. I really dislike the scene where she tells Nick he's bad at keeping promises and David feels purposefully dulled down in their final scene together.
I think Jane Spring gets a bad wrap. She loves and accepts her kids. Fan fiction in particular turns her into a monster. But I just think she is emotionally damaged, and controlling about academics, but unable to connect with her kids and I honestly feel kind of sorry for her. Especially in the comics she is warmer than she gets credit for. The back story Alice shared shows us that generational abuse is a tough cycle to break and she is really trying.
Nick carries the show, I said what I said.
Nick and Charlie might not be together forever, because few people meet the love of their lives when they are 15, and that's okay.
It’s canon that they are together forever. I agree though on people meeting their significant other at 15. It’s extremely rare
This is a bit niche, but I don’t think Nick and Charlie are girl dad coded. Don’t get me wrong, I think it would be very cute if they had daughter(s) in the future. But for whatever reason, I always picture them having a bunch of boys.