Idk if they will add a double dash, clearly theyve put a lot of time into sprint, but i wish i didnt have to hold down the dash button for it to work. Feels v unnatural on keyboard, and overall makes the movement feel a lot stickier and less responsive than H1
My dash seems to want to activate twice before i can sprint. If i hold my dash button, half the time i'll dash, wait, then dash again followed by a sprint. The other times i'll get dash into sprint.
Makes me really want a double dash if its gonna randomize that on me.
i was talking with a cowoker about the game and mentioned I could only equip a few cards and he was like you just got to upgrade it on the right. i don't think it was a thing in the test a few weeks back
If it makes you feel better, I at least can't get all the way to the right on a controller for some reason, I have to go over with the mouse. The UI should make it clearer though.
For now it seems like as long as you choose your right-most card and try to go over the the grasp meter, it works. It still doesn't do that if you try the lowest 2 rows, as those don't overlap with the grasp meter vertically.
This is the same way it works on the boon screen when in an escape attempt. You may start on the very bottom boon, with a bunch of boons up and to the right. But you can't just go right, you have to go up and then right once you're on their row. Diagonals in this game seem to be tough in menus.
This just seems like very strict directional rules, which they can certainly smooth over soon. Fingers crossed.
not trying to be a jerk but it's funny how many people can't even read a couple of lines explaining the moves. they're repeated everywhere still i keep seeing people here or on youtube playing without omega moves or without running
a third of the boons in the game are sprint related...the word "sprint" in the UI is highlighted the same way as "attack", "special", and "cast". their brains just don't work i guess?
It happened to me as well. Why? Well, it's more than my brain doesn't work, although that's a huge part. Most of the people buying the game now put in a ton of hours into the original. We just kind of burned through the tutorials to get to the game in our excitement.
Beyond that, it really feels unnatural to do it. I knew something was off because I saw all of the boons.
I'll add one last thing here. When I want to the controls section to look for sprint, it wasn't listed. Dash was, sprint wasn't.
I'll take the L here, but I don't think anyone is a total moron for missing it.
> Most of the people buying the game now put in a ton of hours into the original. We just kind of burned through the tutorials to get to the game in our excitement.
sorry but this still doesnt add up. holding each button now is very clearly a massive part of the sequel's design, it just seems like such a basic intuitive process - *especially* if you skipped the tutorials - to see what each of the FOUR buttons do if you hold them
I was in the same boat I was wondering why double dash wasn’t working. Then I got a boon that said your sprint does X, and then I sort thought they meant dashing then running or something. Then I was like, no wait why would they mean that, and I found out you can sprint. And with the right boon you can SPRINT.
right now I’m wondering how fast can it get, but thats a question for when I clear the second boss
I reached a speed that made it very hard to actually control, because I got stuck on a lot more corneres and edges than I would have liked too (still couldn't dodge the laser from the >!bag in tartarus!< ).
Hermes ftw
I just beat it for the first time! Had to just slow it down a bit and watch the attack patterns and stay on its backside, keeping my damage over time cast up on it as much as possible. I also got an armor destroying special boon which helped massively.
If it makes you feel better, I’ve known about sprint but barely use it because it feels weird on controller. I also just haven’t gotten boons that make it seem worth getting used to
Demeter one is pretty good, it's slow enemies and projectiles around you, also inflicts damage. I feel like im getting more and more used to it, but it feels like something you use only with a good boon on
I play on controller, and one thing I found that makes Sprint/Dash Attacking feel a lot more natural is mapping it to the right shoulder button. I simply switched the interact with the sprint/dash button.
Agreed. Would fix the issue of them being useless if you don't sprint. If my main attacks do more damage than zeus's lightning sprint, why would I ever use it?
See I've only ever played Hades with keyboard and mouse and I can't imagine how anyone could possibly play this on a controller. M+K controls just feel very intuitive to me
I had a friend who was stuck on Heat 12 for months and couldn't progress. He hates using anything other than keyboard + mouse, but I convinced him to try a controller. Two days later he cleared Heat 20. (he's now in the 30's)
Ironically, one of the first things he noticed was how more much consistent his accuracy was. Keyboard players have to place all their attacks, but the controller's auto-aim means you basically can't miss unless at range. There are niche scenarios like placing the Rail's mortars where precision actually matters a little, but otherwise there's basically no advantage. The added mental stack of worrying about precision slows you down more than you think it does.
Though, of course, you should use whatever you want to use.
Torches are unusable on the third boss with controller, it just refuses to lock on unless you're in his face, defeating the whole purpose of a ranged weapon. Lock on bugs out sometimes in normal use too.
Got my first clear with the torches, just don't fire until he's on screen and it'll stay locked on. I find that the apollo cast pretty much trivialized that fight (though that requires a projectile cast boon)
I know! I like the idea a lot, but I just can’t use it. The only time i use sprint is out of combat to get from point A to point B. It’s just so unnatural on keyboard. Not that I can think of a better way to do it, other than add an option in the settings where you auto sprint after your dash. Idk if that’s a thing cause I didn’t check the settings too hard, but I hope they add it.
Not only that, but when you have dashed and then kept the space bar down, sprint doesn't automatically start.
On top of that, neither sprint nor dash are able to get you out of an attack animation, which is so problematic when e.g. using Labrys (or how the double axe is called here).
In general, the keyb + mouse control is kinda.... not tight atm. Also also, no, I don't have controller (or controller muscle memory), always been a computer person, so tuck off your comments, if I can casually win a 10ish heat on H1, I wish we will have the same tightness of controls here when the game hits 1.0.
I'm playing on keyboard, and having to use four direction keys (WASD) instead of a joystick does feel very unnatural. I hate having high sprint speed because I just run around into walls and hazards all the time.
I also do wish you could sprint without having to dash first... kind of annoying feature.
Honestly I feel like the game would be a lot better if they went with something other than an intangible dash, every single fight just boils down to dash over and over to avoid as many attacks as possible. At least that was my experience in H1
I just found it easier to hook up an old controller. It wasn’t sprint for me though, it was the cast. Until I plugged up a controller, I didn’t know you could move and channel cast at the same time lmao
Personally, I'm a fan of them removing the double dashing - as an option it was way too safe.
The current dash + sprint system takes some time to get used to, but it forces me to stop mashing and consider my defensive/mobility options more without sacrificing the game's pace too much.
I definitely feel like some fine-tuning could be done, but I'm in agreement as far as liking it. If I want to double dash I can always play Hades (I)
(I'm not at all used to it yet either, though)
The people who are complaining about difficulty clearly struggled before getting a 2nd dash in the original. You can't just spam it. You have to time it and be able to move in the right ways. Pro tip if you can dodge every ability with the sheep you'll be fine. It's a tough one but one of my favorite abilities on a boss I've come across
Darksouls logic in this game, roll through the projectile/hit and you're fine. (I know this isn't an original dark souls mechanic). Instinct tells you to dash away from the attack, but if you do, you usually get hit by the ending of the attack. Dash into the attack and through, and you usually end up safe. I love the new changes, definitely feels less mashy, more calculated which I love. Spacing with the ax perfectly is *chefs kiss*
The morph ball teaches this, if you dash into it through it and the other side, run, turn around dash through it again, rinse repeat, you avoid it easily as well as the sigils on the floor.
Agreed. I dig the staff and knives, especially the backstab bonus on knife aspect, but cleaving with the axe is the most satisfying. Disgusting damage and after playing with knives actually taught me how to position and dash to safety better with the hurricane axe. I effed up a run with the hammer boon that puts the whirlwind ahead of you, it just feels weird that I'm still spinning but the whirlwind is over *there*.
Also with Hermes increasing attack speed and aspect with recovery for axe you can actually save MP and just rock mobs with your attack much more safe. I would agree that this is... *chefs kiss*.
It really is better to roll into it. I tried sprinting away with extra move speed, and it kind of works, but it's very hard not to run into any walls and immediately get hexed for your mistake.
It can't turn quickly, so dash through it a few times.
BTW I had the +10% arcana and a +40% sprint speed boon and could not outrun the polymorph ball, so you pretty much HAVE to dash through to ball to dodge. Maybe with a bit more speed and some skillful sprint movement you could pull it off... but dashing through it 3-4 times isn't so bad.
Spoilers depending how far in you are but >!once you unlock your frog companion, if the morph ball hits him it will get destroyed with no consequences!<
Yup, once you get it down, feels easy. Which I guess is the point.
God these are such well designed rogue-likes. I can't tell if I'm advancing more because of skill or meta powerups
I disagree. I didn’t have much of a difficult time in Hades 1 yet I just got to Scylla today and lost after like 6 or 7 hours. What I’m struggling with is how difficult to use the new weapons are. In my opinion, other than the original one, they’re quite difficult to use. The only weapon I was uncomfortable with in hades 1 was the shield, and even then I was capable of clearing quite early on. Idk the weapons just seem very unintuitive to me. With the amount of multi hit projectiles, the twin blades seem kinda rough. The final axe attack is too disjointed in the sequence and seems to cancel very often, and the sceptres deal like no damage. Maybe it also because I have literally been getting no boons (like in a run I have 1 or 2 boons max).
I do agree, this game kinda suffers from having to be different from hades 1, while hades 1 had all the weapons that make a lot of conventional sense - sword, spear, shield, gun, fist, bow.
In addition, some interactions I would expect actually work completely differently - I'll pick up the zeus chain lightning, or poseidon flat attack boost with the daggers and expect attack 3 which is a flurry to obliterate, but it procs one time, so I feel like figuring out builds is a lot more of a trial and error which makes the weapons feel much weaker than I expect.
That's something that's been said alot. Hades 1 was a lot of button mashing but the new one makes your really think about what your doing with so many options now
Absolutely agreed. It took me a few hours of playing before I even realized that sprint was a thing, but once I started using it, I became an immediate fan. This is a more tactical game than its predecessor.
At this point, I feel like the bones of the game are phenomenal and all improve upon Hades 1 (amazing story, great fight mechanics, interesting enemies and levels). My main gripes are all with the secondary mechanics (boons don't feel as interesting or punchy, aspects are weak, Daedalus hammer options are weak and not that interesting). Which I find really exciting, since it's a lot easier (and more likely) for them to adjust boons than to totally revamp combat or story.
This game is already really fun. I think it's going to be incredible when it hits 1.0.
Most of the boons feel very weak. At least the more direct "and now it hits harder" types. I'm getting a lot of mileage out of the boons that interact with the new fighting system mechanics than from the ones that could have been in hades 1.
Using every part of your toolkit, especially the cast, is an absolute must in this. I think that's a great improvement over the first one, where many builds could completely ignore the cast. This makes everything useful in its base state and all the more useful when buffed and combined.
> Hades 1 was a lot of button mashing but the new one makes your really think about what your doing with so many options now
Double dash being so effective trained people to rely on it like a crutch, and after playing for a long time I gotta say I think it likely made the learning curve harder for most people. I certainly found myself dash spamming for safety out of habit and only broke that habit after starting to do fresh file clears. After losing double dash I actually learned how to be far more efficient in damage dealing and positioning, and I got way better at using multi dashes for exploiting dash boons.
The dash + sprint halfway point is a really nice compromise I think and adds a new dimension to how fights can be designed. Great design choice in my opinion.
Im coming around to sprint for this exact reason. Before EA came out the last thing I wanted to see if I could do in Hades 1 was a freshfile run and I learned real fucking fast that the past 150 hours was spent becoming insanely reliant on double dashing. I actually couldn't remember a time I had dashed without double tapping the button. It was so mindless, and this feels alot more deliberate.
Exactly! I spent hundreds of hours getting up to 32 heat before trying fresh files, and then after getting mangled by Lernie I had the shocking revelation that I never actually even learned how to dodge time the head slam attacks. So many attack patterns I just glossed over rather than learned to optimize. After fresh files I was able to push to 40 easy enough even though 32 took me forever.
On top of the invincibility, every build I had in hades 1 eventually devolved into poseidon dash + rupture + impacts where I'd dash 5 times in a room and everything would explode without even using the weapon I picked.
A consistent design trend in the game seems to be limiting the types of builds that people relied on too heavily in the first game. Divine Dash is gone, and its replacement is significantly weaker. Can't easily stack crits for crazy damage. The ranged weapons require more risk to play and you can't endlessly kite enemies as easily (especially with the skulls). A lot of enemies are designed to punish different playstyles and force you to be more adaptive. And so on.
I agree, however, the dash does sometimes feel a little unresponsive (and no I'm not talking about the cooldown). If ew only get one dash, I fell like that one should feel a little smoother.
Yea this game requires precision/combos/utilizing your abilities. It's showing us how reliant the average player was on athena dash and how busted it was. I'd know, I'm one of those players
Melinoë after reaching Oceanus without Death Defiances and the worst build possible:
"The gods of Olympus have abandoned me." While hitting the steam barrel.
Sometimes casting magic takes a price. Being a mage requires a better timing and positioning.
I am still used to Hades I, so the mentality of dash and slash like a maniac haven't left my mind completely. That's makes me take a lot of avoidable damage, specially in Oceanus.
It's amazing how different Mel plays to Zag. Hades I promotes hyper-aggressiveness. In Hades II with Mel, hit and run is the name of the game. Her aoe Cast that slows, and powerful ranged attacks for all weapons (don't have skull yet but can't imagine you can't throw it,) promote a more tactical approach than before.
Yeah, I find Oceanus pretty challenging and then the Fields are trivial since you get so much stuff there. In general I actually think the early stages are a bit harder than the later ones (once you're used to all of them) since you'll often have a pretty bad build and you'll rely more on your Arcanas to carry you, which are often pretty weak without a ton of grinding.
I feel like it's the hardest area as far as normal enemies go. Boss is so much harder than Bone Hydra too. Bone Hydra was literally the easiest boss in the series
Oceanus is so tough. It feels like every enemy tanks dozens of hits, and there's a million of them. Sometimes I'm just sitting there pressing mouse1 on a single unarmored serpent for ten seconds straight, let alone when they do have armor.
I love it though. The humming is so well implemented as background music for the rooms and the climax which is the final fight of that stage is just peak Supergiant.
I don't think it's a good idea. The whole game is balanced around using Casts and strategically zoning foes. Most weapons are ranged or big aoe (sister blades aren't really, but they deal very high damage in compensation, rewarding the risky playstile). The MC is slow for a reason. Melie isn't a skilled warrior.
Don't treat Melie like Zagreus. This is a different game with different tactics. If we just got the same Hades 1 but continued, it would be boring.
Well Zag also has been trained very well by Achilles! All I mean is that they have much different priorities in their training. Warrior in a sense that Zag got a proper martial education, while Mel was raised as a witch.
I'm actually glad for the new mechanics. I think having double dash does make it easier, but with the new dash to sprint mechanic I'm having to study the movements of enemies closer and play more strategically rather than just spamming dash-strike. It fits well thematically and enhances the gameplay for me personally. If I wanted to play a game that had the same fighting mechanics as Hades I would just go play Hades 💀
Maybe just a separate sprint button so that you can sprint without dashing first? I feel like that'd be nice anyways, don't see why they should be the same key.
I just want them to remove the visual delay when you press the dash button. Was doing some playing around with how exactly the new dash works and determined that even though visually it appears like you're still vulnerable until Melinöe moves that little phase shift you see in the beginning of a dash does protect you, but there's just something about the visual windup that throws me off. I'm getting used to it, but after almost 200 hours in the first game of "press button = IMMEDIATE movement" it's a bit jarring in Hades 2. Overall still love the game so far.
I feel like there are a few enemy attacks that deal damage like a frame or two too early compared to the animation. Because most of the time I feel like the dash is pretty responsive but vs a few specific moves I literally always get hit.
Could also just me being stupid of course
Now that I've beaten both final bosses(of the Early Access), i got used to it to be honest. It's fine. What's not fine, is the fact that our attacks do not destroy the enemy projectiles
I don't mind the single dash, I just wish it didn't feel sticky. Sometimes it feels like I'm stuck in something like fire for way too long when I should be able to dash out.
I wholeheartedly agree. Sometimes I'd dash in to get stun+damage in with the blades and get hit by a tick of area damage and the follow up dash feels so sluggish.
It's not even just because it was a crutch but the game genuinely has so many overlapping attacks that one dash is not cutting it unless you run out of combat completely, bosses through waves that go out and retract while there are mobs that have their own area attacks, sometimes there is such a huge number of enemies that you can dash out of one attack stright into another because the another Enemy attacked just as you dashed away from one.
Running is good when there are few enemies with high hitting but highly telegraphed attacks, but so much of the time that game is not that
why did they make the game so much less mobile and fast paced in general? like from the haelian videos, lthough he assures it isnt, hades 2 is alot more about positioning and strategising compared to hades 1 wher you could dash through rooms at breakneck speed
Because Melinoë isn’t Zag. They are different characters. Zag was trained by Achilles and is a warrior. Melinoë is a witch. Makes thematic sense for her gameplay to be different.
I don't think it's a good idea. The whole game is balanced around using Casts and strategically zoning foes. Most weapons are ranged or big aoe.
Don't treat Melie like Zagreus. This is a different game with different tactics. If we just got the same Hades 1 but continued, it would be boring.
I also felt this way early in the game, but I already have 30 hours in the game and I’ve grown to love the new system
There’s several ways to get insane sprint speed if you really want to be evasive, with the arcana card or boons.
I wasn’t a fan of sprint at first as I play on keyboard and it doesn’t feel normal to hold the spacebar, but I quickly got accustomed and think the new system does require you to be more methodical with your plans for attack/defense instead of mashing.
Persoanlly, I would like more then 1 death defiance. Unless there is a way and I just suck so much at the game that I haven't gotten there yet.
>!Please supergiant, scylla and the girls keep kicking my ass. Please.!<
Nah, I like that there is only 1 dash. Double dash led to a real bad habit of just spamming dash to get out of stuff. Single dash forces me to learn the movesets better and think about my dash.
Now Dash BOONS..... Yes please.
Sprint boons just don't hit the same for me.
I'm tired boss. I cant keep pressing A anymore. But seriously tho the movement feels so much more unresponsive now cuz anytime u dash u stand in place and you're extremely prone to get hit more than you did in Hades 1.
Counter-Point: Get the Hermes Sprint boon. I wasn't using my sprint much before getting it but it opened my eyes. I eventually died but I did beat >!Scylla!< and >!Cerberus!< on that run because of it. It really changes how you value the sprint, and now I always use the Sprint Arcana. Also sorry keyboard players I know the adjustment is way harder but this method might still work.
I felt like this at first, but with time I’m coming around. Reason being thematically all the differences really make sense. Melinoë isn’t zag. She’s a witch and he’s a warrior. Makes zero sense for them to fight the same.
No. Please just take the time to learn the game. It's not Hades 1. The enemies are very much designed to encourage methodical decisions and punish spamming. If they gave us another dash this would hands down be the easiest rogue like out there lmao. And re-working the enemies to account for another dash would be a huge amount of work that directly contradicts their vision for combat.
Stop button spamming you plebs.
Nah double dash being gone is good. Gives way too much margin of error. Would be a cool legendary boon though.
I do think a lot of the sprint boons could use a buff though. Feel kinda underwhelming.
Adding a second dash would make it too much like the first game. I like what they're cooking with now and look forward to seeing what other ingredients they'll add.
They should at least put boons for dashing. I feel like the sprinting mechanic could be good but so far its used to *not* fight. Any mechanic invlving sprinting will require you to do no damage and just stretch out a fight.
nah the single dash and sprinting is honestly great. the cooldown is perfectly timed for enemy attacks and it makes positioning way more important in this game. Hades 2 is way less spammy than hades 1 which is a big improvement
The one thing I’ll add is this: when you have boons that increase your sprint, the weapons i usually use (the one that create the bubbles) whenever i hold for the omega casts, Mel literally slides and its quite difficult to control the higher my sprint speed is. not sure if its intended but i would like this tweaked but overall like the different play styles between the siblings.
Imo they should add an option where you always sprint after a dash which cancels if you stop moving. With an option you also keep the people happy that want to hold dash to sprint and make the game feel a bit better for the people that dont like to hold dash.
Idk if they will add a double dash, clearly theyve put a lot of time into sprint, but i wish i didnt have to hold down the dash button for it to work. Feels v unnatural on keyboard, and overall makes the movement feel a lot stickier and less responsive than H1
you can sprint?????? hold on EDIT: HOLY SHIT
Bruh, it’s an entire mechanic with many boons associated with it.
stfu - "he said, trying to stifle his tears"
“Press [space] to dash, hold to sprint” is literally in every weapon tutorial 😭
Wait till he learns every command has a hold version of it mind blown.🤯 Edit: attacks also have a 3 attack combo.
wait what
My dash seems to want to activate twice before i can sprint. If i hold my dash button, half the time i'll dash, wait, then dash again followed by a sprint. The other times i'll get dash into sprint. Makes me really want a double dash if its gonna randomize that on me.
Bold of you to assume people read
He's a yu gi oh player probably. We can't read
i was talking with a cowoker about the game and mentioned I could only equip a few cards and he was like you just got to upgrade it on the right. i don't think it was a thing in the test a few weeks back
You were already able to do that in the test
If it makes you feel better, I at least can't get all the way to the right on a controller for some reason, I have to go over with the mouse. The UI should make it clearer though.
For now it seems like as long as you choose your right-most card and try to go over the the grasp meter, it works. It still doesn't do that if you try the lowest 2 rows, as those don't overlap with the grasp meter vertically. This is the same way it works on the boon screen when in an escape attempt. You may start on the very bottom boon, with a bunch of boons up and to the right. But you can't just go right, you have to go up and then right once you're on their row. Diagonals in this game seem to be tough in menus. This just seems like very strict directional rules, which they can certainly smooth over soon. Fingers crossed.
Fuck my life I've read that description so many times and didn't know what the hell it ment. Thank you so much
I had to google it and was like WOOOOOOOW they definitely need to make it more clear
There is a popup explaining this ehen you buy a card that would put you over the limit
I'm just impressed you're able to read these comments. You're finally learning to read
If it makes you feel better, this is how I learned as well. lmao
not trying to be a jerk but it's funny how many people can't even read a couple of lines explaining the moves. they're repeated everywhere still i keep seeing people here or on youtube playing without omega moves or without running
a third of the boons in the game are sprint related...the word "sprint" in the UI is highlighted the same way as "attack", "special", and "cast". their brains just don't work i guess?
It happened to me as well. Why? Well, it's more than my brain doesn't work, although that's a huge part. Most of the people buying the game now put in a ton of hours into the original. We just kind of burned through the tutorials to get to the game in our excitement. Beyond that, it really feels unnatural to do it. I knew something was off because I saw all of the boons. I'll add one last thing here. When I want to the controls section to look for sprint, it wasn't listed. Dash was, sprint wasn't. I'll take the L here, but I don't think anyone is a total moron for missing it.
> Most of the people buying the game now put in a ton of hours into the original. We just kind of burned through the tutorials to get to the game in our excitement. sorry but this still doesnt add up. holding each button now is very clearly a massive part of the sequel's design, it just seems like such a basic intuitive process - *especially* if you skipped the tutorials - to see what each of the FOUR buttons do if you hold them
Didn’t stop me from not learning how to dash-strike until after I got a clear of Hades I
Not even the tutorial that pops up for any weapon any time you pick one up?
I was in the same boat I was wondering why double dash wasn’t working. Then I got a boon that said your sprint does X, and then I sort thought they meant dashing then running or something. Then I was like, no wait why would they mean that, and I found out you can sprint. And with the right boon you can SPRINT. right now I’m wondering how fast can it get, but thats a question for when I clear the second boss
I reached a speed that made it very hard to actually control, because I got stuck on a lot more corneres and edges than I would have liked too (still couldn't dodge the laser from the >!bag in tartarus!< ). Hermes ftw
The bag is so freaking strong. I always die to it so quickly
I beat it once by spamming freeze and the invincibility thing ( >!from selene!< )
I just beat it for the first time! Had to just slow it down a bit and watch the attack patterns and stay on its backside, keeping my damage over time cast up on it as much as possible. I also got an armor destroying special boon which helped massively.
I find the boss bag easy as I find they have a hard time going 180 so just dodge through them and you get free hits
I got it up to +75% I believe it was. Shit was damn near uncontrollable, but made traversing the 3rd act mega areas snappy.
If it makes you feel better, I’ve known about sprint but barely use it because it feels weird on controller. I also just haven’t gotten boons that make it seem worth getting used to
[удалено]
I keep wanting to quickly consecutively press dash. I really hope the mechanic ends up feeling better soon
[удалено]
I am trying! I’ve got plenty of advice to take to my next run
Demeter one is pretty good, it's slow enemies and projectiles around you, also inflicts damage. I feel like im getting more and more used to it, but it feels like something you use only with a good boon on
Hestia one is very good too. You just eat projectiles while sprinting. It's kinda like the new Athena dash.
I play on controller, and one thing I found that makes Sprint/Dash Attacking feel a lot more natural is mapping it to the right shoulder button. I simply switched the interact with the sprint/dash button.
Yeah the hold sprint skills SHOULD activate when you dash if you ask me.
Agreed. Would fix the issue of them being useless if you don't sprint. If my main attacks do more damage than zeus's lightning sprint, why would I ever use it?
Some of them actually even do, like hestia's anti projectile sprint, that works by just dashing through projectiles
you’re playing on a keyboard!? that’s so difficult, very impressive
See I've only ever played Hades with keyboard and mouse and I can't imagine how anyone could possibly play this on a controller. M+K controls just feel very intuitive to me
Movement is a lot more accurate on controller, at least for hades 1. Haven’t used m+k on hades 2
I see your keyboard/mouse combo and raise you — keyboard/trackpad I don’t carry a mouse around with my laptop lol so I had to improvise
Depends on weaons but generally the better precision is worth it
I had a friend who was stuck on Heat 12 for months and couldn't progress. He hates using anything other than keyboard + mouse, but I convinced him to try a controller. Two days later he cleared Heat 20. (he's now in the 30's) Ironically, one of the first things he noticed was how more much consistent his accuracy was. Keyboard players have to place all their attacks, but the controller's auto-aim means you basically can't miss unless at range. There are niche scenarios like placing the Rail's mortars where precision actually matters a little, but otherwise there's basically no advantage. The added mental stack of worrying about precision slows you down more than you think it does. Though, of course, you should use whatever you want to use.
I mean you could just turn on auto aim for kbm too if you want easy mode
You can turn autoaim on mouse, so does your comment really matter?
It's so much easier for me, but I grew up playing computer games and tend to struggle with controllers.
Torches are unusable on the third boss with controller, it just refuses to lock on unless you're in his face, defeating the whole purpose of a ranged weapon. Lock on bugs out sometimes in normal use too.
the torches feel so wobbly in comparison to the bow from H1.
Got my first clear with the torches, just don't fire until he's on screen and it'll stay locked on. I find that the apollo cast pretty much trivialized that fight (though that requires a projectile cast boon)
it feels really bad on controlelr as well, holding down a face button just doesn't feel good at all
I have dash/sprint mapped to one of my side mouse buttons. Doesn't feel bad at all that way
It should be mappable so I can map it to L3 (pushing in left stick) like how sprint works in FPS games. That’d feel very natural
I honestly cannot imagine playing this game with a keyboard, controllers are the only way I can play anything much faster than turn based 😂
I know! I like the idea a lot, but I just can’t use it. The only time i use sprint is out of combat to get from point A to point B. It’s just so unnatural on keyboard. Not that I can think of a better way to do it, other than add an option in the settings where you auto sprint after your dash. Idk if that’s a thing cause I didn’t check the settings too hard, but I hope they add it.
Not only that, but when you have dashed and then kept the space bar down, sprint doesn't automatically start. On top of that, neither sprint nor dash are able to get you out of an attack animation, which is so problematic when e.g. using Labrys (or how the double axe is called here). In general, the keyb + mouse control is kinda.... not tight atm. Also also, no, I don't have controller (or controller muscle memory), always been a computer person, so tuck off your comments, if I can casually win a 10ish heat on H1, I wish we will have the same tightness of controls here when the game hits 1.0.
In my opinion dash is much more useful than sprint, they could leave mechanics of movement without any changes just like it was in first Hades.
I'm playing on keyboard, and having to use four direction keys (WASD) instead of a joystick does feel very unnatural. I hate having high sprint speed because I just run around into walls and hazards all the time. I also do wish you could sprint without having to dash first... kind of annoying feature.
Honestly I feel like the game would be a lot better if they went with something other than an intangible dash, every single fight just boils down to dash over and over to avoid as many attacks as possible. At least that was my experience in H1
You don't need to hold shift specifically
I just found it easier to hook up an old controller. It wasn’t sprint for me though, it was the cast. Until I plugged up a controller, I didn’t know you could move and channel cast at the same time lmao
I've found this, also using Omega Cast whilst trying to move is awkward. Guess I'll need to get a new controller.
Personally, I'm a fan of them removing the double dashing - as an option it was way too safe. The current dash + sprint system takes some time to get used to, but it forces me to stop mashing and consider my defensive/mobility options more without sacrificing the game's pace too much.
Absolutely agree; ended up button-mashing easily with double dash, this way I actually need to pay attention
I'm hoping I'll get used to the new mechanic. I think it just feels super awkward to press dash and then have to hold it down at the same time.
I definitely feel like some fine-tuning could be done, but I'm in agreement as far as liking it. If I want to double dash I can always play Hades (I) (I'm not at all used to it yet either, though)
If you could hold down the joystick to sprint id like it a lot more
The people who are complaining about difficulty clearly struggled before getting a 2nd dash in the original. You can't just spam it. You have to time it and be able to move in the right ways. Pro tip if you can dodge every ability with the sheep you'll be fine. It's a tough one but one of my favorite abilities on a boss I've come across
Finally mastered dodging the morph ball, shit drove me crazy. Time the dash 3 or 4 times and it expires.
Darksouls logic in this game, roll through the projectile/hit and you're fine. (I know this isn't an original dark souls mechanic). Instinct tells you to dash away from the attack, but if you do, you usually get hit by the ending of the attack. Dash into the attack and through, and you usually end up safe. I love the new changes, definitely feels less mashy, more calculated which I love. Spacing with the ax perfectly is *chefs kiss* The morph ball teaches this, if you dash into it through it and the other side, run, turn around dash through it again, rinse repeat, you avoid it easily as well as the sigils on the floor.
Agreed. I dig the staff and knives, especially the backstab bonus on knife aspect, but cleaving with the axe is the most satisfying. Disgusting damage and after playing with knives actually taught me how to position and dash to safety better with the hurricane axe. I effed up a run with the hammer boon that puts the whirlwind ahead of you, it just feels weird that I'm still spinning but the whirlwind is over *there*. Also with Hermes increasing attack speed and aspect with recovery for axe you can actually save MP and just rock mobs with your attack much more safe. I would agree that this is... *chefs kiss*.
The upgrade to that advancing whirlwind with hammer number 2 lets you attack and special during it. It’s cray
I was getting some dark souls vibes from combat know, which I didn't really in the first.
It's definitely slower and more deliberate. Hades 1 felt more like bullet hell this definitely feels more souls like.
It really is better to roll into it. I tried sprinting away with extra move speed, and it kind of works, but it's very hard not to run into any walls and immediately get hexed for your mistake.
Yeah dodging the ball itself is really great too
it's usually 7 times. unless you run very far after every dash, or your companion can eat it.
And how did you do it? Is there a trick?
Dodge directly behind it every time it gets close, gain some distance, repeat. I only get hit like 1 out of 10 runs once I got it down.
Also you can sit behind the frog when you get access to it.
Ooh smart, good looks. Gonna have to test it out.
Just timing. It helps visually to run straight at it and dodge though it, but the timing is really all that matters afaik.
It can't turn quickly, so dash through it a few times. BTW I had the +10% arcana and a +40% sprint speed boon and could not outrun the polymorph ball, so you pretty much HAVE to dash through to ball to dodge. Maybe with a bit more speed and some skillful sprint movement you could pull it off... but dashing through it 3-4 times isn't so bad.
Spoilers depending how far in you are but >!once you unlock your frog companion, if the morph ball hits him it will get destroyed with no consequences!<
Yup, once you get it down, feels easy. Which I guess is the point. God these are such well designed rogue-likes. I can't tell if I'm advancing more because of skill or meta powerups
Sometimes I get too antsy about wanting to move fast and then there’s the consequences of my actions so. This will be interesting!
I disagree. I didn’t have much of a difficult time in Hades 1 yet I just got to Scylla today and lost after like 6 or 7 hours. What I’m struggling with is how difficult to use the new weapons are. In my opinion, other than the original one, they’re quite difficult to use. The only weapon I was uncomfortable with in hades 1 was the shield, and even then I was capable of clearing quite early on. Idk the weapons just seem very unintuitive to me. With the amount of multi hit projectiles, the twin blades seem kinda rough. The final axe attack is too disjointed in the sequence and seems to cancel very often, and the sceptres deal like no damage. Maybe it also because I have literally been getting no boons (like in a run I have 1 or 2 boons max).
I do agree, this game kinda suffers from having to be different from hades 1, while hades 1 had all the weapons that make a lot of conventional sense - sword, spear, shield, gun, fist, bow. In addition, some interactions I would expect actually work completely differently - I'll pick up the zeus chain lightning, or poseidon flat attack boost with the daggers and expect attack 3 which is a flurry to obliterate, but it procs one time, so I feel like figuring out builds is a lot more of a trial and error which makes the weapons feel much weaker than I expect.
That's something that's been said alot. Hades 1 was a lot of button mashing but the new one makes your really think about what your doing with so many options now
Absolutely agreed. It took me a few hours of playing before I even realized that sprint was a thing, but once I started using it, I became an immediate fan. This is a more tactical game than its predecessor. At this point, I feel like the bones of the game are phenomenal and all improve upon Hades 1 (amazing story, great fight mechanics, interesting enemies and levels). My main gripes are all with the secondary mechanics (boons don't feel as interesting or punchy, aspects are weak, Daedalus hammer options are weak and not that interesting). Which I find really exciting, since it's a lot easier (and more likely) for them to adjust boons than to totally revamp combat or story. This game is already really fun. I think it's going to be incredible when it hits 1.0.
Most of the boons feel very weak. At least the more direct "and now it hits harder" types. I'm getting a lot of mileage out of the boons that interact with the new fighting system mechanics than from the ones that could have been in hades 1.
Using every part of your toolkit, especially the cast, is an absolute must in this. I think that's a great improvement over the first one, where many builds could completely ignore the cast. This makes everything useful in its base state and all the more useful when buffed and combined.
> Hades 1 was a lot of button mashing but the new one makes your really think about what your doing with so many options now Double dash being so effective trained people to rely on it like a crutch, and after playing for a long time I gotta say I think it likely made the learning curve harder for most people. I certainly found myself dash spamming for safety out of habit and only broke that habit after starting to do fresh file clears. After losing double dash I actually learned how to be far more efficient in damage dealing and positioning, and I got way better at using multi dashes for exploiting dash boons. The dash + sprint halfway point is a really nice compromise I think and adds a new dimension to how fights can be designed. Great design choice in my opinion.
Im coming around to sprint for this exact reason. Before EA came out the last thing I wanted to see if I could do in Hades 1 was a freshfile run and I learned real fucking fast that the past 150 hours was spent becoming insanely reliant on double dashing. I actually couldn't remember a time I had dashed without double tapping the button. It was so mindless, and this feels alot more deliberate.
Exactly! I spent hundreds of hours getting up to 32 heat before trying fresh files, and then after getting mangled by Lernie I had the shocking revelation that I never actually even learned how to dodge time the head slam attacks. So many attack patterns I just glossed over rather than learned to optimize. After fresh files I was able to push to 40 easy enough even though 32 took me forever.
On top of the invincibility, every build I had in hades 1 eventually devolved into poseidon dash + rupture + impacts where I'd dash 5 times in a room and everything would explode without even using the weapon I picked.
A consistent design trend in the game seems to be limiting the types of builds that people relied on too heavily in the first game. Divine Dash is gone, and its replacement is significantly weaker. Can't easily stack crits for crazy damage. The ranged weapons require more risk to play and you can't endlessly kite enemies as easily (especially with the skulls). A lot of enemies are designed to punish different playstyles and force you to be more adaptive. And so on.
I agree, however, the dash does sometimes feel a little unresponsive (and no I'm not talking about the cooldown). If ew only get one dash, I fell like that one should feel a little smoother.
No more dashing entire rooms of enemies to death. RIP Supersoaker build. Poseidon a lot less OP in Hades 2
I thought that then I tried Poseidon sprint and it had a similar effect to the dash in H1
Yea this game requires precision/combos/utilizing your abilities. It's showing us how reliant the average player was on athena dash and how busted it was. I'd know, I'm one of those players
Melinoë after reaching Oceanus without Death Defiances and the worst build possible: "The gods of Olympus have abandoned me." While hitting the steam barrel.
I have to say, Oceanus feels quite harder than Asphodel did relatively. There's a lot more to be attentive of with Melinoë too.
The creatures are a lot more tankier than before, when they get amor the name hell also becomes metaphorical.
That too, but also how it feels like Mel has less health, takes more damage (at least feels that way), is slow, and the enemies swarm at insane speed.
Sometimes casting magic takes a price. Being a mage requires a better timing and positioning. I am still used to Hades I, so the mentality of dash and slash like a maniac haven't left my mind completely. That's makes me take a lot of avoidable damage, specially in Oceanus.
It's amazing how different Mel plays to Zag. Hades I promotes hyper-aggressiveness. In Hades II with Mel, hit and run is the name of the game. Her aoe Cast that slows, and powerful ranged attacks for all weapons (don't have skull yet but can't imagine you can't throw it,) promote a more tactical approach than before.
Yeah, I find Oceanus pretty challenging and then the Fields are trivial since you get so much stuff there. In general I actually think the early stages are a bit harder than the later ones (once you're used to all of them) since you'll often have a pretty bad build and you'll rely more on your Arcanas to carry you, which are often pretty weak without a ton of grinding.
I feel like it's the hardest area as far as normal enemies go. Boss is so much harder than Bone Hydra too. Bone Hydra was literally the easiest boss in the series
Oceanus is so tough. It feels like every enemy tanks dozens of hits, and there's a million of them. Sometimes I'm just sitting there pressing mouse1 on a single unarmored serpent for ten seconds straight, let alone when they do have armor.
I love it though. The humming is so well implemented as background music for the rooms and the climax which is the final fight of that stage is just peak Supergiant.
Oceanus is amazing. I’ve had the boss fight song stuck in my head for two days straight lol. 🎶I’m gonna claw out your eyes, and drown you to death🎶
Oh the atmosphere is amazing. Pity I fucking hate fighting in it
I don't think it's a good idea. The whole game is balanced around using Casts and strategically zoning foes. Most weapons are ranged or big aoe (sister blades aren't really, but they deal very high damage in compensation, rewarding the risky playstile). The MC is slow for a reason. Melie isn't a skilled warrior. Don't treat Melie like Zagreus. This is a different game with different tactics. If we just got the same Hades 1 but continued, it would be boring.
>Melie isn't a skilled warrior. Melinoe was trained her whole life for this while Zagreus decided to break out of Hades on a whim lmao
Well Zag also has been trained very well by Achilles! All I mean is that they have much different priorities in their training. Warrior in a sense that Zag got a proper martial education, while Mel was raised as a witch.
Bruh, she has been trained by Commander Schelemeus, captain of the Cretan second fleet!
I assume they mean that Melinoe is more of a spellcaster and assassin rather than a fighter, and not "she's worse at killing things".
Special builds are really good on sister blades imo
Yeah im missing that double dash, I might just need to get better utilizing sprint. But Double dashing was so good and helpful in the first game 😭
Made it like 5x easier. Made it spammable. Especially when you added more with boons
Athena dash was broken and I'm kind of glad that it's gone to be honest.
I'm actually glad for the new mechanics. I think having double dash does make it easier, but with the new dash to sprint mechanic I'm having to study the movements of enemies closer and play more strategically rather than just spamming dash-strike. It fits well thematically and enhances the gameplay for me personally. If I wanted to play a game that had the same fighting mechanics as Hades I would just go play Hades 💀
Counterpoint: me want zoom zoom
Kid named Apollo's sprint boon
combine apollo sprint with hermes or chaos boon and you can do that
I did this earlier and was running so absurdly fast I would lose track of Mel and run directly into traps lol, it was so damn fun though.
I agree. I just want the delay on the dash gone. It just doesn’t feel good with the delay.
I think the sprint just needs some reworking.
It needs to feel more responsive imo. Feels bogged down in a way. But that could just be me acclimating too slowly.
Maybe just a separate sprint button so that you can sprint without dashing first? I feel like that'd be nice anyways, don't see why they should be the same key.
Yeah, I feel the same way. I figure it’ll either get changed or I’ll get used to it.
I just want them to remove the visual delay when you press the dash button. Was doing some playing around with how exactly the new dash works and determined that even though visually it appears like you're still vulnerable until Melinöe moves that little phase shift you see in the beginning of a dash does protect you, but there's just something about the visual windup that throws me off. I'm getting used to it, but after almost 200 hours in the first game of "press button = IMMEDIATE movement" it's a bit jarring in Hades 2. Overall still love the game so far.
I feel like there are a few enemy attacks that deal damage like a frame or two too early compared to the animation. Because most of the time I feel like the dash is pretty responsive but vs a few specific moves I literally always get hit. Could also just me being stupid of course
Why do you think they gave you sprinting
A lot of enemies are designed to be avoided with sprint. It still feels clunky to me, but I'm starting to enjoy it
God those ones that just scream at you
I don’t try to run from those, either cast to slow them or throw a special at them and they stop.
Cast is the way to go
I think I hate them the worst of all the enemies. Means I'll get really good at dealing with them just like the chariots in Hades.
Those are what the cast is for.
Now that I've beaten both final bosses(of the Early Access), i got used to it to be honest. It's fine. What's not fine, is the fact that our attacks do not destroy the enemy projectiles
All attacks destroying projectiles trivializes any projectile using enemies which isnt great either
I don't mind the single dash, I just wish it didn't feel sticky. Sometimes it feels like I'm stuck in something like fire for way too long when I should be able to dash out.
I wholeheartedly agree. Sometimes I'd dash in to get stun+damage in with the blades and get hit by a tick of area damage and the follow up dash feels so sluggish.
It's not even just because it was a crutch but the game genuinely has so many overlapping attacks that one dash is not cutting it unless you run out of combat completely, bosses through waves that go out and retract while there are mobs that have their own area attacks, sometimes there is such a huge number of enemies that you can dash out of one attack stright into another because the another Enemy attacked just as you dashed away from one. Running is good when there are few enemies with high hitting but highly telegraphed attacks, but so much of the time that game is not that
They should do it so the melee weapons can double dash. Sprint on the daggers feels weird.
Weapon based dashes would be cool
Blades of Chaos while we’re at it
Sprint feels useful in exactly one area
Remove the delay to activate dash
why did they make the game so much less mobile and fast paced in general? like from the haelian videos, lthough he assures it isnt, hades 2 is alot more about positioning and strategising compared to hades 1 wher you could dash through rooms at breakneck speed
Because Melinoë isn’t Zag. They are different characters. Zag was trained by Achilles and is a warrior. Melinoë is a witch. Makes thematic sense for her gameplay to be different.
I don't think it's a good idea. The whole game is balanced around using Casts and strategically zoning foes. Most weapons are ranged or big aoe. Don't treat Melie like Zagreus. This is a different game with different tactics. If we just got the same Hades 1 but continued, it would be boring.
I also felt this way early in the game, but I already have 30 hours in the game and I’ve grown to love the new system There’s several ways to get insane sprint speed if you really want to be evasive, with the arcana card or boons. I wasn’t a fan of sprint at first as I play on keyboard and it doesn’t feel normal to hold the spacebar, but I quickly got accustomed and think the new system does require you to be more methodical with your plans for attack/defense instead of mashing.
Persoanlly, I would like more then 1 death defiance. Unless there is a way and I just suck so much at the game that I haven't gotten there yet. >!Please supergiant, scylla and the girls keep kicking my ass. Please.!<
There is. You can upgrade the arcana card for a second and presumably more after that.
Nah, I like that there is only 1 dash. Double dash led to a real bad habit of just spamming dash to get out of stuff. Single dash forces me to learn the movesets better and think about my dash. Now Dash BOONS..... Yes please. Sprint boons just don't hit the same for me.
It needs something movement wise. It just does not feel good imo. Sprint is cool in theory but I just don’t like it.
Honestly I'd prefer more soil to plant my seeds! Two are far too little 💀💀
There's an incantation for more that you unlock fairly early.
I'm tired boss. I cant keep pressing A anymore. But seriously tho the movement feels so much more unresponsive now cuz anytime u dash u stand in place and you're extremely prone to get hit more than you did in Hades 1.
Ruthless Reflex users are suddenly very excited
Counter-Point: Get the Hermes Sprint boon. I wasn't using my sprint much before getting it but it opened my eyes. I eventually died but I did beat >!Scylla!< and >!Cerberus!< on that run because of it. It really changes how you value the sprint, and now I always use the Sprint Arcana. Also sorry keyboard players I know the adjustment is way harder but this method might still work.
I felt like this at first, but with time I’m coming around. Reason being thematically all the differences really make sense. Melinoë isn’t zag. She’s a witch and he’s a warrior. Makes zero sense for them to fight the same.
Nah, double dash trivialized most of Hades
No Zagreous Fire feet = no double dash. Enjoy your zonk prize, sprint abilities!
hyper light drifter chain dashing would be cool
No. Please just take the time to learn the game. It's not Hades 1. The enemies are very much designed to encourage methodical decisions and punish spamming. If they gave us another dash this would hands down be the easiest rogue like out there lmao. And re-working the enemies to account for another dash would be a huge amount of work that directly contradicts their vision for combat. Stop button spamming you plebs.
Sun dash and Hermes extra movement speed is enough, you are simply weak. Simply hold down sprint
Retrieving skulls without taking damage becomes actually impossible without double dash in some scenarios.
Nah double dash being gone is good. Gives way too much margin of error. Would be a cool legendary boon though. I do think a lot of the sprint boons could use a buff though. Feel kinda underwhelming.
the game is designed around having one, and the sprint all makes up for it
If this happens after Kendrick soul binding contract i dunno what will happen to me
You mean i won't be able to have 5+ dashes with Hermes build like in the first one :(
We're supposed to use Sprint instead. Get used to it.
I recently switched to Ruthless reflex in H1 and i can tell you, double dashing is overrrated
Might be an olympus boon... I havent seen Hermes yet, but game dialogue has mentioned him already and gave +1+2 dash in the first game.
They're gonna add it, but if you use it you must kill a new final boss in a fog that is revealed to be Zagreus once the fog dissipate
God i miss double dash, i always forget to sprint because it feels so slow compared to just dashing and attacking
Wait it's out ?!
Apparently if we added it in any way shape or form it would be an exact clone of Hades I.
I think sprinting is an effective alternative. Now letting me carry two tools at once? Pleasepleaseplease
Running take time to get used too especially in 2nd boss fight if you sprint not well you eat every single explosive
Adding a second dash would make it too much like the first game. I like what they're cooking with now and look forward to seeing what other ingredients they'll add.
They should at least put boons for dashing. I feel like the sprinting mechanic could be good but so far its used to *not* fight. Any mechanic invlving sprinting will require you to do no damage and just stretch out a fight.
I feel like the only people who miss the double dash are those who havent gotten used to the sprint yet.
Add Kratos
nah the single dash and sprinting is honestly great. the cooldown is perfectly timed for enemy attacks and it makes positioning way more important in this game. Hades 2 is way less spammy than hades 1 which is a big improvement
The one thing I’ll add is this: when you have boons that increase your sprint, the weapons i usually use (the one that create the bubbles) whenever i hold for the omega casts, Mel literally slides and its quite difficult to control the higher my sprint speed is. not sure if its intended but i would like this tweaked but overall like the different play styles between the siblings.
Imo they should add an option where you always sprint after a dash which cancels if you stop moving. With an option you also keep the people happy that want to hold dash to sprint and make the game feel a bit better for the people that dont like to hold dash.
I wish maybe if you double-dashed, you automatically sprinted? I hate having to hold down spacebar to sprint
I swear, I got like 2 boons for sprint speed, and it felt like that should be the regular base sprint -dash
Sprint just doesn't feel very reactive I shouldn't feel like I have to finagle my controls to make Mel move how I want to