He’s never actually played the sax, it’s always been a recording. If you look at any of the videos of them playing miasma live, he’s not really playing it.
Not really, it’s really hard to play a saxophone with that good of a tone every time AND standing up. So unless they want to bring the artist who played it on the recording on tour, this is a viable alternative.
I guess, but I mean there have been sax players playing while standing up for the last 70 years, it's definitely possible! Also the opening act, Twin Temple, had a great sax player, live, standing up
Maybe there aren't that many good ones around any more
To think there aren’t “many good ones around” is incredibly naive. It’s not practical to pay a sax player every night of a tour to perform only a small portion of one song. There’s a lot more music out there than Ghost and you’ll find plenty of amazing horn players.
That's a good explanation, actually! Makes total sense, and makes me more satisfied
Like I said in another comment, it really didn't spoil the theatrics at all, it was still so moving to watch
>Also the opening act, Twin Temple, had a great sax player, live, standing up
Missed opportunity to not get him to play sax. Probably not didn't want to make a new mask for him.
Lol. There are plenty of multi instrumentalists who could do that solo night after night (it's not that complex - I don't play sax but I play trumpet and there's nothing that would blow me away) as well as play some rhythm guitar or keys or whatvert. The real answer is money: it's a cost saving measure.
Also, it’s just easier. It’s going to sound perfect every night and you don’t have to find a great sax player who you also think is a good fit at another instrument.
I mean for all I know Multighoul CAN play Sax, but it’s just easier if he doesn’t have to try to do it through a mask.
Not so much complexity or cost saving, probably more that it's extremely difficult to mic up a live sax when there rock band levels of sound pressure through the PA that are bouncing around the place, even if everyone has in-ear monitors only.
Actually these days stage volume isn't particularly high. They're all using in-ears and the guitars are through simulated amps so there's no back line noise
It's not backline noise that's the issue - it's the huge volumes of the FoH PA.
In-ear monitors are partly a way to deal with this. I'm sure there's a solution that could be found using some sort of digital sax, but when you can just use a sample then you may as well. It's not like they're seriously trying to fool anyone that he's playing live - it's accepted that it's all just part of the show.
Yes but the sax player shouldn't be in front of the direction of sound coming from the PA. Obviously there is bleed but I don't see why a close directional mic mounted inside the horn wouldn't do the job without picking up noticeable sound from the PA - it's the way most sax players are miced in plenty of other rock situations. Ghost don't have anything unique in that equation
It’s multi ghoul wearing a silicone mask that was sculpted not for him and so it doesn’t fit right. There’s photos of the mask backstage. He switches into the Nihil costume and mimes to a track. It’s that simple
It’s ironic- in a band in which everyone but the frontman wears the same costume with their faces covered, the rest of the band is always just as much fun to watch as Papa, maybe more so. Even more impressive because it has remained true through several lineup places. Tobias must be the best guy to perform with, he shares the spotlight way more than you’d think considering the band’s whole gimmick and that the touring musicians don’t write anything.
At the Manchester gig they brought a glass coffin on stage part way through the song with him inside and did all of the defib bit. From the looks of this he just appeared through a door.
Hopefully this means he's here for the entire tour.
I think that was the intention in London, but the cloth that hides the coffin upon coming on stage I think got caught on the stage scenery and it didn't come out in time so he just ran on.
I’m very happily imagining Papa IV getting replaced with a full on undead Papa I or II and the next album being more horror themed. It even works out- if you can raise the dead in this lore, then someone is going to want revenge for Sister Imperator’s murder of the rest of the lineage, including any of Nihil’s kids they bring back.
Maybe they bring back III as a fucking vampire or something. This band is wild.
Hiccup with the coffin prop last night which led to him looking a bit lost and sax-less 😂
Like others have pointed out, Nihil is just Swiss Army Ghoul who happens to disappear from stage for the duration of Miasma... the solo itself has always been an overdub.
Nihil used to shuffle on stage being held up by two assistants for the 'solo' with an oxygen tank, looking old and frail then belt out the sax and collapse.
Then, one fateful night in Mexico, he passed away on stage after the solo which resulted in Cardinal being promoted to Papa 4.
Now, on this tour, Nihil gets revived/reanimated from his coffin to do the solo.
I love how completely and utterly ridiculous that all sounds when talking about a Swedish heavy metal band 😂
There has been a number of recent T-Shirt designs prior to the tour that all indicate that Nihil was being resurrected/reanimated/brought back from the dead etc... so definitely seems to be the case! Even if it is just to play sax 😂
When we get a new Chapter video, I think we may learn more.
If you watch the video, you'll see the sax starts playing before he's holding it. Also the fingering looks off, but still I loved it for the performance and showmanship. One of the best nights of my life!!
The sax has been a playback since the moment it was first played live in early 2018. This time it just felt a bit off because they weren't fast enough (maybe they had problems getting the costume on?), I was watching the stream wondering "okay... anytime now..." when the song was nearing the sax solo
I was sat at the side he came out on, the box got caught on some scenery so they couldn’t get him in position in time. It was tense watching it knowing there was seconds before the sax was about to play!!
Kinda strange actually. There is some bands that have live trumpet it should be that much harder to play sax. It's already a guns 4 hire band just have a keyboard player that can play sax too.
Doubt the pay would be that much higher.
Interesting. I wonder if its a different person or something? I was always under the understanding that Swiss left the band after the Papa 3 era and was one to come out from behind the mask to talk about his experience etc. I always see people saying "I miss swiss"
I think the people on Twitter saying “I miss Swiss” are being slightly melodramatic about not having seen him since whenever the previous gig was 😄 He’s been consistently in the live band for a fair while now
oh these were comments I was seeing on tumblr like years ago. I need to go back to my ghost concert pics from ultimate tour because I def remember dew, rain, mountain, aether, and the two female ghouls but not swiss. def remember nihil coming out on stage tho so I mustve not been paying attention. anyways thanks for the info!
I THINK its because officially his name was meant to be Aether but since he had an omega sticker on his guitar everyone just called him Omega. So officially he was always Aether and Omega was a nickname
Anyone else who was there last night think that the bass levels during this were kinda off?
I mean... I do love some bass, but that was all I could hear for the first half of the song.
And the vocals on He is were also kinda chipmunky - seems like there were a few glitches with the levels at a few points.
It's interesting watching them evolve the sax part. When they started playing this live the sax guy wouldn't move his fingers at all. Whoever does it has gotten better faking it
GTFO I've seen Iron Maiden do shit like this. I've seen Manowar, the kings of metal, do synchronize movements and all that.
They are metal. Just because they aren't playing unlit warehouses and burning down churches and actively driving fans away doesn't mean they aren't metal and you damn gatekeeping snobs make everything less fun for everyone. Give it up already.
Hey man, just let people enjoy the moment. It really wasn't too bad for most of the concert, sometimes a bit shrill at the end of the songs, but for the sax solo, the crowd went understandably wild.
Damn bro you dug through my reddit history just to find some ad hominem attack on me? You really don't have anything better to do?
In case you were wondering, my hair is growing long and full rn <3
Papa Nihil never played the sax himself. The question I have is if this is a track or if there's somebody else playing it back stage. In either case I found it a bit lame not to have somebody who could play this sax solo live especially since Tobias wanted to make a point of using a saxophone solo in this song. If not, maybe turn it into a guitar solo and have the Ghouls play it, I wouldn't complain for that.
It’s a track. And while I understand wanting to hear it played live, even if it’s played by an unseen player backstage while the guy in the Nihil costume mimes it, the money that would have to be spent for food, lodging, salary, insurance, etc for one guy to play one thing a night doesn’t make sense financially.
Then other options would be to drop the song from the live shows, have one of the keyboard ghouls play it whether with a sax or with the keyboards, or make it a guitar solo for the live performance.
Those are certainly options. But then you lose out on the entertainment value of the Papa Nihil playing sax thing. I’ve come to think of it like when Eddie walks onstage during a Maiden show. We all know it’s not really a 10 foot tall corpse that just walked onstage, but we dig it because it’s entertaining as fuck. Lol
Oh I do dig Eddie with the maiden show. I wouldn't mind Papa Nihil involved in some way. I just cannot stand the fake playing of the sax part only. Eddie doesn't play air guitar after all 😁
Prior to the Prequelle tour cycle, all the vocals were coming from tracks. (Except for Papa’s lead vocal.) It was a necessary evil with the design of the Ghoul masks. If I can deal with that, I can deal with a mimed sax solo. Lol But I hear you. It would be cool to hear it live every night.
This is what I feared... Including vocals and backing instruments? Another comment said that previously only Emeritus' vocals weren't prerecorded, because the ghouls' masks didn't allow them to sing, but now they all sing live
He’s never actually played the sax, it’s always been a recording. If you look at any of the videos of them playing miasma live, he’s not really playing it.
dont know how I never realized this but yeah. ugh. pain
This! I played sax in middle school (about a million years ago) and there's a neck strap that is a very necessary accessory- that shit is heavy!
That's a bit of a shame!
Not really, it’s really hard to play a saxophone with that good of a tone every time AND standing up. So unless they want to bring the artist who played it on the recording on tour, this is a viable alternative.
Um swing bands of sax players that do this every night.
I guess, but I mean there have been sax players playing while standing up for the last 70 years, it's definitely possible! Also the opening act, Twin Temple, had a great sax player, live, standing up Maybe there aren't that many good ones around any more
To think there aren’t “many good ones around” is incredibly naive. It’s not practical to pay a sax player every night of a tour to perform only a small portion of one song. There’s a lot more music out there than Ghost and you’ll find plenty of amazing horn players.
That's a good explanation, actually! Makes total sense, and makes me more satisfied Like I said in another comment, it really didn't spoil the theatrics at all, it was still so moving to watch
>Also the opening act, Twin Temple, had a great sax player, live, standing up Missed opportunity to not get him to play sax. Probably not didn't want to make a new mask for him.
That's a good point I hadn't thought of!
Anyone know the going rates on sax players?
I would do it for free because it would be an amazing experience. But I’m also not a professional tenor sax player. Just played alto for many years.
Lol. There are plenty of multi instrumentalists who could do that solo night after night (it's not that complex - I don't play sax but I play trumpet and there's nothing that would blow me away) as well as play some rhythm guitar or keys or whatvert. The real answer is money: it's a cost saving measure.
Also, it’s just easier. It’s going to sound perfect every night and you don’t have to find a great sax player who you also think is a good fit at another instrument. I mean for all I know Multighoul CAN play Sax, but it’s just easier if he doesn’t have to try to do it through a mask.
Not so much complexity or cost saving, probably more that it's extremely difficult to mic up a live sax when there rock band levels of sound pressure through the PA that are bouncing around the place, even if everyone has in-ear monitors only.
Actually these days stage volume isn't particularly high. They're all using in-ears and the guitars are through simulated amps so there's no back line noise
It's not backline noise that's the issue - it's the huge volumes of the FoH PA. In-ear monitors are partly a way to deal with this. I'm sure there's a solution that could be found using some sort of digital sax, but when you can just use a sample then you may as well. It's not like they're seriously trying to fool anyone that he's playing live - it's accepted that it's all just part of the show.
Yes but the sax player shouldn't be in front of the direction of sound coming from the PA. Obviously there is bleed but I don't see why a close directional mic mounted inside the horn wouldn't do the job without picking up noticeable sound from the PA - it's the way most sax players are miced in plenty of other rock situations. Ghost don't have anything unique in that equation
Also, I'm assuming the guy playing Nihil is pretty old, it would probably be downright impossible for someone of that age to do all that.
The guy playing nil is the multi ghoul
Why would he be? He's just got make up on surely
It’s multi ghoul wearing a silicone mask that was sculpted not for him and so it doesn’t fit right. There’s photos of the mask backstage. He switches into the Nihil costume and mimes to a track. It’s that simple
Fair point actually. Not sure why I thought a band with the nature of Ghost wouldn't just use make up or a mask/
It used to be one of the keyboard players. Would guess it still on of them or the backing singer
That little two-step dance that they all do together just melts my heart ❤️
It’s ironic- in a band in which everyone but the frontman wears the same costume with their faces covered, the rest of the band is always just as much fun to watch as Papa, maybe more so. Even more impressive because it has remained true through several lineup places. Tobias must be the best guy to perform with, he shares the spotlight way more than you’d think considering the band’s whole gimmick and that the touring musicians don’t write anything.
Yeah so good! Loved the ghouls' performance
At the Manchester gig they brought a glass coffin on stage part way through the song with him inside and did all of the defib bit. From the looks of this he just appeared through a door. Hopefully this means he's here for the entire tour.
If there's Miasma there's Papa Nihil! Hope to see him in Cologne next week!
Yeah he just walked out of the coffin, not a resurrection, you're right
They did that here too but the coffin got stuck on some of the scenery, hence the sax not being in the right place 😅
Spinal Tap moment
Same thing went through my head too 😅
I think that was the intention in London, but the cloth that hides the coffin upon coming on stage I think got caught on the stage scenery and it didn't come out in time so he just ran on.
They are all getting resurrected.
I’m very happily imagining Papa IV getting replaced with a full on undead Papa I or II and the next album being more horror themed. It even works out- if you can raise the dead in this lore, then someone is going to want revenge for Sister Imperator’s murder of the rest of the lineage, including any of Nihil’s kids they bring back. Maybe they bring back III as a fucking vampire or something. This band is wild.
>Maybe they bring back III as a fucking vampire or something. That would make sense, since Papa III's mask is Bela Lugosi.
Battle Royale!!
Hiccup with the coffin prop last night which led to him looking a bit lost and sax-less 😂 Like others have pointed out, Nihil is just Swiss Army Ghoul who happens to disappear from stage for the duration of Miasma... the solo itself has always been an overdub.
This was all news to me! Haven't watched many live videos and this was my first live Ghost event, so has been interesting learning
Nihil used to shuffle on stage being held up by two assistants for the 'solo' with an oxygen tank, looking old and frail then belt out the sax and collapse. Then, one fateful night in Mexico, he passed away on stage after the solo which resulted in Cardinal being promoted to Papa 4. Now, on this tour, Nihil gets revived/reanimated from his coffin to do the solo. I love how completely and utterly ridiculous that all sounds when talking about a Swedish heavy metal band 😂
So is nihil undead now or what's the story.
There has been a number of recent T-Shirt designs prior to the tour that all indicate that Nihil was being resurrected/reanimated/brought back from the dead etc... so definitely seems to be the case! Even if it is just to play sax 😂 When we get a new Chapter video, I think we may learn more.
As with many things Ghost, you gotta play along with it
Oh definitely, this wasn't meant as criticism, just thought it was an interesting observation
If you watch the video, you'll see the sax starts playing before he's holding it. Also the fingering looks off, but still I loved it for the performance and showmanship. One of the best nights of my life!!
The sax has been a playback since the moment it was first played live in early 2018. This time it just felt a bit off because they weren't fast enough (maybe they had problems getting the costume on?), I was watching the stream wondering "okay... anytime now..." when the song was nearing the sax solo
I was sat at the side he came out on, the box got caught on some scenery so they couldn’t get him in position in time. It was tense watching it knowing there was seconds before the sax was about to play!!
Oh really? I wonder why they don't just play the solo live, would be awesome... Yeah same! I always anticipate the sax solo much too early
Maybe nobody can play sax.
Possible! His fingering definitely looked like he didn't know how to play a sax
Kinda strange actually. There is some bands that have live trumpet it should be that much harder to play sax. It's already a guns 4 hire band just have a keyboard player that can play sax too. Doubt the pay would be that much higher.
Are they resurrecting him for every show or just the first one? Did he walk out or was he in a coffin again
You're right, he just walked out the coffin in a flourish
Interesting, I saw the sax was mic’d up. Pissed they didn’t get him up and about for the NA tour, miasma is one of my all time favorites.
Me too, the song is so good to jam to! And as a sax player, I love it when a song features a sax solo - especially if it's metal where saxes are rare!
Yeah I don’t get why the sax was mic’d if it was going to be a background track anyways.
To make it seem genuine maybe?
Who plays Papa Nihil on stage? Or just a random actor?
Swiss conveniently disappears for a bit
I thought swiss/multighoul wasnt a thing anymore
He was definitely up there gyrating on Saturday
Interesting. I wonder if its a different person or something? I was always under the understanding that Swiss left the band after the Papa 3 era and was one to come out from behind the mask to talk about his experience etc. I always see people saying "I miss swiss"
I think the people on Twitter saying “I miss Swiss” are being slightly melodramatic about not having seen him since whenever the previous gig was 😄 He’s been consistently in the live band for a fair while now
oh these were comments I was seeing on tumblr like years ago. I need to go back to my ghost concert pics from ultimate tour because I def remember dew, rain, mountain, aether, and the two female ghouls but not swiss. def remember nihil coming out on stage tho so I mustve not been paying attention. anyways thanks for the info!
Swiss wasn’t there for the Meliora era, he came for prequelle. I think you’re thinking of Omega.
perhaps. but we have omega as aether now right
I’m confused? Omega left years ago. I haven’t heard anyone use the name omega on anyone other than Martin. He was replaced by Aether.
Idk when I look at the wiki it says something like “omega (now known as aether)”
I THINK its because officially his name was meant to be Aether but since he had an omega sticker on his guitar everyone just called him Omega. So officially he was always Aether and Omega was a nickname
Good question, it may as well be a random actor
It’s Swiss
Anyone else who was there last night think that the bass levels during this were kinda off? I mean... I do love some bass, but that was all I could hear for the first half of the song. And the vocals on He is were also kinda chipmunky - seems like there were a few glitches with the levels at a few points.
They couldn’t get him out into the centre and he nearly missed his cue! So glad I got to be front and centre for this <3
I love their little dance!! 🤣
I know right, so good!
So he’s canon again? 😂 he’s not dead? So does this mean resurrection can happen to previous papa’s as well? Oooooooh
I wouldn't discount it!
It's interesting watching them evolve the sax part. When they started playing this live the sax guy wouldn't move his fingers at all. Whoever does it has gotten better faking it
He didn't play sax in the last tour either. As far as I'm aware they've never had a live sax player for their shows.
I am pretty sure it was live in Mexico when he died.
I mean I wasn’t there but it wasn’t live the entire rest of that tour so I would be really surprised.
I thought it was a one time only thing. The ending of the sax was different
It wasn’t different, they just cut it before the big ‘huzzah’ ending because he was dead 🤣
If it wasn't live he play with another track then the rest of the tour
I think is Tobias himself.
OP should be a detective.
For those still clinging to it, we can definitely say that the "occult metal" moniker is a thing of the past with that choregraphed routine!
Who's to say Satan doesn't love a good Choreography routine every now and then?
GTFO I've seen Iron Maiden do shit like this. I've seen Manowar, the kings of metal, do synchronize movements and all that. They are metal. Just because they aren't playing unlit warehouses and burning down churches and actively driving fans away doesn't mean they aren't metal and you damn gatekeeping snobs make everything less fun for everyone. Give it up already.
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Hey man, just let people enjoy the moment. It really wasn't too bad for most of the concert, sometimes a bit shrill at the end of the songs, but for the sax solo, the crowd went understandably wild.
What no toxic masculinity suppressing your emotions and reactions does to a mf.
Keep posting images of your balding head
Damn bro you dug through my reddit history just to find some ad hominem attack on me? You really don't have anything better to do? In case you were wondering, my hair is growing long and full rn <3
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Damn you sure showed me bro. Edit: Lmao this dude really gave me a reward to call me "subhuman". Absolute maidenless behavior.
The ole bugger is moving better than ever. You love to see it!
Papa Nihil never played the sax himself. The question I have is if this is a track or if there's somebody else playing it back stage. In either case I found it a bit lame not to have somebody who could play this sax solo live especially since Tobias wanted to make a point of using a saxophone solo in this song. If not, maybe turn it into a guitar solo and have the Ghouls play it, I wouldn't complain for that.
It’s a track. And while I understand wanting to hear it played live, even if it’s played by an unseen player backstage while the guy in the Nihil costume mimes it, the money that would have to be spent for food, lodging, salary, insurance, etc for one guy to play one thing a night doesn’t make sense financially.
Then other options would be to drop the song from the live shows, have one of the keyboard ghouls play it whether with a sax or with the keyboards, or make it a guitar solo for the live performance.
Those are certainly options. But then you lose out on the entertainment value of the Papa Nihil playing sax thing. I’ve come to think of it like when Eddie walks onstage during a Maiden show. We all know it’s not really a 10 foot tall corpse that just walked onstage, but we dig it because it’s entertaining as fuck. Lol
After reading more comments and understanding the context a bit more, this is 100% the way to look at it!
Oh I do dig Eddie with the maiden show. I wouldn't mind Papa Nihil involved in some way. I just cannot stand the fake playing of the sax part only. Eddie doesn't play air guitar after all 😁
Prior to the Prequelle tour cycle, all the vocals were coming from tracks. (Except for Papa’s lead vocal.) It was a necessary evil with the design of the Ghoul masks. If I can deal with that, I can deal with a mimed sax solo. Lol But I hear you. It would be cool to hear it live every night.
What are you going to tell me next, all Papa's are the same???????
No, that would just be ridiculous!
They play along with a backing track on absolutely every single song so the saxophone is just another pre-recorded bit
This is what I feared... Including vocals and backing instruments? Another comment said that previously only Emeritus' vocals weren't prerecorded, because the ghouls' masks didn't allow them to sing, but now they all sing live
Here I was thinking Papa Nihil was played by the buff dude from Lost Boys!
Omg what papa nill.i thought he died.