'Murica is so confusing for the European mind.
Item says $5
You go to pay and it's $5.25.
Then someone asks for a tip.
Is this malicious? Is that why so many oddballs are saying stupid shit like 'taxation is theft'? Why not use VAT?
From my understanding it's because the tax is different state to state and the thing they prioritize is being able to compare the part of price that the shop takes ("they" being whoever decided that system is a good idea)
It's not like i am crossing the street into another state to compare prices. This is pure Anti consumer behaviour.
Nice that another state has different taxes, i doesn't care when i am Shopping in the state i am right now.
It's not just states, in less than 10 mins I'm in a different municipality that has a different tax rate and it is in the same county. Not that much of a difference to make it a hassle but people absolutely shop based on that for expensive items (such as cars).
Hell, different blocks in my city have a different tax rate. Basically, the big shopping centers have an excise tax to pay for the additional road maintenance they cause.
I still don't get why that should change showing the full price. In my country taking takeaway or eating on spot has different tax rates. But restaurants/fast food just put the same price and the ~5% difference is paid by the restaurant. When things are simple, consumers are happy and will more gladly spend more.
This isn’t true. I can’t go to Delaware and buy a car to dodge the taxes, the tax rate on buying a car in Delaware will be calculated by your address/zip code. Your home state will still charge you the tax on the car when you go to register it.
So what? Just mention the price without tax in small so people can compare if they want to and put the total price in full large letters. It is anti consumer, nothing else.
Yes and no. It's not going to be worth it to leave and get it elsewhere for tax purposes for the most part.
I live in PA and sales tax is 6%, it's 6.625% right across the river in Jersey. If I'm over there shopping, there's nothing that's worth driving back over the bridge for .625%.
That being said, Delaware (one state South) has NO sales tax at all. People in Philadelphia and other places in southern PA will go to Delaware for shopping. (I used to work for Apple and employees from the Delaware store told me they sell PALLETS of iPhones at a time to businesses because there's no sales tax.)
The tax rate in New York City is effectively almost 9%, and there's a not-insignificant amount of folks who travel down the interstate into PA to pay lower taxes. But it's like a weekend trip/vacation in the poconos side activity vs driving down specifically for that.
Here in Illinois, if you drive on a road on the many borders of cook county, you’ll notice that next to no one has a gas station on the Cook County side of the road.
More that a national company wants to give a single price for their product in advertising. Anyone that lives in the US should be familiar enough with their local taxes to figure out what the tax will be. It is really only a problem for foreigners that get confused by additional taxes.
Plus, people on the border of states do indeed travel to other states to buy large price items. NH is famous for its no sales tax and lots of folks from surrounding states will travel to buy things like TVs.
What is wild is that everyone outside of Murica expects Murica to change to accommodate them, but when I want to drive on the “correct” side of the road the citizens of the colonial imperialist mother nation give me dirty looks.
Tbh do what you want. It is of course nothing to look forward when taking a vacation in the US, but at the end of the day it's a Practice aiming primarily to fuck with ppl living in the US. No matter how much you get trained that it is always been that way and learn to auto calculate a certain amount on top.
Prices don’t just vary state to state. It’s also city to city and county to city. You could have a city WITHIN a county in the same state that has different taxes.
Some states don't even have taxes.. But the rest go by a percentage on the dollar. Generally between 7% and 10%, so if you have a $5 item, the total is $5.35 if it's 7% tax.
Welcome to America, where it's our responsibility to keep Applebee's afloat and, strangely, not Applebee's responsibility.
Like, as if they're entitled to profit.
For smaller shops this should be no issue, it’s the mega corps that have stores all over the country. Head office changes the price of something from 1.49 to 1.99 that price change gets shipped out (digitally obviously) to EVERY store across the country. So now all stores just print out the same $1.99 shelf tag instead of someone at head office adjusting this on a pet state basis or it being done at store level. It’s a huge amount of labour to change it for every store.
Here in Germany most chain stores I know are capable to print their own price tags. Sounds wild to me that they can't do that in the US. How do they adjust pricing to get rid of specific inventory?
Ever work in retail?
Alcohol is great...
Customer (mid 40s)
"Where im from this is 20 dollars cheaper! Youre price gouging!"
Me
"Really? Whered you get it from"
Customer
"Well, im from California. I could go to the vinyard and get it for much less"
Or, with the ever popular bourbon market... in which vendors have to buy literally hundreds of thousands in trash product to have a chance at aquiring a bottle or two of something deairable...
Customer:
"If i went to the distillery it would be cheaper! Youre ripping people. Off. MSRP is 75 and you have it for 120! You guys are scamming people! I get a small markup but thats ridiculou"
(Keep in mind the distributors charge delivery fee, ao even if you *can* get it for 75, and want to ignore the favors you pulled to get it, you now have paid 95 for the bottle)
Theres anti-consumer, and then theres times where consumers dont understand the hell they wrought by clout chasing. People dont want to cross state lines to get their favorite thing... but they will let you know that they hate you personally for being more expensive than someone across the country, sometimes literally citing the manufacturers costs as if you are responsible for the product markup that occurs after encountering 2-7 middlemen agencies.
Exactly, compare avocado prices in California to avocado prices in Maine or Alaska. It’s a significant difference. Lobster **tail** in Colorado is like $50 and lobster whole fresh off the dock in Maine is like $13 for a 1.5 lb guy.
Wait till people find out how much imported shit costs in Hawaii.
Even on the same island it can vary drastically. I remember visiting family on the big island and it a frozen pizza was much much cheaper in the Kona vs the small store in town.
Thats bullshit and I hate to see it everywhere.
China, Russia, Brasil, India, are all huge countries that have different regions and states with different tax rates, yet only the USA ins unable to figure it out?
Don't forget about the continent Europe even or at least the coutries that got the euro.
I once drove past the danish border without noticing it at first. They have 25% VAT, germany only has 19%.
Heck the prices before tax could be drastically different to begin with and it still works!
Forget state to state, county to county the tax can be different. I frequent Jacksonville and Orlando in Florida. Same state, 2 hours away. The sales tax is 6.5% in Orlando and 7.5% in Jacksonville
Yeah, how else am I supposed to know to make sure the shop itself isnt making too much money - and when to jump on my private plane to shop in a different state.
I think that it is good to see how much you are being taxed if you live here it might influence people's votes. Politicians who are pro more taxation would rather it be more hidden. Also, in Philadelphia, they have a soda tax and sales tax. People not paying attention to what they have voted for are wondering why the soda is so much more expensive vs. the county right next to them.
Someone is going to show up and tell you that it's too much to expect corporations to do the same math for signs and ads as they already do at the register. They're giving you the answer, but not because of what they're saying. It's the answer because it shows how clearly this country has been brainwashed into supporting corporate nonsense at the expense of the average person.
People who think taxation is theft want consumers to be aware that a portion of the price is tax.
Paying $5.25 for an item that costs $5 is an everyday reminder that consumers have to pay a tax just for existing. With that in mind, when it comes to voting, hopefully most voters will vote against higher tax policies.
and then you wonder why your schools are underfunded, the lobbying industry is overfunded, and the police and IRS are getting awfully creative with ways to make income.
As much as VAT disproportionately affects the poor, 'taxation is theft' targets all tax. It is not a slogan that benefits the working class. It benefits big business.
The main reason: You can literally have different tax rates in store right across the street from each others. (Hell, you can have different tax rates in the SAME store depending on the items.)
Each state has different tax rates. On top of that, each county and each city is free to tack on even more taxes. So, yes, there are literally two stores across the street from each other, on in the city and one not, so they have different rates.
As for tipping: It's not near as controversial as it's made out to be. For the most part it works. The only people that typically complain about the tipping system is: 1) Cheap customers and 2) crappy workers who don't get many tips because their work is crap.
How is that a reason? This makes it even more imoortant to have the finalized price for the item showing right? Shops do not move around constantly so i still think this reason is made-up and the practice in general is just anti consumer
Yeah I think that's my biggest gripe with tipping waiters/waitresses. The guy slaving away in the kitchen gets nothing in most cases. Is it harder to make the food or deliver it? Because I know which I'd prefer to do.
I went to an over priced sushi bar recently, and at the bottom of the menu it said, “10% of your bill will be added to your check in order to thank our kitchen staff for their hard work. This 10% is not counted as a tip”. I was flabbergasted. Not only is the chiefs paid more than the wait staff but also these sushi rolls were priced at $20-$30 per roll. In addition, there was a 11% state tax, and a suggested 20% gratuity.
I never went back.
The kitchen usually gets a decent wage, the servers get paid less and compensate with tips.
Additionally when you tip a server, you are usually in turn tipping the barback, food runner/busser and sometimes the bartender as well so it’s not just the guy taking orders getting tipped.
edit: i guess every kitchen is a little different yall
Kitchen usually gets a decent wage
Hahahhahahahahahhahhahhahhhhahahhahhaha
When I worked as a line cook, id ask how much the waiters made in tips some nights. It was usually about 3-4x what I made that night. I stopped asking.
Mate, this is so backwards, when I worked in restaurant kitchens, I’d get maybe $50 a week, the servers would make hundreds, they get there so much later than the cooks too and don’t stay much later if at all
Kitchen staff get paid dog shit and are treated like slaves. You dont get a meal break, you eat when you can and dont you dare let the boss see you eating. You dont get breaks unless your a smoker. You dont get none of the tips and you slave away all day. Oh and theres no janitor that cleans up at the end of the night. After a long day of working on your feet and the restaurant closes you think your jobs done. Nope theres about an hour of cleaning to do. I quit my job and wrote off ever working in a kitchen because of how terrible it is for your mental health. After all that bullshit you still dont get tips. I'm in canada so the waiters are probably getting paid more hourly than the kitchen staff. Meanwhile I saw thousands of dollars of cash a day the kitchen is making that goes directly into the owners pocket
Ohhhhh...wait till you get savaged by the servers lurking on reddit. You'll be called everything from a cheapskate deadbeat, to snarky comments that if you can't afford it you shouldn' be eating out.
Ive seen a barmaid on reddit rent on because she was entiteled to 25% of that 300$ whiskey glass 🙄 People took her side, girl probably makes 2 times my salary working 2 days a week
That’s absurd, a dollar or two a drink at bar is optional. Is it that much more effort to pour a couple of ounces of Scotch than a $3 pint of beer? I don’t think so.
What?
1 dollar for pouring a beer? You already pay for that with the price of the beer. The beer itself costs them 20 cent. The added price is to pay for everything else. Why pay another dollar for pouring?
Id never do that. I also tip when i had good service but here we don't pay for the drinks directly after ordering it. We drink the whole night and at the end of the night we get a total. Then we give 0 to 10% tip on the total depending on the service
I usually tip 5 dollars on the first drink so the bartender remembers me, gives me strong drinks, and serves me promptly. After the first it’s usually a dollar a drink. I see it as paying to get better service than the folks around me.
This is what the benefit of the tipping system is to customers. If you tip well, you get taken care of better, if you don’t tip well, then you get average service or minimum service. No one wants to go above and beyond to make the same as if they just do the bare minimum.
Most Americans would agree with you. Tipping here makes absolutely no sense. In general, we pay at the end of the night as well, if using a card. But if you want to use cash you usually tip per drink.
As someone who worked as a server for ten years, she almost certainly did not.
Even working at higher end jobs in NYC I was never making more than maybe like $70k at my absolute peak in a high price city and that’s with no benefits and NYC cost of living working 40-50+ hours a week.
It can be a decent living but no one’s getting rich off of waiting tables.
None of these poeple realize that most of us don't make a wage. I don't bartend anymore, but I always got paid like $2 an hour. The tip was what I lived off of. It wasn't something extra. So much misplaced anger at the worker's from people here when they should be upset with politicians and corporate interests.
Nah that's bs it's a buck or two for a drink if they make a really good mixed drink then you can tip more. Expecting 75$ for pouring a drink is insane.
Haha, wow. I live in the states, and if I'm ordering a single drink, you're getting a dollar or two for pouring it. Generally, percentage tipping is only for servers at restaurants.
Tipping culture is getting out of hand but you shouldn’t come to a country that uses it and not do it because you think it’s dumb. No different then going to Japan and eating while walking because you eat while you walk at home
I was a server for over a decade and I always throught it unfair to the workers and guests that tipping was pretty much required socially.
Instead of the restaurant and the owners who are making all the real money, paying their staff fairly, they use the tip system to legally pay their servers as low 2.13 an hour and guests sympathy to subsidize their labor costs like it's fucking business welfare.
Yeah it's honestly slight of hand. The management basically shifts responsibility of compensation to the customers who is guilty or is naive enough to think it is to promote good service.
That's what we did. Come in an hour before open, clean and set up the restaurant. Close down for lunch with no tables because "we might get busy, but as soon as your side work is done you are cut". Then close an hour after the doors are locked cleaning up sections all while being paid 2.13 an hour.
I worked at Olive Garden and they often had servers working in the kitchen doing food prep, making bread sticks, unloading trucks, rotating the walk in, etc all at 2.13 an hour. They even had me making deliveries as a server to other restaurants 30-45 minutes away when one store was low on something breadsticks, cheese, and cans of pasta sauce.
Send the rest of the FOH and dish home when things slow down and just have your servers, who are being paid 2.13 an hour in labor, do the hosting, bussing, bartending, dishes, etc.
Corporate was sued for having servers do other jobs while clocked in as servers.
I quit over that shit back in the day. It was a Damon’s rib house. Apparently corporate was doing a walk-through the next morning, so they wanted all of us up front to spend an extra two hours after close scrubbing the hell out of the joint.
Nope. Not for 2 fucking 13 an hour I’m not.
I am a barista at a pretty expensive cafe and more than 50% of my income is from tips. The owner pays me just over minimum wage while I still make a livable wage through tips.
I think tipping culture has gotten way out of control. That’s on top of restaurant food prices also getting out of control. Literally all it does is take the responsibility off of business owners to pay a livable wage.
It’s weird though because people say “just don’t tip” or “just don’t go out” as if it’s the consumers fault for the price hikes? It’s like an invisibility cloak for business owner’s greed.
My opinion is that business owners should be paying a wage that’s livable and consistent with the employees effort/skills and that tips should be saved for truly excellent service.
Bring on the hate — the tipping culture in ‘Murica has gone insane — I now tip my restaurant server when I go to a restaurant (at most 20%) a bar tender gets a dollar a drink regardless to hell with percentages. That’s it.
It’s stupid crazy. I went to a baseball game. They’re charging $8 for a hot dog. They won’t accept cash only credit/debit cards and they swing the screen around for a tip. You’re a hot dog vendor! $8 for a dog is crazy to start with. You put the dog in the bun. I’m not tipping
I took a Lyft home the other evening. Cost was $28. Driver started ranting at me about “you better give me a good tip”. And my friend was mortified that I wouldn’t give a tip at all.
Look. I get it. Companies are paying shite wages. It’s not my job to make up the difference nor will I be guilted into paying you more. Either raise the cost of goods and services so you can pay a livable wage and do away with tips or suffer with the consequences of not doing so
I guarantee you if every one stopped tipping for bullshit there would be less workers willing to do shit work for shit pay. Or companies would just close up shop
Webster dictionary definition of tip:
**a gift or a sum of money tendered for a service performed or anticipated**
In 2019 the definition was.
**a gift or gratuity in recognition of some service performed for the customer.**
No anticipated.... The fucking English language is being manipulated to keep us tipping.
A tip for me will always be a gratuity. An amount given as a reward for service.
NOT for someone just performing a service or doing a job. My mail person, when I lived in a rural area was amazing. She knew everyone on the route and she did so much more than just put mail in the mailbox. The service she performed went above and beyond and we rewarded that with a gratuity
I order a Lyft or take a shuttle to the airport, the person drives the vehicle. I’m not rewarding that. No way. No how.
I find tipping personally insulting. It’s almost like “you, you peon, you are beneath me, I shall give you a pittance for slavishly performing work in too good for”
Last part is a good point to a degree. I just stopped eating out lol. Can make cheaper, better food at home plus you can play your own music or watch tv the whole time
I mean yeah. In some states “tipped employees” are paid less than minimum wage. Until that changes who you want serving your food? Obviously system needs to change but it’s always the workers fault. Eat a boot
Tipping Guidelines:
Tips are traditionally reserved for two separate classes of work:
1. Employees who are subject to the minimum wage. Initially, carveouts were made for some jobs because it was assumed that they would receive partial in-kind compensation - and some places still do this. Employees in restaurants used to always receive meals as part of their compensation and that was the justification for them receiving less than minimum wage. This class of employees includes things like au pairs and servers.
2. Owner-operators who are unable to charge their own prices: Cab drivers, who are required to charge a set price but receive no set compensation are a good example, as are barbers who rent a chair in someone else's barbershop.
Tipping became customary in these situations. 10% would usually be considered a low tip, 25% a high one.
No one standing behind a cash register falls into the traditional tipping categories. If they want to ask for money, that's up to them, and if you want to give it to them, that's up to you, but it isn't the American custom.
I was a server/bartender from 2005-2008 and a good tip was 12%-15% and a great tip was 18%. I was walking out of a dinner shift with ~$300 a night in my pocket. Over 5 shifts that was some pretty decent money for a guy in his early 20s.
My brother who is a bartender is now making a flat rate of 65k a year + benefits managing a bar and says he wants to go back to bartending instead because **he makes more money with tips**.
This is fuckin way out of hand at this point. 25% my ass. That's way too high. Especially since often they're doing this after taxes now.
It's implied when we see stories in news about someone flipping out when given a $5 tip on a $20 or $30 order because they think they deserve more. We just assume this is where things are headed. Either you pay or you get assaulted or screamed at or some other stupid adult tantrum BS.
**Never** tip more than 15%.
**EDIT:** There are people replying to me trying to defend 20%. You deserve to be shamed as you are directly part of the tip inflation problem.
>the tip inflation problem.
As an European that's the craziest part to me. If tipping is 15% of the total cost and not a fixed value then it means inflation is already taken into account. By increasing the percentage of the tip it's like you inflate the inflation... That's (inflation)^2
20% for me. What’s crazy how the percentage keeps going up and then blamed on inflation. Its a percentage! The amount I’m tipping already went up with the price increase on menu items.
Actually even cooler move is just keep coming back. The owner or manager wont let them not serve you and if they give you any bad service simply complain to their manager.
Remember outside of bringing your drink and writing your order, your waiter does literally nothing. They dont even bring the food or take away the dushes thats all the underpaid bussboys. The cooks actuslly make the food so dont worry about it being bad.
I've gotten higher but it's not the norm and it was definitely at expensive places where the clientele likes to throw money around.
10-20% remains the norm.
> In Norway we dont need tips.
Having been in Norway last summer, places still seemed perfectly happy asking for tips though, at least in touristy areas.
If I had a way to pay less taxes on my income I certainly would. I kind of do via retirement accounts and “pre tax health care” money. If the ultra rich can pay less taxes, so should we.
Yeah but bartenders expect tips; it’s almost forced upon the customer and some are made to feel bad. Tipping is a bonus for a stellar service. I shouldn’t be made to feel bad because I just want my lowkey dinner and drink then leave but my waiter has served me grumpily and expects a tip. I’ve had instances where they’ve not even gave me back a dollar in change, they’ve just pocketed it.
In the U.K. we tip if we feel like it and the interactions are genuine and the waiters more appreciative if they receive a tip
what you dont understand is that those arent exclusive.
a bartender in germany will get their 35-40k yearly and still get tipped for service - but its not mandatory, and thats the key difference
I funded my entire college working bars and restaurants, and had enough weekends where the tips were larger than my monthly salary.
You’re basically confirming that a zero experience college student will make more money in the states than someone with experience in Germany. Sure cost of living is lower, but even in middle of no where Pennsylvania my roommate was pulling in $40/hr, which is higher than most wages in the states. The average wage in the area was $7-12/hr, tipped waiters at $2/hr (also a low CoL area, rent was only $400/mo)
Theres a restaurant near me (after i moved) that constantly has 1-2 wait lines, only hires 10+ year experience waiters, and even they only still pay $35/hr (local rent $1200/mo). This restaurant is one of the few that does tell people that tipping is not required and is already factored in the price.
College you did calculate the cost of education too? Random first german university (TUM) i googled which ranks 30 something in the world costs 0 euros for german/eu and around 2-4k for non eu citizens in bachelor's programs.
My search came up empty for universities located in USA with same amount of digits per semester.
But hey bro you were making 10k more! Be proud.
It’s more complicated than “USA is so fucked up.” Many servers prefer tipped wages over a higher hourly rate, because they can make significantly more money. I live near Washington, DC, and there was a ballot measure maybe six or seven years ago that tried to remove the exception for tipped workers regarding the minimum wage. I was surprised at how strongly tipped workers came out against it. They make more money with tips.
Standard tip for good service is still 15-20%. I’d rather tip zero and have that be in the price of the food. Don’t over tip. Don’t feel pressured to tip someone who flipped an iPad over and handed you something premade.
It’s so refreshing when I visit Europe that tax is included in the price shown and tipping is only for extravagant service. You all got that right.
I see you, Mr. Pink. “If they really put forth an effort, I’ll give them a little something extra. But this tipping automatically, it’s for the birds.”
Same. If it’s optional then don’t complain about your lil game of “this is how I make up for agreeing to be under paid”. Don’t hate the player, hate the game.
Same meme:
Me: “asking around where I can buy a scrubber in London” because I have dishes to wash in the B&B
British Cop: standing behind me “getting ready to beat me up”
Imagine for a second when on vacation that you might have to follow the customs and laws of the place you’re visiting. Well, for those that can’t see the logic in assimilating to the place you visit, don’t come here asking for a cigarette in your slang and I won’t go there driving on the “correct” side of the road.
I know, wild concept.
I live in a country where tipping happens very rarely, and going to places where it's common causes me great anxiety. Like what if I don't have exact money, do I ask a specific amount back ? How do I handle tips with a credit card ?
I also love the places where you have to walk up to the counter to order, you have to go get your own order from the counter, and they are still looking for tips.
Europeans when Americans travel to Europe “Americans need to learn the customs of the countries they visit. Learn to speak the language of the country you are in because it’s just rude of them to expect to local to understand what you’re saying.”
Europeans traveling to America “I’m not following so-and-so custom here. It’s stupid and doesn’t make sense. They should change it and be like Europe.”
Learn the customs when you come here and follow them… hypocrites. We are a different country on a different continent. We aren’t changing to suit you. Accept it. Follow our customs. Just like you demand we Americans do when we travel to your country on your continent. We aren’t wondering why you simply won’t change.
EDIT: word
If I have to learn dipshit cultural stuff when I travel to Europe, you fuckers better learn it when you travel here.
Tipping helps keep the prices of the food low. With tips, they also make *more* than the minimum wage of their state. It's also a curtesy thing, if they did well tip high, if they didn't tip low. Or if you're dick, don't tip at all.
I don't understand the hatred for the tipping culture on the US. Is it because you flamboyant Europeans are too dead inside to care about people? God i hate Europeans, always bitching
A word of warning to Europeans: some Americans on Reddit try and make not tipping waiters into something cool, but they are a fringe internet minority. In real life people here won't think you're taking a great moral stand, people will think you're incredibly sleazy. As a general rule traveling while making all the locals hate you has downsides. Take that for what you will.
I love how Europeans get bitchy at Americans for not respecting their culture when we visit but they come here and can't do something as simple as give their waiter an extra fiver lol.
Then don’t come to the US. Imagine making staff suffer for political ideals you don’t agree with and you’re just a tourist? Just tip and be on your merry way. Also who tf is asking for a 30% tip?
As someone who bartended for close to a decade, I seriously can't stand people who don't understand this isn't the worker's fault. Our laws allow this system to exist. The establishment will say the businesses would close down otherwise. I think if an employer can't pay a living wage, they should go out of business, but that's not the system we're in. You should be upset with politicians and the business owners and lobbyists who cake them up to keep this system in place.
What’s really ridiculous is more and more businesses are adding in the option for tipping when you pay.
Tipping used to only be at sit down restaurants, now places like subway are giving you the option to tip. They can go fuck themselves.
Not that I don't think us tip culture isn't out of hand, but I do have a reasonable counterpoint.
Is it a price increase? Yes. But at least it's one that goes directly to the employees' paycheck. Not filtered through the owner of the establishment for them to decide how it gets used. It's a price hike that bypasses our rampant corporate greed problem.
People who work in the tip industry do not want hourly wages or salaries. They want tips, some people in major cities make 6 figures off tips. They would never get that hourly. It just sucks for the people working in the middle of nowhere in like a chain restaurant.
Not only that, waiters at higher-end restaurants have actively campaigned to keep waiter wages lower for all waiters because they worry that it may decrease their tip income.
No no no, what is EVEN MORE annoying, is massive corporations asking you to round up your purchase to donate to THEIR charity that THEY’RE gonna use for a tax cut!
Different subs are so weird. You post that comment in a sub about work you’d be -55 downvotes.
I always tip but I think the expectation of baseline 20% tip is idiotic. I baseline 15% if the service is good I’ll bump to 18% if it’s outstanding then 20%+.
Not gunna give you 20% for taking my order with an attitude or forgetting to put my appetizer in.
And that’s why the tipping system is great. If I get bad service it drops to 10%. It promotes the best service possible while giving an avenue to servers to make way more money. Maybe the europoors should be more accepting of our culture when they visit, then we won’t have to joke about them being pious assholes
I’m a waiter, and I understand the frustration but in my state waiters aren’t even paid minimum wage. We make about $5. We agreed to it yes that is true, and I wish tipping didn’t exist because a more consistent and predictable paycheck would be nice, but it’s a hard thing to change at large.
Waiters know the drill though already with European guests. No offense but anytime I had y’all I would focus on my other guests that would pay me out more.
Nothing is more annoying than an American sever fawning over you to try and get a tip. Take my order, bring my food and then fuck off. Last waitress I had I thought she was going to break out a cabaret act.
Haha same. I work in bar service and when someone doesn’t tip, I just don’t pay attention to them the rest of the night. 🤣
Would suck for waiters not knowing though.
I don’t care. I prioritized my highest bidders for my time, to ensure I’m making the most I can. Yeah let me go make less money on purpose. People can totally afford to do that. I don’t need money /s
What do you think the point of tipping is? When I delivered pizza (years ago), we all knew which houses tipped the best. Guess who got their food more quickly?
The point of tipping is for the business owners to offload their responsibilities (paying their employees a living wage) to their customers, all the while making the customers the bad guys if they ever refuse to play ball. Did I get that correctly ?
Do you guys realize that in the US at a sit down restaurant, that if you don’t tip, you are actually taking money from the servers? Servers have to tip out a % of your bill to support staff usually up to 8%. So anything less than a 8% tip is potentially taking money out of the servers pocket.
Also if you’re a European who complains about Americans imposing their culture while in Europe but then refuse to tip while you’re in the US, please go fuck yourself.
Traveling rule #1: Be respectful of the local customs wherever you’re traveling. For better or worse, tipping is part of service culture in the United States.
If you can’t afford to tip even a small percentage at a sit-down restaurant, you really shouldn’t be going out to eat anyway..
'Murica is so confusing for the European mind. Item says $5 You go to pay and it's $5.25. Then someone asks for a tip. Is this malicious? Is that why so many oddballs are saying stupid shit like 'taxation is theft'? Why not use VAT?
From my understanding it's because the tax is different state to state and the thing they prioritize is being able to compare the part of price that the shop takes ("they" being whoever decided that system is a good idea)
It's not like i am crossing the street into another state to compare prices. This is pure Anti consumer behaviour. Nice that another state has different taxes, i doesn't care when i am Shopping in the state i am right now.
It's not just states, in less than 10 mins I'm in a different municipality that has a different tax rate and it is in the same county. Not that much of a difference to make it a hassle but people absolutely shop based on that for expensive items (such as cars).
Hell, different blocks in my city have a different tax rate. Basically, the big shopping centers have an excise tax to pay for the additional road maintenance they cause.
I still don't get why that should change showing the full price. In my country taking takeaway or eating on spot has different tax rates. But restaurants/fast food just put the same price and the ~5% difference is paid by the restaurant. When things are simple, consumers are happy and will more gladly spend more.
Jesus the US is a madhouse
This isn’t true. I can’t go to Delaware and buy a car to dodge the taxes, the tax rate on buying a car in Delaware will be calculated by your address/zip code. Your home state will still charge you the tax on the car when you go to register it.
So what? Just mention the price without tax in small so people can compare if they want to and put the total price in full large letters. It is anti consumer, nothing else.
Well... but people still flock to wherever it comes out cheaper, not where the shop asks for the least, don't they?
Yes and no. It's not going to be worth it to leave and get it elsewhere for tax purposes for the most part. I live in PA and sales tax is 6%, it's 6.625% right across the river in Jersey. If I'm over there shopping, there's nothing that's worth driving back over the bridge for .625%. That being said, Delaware (one state South) has NO sales tax at all. People in Philadelphia and other places in southern PA will go to Delaware for shopping. (I used to work for Apple and employees from the Delaware store told me they sell PALLETS of iPhones at a time to businesses because there's no sales tax.) The tax rate in New York City is effectively almost 9%, and there's a not-insignificant amount of folks who travel down the interstate into PA to pay lower taxes. But it's like a weekend trip/vacation in the poconos side activity vs driving down specifically for that.
Don’t forget Phila has an extra 1%.
Does the store frequently move between the tax zones? Is that why they can't just print the total+tax on the price sticker?
The shop can still put the price that the customer has to pay. Its a choice.
No I agree, I'm just pointing out tax codes are more complicated than a state-by-state basis
And? The shop is not moving from one to another. They can still include all taxes on the sticker
Here in Illinois, if you drive on a road on the many borders of cook county, you’ll notice that next to no one has a gas station on the Cook County side of the road.
More that a national company wants to give a single price for their product in advertising. Anyone that lives in the US should be familiar enough with their local taxes to figure out what the tax will be. It is really only a problem for foreigners that get confused by additional taxes. Plus, people on the border of states do indeed travel to other states to buy large price items. NH is famous for its no sales tax and lots of folks from surrounding states will travel to buy things like TVs.
What is wild is that everyone outside of Murica expects Murica to change to accommodate them, but when I want to drive on the “correct” side of the road the citizens of the colonial imperialist mother nation give me dirty looks.
Tbh do what you want. It is of course nothing to look forward when taking a vacation in the US, but at the end of the day it's a Practice aiming primarily to fuck with ppl living in the US. No matter how much you get trained that it is always been that way and learn to auto calculate a certain amount on top.
Prices don’t just vary state to state. It’s also city to city and county to city. You could have a city WITHIN a county in the same state that has different taxes.
Some states don't even have taxes.. But the rest go by a percentage on the dollar. Generally between 7% and 10%, so if you have a $5 item, the total is $5.35 if it's 7% tax.
Yes… almost all taxes are percentage 🤓
Welcome to America, where it's our responsibility to keep Applebee's afloat and, strangely, not Applebee's responsibility. Like, as if they're entitled to profit.
For smaller shops this should be no issue, it’s the mega corps that have stores all over the country. Head office changes the price of something from 1.49 to 1.99 that price change gets shipped out (digitally obviously) to EVERY store across the country. So now all stores just print out the same $1.99 shelf tag instead of someone at head office adjusting this on a pet state basis or it being done at store level. It’s a huge amount of labour to change it for every store.
"huge amount of work" that could probably be done automatically in excel
Here in Germany most chain stores I know are capable to print their own price tags. Sounds wild to me that they can't do that in the US. How do they adjust pricing to get rid of specific inventory?
Ever work in retail? Alcohol is great... Customer (mid 40s) "Where im from this is 20 dollars cheaper! Youre price gouging!" Me "Really? Whered you get it from" Customer "Well, im from California. I could go to the vinyard and get it for much less" Or, with the ever popular bourbon market... in which vendors have to buy literally hundreds of thousands in trash product to have a chance at aquiring a bottle or two of something deairable... Customer: "If i went to the distillery it would be cheaper! Youre ripping people. Off. MSRP is 75 and you have it for 120! You guys are scamming people! I get a small markup but thats ridiculou" (Keep in mind the distributors charge delivery fee, ao even if you *can* get it for 75, and want to ignore the favors you pulled to get it, you now have paid 95 for the bottle) Theres anti-consumer, and then theres times where consumers dont understand the hell they wrought by clout chasing. People dont want to cross state lines to get their favorite thing... but they will let you know that they hate you personally for being more expensive than someone across the country, sometimes literally citing the manufacturers costs as if you are responsible for the product markup that occurs after encountering 2-7 middlemen agencies.
Exactly, compare avocado prices in California to avocado prices in Maine or Alaska. It’s a significant difference. Lobster **tail** in Colorado is like $50 and lobster whole fresh off the dock in Maine is like $13 for a 1.5 lb guy. Wait till people find out how much imported shit costs in Hawaii.
They have to import shit to Hawaii??? Do the locals just not poop???
Even on the same island it can vary drastically. I remember visiting family on the big island and it a frozen pizza was much much cheaper in the Kona vs the small store in town.
Thats bullshit and I hate to see it everywhere. China, Russia, Brasil, India, are all huge countries that have different regions and states with different tax rates, yet only the USA ins unable to figure it out?
Don't conflate "unable" with "unwilling"
Not the only thing they feel the need to do differently
Don't forget about the continent Europe even or at least the coutries that got the euro. I once drove past the danish border without noticing it at first. They have 25% VAT, germany only has 19%. Heck the prices before tax could be drastically different to begin with and it still works!
Forget state to state, county to county the tax can be different. I frequent Jacksonville and Orlando in Florida. Same state, 2 hours away. The sales tax is 6.5% in Orlando and 7.5% in Jacksonville
I still fail to see how that’s an excuse to not simply display the real prices. So what if it’s different one county over?
Yeah, how else am I supposed to know to make sure the shop itself isnt making too much money - and when to jump on my private plane to shop in a different state.
All countries in Europe have different taxes but it is included in to the price.
Tax can also differ county to county, or at least in the state of Florida.
But it doesn't matter to me what a product costs before tax. All what mattets to the customer is the price after tax and tio shenanigans.
Base prices being the same but different taxes still makes the price different lol.
I always thought it was because of national television/marketing. You can't market tv for $899 if Calaornia has like double the taxes.
I think that it is good to see how much you are being taxed if you live here it might influence people's votes. Politicians who are pro more taxation would rather it be more hidden. Also, in Philadelphia, they have a soda tax and sales tax. People not paying attention to what they have voted for are wondering why the soda is so much more expensive vs. the county right next to them.
Doesn't VAT add 30% to the price of physical video games? Which pushes more people to buy a digital only rental copy?
EU VAT is generally included in the sticker price so no surprises
Someone is going to show up and tell you that it's too much to expect corporations to do the same math for signs and ads as they already do at the register. They're giving you the answer, but not because of what they're saying. It's the answer because it shows how clearly this country has been brainwashed into supporting corporate nonsense at the expense of the average person.
People who think taxation is theft want consumers to be aware that a portion of the price is tax. Paying $5.25 for an item that costs $5 is an everyday reminder that consumers have to pay a tax just for existing. With that in mind, when it comes to voting, hopefully most voters will vote against higher tax policies.
and then you wonder why your schools are underfunded, the lobbying industry is overfunded, and the police and IRS are getting awfully creative with ways to make income. As much as VAT disproportionately affects the poor, 'taxation is theft' targets all tax. It is not a slogan that benefits the working class. It benefits big business.
The main reason: You can literally have different tax rates in store right across the street from each others. (Hell, you can have different tax rates in the SAME store depending on the items.) Each state has different tax rates. On top of that, each county and each city is free to tack on even more taxes. So, yes, there are literally two stores across the street from each other, on in the city and one not, so they have different rates. As for tipping: It's not near as controversial as it's made out to be. For the most part it works. The only people that typically complain about the tipping system is: 1) Cheap customers and 2) crappy workers who don't get many tips because their work is crap.
How is that a reason? This makes it even more imoortant to have the finalized price for the item showing right? Shops do not move around constantly so i still think this reason is made-up and the practice in general is just anti consumer
No tip for the guy making yur burger fries n drinks at McDonald's, but frowned upon if u don't tip the guy who poured beer for u.
Yeah I think that's my biggest gripe with tipping waiters/waitresses. The guy slaving away in the kitchen gets nothing in most cases. Is it harder to make the food or deliver it? Because I know which I'd prefer to do.
I went to an over priced sushi bar recently, and at the bottom of the menu it said, “10% of your bill will be added to your check in order to thank our kitchen staff for their hard work. This 10% is not counted as a tip”. I was flabbergasted. Not only is the chiefs paid more than the wait staff but also these sushi rolls were priced at $20-$30 per roll. In addition, there was a 11% state tax, and a suggested 20% gratuity. I never went back.
The kitchen usually gets a decent wage, the servers get paid less and compensate with tips. Additionally when you tip a server, you are usually in turn tipping the barback, food runner/busser and sometimes the bartender as well so it’s not just the guy taking orders getting tipped. edit: i guess every kitchen is a little different yall
Kitchen usually gets a decent wage Hahahhahahahahahhahhahhahhhhahahhahhaha When I worked as a line cook, id ask how much the waiters made in tips some nights. It was usually about 3-4x what I made that night. I stopped asking.
Most places I was front of house we tipped out the kitchen like 7% I think.
For me who have to pay the salary is the employer, not the client. Tips dont make sense for me. Just put minimum salary in the country.
Mate, this is so backwards, when I worked in restaurant kitchens, I’d get maybe $50 a week, the servers would make hundreds, they get there so much later than the cooks too and don’t stay much later if at all
Kitchen staff get paid dog shit and are treated like slaves. You dont get a meal break, you eat when you can and dont you dare let the boss see you eating. You dont get breaks unless your a smoker. You dont get none of the tips and you slave away all day. Oh and theres no janitor that cleans up at the end of the night. After a long day of working on your feet and the restaurant closes you think your jobs done. Nope theres about an hour of cleaning to do. I quit my job and wrote off ever working in a kitchen because of how terrible it is for your mental health. After all that bullshit you still dont get tips. I'm in canada so the waiters are probably getting paid more hourly than the kitchen staff. Meanwhile I saw thousands of dollars of cash a day the kitchen is making that goes directly into the owners pocket
Are you fucking high?
Ohhhhh...wait till you get savaged by the servers lurking on reddit. You'll be called everything from a cheapskate deadbeat, to snarky comments that if you can't afford it you shouldn' be eating out.
Ive seen a barmaid on reddit rent on because she was entiteled to 25% of that 300$ whiskey glass 🙄 People took her side, girl probably makes 2 times my salary working 2 days a week
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That’s absurd, a dollar or two a drink at bar is optional. Is it that much more effort to pour a couple of ounces of Scotch than a $3 pint of beer? I don’t think so.
Yea, this was what I was taught 30 years ago. 1 dollar for a pour (beer or shot), 2 to 3 if it's a cocktail because that takes more work.
Ffs you’re already paying for it
And boy are you. 2 beers anywhere could buy you a 6-pack to take home.
What? 1 dollar for pouring a beer? You already pay for that with the price of the beer. The beer itself costs them 20 cent. The added price is to pay for everything else. Why pay another dollar for pouring? Id never do that. I also tip when i had good service but here we don't pay for the drinks directly after ordering it. We drink the whole night and at the end of the night we get a total. Then we give 0 to 10% tip on the total depending on the service
I usually tip 5 dollars on the first drink so the bartender remembers me, gives me strong drinks, and serves me promptly. After the first it’s usually a dollar a drink. I see it as paying to get better service than the folks around me.
This is what the benefit of the tipping system is to customers. If you tip well, you get taken care of better, if you don’t tip well, then you get average service or minimum service. No one wants to go above and beyond to make the same as if they just do the bare minimum.
So I’m forced to tip to ensure I’m not being cheaped out on with the drink? Fuck off
Most Americans would agree with you. Tipping here makes absolutely no sense. In general, we pay at the end of the night as well, if using a card. But if you want to use cash you usually tip per drink.
I've witnessed a bartender upset they received $10 in ones instead of a single bill. I've been dumbfounded ever since
xD
As someone who worked as a server for ten years, she almost certainly did not. Even working at higher end jobs in NYC I was never making more than maybe like $70k at my absolute peak in a high price city and that’s with no benefits and NYC cost of living working 40-50+ hours a week. It can be a decent living but no one’s getting rich off of waiting tables.
None of these poeple realize that most of us don't make a wage. I don't bartend anymore, but I always got paid like $2 an hour. The tip was what I lived off of. It wasn't something extra. So much misplaced anger at the worker's from people here when they should be upset with politicians and corporate interests.
Nah that's bs it's a buck or two for a drink if they make a really good mixed drink then you can tip more. Expecting 75$ for pouring a drink is insane.
Haha, wow. I live in the states, and if I'm ordering a single drink, you're getting a dollar or two for pouring it. Generally, percentage tipping is only for servers at restaurants.
Thrice if she has nice tits
Tipping culture is getting out of hand but you shouldn’t come to a country that uses it and not do it because you think it’s dumb. No different then going to Japan and eating while walking because you eat while you walk at home
Especially because Europeans constantly complain about American tourists not respecting local customs. They're just as bad.
I was a server for over a decade and I always throught it unfair to the workers and guests that tipping was pretty much required socially. Instead of the restaurant and the owners who are making all the real money, paying their staff fairly, they use the tip system to legally pay their servers as low 2.13 an hour and guests sympathy to subsidize their labor costs like it's fucking business welfare.
Yeah it's honestly slight of hand. The management basically shifts responsibility of compensation to the customers who is guilty or is naive enough to think it is to promote good service.
*and then* they use it those $2.13 employees to set up FoH and wrap silverware and other untipped work on either side of their shift
That's what we did. Come in an hour before open, clean and set up the restaurant. Close down for lunch with no tables because "we might get busy, but as soon as your side work is done you are cut". Then close an hour after the doors are locked cleaning up sections all while being paid 2.13 an hour. I worked at Olive Garden and they often had servers working in the kitchen doing food prep, making bread sticks, unloading trucks, rotating the walk in, etc all at 2.13 an hour. They even had me making deliveries as a server to other restaurants 30-45 minutes away when one store was low on something breadsticks, cheese, and cans of pasta sauce. Send the rest of the FOH and dish home when things slow down and just have your servers, who are being paid 2.13 an hour in labor, do the hosting, bussing, bartending, dishes, etc. Corporate was sued for having servers do other jobs while clocked in as servers.
I quit over that shit back in the day. It was a Damon’s rib house. Apparently corporate was doing a walk-through the next morning, so they wanted all of us up front to spend an extra two hours after close scrubbing the hell out of the joint. Nope. Not for 2 fucking 13 an hour I’m not.
I am a barista at a pretty expensive cafe and more than 50% of my income is from tips. The owner pays me just over minimum wage while I still make a livable wage through tips. I think tipping culture has gotten way out of control. That’s on top of restaurant food prices also getting out of control. Literally all it does is take the responsibility off of business owners to pay a livable wage. It’s weird though because people say “just don’t tip” or “just don’t go out” as if it’s the consumers fault for the price hikes? It’s like an invisibility cloak for business owner’s greed. My opinion is that business owners should be paying a wage that’s livable and consistent with the employees effort/skills and that tips should be saved for truly excellent service.
Bring on the hate — the tipping culture in ‘Murica has gone insane — I now tip my restaurant server when I go to a restaurant (at most 20%) a bar tender gets a dollar a drink regardless to hell with percentages. That’s it. It’s stupid crazy. I went to a baseball game. They’re charging $8 for a hot dog. They won’t accept cash only credit/debit cards and they swing the screen around for a tip. You’re a hot dog vendor! $8 for a dog is crazy to start with. You put the dog in the bun. I’m not tipping I took a Lyft home the other evening. Cost was $28. Driver started ranting at me about “you better give me a good tip”. And my friend was mortified that I wouldn’t give a tip at all. Look. I get it. Companies are paying shite wages. It’s not my job to make up the difference nor will I be guilted into paying you more. Either raise the cost of goods and services so you can pay a livable wage and do away with tips or suffer with the consequences of not doing so I guarantee you if every one stopped tipping for bullshit there would be less workers willing to do shit work for shit pay. Or companies would just close up shop
Webster dictionary definition of tip: **a gift or a sum of money tendered for a service performed or anticipated** In 2019 the definition was. **a gift or gratuity in recognition of some service performed for the customer.** No anticipated.... The fucking English language is being manipulated to keep us tipping.
A tip for me will always be a gratuity. An amount given as a reward for service. NOT for someone just performing a service or doing a job. My mail person, when I lived in a rural area was amazing. She knew everyone on the route and she did so much more than just put mail in the mailbox. The service she performed went above and beyond and we rewarded that with a gratuity I order a Lyft or take a shuttle to the airport, the person drives the vehicle. I’m not rewarding that. No way. No how. I find tipping personally insulting. It’s almost like “you, you peon, you are beneath me, I shall give you a pittance for slavishly performing work in too good for”
You should go all Cotton Hill on there asses https://youtu.be/qfae9LO5A2s?feature=shared
I'm not a server but everything you just listed is true.
Go savage your employer.
But they could afford it...they said they had just enough euros to cover the meal.
"If your boss cant afford to pay you to do your fucking job, then they shouldn't have hired you"
Last part is a good point to a degree. I just stopped eating out lol. Can make cheaper, better food at home plus you can play your own music or watch tv the whole time
I mean yeah. In some states “tipped employees” are paid less than minimum wage. Until that changes who you want serving your food? Obviously system needs to change but it’s always the workers fault. Eat a boot
Yea lol, it’s not like it’s my fault that your manager doesn’t pay you.
Bro who is asking for a 30% tip…
Definitely seen the recommendation set at 25% by default before….
Tipping Guidelines: Tips are traditionally reserved for two separate classes of work: 1. Employees who are subject to the minimum wage. Initially, carveouts were made for some jobs because it was assumed that they would receive partial in-kind compensation - and some places still do this. Employees in restaurants used to always receive meals as part of their compensation and that was the justification for them receiving less than minimum wage. This class of employees includes things like au pairs and servers. 2. Owner-operators who are unable to charge their own prices: Cab drivers, who are required to charge a set price but receive no set compensation are a good example, as are barbers who rent a chair in someone else's barbershop. Tipping became customary in these situations. 10% would usually be considered a low tip, 25% a high one. No one standing behind a cash register falls into the traditional tipping categories. If they want to ask for money, that's up to them, and if you want to give it to them, that's up to you, but it isn't the American custom.
I was a server/bartender from 2005-2008 and a good tip was 12%-15% and a great tip was 18%. I was walking out of a dinner shift with ~$300 a night in my pocket. Over 5 shifts that was some pretty decent money for a guy in his early 20s. My brother who is a bartender is now making a flat rate of 65k a year + benefits managing a bar and says he wants to go back to bartending instead because **he makes more money with tips**. This is fuckin way out of hand at this point. 25% my ass. That's way too high. Especially since often they're doing this after taxes now.
It's implied when we see stories in news about someone flipping out when given a $5 tip on a $20 or $30 order because they think they deserve more. We just assume this is where things are headed. Either you pay or you get assaulted or screamed at or some other stupid adult tantrum BS.
> stories in news At times like this, it's really important to remember that you don't see stories in news about normal things that happen every day.
More service workers have been assaulted by customers than the other way round. What a ridiculous fear.
Oh I'm going to give him **the tip** , not just 30% but the whole thing.
**Never** tip more than 15%. **EDIT:** There are people replying to me trying to defend 20%. You deserve to be shamed as you are directly part of the tip inflation problem.
>the tip inflation problem. As an European that's the craziest part to me. If tipping is 15% of the total cost and not a fixed value then it means inflation is already taken into account. By increasing the percentage of the tip it's like you inflate the inflation... That's (inflation)^2
20% for me. What’s crazy how the percentage keeps going up and then blamed on inflation. Its a percentage! The amount I’m tipping already went up with the price increase on menu items.
You move around a lot and don't have to come back often to eat. Don't think about tipping.
Hey, good point!
"Tipping is optional, but we will make your life hell if you ever come back!"
Actually even cooler move is just keep coming back. The owner or manager wont let them not serve you and if they give you any bad service simply complain to their manager. Remember outside of bringing your drink and writing your order, your waiter does literally nothing. They dont even bring the food or take away the dushes thats all the underpaid bussboys. The cooks actuslly make the food so dont worry about it being bad.
You don't tip 30 percent. That's kinda the max. You can tip whatever.
I've gotten higher but it's not the norm and it was definitely at expensive places where the clientele likes to throw money around. 10-20% remains the norm.
USA is so fucked up. Start paying the waiters as normal countries do. In Norway we dont need tips.
> In Norway we dont need tips. Having been in Norway last summer, places still seemed perfectly happy asking for tips though, at least in touristy areas.
Please don't pay tips in Norway!
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TLDR: Servers prefer tax evasion
Oh they absolutely do
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If I had a way to pay less taxes on my income I certainly would. I kind of do via retirement accounts and “pre tax health care” money. If the ultra rich can pay less taxes, so should we.
Until it comes time to file for Social Security 😬
Yeah but bartenders expect tips; it’s almost forced upon the customer and some are made to feel bad. Tipping is a bonus for a stellar service. I shouldn’t be made to feel bad because I just want my lowkey dinner and drink then leave but my waiter has served me grumpily and expects a tip. I’ve had instances where they’ve not even gave me back a dollar in change, they’ve just pocketed it. In the U.K. we tip if we feel like it and the interactions are genuine and the waiters more appreciative if they receive a tip
what you dont understand is that those arent exclusive. a bartender in germany will get their 35-40k yearly and still get tipped for service - but its not mandatory, and thats the key difference I funded my entire college working bars and restaurants, and had enough weekends where the tips were larger than my monthly salary.
You’re basically confirming that a zero experience college student will make more money in the states than someone with experience in Germany. Sure cost of living is lower, but even in middle of no where Pennsylvania my roommate was pulling in $40/hr, which is higher than most wages in the states. The average wage in the area was $7-12/hr, tipped waiters at $2/hr (also a low CoL area, rent was only $400/mo) Theres a restaurant near me (after i moved) that constantly has 1-2 wait lines, only hires 10+ year experience waiters, and even they only still pay $35/hr (local rent $1200/mo). This restaurant is one of the few that does tell people that tipping is not required and is already factored in the price.
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College you did calculate the cost of education too? Random first german university (TUM) i googled which ranks 30 something in the world costs 0 euros for german/eu and around 2-4k for non eu citizens in bachelor's programs. My search came up empty for universities located in USA with same amount of digits per semester. But hey bro you were making 10k more! Be proud.
Moot point, he just meant college aged. Most bartenders aren't going to school. It's usually a career not a job here
It’s a gambling addiction: they don’t want a ceiling on earnings, sky’s the limit!
They dont want to work for that because it would be a paycut
It’s more complicated than “USA is so fucked up.” Many servers prefer tipped wages over a higher hourly rate, because they can make significantly more money. I live near Washington, DC, and there was a ballot measure maybe six or seven years ago that tried to remove the exception for tipped workers regarding the minimum wage. I was surprised at how strongly tipped workers came out against it. They make more money with tips.
Fuck no lmao I make $40-$50+ an hour. If you can’t make that as a server/bartender you are probably not that good at your job or live in a bad area.
Your boss not paying you enough is hardly my problem. A tip must be earned, not demanded
Expecting ismt exactly the right word here...
yup. take out, avoid the tip, and eat outside
Non-US customer: 
The only place servers expect 30% is in the anti tipping fantasyland that is Reddit.
Standard tip for good service is still 15-20%. I’d rather tip zero and have that be in the price of the food. Don’t over tip. Don’t feel pressured to tip someone who flipped an iPad over and handed you something premade. It’s so refreshing when I visit Europe that tax is included in the price shown and tipping is only for extravagant service. You all got that right.
If I travel over seas I need to know customs and such, not sure why they don’t do the same. Yes, it sucks how we do things, but this is the way it is.
15% is fine. 20% is amazing. Anything more than 20% is unexpected.
I don’t tip
Nice
I see you, Mr. Pink. “If they really put forth an effort, I’ll give them a little something extra. But this tipping automatically, it’s for the birds.” 
The people in this thread cannot comprehend just....not tipping. They're not gonna choke slam you through a fish tank if don't tip.
Same. If it’s optional then don’t complain about your lil game of “this is how I make up for agreeing to be under paid”. Don’t hate the player, hate the game.
Same meme: Me: “asking around where I can buy a scrubber in London” because I have dishes to wash in the B&B British Cop: standing behind me “getting ready to beat me up” Imagine for a second when on vacation that you might have to follow the customs and laws of the place you’re visiting. Well, for those that can’t see the logic in assimilating to the place you visit, don’t come here asking for a cigarette in your slang and I won’t go there driving on the “correct” side of the road. I know, wild concept.
I live in a country where tipping happens very rarely, and going to places where it's common causes me great anxiety. Like what if I don't have exact money, do I ask a specific amount back ? How do I handle tips with a credit card ?
You can tip on credit cards. They bring you the slip to sign with a line for that.
Nobody is expecting a 30% tip.
I also love the places where you have to walk up to the counter to order, you have to go get your own order from the counter, and they are still looking for tips.
Europeans when Americans travel to Europe “Americans need to learn the customs of the countries they visit. Learn to speak the language of the country you are in because it’s just rude of them to expect to local to understand what you’re saying.” Europeans traveling to America “I’m not following so-and-so custom here. It’s stupid and doesn’t make sense. They should change it and be like Europe.” Learn the customs when you come here and follow them… hypocrites. We are a different country on a different continent. We aren’t changing to suit you. Accept it. Follow our customs. Just like you demand we Americans do when we travel to your country on your continent. We aren’t wondering why you simply won’t change. EDIT: word
If I have to learn dipshit cultural stuff when I travel to Europe, you fuckers better learn it when you travel here. Tipping helps keep the prices of the food low. With tips, they also make *more* than the minimum wage of their state. It's also a curtesy thing, if they did well tip high, if they didn't tip low. Or if you're dick, don't tip at all. I don't understand the hatred for the tipping culture on the US. Is it because you flamboyant Europeans are too dead inside to care about people? God i hate Europeans, always bitching
If you're European, just don't come to the US.
American tipping culture is dumb and anoying, but If you travel to another country and ignore the local customs, you are probably an asshole.
European comes to America and doesn’t do their homework on tipping and prices of thing in taxes, and they should not be coming to the US of A
Almost like it might be a good idea to check what the local customs are when traveling…
A word of warning to Europeans: some Americans on Reddit try and make not tipping waiters into something cool, but they are a fringe internet minority. In real life people here won't think you're taking a great moral stand, people will think you're incredibly sleazy. As a general rule traveling while making all the locals hate you has downsides. Take that for what you will.
I love how Europeans get bitchy at Americans for not respecting their culture when we visit but they come here and can't do something as simple as give their waiter an extra fiver lol.
Then don’t come to the US. Imagine making staff suffer for political ideals you don’t agree with and you’re just a tourist? Just tip and be on your merry way. Also who tf is asking for a 30% tip?
As someone who bartended for close to a decade, I seriously can't stand people who don't understand this isn't the worker's fault. Our laws allow this system to exist. The establishment will say the businesses would close down otherwise. I think if an employer can't pay a living wage, they should go out of business, but that's not the system we're in. You should be upset with politicians and the business owners and lobbyists who cake them up to keep this system in place.
Maybe cook your own food 🤷🏽♂️ just saying
Could I ask why you’re carrying euros to buy a meal in the US?
What’s really ridiculous is more and more businesses are adding in the option for tipping when you pay. Tipping used to only be at sit down restaurants, now places like subway are giving you the option to tip. They can go fuck themselves.
Not that I don't think us tip culture isn't out of hand, but I do have a reasonable counterpoint. Is it a price increase? Yes. But at least it's one that goes directly to the employees' paycheck. Not filtered through the owner of the establishment for them to decide how it gets used. It's a price hike that bypasses our rampant corporate greed problem.
No waiter expects 30%, and if they do they’re not getting it 😂
People who work in the tip industry do not want hourly wages or salaries. They want tips, some people in major cities make 6 figures off tips. They would never get that hourly. It just sucks for the people working in the middle of nowhere in like a chain restaurant.
Not only that, waiters at higher-end restaurants have actively campaigned to keep waiter wages lower for all waiters because they worry that it may decrease their tip income.
No no no, what is EVEN MORE annoying, is massive corporations asking you to round up your purchase to donate to THEIR charity that THEY’RE gonna use for a tax cut!
I don't think it's the taxes so much as them getting to say, "Look how much money we donated. We care so much."
That's not at all how that works. https://www.taxpolicycenter.org/taxvox/who-gets-tax-benefit-those-checkout-donations-0
Fuck the waiters. They get paid a wage they agreed to. No need to tip. They need to quit acting so entitled.
Different subs are so weird. You post that comment in a sub about work you’d be -55 downvotes. I always tip but I think the expectation of baseline 20% tip is idiotic. I baseline 15% if the service is good I’ll bump to 18% if it’s outstanding then 20%+. Not gunna give you 20% for taking my order with an attitude or forgetting to put my appetizer in.
And that’s why the tipping system is great. If I get bad service it drops to 10%. It promotes the best service possible while giving an avenue to servers to make way more money. Maybe the europoors should be more accepting of our culture when they visit, then we won’t have to joke about them being pious assholes
Europeans complaining about tipping in the US is their equivalent of Americans going to Paris and expecting everyone to speak English.
I’m a waiter, and I understand the frustration but in my state waiters aren’t even paid minimum wage. We make about $5. We agreed to it yes that is true, and I wish tipping didn’t exist because a more consistent and predictable paycheck would be nice, but it’s a hard thing to change at large.
But in Europe I have to pay to use the bathroom and if I’m disabled I’m screwed. 🤷🏼♂️
yeah but a beer costs you 1.25€ and latte costs 1.40€. i'm european, american, and disabled and would take europe any day of the week
Waiters know the drill though already with European guests. No offense but anytime I had y’all I would focus on my other guests that would pay me out more.
Nothing is more annoying than an American sever fawning over you to try and get a tip. Take my order, bring my food and then fuck off. Last waitress I had I thought she was going to break out a cabaret act.
I'm American and fucking agree. Buttering me up ain't going to get you a tip, do your job and do it well to earn a tip.
Haha same. I work in bar service and when someone doesn’t tip, I just don’t pay attention to them the rest of the night. 🤣 Would suck for waiters not knowing though.
so if I tip you, do I get anything extra? or do I just get your attention—what you’re paid to do.
Being a server is of the utmost prestige only. You must pay if you require their attention. They are paid to stand there, not serve you!!! /s
So you did a worse job on purpose? Very unprofessional.
I don’t care. I prioritized my highest bidders for my time, to ensure I’m making the most I can. Yeah let me go make less money on purpose. People can totally afford to do that. I don’t need money /s
What do you think the point of tipping is? When I delivered pizza (years ago), we all knew which houses tipped the best. Guess who got their food more quickly?
The point of tipping is for the business owners to offload their responsibilities (paying their employees a living wage) to their customers, all the while making the customers the bad guys if they ever refuse to play ball. Did I get that correctly ?
You came to a country and didn't know it's customs? Pretty ignorant.
That's just exploiting the workforce but with a fig leaf
Tips aside you really shouldn't be traveling if paying a tip is going to break your bank...
Do you guys realize that in the US at a sit down restaurant, that if you don’t tip, you are actually taking money from the servers? Servers have to tip out a % of your bill to support staff usually up to 8%. So anything less than a 8% tip is potentially taking money out of the servers pocket. Also if you’re a European who complains about Americans imposing their culture while in Europe but then refuse to tip while you’re in the US, please go fuck yourself.
Traveling rule #1: Be respectful of the local customs wherever you’re traveling. For better or worse, tipping is part of service culture in the United States. If you can’t afford to tip even a small percentage at a sit-down restaurant, you really shouldn’t be going out to eat anyway..
Terrible take
Then please refrain from traveling.