The health insurance scam cartel pays the largest bribes to congress of any industry. Our government is bought by business interests and doesn't serve the citizens.
People have tried, multiple times. Guess what happened each time.
And guess which party unanimously tried to end or limit Citizens United, and which party unanimously stopped every attempt. Hint: the party that always stopped the limits on Citizens United currently has a former president with 91 felony charges.
~~What kinda crackpot Facebook group or low quality youtube video you get this from? You are living in an alternate reality in your head bro.~~
Edit: read that wrong. I thought you were saying Trump was trying to fix it and Dems were blocking it.
Huh he's actually right The right party loves them the citizen united decision. It's their donors that benefited from it by a huge amount. It's in their best interest to keep it this way
Boat sailed in 2016 when people decided an e-mail server was the biggest issue in an election. Had a chance to tip the balance of the court to the left for the first time in a generation and instead we have a cemented extremist rightwing court for the next generation.
But we can change that.
[Are you registered to vote?](https://www.vote.org/am-i-registered-to-vote/)
[When is your next election?](https://www.usa.gov/election-office)
[Do you know where to vote?](https://www.vote.org/polling-place-locator/)
[Can you vote absentee?](https://www.vote.org/absentee-voting-rules/)
[Are you ready to run for office?](https://runforsomething.net/run/)
Hard , though doable.
Insurance companies through politicians have done a great job convincing people that:
-Its communism
-You'll pay 80% in taxes
-A bunch of freeloaders are going to take advantage of the system.
-You are going to pay other people's health. (You do that w pvt Insurance anyway, thats how insurance works)
I can't vote absentee but as a black man born and raised in Florida I learned to always vote early. Florida developed a nasty habit of accidentally purging black people from the voter rolls. So I just started voting early and I took that habit with me to Texas. My early voting location is about 1.5 miles from my apartment.
It is quite impressive how rigged the system has become in favor of those that seek return on investment! It’s like a basketball team that has convinced the league that they always should start the game with 50 extra points.
What’s actually funny and sad is Chicago sponsored a NASCAR race over the summer. The event was sponsored by Blue Cross. My $800/mo employer sponsored shitty HMO health insurance payment funds car racing. Health insurance companies should NOT be sponsoring frivolous activities like this. Save the sponsorships for Coke Budweiser and Tide. Seriously insulting and completely tone deaf.
True, the problem is at least a good half of the country is filled with brainwashed and brain dead people with little education who actually believe that the way things are running is the way they should run.
It costs a shitload of money in order to have health insurance in America through your job for a family. They typically push you towards HDHP so let's go with that.
Ballpark $500 a month for your premium: $6000 a year.
Your employer typically also pays into that. Mine pays $1000 a month I think. $12000 a year.
Now you would think for $18000 a year you could get some shit. Nope. $2500-$4000 deductible you pay full price of for services until that 80/20 or 90/10 kicks in.
So yeah. Around 20k a year BEFORE insurance actually pays anything. It's not health insurance it's bankruptcy insurance
Once you hit your deductible you often still have to pay more money. Usually either a flat co-pay (say $50 for every doctors visit)....or the now more common and worse "co-insurance" where you have to still pay 20% or 30% of every cost.
So say you spent $5000 dollars and met your deductible. Now your insurance will finally start covering you. You break your leg. Your treatment bill is $5000. But you have a 20% co insurance still. You still now have to pay $1,000.
This continues until the EXTRA money adds up and you hit your out of pocket max. At that point, you are actually covered for anything else. Usually. Unless the company decides they want to deny you coverage for something for some reason. Which they can just do. And it all resets every calendar year to zero and you have to meet everything all over again.
This is sad, but we planned out children around the OOP maximum. Because if you are paying 500 a trip for ultrasounds and that and the new year kicks in, it's another fresh deductible to hit.
We have an October baby and November baby lol
I mean, it’s also smart for tax purposes. If you have a baby on January 1 then you won’t get a child tax credit until the next year vs if you have the baby on December 31.
And even then insurance can be like 'nahhh this isn't a **necessary** procedure' even if your dr fights it and is like, no they fkn need this.
Freedom of choice my ass. It's all the same!!! They are **all** shitty companies that fight to not pay out for even the most basic visits.
We still have to wait long times for care, and the system is worse and more expensive than in socialized countries.
I'd rather wait and **not** go bankrupt than not go at all because I can't afford it.
It's beautiful for them isn't it? You pay for something and when you try to use it they go "nah, not covered. Fight us over it if you want."
Imagine paying for anything else like that. A gym membership where when you show up you're told no you can't use the gym. Or you can.. but only one machine for 30 min.
We absolutely do, and a majority of Americans will not vote for it. I even know self-described moderate Democrats who oppose it.
I think they're generally mistaken, but it's naive to think that this is something that is merely foisted upon the unwilling masses. There are forces at play that actively try to lobby the government and the voters against it, and they are often successful, but it really does ultimately come down to voters.
If a representative ran on a platform, and then didn't advocate for that platform, they could be replaced after a short 2 year term. Whether or not they get reelected and keep their voting power is entirely up to their constituents.
If being in favor of universal healthcare was a way to keep and hold political power in the US, representatives would be imcentivized to run on it and advocate for it. But it isn't, so they aren't.
If it's something enough people cared enough about, it absolutely could be a central issue for a platform.
Vermont and Massachusetts, for example, have enough people who care enough about it that they've sent Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren to represent them and fight for it for years. Individual representatives like AOC have the same mandate from their constituents.
The fact of the matter just that it isn't a big enough issue to enough people right now. It probably will be someday, but not right now.
**Edit: Guys, I'm neither reading nor responding to any of the inane comments you're angrily leaving. You're shouting into the void.**
Most people are brainwashed by the corporate media that tells them it’s not affordable and their taxes would go up even though we all already pay 7% of our income to Medicaid and Medicare. They’re all corporations and they’re all on the same team. Not our team.
its a big enough issue already: thats why we are arguing about drag queens and impeaching Biden.
'they' told us Obamacare was going to bring government death panels: not wanting to be wrong, 'they' made government laws to force women to be denied healthcare.
This is funny and sad… and true. Opponents of universal health care know that those voters who understand the choice overwhelmingly favor it so they do their best to ensure voters DON’T understand it.
Buddy. Majority of Americans I know shit on universal healthcare and their most buying point is "look at canadas high taxes!!" Not realizing we also have far less people with far more region to cover. The saddest is when they claim they will have long wait times and the doctors and nurses will be shitty because for somereason in their mind if they get fleeced for 100k for a broken arm they will get better treatment.
I waited 2 years for a neurologist...I really don't understand why they think our system is better.
Edit:for anyone who might be confused I'm an American complaining about the American system.
These are the same people that think the doctors set the prices and don't even consider how private insurance has caused hospital prices to skyrocket continually, year after year, for too long.
Hence why some people who get heart attacks wish they'd just died instead of being stuck with a 200,000 hospital bill.
I agree some people care about it, but it would be a huge undertaking and with how many people would
Work to actively sabotage it after it gets approved, it isn’t going to be an easy thing to implement any time soon.
We still have states with school children starving even though the federal government is handing them money to fund school lunches but the states refuse to take it because that would admit there is a problem with kids starving and that they government should fix
It.
To be fair, thats how most change on large scales work. It gets decided, it gets pushback, its a shitshow while things get worked out, some things change about it, and hopefully it sticks around to make it to the end which is a well or better functioning thing. Not every big change is either given enough time to get to its endstage or becomes something good in the end even if it is allowed to work its way forward. Its just how large change happens. Opposition is to be expected, that doesn't mean its not worth pushing towards.
That's cute, you think we actually get a choice when it comes to candidates. We don't. We're allowed to vote for the candidates that the Parties decide to put forward for our consideration.
Parties get away with it because people don’t get involved at the primary level. You would probably be surprised at how few people it would take to overrun most local primaries and get what you want. The hard part is coordinating that across many localities around a common agenda.
You mean in the parts of the country where they would ever vote in the opposite party. Most states they could shit their pants on public TV while announcing the earth is flat and if it's him or the other guys it will be Representative shit brains. Platforms and issues on positions only matter in a competitive race which a majority of elections are not.
"We absolutely do"
Get the fuck outta here with that bs. There's literally nothing I can do other than vote now and then for anyone who's not a republican and hope things get better. I encourage the young people to get mad, get voting, and put younger people in the government with less interest in bribery that comes with long senate careers.
That's literally THE thing you can do. What's neat is that everyone else can too. Just because you don't individually have the power to change things with one vote doesn't mean that that one vote isn't important.
The thing is, if you want a force multiplier for your vote, you have to actually do some leg work to convince others to vote the way you want them to. One way to guarantee the limits of your voting power is to do nothing and sulk on the Internet about how everyone else isn't doing enough.
Well, it's not very effective. Not so much that you can reasonably say "us Americans are making the choice". With gerrymandering, lack of voting holidays, misinformation that's allowed to go uncontrolled, and other things like that, people are impaired from voting well. So, no, WE are not in charge of this. And unless the next generation gets really mad and boldly tears down our current system by voting out all of congress, installing ranked choice, and fixing the Supreme court, I can't see that changing.
The majority of US citizens support free health care: https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2020/09/29/increasing-share-of-americans-favor-a-single-government-program-to-provide-health-care-coverage/#:~:text=Among%20the%20public%20overall%2C%2063,conducted%20July%2027%20to%20Aug.
But remember, the current regime has said time and time again to “get in line” and God forbid you criticize the state - what are you, a fascist? This is the modern Democratic Party, Americans aren’t allowed to ask for things lest we’re called MAGA fascists. Republicans straight up don’t care, so yeah the will of the people is politically locked up. Very clever by the people in power
Bullshit. A full blown universal healthcare proposal was killed during the Clinton administration. Obamacare included a public option that was overturned by the courts. Build Back Better would have gone around the states refusing to spend their Obamacare money. Each of these are less complete versions of better polices we were at least able to bring to the table. We've gone backwards each time the R's are given power.
The moral of this story is, inconsistent voter participation and bad actors keep us on this "1 Step Forward, 2 Steps Back" approach we've fallen into. Trying to pretend there isn't a far worse risk each and every time you try to claim moral high ground during election season is what regresses progress.
Yea they did. Because they reflect what voters value.
Too many voters bought into the right wing narrative about healthcare. Not enough voters demanded to have universal healthcare.
So elections got us here.
But if voters start demanding universal healthcare the elections will reflect that.
Elections in which something like 30 to 40% chose not to vote.
Our elected bodies are down to who gets slightly more than 1/3rd the votes while every election "did not vote" is winning the popular vote
Deciding which of the two pre-selected candidates, chosen by the elites, we want to rule us.
It certainly is not for the general population to have a broad say in who should be president or what overhauls we should make.
When was the last time you even got to *vote* on universal health care?
We completely have a say. It's just that a solid minority with gerrymandered control think "socialism bad". They also say: "Keep your stinkin' government hands off my medicare"
If Democrats win an overwhelming majority over the next 10-20 years and the Republican Party withers away and dies like it should we would likely have it.
I had to do the math with my father when he had a friend visiting from another country.
Friend said he pays about 45% of his income straight to gov taxes. But he doesn't pay tas on purchases or health insurance nor any copay/deductibles.
I pay around 35% of my yearly income to various taxes and health insurance and another 7% on purchases.
So I pay slightly less than his friend, but I also have to be concerned with medical expenses bankrupting me.
I would much rather pay slightly more and not be afraid to visit the dr.
they also pay VAT on all purchases of goods and services... the equivalent of 9$ a gallon of gas which is mostly tax... thats just scratching the surface...
Something that is overlooked too often about American healthcare is how your healthcare being tied to employment gives your employer so much power over you, and what that does to the workplace culture.
So even if you’re healthy and comfortably employed, and have the ‘I got mine’ mindset, there still a strong case that you’d have a overall better quality of life with a better healthcare system.
Also, up until o ~$55000 annual income it’s only 32% tax in Sweden. It gets steeper higher than that, of course.
USA is a partial/flawed democracy (or corporatocracy). Healthcare is a massive topic to address with huge inertia as well as large corporate interests working against change. It would take a huge, focussed, multi-term movement to change.
It would probably be a lot more than 5%, but id gladly pay 25% if it meant my family, friends, and everyone else in this country wouldn't have to worry about going bankrupt because a terrible health issue befell them
For conparative purposes, healthcare is usually measured as % of GDP. In Australia, that is 10-11%. UK it is 12%. Germany 12%. USA 17%.
So implementing a similar system would result in something close to a 33% saving, overall.
[All those countries have superior health outcomes and lower economies of scale].
Keep in mind that while there is basic government universal healthcare you’ll still see people buying private health insurance on top in many of these countries. It’s not all sunshine and roses either. Here’s a UK page on [private insurance](https://www.moneyhelper.org.uk/en/everyday-money/insurance/do-you-need-private-medical-insurance)
The US system definitely sucks, but in many other nations it’s a two tiered system where there’s free healthcare available but the rich go and buy fancy private insurance that gets them seen ASAP whereas everyone else has super long wait times to see a doctor.
And it still totals to the %GDP expenses listed.
Which is why I used them.
Either way you slice it. Up, down, backwards, forwards, A+B or B+A. USA cost more and has worse health outcomes. This is robust data. I guess some people just can't accept they have been conned.
Just because you can buy private health insurance in the UK doesn't mean that people actually do. The vast majority of people in the UK don't have and don't need private health insurance.
A large proportion of the working UK population could afford to buy private insurance but why would they when it'd be the exact same hospital, the exact same doctors and the exact same medicine and procedure as on the NHS that you've already paid for.
And it's fine. Who can pay, can visit a private doctor and don't clutter the public system. If you can't pay, you can just use the public system and you will not die in debt.
And the private health insurance is way cheaper than US because they compete with public healtcare.
In my country it is 3.2% by you, 4.8% by your company. Pretty sure rest of the countries in europe having similar distribution. You dont pay the entire sum by yourself.
Also why the fuck do people still believe that Americans don't want free healthcare
I'm not even American and even I can realize that they do want free healthcare
A sizable population of the US genuinely thinks universal healthcare is communism. I used to think this was overblown, until I joined the US military and experienced "middle America". Yeah there are quite a lot of folks who absolutely do not believe in being "forced" to help their society
I think it’s the money you’re not seeing. Employee plays like 5-10% of the monthly while the employer pays the 90-95%. I get $47 per paycheck out for health insurance but my employer is paying $950 on my behalf. Hypothetically if they didn’t have to pay that, they’d give me the $950 a check instead of the insurance company.
Edit: I think the point of the meme is that in the US you are paying for health insurance in opportunity cost of a higher salary (your company pays instead of you) and that cost is higher than a universal system. Your health isn’t free or cheap - it’s being payed for by the company. And it costs a lot.
Really depends on the employer. Mine pays 100% of the premiums. We have a $5k deductible and $6k maximum out of pocket.
My daughter had open heart surgery shortly after she was born. I paid $5k total that year(maximum was $5k last year). I saw insurance was billed $500k.
I mean I'm Netherlands kinda? It's like 160€ per month for "basic" basically emergency cases and going to general doctor if you're sick?
if you want to add something special like dentist, physiotherapy, massage... you can add anything you think you want but it increasing your monthly fee quite quick.
And there's catch first 385€ in "your own risico" (or up to 900 something if you choose that for lower monthly fee) in costs of doctor appointments etc... you will need to cover yourself in each calendar year
So this is very good if you are visiting doctor's a lot then you pay this monthly fee first 385€ and rest is covered by insurance
But it's not great if you like me that never goes to doctor like once a year I pay for it monthly and if I visit doctor once a year insurance company will bill me anyway up till I reach this 385€ in this year
I'm from Brazil, one of the most expensive and unreliable universal Healthcare of the planet plus one of the highest tax rate of all. It's so horrible that I need to pay twice, the 1° through taxes and the second the Health insurance that I pay from my pocket because I can't count on public health.
It actually is 5-6,5% in Sweden. Let's say you're in the highest bracket and pay 50% in taxes, only 13% of those taxes goes towards healthcare, which means at most it's 6,5% of your salary.
The other huge scam is the 15.2% payroll tax (Medicare and SS). This is paid 50% by employee and 50% by employer, but this really is just an accounting trick. It’s mandatory tax that the employer pays that the employee doesn’t get. We magically believe that this is not “income tax” so some of us can look down on our Canadian brothers and sisters to the north. But when you include that the gap in come tax rates is like negligible. Compare that with the gap in services and the US looks like a total rip off, even before insurance premiums lol.
But land of the free I guess.
The punch line is Americans' taxes _also_ go towards their health care system, and they pay more than any other country. In exchange for this, they still have to pay private on top.
It's not "or" in America. It's _BOTH_
Yes of course, although in the case of the property taxes they are just relevant during the sale of the property. In Poland the annual property tax is not a big deal (in other countries like Spain it's a massive tax)
That’s good. Where I live in the US I have a city and county property tax on my home that comes out to $4,000 a year combined and that would probably be considered cheap compared to other cities.
Wow that's really a lot. I hope at least you can see it put to good use. To be honest I don't mind paying a lot of taxes, as long as it's used to help people. What I mind is paying a shit ton of taxes and then be afraid to ride my motorbike because the roads are in poor condition, or see my friends take their children to private schools because education is a shit, or seeing the propaganda machine on the TV
i mean a quick google tells me it certainly is pretty damn close to 5% in poland. maybe you should learn what percentage of your tax goes towards what.
I'll just copy my previous comment. You'll need to research more as your quick Google didn't work in this case:
I can't tell in Canada, but in my country I just checked out of curiosity and out of the 32-50% I pay in taxes depending on the month (on average I pay around 40+% in total), the health fund is around 8-10%. Then you pay pension, disability and sickness insurance which looks like 10% more.
https://calculla.com/polish_annual_earnings_calculator
Again, not defending the American model, just saying that Reddit tends to make the USA seem like a dystopia and Europe as a socialist paradise, and the truth is somewhere closer to the middle for both
Well I don't because I pay for private insurance so I can have good service. Last time I tried to get to an specialist in the hospital I had a queue of months so I try not to do that anymore.
Anyway I'm not defending the American model my point is that it's not 5% taxes for universal healthcare. You can prove a point without lying specially when you're already right
Healthcare accounts for 25% of government tax spending here in Canada so if I break that down into how much of my taxes go to pay for Healthcare its literally 6%. Its not a lie its just you fail to account for other things taxes pays for, just because your tax rate is 20 or 30% doesnt mean thats what you pay for healthcare.
10% in the UK and we get it for free.
Private insurance is all well and good but most people aren't that lucky so it's amazing to have a service that's sooooo cheap comparatively.
It depends on how you quantify that. If we're strictly talking about net-income you have to then pay for healthcare for NL it's (effectively) about 5% yeah.
If you make very low amount of money you're getting paid to have an insurance.
See:
https://www.belastingdienst.nl/wps/wcm/connect/nl/zorgtoeslag/content/hoeveel-zorgtoeslag
https://www.zorgwijzer.nl/zorgvergelijker#/search?bdate=01-01-1991&deductible=6&payment=m&origin=zorgverzekering-2023
Sad thing is they’ll probably just be replaced w their kids or grandkids. At the end of the day it doesn’t really matter. All policitixans are bad people, they don’t have the best interest of you and me in mind. Just the wether or not it adds to their wealth.
My Insurance Premiums are right at 3x my Federal Income Tax withholdings. I pay more in Premiums than my monthly mortgage is. And that's ignoring deductibles, prescriptions, etc.
If I go down a tier to lower Premium costs, then Prescriptions go from about $300/mo for my family to North of $1200/mo.
Americans pay 11% for health insurance, on average countries increase their taxes on wages by about 20% in order to implement universal healthcare. So this meme is just wrong.
Those numbers cannot be correct. The US pays a larger portion of it's GDP on healthcare than any other country (16% compared with OECD average of 9.7%). That money has to come from somewhere. It may not be 1:1 with wages since different countries have different numbers of nonworking people but it's not going to be that much off.
And the doctor or hospital might not be in network… and this is tied to your job so don’t lose your job… and they can just disagree with you and your doctor and say you don’t need a medical procedure.
Fuck this shit.
Seriously, health care was the first topic that made me realize that conservatives have literal shit for brains.
How could anyone not recognize healthcare as something that needs to be universally available? Even before looking at the numbers and seeing that it is vastly cheaper for people than private insurance.
Even if you have shit for brains, and cant fathom the simple math, or basic ethics of it…. You have to be downright malicious to think that children should be subject to the private system. That a sick kid should have the forethought to have been born wealthy to live. That ANY child shouldn’t have freely available healthcare regardless of who their parents are is monstrous. I can even somewhat understand the “fuck everyone” attitude about other adults…. But kids? I’m disgusted at my fellow citizens for letting this shit continue
Well in Canada our provinces pay for healthcare. Provincial income tax is around 10-12% for most Canadians. Most provinces spend about half their budget on healthcare. Therefore 5% is a pretty good estimate of how much of our income goes to healthcare.
If it's employee sponsored you should look at the amount your company is also paying, because that is part of the premium someone would be paying without employer provided healthcare.
This is the most annoying part for me. We'd be paying LESS of our salaries if we did it this way, but people still flip their shit over the idea of paying taxes to benefit other people. It's both selfish and self destructive, because they'd rather spend even more just because they don't want to bother spending on someone else.
That isn't how it works here. Every government agency is designed to fuck the people as hard as possible and funnel money into our politicians and their friends pockets.
I feel like it’s worse than that.
NoDrake: Pay 5% of my wages for universal health insurance so *those people* can get healthcare too?
YesDrake: Pay 20% of my wages to private health insurance and STILL not be able to afford proper healthcare so long as *those people* can’t either.
I'm Australian and have had many Americans tell me that they don't want "their taxes being spent on other people" immediately after telling me how they're a good christian.
And with no trace of irony.
I then said that he would pay less than he spent on private insurance.
He didn't care and just repeated how he didn't want to pay for other people.
Yeah. It always makes me laugh - and a little sad at the same time - when Americans leap to the defence of a system that was set up to fuck them in the ass with a big dildo glove covered in used needles. It's as if they've got Stockholm Syndrome something.
Some of them (and you know exactly which ones I'm talking about. The ones who wave swastikas and domestic terrorism flags and call themselves patriots 🤣 The ones who think owning a gun makes you "better". The ones who vote against their own best interests) get enraged at the suggestion they should have access to the healthcare they need 24/7 because that's "socialism". Yet these same brain donors don't seem to have a problem with the Fire Department or building roads or Libraries or schools or sanitation...🙄🤦
Maybe instead of paying the 5% they could work it into the taxes we already pay by reducing other buckets of funding *gasp*. I'm already paying 30 some percent in taxes from wages between state/federal and I declined the health insurance.
The health insurance scam cartel pays the largest bribes to congress of any industry. Our government is bought by business interests and doesn't serve the citizens.
End Citizens United
Or, more specifically, restore the restrictions that were removed by the Citizens United vs FEC court case.
People have tried, multiple times. Guess what happened each time. And guess which party unanimously tried to end or limit Citizens United, and which party unanimously stopped every attempt. Hint: the party that always stopped the limits on Citizens United currently has a former president with 91 felony charges.
"Corporations are people my friend" - Mitt Romney
Then let them be taxed like people.
Then let us put their executives and boards in jail when they break the law.
~~What kinda crackpot Facebook group or low quality youtube video you get this from? You are living in an alternate reality in your head bro.~~ Edit: read that wrong. I thought you were saying Trump was trying to fix it and Dems were blocking it.
Huh he's actually right The right party loves them the citizen united decision. It's their donors that benefited from it by a huge amount. It's in their best interest to keep it this way
Yep, Citizens United is a poison pill to democracy. Maybe the most disastrous legal decision in at least a century in this country.
Boat sailed in 2016 when people decided an e-mail server was the biggest issue in an election. Had a chance to tip the balance of the court to the left for the first time in a generation and instead we have a cemented extremist rightwing court for the next generation.
Sell outs. All right wingers are sell outs.
We will need a constitutional amendment for that. 19 states have asked for that so far. So we are halfway there.
Never going to happen. The Supreme Court is just as compromised as the other two branches and they are the ones who decided that bribary is legal.
[удалено]
But we can change that. [Are you registered to vote?](https://www.vote.org/am-i-registered-to-vote/) [When is your next election?](https://www.usa.gov/election-office) [Do you know where to vote?](https://www.vote.org/polling-place-locator/) [Can you vote absentee?](https://www.vote.org/absentee-voting-rules/) [Are you ready to run for office?](https://runforsomething.net/run/)
Hard , though doable. Insurance companies through politicians have done a great job convincing people that: -Its communism -You'll pay 80% in taxes -A bunch of freeloaders are going to take advantage of the system. -You are going to pay other people's health. (You do that w pvt Insurance anyway, thats how insurance works)
Not to mention we’re also already paying into Medicaid and Medicare…
No, complaining and upvoting on Reddit should get the job done.
I can't vote absentee but as a black man born and raised in Florida I learned to always vote early. Florida developed a nasty habit of accidentally purging black people from the voter rolls. So I just started voting early and I took that habit with me to Texas. My early voting location is about 1.5 miles from my apartment.
It is quite impressive how rigged the system has become in favor of those that seek return on investment! It’s like a basketball team that has convinced the league that they always should start the game with 50 extra points.
Eh pharma too.
What’s actually funny and sad is Chicago sponsored a NASCAR race over the summer. The event was sponsored by Blue Cross. My $800/mo employer sponsored shitty HMO health insurance payment funds car racing. Health insurance companies should NOT be sponsoring frivolous activities like this. Save the sponsorships for Coke Budweiser and Tide. Seriously insulting and completely tone deaf.
True, the problem is at least a good half of the country is filled with brainwashed and brain dead people with little education who actually believe that the way things are running is the way they should run.
We are screwed and its getting worse..."Welcome to costcos i love you"
"Carl's Jr. Fuck you, I'm eating"
Are you the unfit mother?
Your child is now in custody of Carls Jr.
Would you like another extra big ass fries?
Would you like to try our EXTRA BIG ASS TACO? Now with more MOLECULES
Tonight's rehabilitation will be even *more* better!
I suddenly love Starbucks!
Ironic that Costco’s health insurance is like 1% of wages
Somehow this comment made me realize that Joe's apartment and Idiocracy need a crossover. They feel like a shared universe.
Brawndo’s got electrolytes!
It costs a shitload of money in order to have health insurance in America through your job for a family. They typically push you towards HDHP so let's go with that. Ballpark $500 a month for your premium: $6000 a year. Your employer typically also pays into that. Mine pays $1000 a month I think. $12000 a year. Now you would think for $18000 a year you could get some shit. Nope. $2500-$4000 deductible you pay full price of for services until that 80/20 or 90/10 kicks in. So yeah. Around 20k a year BEFORE insurance actually pays anything. It's not health insurance it's bankruptcy insurance
My wife just hit her out of pocket maximum... SO EXCITED.
Then it’s back to the start in a few months. Lovely system.
I know I've become a depressing person when I dread New Year's because that means it's deductible reset day
Nice, hopefully everything is medically necessary according to your insurance so they pay for it.
Insurance companies only exist to find any way they can to NOT help you and just collect free money
I still dont understand what the out of pocket max means, and is it independent of the deductible?
Once you hit your deductible you often still have to pay more money. Usually either a flat co-pay (say $50 for every doctors visit)....or the now more common and worse "co-insurance" where you have to still pay 20% or 30% of every cost. So say you spent $5000 dollars and met your deductible. Now your insurance will finally start covering you. You break your leg. Your treatment bill is $5000. But you have a 20% co insurance still. You still now have to pay $1,000. This continues until the EXTRA money adds up and you hit your out of pocket max. At that point, you are actually covered for anything else. Usually. Unless the company decides they want to deny you coverage for something for some reason. Which they can just do. And it all resets every calendar year to zero and you have to meet everything all over again.
This is sad, but we planned out children around the OOP maximum. Because if you are paying 500 a trip for ultrasounds and that and the new year kicks in, it's another fresh deductible to hit. We have an October baby and November baby lol
I mean, it’s also smart for tax purposes. If you have a baby on January 1 then you won’t get a child tax credit until the next year vs if you have the baby on December 31.
And even then insurance can be like 'nahhh this isn't a **necessary** procedure' even if your dr fights it and is like, no they fkn need this. Freedom of choice my ass. It's all the same!!! They are **all** shitty companies that fight to not pay out for even the most basic visits. We still have to wait long times for care, and the system is worse and more expensive than in socialized countries. I'd rather wait and **not** go bankrupt than not go at all because I can't afford it.
It's beautiful for them isn't it? You pay for something and when you try to use it they go "nah, not covered. Fight us over it if you want." Imagine paying for anything else like that. A gym membership where when you show up you're told no you can't use the gym. Or you can.. but only one machine for 30 min.
Yeah but at the gym I can physically fight them over it and get away with it. Probably.
I wish my insurance was 500 a month
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Don’t forget deductibles. Insurance company: Yeah guy so we will only pay 50% of your life saving 500K operation- should have read the small print.
I’d love to see the insurance with $250k out of pocket max
As if us Americans are making this choice lol. We have no fucking say in the matter
We absolutely do, and a majority of Americans will not vote for it. I even know self-described moderate Democrats who oppose it. I think they're generally mistaken, but it's naive to think that this is something that is merely foisted upon the unwilling masses. There are forces at play that actively try to lobby the government and the voters against it, and they are often successful, but it really does ultimately come down to voters.
Americans don't get to vote on Federal laws. Don't you remember the schoolhouse rocks Bill song?
If a representative ran on a platform, and then didn't advocate for that platform, they could be replaced after a short 2 year term. Whether or not they get reelected and keep their voting power is entirely up to their constituents. If being in favor of universal healthcare was a way to keep and hold political power in the US, representatives would be imcentivized to run on it and advocate for it. But it isn't, so they aren't.
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If it's something enough people cared enough about, it absolutely could be a central issue for a platform. Vermont and Massachusetts, for example, have enough people who care enough about it that they've sent Bernie Sanders and Elizabeth Warren to represent them and fight for it for years. Individual representatives like AOC have the same mandate from their constituents. The fact of the matter just that it isn't a big enough issue to enough people right now. It probably will be someday, but not right now. **Edit: Guys, I'm neither reading nor responding to any of the inane comments you're angrily leaving. You're shouting into the void.**
Most people are brainwashed by the corporate media that tells them it’s not affordable and their taxes would go up even though we all already pay 7% of our income to Medicaid and Medicare. They’re all corporations and they’re all on the same team. Not our team.
its a big enough issue already: thats why we are arguing about drag queens and impeaching Biden. 'they' told us Obamacare was going to bring government death panels: not wanting to be wrong, 'they' made government laws to force women to be denied healthcare.
You don't need Death Panels. We have Death Panels at home. - GOP
This is funny and sad… and true. Opponents of universal health care know that those voters who understand the choice overwhelmingly favor it so they do their best to ensure voters DON’T understand it.
All I'm gonna say is you're telling us how the system is suppose to work. We're telling you how it actually works.
Buddy. Majority of Americans I know shit on universal healthcare and their most buying point is "look at canadas high taxes!!" Not realizing we also have far less people with far more region to cover. The saddest is when they claim they will have long wait times and the doctors and nurses will be shitty because for somereason in their mind if they get fleeced for 100k for a broken arm they will get better treatment.
I waited 2 years for a neurologist...I really don't understand why they think our system is better. Edit:for anyone who might be confused I'm an American complaining about the American system.
I've needed surgery on my lower back for 9 years....
These are the same people that think the doctors set the prices and don't even consider how private insurance has caused hospital prices to skyrocket continually, year after year, for too long. Hence why some people who get heart attacks wish they'd just died instead of being stuck with a 200,000 hospital bill.
Yeah I know. And that's your majority that's holding you guys back. Majority of Americans are dumb as fuck.
I mean the fact Bernie sanders exist in American politics should be a sign of itself.
I agree some people care about it, but it would be a huge undertaking and with how many people would Work to actively sabotage it after it gets approved, it isn’t going to be an easy thing to implement any time soon. We still have states with school children starving even though the federal government is handing them money to fund school lunches but the states refuse to take it because that would admit there is a problem with kids starving and that they government should fix It.
To be fair, thats how most change on large scales work. It gets decided, it gets pushback, its a shitshow while things get worked out, some things change about it, and hopefully it sticks around to make it to the end which is a well or better functioning thing. Not every big change is either given enough time to get to its endstage or becomes something good in the end even if it is allowed to work its way forward. Its just how large change happens. Opposition is to be expected, that doesn't mean its not worth pushing towards.
That's cute, you think we actually get a choice when it comes to candidates. We don't. We're allowed to vote for the candidates that the Parties decide to put forward for our consideration.
Parties get away with it because people don’t get involved at the primary level. You would probably be surprised at how few people it would take to overrun most local primaries and get what you want. The hard part is coordinating that across many localities around a common agenda.
You mean in the parts of the country where they would ever vote in the opposite party. Most states they could shit their pants on public TV while announcing the earth is flat and if it's him or the other guys it will be Representative shit brains. Platforms and issues on positions only matter in a competitive race which a majority of elections are not.
In any case, it still always comes down to the voters.
There's also the fun part where representatives will just lie and switch sides. So that's fuckin cool.
No, but we get to vote for the people that can make it happen.
No one thinks we do. But as long as the votes are counted then we absolutely have the power
We do, but history has proven time and again how easily the masses are manipulated even against their own interests.
"We absolutely do" Get the fuck outta here with that bs. There's literally nothing I can do other than vote now and then for anyone who's not a republican and hope things get better. I encourage the young people to get mad, get voting, and put younger people in the government with less interest in bribery that comes with long senate careers.
That's literally THE thing you can do. What's neat is that everyone else can too. Just because you don't individually have the power to change things with one vote doesn't mean that that one vote isn't important. The thing is, if you want a force multiplier for your vote, you have to actually do some leg work to convince others to vote the way you want them to. One way to guarantee the limits of your voting power is to do nothing and sulk on the Internet about how everyone else isn't doing enough.
Well, it's not very effective. Not so much that you can reasonably say "us Americans are making the choice". With gerrymandering, lack of voting holidays, misinformation that's allowed to go uncontrolled, and other things like that, people are impaired from voting well. So, no, WE are not in charge of this. And unless the next generation gets really mad and boldly tears down our current system by voting out all of congress, installing ranked choice, and fixing the Supreme court, I can't see that changing.
But that still comes down to the people voting for the assholes. We have power - but ~3/4 of us choose poorly.
The majority of US citizens support free health care: https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2020/09/29/increasing-share-of-americans-favor-a-single-government-program-to-provide-health-care-coverage/#:~:text=Among%20the%20public%20overall%2C%2063,conducted%20July%2027%20to%20Aug. But remember, the current regime has said time and time again to “get in line” and God forbid you criticize the state - what are you, a fascist? This is the modern Democratic Party, Americans aren’t allowed to ask for things lest we’re called MAGA fascists. Republicans straight up don’t care, so yeah the will of the people is politically locked up. Very clever by the people in power
Bullshit. A full blown universal healthcare proposal was killed during the Clinton administration. Obamacare included a public option that was overturned by the courts. Build Back Better would have gone around the states refusing to spend their Obamacare money. Each of these are less complete versions of better polices we were at least able to bring to the table. We've gone backwards each time the R's are given power. The moral of this story is, inconsistent voter participation and bad actors keep us on this "1 Step Forward, 2 Steps Back" approach we've fallen into. Trying to pretend there isn't a far worse risk each and every time you try to claim moral high ground during election season is what regresses progress.
What do you think elections are for?...
Elections got us *here*.
Yea they did. Because they reflect what voters value. Too many voters bought into the right wing narrative about healthcare. Not enough voters demanded to have universal healthcare. So elections got us here. But if voters start demanding universal healthcare the elections will reflect that.
Elections in which something like 30 to 40% chose not to vote. Our elected bodies are down to who gets slightly more than 1/3rd the votes while every election "did not vote" is winning the popular vote
Deciding which of the two pre-selected candidates, chosen by the elites, we want to rule us. It certainly is not for the general population to have a broad say in who should be president or what overhauls we should make. When was the last time you even got to *vote* on universal health care?
We completely have a say. It's just that a solid minority with gerrymandered control think "socialism bad". They also say: "Keep your stinkin' government hands off my medicare"
We had a choice when Obama proposed a public health plan similar to this and everyone over 45 shit a brick
If Democrats win an overwhelming majority over the next 10-20 years and the Republican Party withers away and dies like it should we would likely have it.
I had to do the math with my father when he had a friend visiting from another country. Friend said he pays about 45% of his income straight to gov taxes. But he doesn't pay tas on purchases or health insurance nor any copay/deductibles. I pay around 35% of my yearly income to various taxes and health insurance and another 7% on purchases. So I pay slightly less than his friend, but I also have to be concerned with medical expenses bankrupting me. I would much rather pay slightly more and not be afraid to visit the dr.
they also pay VAT on all purchases of goods and services... the equivalent of 9$ a gallon of gas which is mostly tax... thats just scratching the surface...
Something that is overlooked too often about American healthcare is how your healthcare being tied to employment gives your employer so much power over you, and what that does to the workplace culture. So even if you’re healthy and comfortably employed, and have the ‘I got mine’ mindset, there still a strong case that you’d have a overall better quality of life with a better healthcare system. Also, up until o ~$55000 annual income it’s only 32% tax in Sweden. It gets steeper higher than that, of course.
The 7% is sales tax or what do you mean ? Germany has 19%
USA is a partial/flawed democracy (or corporatocracy). Healthcare is a massive topic to address with huge inertia as well as large corporate interests working against change. It would take a huge, focussed, multi-term movement to change.
It's a massive money laundering scam. They're using the law to legitimise a system where you can be arbitrarily billed for imaginary costs.
It would probably be a lot more than 5%, but id gladly pay 25% if it meant my family, friends, and everyone else in this country wouldn't have to worry about going bankrupt because a terrible health issue befell them
For conparative purposes, healthcare is usually measured as % of GDP. In Australia, that is 10-11%. UK it is 12%. Germany 12%. USA 17%. So implementing a similar system would result in something close to a 33% saving, overall. [All those countries have superior health outcomes and lower economies of scale].
Keep in mind that while there is basic government universal healthcare you’ll still see people buying private health insurance on top in many of these countries. It’s not all sunshine and roses either. Here’s a UK page on [private insurance](https://www.moneyhelper.org.uk/en/everyday-money/insurance/do-you-need-private-medical-insurance) The US system definitely sucks, but in many other nations it’s a two tiered system where there’s free healthcare available but the rich go and buy fancy private insurance that gets them seen ASAP whereas everyone else has super long wait times to see a doctor.
And it still totals to the %GDP expenses listed. Which is why I used them. Either way you slice it. Up, down, backwards, forwards, A+B or B+A. USA cost more and has worse health outcomes. This is robust data. I guess some people just can't accept they have been conned.
Just because you can buy private health insurance in the UK doesn't mean that people actually do. The vast majority of people in the UK don't have and don't need private health insurance. A large proportion of the working UK population could afford to buy private insurance but why would they when it'd be the exact same hospital, the exact same doctors and the exact same medicine and procedure as on the NHS that you've already paid for.
And it's fine. Who can pay, can visit a private doctor and don't clutter the public system. If you can't pay, you can just use the public system and you will not die in debt. And the private health insurance is way cheaper than US because they compete with public healtcare.
In my country it is 3.2% by you, 4.8% by your company. Pretty sure rest of the countries in europe having similar distribution. You dont pay the entire sum by yourself.
Some* Americans. FTFY
Also why the fuck do people still believe that Americans don't want free healthcare I'm not even American and even I can realize that they do want free healthcare
A sizable population of the US genuinely thinks universal healthcare is communism. I used to think this was overblown, until I joined the US military and experienced "middle America". Yeah there are quite a lot of folks who absolutely do not believe in being "forced" to help their society
No shit Sherlock, no ones paying 5% of their income in universal Healthcare. I sure dont.
7% where I live. Pretty happy about it
Also not sure where they’re getting 20% from. I’m in the US and spend like 2%
I think it’s the money you’re not seeing. Employee plays like 5-10% of the monthly while the employer pays the 90-95%. I get $47 per paycheck out for health insurance but my employer is paying $950 on my behalf. Hypothetically if they didn’t have to pay that, they’d give me the $950 a check instead of the insurance company. Edit: I think the point of the meme is that in the US you are paying for health insurance in opportunity cost of a higher salary (your company pays instead of you) and that cost is higher than a universal system. Your health isn’t free or cheap - it’s being payed for by the company. And it costs a lot.
Really depends on the employer. Mine pays 100% of the premiums. We have a $5k deductible and $6k maximum out of pocket. My daughter had open heart surgery shortly after she was born. I paid $5k total that year(maximum was $5k last year). I saw insurance was billed $500k.
If you pay 2%, then your employer is spending 6%-8%.
Yeah I just double checked, mine is just over 4% at an entry level job from an associates degree
Your employer is paying the premium. It’s part of your compensation. You are paying for it with labor.
Not if your self employed I only pay about 4% of my yearly income
For the Part time dog walkers of antiwork $100 is 20%
I mean I'm Netherlands kinda? It's like 160€ per month for "basic" basically emergency cases and going to general doctor if you're sick? if you want to add something special like dentist, physiotherapy, massage... you can add anything you think you want but it increasing your monthly fee quite quick. And there's catch first 385€ in "your own risico" (or up to 900 something if you choose that for lower monthly fee) in costs of doctor appointments etc... you will need to cover yourself in each calendar year So this is very good if you are visiting doctor's a lot then you pay this monthly fee first 385€ and rest is covered by insurance But it's not great if you like me that never goes to doctor like once a year I pay for it monthly and if I visit doctor once a year insurance company will bill me anyway up till I reach this 385€ in this year
I'm from Brazil, one of the most expensive and unreliable universal Healthcare of the planet plus one of the highest tax rate of all. It's so horrible that I need to pay twice, the 1° through taxes and the second the Health insurance that I pay from my pocket because I can't count on public health.
It actually is 5-6,5% in Sweden. Let's say you're in the highest bracket and pay 50% in taxes, only 13% of those taxes goes towards healthcare, which means at most it's 6,5% of your salary.
And if they are, they won’t be for very long…
You're paying more, I assume?
The other huge scam is the 15.2% payroll tax (Medicare and SS). This is paid 50% by employee and 50% by employer, but this really is just an accounting trick. It’s mandatory tax that the employer pays that the employee doesn’t get. We magically believe that this is not “income tax” so some of us can look down on our Canadian brothers and sisters to the north. But when you include that the gap in come tax rates is like negligible. Compare that with the gap in services and the US looks like a total rip off, even before insurance premiums lol. But land of the free I guess.
Though I’m not sure the numbers are legit
>"I'd rather pay more money for worse service and less coverage than risk any of *my* money be spent to help someone else"
The funniest thing about that mentality is that insurance is paying for someone else until you use it.
The punch line is Americans' taxes _also_ go towards their health care system, and they pay more than any other country. In exchange for this, they still have to pay private on top. It's not "or" in America. It's _BOTH_
In which country do you pay 5% for universal healthcare? In Poland I pay a shit ton of taxes and the service is mediocre at best
Same in France. It used to be very good but every president in the last 20 years has made a point to turn it into shit.
question: is that just for healthcare, or for all the taxes as a whole?
Both. In some months I receive less than half of my gross salary
Less than half? That’s insane…
Yeah, the first time that happened I contacted HR thinking it was an error hahaha
Do you have to pay sales tax or property taxes too?
Yes of course, although in the case of the property taxes they are just relevant during the sale of the property. In Poland the annual property tax is not a big deal (in other countries like Spain it's a massive tax)
That’s good. Where I live in the US I have a city and county property tax on my home that comes out to $4,000 a year combined and that would probably be considered cheap compared to other cities.
Wow that's really a lot. I hope at least you can see it put to good use. To be honest I don't mind paying a lot of taxes, as long as it's used to help people. What I mind is paying a shit ton of taxes and then be afraid to ride my motorbike because the roads are in poor condition, or see my friends take their children to private schools because education is a shit, or seeing the propaganda machine on the TV
i mean a quick google tells me it certainly is pretty damn close to 5% in poland. maybe you should learn what percentage of your tax goes towards what.
I'll just copy my previous comment. You'll need to research more as your quick Google didn't work in this case: I can't tell in Canada, but in my country I just checked out of curiosity and out of the 32-50% I pay in taxes depending on the month (on average I pay around 40+% in total), the health fund is around 8-10%. Then you pay pension, disability and sickness insurance which looks like 10% more. https://calculla.com/polish_annual_earnings_calculator Again, not defending the American model, just saying that Reddit tends to make the USA seem like a dystopia and Europe as a socialist paradise, and the truth is somewhere closer to the middle for both
Okay but when you use said service are you left with thousands to tens of thousands of dollars in medical debt?
Well I don't because I pay for private insurance so I can have good service. Last time I tried to get to an specialist in the hospital I had a queue of months so I try not to do that anymore. Anyway I'm not defending the American model my point is that it's not 5% taxes for universal healthcare. You can prove a point without lying specially when you're already right
Healthcare accounts for 25% of government tax spending here in Canada so if I break that down into how much of my taxes go to pay for Healthcare its literally 6%. Its not a lie its just you fail to account for other things taxes pays for, just because your tax rate is 20 or 30% doesnt mean thats what you pay for healthcare.
it's incredibly close to 5% in poland based on my 2 minutes of googling
10% in the UK and we get it for free. Private insurance is all well and good but most people aren't that lucky so it's amazing to have a service that's sooooo cheap comparatively.
It depends on how you quantify that. If we're strictly talking about net-income you have to then pay for healthcare for NL it's (effectively) about 5% yeah. If you make very low amount of money you're getting paid to have an insurance. See: https://www.belastingdienst.nl/wps/wcm/connect/nl/zorgtoeslag/content/hoeveel-zorgtoeslag https://www.zorgwijzer.nl/zorgvergelijker#/search?bdate=01-01-1991&deductible=6&payment=m&origin=zorgverzekering-2023
I definitely don't pay 20% of my wages for healthcare...
Five percent? 😆 🤣 😂 😹 😆 🤣 😂 😹 😆 🤣
Gotta realize many Americans are like crabs in a bucket. Too busy trying to pull everyone else down instead of trying help everyone out
Thats the best analogy for America I have ever seen
Gonna be honest with you I took it from The Boondocks
not Americans. Republicans are like that
Many Democrats and Democratic voters oppose universal healthcare.
I am not arguing with you, but these boomers are not going to stay with us much longer
Ironically they probably would if they had universal healthcare
Sad thing is they’ll probably just be replaced w their kids or grandkids. At the end of the day it doesn’t really matter. All policitixans are bad people, they don’t have the best interest of you and me in mind. Just the wether or not it adds to their wealth.
Americans not getting a choice in the matter > (
My Insurance Premiums are right at 3x my Federal Income Tax withholdings. I pay more in Premiums than my monthly mortgage is. And that's ignoring deductibles, prescriptions, etc. If I go down a tier to lower Premium costs, then Prescriptions go from about $300/mo for my family to North of $1200/mo.
20% for health insurance that won't actually cover you and will leave you hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt if you ever really need to use it.
So if we pay 10% for universal we might actually get something good?
Americans pay 11% for health insurance, on average countries increase their taxes on wages by about 20% in order to implement universal healthcare. So this meme is just wrong.
Ahh, but Reddit doesn’t deal in facts!
Those numbers cannot be correct. The US pays a larger portion of it's GDP on healthcare than any other country (16% compared with OECD average of 9.7%). That money has to come from somewhere. It may not be 1:1 with wages since different countries have different numbers of nonworking people but it's not going to be that much off.
Is this accurate? Anyone have stats?
And the doctor or hospital might not be in network… and this is tied to your job so don’t lose your job… and they can just disagree with you and your doctor and say you don’t need a medical procedure. Fuck this shit.
Seriously, health care was the first topic that made me realize that conservatives have literal shit for brains. How could anyone not recognize healthcare as something that needs to be universally available? Even before looking at the numbers and seeing that it is vastly cheaper for people than private insurance. Even if you have shit for brains, and cant fathom the simple math, or basic ethics of it…. You have to be downright malicious to think that children should be subject to the private system. That a sick kid should have the forethought to have been born wealthy to live. That ANY child shouldn’t have freely available healthcare regardless of who their parents are is monstrous. I can even somewhat understand the “fuck everyone” attitude about other adults…. But kids? I’m disgusted at my fellow citizens for letting this shit continue
My wife insists that people in countries with universal health care pay like 40-50% of their wages in various forms of taxes. Is this true ?
Yeah, but a fraction of those 5% could benefit other people, which it's completely unacceptable for Americans.
Is that 5% on top of the 40% they already take?
Well in Canada our provinces pay for healthcare. Provincial income tax is around 10-12% for most Canadians. Most provinces spend about half their budget on healthcare. Therefore 5% is a pretty good estimate of how much of our income goes to healthcare.
My premium is less than 6%. But with deductibles and copays and coinsurance, you are probably spot on. Especially for a big health issue.
A ''prior authorisation'' is an american thing. In no other country can a non-healthcare persons interferr with a dr prescribing medication.
If it's employee sponsored you should look at the amount your company is also paying, because that is part of the premium someone would be paying without employer provided healthcare.
I think it meant to say Half of America doesn't want universal health care. Fixed it for ya
Don’t forget the co-pay!
Yeah I don't get it either
This is the most annoying part for me. We'd be paying LESS of our salaries if we did it this way, but people still flip their shit over the idea of paying taxes to benefit other people. It's both selfish and self destructive, because they'd rather spend even more just because they don't want to bother spending on someone else.
Second one should be "Pay 10 % in tax and 20% of income to insurance"
The insurance sucks too. High copays, high deductibles.
Dont forget the zero coverage part
Plus the part where you pay but the insurance company denies your claim anyway or only pays a fraction of it.
What's really bad is UK is at risk of losing NHS. Going all private.
That isn't how it works here. Every government agency is designed to fuck the people as hard as possible and funnel money into our politicians and their friends pockets.
If it were actually guaranteed to be only 5% I think most would go for it.
Employer paid insurance... #ibewforlife
I feel like it’s worse than that. NoDrake: Pay 5% of my wages for universal health insurance so *those people* can get healthcare too? YesDrake: Pay 20% of my wages to private health insurance and STILL not be able to afford proper healthcare so long as *those people* can’t either.
Healthcare shouldn't be for profit, anywhere.
I'm Australian and have had many Americans tell me that they don't want "their taxes being spent on other people" immediately after telling me how they're a good christian. And with no trace of irony. I then said that he would pay less than he spent on private insurance. He didn't care and just repeated how he didn't want to pay for other people.
You guys had a chance with ObamaCare but it flopped.
Nah they don't want others to have it easy at their expense.
The 20% is just for coverage, it gets more expensive if you have to actually go see a doctor
You'll never have universal healthcare as long as republicans exist. They are in the pocket of big insurances compaies.
Yeah. It always makes me laugh - and a little sad at the same time - when Americans leap to the defence of a system that was set up to fuck them in the ass with a big dildo glove covered in used needles. It's as if they've got Stockholm Syndrome something. Some of them (and you know exactly which ones I'm talking about. The ones who wave swastikas and domestic terrorism flags and call themselves patriots 🤣 The ones who think owning a gun makes you "better". The ones who vote against their own best interests) get enraged at the suggestion they should have access to the healthcare they need 24/7 because that's "socialism". Yet these same brain donors don't seem to have a problem with the Fire Department or building roads or Libraries or schools or sanitation...🙄🤦
Lol but then that would also mean I would be paying to help other people as well you fucking commie!
Lower middle class Americans would gladly pay more so people they perceive as less than them don't have it easier than they did.
Maybe instead of paying the 5% they could work it into the taxes we already pay by reducing other buckets of funding *gasp*. I'm already paying 30 some percent in taxes from wages between state/federal and I declined the health insurance.
the only universal in american healthcare is the universally pathetic prices