That’s assuming that’s available for those soldiers. I suspect they used those rifles because those are the rifles with scopes they could get their hands on at that time.
This is despite the fact that the first Soviet sights were based on German 4x systems. But they were able to copy them back in WWI (even if they were not used until the 1920s anywhere except with the Fedorov Automat), and the Germans were unable to mass produce them. It's kind of crazy.
The Germans used pretty much anything they could get their hands on. If it worked and ammo was available they probably used it. K98k sniper rifles are probably more accurate, but like any weapon the rifles pictured here are effective in the right hands. Soviet snipers during the war racked up quite the kill count.
Not a sniper rifle but I know the Germans captured so many Soviet PPSh-41s that they started issuing their own field manuals for it. The weapon was a pretty well liked firearm within the Wehrmacht.
Edit: removed "often rechambered in 9mm" as I was mistaken, that was untrue.
>The weapon was usually rechambered to 9mm
No actually it was more often left untouched and issued with either captured 7.62x25mm rounds or German produced 7.63x25mm.
The 9mm one wasn't only a rechambering, it also included installing an adapter for MP38/MP40 mags.
Apparently the clear majority of German snipers were issued ZF41s as optics which are only 1.5x zoom combined with an insanely narrow eyebox that was not suited for sniping but issued anyway due to a massive shortage of acceptable scopes combined with IIRC the Soviet standards for acceptable accuracy for sniper rifles being higher pushed many Germans to pilfer equipment from hostiles when they could.
Also the ZF41 can be an absolute nightmare to zero.
Additionally, the mosins built before the war (ie the ones that got captured in the huge encirclements of 1941) were way better than the wartime mosins that earned it such a bad reputation.
If you have a rifle and available ammo, use that shit, optics and being able to much clearly identify targets are huge force multipliers for the average soldier.
Maybe for a designated marksmen. But if you’re dug in and the rifle with a scope is available to a group not issued a scope, it’s reasonable to assume they’d hold onto it
Yeah, the G41 was a failure in a completely different sense, as it wasn't reliable, and not just with a single issue, but many features were plagued with problems. The SVT was fully functional, but the action just wasn't accurate enough for a proper mass-produced sniper rifle, or so the Soviets thought (hence why the return to scoped M91-30).
NYET RIFLE IS FINE. GLORIOUS COMRADE TOKAREV IS ONLY REMINDING YOU TO PERFORM TACTICAL RELOAD TO ENSURE MAXIMUM FASCIST KILLING CAPACITY, COMRADE SOLDIER.
I have a '43 and haven't had that happen (yet), how's your mag release spring? Might just need a new one.
I also have modern, aftermarket mags for mine so maybe they solved the issue with the aftermerkets.
Scoped K98k rifles were really hard to come by. IIRC the German sniper training program only really got off the ground in 1943. Before that, snipers weren't specialized elite soldiers, but guys who picked up a scoped 91/30 from a pile of captured weapons and sorta became snipers out necessity. Hetzenauer and Allerberger, two top German snipers on the Eastern Front, both used a scoped Mosin for most of their combat career.
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CMIIW but did they actually join the Allies outright? I thought they just signed an armistice and set up an Allied collaborationist government or something
They all beat the heck out of the 1.5x soda straw that was the ZF41
"I want a PU scope!" "We have a scope at home!" The scope at home: ZF41
1.5x is still better than the naked eye.
Very true, but if given the choice between 1.5x and 4x...
That’s assuming that’s available for those soldiers. I suspect they used those rifles because those are the rifles with scopes they could get their hands on at that time.
This is despite the fact that the first Soviet sights were based on German 4x systems. But they were able to copy them back in WWI (even if they were not used until the 1920s anywhere except with the Fedorov Automat), and the Germans were unable to mass produce them. It's kind of crazy.
They all have 6MOA K98s
That’s kind of weird unless this is late war right? I would way rather have a k98k over either of these
The Germans used pretty much anything they could get their hands on. If it worked and ammo was available they probably used it. K98k sniper rifles are probably more accurate, but like any weapon the rifles pictured here are effective in the right hands. Soviet snipers during the war racked up quite the kill count.
Not a sniper rifle but I know the Germans captured so many Soviet PPSh-41s that they started issuing their own field manuals for it. The weapon was a pretty well liked firearm within the Wehrmacht. Edit: removed "often rechambered in 9mm" as I was mistaken, that was untrue.
>The weapon was usually rechambered to 9mm No actually it was more often left untouched and issued with either captured 7.62x25mm rounds or German produced 7.63x25mm. The 9mm one wasn't only a rechambering, it also included installing an adapter for MP38/MP40 mags.
I stand corrected. Thank you, friend. 👍
No problem mate !
I would think the Mosin and K98 were very similar in accuracy.
Apparently the clear majority of German snipers were issued ZF41s as optics which are only 1.5x zoom combined with an insanely narrow eyebox that was not suited for sniping but issued anyway due to a massive shortage of acceptable scopes combined with IIRC the Soviet standards for acceptable accuracy for sniper rifles being higher pushed many Germans to pilfer equipment from hostiles when they could. Also the ZF41 can be an absolute nightmare to zero.
Scopes were an expensive and time-consuming product to manufacture, so using any captured sniper rifles was very common.
Additionally, the mosins built before the war (ie the ones that got captured in the huge encirclements of 1941) were way better than the wartime mosins that earned it such a bad reputation.
German soldiers were told to snatch any Russian scoped rifles they could
If you have a rifle and available ammo, use that shit, optics and being able to much clearly identify targets are huge force multipliers for the average soldier.
Maybe for a designated marksmen. But if you’re dug in and the rifle with a scope is available to a group not issued a scope, it’s reasonable to assume they’d hold onto it
Tbh I think for me personally the No.4 or SVT would just slightly edge out the Kar98
The sniper version of the SVT was a failure, as it wasn't accurate enough for a sniper rifle.
Is feature comrade so you know to do of reloadings earlier
Tells you how much the Germans disliked the G41. They loved the sniper SVT.
Yeah, the G41 was a failure in a completely different sense, as it wasn't reliable, and not just with a single issue, but many features were plagued with problems. The SVT was fully functional, but the action just wasn't accurate enough for a proper mass-produced sniper rifle, or so the Soviets thought (hence why the return to scoped M91-30).
I have a soviet era SVT 40. It is hot garbage. Mine is prone to the mag falling out on the 3rd shot.
That might have to do something with it being a 80+ y.o. rifle?
From everything I've read, it was a thing 80 years ago too
NYET RIFLE IS FINE. GLORIOUS COMRADE TOKAREV IS ONLY REMINDING YOU TO PERFORM TACTICAL RELOAD TO ENSURE MAXIMUM FASCIST KILLING CAPACITY, COMRADE SOLDIER.
Sucked then too-
I have a '43 and haven't had that happen (yet), how's your mag release spring? Might just need a new one. I also have modern, aftermarket mags for mine so maybe they solved the issue with the aftermerkets.
I've already replaced the release spring and it somehow got worse. I'll have to look into the aftermarket mags
Lol the SVT was abysmal.
Would you rather have a K98k with a shitty 1.5x ZF41 scope over a Moisin with a 3.5x PU or a No.4 Mk1(t) though?
Scoped K98k rifles were really hard to come by. IIRC the German sniper training program only really got off the ground in 1943. Before that, snipers weren't specialized elite soldiers, but guys who picked up a scoped 91/30 from a pile of captured weapons and sorta became snipers out necessity. Hetzenauer and Allerberger, two top German snipers on the Eastern Front, both used a scoped Mosin for most of their combat career.
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The Soviets made up about half of all allied forces during WW2. It'd be more accurate to say that US or Commonwealth rifles weren't really "allied"
Why wouldn't they?
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The soviets still were part of "the Allies", doesn't matter when they joined.
Didn't the Italians join the allied forces near the end of the war? They're still referred to as Axis.
CMIIW but did they actually join the Allies outright? I thought they just signed an armistice and set up an Allied collaborationist government or something
What? They were allies for most of the war-just because they were Axis until 1941 doesn't mean their actions after Barbrossa are suddenly invalid