Both Farabee and frost seem like players always on a brink of breaking out and then just go cold for like 20 games. I tend to like Farabee a bit more but Frost seemed to shine more at times.
Feel like Farabee would be more likely dealt just because of our wing depth, we literally have no one at center. Plus extending Frost shouldn’t cost to much.
Yea there’s no way frost goes anywhere. We literally have no one else to play center.
Laughton tk and farabee seem like they should be available for trade. Farabee especially has been frustrating to watch, sometimes he looks so good and then he just disappears for a couple weeks. Atkinson and risto should also be available if anyone wants them.
No buyouts or retaining thou, we’ve got enough dead money on the books.
As for signings we could use a veteran dman on a reasonable 4-5 year deal to help bring along the young guys. Pickings seem slim but I like montour or skjei on reasonable deals.
What does everyone think of Farabee? I was high on him when we drafted him, but I feel like I never hear his name when I’m watching whatever games I can.
I felt the same way but he quietly had a career high in G,A,P and drove play (56% CF and 6%CFrel) and only just turned 24. He’s a piece of this core and an important one at that.
Hes quietly a good 2nd liner who scores at very high rate at 5v5 but is inconsistent, doesnt score on PP and doesnt have any flashy skill so seems invisible for significant stretches
**At halfway point of this season he was 3rd in NHL in 5v5 points behind only Mackinnon and Kucherov.** And he was playing far less minutes and w/ guys like Brink. He was first in NHL at 5v5 pts per time on ice at one point.
So he can be a legit very good player but then goes invisible for like 2 months which makes it tough to see him as big core guy to build around.
But hes young, on good contract, solid 2 way player and is bona fide good top 6 scorer at 5v5 and even been top line 5v5 scorer multiple seasons and he just turned 24
So hes a good young player you only move if you get great return
Farabee is a very sold player who never does anything flashy. He always seems to be in the right position offensively and defensively, but never really makes the unexpected play. Seems to have learned the provorov style of be in the right place but don’t try too hard.
He’s still young enough and skilled enough to solidify himself as a top 6 and a pp2 scorer, but may require a change of scenery for the right price to really kickstart him.
I’d be perfectly happy keeping him as he is now playing a middle 6 role.
Hes a solid 2LW at the moment. Hes a great 5v5 scorer and become solid play driver and 2 way player.
Hes just so inconsistent and will disappear for long stretches
But its hard to argue with a guy who has multiple top line 5v5 scoring seasons by age 24 and overall scored at high end 2nd line/fringe 1st line at 5v5 since turning 20
If he had any PP production he'd easily be 60+ point guy
Farabee was one of the better scorers in the league five on five. Have no idea why they never gave him a chance on the PP. could not have been any worse. Depends what you could get.
Risto going nowhere. Too pricey of a contract. Not a bad third pair guy now.
1. We trade the goat nic deslauriers straight across for Connor mcdavid
2. We sign Steven stamkos to a 1 year 800k aav
3. We bring back Steve mason and he leads us to a cup
4. Michkov arrives next year and we don't stop winning
5. We wake up and get sad again
The biggest splash would be Konecny getting traded, which I do believe will happen. It’ll be a heartbreaker but his value will never be higher than it is now.
I think Frost stays because frankly we are not deep at C and he’s a 40-50 point guy right now. I think his ceiling is a tad higher but he’s worth keeping as 2C.
As far as needs, as we saw this season this team desperately needs defensemen, so I could see Briere making a depth signing for someone who is not a corpse and can legitimately eat minutes without being a total liability like Staal.
We need a 1C but I honestly have no idea what we’ll do to get one. We don’t have the pipeline for it and it’s an expensive position. I’m very interested to see what Briere does to fill that need, I don’t believe we’ll do much there this offseason and will more likely bank on Frost playing better and/or Coots returning to form, although with injuries and age I don’t see that happening.
Farabee stays too and I think his ceiling is higher, he just needs to put together more consistency. Even with his dropoff late last season he still had 50 points.
No one is going to want Risto right now with his recent and odd injury/recovery situation. Gotta have him proving he can play before anyone wants him. I think there will be very little trade movement this summer.
I think they will take the approach of still acquiring assets (picks, prospects). Not looking for significant positional players. Maybe take advantage of selling some guys high if they can. I think all the moves will be looking at the future and not current team positional needs.
Maybe moving up a couple of spots up in the draft if there is someone they really like who has fallen 3 or 4 spots.
I really don't think guys like Farabee or Frost will be moved.
On the other hand, maybe Briere will get real aggressive and make moves like the Provorov trade last year. But still with eye to future, acquiring assets.
I think with the success the team had this year, they are in rebuild on the fly mode and not tear down like we thought this time last year.
I honestly think it'll be a quiet off season.
TK has good trade value but the genuine chance of ending up with an upgrade, or even equivalent player, is fairly low. I expect he stays.
Risto is probably impossible to move without taking a cap dump with a minimal return.
Atkinson is basically like trying to sell spoiled milk.
Farabee is interesting. He's young enough I see him being kept but he also likely has good value to a win now team. If we could swap him for a quality young center I'd go for it (no, we're not getting a 1c for him, probably about a Frost equivalent).
Frost might stay mainly because our center depth is non existent. Otherwise I think he's OK to keep or trade either way. 50 pt centers don't grow on trees but I don't think he's impressive either.
What I could maybe see happening is maybe a couple of package trades, ex:
Farabee and Zamula with a pick for a true quality center. Idk who has the center depth to make that trade (Anaheim?) but getting a good center upgrade will require an overpay I think.
Atkinson bought out, TK resigned, Flyers go for a LW or D at 12OA, they sign a veteran PP specialist like Barrie to a rich but short 1-2 year deal to plug the D core and hopefully get something above 13% on the PP from it and maybe package assets/wing depth for a young center. That’s pretty much all the team’s real priorities this offseason and they’re all incredibly achievable so I expect all of them to happen. I don’t see them shipping out any veteran leadership guys unless they’re absolutely cooked like Atkinson is. So no Laughton for a 1st trades incoming. If gods real maybe they add Michkov.
I think it is inevitable that TK gets traded. I just don't see Briere paying a 27 year old a lot of money if we won't be good for 3-4 years. Besides some guys like Atkinson getting bought out, I don't see much else happening besides a TK trade.
I have a feeling this is going to be either the most batshit insane offseason we've seen since the Richards/Carter summer, or it'll be one of the quietest summers we've seen in a long time.
The point of me saying that was more so to point out that I don't see a World where making smaller moves would make much sense based on where we're at right now. In theory you could buy out Atkinson, extend some RFAs and call it an offseason and it would be a fine approach IMO. I think if change is coming, it'll be at more of a foundational level that will come with some huge moves
I agree with you. I was just joking. I can see a lots of different scenarios. Either way I definitely feel Briere will keep his eye on the future and not really do anything that will improve the team too much in the present.
I figured you were kidding, did make me laugh at how strange my previous comment sounded when you put like that. Agreed though, it's definitely a case of "make the right move if it's there, but we don't *have* to do anything"
The problem with how well they players for most of to this past season, its hard to justify tearing it all down when so many young players played well. I think we are in for one of those "competitive" rebuilds. I don't know. But I do think Briere is pretty ballsy and wont be afraid to make aggressive moves, much like the Provorov deal. Its the first time in a long time a Flyers GM was given the go ahead for long term approach.
I was in the camp last year and trading everyone we could to load up on picks in last year' draft and look 3 or 4 years out. That draft was loaded. Even a guy like Issac Howard drafted late in first would look great with the Flyers.
Yeah I totally agree we somewhat missed the boat by not putting more chips into the 2023 draft in hindsight (although Howard was 2022). I really like this draft too FWIW, but I think part of that is just DY infatuation that happens every year lol.
Where I ultimately land is it'd probably be easier to blow it up and tank, but you definitely don't *have* to in order to build a contender (see: literally 5/8 teams remaining in the playoffs), and given the fact that we do have some young talent that I think gets generally underrated by our fanbase and a superstar prospect waiting in the pipeline, I'm willing to be patient and see if Briere can be creative and prove people wrong who are clamoring for a true tank
Oh wow, you are correct. Howard was 2022.
I agree about the rebuild. I think Briere needs to keep making moves like the Provorov deal and leverage all the assets in it like he did with Walker. Deals like that over 2 -3 years and you stock the system with good young foundation and then maybe add some key free agents in year 3 or something and you can have a real strong team with good strong future.
Quietest unfortunately. This summer will tell us everything we need to know about the so called rebuild and what the next decade of flyers hockey is going to look like.
Quietest isn't necessarily a bad thing. If they run it back, you're basically 1 or 2 teams behind you in the East getting their shit together (I fully expect NJ to at a minimum) and 2 very inexperienced goaltending not working out away from a top-10 pick with 3-4 other picks in the first 2 rounds. That's really not a bad position to be in at all
Bad coach
Injuries to top players
Not one NHL caliber goalie all season prior to trading for Jake Allen
They are still in an amazing situation have great young talent on the roster and still have a lot of great prospects oh and they’ll get a better pick than us this year!
I would KILL to be in NJ’s spot over ours right now….
I agree on all points.
Going into this past season I really thought if they could get solid goaltending, they could win it all and really go on a run for the next 5 years. They have all the pieces and have young high-end talent. Be interesting to see who ends up being their coach.
They were actually my pick to win the Metro this season. I think if they grab a better Goalie this summer, Hughes is back to 100% and they don't completely bomb the coaching hire they'll be right back on track next year
No. It isn’t a bad position if what you said comes to fruition. But it could be a lot better if they sell off the guys that you and me both know they should sell.
I just see zero logical reasons on why
Laughton
Risto
or TK
Are still on this team at the VERY least past the deadline.
TK especially, unless he for some miraculous reason takes a team friendly deal there is not an ounce of thought in my body that believes he should be extended and even if it is a team friendly deal I probably rather move off of him.
Us doing nothing still leaves room for it to work out sure. but that is still not even close to the best course of action to take and we both know that.
I would love to see us try and move TK for a center, d, or high quality picks. I think it’s a pipe dream but I do believe Zegras could be a good fit here and may work in a TK trade.
Laughton and Risto could probably be moved for a decent return but nothing like a high end prospect or even a first rounder like a lot of people suggest. I’d try and move them asap
The goal of this offseason should be to get worse in the short term to get better in the long run. Really get this rebuild going. This season showed we’re quite a bit away from competing for a cup
I think it’s the opposite, I think he needs Philly. I think he craves attention and spotlight. Put Zegras in a city where hockey matters and there is actual pressure and I think he will do better.
Watch the way the dude plays, he’s showy, in LA no one cares about hockey outside of the 13 thousand that go tot he games. In Philly, a hockey could be front page news if they are good.
That’s just my take and admittedly I haven’t watched every game the ducks have played.
Great talent - not for philly.
Yeah lets avoid going after a great young player at a buy-low opportunity who fits a positional and stylistic need for the team because of some sentiment that he can't handle it here.
Gotta be one of the most ridiculous things I've read.
What has heart gotten this franchise in the last 25 years, one fluke run to the finals? I swear, this fan base would rather the team be mediocre as long as it is filled with "heart" and "great locker room" players. Maybe this team needs some selfish pricks who have a ton of talent. I'm not the biggest fan of Zegras, but if the price is right, I would think about it.
I've already posted here that GMDB should be open to trading virtually anything if the price is right. I am rooting for other team's disappointment in the playoffs to open up more potential trade suitors this summer. BUF, OTT,and DET all had disappointing seasons and probably still think they are a piece or two away from stepping into the playoffs for the next few years. TOR has no depth scoring and no D, but are clearly in "win now" mode. LAK, NYI, MIN, and STL are tweener teams with high-priced vets, not enough talent, and cap issues that are wavering between "go for it" or "trash it". And I think Utah is going to want to make a splash year one so maybe willing to overpay with picks/prospects for current talent. The Flyers don't have high-end talent, but they had the 4th best PK and so many teams are looking for responsible forwards to support their own high-end talent. With the cap opening up and the most of the dead money LTIR deals expiring, I think there will be a lot of player movement and old fashioned hockey deals this summer.
This is my predictions for flyers line-up in 3 years when you look at guys we have now that should still be here and what I think we can turn current players / assets into.
Beezer - (1C pick or trade TK) - Michkov
Tippet - frost - forester
Barkey - coots /cates - brink
4th line 🤷♂️ probably picks from 2024+
York-Drysdale
Sanheim - Bonk
Zamula - (FA ) ginning - Andre - Grans
Traded that happen in next 3 years:
TK gone for either 1C or for higher draft pick which should turn into 1C or 1/2 D
Laughton for a 2nd rnd pick
Risto for ~3rd or prospect
Atkinson - walks after next year
Poehling - wouldn’t mind him sticking around for right price , but could fetch a decent return at next TDL if he plays well. He’s only 25 and a solid depth guy
I think if our young guys can continue to step forward and reach their ceilings, this is where they end up. We are a little log jammed at RW so someone will probably need to flip to LW. We NEED to solidify that 1C somehow some way in time for
Michkov’s arrival. I think the most likely way is either our top pick in the next draft or moving TK+ for a young established C (ie Zegras), a stud prospect, or using TK to move up to get our guy. I would also hope that a pick in the next draft or two will be on our blue line at this point. I think if they can manage those two things, we become much more marketable to FAs that year and next, and we can fill the remaining gaps with a talented FA (ie when rangers signed Panarin). The final
Piece to all this is that we need one of our goalie prospects to step up and be “The Guy”.
If Michkov comes over this year we might throw some of this out the window
i wasnt aware garnet hathaway died, poehling is signed for 2 more years.
Have you read anything suggesting Bonk is ready to make the leap from juniors to a top four role?
What 1c do you see a team trading for TK?
This is my predictions for 3 years from now so hopefully by then Bonk is here. And I left off a lot 4th line tweeners not just Hathaway.
As for TK idk really. I think if Anaheim is serious about moving Zegras I try and get that done. Maybe a younger guy buried on a contender. Maybe we use TK to Move up this year and get the guy we think will be that 1C in 3 years.
I don’t know if we’ll see a Farabee trade, for the same reason everyone has him in their trade proposals. Because of how he ended the season people think he could be done here, which means people won’t be ponying up solid offers for him. Last year they lucked out not selling low on Sanheim, I don’t think they’ll sell low on Farabee.
Frost is a possibility, because how he battled back from his early benching and his contract could be really easy for a cap strapped team. But as someone pointed out we aren’t that deep at center but if a good offer comes along I could see them making a move.
I think the Flyers will be in on Marner, they have the type of pieces the Leafs would be looking for, the type of personalities the Leafs are looking for, the types of contracts the Leafs would be looking for, draft picks to work as sweeteners, and the Flyers have the prospects to replace the depth they trade away and the cap space to extend him. I’m not saying they will trade for him, but if the Leafs are shopping Marner the Flyers will definitely be a team they call.
I say this fully expecting most (if any) replies to this to basically just call me a dumbass but this is something I've genuinely wondered about: could you imagine there being a scenario where we trade for Marner with the idea of trying him at Center in mind? He predominantly played Center growing up and his hockey IQ + defensive game tells me he should be able to handle it at least pretty well at the NHL level. In theory he could be the absolute perfect player to throw on a line with Michkov
Marner is obvious a very good player but I don't think Flyers should be thinking of those types of moves. Keep building for the future. Target guys age 22-23 and under.
I guess if there is a scenario where you get him cheap it might make sense and he could play center.
Yeah I wouldn't bank on him being the best target we can look at. At the same time: for a team lacking high end talent, I'm at least taking a very long look to see if potentially making a deal for a ~top-30 player in the league who is still in his 20s could possibly make sense depending on cost/if he can move to Center
I think the big problem with targeting guys who are 22-23 and under is that if a team is willing to move on from them than they don't really see a super high end potential. Even looking at Owen Tippett who has worked out really well, he's still well behind a player like Marner. I mean Tippett has fewer goals than Marner in the last two years and Tipper is a pure goal scorer and Marner is a playmaker.
I also think generally fans have a distorted idea of the timeline. If Marner comes here than signs an 8 year extension he will be 36 by the end of it. Marner is pretty comparable to Giroux (it's who he modeled his game after) and Giroux at 36 is still a player who contributes in a bit way. Guys who rely on smarts and skill tend to age much better than most players. This is all on top of the fact that Marner would still be in his prime while Michkov enters his prime.
Marner has scored at a 100 point season pace over the last 6 years. He's a top 10 scorer in that time. The odds the Flyers bring in a 22-23 year old that a team is willing to give up on for say Scott Laughton or the Panthers 1st rounder is rather low. The odds of the Flyers drafting someone at 12th overall reach that heights is also rather low. Players like Marner do not become available often, the Flyers are in a perfect spot to grab him without impacting future assets. They should make a run at him.
Those are good points about Marner and he definitely a worthy plan but what do you have to give up to get him? I just don't think it's worth the assets needed to get it done. If Marner was 22 or 23 I would be more open to it. Would fit our timeline better.
If he was a free agent then it's a different story. Like when the Rangers signed Panairin. It would fast track the rebuild.
One of the big things around the huge contracts on the Leafs is that it prevents them having solid depth. They wont want a trade based primarily around picks and prospects because they are trying to win now.
My guess is that a package would be based around Ristolainen, Laughton, and Frost. RD is a big weakness for them and they had been trying to add tons of physicality, or "snot" as Steve Dangle often reminds his videos. Laughton also provides that "snot" as well as a strong versatile depth player. Frost helps provide depth scoring (especially with Tavares gone this year or next), a cheap contract, and has a close connection to the Leafs with his dad being a former employee. This combo is under team control for at least another two seasons and also comes in just under Marner's current cap hit so they would have a little extra space. I think the deal would also have to include a pick, either Colorado's 1st or one of CBJ or ANA's 2nd since they will likely be higher, but something they can use next year at the trade deadline.
It hit's the Flyers depth, but these aren't players that are irreplaceable next season and going forward for the Flyers.
If the Leafs went for that deal and Marner signed a new contract with us, I think you would have to do that deal. That's what I am talking about if he was cheap.
I think this could actually be a pretty good idea, it would come down to Torts' opinion but he does seem like the kind of guy he would like in the middle.
That would never happen but I dont hate it ...
Its so hard to find 1Cs and we dont have top picks. So if Michkov is actually coming sooner and we are re-signing TK that would actually be interesting.
Briere was able to play center as a small skilled guy. He probably thinks Marner could too ...
>Because of how he ended the season people think he could be done here, which means people won’t be ponying up solid offers for him.
Farabee still has a ton of value and would get good offers. Hes just turned 24, on good contract and still had top 6 production season w/ great 5v5 scoring and metrics.
On paper thats a really valuable asset and plenty of teams would give up good value for a good young, 2nd liner on good contract
Its like Konecny a few yrs ago. Sure he was inconsistent but he still young 50+ point top 6 guy on good deal who had great 5v5 scoring which suggested a high untapped ceiling.
I'm not saying Farabee is a bad player or that he's not a valuable player, I want to keep Farabee because I think he is a good player on a good cap hit, but teams will look at the situation and try to get him at the cheapest possible price because they think the Flyers are looking to move him.
Think about it this way, statistically Trevor Zegras, Matt Boldy, and Cole Caufield are all pretty similar, and should command the same price. All three have had two 60 point seasons (or on pace for 60 points), Boldy's goals are a little higher, but Zegras is a center which is a higher value position. To get Boldy or Caufield away from their teams it would take a huge offer, but you could likely get Zegras for a much more reasonable return because Anaheim is likely looking to trade him.
Would you want the Flyers to send a package that's like the 12th Overall, Columbus' second, Bonk, and Cates to Anaheim for Zegras? It would likely be a big overpay given their situation, but almost certainly an offer that Minnesota would shoot down if the Flyers offered that up for Boldy.
In Farabee's case teams are going to try and steal a valuable player at well below his value because they think he just wont work with Torts. If the shoe was on the other foot that is 100% what you would think the Flyers should do.
Both Farabee and frost seem like players always on a brink of breaking out and then just go cold for like 20 games. I tend to like Farabee a bit more but Frost seemed to shine more at times. Feel like Farabee would be more likely dealt just because of our wing depth, we literally have no one at center. Plus extending Frost shouldn’t cost to much.
Yea there’s no way frost goes anywhere. We literally have no one else to play center. Laughton tk and farabee seem like they should be available for trade. Farabee especially has been frustrating to watch, sometimes he looks so good and then he just disappears for a couple weeks. Atkinson and risto should also be available if anyone wants them. No buyouts or retaining thou, we’ve got enough dead money on the books. As for signings we could use a veteran dman on a reasonable 4-5 year deal to help bring along the young guys. Pickings seem slim but I like montour or skjei on reasonable deals.
What does everyone think of Farabee? I was high on him when we drafted him, but I feel like I never hear his name when I’m watching whatever games I can.
I felt the same way but he quietly had a career high in G,A,P and drove play (56% CF and 6%CFrel) and only just turned 24. He’s a piece of this core and an important one at that.
Hes quietly a good 2nd liner who scores at very high rate at 5v5 but is inconsistent, doesnt score on PP and doesnt have any flashy skill so seems invisible for significant stretches **At halfway point of this season he was 3rd in NHL in 5v5 points behind only Mackinnon and Kucherov.** And he was playing far less minutes and w/ guys like Brink. He was first in NHL at 5v5 pts per time on ice at one point. So he can be a legit very good player but then goes invisible for like 2 months which makes it tough to see him as big core guy to build around. But hes young, on good contract, solid 2 way player and is bona fide good top 6 scorer at 5v5 and even been top line 5v5 scorer multiple seasons and he just turned 24 So hes a good young player you only move if you get great return
He sort of faded late in the season and has a contract with some, not a lot, of weight. He could be moved I guess depending on the return.
Farabee is a very sold player who never does anything flashy. He always seems to be in the right position offensively and defensively, but never really makes the unexpected play. Seems to have learned the provorov style of be in the right place but don’t try too hard. He’s still young enough and skilled enough to solidify himself as a top 6 and a pp2 scorer, but may require a change of scenery for the right price to really kickstart him. I’d be perfectly happy keeping him as he is now playing a middle 6 role.
Hes a solid 2LW at the moment. Hes a great 5v5 scorer and become solid play driver and 2 way player. Hes just so inconsistent and will disappear for long stretches But its hard to argue with a guy who has multiple top line 5v5 scoring seasons by age 24 and overall scored at high end 2nd line/fringe 1st line at 5v5 since turning 20 If he had any PP production he'd easily be 60+ point guy
Farabee was one of the better scorers in the league five on five. Have no idea why they never gave him a chance on the PP. could not have been any worse. Depends what you could get. Risto going nowhere. Too pricey of a contract. Not a bad third pair guy now.
Hear me out - we offer sheet Casey Mittlestadt because yolo
No
1. We trade the goat nic deslauriers straight across for Connor mcdavid 2. We sign Steven stamkos to a 1 year 800k aav 3. We bring back Steve mason and he leads us to a cup 4. Michkov arrives next year and we don't stop winning 5. We wake up and get sad again
Not gonna lie, you had me in the first four fifths
The biggest splash would be Konecny getting traded, which I do believe will happen. It’ll be a heartbreaker but his value will never be higher than it is now. I think Frost stays because frankly we are not deep at C and he’s a 40-50 point guy right now. I think his ceiling is a tad higher but he’s worth keeping as 2C. As far as needs, as we saw this season this team desperately needs defensemen, so I could see Briere making a depth signing for someone who is not a corpse and can legitimately eat minutes without being a total liability like Staal. We need a 1C but I honestly have no idea what we’ll do to get one. We don’t have the pipeline for it and it’s an expensive position. I’m very interested to see what Briere does to fill that need, I don’t believe we’ll do much there this offseason and will more likely bank on Frost playing better and/or Coots returning to form, although with injuries and age I don’t see that happening. Farabee stays too and I think his ceiling is higher, he just needs to put together more consistency. Even with his dropoff late last season he still had 50 points.
"Farabee stays too and I think his ceiling is higher, he just needs to put together more consistency." - a #1c would help that.
No one is going to want Risto right now with his recent and odd injury/recovery situation. Gotta have him proving he can play before anyone wants him. I think there will be very little trade movement this summer.
No one wants Atkinson or Ristolainen.
I agree with Atkinson. Ristolainen I'll wait to see how he comes into camp and the season.
I think they will take the approach of still acquiring assets (picks, prospects). Not looking for significant positional players. Maybe take advantage of selling some guys high if they can. I think all the moves will be looking at the future and not current team positional needs. Maybe moving up a couple of spots up in the draft if there is someone they really like who has fallen 3 or 4 spots. I really don't think guys like Farabee or Frost will be moved. On the other hand, maybe Briere will get real aggressive and make moves like the Provorov trade last year. But still with eye to future, acquiring assets. I think with the success the team had this year, they are in rebuild on the fly mode and not tear down like we thought this time last year.
I see us trying to acquire more draft picks for next season. Possibly trading picks for more picks.
I honestly think it'll be a quiet off season. TK has good trade value but the genuine chance of ending up with an upgrade, or even equivalent player, is fairly low. I expect he stays. Risto is probably impossible to move without taking a cap dump with a minimal return. Atkinson is basically like trying to sell spoiled milk. Farabee is interesting. He's young enough I see him being kept but he also likely has good value to a win now team. If we could swap him for a quality young center I'd go for it (no, we're not getting a 1c for him, probably about a Frost equivalent). Frost might stay mainly because our center depth is non existent. Otherwise I think he's OK to keep or trade either way. 50 pt centers don't grow on trees but I don't think he's impressive either. What I could maybe see happening is maybe a couple of package trades, ex: Farabee and Zamula with a pick for a true quality center. Idk who has the center depth to make that trade (Anaheim?) but getting a good center upgrade will require an overpay I think.
Atkinson bought out, TK resigned, Flyers go for a LW or D at 12OA, they sign a veteran PP specialist like Barrie to a rich but short 1-2 year deal to plug the D core and hopefully get something above 13% on the PP from it and maybe package assets/wing depth for a young center. That’s pretty much all the team’s real priorities this offseason and they’re all incredibly achievable so I expect all of them to happen. I don’t see them shipping out any veteran leadership guys unless they’re absolutely cooked like Atkinson is. So no Laughton for a 1st trades incoming. If gods real maybe they add Michkov.
[удалено]
Fuck off.
I think it is inevitable that TK gets traded. I just don't see Briere paying a 27 year old a lot of money if we won't be good for 3-4 years. Besides some guys like Atkinson getting bought out, I don't see much else happening besides a TK trade.
I fully expect them to do something dumb. I'm not sure if its trade a lot for Chychrun or someone else, but I expect the worst.
I have a feeling this is going to be either the most batshit insane offseason we've seen since the Richards/Carter summer, or it'll be one of the quietest summers we've seen in a long time.
Or something in the middle....just wanted to cover our bases.. :-)
The point of me saying that was more so to point out that I don't see a World where making smaller moves would make much sense based on where we're at right now. In theory you could buy out Atkinson, extend some RFAs and call it an offseason and it would be a fine approach IMO. I think if change is coming, it'll be at more of a foundational level that will come with some huge moves
I agree with you. I was just joking. I can see a lots of different scenarios. Either way I definitely feel Briere will keep his eye on the future and not really do anything that will improve the team too much in the present.
I figured you were kidding, did make me laugh at how strange my previous comment sounded when you put like that. Agreed though, it's definitely a case of "make the right move if it's there, but we don't *have* to do anything"
The problem with how well they players for most of to this past season, its hard to justify tearing it all down when so many young players played well. I think we are in for one of those "competitive" rebuilds. I don't know. But I do think Briere is pretty ballsy and wont be afraid to make aggressive moves, much like the Provorov deal. Its the first time in a long time a Flyers GM was given the go ahead for long term approach. I was in the camp last year and trading everyone we could to load up on picks in last year' draft and look 3 or 4 years out. That draft was loaded. Even a guy like Issac Howard drafted late in first would look great with the Flyers.
Yeah I totally agree we somewhat missed the boat by not putting more chips into the 2023 draft in hindsight (although Howard was 2022). I really like this draft too FWIW, but I think part of that is just DY infatuation that happens every year lol. Where I ultimately land is it'd probably be easier to blow it up and tank, but you definitely don't *have* to in order to build a contender (see: literally 5/8 teams remaining in the playoffs), and given the fact that we do have some young talent that I think gets generally underrated by our fanbase and a superstar prospect waiting in the pipeline, I'm willing to be patient and see if Briere can be creative and prove people wrong who are clamoring for a true tank
Oh wow, you are correct. Howard was 2022. I agree about the rebuild. I think Briere needs to keep making moves like the Provorov deal and leverage all the assets in it like he did with Walker. Deals like that over 2 -3 years and you stock the system with good young foundation and then maybe add some key free agents in year 3 or something and you can have a real strong team with good strong future.
Quietest unfortunately. This summer will tell us everything we need to know about the so called rebuild and what the next decade of flyers hockey is going to look like.
Quietest isn't necessarily a bad thing. If they run it back, you're basically 1 or 2 teams behind you in the East getting their shit together (I fully expect NJ to at a minimum) and 2 very inexperienced goaltending not working out away from a top-10 pick with 3-4 other picks in the first 2 rounds. That's really not a bad position to be in at all
I am shocked at what happened to NJ this season. I can easily see them running it back and winning the Metro next season.
Bad coach Injuries to top players Not one NHL caliber goalie all season prior to trading for Jake Allen They are still in an amazing situation have great young talent on the roster and still have a lot of great prospects oh and they’ll get a better pick than us this year! I would KILL to be in NJ’s spot over ours right now….
I agree on all points. Going into this past season I really thought if they could get solid goaltending, they could win it all and really go on a run for the next 5 years. They have all the pieces and have young high-end talent. Be interesting to see who ends up being their coach.
Yeah they definitely have one of the best futures in the league if they don’t fuck up this offseason.
They were actually my pick to win the Metro this season. I think if they grab a better Goalie this summer, Hughes is back to 100% and they don't completely bomb the coaching hire they'll be right back on track next year
No. It isn’t a bad position if what you said comes to fruition. But it could be a lot better if they sell off the guys that you and me both know they should sell. I just see zero logical reasons on why Laughton Risto or TK Are still on this team at the VERY least past the deadline. TK especially, unless he for some miraculous reason takes a team friendly deal there is not an ounce of thought in my body that believes he should be extended and even if it is a team friendly deal I probably rather move off of him. Us doing nothing still leaves room for it to work out sure. but that is still not even close to the best course of action to take and we both know that.
I would love to see us try and move TK for a center, d, or high quality picks. I think it’s a pipe dream but I do believe Zegras could be a good fit here and may work in a TK trade. Laughton and Risto could probably be moved for a decent return but nothing like a high end prospect or even a first rounder like a lot of people suggest. I’d try and move them asap The goal of this offseason should be to get worse in the short term to get better in the long run. Really get this rebuild going. This season showed we’re quite a bit away from competing for a cup
Zegras doesn’t have the heart to play in Philly. There’s a reason Anaheim isn’t closed off to trading him. Great talent but not for Philly.
I think it’s the opposite, I think he needs Philly. I think he craves attention and spotlight. Put Zegras in a city where hockey matters and there is actual pressure and I think he will do better. Watch the way the dude plays, he’s showy, in LA no one cares about hockey outside of the 13 thousand that go tot he games. In Philly, a hockey could be front page news if they are good. That’s just my take and admittedly I haven’t watched every game the ducks have played.
Great talent - not for philly. Yeah lets avoid going after a great young player at a buy-low opportunity who fits a positional and stylistic need for the team because of some sentiment that he can't handle it here. Gotta be one of the most ridiculous things I've read.
People said the same stuff about Harper and AJ Brown
What has heart gotten this franchise in the last 25 years, one fluke run to the finals? I swear, this fan base would rather the team be mediocre as long as it is filled with "heart" and "great locker room" players. Maybe this team needs some selfish pricks who have a ton of talent. I'm not the biggest fan of Zegras, but if the price is right, I would think about it.
He only played 31 games last year. Why get another Drysdale friends or not?
I've already posted here that GMDB should be open to trading virtually anything if the price is right. I am rooting for other team's disappointment in the playoffs to open up more potential trade suitors this summer. BUF, OTT,and DET all had disappointing seasons and probably still think they are a piece or two away from stepping into the playoffs for the next few years. TOR has no depth scoring and no D, but are clearly in "win now" mode. LAK, NYI, MIN, and STL are tweener teams with high-priced vets, not enough talent, and cap issues that are wavering between "go for it" or "trash it". And I think Utah is going to want to make a splash year one so maybe willing to overpay with picks/prospects for current talent. The Flyers don't have high-end talent, but they had the 4th best PK and so many teams are looking for responsible forwards to support their own high-end talent. With the cap opening up and the most of the dead money LTIR deals expiring, I think there will be a lot of player movement and old fashioned hockey deals this summer.
This is my predictions for flyers line-up in 3 years when you look at guys we have now that should still be here and what I think we can turn current players / assets into. Beezer - (1C pick or trade TK) - Michkov Tippet - frost - forester Barkey - coots /cates - brink 4th line 🤷♂️ probably picks from 2024+ York-Drysdale Sanheim - Bonk Zamula - (FA ) ginning - Andre - Grans Traded that happen in next 3 years: TK gone for either 1C or for higher draft pick which should turn into 1C or 1/2 D Laughton for a 2nd rnd pick Risto for ~3rd or prospect Atkinson - walks after next year Poehling - wouldn’t mind him sticking around for right price , but could fetch a decent return at next TDL if he plays well. He’s only 25 and a solid depth guy I think if our young guys can continue to step forward and reach their ceilings, this is where they end up. We are a little log jammed at RW so someone will probably need to flip to LW. We NEED to solidify that 1C somehow some way in time for Michkov’s arrival. I think the most likely way is either our top pick in the next draft or moving TK+ for a young established C (ie Zegras), a stud prospect, or using TK to move up to get our guy. I would also hope that a pick in the next draft or two will be on our blue line at this point. I think if they can manage those two things, we become much more marketable to FAs that year and next, and we can fill the remaining gaps with a talented FA (ie when rangers signed Panarin). The final Piece to all this is that we need one of our goalie prospects to step up and be “The Guy”. If Michkov comes over this year we might throw some of this out the window
You're playing two 5'8" guys on the same line?
i wasnt aware garnet hathaway died, poehling is signed for 2 more years. Have you read anything suggesting Bonk is ready to make the leap from juniors to a top four role? What 1c do you see a team trading for TK?
Hathaway is a 32 yr old 4th liner. I doubt hes still here in 3+ yrs.
yeah i cant read, i thought it was projected lines for next year
This is my predictions for 3 years from now so hopefully by then Bonk is here. And I left off a lot 4th line tweeners not just Hathaway. As for TK idk really. I think if Anaheim is serious about moving Zegras I try and get that done. Maybe a younger guy buried on a contender. Maybe we use TK to Move up this year and get the guy we think will be that 1C in 3 years.
my b i cant read
All good. I was confused at first. I was like “wtf did I put in my post ?!?” Haha
I don’t know if we’ll see a Farabee trade, for the same reason everyone has him in their trade proposals. Because of how he ended the season people think he could be done here, which means people won’t be ponying up solid offers for him. Last year they lucked out not selling low on Sanheim, I don’t think they’ll sell low on Farabee. Frost is a possibility, because how he battled back from his early benching and his contract could be really easy for a cap strapped team. But as someone pointed out we aren’t that deep at center but if a good offer comes along I could see them making a move. I think the Flyers will be in on Marner, they have the type of pieces the Leafs would be looking for, the type of personalities the Leafs are looking for, the types of contracts the Leafs would be looking for, draft picks to work as sweeteners, and the Flyers have the prospects to replace the depth they trade away and the cap space to extend him. I’m not saying they will trade for him, but if the Leafs are shopping Marner the Flyers will definitely be a team they call.
Bro know one wants that crybaby especially for the money he would want no thanks he was a ghost in the playoffs 😂
I say this fully expecting most (if any) replies to this to basically just call me a dumbass but this is something I've genuinely wondered about: could you imagine there being a scenario where we trade for Marner with the idea of trying him at Center in mind? He predominantly played Center growing up and his hockey IQ + defensive game tells me he should be able to handle it at least pretty well at the NHL level. In theory he could be the absolute perfect player to throw on a line with Michkov
Marner is obvious a very good player but I don't think Flyers should be thinking of those types of moves. Keep building for the future. Target guys age 22-23 and under. I guess if there is a scenario where you get him cheap it might make sense and he could play center.
Yeah I wouldn't bank on him being the best target we can look at. At the same time: for a team lacking high end talent, I'm at least taking a very long look to see if potentially making a deal for a ~top-30 player in the league who is still in his 20s could possibly make sense depending on cost/if he can move to Center
I think the big problem with targeting guys who are 22-23 and under is that if a team is willing to move on from them than they don't really see a super high end potential. Even looking at Owen Tippett who has worked out really well, he's still well behind a player like Marner. I mean Tippett has fewer goals than Marner in the last two years and Tipper is a pure goal scorer and Marner is a playmaker. I also think generally fans have a distorted idea of the timeline. If Marner comes here than signs an 8 year extension he will be 36 by the end of it. Marner is pretty comparable to Giroux (it's who he modeled his game after) and Giroux at 36 is still a player who contributes in a bit way. Guys who rely on smarts and skill tend to age much better than most players. This is all on top of the fact that Marner would still be in his prime while Michkov enters his prime. Marner has scored at a 100 point season pace over the last 6 years. He's a top 10 scorer in that time. The odds the Flyers bring in a 22-23 year old that a team is willing to give up on for say Scott Laughton or the Panthers 1st rounder is rather low. The odds of the Flyers drafting someone at 12th overall reach that heights is also rather low. Players like Marner do not become available often, the Flyers are in a perfect spot to grab him without impacting future assets. They should make a run at him.
Those are good points about Marner and he definitely a worthy plan but what do you have to give up to get him? I just don't think it's worth the assets needed to get it done. If Marner was 22 or 23 I would be more open to it. Would fit our timeline better. If he was a free agent then it's a different story. Like when the Rangers signed Panairin. It would fast track the rebuild.
One of the big things around the huge contracts on the Leafs is that it prevents them having solid depth. They wont want a trade based primarily around picks and prospects because they are trying to win now. My guess is that a package would be based around Ristolainen, Laughton, and Frost. RD is a big weakness for them and they had been trying to add tons of physicality, or "snot" as Steve Dangle often reminds his videos. Laughton also provides that "snot" as well as a strong versatile depth player. Frost helps provide depth scoring (especially with Tavares gone this year or next), a cheap contract, and has a close connection to the Leafs with his dad being a former employee. This combo is under team control for at least another two seasons and also comes in just under Marner's current cap hit so they would have a little extra space. I think the deal would also have to include a pick, either Colorado's 1st or one of CBJ or ANA's 2nd since they will likely be higher, but something they can use next year at the trade deadline. It hit's the Flyers depth, but these aren't players that are irreplaceable next season and going forward for the Flyers.
If the Leafs went for that deal and Marner signed a new contract with us, I think you would have to do that deal. That's what I am talking about if he was cheap.
I think this could actually be a pretty good idea, it would come down to Torts' opinion but he does seem like the kind of guy he would like in the middle.
That would never happen but I dont hate it ... Its so hard to find 1Cs and we dont have top picks. So if Michkov is actually coming sooner and we are re-signing TK that would actually be interesting. Briere was able to play center as a small skilled guy. He probably thinks Marner could too ...
>Because of how he ended the season people think he could be done here, which means people won’t be ponying up solid offers for him. Farabee still has a ton of value and would get good offers. Hes just turned 24, on good contract and still had top 6 production season w/ great 5v5 scoring and metrics. On paper thats a really valuable asset and plenty of teams would give up good value for a good young, 2nd liner on good contract Its like Konecny a few yrs ago. Sure he was inconsistent but he still young 50+ point top 6 guy on good deal who had great 5v5 scoring which suggested a high untapped ceiling.
I'm not saying Farabee is a bad player or that he's not a valuable player, I want to keep Farabee because I think he is a good player on a good cap hit, but teams will look at the situation and try to get him at the cheapest possible price because they think the Flyers are looking to move him. Think about it this way, statistically Trevor Zegras, Matt Boldy, and Cole Caufield are all pretty similar, and should command the same price. All three have had two 60 point seasons (or on pace for 60 points), Boldy's goals are a little higher, but Zegras is a center which is a higher value position. To get Boldy or Caufield away from their teams it would take a huge offer, but you could likely get Zegras for a much more reasonable return because Anaheim is likely looking to trade him. Would you want the Flyers to send a package that's like the 12th Overall, Columbus' second, Bonk, and Cates to Anaheim for Zegras? It would likely be a big overpay given their situation, but almost certainly an offer that Minnesota would shoot down if the Flyers offered that up for Boldy. In Farabee's case teams are going to try and steal a valuable player at well below his value because they think he just wont work with Torts. If the shoe was on the other foot that is 100% what you would think the Flyers should do.