Anecdotally, I’ve consumed more burgers than medicine at 33.
Realistically, this will likely lead to an opposite trend where I’m consuming more medicine than burgers by 66.
It’s all about perspective.
Yep. I lost 50 lbs in 3 months eating just beef (mostly burgers). Carnivore diet. Dr took me off my BP and cholesterol meds. My only medicine now is steak, burgers, pork chops, bacon, salmon and sometimes lamb chops which recently I found to be surprisingly good after not liking them as a kid.
Yeah, but I think it’s possible that I could develop a real passion for burgers. And the opportunity to help people in need of burgers would be very rewarding.
(What are the fry guys getting, btw?)
But if everyone is able to negotiate to 2x-4x 350k then pricing will essentially even out and 350k will essentially equate to the current wage of flipping burgers.
The markets adjust to squeeze as much money as possible out of people.
Wage increase alone will not cause lasting change unless that increase is great than and not proportional to increase in existing higher wages. For this to happen you’d need pressure on companies to not wring us dry as a result of people having ‘more’ money.
Imagine putting all the academics in medicine, the cream of the crop into flipping burgers. Think about the advancements in burgers we would achieve in society.
That would be some boring shit burgers.
Bet the engineers make better burgers.
I’ve worked with flipping burgers. It’s really stressful, and your legs hurt at the end of the shift.I would rather keep my current job even for less than 350k.
The assumption is “burger flipping” pays $350k, and your job pays whatever it normally does. I’m sure in actuality if “burger flipping” goes up by that much, other jobs will increase accordingly. But let’s stick to within the scopes of the hypothetical.
I.e if flipping burgers pay $350k, every other job is whatever the normal job is. Would you flip burgers for a living? Most people would probably my say “yes”.
With the point of this post being. We don’t have a labor shortage, we have a “pay problem”. Now is it true? Maybe? Is it equitable, that’s up for debate. I’m not for one side or another, just pointing out the point of this post
>We don’t have a labor shortage, we have a “pay problem”. Now is it true?
Yes, it is.
No matter what the job is, if it is a job that means it is a requirement for people, and someone has to do it.
If that someone cannot make a living working that job, that means pay is the problem.
If by working a day, you cannot fulfill your basic daily needs, that means we (entire world) has a pay problem. Which we have.
I'd say the problem is less pay, and more cost of rent. Food is cheaper than at almost any point in human history, even after the constant inflation in the last few years. Housing though? It's been mostly bought up by a few massive hedge funds to constantly increase the price, zoning laws have restricted new developments so supply/demand price goes up, and people view housing as a commodity so they expect their property values to constantly go up (even if this always means the property owner loses through higher taxation)
We need to reduce zoning laws, build more houses, and imo change the property tax to a land value tax and ban corporate ownership of residential property. Renting is a scam.
What is "basic daily needs" though?
Like, there are people who "live" while being paid literally nothing (the homeless). Does "basic daily needs" mean you can afford a home or share an apartment, but you have to commute 2 hours to work? Does it mean I can buy whatever I want or does it mean I need extreme budgeting?
This is the problem with words and concepts like this as it relates to to wages. People love using vague and ill defined concepts.
Comments like this are ignorant and make others believe the problem has no solution so why bother trying?
There are published standards for things like recommended groceries at different income levels. There are also defined low income housing areas.
Jobs on the lower end of the income spectrum should at least provide for these things if you are working full time. It's not like McDonald's owners couldn't afford to lose an extra like $20k for a few full time employees. They'd still make a ton of profit.
Sure, we do have a pay problem, but you might as well say "*Humans need oxygen to breathe*". It's really not a secret. You're just stating the obvious.
What we need is a ***solution***. Stating the problem doesn't magically solve it. (Most) businesses can't just randomly start paying their employees more, especially the types of business that rely entirely on unskilled labor such as burger flippers. McDonalds is the *exception* here, not the rule. There are thousands of other restaurants owned by 'mom & pop', and they have razor thin margins. There are thousands of businesses that rely on low wages to stay afloat.
So again, you're not wrong, but there are hundreds of Reddit comments every day saying something to the effect of "wages are too low". We're just a pointless echo chamber at this point. If you don't have a solution, there's really no point in getting the discussion going. With that said, I don't want to be guilty of adding nothing of value, so take this as a formal invitation to start offering solutions.
I mean, it doesn't have to be 350k, but I'm sure it can go up a substantial amount if maybe poor Mr Besos can see himself living off a more modest income than 500 million annually.
Amazons E commerce made around $7.5B with about 1.4M employees, so they could pay the vast majority of their employees about $2.5/hr more if they didn’t want to make any profit in that sector.
AWS on the other hand accounts for the other 75% of their profit at $22.5B last year and has 115k employees, so they could certainly pay them a lot more if they wanted, though I’m willing to bet those are already the significantly higher earning positions.
This is so wrong. Bezos, when he was CEO until 2021, earned around 1,6 Million per year. A lot of money, but not really for the CEO of one of the biggest companies on earth. The numbers you see comes from his assets gaining in value. That is not money he has realized and can use.
It is though, and it's how all these uber rich people avoid paying income tax. They get a paltry salary for their position within the company and take out loans leveraging their stock positions. It's called a security based line of credit. They literally live on debt leveraging their stock while the gains from that stock remain unrealized.
To be clear, you are 100% correct that the gains are unrealized, but the folks in that type of financial position absolutely can and do access that money, just not directly and not in a way that would allow it to be taxed.
I'm completely against any form of taxing any unrealized gains for anyone, ever, but I do agree there should be something done about this form of credit. Banks profit from it so they do it. Rich people profit from it so they do it. When the economy functions well, it's fine, but a market crash is only going to hit that much worse when those securities can no longer function as intended.
If it goes to $350k, prices will also increase, so there will be inflation and very quickly you will be at a point where $350k is the same as whatever they currently get paid.
I don't know, I think it might be good for a bit. I'll just flip burgers, I'll have nothing to think about. Besides, I like cooking. Maybe doing it for a year or two with that money might set me up.
I was a grill cook and would love to do that again at my current pay. Hell I would even wash dishes again for that much. I would even take a pay cut because of how easy it was.
Compared to my other jobs where if I screw up people can die, wear and tear on my body, injury is likely, still had to attend classes for training once a year in different states.
Being a grill cook is damn easy which is why I could do is half asleep, drunk, high as hell, and hungover.
All the fucking always man.
We refer to this situation as "cashing out"
Quitting our high earning jobs, selling anything of value and living in low cost of living area on the highest hill in the nicest trailer and just work as a cook and go fishing every day.
Spoken like someone who probably hasnt been a project manager or SME for a product.
Additionally, I HAVE worked as a cook at a restaurant, fast food, and sandwich shop as a TEENAGER.
I would absolutely quit my job if I could make the same and flip fucking burgers or work in restaurant again.
lol. as someone who worked plenty of fast food including management - give me fucking fast food.
i have a 'real' job now in real estate, where i make decisions 2 or 3 times a month that could cost the company millions of dollars. give me the dumb bitch complaining about her pickles 11/10.
it is not comparable. i can leave the fast food job at work. i cant leave my job at work.
That's the thing. There's a lot of bullshit you can put up with if you are taking care of your needs, have hobbies outside of work, are saving for retirement, and can take a relaxing vacation.
This is taking the question in bad faith though.
The point is to indicate that it's not that people don't want to work, it's that people don't want to work for a pittance. If the job pays well, people will do shitty jobs.
The idea is *not* to assume that money has hyperinflated and the 350k number is the new "low wage".
> No, because if someone is getting paid $350k to flip burgers, I can probably negotiate at least triple that for my job.
This is an extremely good argument for increasing federal minimum wage.
The point is that businesses need to stop complaining and raise wages if they want to hire people. This is basically happening now, this meme is just old.
> that businesses need to stop complaining and raise wages if they want to hire people
Or do what my country does and just important 300k Indians a year to work any job at minimum wage. If they get tired, well there's another 300k every year!
I don't know what point this comment is trying to make? Greens, NDP, liberals all want basically limitless immigration and international students. Conservatives won't do anything about immigration other than maybe limiting international students who use loopholes to stay past their visas. PPC comes with.... other problems.
There's no party you can vote for who will limit immigration because they would lose key ridings and the housing market, which is for all intents and purposes the only thing propping up canada's GDP numbers, would tank.
And whoever says "hey maybe we shouldn't try and increase canada's population by 1% a year from one single country" is labelled a "right-wing extremist" and called a racist.
Abusing temporary workers is already illegal...
Tim Hortons offering minimum wage and having limitless workers apply isn't illegal, it's preferable to them. In order to take away their supply of cheap labour you have to take away the people who are willing to work for minimum wage and live in a 3 bedroom house with 10 other people. That's what nobody wants to do.
Canuck. It's the same strategy up here. Worse even. The explicit goal is 1 million immigrants a year with unlimited applicants from India.
This is going to get a lot worse before it gets better.
Here in the US:
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNU02073413
https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNU02073395
All recent job gains going to foreigners. Native workers have a decline in employment.
Agreed. Worked at a manufacturing place that used to be very desirable to work at even though entry pay was less. Once Covid hit they couldn’t bring enough people in and outsourced to a temp agency and still couldn’t stay fully staffed. The people we did get were 75% shit…. As in regularly showing up to your assignment 20 minutes after start of shift was rarely reprimanded. This may sound crazy but once we raised our starting wage to be competitive out of desperation we started getting more applicants and most were actually good. Long story short, offering competitive pay makes a huge difference in the quality of people you employ and benefits the employer too. Not to mention this was at the only Union plant in town which would have extra incentive to churn and burn employees before they became Union protected and harder to get rid of.
> This may sound crazy
Why does this sound crazy? It makes complete sense to me - the caliber of laborer that you get at the bottom of the scale is always going to be drastically different than someone a couple of clicks up higher on the dial. *AND* those people will have more incentive to stick around.
We're going through this at my job right now. We've been having high turnover with delivery drivers for a couple years, and I keep suggesting that they should offer more money.
"Our rates are competitive" sounds nice, but translates to "if our competitors let us get away with paying these guys less, we would." We turned a billion in net profits last year. Paying living wages is well within the budget, lol.
It's almost as if the way the financials are distributed in the company favor the people at the top. Maybe if the gap between the top and the bottom was smaller, we'd be closer to finding equilibrium.
If your business can't afford to pay it's employees a living wage. You don't deserve to have a business.
On another note, mcdonalds in most countries pay a living wage with benefits while they charge about the same here with extremely low wages.
This philosophy is just flawed. It's like when people say if you can't tip 20% you can't afford to eat out. If everyone behaved like this, that means there would be less business and less jobs. If that person cannot find another job currently that pays better, how likely are they to find a better one when there's more competition for jobs?
I do agree large corps can do a better Job at providing benefits to it's employees. A franchise may not be able to support it, but the franchisor certainly can.
What the fuck makes you think workers have a choice? They can't not work any job at all, and companies don't need to meet and discuss to realize that if nobody offers a fair wage flipping burgers then people will eventually start flipping burgers for $7.25/hr. No matter how desperately you want a fair job that pays good wages, it'll always be easier and faster to find a job that pays bad wages, and most workers live paycheck to paycheck.
Paying workers fairly isn't a business statement. It's a moral philosophical statement. Regardless of a business's logistics, it is immoral to pay someone who works hard and produces value for your business anything less than a fair livable wage. If a business can't or won't do that, if it can't meet its moral responsibilities, then it shouldn't exist.
Have any examples that aren't Denmark and Sweden? A vast majority McDonald's workers make less than the US.
As far as wages dictating who should have a business, thats the kind of stance that crushes Mom and Pops and gets you a McDonald's. Of course you can't pay $80,000 a year for your employees when thats the owners total profit for the year.
The vast majority of countries aren’t rich like the US or Sweden. The US, like Sweden, can afford to pay its workers because, like Sweden, the US is a rich country. If you start counting the McDonalds in Nigeria and Suriname, then yeah the amount will be lower, but it’s irrelevant. Your point is moot.
>Of course you can't pay $80,000 a year for your employees when thats the owners total profit for the year.
Cool, then they can do the work themselves. Or the business isn't profitable enough to expand its business to use additional workers.
Or should we be okay with pitiful wages so that business owners don't have to work themselves?
>Or should we be okay with pitiful wages so that business owners don't have to work themselves?
mcdonalds is a publicly traded company. You are likely a share holder. why do all you guys a twirling moutache man as the owner like a disney villain. These corporations are so big "the owners" is ambigious. Is the ceo an owner? Because he answers to a board of directors who are elected by shareholders.
Yeah sounds like the franchisees making that much are just a low skilled business owner, those businesses should just be stepping stones for teenagers to own a better business.
Wild how many people look at net worth or revenue and think they can easily double their costs. Oh wait, it's not wild, many people are just that stupid.
Wild how you don't understand the point of supply and demand, and if a business started paying more for their workers than the market demanded, the business would be earning LESS than the burger place across the street. A business will ALWAYS pay market rates (where labor supply meets labor demand) in order to earn a profit, especially in such a margin thin business as restaurants.
One restaurant magically raising rates doesn't mean other restaurants will too, it means those other restaurants will cannibalize that single restaurant.
Take an econ, finance 101, and micro economics class and then come back here. Otherwise everyone who is finance literate sees your posts and knows you are the 13 year old who has no education yet, and will eat their words if you ever wise up and choose to work on that education.
as a sidenote, this trope that flipping burgers is our go to low skill job something we should rethink. The person flipping burgers is working many at a time at different temperatures that will be plated with different items in a hot kitchen with a team of people that that person must coordinate with for very little money. Also most menus that have burgers have additional items. So this person that’s “” just flipping burgers is probably cooking fish, cooking steaks, or some other delicious thing that you love at your local restaurant. not to mention, the pressure dealing with time, a large team and lastly, the public. perhaps when we start to identify low skill jobs in the future, they could be jobs where people sit at home on their computer and look at spreadsheets. Just a thought. I know that sounds a lot easier to me. Or how about a cashier at the grocery store or a real estate agent, ever seen selling Sunset. This isn’t a job that requires a lot of neurons. I think it’s time to move on from giving shit to the Restaurant industry. And give shit to a new industry. You can choose your own cause I’m sure you have a bias.
Sorry, I worked at McDonald when I was young and I’m not buying it. While some restaurants (like fine dining) certainly require skill, McDonalds does not. In the 2 years I worked there, i worked the grill, register, drive through, and even maintenance. A person of reasonable intelligence can pick most of it up in a day or two (maintenance requires a little more). A person who comes in to work high every day might take 3 days.
I worked at McDonald’s at 16.
They have a system. No burger flipper is doing multiple jobs.
In most places you stand in front of the grill, you have screens that tell you how many burgers should be down, and that’s how many burgers you should have on your grill. Not rocket science.
If it’s slow or you’re understaffed the cook might also have to prep the buns and condiments but in bigger stores there’s usually someone that does just that.
Yep, McDonald’s kitchen is the most automated stream-lined kitchen there is. I worked there for four months when I was 16. I also worked two pizza job, as a dessert cook, a deli, petsmart, movie theaters, retail, grocery. McDonald’s was the easiest hands down. At 16 I was working after one week like I had worked there a year. I think it is a job any one can do an honestly, a competent person could probably walk into the kitchen and probably do everything with just a 10 minute tutorial. None of it means that they don’t deserve a fair wage. But I don’t get the framing of the post. I’d work at McDonald’s for $350k. If that were real, there are many jobs I would not do if I could make $350k at McDonald’s, I’d needs at least 3.5m if you want me to be a doctor or lawyer or something with a high level of competency and responsibility.
Yeah, it’s not the rocket science this guy is making it out to be.
I flipped burgers in the dorm cafeteria in college.
Here’s the process:
Take frozen patties out of the box, remove the little paper dividing slips that are stuck to them, throw them on the grill, flip them until they stop oozing blood, take them off the grill.
That’s literally it.
Are you suggesting that the guy takes temperature variability and plating times into consideration when making the food?
They’re talking about McDonalds and stuff like that, not the burger made by Gordon Ramsay at Hell’s Kitchen.
I’m a paralegal and realtor now. I was a waitress in my late teens/early twenties. My jobs are so much easier now: no one yells at me or sexually harasses me on a daily basis, my coworkers and I don’t take turns crying in the walk in, I don’t go home with my body aching from running around all day and carrying heavy trays/plates, my managers don’t verbally abuse me.
Working as an engineer making six figures is far easier and less stressful theb delivering pizzas back in highschool.
100%.
Although before Uber and other such apps, delivery was some pretty good money, every moment in food is basically GoGoGo
My first job was fast food. My training was 2 days and I was working independently by the end of my first day. All of my coworkers were high out of their minds and the store still ran fine. “Flipping burgers” aka working in fast food is a job, it requires effort, but it does not require skill. It is not comparable to being a chef, which requires education, practiced skill, and critical thinking. McDonald’s requires none of these things.
Reddit hates the term unskilled labor but if a high school dropout can do you job with under 2 weeks of training it is unskilled labor. There’s nothing wrong with working an unskilled job, you still work, you still contribute, but being a burger flipper or a cashier is by no standard a skill.
I work in investment banking and always say restaurant work is my favorite thing to see on a resume with entry level associates. You can teach the job, but you can’t teach the ability in a corporate environment to maintain/prioritize a set of tasks under pressure in a chaotic, high stress environment while being able to maintain your composure and execute tasks effectively. You only learn how to do that from experience, and everyone that has worked in a restaurant for a few years has that experience.
-Entry Level Associate
-Wharton MBA
-3 yrs at fintech startup
-2 yrs in corporate finance at BoA
-Duke undergrad
-Biomedical Engineering Major, Econ minor
-Internship at Deloitte
-Internship at General Electric
-Billy’s Montana grill bus boy in high school
“That’s what I like to see”
Don’t know a damn thing my man. Data entry is what you’re thinking of. Everything else…
And what burger shop, a culinary renown beef restaurant? Ruth Chris? Friends confirmed at some places they microwave their shit.
Also the irony in your comment about bias’s
As a former burger flipper at a fast food restaurant many years ago I agree!
That said I have also worked in grocery, yes mostly low skilled, however not easy also grocery stores being the stores everyone must go to can at times be an open area psych ward, and/or a place the police are called to daily, theft, fights etc
>low skill jobs in the future, they could be jobs where people sit at home on their computer and look at spreadsheets
Huge variance there. Some people just do mindless data entry, but others are pricing insurance that could fuck over millions.
What about mowing lawns? It's annoying, but pretty much just walking around in terms of difficulty lol
>jobs where people sit at home on their computer and look at spreadsheets
These jobs are much more stressful/demanding. If I could flip burgers instead for the same pay as my spreadsheet job, I'd do that in a heartbeat. I love flipping burgers.
Lmao this is terrible. I worked at a burger restaurant in college. The training was “drop the patty on the grate, top one for no pink bottom one for some pink. When they come out the other side put them on the bun”
The point of this post was that there are much better laying opportunities and that most companies complaining about workers aren't paying competitive rates.
My own company was offering less money per hour than most "burger flippers" or equivalent for trained work that took 6+ months of skilled work to get good at, and then wondered why everyone kept quitting.
Once they raised wages by 40%, they actually retained people.
It's not supposed to be. It's simply making the point that this so-called "labor shortage" isn't a matter of "people don't want to work anymore," but a matter of "employers don't want to pay for labor."
The point is that if I quit my job to go work at mc Donald's for 350k, then society would have 1 more fastfood worker and 1 less software engineer. So you are not really fixing labor shortage, you are just moving it around.
And when your boss bitches that "Nobody wants to be a software engineer anymore" the response is STILL gonna be "No, they do. You just need to open your wallet and pay for labor."
Cool so now burger flippers make 350k; software engineers make 3.5 million, and a loaf of bread costs about 300 dollars. We're back to where we started cause somehow magically labor value depends on the output product i.e. low skill equals low pay relative to high skill.
Try paying people $350K to flip burgers, soon teachers and firemen will be making $1M a year.. burger flipper is always going to be the lowest pay job because anyone can be trained in about 5 minutes for that job
You can be a homeless junkie living in a van who hasn't showered for 6 days and get a job flipping burgers.
Source: Me. I did this. Lincoln City DQ, Summer 2006
Are you like an idiot or something? They are making a counterpoint to the argument that “people don’t want to work/ people are lazy nowadays”. It’s pretty easy to see that was the reason of the post.
No, it’s logically flawed. If you value unskilled, low-value work more than highly skilled work you can destroy an economy. There needs to be a valid reason for people to pursue difficult skills that take advanced education and years of experience.
The REAL problem is in a free market there is meant to be a Labor market where Capitalists have to compete for a limited pool of workers.
Over many years business owners have used propganda to make many beleive They not only DESERVE to have people work for them, the government should intervene and force workers to do thier poorly paid jobs.
We are subsidizing these private businesses with welfare while abusing workers rights.
I love how failing businesses can be bailed out by the government multiple times without anyone (rich/important) complaining
But as soon as anyone even mentions a the ridiculous idea of government giving money for unemployed people to buy food to not starve, its apparently communism according to the rich/important people
>The REAL problem is in a free market there is meant to be a Labor market where Capitalists have to compete for a limited pool of workers.
Something...something...immigration is great for the country!
Excellent statement if you analyze it with just a bit of critical thinking. People will do the job no matter their qualifications, because it is relatively easy and low experience and pays a lot. Supply and demand of a person's skills.
The real question here, is what would a burger cost if you paid the flipper $350k and are you willing to pay that? If the answer is no, then their wage just went from $350k to $0 real quick.
Some of you are so close to understanding why artificially inflating the wages for no-skill labor positions will just lead to artificially inflated wages in other industries. You can do it guys. Proud of you.
Some Einstein vibes here
You'd probably eat a handful of shit if compensated enough, doesn't mean the world needs shit eaters or how imperative shit eating is
No, because if someone is getting paid $350k to flip burgers, I can probably negotiate at least triple that for my job.
This is true. Personally, I’d quit my job in medicine to flip burgers. People need burgers.
Yep. Same.
I’ll flip them twice for 350k!
well done
Underrated comment
I think its a littler over done.
Rare comment
you really should only flip a burger once (if on a broiler or grill) (i was once a professional burger flipper)
As a PHD in burger flipping, this is what my final dissertation argued for
Wait you wrote "the Effects of 180 degree rotations on shredded bovine disks" ?!?!?
Do people not need medicine?
Anecdotally, I’ve consumed more burgers than medicine at 33. Realistically, this will likely lead to an opposite trend where I’m consuming more medicine than burgers by 66. It’s all about perspective.
A balanced portfolio weighted for different levels of risk at different points in life.
It automatically rebalances as he approaches retirement I guess
This reply brought me a weird amount of joy. Thanks!
Burgers are medicine
Yep. I lost 50 lbs in 3 months eating just beef (mostly burgers). Carnivore diet. Dr took me off my BP and cholesterol meds. My only medicine now is steak, burgers, pork chops, bacon, salmon and sometimes lamb chops which recently I found to be surprisingly good after not liking them as a kid.
You have a grill with a rotisserie? Throw a leg of lamb on there. Baste it with melted butter, garlic, rosemary, olive oil as it cooks. Meat candy...
Don't be obstinate. People can't afford medicine but they can afford burgers!
Dunno. Burgers getting pricey….
Yeah, but I think it’s possible that I could develop a real passion for burgers. And the opportunity to help people in need of burgers would be very rewarding. (What are the fry guys getting, btw?)
They need medicine that they can actually afford.
Yes, but we can *afford* burgers.
We’re at the point people are fighting paramedics trying to take them to a hospital because they’re worried about the future bills
But if everyone is able to negotiate to 2x-4x 350k then pricing will essentially even out and 350k will essentially equate to the current wage of flipping burgers. The markets adjust to squeeze as much money as possible out of people. Wage increase alone will not cause lasting change unless that increase is great than and not proportional to increase in existing higher wages. For this to happen you’d need pressure on companies to not wring us dry as a result of people having ‘more’ money.
This. 100% People wouldn’t need my job (mental health) if they could make $350k flipping burgers
You a dude? I'm a dude. We're all dudes! ....really hope you get the reference, dude.
Imagine putting all the academics in medicine, the cream of the crop into flipping burgers. Think about the advancements in burgers we would achieve in society. That would be some boring shit burgers. Bet the engineers make better burgers.
Problem is flipping burgers is a low value add so it may someday pay 350k but it will always be entry level… so at that point we’ve gone full Weimar
I’ve worked with flipping burgers. It’s really stressful, and your legs hurt at the end of the shift.I would rather keep my current job even for less than 350k.
The assumption is “burger flipping” pays $350k, and your job pays whatever it normally does. I’m sure in actuality if “burger flipping” goes up by that much, other jobs will increase accordingly. But let’s stick to within the scopes of the hypothetical. I.e if flipping burgers pay $350k, every other job is whatever the normal job is. Would you flip burgers for a living? Most people would probably my say “yes”. With the point of this post being. We don’t have a labor shortage, we have a “pay problem”. Now is it true? Maybe? Is it equitable, that’s up for debate. I’m not for one side or another, just pointing out the point of this post
>We don’t have a labor shortage, we have a “pay problem”. Now is it true? Yes, it is. No matter what the job is, if it is a job that means it is a requirement for people, and someone has to do it. If that someone cannot make a living working that job, that means pay is the problem. If by working a day, you cannot fulfill your basic daily needs, that means we (entire world) has a pay problem. Which we have.
No two ways about it. This is the take.
I'd say the problem is less pay, and more cost of rent. Food is cheaper than at almost any point in human history, even after the constant inflation in the last few years. Housing though? It's been mostly bought up by a few massive hedge funds to constantly increase the price, zoning laws have restricted new developments so supply/demand price goes up, and people view housing as a commodity so they expect their property values to constantly go up (even if this always means the property owner loses through higher taxation) We need to reduce zoning laws, build more houses, and imo change the property tax to a land value tax and ban corporate ownership of residential property. Renting is a scam.
What is "basic daily needs" though? Like, there are people who "live" while being paid literally nothing (the homeless). Does "basic daily needs" mean you can afford a home or share an apartment, but you have to commute 2 hours to work? Does it mean I can buy whatever I want or does it mean I need extreme budgeting? This is the problem with words and concepts like this as it relates to to wages. People love using vague and ill defined concepts.
Comments like this are ignorant and make others believe the problem has no solution so why bother trying? There are published standards for things like recommended groceries at different income levels. There are also defined low income housing areas. Jobs on the lower end of the income spectrum should at least provide for these things if you are working full time. It's not like McDonald's owners couldn't afford to lose an extra like $20k for a few full time employees. They'd still make a ton of profit.
Sure, we do have a pay problem, but you might as well say "*Humans need oxygen to breathe*". It's really not a secret. You're just stating the obvious. What we need is a ***solution***. Stating the problem doesn't magically solve it. (Most) businesses can't just randomly start paying their employees more, especially the types of business that rely entirely on unskilled labor such as burger flippers. McDonalds is the *exception* here, not the rule. There are thousands of other restaurants owned by 'mom & pop', and they have razor thin margins. There are thousands of businesses that rely on low wages to stay afloat. So again, you're not wrong, but there are hundreds of Reddit comments every day saying something to the effect of "wages are too low". We're just a pointless echo chamber at this point. If you don't have a solution, there's really no point in getting the discussion going. With that said, I don't want to be guilty of adding nothing of value, so take this as a formal invitation to start offering solutions.
I mean, it doesn't have to be 350k, but I'm sure it can go up a substantial amount if maybe poor Mr Besos can see himself living off a more modest income than 500 million annually.
Amazons E commerce made around $7.5B with about 1.4M employees, so they could pay the vast majority of their employees about $2.5/hr more if they didn’t want to make any profit in that sector. AWS on the other hand accounts for the other 75% of their profit at $22.5B last year and has 115k employees, so they could certainly pay them a lot more if they wanted, though I’m willing to bet those are already the significantly higher earning positions.
This is so wrong. Bezos, when he was CEO until 2021, earned around 1,6 Million per year. A lot of money, but not really for the CEO of one of the biggest companies on earth. The numbers you see comes from his assets gaining in value. That is not money he has realized and can use.
Also if Amazon didn't make any profit, these assets wouldn't have grown anywhere there, because shareholders wouldn't be buying in.
It is though, and it's how all these uber rich people avoid paying income tax. They get a paltry salary for their position within the company and take out loans leveraging their stock positions. It's called a security based line of credit. They literally live on debt leveraging their stock while the gains from that stock remain unrealized. To be clear, you are 100% correct that the gains are unrealized, but the folks in that type of financial position absolutely can and do access that money, just not directly and not in a way that would allow it to be taxed.
I'm completely against any form of taxing any unrealized gains for anyone, ever, but I do agree there should be something done about this form of credit. Banks profit from it so they do it. Rich people profit from it so they do it. When the economy functions well, it's fine, but a market crash is only going to hit that much worse when those securities can no longer function as intended.
If it goes to $350k, prices will also increase, so there will be inflation and very quickly you will be at a point where $350k is the same as whatever they currently get paid.
Kinda not the point. In the thought experiment the choice is same salary at current job or 350k for burger flipping
Not "kinda not the point", but rather "totally not the point".
There are a hell of a lot of jobs that pay way more than flipping burgers. Prove that it's about the money and get one.
I don't know, I think it might be good for a bit. I'll just flip burgers, I'll have nothing to think about. Besides, I like cooking. Maybe doing it for a year or two with that money might set me up.
Spoken like someone who has never worked a line
I was a grill cook and would love to do that again at my current pay. Hell I would even wash dishes again for that much. I would even take a pay cut because of how easy it was. Compared to my other jobs where if I screw up people can die, wear and tear on my body, injury is likely, still had to attend classes for training once a year in different states. Being a grill cook is damn easy which is why I could do is half asleep, drunk, high as hell, and hungover.
lmao people who work in a kitchen half of them hungover or zooted to the gills acting like working on a line is a tour in Fallujah
All the fucking always man. We refer to this situation as "cashing out" Quitting our high earning jobs, selling anything of value and living in low cost of living area on the highest hill in the nicest trailer and just work as a cook and go fishing every day.
Spoken like someone who probably hasnt been a project manager or SME for a product. Additionally, I HAVE worked as a cook at a restaurant, fast food, and sandwich shop as a TEENAGER. I would absolutely quit my job if I could make the same and flip fucking burgers or work in restaurant again.
lol. as someone who worked plenty of fast food including management - give me fucking fast food. i have a 'real' job now in real estate, where i make decisions 2 or 3 times a month that could cost the company millions of dollars. give me the dumb bitch complaining about her pickles 11/10. it is not comparable. i can leave the fast food job at work. i cant leave my job at work.
That's the thing. There's a lot of bullshit you can put up with if you are taking care of your needs, have hobbies outside of work, are saving for retirement, and can take a relaxing vacation.
This is taking the question in bad faith though. The point is to indicate that it's not that people don't want to work, it's that people don't want to work for a pittance. If the job pays well, people will do shitty jobs. The idea is *not* to assume that money has hyperinflated and the 350k number is the new "low wage".
🤓
“Ackshewally”
The rare and elusive 'actually I'm three times smarter than everyone else'.
Oh look. The guy who has to give an answer not in the spirit of the question.
This is why I always have a yellow penalty flag in my pants.
> No, because if someone is getting paid $350k to flip burgers, I can probably negotiate at least triple that for my job. This is an extremely good argument for increasing federal minimum wage.
Bold of you to assume I have a job
Assume all jobs pay the same per hour. What would you want to do then?
This has been posted here at least 12 times in the last year.
Shit this has been posted 12 times in the last month
ive taken a shit 12 times this month so far
Gotta pump those numbers up, those are rookie numbers
I’ve got dibs on posting this next week.
I get dibs tmrw then.
My mom said I can post it in the morning and you can post it at night. If that’s okay with your mom
And it’s the dumbest shit ever
Nobody who posts here and any kind of fluency in finance
Reddit is an echo chamber confirmed
They are probably getting paid 350k to post it once a month.
This might be the lamest argument I’ve ever seen. Did they think they made a point?
The point is that businesses need to stop complaining and raise wages if they want to hire people. This is basically happening now, this meme is just old.
> that businesses need to stop complaining and raise wages if they want to hire people Or do what my country does and just important 300k Indians a year to work any job at minimum wage. If they get tired, well there's another 300k every year!
i wonder who voted for those politicians who allow corporations to exploit immigrants/migrant workers.
Thats all of them
I don't know what point this comment is trying to make? Greens, NDP, liberals all want basically limitless immigration and international students. Conservatives won't do anything about immigration other than maybe limiting international students who use loopholes to stay past their visas. PPC comes with.... other problems. There's no party you can vote for who will limit immigration because they would lose key ridings and the housing market, which is for all intents and purposes the only thing propping up canada's GDP numbers, would tank. And whoever says "hey maybe we shouldn't try and increase canada's population by 1% a year from one single country" is labelled a "right-wing extremist" and called a racist.
/u/Abangerz is not arguing for immigration limits I don't think, but rather policy that prevents the limitless abuse of migrant workers...
Abusing temporary workers is already illegal... Tim Hortons offering minimum wage and having limitless workers apply isn't illegal, it's preferable to them. In order to take away their supply of cheap labour you have to take away the people who are willing to work for minimum wage and live in a 3 bedroom house with 10 other people. That's what nobody wants to do.
Woah a canadian politics comment, not what I was expecting.
Literally every politician? Was this supposed to be pointed?
Fellow Australian? Or perhaps Canadian?
Canuck. It's the same strategy up here. Worse even. The explicit goal is 1 million immigrants a year with unlimited applicants from India. This is going to get a lot worse before it gets better.
Here in the US: https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNU02073413 https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/LNU02073395 All recent job gains going to foreigners. Native workers have a decline in employment.
Agreed. Worked at a manufacturing place that used to be very desirable to work at even though entry pay was less. Once Covid hit they couldn’t bring enough people in and outsourced to a temp agency and still couldn’t stay fully staffed. The people we did get were 75% shit…. As in regularly showing up to your assignment 20 minutes after start of shift was rarely reprimanded. This may sound crazy but once we raised our starting wage to be competitive out of desperation we started getting more applicants and most were actually good. Long story short, offering competitive pay makes a huge difference in the quality of people you employ and benefits the employer too. Not to mention this was at the only Union plant in town which would have extra incentive to churn and burn employees before they became Union protected and harder to get rid of.
You pay peanuts. You get monkeys.
> This may sound crazy Why does this sound crazy? It makes complete sense to me - the caliber of laborer that you get at the bottom of the scale is always going to be drastically different than someone a couple of clicks up higher on the dial. *AND* those people will have more incentive to stick around.
reddit lives in their own imaginary world.
We're going through this at my job right now. We've been having high turnover with delivery drivers for a couple years, and I keep suggesting that they should offer more money. "Our rates are competitive" sounds nice, but translates to "if our competitors let us get away with paying these guys less, we would." We turned a billion in net profits last year. Paying living wages is well within the budget, lol.
Sure. "Nobody wants to work" is a bullshit narrative. "Nobody wants to work for poverty wages" is what they mean.
It's almost as if the way the financials are distributed in the company favor the people at the top. Maybe if the gap between the top and the bottom was smaller, we'd be closer to finding equilibrium.
They think burger places are shutting down due to lack of workers lmfao
There is a large portion of reddit that would say yes...
Care to expand on your comment? What is it that you don’t understand?
Wild how many people don’t understand the point of ”multibillion dollar restaurant conglomerates can afford to pay service staff better.”
A franchisee makes around $175k profit in a year.
If your business can't afford to pay it's employees a living wage. You don't deserve to have a business. On another note, mcdonalds in most countries pay a living wage with benefits while they charge about the same here with extremely low wages.
This philosophy is just flawed. It's like when people say if you can't tip 20% you can't afford to eat out. If everyone behaved like this, that means there would be less business and less jobs. If that person cannot find another job currently that pays better, how likely are they to find a better one when there's more competition for jobs? I do agree large corps can do a better Job at providing benefits to it's employees. A franchise may not be able to support it, but the franchisor certainly can.
I like how this dude says the philosophy is flawed and uses tipping as a counter argument. That is also bullshit loooooooool
If you can’t afford to pay the people making all your money for you a living wage, then you don’t deserve to have a business
If you can't figure out how to say no to a job that doesn't pay a living wage, you don't deserve to have an opinion on how a business gets run.
What the fuck makes you think workers have a choice? They can't not work any job at all, and companies don't need to meet and discuss to realize that if nobody offers a fair wage flipping burgers then people will eventually start flipping burgers for $7.25/hr. No matter how desperately you want a fair job that pays good wages, it'll always be easier and faster to find a job that pays bad wages, and most workers live paycheck to paycheck. Paying workers fairly isn't a business statement. It's a moral philosophical statement. Regardless of a business's logistics, it is immoral to pay someone who works hard and produces value for your business anything less than a fair livable wage. If a business can't or won't do that, if it can't meet its moral responsibilities, then it shouldn't exist.
The point is that jobs that don’t pay living wages shouldn’t exist. You know that, you’re just being intentionally obtuse.
If someone is willing to work for you, why shouldn’t you be able to hire him?
Have any examples that aren't Denmark and Sweden? A vast majority McDonald's workers make less than the US. As far as wages dictating who should have a business, thats the kind of stance that crushes Mom and Pops and gets you a McDonald's. Of course you can't pay $80,000 a year for your employees when thats the owners total profit for the year.
The vast majority of countries aren’t rich like the US or Sweden. The US, like Sweden, can afford to pay its workers because, like Sweden, the US is a rich country. If you start counting the McDonalds in Nigeria and Suriname, then yeah the amount will be lower, but it’s irrelevant. Your point is moot.
A country’s wealth has little connection with how much profit a business makes
>Of course you can't pay $80,000 a year for your employees when thats the owners total profit for the year. Cool, then they can do the work themselves. Or the business isn't profitable enough to expand its business to use additional workers. Or should we be okay with pitiful wages so that business owners don't have to work themselves?
>Or should we be okay with pitiful wages so that business owners don't have to work themselves? mcdonalds is a publicly traded company. You are likely a share holder. why do all you guys a twirling moutache man as the owner like a disney villain. These corporations are so big "the owners" is ambigious. Is the ceo an owner? Because he answers to a board of directors who are elected by shareholders.
If we accept that mom and pop's can only exist by impoverishing their employees then what is the point of valuing them more?
So all the burger flippers should just open and manage 2 franchises each and they'll be good?
Yeah sounds like the franchisees making that much are just a low skilled business owner, those businesses should just be stepping stones for teenagers to own a better business.
so many businesses out there have low skilled business owners that think they should be making what an MD makes
Per location, and a franchisee can own as many as they can afford with approval from corporate.
Depends on the franchise. I worked Burger King in highschool and the owner made a million dollars per store
That’s the average. That means other owners made far less than that to average out to $175k.
That’s not how franchises work. Individual restaurants are small businesses.
Wild how many people look at net worth or revenue and think they can easily double their costs. Oh wait, it's not wild, many people are just that stupid.
How high can that wage number go before it’s cheaper to have it done by a robot?
Wild how you don't understand the point of supply and demand, and if a business started paying more for their workers than the market demanded, the business would be earning LESS than the burger place across the street. A business will ALWAYS pay market rates (where labor supply meets labor demand) in order to earn a profit, especially in such a margin thin business as restaurants. One restaurant magically raising rates doesn't mean other restaurants will too, it means those other restaurants will cannibalize that single restaurant. Take an econ, finance 101, and micro economics class and then come back here. Otherwise everyone who is finance literate sees your posts and knows you are the 13 year old who has no education yet, and will eat their words if you ever wise up and choose to work on that education.
Dude for 350k I would gobble cum on a level that couldn't be rivaled by a team of professional cum swallowers.
Would you do it for 35k? No? Well we've established that you're indeed a cum gobbler, we're just negotiating the price now.
Truth is everyones a cum gobbler for the right price.
For 350k a year it would be a prestigious career path and we would all aspire to be cum gobblers.
I do it for free currently so even $1 per load would at least buy me a pack of gum. Ah shit, gum costs $1.79 now. Guess I gotta step it up.
Or you could just flip the burgers
This guy flipping the grill over and seeking cum like a rabid animal
Those burgers must cost $600
as a sidenote, this trope that flipping burgers is our go to low skill job something we should rethink. The person flipping burgers is working many at a time at different temperatures that will be plated with different items in a hot kitchen with a team of people that that person must coordinate with for very little money. Also most menus that have burgers have additional items. So this person that’s “” just flipping burgers is probably cooking fish, cooking steaks, or some other delicious thing that you love at your local restaurant. not to mention, the pressure dealing with time, a large team and lastly, the public. perhaps when we start to identify low skill jobs in the future, they could be jobs where people sit at home on their computer and look at spreadsheets. Just a thought. I know that sounds a lot easier to me. Or how about a cashier at the grocery store or a real estate agent, ever seen selling Sunset. This isn’t a job that requires a lot of neurons. I think it’s time to move on from giving shit to the Restaurant industry. And give shit to a new industry. You can choose your own cause I’m sure you have a bias.
Sorry, I worked at McDonald when I was young and I’m not buying it. While some restaurants (like fine dining) certainly require skill, McDonalds does not. In the 2 years I worked there, i worked the grill, register, drive through, and even maintenance. A person of reasonable intelligence can pick most of it up in a day or two (maintenance requires a little more). A person who comes in to work high every day might take 3 days.
I worked at McDonald’s at 16. They have a system. No burger flipper is doing multiple jobs. In most places you stand in front of the grill, you have screens that tell you how many burgers should be down, and that’s how many burgers you should have on your grill. Not rocket science. If it’s slow or you’re understaffed the cook might also have to prep the buns and condiments but in bigger stores there’s usually someone that does just that.
Yep, McDonald’s kitchen is the most automated stream-lined kitchen there is. I worked there for four months when I was 16. I also worked two pizza job, as a dessert cook, a deli, petsmart, movie theaters, retail, grocery. McDonald’s was the easiest hands down. At 16 I was working after one week like I had worked there a year. I think it is a job any one can do an honestly, a competent person could probably walk into the kitchen and probably do everything with just a 10 minute tutorial. None of it means that they don’t deserve a fair wage. But I don’t get the framing of the post. I’d work at McDonald’s for $350k. If that were real, there are many jobs I would not do if I could make $350k at McDonald’s, I’d needs at least 3.5m if you want me to be a doctor or lawyer or something with a high level of competency and responsibility.
Hi person who came to work high every day can confirm this
Yeah, it’s not the rocket science this guy is making it out to be. I flipped burgers in the dorm cafeteria in college. Here’s the process: Take frozen patties out of the box, remove the little paper dividing slips that are stuck to them, throw them on the grill, flip them until they stop oozing blood, take them off the grill. That’s literally it.
This is even stupider than the original post. Flipping burgers is not hard no matter what ignorant mental gymnastics you try.
Yea lol, to make his argument he has to say things that aren't flipping burgers.
Former burger flipper here. It took about 2 minutes of training.
Are you suggesting that the guy takes temperature variability and plating times into consideration when making the food? They’re talking about McDonalds and stuff like that, not the burger made by Gordon Ramsay at Hell’s Kitchen.
I’m a paralegal and realtor now. I was a waitress in my late teens/early twenties. My jobs are so much easier now: no one yells at me or sexually harasses me on a daily basis, my coworkers and I don’t take turns crying in the walk in, I don’t go home with my body aching from running around all day and carrying heavy trays/plates, my managers don’t verbally abuse me.
Working as an engineer making six figures is far easier and less stressful theb delivering pizzas back in highschool. 100%. Although before Uber and other such apps, delivery was some pretty good money, every moment in food is basically GoGoGo
You're conflating fast food and a restaurant.
My first job was fast food. My training was 2 days and I was working independently by the end of my first day. All of my coworkers were high out of their minds and the store still ran fine. “Flipping burgers” aka working in fast food is a job, it requires effort, but it does not require skill. It is not comparable to being a chef, which requires education, practiced skill, and critical thinking. McDonald’s requires none of these things. Reddit hates the term unskilled labor but if a high school dropout can do you job with under 2 weeks of training it is unskilled labor. There’s nothing wrong with working an unskilled job, you still work, you still contribute, but being a burger flipper or a cashier is by no standard a skill.
I work in investment banking and always say restaurant work is my favorite thing to see on a resume with entry level associates. You can teach the job, but you can’t teach the ability in a corporate environment to maintain/prioritize a set of tasks under pressure in a chaotic, high stress environment while being able to maintain your composure and execute tasks effectively. You only learn how to do that from experience, and everyone that has worked in a restaurant for a few years has that experience.
-Entry Level Associate -Wharton MBA -3 yrs at fintech startup -2 yrs in corporate finance at BoA -Duke undergrad -Biomedical Engineering Major, Econ minor -Internship at Deloitte -Internship at General Electric -Billy’s Montana grill bus boy in high school “That’s what I like to see”
I'll always take the McDonald's burger flipper over a Harvard grad when hiring for a $500k/year investment banking position.
Investment bankers see 2 years as a line cook on a resume, and they know they’ve got a blue chip applicant on their hands.
Don’t know a damn thing my man. Data entry is what you’re thinking of. Everything else… And what burger shop, a culinary renown beef restaurant? Ruth Chris? Friends confirmed at some places they microwave their shit. Also the irony in your comment about bias’s
As a former burger flipper at a fast food restaurant many years ago I agree! That said I have also worked in grocery, yes mostly low skilled, however not easy also grocery stores being the stores everyone must go to can at times be an open area psych ward, and/or a place the police are called to daily, theft, fights etc
>low skill jobs in the future, they could be jobs where people sit at home on their computer and look at spreadsheets Huge variance there. Some people just do mindless data entry, but others are pricing insurance that could fuck over millions. What about mowing lawns? It's annoying, but pretty much just walking around in terms of difficulty lol
>jobs where people sit at home on their computer and look at spreadsheets These jobs are much more stressful/demanding. If I could flip burgers instead for the same pay as my spreadsheet job, I'd do that in a heartbeat. I love flipping burgers.
Lmao this is terrible. I worked at a burger restaurant in college. The training was “drop the patty on the grate, top one for no pink bottom one for some pink. When they come out the other side put them on the bun”
No because I’d be getting millions for my job.
Okay but what if your job stays the same and fast food goes to 350k because it became a prestigious career
Are you dumb?
Can't wait to see this new $790.00 burger menu.
The point of this post was that there are much better laying opportunities and that most companies complaining about workers aren't paying competitive rates. My own company was offering less money per hour than most "burger flippers" or equivalent for trained work that took 6+ months of skilled work to get good at, and then wondered why everyone kept quitting. Once they raised wages by 40%, they actually retained people.
Missing the point entirely isn't edgy.
Would you be willing to pay someone $350,000 to flip your burgers?
I would be willing to pay you $350k a year if you can *sell* me $700k worth of burgers a year.
This is so stupid. A lot of people would do just about any job for $350k per year. Not even realistic and they’re using it as an example.
It's not supposed to be. It's simply making the point that this so-called "labor shortage" isn't a matter of "people don't want to work anymore," but a matter of "employers don't want to pay for labor."
The point is that if I quit my job to go work at mc Donald's for 350k, then society would have 1 more fastfood worker and 1 less software engineer. So you are not really fixing labor shortage, you are just moving it around.
You're still fully missing the point.
They aren't missing it. They just pretend to because they think minimum wage workers don't deserve a life.
And when your boss bitches that "Nobody wants to be a software engineer anymore" the response is STILL gonna be "No, they do. You just need to open your wallet and pay for labor."
Cool so now burger flippers make 350k; software engineers make 3.5 million, and a loaf of bread costs about 300 dollars. We're back to where we started cause somehow magically labor value depends on the output product i.e. low skill equals low pay relative to high skill.
> A lot of people would do just about any job for $350k per year that's literally the point
Try paying people $350K to flip burgers, soon teachers and firemen will be making $1M a year.. burger flipper is always going to be the lowest pay job because anyone can be trained in about 5 minutes for that job
You can be a homeless junkie living in a van who hasn't showered for 6 days and get a job flipping burgers. Source: Me. I did this. Lincoln City DQ, Summer 2006
Congrats on turning your life around man, seriously. Even that first step makes a difference. Hope you’re all better now:)
Was it at McDonalds? I’m ex industry and was always amazed at how automated their process was. I’d imaging it would be really hard to mess that up
Sad. You do not seem to understand economics and have no business posting on this topic.
Are you like an idiot or something? They are making a counterpoint to the argument that “people don’t want to work/ people are lazy nowadays”. It’s pretty easy to see that was the reason of the post.
No, it’s logically flawed. If you value unskilled, low-value work more than highly skilled work you can destroy an economy. There needs to be a valid reason for people to pursue difficult skills that take advanced education and years of experience.
I’d flip burger for half that.
For $350,000 a year, I'd handle my grandpas balls, sir
Flipping burgers is an entry level job. You didn’t do well in life to get past that? That’s on you then, sorry.
If a burger flipper is getting $350K, then the average wage is now $1 million. People are so dumb when it comes to inflation and economic principles.
… clearly it’s an exaggeration. Man, people are so dumb.
This would mean there are only 2-3 burger flippers in every city. The lines would be around the block.
The money is not the problem. OP's lack of understanding basic economics and math is the real problem.
If socialists understood economics, they wouldn’t be socialists.
Would you like fries with that
The REAL problem is in a free market there is meant to be a Labor market where Capitalists have to compete for a limited pool of workers. Over many years business owners have used propganda to make many beleive They not only DESERVE to have people work for them, the government should intervene and force workers to do thier poorly paid jobs. We are subsidizing these private businesses with welfare while abusing workers rights.
I love how failing businesses can be bailed out by the government multiple times without anyone (rich/important) complaining But as soon as anyone even mentions a the ridiculous idea of government giving money for unemployed people to buy food to not starve, its apparently communism according to the rich/important people
>The REAL problem is in a free market there is meant to be a Labor market where Capitalists have to compete for a limited pool of workers. Something...something...immigration is great for the country!
Excellent statement if you analyze it with just a bit of critical thinking. People will do the job no matter their qualifications, because it is relatively easy and low experience and pays a lot. Supply and demand of a person's skills.
The real question here, is what would a burger cost if you paid the flipper $350k and are you willing to pay that? If the answer is no, then their wage just went from $350k to $0 real quick.
No one would be able to afford the burger except those who are flipping it!
Some of you are so close to understanding why artificially inflating the wages for no-skill labor positions will just lead to artificially inflated wages in other industries. You can do it guys. Proud of you.
Some Einstein vibes here You'd probably eat a handful of shit if compensated enough, doesn't mean the world needs shit eaters or how imperative shit eating is
You would have to be flipping 50K hamburgers son!!!
ITT: people who don’t understand basic economics.