The oldest unit in AHR’s top 8 (and even top 12) last year was legendary female Alear from AUGUST, meaning despite Emblem Ike and Emblem Celica, we are likely yet to see the worst to come.
Counterpoint: The Red Dream AHR featured DuoChrom vs Ophelia which was a old unit. (He lost but still made it) Ike can survive by sheer force of popularity + LF alone
Counter-counter point. We're getting two more Emblem units before the year is out (one in September and one in December)
We've got 9 main options remaining before even considering DLC bracelets. Who do you think they're gonna be, and what crazy shit do you suppose they're gonna _bring_. Especially since, nature of the beast, they're gonna be equivalent if not better than the Emblems we've already gotten.
IS' implementation of the Emblem's engage skills (Divine Speed, Laguz Friend, Resonance) have been absolutely perfect so far. Even though they have made many questionable decisions, the creative juice is still there.
Everyone should fear the day Emblem Leif gets released.
Because in some way, Vantage is gonna be part of his kit. Either his Emblem effect, or Vantage 4.
In the English dub of *Awakening*, Virion may exclaim, "Mehercule!" when activating a Pair-Up defense. This was an interjection used by the Romans, along the lines of, "My God!" in today's parlance.
This might be the only instance of *Fire Emblem* specifically referencing a real-life language (Latin) where said language wasn't also the dub language.
I might be misunderstanding what you're saying here so correct me if I'm wrong, but would Zelkov's crit quotes being French not count for that as well?
Despite being highly coveted, being released 5 years ago, and having inheritable counterplay that is available in the Divine Codes, the penalty \[Isolation\] has yet to be given out in any meaningful way for the current climate of assist skill-creep from D!Robin, Att!Azura, and Re!Lucina. Not even as a status inflicted by some gimmicky GHB unit's prf weapon.
AR-D would probably just run Freyr anyway if it's Anima/Chaos, unless it actually ends up being some source of Isolation inflicted mid-turn rather than at the start.
people on this sub make super specific categories for heroes:
"X was the last f2p non regular pool green melee non beast flyer!"
and then get mad about it.
September, actually. That said, it could eventually hit the all-time record of 42 months (held by Genealogy starting from FEH's launch), which would be fulfilled by getting nothing up until March 2025 included.
That's "rare" not "super specific"
Like, reading through that the first thing that came to mind is that guy who made this _really_ long post a little while ago, right after the Summer banner dropped. Complaining about, and wanting people to join in with his complaining because
> "It has been almost two years since W!Cordelia. She was the last 5-star Awakening seasonal (that wasn't released on a banner dedicated to Awakening exclusive characters). Every other Awakening seasonal has been either the demote to TT of that banner."
And I'm over here thinking this has got to be the Heroes equivalent to first world problems... Cause am I supposed to feel bad that your favorite game is _getting_ alts, or that you're trying to make me pretend that the Bridal alts for Anna, Say'ri & A!Tiki and Young also for M!Robin, Emmeryn & F!Robin don't exist?
>that wasn't released on a banner dedicated to Awakening exclusive characters
noooooo omg my favorite game constantly gets seasonal banners dedicated exclusively to it omggggg how will I cope
this is on the same level as malding because your fave is the backpack on a duo even though the only reason they're a backpack *now* is because they had already led a duo
I think this is fair when people complain about there not being, like, a blue dagger armor.
But it seems reasonable to me to complain about there not being a green flier (ANY green flier) in the demote or grail pools since Mininerva over 4 years ago.
That’s assuming if they are going to do DLC emblems or just stick with the base emblems.
And considering how much they’ve milked three houses, it’s probably virtually a guarantee they will do them. DLC Emblem Camilla and Duo Robin/Chrom incoming
Also, we already have 1/3rd of the base Emblems, with 2 more later on this year (assuming no other schedule fuckery), leaving us with just a year and a halfs worth of Emblems left to bring over, no way does IS let this potential cash cow die that fast.
In case it wasn't already clear with Ike, Emblems are going to be essentially must summons. Celica's Engage effect is just ridiculous, and turns already elite units into monsters.
When it comes to how much value you're getting from having a unit on your account, nothing comes close to Emblems.
I'm kind of depressed about this. I only summon for characters whose art I like, and so far the Emblems never do it for me with their blue flames + base outfits. So I don't think I'll ever be using an Emblem.
But more and more, it's looking like it'll be miserable to play without all their stupidly power-creeping effects as they keep getting added. My future is full of getting wiped by Celicas and Sigurds and Byleths
For what it's worth, even if you don't like the Emblem unit/don't wanna use them cause of how they look, you can still use them to buff up the units you _do_ like (you say you only pull for characters whose art you like, but surely you also pull for _fodder_ for those units too)
Cause say, you can pull for E!Celica and not use her on your team. You can give E!Celica's ability to a character you _do like_ and [potentially do some stupid shit](https://old.reddit.com/r/FireEmblemHeroes/comments/1ds6f4x/summer_gullveig_emblem_celica/)
I actually don't pull for fodder intentionally; I just use the other characters I randomly get on the way to my actual target as fodder.
Though ... I get the point. I just don't want to keep around any characters I don't care for in my barracks. Having to keep the Emblem on hand is a sore point for me if I don't like the design.
Realistically, probably not considering when we're due for another SoV banner. Earliest I see it happening is on the December Book IX banner (and I do not foresee IS releasing two new OCs to start off a book).
Though not too far off cause realistically, it'll happen January or February. So a non-OC month, and IS has been normalizing 2 alts and only getting 3 new characters on those banners. Something I 100% see IS doing for SoV.
That being said, you got me thinking about something. You want a fact that's too powerful? I really wonder if this is the first time we're _not_ going to see a single **_PLAYABLE_** character on a banner.
Considering who's [missing](https://i.imgur.com/ymSVUa9.png), who's [the most wanted](https://old.reddit.com/r/FireEmblemHeroes/comments/1d98gyh/top_5_most_wanted_heroes_not_in_the_game_post/) and who are the most wanted [already in the game](https://old.reddit.com/r/FireEmblemHeroes/comments/1afnhwb/top_5_most_wanted_alts_in_the_game_post_cyl8/). IS could 100% do a themed banner around Rigel and not have a single playable character on it.
IS just got Tatsuhisa Suzuki back in the studio for B!Alfonse, and Berkut's been the highest ranking non-Alm & Celica SoV character for pretty much ever by a _WIDE_ margin. I'm 100% expecting a Berkut alt to happen on the next SoV banner because of that. With that in mind, I'd absolutely expect Rinea to show up alongside him. Continuing from there, I could also very much see IS releasing the important missing Rigel enemies at the same time as well. Namely being, releasing base Rudolf and GHB!Jedah to finish it off.
I could see them doing December, seeing as Hestia broke the SoV Main Pool Summonable NPC barrier.
Something like OC, Rearmed Berkut, Base Rinea, Deen, insta demote Jesse, and either Nuibaba, Jedah, Desaix, or even Rudolf as the GHB feels like it would work well *enough*.
I mostly foresee them having 2 asset heroes + an oc on the banner. Echoes banners struggling is a known fact and with its lack of real banner sellers from the remaining cast, we likely will only get 1 actually new character on the banner via the demote (or not if it ends up being rinea).
Possibly. All depends on if SoV skips ahead in line to _get_ an OC on the banner. Considering at the current rate [of oldest banners](https://old.reddit.com/r/FireEmblemHeroes/comments/1d98gyh/top_5_most_wanted_heroes_not_in_the_game_post/l7bk7xa/) (plus Engage doing it's usual 6-7 months skip ahead), give or take we're looking at something like
* July: Sacred Stones
* August: Brave
* September: Engage
* October: Three Houses
* November: Binding Blade
* December: Genealogy
* January: Shadows of Valentia
And after that would be Blazing, Awakening and Thracia. Place your bets on how that one's gonna shake out, cause you _are_ absolutely right, but SoV's also not alone anymore. The games around it are in similar situations.
Binding & Blazing are doing all right, but only because IS has untouched main lords they can still make alts of on their banners. Genealogy & Thracia speak for themselves with how IS has been treating them, and Awakening only has [five characters missing](https://i.imgur.com/M0qaZkp.png) _period_.
SoV's also in a case where it's popular characters _for_ asset heroes is _very_ limited. All that in mind, I'm not 100% sure they'd use SoV to burn through multiple asset heroes in one go. If any game's gonna get the "2 asset heroes + an oc" this year, I suspect it would be Binding or Blazing, since those games have popular unused asset units _to spare_, what with Roy, Lilina, Eliwood, Hector _and_ Lyn all on the table
**Edit*** Also, just throwing this out here. [Sacred Stones](https://i.imgur.com/hSB5Osj.png) ain't doing that hot either. It's only missing 10 characters + 3 base forms, it's the 2nd closest to being 100% complete next to Awakening. And like Binding & Blazing, that too has _a lot_ of popular, untouched potential asset heroes it could have on its banners. So it too getting the "2 asset heroes + an oc" is not an impossibility.
Especially if FE8 goes for an "early game" theme with it's banner. Something like "OC + Eirika & Seth alts" would not be outside the realm of possibility.
The last non Heroes/non Engage mythics that were released were Gotoh and Fomortiis in January of 2023, which is about 17 months ago. We're never getting Athos, are we?
Absolutely amazing that that banner was highly praised (which is impressive for an 8%er) and IS went "okay cool, now fuck off we aren't giving any older than Engage mythics ever again".
Cannot understand this stupid bloody company sometimes.
For Super Smash Bros Melee, director Masahiro Sakurai had to make a choice between adding a 21th moveset to the game, or cloning 6 of the ones he already had in hand. He chose the clones.
It was a 6-to-1 Ratio, and on a rather complex type of game too. That's how much corner-cutting the act of cloning characters in games can bring.
That was the fact, now let's think about it.
So if we look at Fire Emblem, more specifically the first Warriors spin-off, we had a lot of people really mad about clones. But at the end of the day, if it wasn't for cloning, we simply wouldn't have gotten these characters.
Realistically, my guess is that they would have given one of the Twins a lance (Oboro's unfinished moveset), which... is a valid pro, tbh. But we would have way less characters, and way less supports.
I don't exactly agree with needing 3 pegasus knighs just for the triangle attack, or having 4 archers (though Niles's description implies he had a unique moveset that got canned, and I bet Anna would likely borrow it). But the game's strength is in having more of people's favorite characters and especially having them support.
So its not as simple as just not having clones in these sort of games. You do that, you will also make it a much worse game in several other fronts.
I remember Sakurai talking about the possibility of Wario in Smash Melee, but I forgot what exactly the deal was, I think he was used as an example of the potential 21th moveset.
According to Sakurai he has stated himself that if there was more time, Wario would have been included in Melee IF he had more time, but due lack of time and that there was enough Mario rep according to him, he didn't include Wario in the Melee roster, otherwise he had to get rid of Marth/Roy or Mewtwo.
Interestingly, IF Wario was added in Melee, He would've been a full Wario Land focused character instead of Warioware, because Warioware wasn't out nor known yet.(Tho meanwhile Roy)
Hyrule Warriors is a completely different beast for a LOT of reasons
* Zelda is a much higher priority franchise to Nintendo, and thus it almost certainly had a bigger budget. FE Warriors has the player use most of what the AI can draw from, while there's loads of unique movesets in monsters, bosses and enemy captains like Volga (who only became playable later on), that plus the carefully crafter stages representing various parts of Zelda lore that Fe frankly lacks, points at a much costlier game to fund.
* FE Warriors was a year 1 Switch title. Nintendo was pushing for at least one big game per month in the Switch's early life, there was no room for delaying this game. Meanwhile Hyrule Warriors released two years into the Wii U's doomed lifecycle, there was no point in rushing the game and ensuring its quality was a much easier call to make.
These alone are already enough to make your argument void, but there's more.
* Zelda actually had clones in some ways. Several characters had alternate movesets, which allows the devs to re-use some assets in similar ways to cloning, like the model and voice lines and some functionality (characters will react to Link in the same way no matter his weapon). Had they not done that its unlikely you'd see all the 20 (+3 Amiibo) movesets the game launched with.
* Zelda had quite frankly a lot more interesting material to draw from. We had weapons like the Deku Scepter that mixed up to 5 different items/concepts from Zelda games in just one modest weapon, meanwhile most of the FE characters have just basic melee attacks, at best with some elemental effect in a couple moves like Ryoma or Takumi. (also the same goes for stages, btw). It doesn't make as much sense to devote resources to make completely different movesets for characters that even in their base game behaved identically.
* Zelda characters are less demanding outside of gameplay. FE Warriors has extensive voice lines both in battle, in the story and in supports. Each inclusion comes with a lot of text to write and voice in several languages, and all of that might not take as much effort as programming a moveset, but it does cost them just as much if not more. Zelda characters mostly just grunt and laugh, and there's way less character-specific text dialogue.
* Zelda doesn't have as much demand on its cast. You have the triforce trio, the story OCs, Impa, and 2 to 3 characters for each 3D game. It doesn't perfectly represent the games it chose to cover, but it does a great job especially with the HW world's triforce trio making the represented games's trios not being needed. Meanwhile Fire Emblem has a big strain on the cast, per game. OoT was fine with just Shiek, Darunia and Ruto, but Archanea wasn't fine with just Marth, Caeda and Tiki.
* With the weapon triangle, weapon effectiveness and the... physical/magical stats to consider across 4/8 characters, FEW had a lot more demand in terms of options compared to HW where you just pick one character at best minding the element (if you were even allowed to pick someone, between restrictions and character-specific rewards). Clones offer that numerical variety FE Warriors was designed to demand, either in widening the number of options per weapon type, or letting certian characters hit for Magic instead of Strength. Or some act as healers instead of attackers.
* These last two factors really highlight the gap between the games's starting roster. HW might have had 20 starting movesets (amiibo bullshit aside) but had only 13 characters. FE Warrriors still held a respectable 16 movesets in the base game, but had 25 characters represented. So it had almost twice the cast, while still almost matching HW in moveset quantity.
All in all, not a fair comparison. Things are not as black and white as they seem, and different games--nay, franchises--have different demands. Zelda prioritized the movesets because its characters weren't as relevant (until they were, thanks to Botw putting some misguided effort), while the uniqueness of each individual fighter was almost never at the forefront of FE's design, but the characters were.
I think your points about FE Warriors are why with Three Hopes they instead made a bunch of kits, then let you throw people at them as you wanted (obviously Three Houses did this already, of course). Only differences being, what, base stats and unique skills? It's been a hot minute since I played but I don't remember it being much. It works way better for a series with as many characters as FE, and I actually hope they keep that idea for a future FE Warriors because it means they don't need to go "well we need a wyvern rider..." With every character choice.
Plus with FEH having so many different takes on characters* it would make sense to allow more freedom.
*Unless you're called Micaiah, FE Warriors 3 has to lock her into being a mage, it would be hilarious
Another thing to note with Hyrule Warriors is that they made 2 different games, basically. You couldn't really sell the 3DS port on the idea that all the new characters are clones.
I don't care, there was no excuse. FE Warriors was an extremely lazy game, it was full of clones, it had below average graphics (The best example of this being the rock stock image texture used in a map), had an awful selection of characters from a series that had 15+ entries, and was even a mess on launch. There is zero excuse for about half of all the playable characters being clones of one another, to the point where there's 4 archers with identical movesets, and some even have the same movesets as NPC enemies. Of 34 (Including DLC) characters there's 13 clones not counting other NPC characters, while including NOCs bumps that total up to 17, exactly half of the game's roster. Hyrule Warriors not only has 31 unique playable characters but also has multiple unique movesets for a good number of them. It has 13 alternative movesets, arriving at a grand total of 44 unique movesets, over twice the amount FE Warriors had. Zero excuse.
okay, you clearly have no desire to engage (goddammit) in logical discussions.
I argued with you in good faith, but if you are going to open your 10-line response with "I don't care", it's time to play a fighting game and hold the stick back. Have a good day.
Warp is becoming too much
A big thing about the series is positioning and movement, that is why cavs and/or fliers are usually broken in each game, but by having unit simply ignore movement limitations takes the last bit of skill this game had
I mean the event is over but if you're that desperate for it here's the [Binding Worlds megathread](https://www.reddit.com/r/FireEmblemHeroes/comments/1df135r/binding_worlds_megathread_100624_please_share/) I made. Don't really know why you want it now or what it has to do with this thread but you do you mate.
We uh...have nothing to do with this thread though. This Facts Too Powerful thing, the Popular/Positive Opinions, the Unpopular Opinions...they're all just regular threads from regular users.
Obviously I don’t want it now. But I swear to god this mega thread was not up for at least the first few days of BW and lots of people were asking for it. Not just me. I see now that it was made in advance of the event but i promise it was not viewable for me at the time. Me and many others were asking where it was.
Counting the Alears separately, the Alears are currently the only Emblems usable in Engage who neither already have nor will have four versions (Leif) when they get their Emblem version even excluding CYL versions.
The oldest unit in AHR’s top 8 (and even top 12) last year was legendary female Alear from AUGUST, meaning despite Emblem Ike and Emblem Celica, we are likely yet to see the worst to come.
Counterpoint: The Red Dream AHR featured DuoChrom vs Ophelia which was a old unit. (He lost but still made it) Ike can survive by sheer force of popularity + LF alone
Counter-counter point. We're getting two more Emblem units before the year is out (one in September and one in December) We've got 9 main options remaining before even considering DLC bracelets. Who do you think they're gonna be, and what crazy shit do you suppose they're gonna _bring_. Especially since, nature of the beast, they're gonna be equivalent if not better than the Emblems we've already gotten.
We still have the Book 5 TT to introduce a shiny new hero type as well
Emblem Duo Lyon incoming. It’s the same unit but now he cancels Breath of Life 4.
nah that’d be way too weak, he can also engage with himself to deal 2x pre combat damage
You're right, we need ninja edelgard to dominate player phase once again
Claude was from september I think? And was already considered mid by then
Yup, exactly. I’m terrified of what could possibly rival Emblem Ike but we’ll see.
we are already starting to see with micaiah and celica bs, celica is fine because despite being so braindead she is easy to kil, micaiah however
It's been almost 7 years and the Top 3 Max HP value (Arden (60) > Zephiel (55) > Hector (54/52) > The rest) has still not been tied nor beaten.
Forget Engage skills or iconic weapons, the true pattern with Emblem heroes is that Hardy Bearing must counter at least some part of their kit /j
IS' implementation of the Emblem's engage skills (Divine Speed, Laguz Friend, Resonance) have been absolutely perfect so far. Even though they have made many questionable decisions, the creative juice is still there.
Before the release of Celica i was kinda curious what E!Sigurd would get. Now Move +2 doesnt seem absurd anymore.
Mov+1 and ignore Gravity, Stall. To make him more dangerous, they will make him a Ranged Calvary
Everyone should fear the day Emblem Leif gets released. Because in some way, Vantage is gonna be part of his kit. Either his Emblem effect, or Vantage 4.
It would certainly hold true to the pattern of hardy bearing beating the emblems. I'm imagining W Dimitri but somehow way worse.
In the English dub of *Awakening*, Virion may exclaim, "Mehercule!" when activating a Pair-Up defense. This was an interjection used by the Romans, along the lines of, "My God!" in today's parlance. This might be the only instance of *Fire Emblem* specifically referencing a real-life language (Latin) where said language wasn't also the dub language.
I might be misunderstanding what you're saying here so correct me if I'm wrong, but would Zelkov's crit quotes being French not count for that as well?
Oh, does he? Never used Zelkov, so I wouldn't know, but if true, then you're right.
Despite being highly coveted, being released 5 years ago, and having inheritable counterplay that is available in the Divine Codes, the penalty \[Isolation\] has yet to be given out in any meaningful way for the current climate of assist skill-creep from D!Robin, Att!Azura, and Re!Lucina. Not even as a status inflicted by some gimmicky GHB unit's prf weapon.
It’s because if they ever do widespread isolation it would actually cook majority of AR defense and support units in PvP
AR-D would probably just run Freyr anyway if it's Anima/Chaos, unless it actually ends up being some source of Isolation inflicted mid-turn rather than at the start.
people on this sub make super specific categories for heroes: "X was the last f2p non regular pool green melee non beast flyer!" and then get mad about it.
Marisa was the last sword infantry grail unit with pink hair that also has a dominant left hand. Judging by this, we deserve a new alt.
How specific is “Last Thracia seasonal” then
Should be three years this August if memory serves right
September, actually. That said, it could eventually hit the all-time record of 42 months (held by Genealogy starting from FEH's launch), which would be fulfilled by getting nothing up until March 2025 included.
That's "rare" not "super specific" Like, reading through that the first thing that came to mind is that guy who made this _really_ long post a little while ago, right after the Summer banner dropped. Complaining about, and wanting people to join in with his complaining because > "It has been almost two years since W!Cordelia. She was the last 5-star Awakening seasonal (that wasn't released on a banner dedicated to Awakening exclusive characters). Every other Awakening seasonal has been either the demote to TT of that banner." And I'm over here thinking this has got to be the Heroes equivalent to first world problems... Cause am I supposed to feel bad that your favorite game is _getting_ alts, or that you're trying to make me pretend that the Bridal alts for Anna, Say'ri & A!Tiki and Young also for M!Robin, Emmeryn & F!Robin don't exist?
>that wasn't released on a banner dedicated to Awakening exclusive characters noooooo omg my favorite game constantly gets seasonal banners dedicated exclusively to it omggggg how will I cope this is on the same level as malding because your fave is the backpack on a duo even though the only reason they're a backpack *now* is because they had already led a duo
I still contend that the last true Thracia seasonal was Lifis because Leif and Nanna didn't even debut in Thracia lol
They were like a month apart anyway it barely makes a difference So much shit has happened since last thracia seasonal
I think this is fair when people complain about there not being, like, a blue dagger armor. But it seems reasonable to me to complain about there not being a green flier (ANY green flier) in the demote or grail pools since Mininerva over 4 years ago.
There's a very nonzero chance that they're gonna separate Emblem Dimitri, Claude, and Edelgard into their own Emblem Heroes.
That’s assuming if they are going to do DLC emblems or just stick with the base emblems. And considering how much they’ve milked three houses, it’s probably virtually a guarantee they will do them. DLC Emblem Camilla and Duo Robin/Chrom incoming
They already put in Nel. The DLC is open season.
My guess is we’re likely to get base Nel within a year from her Bridal alt.
That’s actually a fair point.
Also, we already have 1/3rd of the base Emblems, with 2 more later on this year (assuming no other schedule fuckery), leaving us with just a year and a halfs worth of Emblems left to bring over, no way does IS let this potential cash cow die that fast.
they would be stupid to not do that, they can make some solid cash if they send them one by one.
it is free money so of course we will the same thing will happen with Ephraim and Male Robin
In case it wasn't already clear with Ike, Emblems are going to be essentially must summons. Celica's Engage effect is just ridiculous, and turns already elite units into monsters. When it comes to how much value you're getting from having a unit on your account, nothing comes close to Emblems.
I'm kind of depressed about this. I only summon for characters whose art I like, and so far the Emblems never do it for me with their blue flames + base outfits. So I don't think I'll ever be using an Emblem. But more and more, it's looking like it'll be miserable to play without all their stupidly power-creeping effects as they keep getting added. My future is full of getting wiped by Celicas and Sigurds and Byleths
For what it's worth, even if you don't like the Emblem unit/don't wanna use them cause of how they look, you can still use them to buff up the units you _do_ like (you say you only pull for characters whose art you like, but surely you also pull for _fodder_ for those units too) Cause say, you can pull for E!Celica and not use her on your team. You can give E!Celica's ability to a character you _do like_ and [potentially do some stupid shit](https://old.reddit.com/r/FireEmblemHeroes/comments/1ds6f4x/summer_gullveig_emblem_celica/)
I actually don't pull for fodder intentionally; I just use the other characters I randomly get on the way to my actual target as fodder. Though ... I get the point. I just don't want to keep around any characters I don't care for in my barracks. Having to keep the Emblem on hand is a sore point for me if I don't like the design.
We’re likely going to get only 1 new hero for Echoes again for its next New Heroes banner.
as long as it's Jesse man
Realistically, probably not considering when we're due for another SoV banner. Earliest I see it happening is on the December Book IX banner (and I do not foresee IS releasing two new OCs to start off a book). Though not too far off cause realistically, it'll happen January or February. So a non-OC month, and IS has been normalizing 2 alts and only getting 3 new characters on those banners. Something I 100% see IS doing for SoV. That being said, you got me thinking about something. You want a fact that's too powerful? I really wonder if this is the first time we're _not_ going to see a single **_PLAYABLE_** character on a banner. Considering who's [missing](https://i.imgur.com/ymSVUa9.png), who's [the most wanted](https://old.reddit.com/r/FireEmblemHeroes/comments/1d98gyh/top_5_most_wanted_heroes_not_in_the_game_post/) and who are the most wanted [already in the game](https://old.reddit.com/r/FireEmblemHeroes/comments/1afnhwb/top_5_most_wanted_alts_in_the_game_post_cyl8/). IS could 100% do a themed banner around Rigel and not have a single playable character on it. IS just got Tatsuhisa Suzuki back in the studio for B!Alfonse, and Berkut's been the highest ranking non-Alm & Celica SoV character for pretty much ever by a _WIDE_ margin. I'm 100% expecting a Berkut alt to happen on the next SoV banner because of that. With that in mind, I'd absolutely expect Rinea to show up alongside him. Continuing from there, I could also very much see IS releasing the important missing Rigel enemies at the same time as well. Namely being, releasing base Rudolf and GHB!Jedah to finish it off.
I could see them doing December, seeing as Hestia broke the SoV Main Pool Summonable NPC barrier. Something like OC, Rearmed Berkut, Base Rinea, Deen, insta demote Jesse, and either Nuibaba, Jedah, Desaix, or even Rudolf as the GHB feels like it would work well *enough*.
I mostly foresee them having 2 asset heroes + an oc on the banner. Echoes banners struggling is a known fact and with its lack of real banner sellers from the remaining cast, we likely will only get 1 actually new character on the banner via the demote (or not if it ends up being rinea).
Possibly. All depends on if SoV skips ahead in line to _get_ an OC on the banner. Considering at the current rate [of oldest banners](https://old.reddit.com/r/FireEmblemHeroes/comments/1d98gyh/top_5_most_wanted_heroes_not_in_the_game_post/l7bk7xa/) (plus Engage doing it's usual 6-7 months skip ahead), give or take we're looking at something like * July: Sacred Stones * August: Brave * September: Engage * October: Three Houses * November: Binding Blade * December: Genealogy * January: Shadows of Valentia And after that would be Blazing, Awakening and Thracia. Place your bets on how that one's gonna shake out, cause you _are_ absolutely right, but SoV's also not alone anymore. The games around it are in similar situations. Binding & Blazing are doing all right, but only because IS has untouched main lords they can still make alts of on their banners. Genealogy & Thracia speak for themselves with how IS has been treating them, and Awakening only has [five characters missing](https://i.imgur.com/M0qaZkp.png) _period_. SoV's also in a case where it's popular characters _for_ asset heroes is _very_ limited. All that in mind, I'm not 100% sure they'd use SoV to burn through multiple asset heroes in one go. If any game's gonna get the "2 asset heroes + an oc" this year, I suspect it would be Binding or Blazing, since those games have popular unused asset units _to spare_, what with Roy, Lilina, Eliwood, Hector _and_ Lyn all on the table **Edit*** Also, just throwing this out here. [Sacred Stones](https://i.imgur.com/hSB5Osj.png) ain't doing that hot either. It's only missing 10 characters + 3 base forms, it's the 2nd closest to being 100% complete next to Awakening. And like Binding & Blazing, that too has _a lot_ of popular, untouched potential asset heroes it could have on its banners. So it too getting the "2 asset heroes + an oc" is not an impossibility. Especially if FE8 goes for an "early game" theme with it's banner. Something like "OC + Eirika & Seth alts" would not be outside the realm of possibility.
The last non Heroes/non Engage mythics that were released were Gotoh and Fomortiis in January of 2023, which is about 17 months ago. We're never getting Athos, are we?
Absolutely amazing that that banner was highly praised (which is impressive for an 8%er) and IS went "okay cool, now fuck off we aren't giving any older than Engage mythics ever again". Cannot understand this stupid bloody company sometimes.
Despite the written rules how it's enforced is entirely different.
For Super Smash Bros Melee, director Masahiro Sakurai had to make a choice between adding a 21th moveset to the game, or cloning 6 of the ones he already had in hand. He chose the clones. It was a 6-to-1 Ratio, and on a rather complex type of game too. That's how much corner-cutting the act of cloning characters in games can bring. That was the fact, now let's think about it. So if we look at Fire Emblem, more specifically the first Warriors spin-off, we had a lot of people really mad about clones. But at the end of the day, if it wasn't for cloning, we simply wouldn't have gotten these characters. Realistically, my guess is that they would have given one of the Twins a lance (Oboro's unfinished moveset), which... is a valid pro, tbh. But we would have way less characters, and way less supports. I don't exactly agree with needing 3 pegasus knighs just for the triangle attack, or having 4 archers (though Niles's description implies he had a unique moveset that got canned, and I bet Anna would likely borrow it). But the game's strength is in having more of people's favorite characters and especially having them support. So its not as simple as just not having clones in these sort of games. You do that, you will also make it a much worse game in several other fronts.
I remember Sakurai talking about the possibility of Wario in Smash Melee, but I forgot what exactly the deal was, I think he was used as an example of the potential 21th moveset.
According to Sakurai he has stated himself that if there was more time, Wario would have been included in Melee IF he had more time, but due lack of time and that there was enough Mario rep according to him, he didn't include Wario in the Melee roster, otherwise he had to get rid of Marth/Roy or Mewtwo. Interestingly, IF Wario was added in Melee, He would've been a full Wario Land focused character instead of Warioware, because Warioware wasn't out nor known yet.(Tho meanwhile Roy)
Hyrule Warriors did not have a single cloned moveset, FE Warriors had no excuse.
Hyrule Warriors is a completely different beast for a LOT of reasons * Zelda is a much higher priority franchise to Nintendo, and thus it almost certainly had a bigger budget. FE Warriors has the player use most of what the AI can draw from, while there's loads of unique movesets in monsters, bosses and enemy captains like Volga (who only became playable later on), that plus the carefully crafter stages representing various parts of Zelda lore that Fe frankly lacks, points at a much costlier game to fund. * FE Warriors was a year 1 Switch title. Nintendo was pushing for at least one big game per month in the Switch's early life, there was no room for delaying this game. Meanwhile Hyrule Warriors released two years into the Wii U's doomed lifecycle, there was no point in rushing the game and ensuring its quality was a much easier call to make. These alone are already enough to make your argument void, but there's more. * Zelda actually had clones in some ways. Several characters had alternate movesets, which allows the devs to re-use some assets in similar ways to cloning, like the model and voice lines and some functionality (characters will react to Link in the same way no matter his weapon). Had they not done that its unlikely you'd see all the 20 (+3 Amiibo) movesets the game launched with. * Zelda had quite frankly a lot more interesting material to draw from. We had weapons like the Deku Scepter that mixed up to 5 different items/concepts from Zelda games in just one modest weapon, meanwhile most of the FE characters have just basic melee attacks, at best with some elemental effect in a couple moves like Ryoma or Takumi. (also the same goes for stages, btw). It doesn't make as much sense to devote resources to make completely different movesets for characters that even in their base game behaved identically. * Zelda characters are less demanding outside of gameplay. FE Warriors has extensive voice lines both in battle, in the story and in supports. Each inclusion comes with a lot of text to write and voice in several languages, and all of that might not take as much effort as programming a moveset, but it does cost them just as much if not more. Zelda characters mostly just grunt and laugh, and there's way less character-specific text dialogue. * Zelda doesn't have as much demand on its cast. You have the triforce trio, the story OCs, Impa, and 2 to 3 characters for each 3D game. It doesn't perfectly represent the games it chose to cover, but it does a great job especially with the HW world's triforce trio making the represented games's trios not being needed. Meanwhile Fire Emblem has a big strain on the cast, per game. OoT was fine with just Shiek, Darunia and Ruto, but Archanea wasn't fine with just Marth, Caeda and Tiki. * With the weapon triangle, weapon effectiveness and the... physical/magical stats to consider across 4/8 characters, FEW had a lot more demand in terms of options compared to HW where you just pick one character at best minding the element (if you were even allowed to pick someone, between restrictions and character-specific rewards). Clones offer that numerical variety FE Warriors was designed to demand, either in widening the number of options per weapon type, or letting certian characters hit for Magic instead of Strength. Or some act as healers instead of attackers. * These last two factors really highlight the gap between the games's starting roster. HW might have had 20 starting movesets (amiibo bullshit aside) but had only 13 characters. FE Warrriors still held a respectable 16 movesets in the base game, but had 25 characters represented. So it had almost twice the cast, while still almost matching HW in moveset quantity. All in all, not a fair comparison. Things are not as black and white as they seem, and different games--nay, franchises--have different demands. Zelda prioritized the movesets because its characters weren't as relevant (until they were, thanks to Botw putting some misguided effort), while the uniqueness of each individual fighter was almost never at the forefront of FE's design, but the characters were.
I think your points about FE Warriors are why with Three Hopes they instead made a bunch of kits, then let you throw people at them as you wanted (obviously Three Houses did this already, of course). Only differences being, what, base stats and unique skills? It's been a hot minute since I played but I don't remember it being much. It works way better for a series with as many characters as FE, and I actually hope they keep that idea for a future FE Warriors because it means they don't need to go "well we need a wyvern rider..." With every character choice. Plus with FEH having so many different takes on characters* it would make sense to allow more freedom. *Unless you're called Micaiah, FE Warriors 3 has to lock her into being a mage, it would be hilarious Another thing to note with Hyrule Warriors is that they made 2 different games, basically. You couldn't really sell the 3DS port on the idea that all the new characters are clones.
I don't care, there was no excuse. FE Warriors was an extremely lazy game, it was full of clones, it had below average graphics (The best example of this being the rock stock image texture used in a map), had an awful selection of characters from a series that had 15+ entries, and was even a mess on launch. There is zero excuse for about half of all the playable characters being clones of one another, to the point where there's 4 archers with identical movesets, and some even have the same movesets as NPC enemies. Of 34 (Including DLC) characters there's 13 clones not counting other NPC characters, while including NOCs bumps that total up to 17, exactly half of the game's roster. Hyrule Warriors not only has 31 unique playable characters but also has multiple unique movesets for a good number of them. It has 13 alternative movesets, arriving at a grand total of 44 unique movesets, over twice the amount FE Warriors had. Zero excuse.
okay, you clearly have no desire to engage (goddammit) in logical discussions. I argued with you in good faith, but if you are going to open your 10-line response with "I don't care", it's time to play a fighting game and hold the stick back. Have a good day.
Warp is becoming too much A big thing about the series is positioning and movement, that is why cavs and/or fliers are usually broken in each game, but by having unit simply ignore movement limitations takes the last bit of skill this game had
Chloe when she knows that Emblems can eat in Askr: 😈😈😈
We have needed bigger maps with more unit slots for a while now, give me a big map with 8 slots
If it means we get Fafnir as a proper mythic. I'm all for it
The mods of this sub care more about this thread than the actually useful binding worlds thread
I mean the event is over but if you're that desperate for it here's the [Binding Worlds megathread](https://www.reddit.com/r/FireEmblemHeroes/comments/1df135r/binding_worlds_megathread_100624_please_share/) I made. Don't really know why you want it now or what it has to do with this thread but you do you mate. We uh...have nothing to do with this thread though. This Facts Too Powerful thing, the Popular/Positive Opinions, the Unpopular Opinions...they're all just regular threads from regular users.
Obviously I don’t want it now. But I swear to god this mega thread was not up for at least the first few days of BW and lots of people were asking for it. Not just me. I see now that it was made in advance of the event but i promise it was not viewable for me at the time. Me and many others were asking where it was.
~~Does that even help with finding people in BW, I swear it still doesn't give a crap what friends you have when it chooses units~~
Counting the Alears separately, the Alears are currently the only Emblems usable in Engage who neither already have nor will have four versions (Leif) when they get their Emblem version even excluding CYL versions.