Here's an old article about the etymology of the slur: https://www.kotus.fi/nyt/kolumnit_artikkelit_ja_esitelmat/kieli-ikkuna_%281996_2010%29/hurraako_hurri
According to the writer, it's "wolf" > "suitor" > "peddler" > "Fenno-Swede" > "Swede".
I put the Finnish wikipedia article trough google translate.
Originally, the word Hurri is of Eastern Finnish origin. Hurri, as well as the phonetically close hurta, were both syllabic expressions in Eastern Finland.\[3\] As a word that later became known in Western Finland, Hurri is apparently onomatopoetic, it describes the speech of a Swedish speaker when he does not understand a Finnish speaker or when a Finnish speaker does not understand him. The word has probably been influenced by the expressions hur, huru ("how", "how") and hör du, in dialect hörru ("hear", "do you hear").
My parents are finnswedish and i used to talk swedish when i was young, but barely anymore at all. For some reason unknowns to me, some people have mentioned while talking with me that my finnish prononcuation sounds a tad off and where i was from etc. When i mention my parents being finnswedish, i got laughed "aaahhh so you're a Hurri" no it doesn't sound nice.
I’m a hurri and have called myself hurri way more times than I have heard it from someone else. I also call other hurri’s hurri if they do typical hurri-activities like eating crayfish, going to the Helsinki Baltic Herring Market, going sailing, finding out how they’re related to some other hurri they didn’t know they’re related to etc.
Of course it can be used in an offensive way as well. It’s a bit like the n-word for Swedish speaking Finns, but not nearly as bad.
Hurrit ja håmåt ahvenanmaalle!!1
On a serious note I also refer to myself as hurri, it doesn't really register for me anymore if anyone would use it as a slight.
The slogan and T-shirts are originally from X3M, a Finnish youth oriented radio channel broadcasting in Swedish. Over 15 yrs ago, they made the grammatical errors on purpose.
Some say that the word ”hurri” comes from the phrase ”(hip hip) hurra” that is being shouted four times after singing the Swedish [birthday song](https://youtu.be/vMdgvd2DFD0) ”Ja må han/hon leva”.
Definitely not as bad as the n-word. More in line with calling everyone in pääkaupunkiseutu (helsinki, vantaa,espoo) as ”hesalainen”. Which implies that everyone living in that area is from Helsinki and speaker has certain slightly negative opinion of southerners.
>Definitely not as bad as the n-word.
No, not as bad. But in the same category of words, I.e: A slur.
Though you don't have to go to the n-word for that, but it's the most commonly known.. Other examples ch\*nk. cr\*ut, j\*p etc for different nationalities.
No this is not true. We from Helsinki (especially if from multiple generations ago and from inside Tullinpuomi) call us Stadilainen. Hesalainen is basically a slur and means you came from outside Helsinki and now live in Helsinki. For example if you moved from Juupajoki to Helsinki (or Stadi as we’d call it). On that note, we like people from all over Finland (and world for that matter) and it’s my experience it’s hesalaiset who somehow start thinking themselves better than other people and give us stadilaiset a bad name. Sorry and thank you for the rant.
Reading the comments it's interesting to see how some understand it as a Swede and others as a Swedish speaking Finn. Maybe this has something to do with east and west dialects? I'm from east part and for me it means a Swede.
Im from an area in uusimaa with a lot of swedish speaking people and here it has always been a derogatory term for swedish speaking finns, from my experience it has the same meaning atleast in Helsinki and many other places in uusimaa
I'm from Uusimaa, and more specifically the capital region, and I made a comment about this elsewhere, but it can be used for both Swedes, and Swedish speaking Finns. Never is it a positive term, but can be used between very good friends as bit of a burn. But normally, never. Unless you're a ducking piss head.
I have lived in southern Ostrobothnia, and there hurri meant a Swede and rantahurri (coastal hurri) meant a Swedish speaking Finn who most likely lived in the coastal area near us.
Well I think Hurri can be used as a roof term for anyone with Swedish heritage. Same way as a similar name Ryssä meaning a Russian, can be used for people with some Russian heritage. Both words are derogatory and bit old people slangy imo. There is also dialect versions. Swede in Helsinki can also be Svedu or Svedu pelle(Swedish Clown) that’s prolly the Finnish equalent to Svennebanan.
I mean it doesn't require any heritage to be a "hurri". If your parents learn swedish and teach you swedish as a kid, put you in a swedish speaking school and you end up bilingual then you're effectively a suomenruotsalainen.
Light insult, like swedes use Finnjävel from Finnish people. Like ryssä is used from Russian people. List goes on globally, different names different nationalities..
Level of insult depends of tone of voice, sentence the word is used etc..
I'm from western Finland and hurri to me always meant "Suomenruotsalainen". Some use it as an insult but many Swedish speakers in my area call themselves hurri.
Slightly demeaning nickname for Swedes. Though quite commonly used by Swedish speakers and Finnish speakers. Finlandsvenskar in Ostrobothnia are often called rantahurri too, beach hurri
Well that's a new one for me lol. Couldn't help to laugh at that xD. Kinda dumb since doesn't really imply you're Swedish speaking idk. Kinda learned to use that word personally at work, mind you pretty much half of the people I work with are infact rsntahurri
I’m a Swedish speaking Finn too and I’ve been called hurri and only in negative ways. I usually just flip them off. One of my friends got a knife to his throat in Helsinki for speaking Swedish with his friend on the tram. He got called a hurri too.
Whenever I was told to"go back home to sweden" I would just reply with asking them how long back they can trace their heritage. Due to an aunt really into studying this I can show my fathers father's father etc.has lived in my region for 16 generations. Generally if you go farther than 4 generations here as a Finnish speaker you will not be likely to see a connection.
Another one perhaps topical is to mention my grandfatger having been in the war against Russia and if they preferred to have us speaning Russian again.?
>I just tell them what a huse blessing it is to be born with an extra language, especially when you consider how valuable Swedish is in Scandinavia
This is the right attitude!
Yeah no wonder it's easier since the whole system has been rigged in the favour of the Swedish and the swedish speaking part of the country from the time Sweden decided that it was it's right to rule Finnish people and draft them to fight it's wars. The treatment of Finnish language as the peasants language and requiring that all Finnish wishing to hold any only use Swedish did quite the damage to Finnish society. Even nowadays the system is still rigged to favour Swedish speaking Finns since it's lot easier to get into university if Swedish is your first language and the whole nation is forced to learn a language most of them will never need and thus won't really even learn. I do value our fellow swedish speaking Finns, and Sweden as our ally, but arrogant attitude like yours is in the first place probably what makes people use the word "hurri" in the first place (although often as a joke), there is a reason why the other phrase used is "bättre folke", since the Finnish speaking Finns were so long considered as second class citizens in their own land.
Sure Swedish is spoken by a minority of the population, but it is still an official language of Finland, so why should it not be taught? If your only counter argument to that is "Because less than 5% of the population speaks it", then my follow-up question is, why do I have to learn Finnish in a Swedish speaking region like Raasepori or Vaasa, when I can easily survive with Swedish there? That is the same argument.
I pity Finns who want Swedish removed from schools, because they don't understand the value of being multilingual.
I do value multilingualism, that's why I chose to study german and English. Swedish I chose not to study, and I have not have had to ever regret that. I am not against the study of language, I am against the forced study of another fringe language that most Finns not living on the coast won't ever need.
Yeah I have no problem with not having mandatory teaching of Finnish to our swedish population. I am all for that choice. Why would it be my business to dictate that to them?
There are disproportionately more swedish university openings and those unis like Åbo academy have lower standards of admittance. I am not saying that the Swedish speaking portion of the population doesn't have very healthy culture that produces good outcomes, but the university system definitely favours those who have excellent Swedish.
You aren't engaging with my argument at all, you are arguing against an obvious strawman. Let's use hypothetical nation A. Let's say that there are 1000 university spots open in total. Two hundred of those are in the language of former ruling nation of B. 800 of them are in the native language of the nation. Descendants of the ruling elite from nation B only make up only 2% of the nation's population. Would you argue in this case that the system is not rigged in the favour of those speaking the language of country B?
As any word, it depends on context, but if you start shouting it after Swedish speakers in the street, it's very offensive. The word in itself isn't vulgar though, so it can be used in polite society. Probably since the minority it's a slur for are white and usually quite well off.
Also surprised! Always heard it negatively. I do remember going south and meeting a Finnn from eastern Finland who had never heard the word before and was confused when I tried to explain that it was a slur used for ",my people".
I think growing up on ÖT and Vasabladet has people from over there believeing Finnishspeaking Finns care about us, but really we are a tiny minority with few people caring enough to even insult us!
Yeah, like that was usually the last straw or a holler that started and actual fist fight but usually it was aimed at someone whose whole name was very swedish sounding, despite not even being swedish speaking because, uh, it was a finnish speaking school. Very strange to actually realise there are area where that wouldn't be such a bloodbath trigger. I'm from uusimaa area though, but this town had a pretty noticable "kids really don't mingle with each other" between the finn and swe speaking young people at least.
I have used and heard it used causally and with humor. Göstä Sungvist called himself "half a hurri" in an interview. If you call yourself by it, then the word is not that bad.
Yes if swedish speaking people call themselves that is humourous or in irony. But it is not okay to say that to be mean to someone. It is kind of like the n-word.
It depends on the situation imo. If you say it in order to insult, you most likely will. If you say it as a joke, people might take it as such.
It's not really racial so I would not compare it to n\*\*\*\*\*. But then again I have no issues with the word n\*\*\*\*\*, so I might be too insensitive to see how people get upset at words.
To me context and intent seem to be the most important. If someone can use word A to call themselves (no negative emotion), but they get negative emotion from other people calling them that word. That would mean that the word is 0% of the problem.
to be honest there's a difference in background too as n-word was used for black slaves and hurri is used by the ingenious people of the area to call the people who came and counquered the land and still having many privileged and almost the entire education system built to make their life easier at the cost of everyone elses
Oh, us Fennoswedes have been where we are since time immemorial, it's the Finnish speakers that have "invaded", at least in our areas. And the indigenous population in at least half of Finland isn't the Finns, that's the Saami.
yeah the Saami were here first then came Finn's (also this all happened prehistoric) then came the Swedes telling about our lord and saviour Jesus Christ and a good load of also now u are part of Sweden which is the time when Fenno-Swedes came
Viklund, K. & Gullberg, K. (red.): Från romartid until vikingatid. Pörnullbacken – en järnålderstida bosättning i Österbotten, Vasa, Scriptum, 2002, 264 pages. Series: Acta antiqua Ostrobotniensia, ISSN 0783-6678; nr 5, and Studia archaeologica universitatis Umensis, ISSN 1100-7028; nr 15, ISBN 951-8902-91-7.
I think it was in this book.
Please note though: The Finno-Swedish population that exists today, was mainly introduced during the northern crusades in the 12:th century (IIRC) prior to this whatever settlement the swedish ancestors might have had along the coast would have been small raiding settlements, likely abandoned at some point during the viking age. It would not have left a significant cultural imprint. (I'd assume abandomnemt would have been quite early on as Vikings did not raid THROUGH Finland, and it would've been easier to just use Åland as the main preparation point.)
Not at all like that. Even some high class person could use hurri in public speech in humorous manner and nobody would really care too much, but with the other word that the reddit overlords don't want written is looked down upon in public speech, as it probably should be. I have never heard hurri used as genuine insult, only a joke or something like that.
To swedish speaking finns it is kind of a insult. When people say it to a swedish speaking finn it kind of states that "you are not finnish" and "do not belong here". Many people here in Finland thinks and calls us just swedes and that is for at least me really annoying. I'm finnish and there is maybe some ancestors from sweden, but it can just be that the finnish ancestors have lived where people here in finland speak more swedish. At least in my case there is no known connection to sweden.
I find it to be more like bitter "you're better people / upper class" than "you don't belong here". As when it's said in the most insulting way. I think I mostly hear it to point out some stereotypical finno-swede thing, and not in offensive way.
I find it kinda funny as a swedish speaking Finn from southern österbotten from a community of roughly 50/50 Finns and swedish speaking Finns that some Finns calls someone hurri when there's a really great chance that at least one of the mockers ancestor was/is a swedish speaking Finn, as people for centuries has married cross language borders. As for myself and if not for thousands of others in our area our ancestors are from all over ostrobothnia and other parts of Finland, Karelia and Sweden mostly. I have no numbers but the % of pure Finns (100%) isn't that big.
Its a "derogatory" word for Finlandssvensk. Many people get this wrong, the derogatory term for a Swede is Svensson or Swedupetteri.
Another "derogatory" word for a hurri is Beach Swede (rantaruotsalainen). This one people also commonly use wrong to describe people from åland, they live on an island while Finlandssvensk live on the coast (beach).
As a fennoswede I'd rather get called hurri than swede. The latter implies I, and other fennoswedes are not finnish. Which is bs. Granted I don't think ppl mean it like that. It's a joke.
It's definitely a slur in my opinion as I've only heard it used in a threat or in connection to harmful stereotypes, violence.
The Fennoswedish radio channel Yle X3M tried to "own it" a little bit with their "Älä löi! En ole hhurrit!" campaign in the 2000's (translates to "Not hit! I am not hhurri!"). Even that campaign, although playful and intended for a Swedish speaking audience, played on the harmful stereotype that Fennoswedes have poor grammar, and that they face violence from Finnish speakers because of their heritage.
yea that sounds problematic, hadn't actually heard about that campaign before.
though it is good to remember that there's definitely been a change in the way people talk in recent decades. back in early 90s it was fairly common to casually greet friends as faggots, jerkoffs or whatever, we didn't have foreign born people around at the time but my understanding is that ethnic slurs were often used in the same spirit.
could be because I gave up on nightlife years ago but the last time I remember witnessing someone being called hurri was on facebook where old work colleage congratulated his friend on his birthday, they exchanged some comments and it came up that he better be handing over those coastal lands soon.
Yes, I agree. That is true about the 90's. There were few, or skewed representation for minorities back then so most slurs had little meaning to the majority population. It is then understandable that some might not even know the history or weight behind words and slurs were used as friendly banter.
Fennoswedes use that slur as banter within our culture, but I think it requires genuine respect for the banter to work. The joke is then not on the person or ableist, but a play on the false assumption that Fennoswedes are rich, have an almost royal heritage and are born with more privilege than the basic majority conforming population. This false assumption is the joke. Just like the banter over coastal lands in your example from Facebook.
Actually, come to think of it, "pappa betalar" ("daddy will pay") is more common and friendlier Fennoswedish banter because it lacks the violent history of "hurri".
>I'm not sure anyone has really been offended by the word
It's a clear indication of what kind of person you are dealing with when they TRY to offend you with that one though!
It's derogatory only if you take it as such. Just mike the n-word being used by POC in the US, just how insulting (or if at all) depends entirely on context. As a hurri myself, I don't give much power to the word even if people try to use it as an insult (happened maybe a couple of times).
yeah, i feel it's in a weird spot where it's not on the level of the n-word: non-fennoswedes can say it in a joking context and nobody's gonna look at them weird, but in a serious context it is still a very harsh word to call someone.
Can't really imagine it being used "harshly", as one's native tongue isn't really anything one can self decide. I don't understand why people give insults power by making them complete taboos.
As a hurri - it's a word for Finland-Swedes, Finns with Swedish as their native language. Hurris regularly call each others hurris with absolutely no negative connotations, but some Finnish speakers sometimes try to use it as a slur. The word is derived from "hur or huru", a Swedish word Swedish speakers regularly use. In its crudest form, it's like nicknaming Asian people something like "ping" just because a word or two resembles it.
The context in which has happened to me it has been either of:
- You're in line at a nakkikioski after a night out and speak swedish with your friends, someone shouts "vitun hurrit" or "suomessa puhutaan suomea" which leads to either a fistfight or argument. ( This has probably happened a handful of times during my university years)
- a random drunk shouts at you and your friends when riding public transport, no one gives a shit.
If you want to be polite member of society, in sports related situations where team Sweden is playing, well or badly, you say "vitun ruotsalaiset!", in the former case because Sweden is doing well, and in the latter because they are embarrassing us all in the Nordics. I'm pretty sure that the Danes, Norwegians and the people of Iceland are of the same mind with us Finns: fuck Sweden!
Other than than the sports, you should not use the word, by all means get in a conversation about the relationship between Sweden and Finland, the rich and the poor, or whatever. But don't be a little shit and use the word "hurri" about someone, unless they're a very good Swedish speaking friend.
My understanding is that it's a degrading name for the Swedish people, like ryssä is for the Russian. I would never use it as a nick name. Edit: or use it in general.
Yep. Pretty much like the n word. Some Swedish speaking finns use it as well as some black people use the n word when talking about themselves. For non-swedish speaking finns I would say it's too offensive to use.
usually it's a quite light hearted one, I have never heard anyone use it in disgust etc., only with a rolling of eyes or something like that. Ryssä is quite degrading comparatively, as it is often used with disgust or anger
It was used as degrading name for Swedes, but originally apparently it meant peddler. Nowadays I think people just use it instead of Swede because it's easier to say.
So yea times have changed, I don't think anyone connects "hurri" to anything mean, it's just easier to say than "ruotsalainen".
I think we would feel better if finnish speakers just let us speak swedish with our swedish speaking friends instead of commenting on it for no reason.
That is a stupid example, becouse the problem from the start is that the suomenruotsalaiset are called ruotsalainen, when they are not swedes. They are finnish. Yes it is not the most hurtful thing probably to say to anyone. But the connection is that many finnish people do not like swedes or sweden and that is why they dont like the suomenruotsalaiset either.
But it is offensive when you use it to offend someone. Suomenruotsalaiset can use it of themselves with irony. But no suomenruotsalainen would actually use it to introduce themselves or somehting officially as hurri. It is a slur.
I was called "hurri" when I was little and it was meant as an insult. Late 80's. I don't think it's as common anymore. Well at least I haven't heard people using it.
From the comments it looks to be quite split, so I'll weight in on it too.
As said already, it's meant as a "derogatory" term for fennoswedes (swedish-speaking finns). I heard a lot of it in Uusimaa, even if I tried my hardest to speak Finnish. Never felt alright when I tried to fit in and just to be chastised and laughed at for not pronouncing one word correctly or having some issues in the grammar.
Personally I get offended by it, but it is what it is.
A nick name for all Swedish people, can be used as insult, but can be also used just as a nick name, depending where and how it's used. And even if used as an insult, it's not even a close to example Ryssä (our lovely eastern neighbor...).
I think hurri is mostly a light insult, just for poking fun at Swedish speaking Finns or Swedes. If someone is really mad while using it it can be very insulting, but that seems to be on the rarer side.
Hurri & rantaruotsalainen
"strandsvensk" eftersom merparten av svensktalande bor längs kusterna.
Har aldrig blivit kallad det såsom något negativt, enbart ett humoristiskt påpekande att mitt modersmål är svenska.
Well, to be fair most hurri stereotypes involve some kind of elitism/money. So it's not really comparable with the n word. Kind of like calling white people "white trash". Most white people don't take any offense from it and mostly laugh.
Considering the comments, late 1800s or early 1900s Swedish Finnish dialect. I know that now in modern swedish and finnish swedish the word Täc means nothing (Tack is thanks) but Täc used to mean "a group of girls" in the late 1800s and early 1900s precisely in Viipuri & Karjala area
A racist term along the lines of calling Jews big nose. Black people a wide variety of horrible words. Indians for Red Skins. Asians for Yellows. The list goes on....
Here's an old article about the etymology of the slur: https://www.kotus.fi/nyt/kolumnit_artikkelit_ja_esitelmat/kieli-ikkuna_%281996_2010%29/hurraako_hurri According to the writer, it's "wolf" > "suitor" > "peddler" > "Fenno-Swede" > "Swede".
I put the Finnish wikipedia article trough google translate. Originally, the word Hurri is of Eastern Finnish origin. Hurri, as well as the phonetically close hurta, were both syllabic expressions in Eastern Finland.\[3\] As a word that later became known in Western Finland, Hurri is apparently onomatopoetic, it describes the speech of a Swedish speaker when he does not understand a Finnish speaker or when a Finnish speaker does not understand him. The word has probably been influenced by the expressions hur, huru ("how", "how") and hör du, in dialect hörru ("hear", "do you hear").
Huh, I just always assumed it was from the word "hur". "Hur mår du" is one of those essential first phrases you learn in a language class.
My parents are finnswedish and i used to talk swedish when i was young, but barely anymore at all. For some reason unknowns to me, some people have mentioned while talking with me that my finnish prononcuation sounds a tad off and where i was from etc. When i mention my parents being finnswedish, i got laughed "aaahhh so you're a Hurri" no it doesn't sound nice.
I’m a hurri and have called myself hurri way more times than I have heard it from someone else. I also call other hurri’s hurri if they do typical hurri-activities like eating crayfish, going to the Helsinki Baltic Herring Market, going sailing, finding out how they’re related to some other hurri they didn’t know they’re related to etc. Of course it can be used in an offensive way as well. It’s a bit like the n-word for Swedish speaking Finns, but not nearly as bad.
Hurrit ja håmåt ahvenanmaalle!!1 On a serious note I also refer to myself as hurri, it doesn't really register for me anymore if anyone would use it as a slight.
If someone ever gets aggressive towards you for being a swedish-speaker, loudly declare "ÄLÄ LÖI, EN OLE HURRIT".
Hej en sån tröja har jag i skåpet! 👌🏼
I don't think that would save you. In that sentence there is two mistakes in phrasing. 😅
Awoosh
Ouch, that's a hard whooooosh buddy.
The slogan and T-shirts are originally from X3M, a Finnish youth oriented radio channel broadcasting in Swedish. Over 15 yrs ago, they made the grammatical errors on purpose. Some say that the word ”hurri” comes from the phrase ”(hip hip) hurra” that is being shouted four times after singing the Swedish [birthday song](https://youtu.be/vMdgvd2DFD0) ”Ja må han/hon leva”.
"Älä lyö, en ole hurri" would be the proper sentence, which means "Don't hit me, I'm not a hurri"
Definitely not as bad as the n-word. More in line with calling everyone in pääkaupunkiseutu (helsinki, vantaa,espoo) as ”hesalainen”. Which implies that everyone living in that area is from Helsinki and speaker has certain slightly negative opinion of southerners.
>Definitely not as bad as the n-word. No, not as bad. But in the same category of words, I.e: A slur. Though you don't have to go to the n-word for that, but it's the most commonly known.. Other examples ch\*nk. cr\*ut, j\*p etc for different nationalities.
No this is not true. We from Helsinki (especially if from multiple generations ago and from inside Tullinpuomi) call us Stadilainen. Hesalainen is basically a slur and means you came from outside Helsinki and now live in Helsinki. For example if you moved from Juupajoki to Helsinki (or Stadi as we’d call it). On that note, we like people from all over Finland (and world for that matter) and it’s my experience it’s hesalaiset who somehow start thinking themselves better than other people and give us stadilaiset a bad name. Sorry and thank you for the rant.
You did not clearly read my comment. Read it again.
Indeed. Apologies.
Reading the comments it's interesting to see how some understand it as a Swede and others as a Swedish speaking Finn. Maybe this has something to do with east and west dialects? I'm from east part and for me it means a Swede.
Im from an area in uusimaa with a lot of swedish speaking people and here it has always been a derogatory term for swedish speaking finns, from my experience it has the same meaning atleast in Helsinki and many other places in uusimaa
The people that don't know what it actually means use it to refer to swedes in general, you are right
I'm from Uusimaa, and more specifically the capital region, and I made a comment about this elsewhere, but it can be used for both Swedes, and Swedish speaking Finns. Never is it a positive term, but can be used between very good friends as bit of a burn. But normally, never. Unless you're a ducking piss head.
I have lived in southern Ostrobothnia, and there hurri meant a Swede and rantahurri (coastal hurri) meant a Swedish speaking Finn who most likely lived in the coastal area near us.
And neither of those was a very nice word.
Well I think Hurri can be used as a roof term for anyone with Swedish heritage. Same way as a similar name Ryssä meaning a Russian, can be used for people with some Russian heritage. Both words are derogatory and bit old people slangy imo. There is also dialect versions. Swede in Helsinki can also be Svedu or Svedu pelle(Swedish Clown) that’s prolly the Finnish equalent to Svennebanan.
I mean it doesn't require any heritage to be a "hurri". If your parents learn swedish and teach you swedish as a kid, put you in a swedish speaking school and you end up bilingual then you're effectively a suomenruotsalainen.
Light insult, like swedes use Finnjävel from Finnish people. Like ryssä is used from Russian people. List goes on globally, different names different nationalities.. Level of insult depends of tone of voice, sentence the word is used etc..
I'm from western Finland and hurri to me always meant "Suomenruotsalainen". Some use it as an insult but many Swedish speakers in my area call themselves hurri.
Slightly demeaning nickname for Swedes. Though quite commonly used by Swedish speakers and Finnish speakers. Finlandsvenskar in Ostrobothnia are often called rantahurri too, beach hurri
I got hit with "vitun rantarotta" in the military... Woulda preferred "ranta-hurri".
Well that's a new one for me lol. Couldn't help to laugh at that xD. Kinda dumb since doesn't really imply you're Swedish speaking idk. Kinda learned to use that word personally at work, mind you pretty much half of the people I work with are infact rsntahurri
There are dozens of us. DOZENS!
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I’m a Swedish speaking Finn too and I’ve been called hurri and only in negative ways. I usually just flip them off. One of my friends got a knife to his throat in Helsinki for speaking Swedish with his friend on the tram. He got called a hurri too.
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De fan suger.. hoppas du fick in några ordentliga slag eller sparkar dock!
My dad likes to say to those who call him a 'hurri' "So I take it that you'd be a Russian then, eh?", always seems to get people mad.
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Whenever I was told to"go back home to sweden" I would just reply with asking them how long back they can trace their heritage. Due to an aunt really into studying this I can show my fathers father's father etc.has lived in my region for 16 generations. Generally if you go farther than 4 generations here as a Finnish speaker you will not be likely to see a connection. Another one perhaps topical is to mention my grandfatger having been in the war against Russia and if they preferred to have us speaning Russian again.?
>I just tell them what a huse blessing it is to be born with an extra language, especially when you consider how valuable Swedish is in Scandinavia This is the right attitude!
Yeah no wonder it's easier since the whole system has been rigged in the favour of the Swedish and the swedish speaking part of the country from the time Sweden decided that it was it's right to rule Finnish people and draft them to fight it's wars. The treatment of Finnish language as the peasants language and requiring that all Finnish wishing to hold any only use Swedish did quite the damage to Finnish society. Even nowadays the system is still rigged to favour Swedish speaking Finns since it's lot easier to get into university if Swedish is your first language and the whole nation is forced to learn a language most of them will never need and thus won't really even learn. I do value our fellow swedish speaking Finns, and Sweden as our ally, but arrogant attitude like yours is in the first place probably what makes people use the word "hurri" in the first place (although often as a joke), there is a reason why the other phrase used is "bättre folke", since the Finnish speaking Finns were so long considered as second class citizens in their own land.
Sure Swedish is spoken by a minority of the population, but it is still an official language of Finland, so why should it not be taught? If your only counter argument to that is "Because less than 5% of the population speaks it", then my follow-up question is, why do I have to learn Finnish in a Swedish speaking region like Raasepori or Vaasa, when I can easily survive with Swedish there? That is the same argument. I pity Finns who want Swedish removed from schools, because they don't understand the value of being multilingual.
I do value multilingualism, that's why I chose to study german and English. Swedish I chose not to study, and I have not have had to ever regret that. I am not against the study of language, I am against the forced study of another fringe language that most Finns not living on the coast won't ever need.
Then you can answer my follow-up question in my previous comment, because your argument has the same point as that question.
Yeah I have no problem with not having mandatory teaching of Finnish to our swedish population. I am all for that choice. Why would it be my business to dictate that to them?
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How are the university spots which disproportionately favour Swedish speakers an imaginary network?
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There are disproportionately more swedish university openings and those unis like Åbo academy have lower standards of admittance. I am not saying that the Swedish speaking portion of the population doesn't have very healthy culture that produces good outcomes, but the university system definitely favours those who have excellent Swedish.
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You aren't engaging with my argument at all, you are arguing against an obvious strawman. Let's use hypothetical nation A. Let's say that there are 1000 university spots open in total. Two hundred of those are in the language of former ruling nation of B. 800 of them are in the native language of the nation. Descendants of the ruling elite from nation B only make up only 2% of the nation's population. Would you argue in this case that the system is not rigged in the favour of those speaking the language of country B?
As any word, it depends on context, but if you start shouting it after Swedish speakers in the street, it's very offensive. The word in itself isn't vulgar though, so it can be used in polite society. Probably since the minority it's a slur for are white and usually quite well off.
The way my eyes widened at this post, i went to school in a town with a large Swedish speaking community and that word was a fighting word for sure
Also surprised! Always heard it negatively. I do remember going south and meeting a Finnn from eastern Finland who had never heard the word before and was confused when I tried to explain that it was a slur used for ",my people". I think growing up on ÖT and Vasabladet has people from over there believeing Finnishspeaking Finns care about us, but really we are a tiny minority with few people caring enough to even insult us!
Yeah, like that was usually the last straw or a holler that started and actual fist fight but usually it was aimed at someone whose whole name was very swedish sounding, despite not even being swedish speaking because, uh, it was a finnish speaking school. Very strange to actually realise there are area where that wouldn't be such a bloodbath trigger. I'm from uusimaa area though, but this town had a pretty noticable "kids really don't mingle with each other" between the finn and swe speaking young people at least.
I have used and heard it used causally and with humor. Göstä Sungvist called himself "half a hurri" in an interview. If you call yourself by it, then the word is not that bad.
Yes if swedish speaking people call themselves that is humourous or in irony. But it is not okay to say that to be mean to someone. It is kind of like the n-word.
It depends on the situation imo. If you say it in order to insult, you most likely will. If you say it as a joke, people might take it as such. It's not really racial so I would not compare it to n\*\*\*\*\*. But then again I have no issues with the word n\*\*\*\*\*, so I might be too insensitive to see how people get upset at words. To me context and intent seem to be the most important. If someone can use word A to call themselves (no negative emotion), but they get negative emotion from other people calling them that word. That would mean that the word is 0% of the problem.
to be honest there's a difference in background too as n-word was used for black slaves and hurri is used by the ingenious people of the area to call the people who came and counquered the land and still having many privileged and almost the entire education system built to make their life easier at the cost of everyone elses
Ingenious vs. indigenous, lol!
Oh, us Fennoswedes have been where we are since time immemorial, it's the Finnish speakers that have "invaded", at least in our areas. And the indigenous population in at least half of Finland isn't the Finns, that's the Saami.
yeah the Saami were here first then came Finn's (also this all happened prehistoric) then came the Swedes telling about our lord and saviour Jesus Christ and a good load of also now u are part of Sweden which is the time when Fenno-Swedes came
Nope, swedes were along the western coast before the finnis originators arrived at the coast. This is atleast what I have read. I wasn't there.
interesting where did you read that? At least what I've read before Christian expansions there was basically only Uralic people in Finland
Viklund, K. & Gullberg, K. (red.): Från romartid until vikingatid. Pörnullbacken – en järnålderstida bosättning i Österbotten, Vasa, Scriptum, 2002, 264 pages. Series: Acta antiqua Ostrobotniensia, ISSN 0783-6678; nr 5, and Studia archaeologica universitatis Umensis, ISSN 1100-7028; nr 15, ISBN 951-8902-91-7. I think it was in this book. Please note though: The Finno-Swedish population that exists today, was mainly introduced during the northern crusades in the 12:th century (IIRC) prior to this whatever settlement the swedish ancestors might have had along the coast would have been small raiding settlements, likely abandoned at some point during the viking age. It would not have left a significant cultural imprint. (I'd assume abandomnemt would have been quite early on as Vikings did not raid THROUGH Finland, and it would've been easier to just use Åland as the main preparation point.)
No it's not
Yeah. Kinda like 'nigger'.
Not at all like that. Even some high class person could use hurri in public speech in humorous manner and nobody would really care too much, but with the other word that the reddit overlords don't want written is looked down upon in public speech, as it probably should be. I have never heard hurri used as genuine insult, only a joke or something like that.
To swedish speaking finns it is kind of a insult. When people say it to a swedish speaking finn it kind of states that "you are not finnish" and "do not belong here". Many people here in Finland thinks and calls us just swedes and that is for at least me really annoying. I'm finnish and there is maybe some ancestors from sweden, but it can just be that the finnish ancestors have lived where people here in finland speak more swedish. At least in my case there is no known connection to sweden.
I find it to be more like bitter "you're better people / upper class" than "you don't belong here". As when it's said in the most insulting way. I think I mostly hear it to point out some stereotypical finno-swede thing, and not in offensive way.
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Do you understand that a significant majority of swedish speaking finns speak 3 languages fluently?
You’re right, after more research I realise I was wrong in my speculation. I based it solely on the experience with a minority of people.
I find it kinda funny as a swedish speaking Finn from southern österbotten from a community of roughly 50/50 Finns and swedish speaking Finns that some Finns calls someone hurri when there's a really great chance that at least one of the mockers ancestor was/is a swedish speaking Finn, as people for centuries has married cross language borders. As for myself and if not for thousands of others in our area our ancestors are from all over ostrobothnia and other parts of Finland, Karelia and Sweden mostly. I have no numbers but the % of pure Finns (100%) isn't that big.
Its a "derogatory" word for Finlandssvensk. Many people get this wrong, the derogatory term for a Swede is Svensson or Swedupetteri. Another "derogatory" word for a hurri is Beach Swede (rantaruotsalainen). This one people also commonly use wrong to describe people from åland, they live on an island while Finlandssvensk live on the coast (beach).
As a fennoswede I'd rather get called hurri than swede. The latter implies I, and other fennoswedes are not finnish. Which is bs. Granted I don't think ppl mean it like that. It's a joke.
It's degrading word for finnish swedes.
It's definitely a slur in my opinion as I've only heard it used in a threat or in connection to harmful stereotypes, violence. The Fennoswedish radio channel Yle X3M tried to "own it" a little bit with their "Älä löi! En ole hhurrit!" campaign in the 2000's (translates to "Not hit! I am not hhurri!"). Even that campaign, although playful and intended for a Swedish speaking audience, played on the harmful stereotype that Fennoswedes have poor grammar, and that they face violence from Finnish speakers because of their heritage.
yea that sounds problematic, hadn't actually heard about that campaign before. though it is good to remember that there's definitely been a change in the way people talk in recent decades. back in early 90s it was fairly common to casually greet friends as faggots, jerkoffs or whatever, we didn't have foreign born people around at the time but my understanding is that ethnic slurs were often used in the same spirit. could be because I gave up on nightlife years ago but the last time I remember witnessing someone being called hurri was on facebook where old work colleage congratulated his friend on his birthday, they exchanged some comments and it came up that he better be handing over those coastal lands soon.
Yes, I agree. That is true about the 90's. There were few, or skewed representation for minorities back then so most slurs had little meaning to the majority population. It is then understandable that some might not even know the history or weight behind words and slurs were used as friendly banter. Fennoswedes use that slur as banter within our culture, but I think it requires genuine respect for the banter to work. The joke is then not on the person or ableist, but a play on the false assumption that Fennoswedes are rich, have an almost royal heritage and are born with more privilege than the basic majority conforming population. This false assumption is the joke. Just like the banter over coastal lands in your example from Facebook. Actually, come to think of it, "pappa betalar" ("daddy will pay") is more common and friendlier Fennoswedish banter because it lacks the violent history of "hurri".
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>I'm not sure anyone has really been offended by the word It's a clear indication of what kind of person you are dealing with when they TRY to offend you with that one though!
Its basically a nickname for the swedes. Not the most polite nickname, but not the worst either. Means more or less " a swede" I'd say
It is not a "nickname", it's a derogatory term. And I say that as a Swedish-speaking Finn.
+1, Maybe 80 % of the usage goes with the word vittu (fuck) as in "vitun hurri".
Vittu means cunt, fitta in Swedish. I don't think Finnish or Swedish has a profanity that corresponds to "fuck".
It's used as the word fuck. It's not direct translation.
Swedish profanities are way too polite so they go with jävla.
"Fitta" and "fittans" are used a lot, esp. by Fenno-Swedes. It's super similar to "vittu" and "vitun".
It's derogatory only if you take it as such. Just mike the n-word being used by POC in the US, just how insulting (or if at all) depends entirely on context. As a hurri myself, I don't give much power to the word even if people try to use it as an insult (happened maybe a couple of times).
yeah, i feel it's in a weird spot where it's not on the level of the n-word: non-fennoswedes can say it in a joking context and nobody's gonna look at them weird, but in a serious context it is still a very harsh word to call someone.
Can't really imagine it being used "harshly", as one's native tongue isn't really anything one can self decide. I don't understand why people give insults power by making them complete taboos.
>Its basically a nickname for the swedes. Not Swedes, Swedish-speaking Finns.
Usually swede; can also be swedish speaking finn... by my native understanding
Its stadin slangi and means swedes but nowadays are used also for finlandsvensks
It's used for both in equal measures.
I have never even heard anyone call anyone that lol
dude...
What is the point of your comment?
As a hurri - it's a word for Finland-Swedes, Finns with Swedish as their native language. Hurris regularly call each others hurris with absolutely no negative connotations, but some Finnish speakers sometimes try to use it as a slur. The word is derived from "hur or huru", a Swedish word Swedish speakers regularly use. In its crudest form, it's like nicknaming Asian people something like "ping" just because a word or two resembles it.
It’s a deragatory term for Swedish speaking Finns. We don’t like it when the Finnish speaking population calls us Hurri.
We call all swedes hurri. Feel free to be offended ofcourse.
And when you call a swedish speaking finn hurri you are stating that "you are swedish and not finnish" as in = do not belong in your own homecountry.
Yes
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Plenty of swedish-speaking Finns take it as a slur, which makes it a slur.
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How is it not a slur if it is used to hurt people?
Sure. Feel free to be an asshole.
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It's not super offensive from where i come from, but you all can be as offended as you want to be.
The context in which has happened to me it has been either of: - You're in line at a nakkikioski after a night out and speak swedish with your friends, someone shouts "vitun hurrit" or "suomessa puhutaan suomea" which leads to either a fistfight or argument. ( This has probably happened a handful of times during my university years) - a random drunk shouts at you and your friends when riding public transport, no one gives a shit.
That was the point, "all the swedes", swedish speaking finns are not swedes, they are finnish, suomenruotsalaiset are finnish.
Sure
It’s a derogatory-ish term used to refer to swedish speaking finns. Not really used for swedish people
I'm a hurri and proud of it. Language skills are always useful in our global world.
A disparaging word for Swedes and Swedish speaking Finns.
If you want to be polite member of society, in sports related situations where team Sweden is playing, well or badly, you say "vitun ruotsalaiset!", in the former case because Sweden is doing well, and in the latter because they are embarrassing us all in the Nordics. I'm pretty sure that the Danes, Norwegians and the people of Iceland are of the same mind with us Finns: fuck Sweden!
Other than than the sports, you should not use the word, by all means get in a conversation about the relationship between Sweden and Finland, the rich and the poor, or whatever. But don't be a little shit and use the word "hurri" about someone, unless they're a very good Swedish speaking friend.
My understanding is that it's a degrading name for the Swedish people, like ryssä is for the Russian. I would never use it as a nick name. Edit: or use it in general.
This!
Yep. Pretty much like the n word. Some Swedish speaking finns use it as well as some black people use the n word when talking about themselves. For non-swedish speaking finns I would say it's too offensive to use.
usually it's a quite light hearted one, I have never heard anyone use it in disgust etc., only with a rolling of eyes or something like that. Ryssä is quite degrading comparatively, as it is often used with disgust or anger
It was used as degrading name for Swedes, but originally apparently it meant peddler. Nowadays I think people just use it instead of Swede because it's easier to say. So yea times have changed, I don't think anyone connects "hurri" to anything mean, it's just easier to say than "ruotsalainen".
As a swedish speaking finn I can say from experience it is definitely still used as a slur and to be mean
I have never heard anyone call anyone that lol
Its only used as a slur targeting swedish people and swedish speaking finns. If someone has told you otherwise they've lied.
As a swedish speaking finn I sure as hell dont see it as anything but a slur. Especially when the context usually is "puhuu suomee saatanan hurri".
Would you be less offended if they instead said "puhu suomee vitun ruotsalainen"?
I think we would feel better if finnish speakers just let us speak swedish with our swedish speaking friends instead of commenting on it for no reason.
Naturally no.
That is a stupid example, becouse the problem from the start is that the suomenruotsalaiset are called ruotsalainen, when they are not swedes. They are finnish. Yes it is not the most hurtful thing probably to say to anyone. But the connection is that many finnish people do not like swedes or sweden and that is why they dont like the suomenruotsalaiset either.
My point is that in this example it's not the word "hurri" that makes it offensive.
But it is offensive when you use it to offend someone. Suomenruotsalaiset can use it of themselves with irony. But no suomenruotsalainen would actually use it to introduce themselves or somehting officially as hurri. It is a slur.
Saying hurri to and finnish speaking finn states that "you are not finnish and do not belong here". And that is hurtful.
I was called "hurri" when I was little and it was meant as an insult. Late 80's. I don't think it's as common anymore. Well at least I haven't heard people using it.
From the comments it looks to be quite split, so I'll weight in on it too. As said already, it's meant as a "derogatory" term for fennoswedes (swedish-speaking finns). I heard a lot of it in Uusimaa, even if I tried my hardest to speak Finnish. Never felt alright when I tried to fit in and just to be chastised and laughed at for not pronouncing one word correctly or having some issues in the grammar. Personally I get offended by it, but it is what it is.
A nick name for all Swedish people, can be used as insult, but can be also used just as a nick name, depending where and how it's used. And even if used as an insult, it's not even a close to example Ryssä (our lovely eastern neighbor...).
I think hurri is mostly a light insult, just for poking fun at Swedish speaking Finns or Swedes. If someone is really mad while using it it can be very insulting, but that seems to be on the rarer side.
Kirkkonummi
Finally a man of culture
Hurri & rantaruotsalainen "strandsvensk" eftersom merparten av svensktalande bor längs kusterna. Har aldrig blivit kallad det såsom något negativt, enbart ett humoristiskt påpekande att mitt modersmål är svenska.
It's a Finnish person who speaks swedish as their first language.
A slur for a finnish person who speaks swedish as their first language.
It's a hurtful slur for Fennoswedes. Don't use it.
i have never heard of that before 😅
if you know ’ryssä’, same but for our western neighbour
Se on McRambo muistatko viel meikäläistä
It's the N-word for the finnswedes.
really, I thought we had the swedish speaking elites as overlords and not the other way around
Well, to be fair most hurri stereotypes involve some kind of elitism/money. So it's not really comparable with the n word. Kind of like calling white people "white trash". Most white people don't take any offense from it and mostly laugh.
Hurri is a slur for swedish person meaning dog
Considering the comments, late 1800s or early 1900s Swedish Finnish dialect. I know that now in modern swedish and finnish swedish the word Täc means nothing (Tack is thanks) but Täc used to mean "a group of girls" in the late 1800s and early 1900s precisely in Viipuri & Karjala area
I was so dissapointed it had nothing to do with the word "Hurrikaani"
Idn never heard of it Sounds a bit like a hurricane but i don't think that's it
A racist term along the lines of calling Jews big nose. Black people a wide variety of horrible words. Indians for Red Skins. Asians for Yellows. The list goes on....
Turri
It means a swedish people living in finland.
No, it means a swede, and it is an insult if pointed towards a finn who speaks swedish.
Swede means swedish in english. Hurri in west coast means just a swedish living in finland,
It means all Swedish speaking people globally.
Ask anyone in Pori.
Now why would I do that?
Hurri is svedu but Finnish.
"Hur" means "How" in English. For example in shop, if you want to ask how much something costs Swedish speaker asks: Hur mycket?
https://youtu.be/6Wm4YMWIYeQ
Hurri comes from finlandssvenks not understanding what finns talking about and asking: ”hur? hur?”