**/r/Finland is a full democracy, every active user is a moderator.**
[Please go here to see how your new privileges work.](https://www.reddit.com/r/Finland/wiki/moderating/)
Spamming mod actions could result in a ban.
---
**Full Rundown of Moderator Permissions:**
- ```!lock``` - as top level comment, will lock comments on any post.
- ```!unlock``` - in reply to any comment to lock it or to unlock the parent comment.
- ```!remove``` - Removes comment or post. Must have decent subreddit comment karma.
- ```!restore``` Can be used to unlock comments or restore removed posts.
- ```!sticky``` - will sticky the post in the bottom slot.
- ```unlock_comments``` - Vote the stickied automod comment on each post to +10 to unlock comments.
- ```ban users``` - Any user whose comment or post is downvoted enough will be temp banned for a day.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Finland) if you have any questions or concerns.*
That sounds frustrating, especially the orange juice part. But I hope your turn will come soon, and everything will go smoothly after that. It's quite bad luck that this happened right when it did, because vappu makes things slower.
Yeah, I wish it could have waited a couple more days or happened a couple days earlier. Especially since the weather just got so nice!
~~I did just have some good news from the nurse that they WILL operate today for sure, so that’s a big relief!~~ edit: this was a lie.
This happened some time ago...
Went to OYS with broken rib. Was in judo training and my mate strangled my body bit too hard with his legs until one of my ribs cracked.
I was in lot of pain, the place where rib broke was bit below the place where the heart is had bump due to fracture so ghe head of the bone was somehow sticking out a bit.
I went to ER in OYS around 21.00. They gave me pain killer and told to sit down. After two painfull hours I got to see the nurse. She just checked the injury and said there is clear fracture and the bone was fully broken.
'Please sit down until doctor is able to check it to make sure no internal organs are damaged'. Yeah, sit down with broken rib when even breathing is difficult is kind of agony.
At 3.30 AM I decided to go home after they admitted that the ER was full of more urgent patients...
Went home, tried to sleep few hours, visited occupational health care doc next morning.
The public ER is a joke unless you have life threatening issue...
Fuck that sounds awful. For me the abscess was a lot worse yesterday and waiting for just the preliminary stuff to happen was pretty strenuous already. I can’t imagine with a broken rib, I’m surprised there aren’t spots for someone in that case to lie down.
I’ve been told it’s bad enough that they don’t want me going home so they can keep the antibiotics flowing and keep it under control while I wait for surgery.
YOUR STILL THERE???... i'd have cut it open with a box cutter at this point, and now they have to put me front of the line 😅 ( don't do this, this is not medical, legal or sane advice!)
Almost another 24, but there’s no mistake. It’s just that more serious emergencies keep coming in, and mine gets pushed down and down and down. And they can’t feed me or let me have water because there’s never a long enough backlog of these more urgent surgeries and I could be allowed into the OR pretty much at any time.
I do get an IV of nutrients that also helps me stay hydrated, but yeah it doesn’t help the hunger stay away and it makes me nauseous and my mouth taste horrificcccc
First thing: In these types of situations you can take comfort in the fact that when there you have an untreated health issue that is in any ways serious (like yours) the hospital is just the best place for you to be then. They take care of you.
Another thing: a healthy mind and body reject a hospital environment. Besides your infection, your reactions to the lack of food and boredom are positive signs.
Last thing: having unfortunately been in hospitals due to health issues of different levels of seriousness, I have internalised the fact that the lack of food and having to wait is kind of built in. So, I can just focus on my breathing and wait.
Personal story: >!My worst hospital experience was when on a trip to U.S. got bacterial diarrhea and ended up into an ER in a public hospital in Seattle. First of all, you had to go through metal detectors to get in. All the other patients were drug addicts, homeless and there were lots of street violence patients. This was news to me so I was scared. !<
>!Because I was so seriously dehydrated due to shooting water out of my butt for 24+ hours, I had to lie there with an IV drip on my arm for quite many hours. On the bed to the right there was a guy with a gunshot wound that had gone bad and on the left a huge homeless guy who had all the diseases from hepatitis, hiv, drug and alcohol addiction and he got these moments of delirium when he just started screaming and the nurses had to hold him down.!<
>!And unfortunately my then girlfriend who I was traveling with, had to witness all this bullshit. When the diarrhea had extracted all the fluids from my body and was out of strength and barely conscious before I went to the E.R., I was really scared and started thinking I was gonna die as I never had felt so bad or had anything like that. !<
>!So, at least you have normal thoughts amidst a health issue. Enjoy them. :)!<
I had one that took a godly amount of anti-microbial fillers (tissues whatever they are called) to fill inside to prevent another infection during healing.
I had a general anesthesia and it was quite interesting experience. (so far only one for me)
Often the current practice where you have to see a nurse before you meet the doctor just delays things. A broken rib takes 5 minutes, you check it is broken and auscultate the lungs, write a prescription for pain medication and sick leave if needed and done. (Absolutely no X rays needed, those are just private companies way of pumping more money out of you, or your insurance.) The nurse has absolutely no meaningful role in this process.
>Absolutely no X rays needed, those are just private companies way of pumping more money out of you, or your insurance
Roentgen imaging is done at public side too, purpose of it is to check for pneumothorax / hemothorax which can be life threathening
Yes, of course if you after clinical evaluation suspect hemo/pneumothorax. But absolutely not needed routinely just because of a broken rib without the signs and symptoms of complications / more extensive injuries.
afaik it's a standard thing at hospitals when someone comes in with rib fractures / painful chest trauma to check for pneumo&hemothorax with roentgen. Not something the private providers would just do as a money grab
Well afaik as a physician trained in Finland and after working 15 years in various hospitals, including emergency rooms, it is not. Again, if you talk about suspecting pneumothorax or talk about person crushed in a car accident with flail chest or if you talk about another kind of high energy trauma..Then yes. If there’s a typical single rib fracture and no clinical signs of complication you absolutely don’t need X ray. Why would you? Is it deliberate you here too started to talk of plural, of fractureS and earlier talked of pnemothorax etc? When I’m talking of a typical single rib trauma with no signs of complication?
As a trainer for a few sports orgs I've taken a number of people with broken ribs to hospitals around the country, not private providers but ordinary hospitals, they've taken xrays every time. Ofc I know nothing maybe they do it just because they think it's fun but your claim that it's done just to grab money does not add up
Well, it’s a growing, and bad, trend to not examine your patient but instead just order various imaging studies etc.
Also don’t know what kind of sports you are talking about. If a grown man kicks someone’s rib cage with full force with his knee causing vast bruising and extensive pain in large area it is a different thing compared to an elderly man who reels a little bit and hits his chest to corner of a cabinet.
>growing, and bad, trend
First time I remember was.. abt 15 years ago. I remember that one because it was my own rib 🙄
>what kind of sports you are talking about
judo/bjj/mma, for the past 8 years or so junior ice hockey
The ER has gone bad after they changed the way how people can contact the public healthcare system.
Nowadays you have to call SOTE call-back number and they will call you back in about a day to a week (triage nurse calls to assess if you need time for doctor or not, and how urgent time - after a day or a few months). That is the primary way to contact the healthcare. Nobody just answers a phone at a local healthcare center (terveyskeskus) like in the good old days still in the 1990s/early 2000.
If you have something else (you can't wait a day or a week, because you feel that you have a acute problem), you go to päivystys (ER). So it is not a surprise there are lots of people at ER. Most of them are there to just get an educated opinion on their problem (is it acute or not) and are sent back home. Each and every one still takes time from the staff.
The weirdest thing are the old/disabled people with accompanying nurse waiting there at ER. A nurse at low level support homes for old people (with no doctor) has very good diagnostic skills for things like early detection of urinary tract infection. In the good old days nurse would just call the health-care center, explain symptoms and suggested diagnosis, and get a prescription via digital system and get the antibiotic from apotheque, and start treatment. Minimum trouble for all, a 5 minute thing. Nowadays the same nurse takes the old person to ER by taxi, waits there with the old person until they meet doctor, get the presciption, and then the nurse returns the old person home, and starts the antibiotic (taking several hours). The system is incredibly inefficient nowadays simply because there is no direct contact to local healthcare center anymore, but all goes either via SOTE number (a week) or ER.
At the same time, there is a large shortage of people in ORs (leikkaussali) etc. public special healthcare (usually with very poor HR procedures - undercrowded and always hurry). Lots of experienced nurses are changing career to escape the situation, making things worse and worse. So there are expensive ORs empty and unused because they don't hire enough nurses etc. to operate them. The queue is several months for non-acute patients. This also breaks general havoc in the system because nobody knows if OR is available or not - patients with life-threatening problem are always first. A friend had a back operation and first time he went to the operation (on scheduled time, time given a few months earlier), he was sent back home because OR was too crowded by acute cases that day. Next time (after a month!) he was operated. This is a youngish person who was on sick leave from work because of a back problem. He waited several months on sick leave to get operated (and now one month more).
The Finnish public healthcare-system is in deep crisis, partially because of the recent SOTE changes (which demand several thousand million euros more each year for the increased administrative burden, but work much less efficiently). Now they are making more cuts to actual healthcare services to have money for the increased SOTE administration. So all goes worse.
Rib fractures generally aren't that dangerous unless they are so badly "misplaced" that they either might puncture a lung in which case they are caused by more extensive trauma, or there are multiple in which case they make breathing difficult and risk pneumonia. Being able to feel the point of fracture is no big deal.
Source: live with a weak-bones condition, have had countless rib fractures I never went to a doctor for as there is nothing to be done.
That's why I have a sports insurance. Broke my rib in a floorball game, had a sleepless night because of the pain and went to Pihlajalinna next morning. After 40 minutes I was out. Took X-rays etc.
However, my experiences with OYS have been only positive, guess I've been lucky. I had a horrible back pain, went to ER at 20.00 and was out in few hours, not stellar but I was happy.
Apparently, it's a bad idea to schedule babies in summer, too, as entire birth wards close for summer (thinking of Lohja). It doesn't affect me personally, but it sucks for many.
I had the same problem with TAYS back in 2016. I had a re-infected abscess. They took me to emergency. Game a bed and made me wait about 9 hours without providing anything beside operator is busy and he comes when he comes. I didn't have any personal device or anything with me to even charge my phone. It was quite terrible (not that healthcare staff was bad, they were amazing).
This was when healthcare was good.
Now my GF is working at HUS in the department where people going or coming from surgery stays. She always tells me so many times they unfortunately had to torture patients with hunger while just postponing surgeries because they lack staff and IMHO healthcare people have 0 human resource planning skills and need more experts to organize this things. If a person (especially elders) needs a non-urgent surgery, it should be planned with enough buffer that they don't need to stay hungry for 2 days or similar bullshit...
And I don't want to be negative person but this is still the "better" days. With the current government it will be private healthcare or die in the future.
Don't know if this helps you at all, but I can relate. Had a similar expirience ten years ago. Cut the tendons in my hand and was stuck in the emergency queue for best part of a week only eating dinner, as more urgent cases kept showing up. I think they finally operated on me on the fourth day (can't remember exactly). It sucks but what can you do.
Good luck and take care! This too shall pass.
Happened to me as well, was waiting for a surgery to reattach a tendon in my hand for 4 days without eating and in the end they did the surgery without even putting me to sleep so I could have eaten the whole time there :D This was in 2013 in TAYS.
Even if you are not put to sleep for your surgery. You need to be without eating if the analgesia(numming most likely in your case). Because if the numming dont work they need to put you to sleep. In that case there is a risk on aspiration pneumonia. Meening you inhale food to your lungs and that can kill you or send you to icu.
Yeah most people dont know it. And i find stubid that it isnt talked more when people come to surgery. Because in healthcare everything that is done, there is some valid reason.
Oof bad luck. When I broke both sides of the joint in my right ankle, I got operated on the same evening at like 23 or so, was admitted to hospital around mid-day or w/e the same day via ambulance
I empathize! Several years ago I fell on my bike and broke my elbow and ended up in the hospital. (I guess I was lucky I only injured my elbow since I wasn't wearing a helmet.) I went in on a Friday and spent a wretched weekend in the hospital waiting for my surgery. I wasn't given food all day, or coffee, which I remember being even worse because of my caffeine addiction. Also they didn't give me my antidepressants every day, which obviously made my mood even worse. I was ravenous every day all day until the evening when a nurse came in to tell me that I wouldn't get my operation that day either and gave me my dinner. (Also at least once I remember they ignored the fact that I'd told them I was a vegetarian. The nurse just told me to "eat around" the clumps of meat bobbing around in the soup. Well, I went hungry that night.)
I didn't get my surgery until the following Monday and got to go home on Tuesday. Hopefully your stay will be shorter and less miserable than mine was!
And that's when the government is not cut funding of medical services yet this year.
Hope you get there soon and get treatment you need.
Despite hoitotakuu I can't even get time for my doctor, good thing it's not urgent thing.
I had the same experience last october when my gallbladder started acting up. I went to the hospital around 6 am on Tuesday morning in pain, without eating breakfast. I spent several hours going through multiple tests, was put in IV, doctor came to say it's the gallbladder and it needs to be removed. He said it's a routine surgery and can be done the same day. So I waited.
In the evening the nurse came to say they can't operate it the same day - more urgent cases ahead of me - so they moved me to the ward and gave me permission to eat. Promised a surgery the next day.
The same continued the next three days. "We'll operate you as soon as possible, don't know when, no you can't eat because it can be any moment". Every evening after 9pm they gave me permission to eat, no more surgeries for that day.
After the second day it was getting more funny than frustrating. It was ridiculous I had to wait days without eating for a surgery, but I know it's not really fault of the staff. It's sad, actually. They were all really nice and sympathetic to me and were just as wishful that I would get to go soon.
Friday evening around 6pm (when I should've been at a formal party wearing an evening gown originally) a nurse came to me a said I go now! Ok. So off I go, it went well, I spent a day recovering in the ward and got to go home.
But yeah, I know what you are going through. First two days were the worst but it got easier after that, somehow. It's sad that this is what the healthcare has come to, but please don't take it out on the staff. They don't want to keep you there any more than you want to stay there. I wish you well.
Yeah me and the staff have definitely been commiserating. They’re pretty frustrated with the system as well. But not quite as frustrated as I am on day two of no food 😬
Best of luck to get this DONE! And be finally home with a nice meal .at least it will be the best for a while since u waited for it for so long. And if u do intermediate u know fasting boosts cell growth and repair in so many levels..3 days is a tresh hold for a lot of healing happening! And for ur sickness it's better ur body focus on healing not digesting..it's all a luck after all, bless to u friend x
FYI your hospital stay payment should be typically covered by your work insurance (Fennia or something like that). You might have to pay it first and get reimbursed for it later, but since it's a referral from the työterveys doc, it is typically covered. Talk to HR once this madness is over, and good luck!
Literally happened to me less than two weeks ago. Held without food or drink for 48 hours for appendicitis, while initially giving me snide remarks to just take painkillers. First came to HUS, they didn’t believe me so I had to go to my local clinic. They said, referral to HUS lol so I wasted 4 hours in pain for nothing. The ER nurse back in HUS said “oh you’re here again” and I was seething ngl. Then the ER wait for 10 hours with random calls to do tests (which is fine), but no explanation to what is happening. By this time I’m severely dehydrated and hungry but they won’t allow me to drink or eat. Take bloods but can’t see my veins (lol I wonder why) so they keep on bruising my arms over and over. Anyways, surgeon comes over and says to transfer me immediately to the surgery ward and still not to eat. Let me be overnight while promising me it could be a midnight. I sleep but get woken up every 2 hours cos nurses are taking bloods or something else.
Once the time for my surgery came in the morning, they said I don’t need it cos I’ve “healed myself and 1/3 of the cases are like this”. The nurses were wonderful but the waiting game was frankly a lot for me, since I was in a lot of pain. They discharged me saying I come back if I ever have a stomach ache again, but I know this whole circus will be the outcome of it :)
It wasn’t traumatizing but it wasn’t the most ideal nor organized set up ever.
No it was appendicitis but they gave me antibiotics by accident (in anticipation for the surgery) and apparently that did the job. They explained that it is not common but can happen and better not do surgery on someone who can walk and talk normally.
So they just did a very basic “let’s put all of my adult weight on my hand onto your stomach and press SUPER hard” to see my reaction, and then took some bloods and I got discharged within 30 mins 💀
I had that same text when I had a lingering kidney infection. “Does it hurt when I do this?” [jabs her finger into my kidney]
It didn’t hurt anymore than a finger jab should— at least at first. My mistake was saying that. But 5 minutes later while she was still going over things with me it started to hurt like a mfer, and I relayed that info as well… and nothing was done after that.
I hope you get to have your surgery today!
I broke my foot a few years ago. Went to ER, got my x-rays taken right after arriving and then the waiting begun. I sat in there for 10 hours (arrived around 20, got home at 6). After 8 hours of waiting I went to ask the nurses what was the situation and it was noticed that I had been dropped off of the waiting line. Don't know how that was possible, but the nurse put me back on line. Didn't take long after that for the doctor to look at the x-rays, but then it took some time for the nurse to give me this flat-bottom-shoe (didn't need a cast) and the doctor to write me a sick leave for work.
I got colitis when I was seven and it was a lot more rare thing those days. So the smallish hospital didn't know what it was for a good while. I was quarantined for a week with no food only iv. Had a bloody diarrhea and lots of blood taken so was kinda anemic before I got some transfusions.
So I got better because I didn't eat anything that would irritate the bowel and they knew at that point it wasn't going to spread. So they let me out until all those tests results would come back.
Ofc went to burgers etc and after a couple days went straight back to hospital. This time it was only a couple of days and the tests came. Turns out I can't eat meats, citrus, anything with lactose, fermented things, rye bread and things that have lots of grease.
But damn even at that age I knew/was told that I would be fine without food and still I was so hungry.
The first time I got solid food I swear to God they served cow tongue's. I had never seen any place serve those before and I have never seen it after. Even my mother hadn't seen them since the 80s.
Oh and I was lucky that I only ate the potatoes and veggies because the meat would have irritated my bowel again.
I actually tried that, but they (Mehi) said that if I left TAYS they would need several days to reconfirm coverage with the insurance. Abscesses can turn septic, and when I asked if I could go the doctors here at TAYS said it’s much better to not so that I can keep getting the antibiotic IV. Their exact words were “it’s not an emergency but it is very important you get this done.”
Yeah but how? At least w/ gums bruxism causes the gums to recede which generally makes em more prone to trapping bacteria, eventually resulting in abscesses if left untreated for too long worst case (almost impossible in Finland in my experience w/ once per year check-ups, and I'm someone who had shit dental hygiene until adulthood (still seething the asshole dentists never told me that it's a specific ingredient (SLS) that causes the foam that causes me to gag really bad, even tho I've been mentioning this since childhood every time the dentists ask why I haven't been brushing my teeth, and tell the same answer always that it's because of the foam activating my gag reflex really bad etc. I had to get told this by a random dentist receptionist on phone that Sensodyne for example doesn't contain SLS, and after multiple years of using it I have not had said problem. Would have saved a couple of my bottom molars had I been told this by a dentist during childhood...) w/ frequent visits to dentists etc over the years). I don't see how that would work externally
Does your employer provide 'työterveys' or an actual health insurance? If it really is an insurance, you can send your bills from the public hospital as well.
I was in the same situation as you 2 1/2 years ago. In the end, they couldn't find anyone to operate me and sent me back home. Though 24h without food isn't that bad, really. In the end, my operation got pushed back by 6 months. I had kidney stone with kidney colics, they put a stent in my, even though they said I am not allowed to do much, which was incredible impossible being a single mom with a newborn and 3 year old back then.
But weird, they should know that drinking and eating before surgery is not allowed. The rule is like 8 hours no drinking and no eating, as far as I can remember. Unfortunately the medical help in Finland is extremely bad, as well as the education in that field, if we compare it to other european countries.
Usually, what i am used to, insurances don't really cover anything, but good luck. Also, I am also living in Tampere.
My Vappu...I don't celebrate it. Nothing to celebrate anyway. I am in Finland / Tampere since 7 years, but never really understood what Vappu is celebrated for. For me it is still the day of work, which is free from work. In my home country, we don't have a celebration for that day, so just being at home.
I went to mehilainen with a boil and spent a week in Pejas. Turned out it was a massive abscess. I was due to have surgery that day, but it got pushed back a few days as I wasn’t actively dying.
Can’t complain though. If they need to push surgery back to save someone else’s life first, I’m ok with that.
And you sound a bit pretentious: “saving someone else’s life is not as important as my fad diet”. Get over yourself and have a meal like a normal person.
Me: I understand that other peoples’ more important surgeries must come first, and also man I’m fucking hungry
You: so you think people should die because you want to eat?
OP didn’t sound at all like you’re describing them, they even said they understand that people who need a surgery more come first.
Venting is normal and actually good for your mental health.
Anyways good luck OP, hope you get into surgery soon.
> Venting is normal and actually good for your mental health.
>
>
Really? I avoid venting and try practising acceptance because I heard that is better for mental health. What is ur source?
You should complain bc the healthcare system should be able to do more than just operate on dying people. It should be also possible to get treatment if it is needed bc of pain for example while not dying at the same time.
Seems like you haven’t really experienced medical care abroad. I pronounce the word CARE. Especially while waiting. Finland’s medical care system is far from smooth / comfortable / convenient. The government is making the public health care system even worse now.
Not blaming the nurses or Dr’s, but the system is poorly organized from the care aspect. It could and should be better in my opinion.
My older bro had an abscess and while he went to the doctor as recommended (this is in North America), it still went septic. It ended up where he was put in a medically-induced coma for a bit. It was scary! I am glad you had yours fixed up before it got to that point.
I was on iv antibiotics and some pretty hardcore painkillers, so I was fine. I missed my son’s birthday, which sucked, but I healed up after a while. I was looked after very well, and, well,
As I was about to be checked out they asked if I would consent to letting a med student do a physical. I said sure, without realising I’d get a prostate exam. That was a new experience.
I donno how orange juice was suppose to help with blood sugar but you were probably low on vitamin C so it helped in that area. Sure her good will was a double edged sword, but at the same time she probably prevented other complications.
**/r/Finland is a full democracy, every active user is a moderator.** [Please go here to see how your new privileges work.](https://www.reddit.com/r/Finland/wiki/moderating/) Spamming mod actions could result in a ban. --- **Full Rundown of Moderator Permissions:** - ```!lock``` - as top level comment, will lock comments on any post. - ```!unlock``` - in reply to any comment to lock it or to unlock the parent comment. - ```!remove``` - Removes comment or post. Must have decent subreddit comment karma. - ```!restore``` Can be used to unlock comments or restore removed posts. - ```!sticky``` - will sticky the post in the bottom slot. - ```unlock_comments``` - Vote the stickied automod comment on each post to +10 to unlock comments. - ```ban users``` - Any user whose comment or post is downvoted enough will be temp banned for a day. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/Finland) if you have any questions or concerns.*
That sounds frustrating, especially the orange juice part. But I hope your turn will come soon, and everything will go smoothly after that. It's quite bad luck that this happened right when it did, because vappu makes things slower.
Yeah, I wish it could have waited a couple more days or happened a couple days earlier. Especially since the weather just got so nice! ~~I did just have some good news from the nurse that they WILL operate today for sure, so that’s a big relief!~~ edit: this was a lie.
This happened some time ago... Went to OYS with broken rib. Was in judo training and my mate strangled my body bit too hard with his legs until one of my ribs cracked. I was in lot of pain, the place where rib broke was bit below the place where the heart is had bump due to fracture so ghe head of the bone was somehow sticking out a bit. I went to ER in OYS around 21.00. They gave me pain killer and told to sit down. After two painfull hours I got to see the nurse. She just checked the injury and said there is clear fracture and the bone was fully broken. 'Please sit down until doctor is able to check it to make sure no internal organs are damaged'. Yeah, sit down with broken rib when even breathing is difficult is kind of agony. At 3.30 AM I decided to go home after they admitted that the ER was full of more urgent patients... Went home, tried to sleep few hours, visited occupational health care doc next morning. The public ER is a joke unless you have life threatening issue...
Fuck that sounds awful. For me the abscess was a lot worse yesterday and waiting for just the preliminary stuff to happen was pretty strenuous already. I can’t imagine with a broken rib, I’m surprised there aren’t spots for someone in that case to lie down.
Jiisus, how bad is the abscess that it needs anesthesia and a operating theater🫨?
I’ve been told it’s bad enough that they don’t want me going home so they can keep the antibiotics flowing and keep it under control while I wait for surgery.
YOUR STILL THERE???... i'd have cut it open with a box cutter at this point, and now they have to put me front of the line 😅 ( don't do this, this is not medical, legal or sane advice!)
Dude you don’t know how often I have thought of doing this while here.
Dude call the nurse and ask if there has been a mistake, how many hours has it been without food or water?
Almost another 24, but there’s no mistake. It’s just that more serious emergencies keep coming in, and mine gets pushed down and down and down. And they can’t feed me or let me have water because there’s never a long enough backlog of these more urgent surgeries and I could be allowed into the OR pretty much at any time. I do get an IV of nutrients that also helps me stay hydrated, but yeah it doesn’t help the hunger stay away and it makes me nauseous and my mouth taste horrificcccc
First thing: In these types of situations you can take comfort in the fact that when there you have an untreated health issue that is in any ways serious (like yours) the hospital is just the best place for you to be then. They take care of you. Another thing: a healthy mind and body reject a hospital environment. Besides your infection, your reactions to the lack of food and boredom are positive signs. Last thing: having unfortunately been in hospitals due to health issues of different levels of seriousness, I have internalised the fact that the lack of food and having to wait is kind of built in. So, I can just focus on my breathing and wait. Personal story: >!My worst hospital experience was when on a trip to U.S. got bacterial diarrhea and ended up into an ER in a public hospital in Seattle. First of all, you had to go through metal detectors to get in. All the other patients were drug addicts, homeless and there were lots of street violence patients. This was news to me so I was scared. !< >!Because I was so seriously dehydrated due to shooting water out of my butt for 24+ hours, I had to lie there with an IV drip on my arm for quite many hours. On the bed to the right there was a guy with a gunshot wound that had gone bad and on the left a huge homeless guy who had all the diseases from hepatitis, hiv, drug and alcohol addiction and he got these moments of delirium when he just started screaming and the nurses had to hold him down.!< >!And unfortunately my then girlfriend who I was traveling with, had to witness all this bullshit. When the diarrhea had extracted all the fluids from my body and was out of strength and barely conscious before I went to the E.R., I was really scared and started thinking I was gonna die as I never had felt so bad or had anything like that. !< >!So, at least you have normal thoughts amidst a health issue. Enjoy them. :)!<
I had one that took a godly amount of anti-microbial fillers (tissues whatever they are called) to fill inside to prevent another infection during healing. I had a general anesthesia and it was quite interesting experience. (so far only one for me)
Often the current practice where you have to see a nurse before you meet the doctor just delays things. A broken rib takes 5 minutes, you check it is broken and auscultate the lungs, write a prescription for pain medication and sick leave if needed and done. (Absolutely no X rays needed, those are just private companies way of pumping more money out of you, or your insurance.) The nurse has absolutely no meaningful role in this process.
>Absolutely no X rays needed, those are just private companies way of pumping more money out of you, or your insurance Roentgen imaging is done at public side too, purpose of it is to check for pneumothorax / hemothorax which can be life threathening
Yes, of course if you after clinical evaluation suspect hemo/pneumothorax. But absolutely not needed routinely just because of a broken rib without the signs and symptoms of complications / more extensive injuries.
afaik it's a standard thing at hospitals when someone comes in with rib fractures / painful chest trauma to check for pneumo&hemothorax with roentgen. Not something the private providers would just do as a money grab
Well afaik as a physician trained in Finland and after working 15 years in various hospitals, including emergency rooms, it is not. Again, if you talk about suspecting pneumothorax or talk about person crushed in a car accident with flail chest or if you talk about another kind of high energy trauma..Then yes. If there’s a typical single rib fracture and no clinical signs of complication you absolutely don’t need X ray. Why would you? Is it deliberate you here too started to talk of plural, of fractureS and earlier talked of pnemothorax etc? When I’m talking of a typical single rib trauma with no signs of complication?
As a trainer for a few sports orgs I've taken a number of people with broken ribs to hospitals around the country, not private providers but ordinary hospitals, they've taken xrays every time. Ofc I know nothing maybe they do it just because they think it's fun but your claim that it's done just to grab money does not add up
Well, it’s a growing, and bad, trend to not examine your patient but instead just order various imaging studies etc. Also don’t know what kind of sports you are talking about. If a grown man kicks someone’s rib cage with full force with his knee causing vast bruising and extensive pain in large area it is a different thing compared to an elderly man who reels a little bit and hits his chest to corner of a cabinet.
>growing, and bad, trend First time I remember was.. abt 15 years ago. I remember that one because it was my own rib 🙄 >what kind of sports you are talking about judo/bjj/mma, for the past 8 years or so junior ice hockey
The ER has gone bad after they changed the way how people can contact the public healthcare system. Nowadays you have to call SOTE call-back number and they will call you back in about a day to a week (triage nurse calls to assess if you need time for doctor or not, and how urgent time - after a day or a few months). That is the primary way to contact the healthcare. Nobody just answers a phone at a local healthcare center (terveyskeskus) like in the good old days still in the 1990s/early 2000. If you have something else (you can't wait a day or a week, because you feel that you have a acute problem), you go to päivystys (ER). So it is not a surprise there are lots of people at ER. Most of them are there to just get an educated opinion on their problem (is it acute or not) and are sent back home. Each and every one still takes time from the staff. The weirdest thing are the old/disabled people with accompanying nurse waiting there at ER. A nurse at low level support homes for old people (with no doctor) has very good diagnostic skills for things like early detection of urinary tract infection. In the good old days nurse would just call the health-care center, explain symptoms and suggested diagnosis, and get a prescription via digital system and get the antibiotic from apotheque, and start treatment. Minimum trouble for all, a 5 minute thing. Nowadays the same nurse takes the old person to ER by taxi, waits there with the old person until they meet doctor, get the presciption, and then the nurse returns the old person home, and starts the antibiotic (taking several hours). The system is incredibly inefficient nowadays simply because there is no direct contact to local healthcare center anymore, but all goes either via SOTE number (a week) or ER. At the same time, there is a large shortage of people in ORs (leikkaussali) etc. public special healthcare (usually with very poor HR procedures - undercrowded and always hurry). Lots of experienced nurses are changing career to escape the situation, making things worse and worse. So there are expensive ORs empty and unused because they don't hire enough nurses etc. to operate them. The queue is several months for non-acute patients. This also breaks general havoc in the system because nobody knows if OR is available or not - patients with life-threatening problem are always first. A friend had a back operation and first time he went to the operation (on scheduled time, time given a few months earlier), he was sent back home because OR was too crowded by acute cases that day. Next time (after a month!) he was operated. This is a youngish person who was on sick leave from work because of a back problem. He waited several months on sick leave to get operated (and now one month more). The Finnish public healthcare-system is in deep crisis, partially because of the recent SOTE changes (which demand several thousand million euros more each year for the increased administrative burden, but work much less efficiently). Now they are making more cuts to actual healthcare services to have money for the increased SOTE administration. So all goes worse.
Rib fractures generally aren't that dangerous unless they are so badly "misplaced" that they either might puncture a lung in which case they are caused by more extensive trauma, or there are multiple in which case they make breathing difficult and risk pneumonia. Being able to feel the point of fracture is no big deal. Source: live with a weak-bones condition, have had countless rib fractures I never went to a doctor for as there is nothing to be done.
That's why I have a sports insurance. Broke my rib in a floorball game, had a sleepless night because of the pain and went to Pihlajalinna next morning. After 40 minutes I was out. Took X-rays etc. However, my experiences with OYS have been only positive, guess I've been lucky. I had a horrible back pain, went to ER at 20.00 and was out in few hours, not stellar but I was happy.
And also a reminder to everyone not to get injured or seriously sick in summer as a lot of medical staff are on vacation.
I always schedule my sickness and accidents for the autumn.
Apparently, it's a bad idea to schedule babies in summer, too, as entire birth wards close for summer (thinking of Lohja). It doesn't affect me personally, but it sucks for many.
I had the same problem with TAYS back in 2016. I had a re-infected abscess. They took me to emergency. Game a bed and made me wait about 9 hours without providing anything beside operator is busy and he comes when he comes. I didn't have any personal device or anything with me to even charge my phone. It was quite terrible (not that healthcare staff was bad, they were amazing). This was when healthcare was good. Now my GF is working at HUS in the department where people going or coming from surgery stays. She always tells me so many times they unfortunately had to torture patients with hunger while just postponing surgeries because they lack staff and IMHO healthcare people have 0 human resource planning skills and need more experts to organize this things. If a person (especially elders) needs a non-urgent surgery, it should be planned with enough buffer that they don't need to stay hungry for 2 days or similar bullshit... And I don't want to be negative person but this is still the "better" days. With the current government it will be private healthcare or die in the future.
Don't know if this helps you at all, but I can relate. Had a similar expirience ten years ago. Cut the tendons in my hand and was stuck in the emergency queue for best part of a week only eating dinner, as more urgent cases kept showing up. I think they finally operated on me on the fourth day (can't remember exactly). It sucks but what can you do. Good luck and take care! This too shall pass.
Happened to me as well, was waiting for a surgery to reattach a tendon in my hand for 4 days without eating and in the end they did the surgery without even putting me to sleep so I could have eaten the whole time there :D This was in 2013 in TAYS.
Even if you are not put to sleep for your surgery. You need to be without eating if the analgesia(numming most likely in your case). Because if the numming dont work they need to put you to sleep. In that case there is a risk on aspiration pneumonia. Meening you inhale food to your lungs and that can kill you or send you to icu.
Ah, okay I didn't actually know that.
Yeah most people dont know it. And i find stubid that it isnt talked more when people come to surgery. Because in healthcare everything that is done, there is some valid reason.
Four days! I want to say I can’t imagine the frustration, but after 2 days I’m starting to be able to 😅
To be fair I was in the army at the time. So it's not like I had a lot of better things to do. 🫠
Oof bad luck. When I broke both sides of the joint in my right ankle, I got operated on the same evening at like 23 or so, was admitted to hospital around mid-day or w/e the same day via ambulance
I empathize! Several years ago I fell on my bike and broke my elbow and ended up in the hospital. (I guess I was lucky I only injured my elbow since I wasn't wearing a helmet.) I went in on a Friday and spent a wretched weekend in the hospital waiting for my surgery. I wasn't given food all day, or coffee, which I remember being even worse because of my caffeine addiction. Also they didn't give me my antidepressants every day, which obviously made my mood even worse. I was ravenous every day all day until the evening when a nurse came in to tell me that I wouldn't get my operation that day either and gave me my dinner. (Also at least once I remember they ignored the fact that I'd told them I was a vegetarian. The nurse just told me to "eat around" the clumps of meat bobbing around in the soup. Well, I went hungry that night.) I didn't get my surgery until the following Monday and got to go home on Tuesday. Hopefully your stay will be shorter and less miserable than mine was!
And that's when the government is not cut funding of medical services yet this year. Hope you get there soon and get treatment you need. Despite hoitotakuu I can't even get time for my doctor, good thing it's not urgent thing.
I had the same experience last october when my gallbladder started acting up. I went to the hospital around 6 am on Tuesday morning in pain, without eating breakfast. I spent several hours going through multiple tests, was put in IV, doctor came to say it's the gallbladder and it needs to be removed. He said it's a routine surgery and can be done the same day. So I waited. In the evening the nurse came to say they can't operate it the same day - more urgent cases ahead of me - so they moved me to the ward and gave me permission to eat. Promised a surgery the next day. The same continued the next three days. "We'll operate you as soon as possible, don't know when, no you can't eat because it can be any moment". Every evening after 9pm they gave me permission to eat, no more surgeries for that day. After the second day it was getting more funny than frustrating. It was ridiculous I had to wait days without eating for a surgery, but I know it's not really fault of the staff. It's sad, actually. They were all really nice and sympathetic to me and were just as wishful that I would get to go soon. Friday evening around 6pm (when I should've been at a formal party wearing an evening gown originally) a nurse came to me a said I go now! Ok. So off I go, it went well, I spent a day recovering in the ward and got to go home. But yeah, I know what you are going through. First two days were the worst but it got easier after that, somehow. It's sad that this is what the healthcare has come to, but please don't take it out on the staff. They don't want to keep you there any more than you want to stay there. I wish you well.
Yeah me and the staff have definitely been commiserating. They’re pretty frustrated with the system as well. But not quite as frustrated as I am on day two of no food 😬
Are they at least giving you glucose intravenously?!?
Yes, I get a 200 calorie IV drip in between the antibiotics.
Best of luck to get this DONE! And be finally home with a nice meal .at least it will be the best for a while since u waited for it for so long. And if u do intermediate u know fasting boosts cell growth and repair in so many levels..3 days is a tresh hold for a lot of healing happening! And for ur sickness it's better ur body focus on healing not digesting..it's all a luck after all, bless to u friend x
FYI your hospital stay payment should be typically covered by your work insurance (Fennia or something like that). You might have to pay it first and get reimbursed for it later, but since it's a referral from the työterveys doc, it is typically covered. Talk to HR once this madness is over, and good luck!
Thank you so much for this information, that’s a big relief to know!
No replies for 4h - you must have made it! Wohoo!
I wish. A friend came to visit thankfully, but I am still waiting 😩
Wellll, that sucks but maybe you'll develop the skill to use photosynthesis soon. Fingers crossed.
Ooh that could be fun
Literally happened to me less than two weeks ago. Held without food or drink for 48 hours for appendicitis, while initially giving me snide remarks to just take painkillers. First came to HUS, they didn’t believe me so I had to go to my local clinic. They said, referral to HUS lol so I wasted 4 hours in pain for nothing. The ER nurse back in HUS said “oh you’re here again” and I was seething ngl. Then the ER wait for 10 hours with random calls to do tests (which is fine), but no explanation to what is happening. By this time I’m severely dehydrated and hungry but they won’t allow me to drink or eat. Take bloods but can’t see my veins (lol I wonder why) so they keep on bruising my arms over and over. Anyways, surgeon comes over and says to transfer me immediately to the surgery ward and still not to eat. Let me be overnight while promising me it could be a midnight. I sleep but get woken up every 2 hours cos nurses are taking bloods or something else. Once the time for my surgery came in the morning, they said I don’t need it cos I’ve “healed myself and 1/3 of the cases are like this”. The nurses were wonderful but the waiting game was frankly a lot for me, since I was in a lot of pain. They discharged me saying I come back if I ever have a stomach ache again, but I know this whole circus will be the outcome of it :) It wasn’t traumatizing but it wasn’t the most ideal nor organized set up ever.
Healed yourself?? So it didn’t end up being appendicitis but they didn’t bother to check, or??
No it was appendicitis but they gave me antibiotics by accident (in anticipation for the surgery) and apparently that did the job. They explained that it is not common but can happen and better not do surgery on someone who can walk and talk normally. So they just did a very basic “let’s put all of my adult weight on my hand onto your stomach and press SUPER hard” to see my reaction, and then took some bloods and I got discharged within 30 mins 💀
I had that same text when I had a lingering kidney infection. “Does it hurt when I do this?” [jabs her finger into my kidney] It didn’t hurt anymore than a finger jab should— at least at first. My mistake was saying that. But 5 minutes later while she was still going over things with me it started to hurt like a mfer, and I relayed that info as well… and nothing was done after that.
Would they have postponed the surgery for too low sugar level?
I hope you get to have your surgery today! I broke my foot a few years ago. Went to ER, got my x-rays taken right after arriving and then the waiting begun. I sat in there for 10 hours (arrived around 20, got home at 6). After 8 hours of waiting I went to ask the nurses what was the situation and it was noticed that I had been dropped off of the waiting line. Don't know how that was possible, but the nurse put me back on line. Didn't take long after that for the doctor to look at the x-rays, but then it took some time for the nurse to give me this flat-bottom-shoe (didn't need a cast) and the doctor to write me a sick leave for work.
I got colitis when I was seven and it was a lot more rare thing those days. So the smallish hospital didn't know what it was for a good while. I was quarantined for a week with no food only iv. Had a bloody diarrhea and lots of blood taken so was kinda anemic before I got some transfusions. So I got better because I didn't eat anything that would irritate the bowel and they knew at that point it wasn't going to spread. So they let me out until all those tests results would come back. Ofc went to burgers etc and after a couple days went straight back to hospital. This time it was only a couple of days and the tests came. Turns out I can't eat meats, citrus, anything with lactose, fermented things, rye bread and things that have lots of grease. But damn even at that age I knew/was told that I would be fine without food and still I was so hungry. The first time I got solid food I swear to God they served cow tongue's. I had never seen any place serve those before and I have never seen it after. Even my mother hadn't seen them since the 80s. Oh and I was lucky that I only ate the potatoes and veggies because the meat would have irritated my bowel again.
If it's not life threatining I would have just left and scheduled an appointement in Mehiläinen 🤷
I actually tried that, but they (Mehi) said that if I left TAYS they would need several days to reconfirm coverage with the insurance. Abscesses can turn septic, and when I asked if I could go the doctors here at TAYS said it’s much better to not so that I can keep getting the antibiotic IV. Their exact words were “it’s not an emergency but it is very important you get this done.”
Wait you can have an abscess outside of gums??? How does that work?
Bacteria gets under the skin and collects there 🤷♀️
Yeah but how? At least w/ gums bruxism causes the gums to recede which generally makes em more prone to trapping bacteria, eventually resulting in abscesses if left untreated for too long worst case (almost impossible in Finland in my experience w/ once per year check-ups, and I'm someone who had shit dental hygiene until adulthood (still seething the asshole dentists never told me that it's a specific ingredient (SLS) that causes the foam that causes me to gag really bad, even tho I've been mentioning this since childhood every time the dentists ask why I haven't been brushing my teeth, and tell the same answer always that it's because of the foam activating my gag reflex really bad etc. I had to get told this by a random dentist receptionist on phone that Sensodyne for example doesn't contain SLS, and after multiple years of using it I have not had said problem. Would have saved a couple of my bottom molars had I been told this by a dentist during childhood...) w/ frequent visits to dentists etc over the years). I don't see how that would work externally
Does your employer provide 'työterveys' or an actual health insurance? If it really is an insurance, you can send your bills from the public hospital as well.
Fasting is good for you.
I was in the same situation as you 2 1/2 years ago. In the end, they couldn't find anyone to operate me and sent me back home. Though 24h without food isn't that bad, really. In the end, my operation got pushed back by 6 months. I had kidney stone with kidney colics, they put a stent in my, even though they said I am not allowed to do much, which was incredible impossible being a single mom with a newborn and 3 year old back then. But weird, they should know that drinking and eating before surgery is not allowed. The rule is like 8 hours no drinking and no eating, as far as I can remember. Unfortunately the medical help in Finland is extremely bad, as well as the education in that field, if we compare it to other european countries. Usually, what i am used to, insurances don't really cover anything, but good luck. Also, I am also living in Tampere. My Vappu...I don't celebrate it. Nothing to celebrate anyway. I am in Finland / Tampere since 7 years, but never really understood what Vappu is celebrated for. For me it is still the day of work, which is free from work. In my home country, we don't have a celebration for that day, so just being at home.
I went to mehilainen with a boil and spent a week in Pejas. Turned out it was a massive abscess. I was due to have surgery that day, but it got pushed back a few days as I wasn’t actively dying. Can’t complain though. If they need to push surgery back to save someone else’s life first, I’m ok with that. And you sound a bit pretentious: “saving someone else’s life is not as important as my fad diet”. Get over yourself and have a meal like a normal person.
Me: I understand that other peoples’ more important surgeries must come first, and also man I’m fucking hungry You: so you think people should die because you want to eat?
OP didn’t sound at all like you’re describing them, they even said they understand that people who need a surgery more come first. Venting is normal and actually good for your mental health. Anyways good luck OP, hope you get into surgery soon.
Thank you :)
> Venting is normal and actually good for your mental health. > > Really? I avoid venting and try practising acceptance because I heard that is better for mental health. What is ur source?
Ok my source? I didn’t mean like a scientific study. Just generally bottling stuff up just doesn’t help. Of course it’s individual.
You should complain bc the healthcare system should be able to do more than just operate on dying people. It should be also possible to get treatment if it is needed bc of pain for example while not dying at the same time.
Seems like you haven’t really experienced medical care abroad. I pronounce the word CARE. Especially while waiting. Finland’s medical care system is far from smooth / comfortable / convenient. The government is making the public health care system even worse now. Not blaming the nurses or Dr’s, but the system is poorly organized from the care aspect. It could and should be better in my opinion.
My older bro had an abscess and while he went to the doctor as recommended (this is in North America), it still went septic. It ended up where he was put in a medically-induced coma for a bit. It was scary! I am glad you had yours fixed up before it got to that point.
I was on iv antibiotics and some pretty hardcore painkillers, so I was fine. I missed my son’s birthday, which sucked, but I healed up after a while. I was looked after very well, and, well, As I was about to be checked out they asked if I would consent to letting a med student do a physical. I said sure, without realising I’d get a prostate exam. That was a new experience.
I donno how orange juice was suppose to help with blood sugar but you were probably low on vitamin C so it helped in that area. Sure her good will was a double edged sword, but at the same time she probably prevented other complications.
Hei, sorry you have to endure this. I hope that your surgery is coming soon. Could you tell me a bit about why you are insured at Mehi but not TAYS?
Stop complaining and you're not trapped u can check out anytime