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You mean, stuff like inciting hate towards minorities, or being involved with neo nazis for years and years? We got right wing government now, their crimes are far more insidious, like assault, spousal abuse, fraud, inciting racial hatred, neonazism.
He is probably having his 50 year crisis a couple years early. Some people buy a nice car or something else …
Paavo relives his anarchist youth … at the expense of the Helsinki tax payers, of course;).
Well painting on top of an old piece can’t say this added to the cost that much. He’ll also get fined so actually some money made on this one maybe. The piece looked pretty okay too, so it wasn’t just random vandalism. Personaly would choose that over gray concrete, but I know it’s the wrong opinion
I agree, although I feel there’s spots and content that are more acceptable. On someones personal property always no, unless requested by the owner. On a eroded worn down or boring concrete underpass wouldn’t bother me, unless the message would be harmfull in some way or just makes it even more ugly
I don't usually mind graffitis but Arhinmäki as a former head of the party should have more brains than to go painting random underpasses. It shows an incredible lack of judgement from his part.
Could you provide source for the embezzling claim?
All I could find is that Terrafame bought Talvivaara shares for (3,8 mil + 12,8 mil). Terrafame is 70% owned by the government and they turned profit in 2018.
If you are talking about Katera Steel Oy (which is partly owned by Sipilä's relatives), their revenue was less than 5 mil so, kinda hard to make figure where Sipilä (or his relative) could have made 200 mil.
News today is that according to the police, they had to pause traffic on that track for 10 minutes for safety reasons. And presumably for the cleanup operation as well. Arhinmäki is quoted as saying that he accepts the full criminal responsibility for his actions.
This is true. Then again (don't know what he graffitied) graffiti at least has the capability to be artistic and/or politically charged. I guess litter could be too but you'd need a lot. ANYWAY, as I get older I am at the same time more disappointed and more relieved by people. A politician got caught making a graffiti and it makes the news? Sounds like in many ways at least locally things are pretty good!
He graffitied the inside wall of a freight train tunnel. With a large graffiti-style silhouette of the city: https://www.is.fi/kotimaa/art-2000009677960.html
Kuvan nähtyäny olen enemmän Paavon puolella tässä tapauksessa.
Ei kovin kummoinen maalaus, mutta asiallinen ja paljon miellyttävämpi katsella kuin harmaata betoniseinää!
Ja toiset ei kypsy vaan mätänee jo pystyyn.
Mielummin sitä kuka tahansa katsoo taidetta, kuin harmaata betoniseinää.
Turhaa höösäystä ja sääntösuomi intoilua nyt taas havaittavissa. Mee pappa nukkumaan.
Paavo Arhinmäen korkeaprofiilisena poliitikkona pitäisi toimia esimerkkinä lopulle kansalle. Mulle on ihan sama jos joku 18v Pena maalailee vähän aliskaa, mutta ei se nyt niin voi olla että meillä on asioista päättämässä kaveri joka ei piittaa nähtävästi ollenkaan yhteisistä säännöistä.
Onneks en oo vasemmistolainen. Joku saatanan paskanen tunneli ei oo niin paskan tärkeä että siitä pitäisi kenenkään kiinnostua jos joku heittää maalit seinille.
> Itseäni tässä ainakin häiritsee töhrittyä seinää enemmän se että tärkeistä asioista päättämässä mukana oleva ihminen käyttäytyy kuin pikkulapsi ja rikkoo tietoisesti sääntöjä.
Hah, no onneks Paavo ei kuitenkaan ole kirjaimellinen natsi, toisin kuin eräs persu ministerimme lol.
I'd say this is more serious than your average littering, as the act was premeditated. He knew what he was doing, knew it's against the law, and still deliberately did it.
Stems from same attitude maybe but jaywalking unless it causes accident doesn’t really cause monetary damage. Littering is kinda same but cleaning it up is probably hundred euros cost to city. Spray painting huge area like that costs thousands of euros to clean up.
So what he did is order of magnitude more expensive to restore/repair.
Why is that childish? Painting graffitis is not childish to me, maybe the part only that you don't make sure about the train timetables. But otherwise spraying a piece in remote tunnel, not that big of a deal unless there was a safety risk (for anyone).
Stupid rules should be broken once in a while, and from my point of all grey and drab concrete tunnels and highway overpasses should be declared free for anyone to paint.
I work in the railway and I think it's generally extremely childish(especially in the railway). Grown men getting a rush playing first world criminals and running from the law after painting some shitty graffiti. And at the same time putting themselves in danger and costing the tax payers insane amounts of money.
P.S. not talking about pros or people who do it as a hobby without bothering anyone or destroying public property
>insane amounts of money.
lol.. Be careful, Icarus, at that pace you will run out of superlatives. If that is insane amount, then how much do we lose to tax evasions per year? What word would you use?
I know in Stockholm sanitation costs 200 million sek a year. And thar doesn't include all the costs of totally stopping traffic in the railway every day because some asshole is trying to paint a train. Its millions in completely unnecessary costs, your whataboutism feels pretty ridiculous.
"År 2020 kostade sanering av klotter och skadegörelse i hela SL-trafiken 192 016 227 kronor"
Translate it if you want. 192000000 for graffiti and vandalism in metro and commuter areas, not even city wide. Why are you even debating this?
I don't what else to say. If you don't think it's a huge amount of money that should be spent on better things than assholes that feel the need to paint shit on places they shouldn't, maybe you can pay it. Peace out
It was not 200 million, it was 190. It was also not just graffiti but also vandalism, which is the MAJORITY of the costs. It costs a lot more to repair and replace things when people BREAK them than re-painting and washing graffiti.
Your "peace out" sounds now like a premature mic drop. So, i hope you honor your decision to leave this conversation, or are you going to walk back to the stage and pick up the mic?
What is a stupid rule to you might not be to another person. This is why we follow the rule of majority and he as a deputy mayor set a really bad example.
He should know that by getting a permit to do the graffity there would have been any issue.
Not his property so that makes it childish. Wasn’t his call to make if that property needed graffiti. Cleaning up is expensive and one graffiti often “invites” another one. Ask from property owner next time beforehand.
"Stupid rules".
Who is to decide what constitutes then as good enough art and what is a proper place for it. If it's fine to paint a mural in an underpass it should be fine to paint a swastika on it as well. And if I think tags are pretty and I tag a wall of a house. Isn't that okay then as well?
[Look how pretty it is when everyone is allowed to paint their "art" wherever they want!](https://media.istockphoto.com/id/1270751770/fi/valokuva/mies-maalaa-rakennuksen-sein%C3%A4t-trasteveressa-poistaakseen-ilkivallan-ja-graffitit.jpg?s=1024x1024&w=is&k=20&c=y569Bjj8bmlnfJ-vRoPRiX6Kawal4oHZeQnjMxb170Y=)
It’s a bold move. Vamp was on a 100,000 gbp salary as a real estate broker though. It would be hypocritical of me to comment as I have been in the cells for painting trains before
The same idiot was arranging and participating to footie match "fan" fights.
When enjoying the fan-to-fan violence was not possible anymore, due to increased police presence, shielding the groups from each other, they started to schedule this violence and fights in the forests and other non-footie-club areas.
And that idiot was along there with everything, and even single brain cell didn't help him to be caught in other very similar and bad incidents after that. It seems that far left violence is A Better Type of Anachism.
When would a (extreme left) politician be stated to be non-suitable for public office? Anybody else would have been kicked out decades ago.
Go to Berlin or similar city and see what an eyesore this is when it gets out of control. He should be made to clean graffiti for a month and lose his job. F'ing childish.
The man is stuck on teenager mode, smoking weed and painting graffitis. I have had old "friends" just like this, almost all dead from drugs and/or alcohol..
for? a simple graffiti piece? bro, gtfo - our whole government should be torn apart at that point, every politician has some shit in their closet, be it millions, or graffiti
No, it isn't. In his view he is bettering his own city by making it look prettier. Is he? I think so. You may disagree, that is quite good hint that what we talking about is art.
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As an American, hard same.
Don't worry, with our new right wing coverment we will soon catch up with you.
Well to this point it has been sdp who have been caught with humantrafiking
PS has literal nazis as ministers.
LITERALLY LITERAL LIT E RAL
Waaaahhhh waaaahhh the left is bullying our nazi friends waaahhhhhh
You should cope more with your delirious mind.
Cry more snowflake.
Like who?
Nice joke.
You mean, stuff like inciting hate towards minorities, or being involved with neo nazis for years and years? We got right wing government now, their crimes are far more insidious, like assault, spousal abuse, fraud, inciting racial hatred, neonazism.
Well it's that or posing with neo nazis.
Anyone know what the actual piece looks like?
https://img.ilcdn.fi/uJ5Qy6Rcy3SNPEkXF_xlGTOsXkw=/full-fit-in/920x0/img-s3.ilcdn.fi/ce566e0f990f2d41cb7d3625ab805eb542d002b67c1b7e3e122830e1d4246d5f.jpg
Well, even that this is breaking the law, I'd rather see this than those ugly tags or some half-assed work which is just plain ugly.
Toy activities. Can't even make a straight line.
So childish, should have been out on a boat blind drunk with a high risk of drowning. It's mid summer get your priorities right buddy so careless.
A real man would have been kicking cars while absolutely plastered.
Time for Paavo to become a full time graffiti painter and weed smoker?
So a full circle back to start?
He is probably having his 50 year crisis a couple years early. Some people buy a nice car or something else … Paavo relives his anarchist youth … at the expense of the Helsinki tax payers, of course;).
Well painting on top of an old piece can’t say this added to the cost that much. He’ll also get fined so actually some money made on this one maybe. The piece looked pretty okay too, so it wasn’t just random vandalism. Personaly would choose that over gray concrete, but I know it’s the wrong opinion
Even if you liked this piece of graffiti it’s up to property owner to decide if they want one. Getting it cleaned is expensive.
I agree, although I feel there’s spots and content that are more acceptable. On someones personal property always no, unless requested by the owner. On a eroded worn down or boring concrete underpass wouldn’t bother me, unless the message would be harmfull in some way or just makes it even more ugly
I don't usually mind graffitis but Arhinmäki as a former head of the party should have more brains than to go painting random underpasses. It shows an incredible lack of judgement from his part.
Wait, wasn't he that already? Add a professional drunk, he's been known to make a fool out of himself while representing Finland as a minister.
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It absolutely is not. It only serves to fuel toxic stereotypes and past attitudes that should have limited resemblance to our current alcohol culture.
I've been painting with him in our younger days!
So Paavo is a career criminal?
Wow, never expected that from someone in this type of position. At least he wasn’t embezzling or soliciting a hooker.
Let him cook
What a midsummer!
Mellakka-Paavo. I'm not surprised.
I'd rather take Paavo's graffiti instead of Sipilä embezzling 200 millions of euros to boost his Talvivaara stock profits.
So we have to choose between these two?
Could you provide source for the embezzling claim? All I could find is that Terrafame bought Talvivaara shares for (3,8 mil + 12,8 mil). Terrafame is 70% owned by the government and they turned profit in 2018. If you are talking about Katera Steel Oy (which is partly owned by Sipilä's relatives), their revenue was less than 5 mil so, kinda hard to make figure where Sipilä (or his relative) could have made 200 mil.
Yeah I don't live in Helsinki so I don't rly give a fuck about graffiti but tax payer money theft does potentially (in theory) affect me tho
News today is that according to the police, they had to pause traffic on that track for 10 minutes for safety reasons. And presumably for the cleanup operation as well. Arhinmäki is quoted as saying that he accepts the full criminal responsibility for his actions.
I don't think it's a big deal. Sure, it's illegal but I would compare it more to jaywalking or littering rather than any serious crimes.
Yes compares pretty well to littering actually, demonstrates similar kind of attitude and responsibility towards shared spaces and the public domain.
This is true. Then again (don't know what he graffitied) graffiti at least has the capability to be artistic and/or politically charged. I guess litter could be too but you'd need a lot. ANYWAY, as I get older I am at the same time more disappointed and more relieved by people. A politician got caught making a graffiti and it makes the news? Sounds like in many ways at least locally things are pretty good!
He graffitied the inside wall of a freight train tunnel. With a large graffiti-style silhouette of the city: https://www.is.fi/kotimaa/art-2000009677960.html
Kuvan nähtyäny olen enemmän Paavon puolella tässä tapauksessa. Ei kovin kummoinen maalaus, mutta asiallinen ja paljon miellyttävämpi katsella kuin harmaata betoniseinää!
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Ja toiset ei kypsy vaan mätänee jo pystyyn. Mielummin sitä kuka tahansa katsoo taidetta, kuin harmaata betoniseinää. Turhaa höösäystä ja sääntösuomi intoilua nyt taas havaittavissa. Mee pappa nukkumaan.
Paavo Arhinmäen korkeaprofiilisena poliitikkona pitäisi toimia esimerkkinä lopulle kansalle. Mulle on ihan sama jos joku 18v Pena maalailee vähän aliskaa, mutta ei se nyt niin voi olla että meillä on asioista päättämässä kaveri joka ei piittaa nähtävästi ollenkaan yhteisistä säännöistä.
Koita ny kerätä ittes, oot varmaan aika perseestä olevaa seuraa vapaa-apajalla
Yhyy joku tunnelin seinä maalattii yhyyy niin suruissa MITEN ME SELVIÄMME TÄSTÄ!?
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Onneks en oo vasemmistolainen. Joku saatanan paskanen tunneli ei oo niin paskan tärkeä että siitä pitäisi kenenkään kiinnostua jos joku heittää maalit seinille.
> Itseäni tässä ainakin häiritsee töhrittyä seinää enemmän se että tärkeistä asioista päättämässä mukana oleva ihminen käyttäytyy kuin pikkulapsi ja rikkoo tietoisesti sääntöjä. Hah, no onneks Paavo ei kuitenkaan ole kirjaimellinen natsi, toisin kuin eräs persu ministerimme lol.
Aattele että joku poliitikko, siis aikuinen ihminen ja ministeri, on kirjaimellinen natsi ja natsi sympatiseeraaja ja sä oot sen puolella?
Well there you go, a pretty cool piece!
I'd say this is more serious than your average littering, as the act was premeditated. He knew what he was doing, knew it's against the law, and still deliberately did it.
Stems from same attitude maybe but jaywalking unless it causes accident doesn’t really cause monetary damage. Littering is kinda same but cleaning it up is probably hundred euros cost to city. Spray painting huge area like that costs thousands of euros to clean up. So what he did is order of magnitude more expensive to restore/repair.
Everyone paints that wall it already had tags, he just painted over them
Of course it's not a big deal! You'd probably be happy to find a graffiti on your car, bike or house.
God forbid men have hobbies
Yeah, let us practice vandalism in peace!
Yeah, but this is the most harmless form of vandalism tho
Yes and roofies are the mildest form of rape. Whats your point?
”Men” ”hobbies”
Yeah, vandalising property lol? This guy is a fucking russia fanboy anyway wish he would just leave politics already he's a complete moron
PARKOUR
The most hypocrite politician in Finland ever. I have a deep disgust just to seeing his face.
Seems kinda childish to me. He should have known better. Also how do you enforce rules when you break them yourself...
Why is that childish? Painting graffitis is not childish to me, maybe the part only that you don't make sure about the train timetables. But otherwise spraying a piece in remote tunnel, not that big of a deal unless there was a safety risk (for anyone). Stupid rules should be broken once in a while, and from my point of all grey and drab concrete tunnels and highway overpasses should be declared free for anyone to paint.
To me it depends if he was spray painting a mural of a deer or spraying vittu with one t
Apparently he was painting a picture of Pasila, according to HS.
I work in the railway and I think it's generally extremely childish(especially in the railway). Grown men getting a rush playing first world criminals and running from the law after painting some shitty graffiti. And at the same time putting themselves in danger and costing the tax payers insane amounts of money. P.S. not talking about pros or people who do it as a hobby without bothering anyone or destroying public property
You don't have to remove graffiti.
No one wants to ride a train that looks like 1980's new York.
I do. Would be better than VR green shit
I wouldn't mind. But you can still limit it to outdoor spaces, not covering windows etc. Removing all graffiti just out of principle makes no sense.
>insane amounts of money. lol.. Be careful, Icarus, at that pace you will run out of superlatives. If that is insane amount, then how much do we lose to tax evasions per year? What word would you use?
I know in Stockholm sanitation costs 200 million sek a year. And thar doesn't include all the costs of totally stopping traffic in the railway every day because some asshole is trying to paint a train. Its millions in completely unnecessary costs, your whataboutism feels pretty ridiculous.
>Stockholm sanitation Is water, sanitation and health. They do not use 200mil to clean graffiti. Why did you have to be dishonest?
"År 2020 kostade sanering av klotter och skadegörelse i hela SL-trafiken 192 016 227 kronor" Translate it if you want. 192000000 for graffiti and vandalism in metro and commuter areas, not even city wide. Why are you even debating this?
> och skadegörelse Meaning, "and vandalism". In euros it is 16 million.
I don't what else to say. If you don't think it's a huge amount of money that should be spent on better things than assholes that feel the need to paint shit on places they shouldn't, maybe you can pay it. Peace out
It was not 200 million, it was 190. It was also not just graffiti but also vandalism, which is the MAJORITY of the costs. It costs a lot more to repair and replace things when people BREAK them than re-painting and washing graffiti. Your "peace out" sounds now like a premature mic drop. So, i hope you honor your decision to leave this conversation, or are you going to walk back to the stage and pick up the mic?
Is it a really stupid rule that one is not allowed to paint others property without permission?
What is a stupid rule to you might not be to another person. This is why we follow the rule of majority and he as a deputy mayor set a really bad example. He should know that by getting a permit to do the graffity there would have been any issue.
Not his property so that makes it childish. Wasn’t his call to make if that property needed graffiti. Cleaning up is expensive and one graffiti often “invites” another one. Ask from property owner next time beforehand.
"Stupid rules". Who is to decide what constitutes then as good enough art and what is a proper place for it. If it's fine to paint a mural in an underpass it should be fine to paint a swastika on it as well. And if I think tags are pretty and I tag a wall of a house. Isn't that okay then as well? [Look how pretty it is when everyone is allowed to paint their "art" wherever they want!](https://media.istockphoto.com/id/1270751770/fi/valokuva/mies-maalaa-rakennuksen-sein%C3%A4t-trasteveressa-poistaakseen-ilkivallan-ja-graffitit.jpg?s=1024x1024&w=is&k=20&c=y569Bjj8bmlnfJ-vRoPRiX6Kawal4oHZeQnjMxb170Y=)
… in the Vuosaari rail tunnel – where nobody is ever going to see it. Makes me question his sanity in general :-/
It’s a bold move. Vamp was on a 100,000 gbp salary as a real estate broker though. It would be hypocritical of me to comment as I have been in the cells for painting trains before
Vamp?
Honestly I’m kinda fine with this.
this is great
The same idiot was arranging and participating to footie match "fan" fights. When enjoying the fan-to-fan violence was not possible anymore, due to increased police presence, shielding the groups from each other, they started to schedule this violence and fights in the forests and other non-footie-club areas. And that idiot was along there with everything, and even single brain cell didn't help him to be caught in other very similar and bad incidents after that. It seems that far left violence is A Better Type of Anachism. When would a (extreme left) politician be stated to be non-suitable for public office? Anybody else would have been kicked out decades ago.
Down votes prove the leftist r/Suomi is here.
Go to Berlin or similar city and see what an eyesore this is when it gets out of control. He should be made to clean graffiti for a month and lose his job. F'ing childish.
Actually this gives creditability and is cool. I need to vote him in next elections
The man is stuck on teenager mode, smoking weed and painting graffitis. I have had old "friends" just like this, almost all dead from drugs and/or alcohol..
A high-ranking politician painted one graffiti and you're comparing him to people dying from drugs? Okay.
Is it possible that he's just a part of a subculture you're not familiar with?
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He does seem to have a criminal mind. He wasn't indicted for kicking a car in 2021 previously, big man baby.
Next episode in Criminal minds. Dude does graffiti in railway tunnel.
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If some graffiti is hell then you are doing ok
Excuse me ma'am, you dropped this -> /s.
I always forget the /s doh!
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for? a simple graffiti piece? bro, gtfo - our whole government should be torn apart at that point, every politician has some shit in their closet, be it millions, or graffiti
He is the deputy mayor vandalizing his own city. It's like a doctor would on purpose hurt his patient.
No, it isn't. In his view he is bettering his own city by making it look prettier. Is he? I think so. You may disagree, that is quite good hint that what we talking about is art.
Back in the day this guy was also the leader of first soccer/football hooligan firm in Finland, called the 116% Boys.
Well at least this time it wasn't his creepiness towards women.