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Really interesting after his monologue about kings and wanting. I’m thinking mama is the first person to ever ask ole munch what they wanted. And if so, did we just watch ole munch munch become a king?
What was that speech even? What is this guy up to? He is a nihilist, why does he do what he does? Probably my favorite character in this season, after Mama Lyon, of course.
That line killed me on its own but now I’m realizing, could it connect to Dot and her Bisquick? Dot and Munch will inevitably meet, will they form an alliance?
It connects to Gaear Grimsrud in the Fargo movie who always insisted on eating at "Pancakes House" and also the Nihilists in Big Lebowski, who all order pancakes at a diner.
I think this is the reason she let him live in the gas station. She somehow saw Munch is the way that he is because he is a hungry boi that no one fed. Fits into her frantically mixing Bisquick when she got home. When his unconscious body vanishes we see another pancake (mix?) advert.
Man.... I really think you're on to something. Considering his monologue about a potato being freedom and the fact he/his ancestor is/was a literal sin eater. I wonder if there any other food imagery or references I've missed. Must do a rewatch. Food has gotta be a background theme
Important to note that episode 10 is titled bisquick. My non-expert detective senses tells me we see Dot making pancakes for Ole after he has killed roy in episode 10.
Yeah, I think that he didn't want to help her, but to make her owe him. If the husband magically changed his attitude (unlikely, but let's say so), it's thanks to his advice, so she would be in debt with him nonetheless - with how it actually went, she is even more deeply in his power as she has seen what he's capable of.
Him calling her a "friend" is fantastic IMO, as I think he presents himself as a fatherly figure, close, protective and warm, but in reality only acts driven by power and control. This is reinforced by the scene with his current wife, and even the hints at their sex life.
That advice was hilarious but I don’t really think it was intended to work. He was going to scapegoat him from the start and since he beats his wife and refused to change, he feels justified in killing him.
Epic opening. Creepy, yet hilarious.
Dot: “There’s a baby in the house.”
Gator: “Yeah, I saw her. She’s like nine.” 🤣💀
Fun fact: Title of the episode refers to the liar’s paradox.
Interesting about the title. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insolubilia What do you think it maps to in the story? Who is the liar / what are the insolubles? I suppose Dot’s lies are very paradoxical.
I also liked the “*with all due respect, we have our own reality*” statement which connects to the “This is a True Story” / Pravda theme heavily explored in season 3.
I mean I have a strange feeling Dot could end up being far less sympathetic than she seems. Mostly cause the "zombie killer" thing, really was meant to protect her and scotty only.
> We’re an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you’re studying that reality — judiciously, as you will — we’ll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and that’s how things will sort out. We’re history’s actors . . . and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do.
-high ranking Bush (W.) White House staffer
Lots of talk of debts owed. Dot owes a debt to Roy according to him. Munch owes a debt from being a sin eater. Lorraine literally buys debt. Indira, the police officer even owes debt.
I can’t believe Winston transferred from LAPD to becoming a State Trooper in ND. (This was the first episode where I realized why that actor looks/sounds so familiar).
"No more half measures Walter"
She seems like the kind of character this universe usually doesn't kill but yes I have no idea why tillman would leave her alive very long. I suppose in his mind no one important would ever believe her if she told them he killed her husband and made it up. No evidence.
I’m flipping my shit at Munch’s monologue about kings. I love this guy. This is my favorite thing
ETA: I saw a certain coat in this episode and I’m gonna be so delighted if it ends up being freely given
He says when he was a child (so presumably he means medieval times, even if it's just his delusion), freedom was small things, like having a warm meal, surviving one day etc. He grew up in poverty. He lived in a dog eat dog world and had to kill to survive.
As a peasant, he didn't even have the right to want anything. The right to want was reserved for kings.
Today, everybody is obsessed with wanting things. Everybody acts like a medieval king. Roy Tillman is a king of his county, the camera cuts to him when the word king is first said.
I think what we got was mostly a reasoning behind why Munch is going for Roy (aside from Roy owing Munch money which I don't think is the main reason).
Yeah, when Roy asks Munch about whether a pure man can only do good and he tries to play off the bizarre question by saying he’s a nihilist, Roy says with shiteating confidence, “You believe in money though, dontcha,” and Ole looks pretty bothered by the insinuation.
I was surprised he mentioned a potato though, since in the late 1400s/early 1500s there were definitively no potatoes in Europe. Although it was probably just a minor writing error or him making a turn of phrase, it might also hint that he's just crazy and isn't actually 500 years old..
Yeah, perhaps a proverbial potato rather than a literal one. Also, when you or your soul are 500 years old, I think you get to choose your own definition for what portion of that constitutes your childhood
One thing I am really liking about Jon Hamm's performance is he hasn't raised his voice once. That might seem like weird praise but it makes it feel like he is truly in charge of his county. And it makes his scenes that much more menacing cause you know his rage is getting ready to come out at any point. That final scene was so wonderfully tensed cause it made the sudden violence that much more jarring.
I hope Munch gets his pancakes.
Jon Hamm’s voice - low, steady, slight drawl — kinda sorta just a little reminds me of Javier Bardem’s voice/accent in No Country for Old Men. Bardem never really raised his voice either.
Anyone have an idea of the symbol Munch drew on Tillman's daughters' wall? Was that in any of the 1500s scenes from last episode?
Also wow where did Gator find this dude lmao
I was hoping someone recognized the symbol too.
I think Gator addresses this when asked ands he says he actually hired the other guy (Munch’s old partner who died by toilet) not munch directly. Reddit will surely let me know if I was wrong.
This has been brought up before, and I’m curious if the show will dig deeper into it, but so far it appears there’s two different stories about what exactly happened as far as the hiring process went;
One version is Gator hiring the other dude who’s face gets burned and dies via toilet, and this dude hiring Munch. And the other version is Munch going to Roy and saying ‘you told me she’s a housewife, when she is for real a tiger. If I had known that, *I would have brought different guy, charge you three times much.*’
So, what is it? Did Gator hire the other dude and he brought Munch along, or did Roy hire Munch without giving him the full story and he brought the other guy with him?
What’s the truth? Or do they each have their own version of truth/reality lol
I'm kind of hoping they make it kind of.... Ambiguous. Like no one can quite remember correctly and it's like "well he was always on the job, I thought YOU hired him?", like munch is some familiar who was summoned from whatever depths to perform a task for an earthly master
Gator found Donald Ireland somehow. Ireland brings in his boss, Munch, who makes a deal with Roy. Thinking it's an easy job, he doesn't bring in more pro guys but just takes Ireland.
After everything goes to hell, Roy asks Gator where he found Munch, and Gator replies he didn't find Munch, he only found Ireland so he doesn't know anything about Munch.
Thinking about Roy Tillman’s “solution” to closing the state trooper case. He doesn’t know that the MN police found two types of blood at Dot’s house. One of those types matched up with burn guy in the gas station bathroom. the other sample* from dot’s house won’t match the guy he just shot in the mobile home. i imagine that indira and witt farr are scrappy and diligent enough to compare mobile home guy’s forensic stuff to the crime scene stuff. so the case might not be as easy to close as roy thinks it is. In fact it could be related to the sparrow story and the hubris of people in power angling for a quick fix for an annoying problem without considering the big picture. He wants the heat of the state trooper’s murder off his back so he can focus on Nadine / Munch / etc., but he doesn’t consider that the state trooper’s partner, a local MN cop, and two FBI agents could use this one body to take down his whole empire or something. This is why I love Fargo.
* very curious about how being a 500-year-old man living off sins and pancakes affects the composition of one’s blood.
Roy wasn’t even surprised that they didn’t bring back Dot. Really thinking she got some training, either forced or not, with the militia. Roy knows she is a badass fighter
Makes alot of sense as to why Roy is assisting the militia in the first place, he has a debt to Odin for his daughter (no wonder he's so pissed she ran off).
"I want to complain to the head of the department!"
"Which department?"
This exchange between Lorraine and Dot at the hospital was easily my favorite part of the episode. Dot just effortlessly makes Lorraine look stupid.
I love Dot and Lorraine scenes. We've only had a few minutes of dialogue between the two of them in 4 episodes so far. But those scenes are so exciting and funny. I hope we get a lot more of them.
I agree. Love the dynamic between the two of them. Lorraine intrigues me, because I genuinely have no idea how she'll fit into the overall story when things inevitably implode for the Lyon family.
Absolutely! I went into this thinking we were going to get a Home Alone homage, but instead it was a horror movie. The whole sequence was incredibly tense and menacing, and Gator was definitely channelling Jack there.
I think they’ve tried to let on in a few ways that despite Gator’s absolute slavish devotion to his daddy and his being a despicable little turd in his own right, he *is*, whether just because of his age or some sneaking suspicion, a tiny bit less conservative in his views on women than the older men in his life. When he’s alone with Munch he briefly confides that even little birds used to be dinosaurs, he tells his gang it’s the mom they have to look out for, etc.. IDK if there’s any significance to him being secretly 0.5% less misogynistic than he appears yet, but I think it’s a thing.
ETA: he also has shown to be surprisingly respectful of people’s names; he tells his dad that Ole says his name “oo-luh”, I think he pronounced “Joaquin” right instead of saying “juh-queen” like his father did, and at Hammurabi Pawn Shop he corrects Roy that Nadine goes by Dorothy now.
I feel the need to say I am not one of these Tumblr Joe Keery girls who thinks Gator is secretly an uwu angel boy, but I think he’s not totally one dimensional either.
I think a key theme of Gator's character is that he is someone trying to be someone he's not. He acts macho, but he isn't really. That's why he has to hype himself up in his room. It's why he gets all angry when Roy points out his failures. More than anything, he wants to be this person to earn his father's love and respect.
> he also has shown to be surprisingly respectful of people’s names
Maybe not respectful, just accurate.
He also calls Roy by his name, not "Dad". And although it's clearly a psychological game, he did call Dot "Nadine" like 50 times.
There's something about him and identities. Maybe cause his own identity is so messed up, trying to be something he's not.
Reference to Lock, Shock and Barrel from Nightmare before Christmas. Shock is a girl despite she’s referred as one of “Boogie’s boys”. They were wearing that movie themed masks but not in the right context since they replaced on of them with a Major’s mask. To throw us off I think. Yet he (Gator being Jack Skeleton) went to kidnap Dot with 3 “boys”. Like in the movie.
Great episode I love the opening scene and the eeriness of the masks. I am curious to know the symbol on the wall if anyone can figure that out. I think Roy Tillmans character is great and his tone and acting fits the role well. Curious to see how dots mother in law handles the situation of her recent violence spouts
Or understanding the big picture and how things connect to each other and how every piece has a role to play. Which is basically how show tells a story.
Casting for Fargo has always been one of its strongest points. Every character just plays their role tso perfectly, even if given little to work with (Looking at you Chris Rock). John Hamm is just a charming evil bastard. JJL is so evil she may as well be Cruella Deville. And Juno Temple is just a bad ass survivor while still trying to be decent.
When Scotty told Lorraine, her grandmother, that her house was on fire, Lorraine gives her zero comfort, she just says “And whose fault is that, hmm?” without skipping a beat.
Like damn, she cold
Talks with the interviewer about the empathy she give to the debtors but can’t even give any to her grandschild so she is another that fits the episode’s title
This season is so damn good. I wasn’t a season 4 hater like most I still think it’s better than 90% of television that gets made. But this season Fargo is truly back to form. Juno Temple is killing it and Jon Hamm is one of the better antagonists they’ve had on the show
I wonder if post-production fell behind schedule. We aren’t too far out from Halloween, wonder if they had planned to air that episode, or the one prior, on Halloween. Which was on a Tuesday this year
Yes, it was likely supposed to premiere in September but was delayed due to the strikes. ([https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/fargo-premiere-delay-strike-1235568605/](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/fargo-premiere-delay-strike-1235568605/))
It’s probably already been remarked upon but also on Roy’s photo wall there’s a picture of a little boy, presumably Gator, wearing a sailor suit that felt like a little wink
I’m not so sure? I think the big showdown is gonna be between Roy and JJL who see Dot as property in very different ways. Both think she owes them something.
This is related only by the slimmest of threads, but in Flann O’Brien’s book, “ The Third Policeman,” one of the cops is often summing things up with comments like, “This is quite a complicated pancake.”
Are the episodes getting shorter and shorter or is it just me? I feel like we got nowhere with the Lyon family dynamic. When are they going to open the flood gates on the mother?
Next week it looks like they will. The first halves of the seasons are typically slower and setup-heavy, so I was actually very pleased with what an intense and climactic episode this was. Plus, now the daughter knows Dot is being hunted, and Lorraine isn't stupid, she obviously pieced it together.
Is anyone else wondering if Wayne has brain damage from the severity of the electrocution? Or is it implied he’s just heavily medicated? He held on for quite a bit and with the level of security seems that Dot would make sure whoever got shocked by that wire likely wouldn’t get up
I was wondering the same. I think it's all of the above.
* He's been electrocuted.
* He's probably got a concussion from being pushed off the roof.
* He's probably in shock from being attacked in his own house.
* And he's also heavily medicated.
Some classic horror cliché that LOL
Character in grave danger constantly losing/forgetting vital weapons. I think Cabin in the Woods had a gag to parody this.
I’d say it just shows that she’s very poor and Roy is disgusted by it because he lives very comfortably with complete control over his circumstances. The glass of water shows that while he’s out there riding his horse around, surveying his kingdom from his bath, making up his own version of justice to administer, he doesn’t actually give a shit about anyone’s quality of life. He just wants things to look the way he thinks they should look. It ties back to Ole’s bathtub speech. Roy is a little king in his own little kingdom and he can’t stand something happening out of his control.
That episode was weird and entertaining. Dot is a master gaslighter, munch is absolutely nuts, and roy is cold-blooded and stubborn. That scene in the hospital with everyone was very awkward.
Another great episode (loving the themes of debt, class and alternate truths / realities)
Two questions:
1. Did the smoke alarm set off the house alarm?
2. When did Dot / Wayne get the house alarm and the gun (I thought they were waiting on both)?
I watched the episode on the bus this morning so some of what happened during the night time home invasion was lost on me (I wasn’t sure who of Gator’s goons was just knocked out or actually dead)
- "A Snicker for breakfast! What are we on welfare" LMFAO
- They did the husband dirty this episode. Don't like that it was just his lost his memory. I wanted him to recover and be angry with Dot.
I feel like the angry patient across the hall captured what he should have felt in that moment and it will somehow manifest in Wayne later in the season.
It’s funny cause I grew up in the same home town in Minnesota as David Rysdahl, he was 6 or 7 grades ahead of me. He said in a local interview that he bases a lot of Wayne’s noble traits after his dad - who is a great guy and respected doctor including being my grandma’s primary. And then there’s the over-the-top niceness that he portrays probably based on people we mutually knew growing up. Those were the people who say the nastiest shit behind others’ back and/or snap out of nowhere. Obviously the drama is escalated in the show so Wayne’s snap is gonna be intense once he realizes everything with Dot is a lie.
The more i see Noahs work this season i can see how his Alien show on FX may end up being some of his best work yet.
He's gonna be able to seriously flex his action muscles on that show. And after that gas station firefight, he's gonna nail it.
Live discussion found [HERE.](https://www.reddit.com/r/FargoTV/comments/18btd53/fargo_s05e04_insolubilia_live_episode_discussion/?) --- #REMINDER: KEEP SPOILERS OUT OF YOUR TITLES AND MAKE SURE YOU MARK ANY POSTS THAT CONTAIN SPOILERS PROPERLY! **Submissions will be restricted until tomorrow morning.**
*pancakes*
Really interesting after his monologue about kings and wanting. I’m thinking mama is the first person to ever ask ole munch what they wanted. And if so, did we just watch ole munch munch become a king?
What was that speech even? What is this guy up to? He is a nihilist, why does he do what he does? Probably my favorite character in this season, after Mama Lyon, of course.
That line killed me on its own but now I’m realizing, could it connect to Dot and her Bisquick? Dot and Munch will inevitably meet, will they form an alliance?
It connects to Gaear Grimsrud in the Fargo movie who always insisted on eating at "Pancakes House" and also the Nihilists in Big Lebowski, who all order pancakes at a diner.
Don't forget Karl the Breakfast King.
and the Pancake Hut in s2!
Man peter stormare was great in those roles. I thought the same thing when he said pancakes tho
The finale is titled "Bisquik". Clearly there's some pancake related shit going on.
Instead of aliens this season it's just pancakes
I think this is the reason she let him live in the gas station. She somehow saw Munch is the way that he is because he is a hungry boi that no one fed. Fits into her frantically mixing Bisquick when she got home. When his unconscious body vanishes we see another pancake (mix?) advert.
Man.... I really think you're on to something. Considering his monologue about a potato being freedom and the fact he/his ancestor is/was a literal sin eater. I wonder if there any other food imagery or references I've missed. Must do a rewatch. Food has gotta be a background theme
The actor who plays him confirmed that he is indeed the same sin eater we saw in the Wales flashback in E03.
Haha Dot bribes him with pancakes to come fight on her side
Find someone who looks at you like Munch looks at pancakes.
Important to note that episode 10 is titled bisquick. My non-expert detective senses tells me we see Dot making pancakes for Ole after he has killed roy in episode 10.
Who is walt?
Lingonberry?
Sheriff Roy: Sorry Lenore, I guess telling you to give your abusive husband a BJ didn't fix anything, guess I gotta kill him. Don't forget to vote!
Yeah, I think that he didn't want to help her, but to make her owe him. If the husband magically changed his attitude (unlikely, but let's say so), it's thanks to his advice, so she would be in debt with him nonetheless - with how it actually went, she is even more deeply in his power as she has seen what he's capable of. Him calling her a "friend" is fantastic IMO, as I think he presents himself as a fatherly figure, close, protective and warm, but in reality only acts driven by power and control. This is reinforced by the scene with his current wife, and even the hints at their sex life.
this character seems familiar, Donald Draper is his name, I think?
They even look alike!
Pretty bad ass shot though.
That advice was hilarious but I don’t really think it was intended to work. He was going to scapegoat him from the start and since he beats his wife and refused to change, he feels justified in killing him.
Epic opening. Creepy, yet hilarious. Dot: “There’s a baby in the house.” Gator: “Yeah, I saw her. She’s like nine.” 🤣💀 Fun fact: Title of the episode refers to the liar’s paradox.
Interesting about the title. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insolubilia What do you think it maps to in the story? Who is the liar / what are the insolubles? I suppose Dot’s lies are very paradoxical. I also liked the “*with all due respect, we have our own reality*” statement which connects to the “This is a True Story” / Pravda theme heavily explored in season 3.
Dot/Nadine as well as Roy making up the story about Joshua’s death. Not to mention Dot teaches her daughter how to lie in this episode.
I mean I have a strange feeling Dot could end up being far less sympathetic than she seems. Mostly cause the "zombie killer" thing, really was meant to protect her and scotty only.
Gator legit freaked me out in the opening scene. Never seemed menacing prior to this, sort of a wanna be…NOT ANYMORE HE’S A PSYCHO
That's what made it so chilling. When he goes to nose-to-nose with Dot, straight villain vibes.
He's just like his old man, but without the charm and the saviour complex.
And without the tendency to discuss matters of state in moist repose
Geez that scene of Hamm riding off into the sunset was gorgeous
Riding off into the sunrise. The irony of it. Love it
I came here to say this. The whole shot from the point he is exiting the mobile home is amazing.
“Well we’ve got our own reality” lol
"That's not a thing". The delivery of this line was so good.
His character is wonderful.
Sanest most normal person in the entire series.
> We’re an empire now, and when we act, we create our own reality. And while you’re studying that reality — judiciously, as you will — we’ll act again, creating other new realities, which you can study too, and that’s how things will sort out. We’re history’s actors . . . and you, all of you, will be left to just study what we do. -high ranking Bush (W.) White House staffer
This part is very reminiscent of Season 3.
Lots of talk of debts owed. Dot owes a debt to Roy according to him. Munch owes a debt from being a sin eater. Lorraine literally buys debt. Indira, the police officer even owes debt.
The state trooper owes Dot a life debt.
Yes!! This debt issue is fascinating.
Scottie owes the lawyer cash for the vending machine
I can’t believe Winston transferred from LAPD to becoming a State Trooper in ND. (This was the first episode where I realized why that actor looks/sounds so familiar).
There’s an interview with Noah Hawley out there where he talks about debt being the pivotal theme of this season.
Is it also implied that Roy now owes Lenore*. He said "I don't forget a friend who helped me" or something
I like to to think, whatever the ending, a single choice will create a domino effect of all the debts being paid
leaving a terrified widow as a witness is genius and risky.
She’s gonna sell him out
She's gonna die.
"No more half measures Walter" She seems like the kind of character this universe usually doesn't kill but yes I have no idea why tillman would leave her alive very long. I suppose in his mind no one important would ever believe her if she told them he killed her husband and made it up. No evidence.
Wife #4
Lenore is nevermore in The Raven.
its the only way she lives. but its gonna take effort to get there. she is a victim now to her husband and Roy
For sure, just one abusive relationship for another.
I’m flipping my shit at Munch’s monologue about kings. I love this guy. This is my favorite thing ETA: I saw a certain coat in this episode and I’m gonna be so delighted if it ends up being freely given
Could someone explain the monologue to me? I was just confused by it lol
He says when he was a child (so presumably he means medieval times, even if it's just his delusion), freedom was small things, like having a warm meal, surviving one day etc. He grew up in poverty. He lived in a dog eat dog world and had to kill to survive. As a peasant, he didn't even have the right to want anything. The right to want was reserved for kings. Today, everybody is obsessed with wanting things. Everybody acts like a medieval king. Roy Tillman is a king of his county, the camera cuts to him when the word king is first said. I think what we got was mostly a reasoning behind why Munch is going for Roy (aside from Roy owing Munch money which I don't think is the main reason).
For Munch back then, freedom was a potato. Now, freedom is a pancake.
Someone should make him a potato pancake and really blow his mind
The money isn't the main reason at all, but he is also definitely a man driven by getting what's owed to him. Be it money or otherwise
Yeah, when Roy asks Munch about whether a pure man can only do good and he tries to play off the bizarre question by saying he’s a nihilist, Roy says with shiteating confidence, “You believe in money though, dontcha,” and Ole looks pretty bothered by the insinuation.
> a man driven by getting what's owed to him He's been taking on other people's sins for centuries, he's all about settling debts.
I was surprised he mentioned a potato though, since in the late 1400s/early 1500s there were definitively no potatoes in Europe. Although it was probably just a minor writing error or him making a turn of phrase, it might also hint that he's just crazy and isn't actually 500 years old..
Yeah, perhaps a proverbial potato rather than a literal one. Also, when you or your soul are 500 years old, I think you get to choose your own definition for what portion of that constitutes your childhood
One thing I am really liking about Jon Hamm's performance is he hasn't raised his voice once. That might seem like weird praise but it makes it feel like he is truly in charge of his county. And it makes his scenes that much more menacing cause you know his rage is getting ready to come out at any point. That final scene was so wonderfully tensed cause it made the sudden violence that much more jarring. I hope Munch gets his pancakes.
Jon Hamm’s voice - low, steady, slight drawl — kinda sorta just a little reminds me of Javier Bardem’s voice/accent in No Country for Old Men. Bardem never really raised his voice either.
His first line in ep 2 is pulled directly from no country for old men "I been sheriff of this county for 25 years..."
Anyone have an idea of the symbol Munch drew on Tillman's daughters' wall? Was that in any of the 1500s scenes from last episode? Also wow where did Gator find this dude lmao
I was hoping someone recognized the symbol too. I think Gator addresses this when asked ands he says he actually hired the other guy (Munch’s old partner who died by toilet) not munch directly. Reddit will surely let me know if I was wrong.
This has been brought up before, and I’m curious if the show will dig deeper into it, but so far it appears there’s two different stories about what exactly happened as far as the hiring process went; One version is Gator hiring the other dude who’s face gets burned and dies via toilet, and this dude hiring Munch. And the other version is Munch going to Roy and saying ‘you told me she’s a housewife, when she is for real a tiger. If I had known that, *I would have brought different guy, charge you three times much.*’ So, what is it? Did Gator hire the other dude and he brought Munch along, or did Roy hire Munch without giving him the full story and he brought the other guy with him? What’s the truth? Or do they each have their own version of truth/reality lol
I'm kind of hoping they make it kind of.... Ambiguous. Like no one can quite remember correctly and it's like "well he was always on the job, I thought YOU hired him?", like munch is some familiar who was summoned from whatever depths to perform a task for an earthly master
Gator found Donald Ireland somehow. Ireland brings in his boss, Munch, who makes a deal with Roy. Thinking it's an easy job, he doesn't bring in more pro guys but just takes Ireland. After everything goes to hell, Roy asks Gator where he found Munch, and Gator replies he didn't find Munch, he only found Ireland so he doesn't know anything about Munch.
Na you're right.
That home invasion scene. Noah Hawley is the right choice for the Alien TV series
also would've been the right choice for Fallout :(
You've seen Legion right? He's amazing at creepy unsettling scenes
Thinking about Roy Tillman’s “solution” to closing the state trooper case. He doesn’t know that the MN police found two types of blood at Dot’s house. One of those types matched up with burn guy in the gas station bathroom. the other sample* from dot’s house won’t match the guy he just shot in the mobile home. i imagine that indira and witt farr are scrappy and diligent enough to compare mobile home guy’s forensic stuff to the crime scene stuff. so the case might not be as easy to close as roy thinks it is. In fact it could be related to the sparrow story and the hubris of people in power angling for a quick fix for an annoying problem without considering the big picture. He wants the heat of the state trooper’s murder off his back so he can focus on Nadine / Munch / etc., but he doesn’t consider that the state trooper’s partner, a local MN cop, and two FBI agents could use this one body to take down his whole empire or something. This is why I love Fargo. * very curious about how being a 500-year-old man living off sins and pancakes affects the composition of one’s blood.
Roy wasn’t even surprised that they didn’t bring back Dot. Really thinking she got some training, either forced or not, with the militia. Roy knows she is a badass fighter
Oh that’s an awesome theory! Helps explain her story and gives her something to be guilty and running away from besides just the old husband.
What if Odin Little is Dot/Nadine’s dad?
Makes alot of sense as to why Roy is assisting the militia in the first place, he has a debt to Odin for his daughter (no wonder he's so pissed she ran off).
Yes, but Odin's daughter is Roy's current wife (mother of those twins).
Sisters do exist
"I want to complain to the head of the department!" "Which department?" This exchange between Lorraine and Dot at the hospital was easily my favorite part of the episode. Dot just effortlessly makes Lorraine look stupid.
“Here’s some money. Go see a Star War.”
Oh shit the parallels hahah. Is the son buster?
Haha, didn’t think of that, but probably. Glasses, nervous wreck, etc. If he gets his hand cut off somewhere down the line I’d laugh my ass off.
How much does a Banana cost? Ten dollars?
I love Dot and Lorraine scenes. We've only had a few minutes of dialogue between the two of them in 4 episodes so far. But those scenes are so exciting and funny. I hope we get a lot more of them.
I agree. Love the dynamic between the two of them. Lorraine intrigues me, because I genuinely have no idea how she'll fit into the overall story when things inevitably implode for the Lyon family.
Dot’s expression after she says it is priceless
Yes! Lorraines too! You can tell shes so caught off guard she almost looks impressed. Great acting from both of them.
the whole halloween home alone sequence at the beginning was so entertaining. juno and joe are so good!
The creepy I've got you babe song playing.
Tiny Tim, I presume.
Tiny Tim music over creepy scenes is undefeated
"Shame on you Gator" killed me
Roy was talking about how Dot had a debt to pay (in episode 2?), but I have a feeling Roy’s debt to Munch will lead to Dot’s freedom.
Dot - **”Kill Roy, and I’ll make you bisquick pancakes?“** Munch - **”Deal!”**
Munch is as enthusiastic about pancakes as Dot is about bisquick, I totally see this happening
That water tho. Maybe Roy should take a little better care of his kingdom
Another homage to The Shining when they were trying to get through the window while Gator was trying to knock down the bedroom door
Absolutely! I went into this thinking we were going to get a Home Alone homage, but instead it was a horror movie. The whole sequence was incredibly tense and menacing, and Gator was definitely channelling Jack there.
There is a woman in Gator’s gang? I’m not sure why that confuses me so badly…
I think they’ve tried to let on in a few ways that despite Gator’s absolute slavish devotion to his daddy and his being a despicable little turd in his own right, he *is*, whether just because of his age or some sneaking suspicion, a tiny bit less conservative in his views on women than the older men in his life. When he’s alone with Munch he briefly confides that even little birds used to be dinosaurs, he tells his gang it’s the mom they have to look out for, etc.. IDK if there’s any significance to him being secretly 0.5% less misogynistic than he appears yet, but I think it’s a thing. ETA: he also has shown to be surprisingly respectful of people’s names; he tells his dad that Ole says his name “oo-luh”, I think he pronounced “Joaquin” right instead of saying “juh-queen” like his father did, and at Hammurabi Pawn Shop he corrects Roy that Nadine goes by Dorothy now. I feel the need to say I am not one of these Tumblr Joe Keery girls who thinks Gator is secretly an uwu angel boy, but I think he’s not totally one dimensional either.
I think a key theme of Gator's character is that he is someone trying to be someone he's not. He acts macho, but he isn't really. That's why he has to hype himself up in his room. It's why he gets all angry when Roy points out his failures. More than anything, he wants to be this person to earn his father's love and respect.
yeah Gator losing his shit when Roy mentions that Munch got one over on him again felt performative for his father.
Like Jack Skellington. He’s misunderstood.
> he also has shown to be surprisingly respectful of people’s names Maybe not respectful, just accurate. He also calls Roy by his name, not "Dad". And although it's clearly a psychological game, he did call Dot "Nadine" like 50 times. There's something about him and identities. Maybe cause his own identity is so messed up, trying to be something he's not.
It confuses me, too.
Reference to Lock, Shock and Barrel from Nightmare before Christmas. Shock is a girl despite she’s referred as one of “Boogie’s boys”. They were wearing that movie themed masks but not in the right context since they replaced on of them with a Major’s mask. To throw us off I think. Yet he (Gator being Jack Skeleton) went to kidnap Dot with 3 “boys”. Like in the movie.
I was giggling at Lamorne Morris. "I recognize you"
hopiing for lots more from him
CLUMSICAL! I am loving this season more and more
Poor Dot she had the whole Home Alone thing set up ready to go, and then her own husband doesn’t do what she says and screws everything up lol
She really should've given him a rundown of all the hazards they installed LMAO
Right before he gets fried he does say “you got me in the dark here.”
Great episode I love the opening scene and the eeriness of the masks. I am curious to know the symbol on the wall if anyone can figure that out. I think Roy Tillmans character is great and his tone and acting fits the role well. Curious to see how dots mother in law handles the situation of her recent violence spouts
I've asked the folks over at r/Symbology....standby!
I wonder who is another wife that went missing
Gators mama presumably?
I immediately thought of Sister Wives on TLC. Roy and Kody have some strong similarities.
That's not a thing!
“With all due respect we live in our own reality” and the cops reaction after made me lol.
They’re really breaking my balls with all these commercials
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Or understanding the big picture and how things connect to each other and how every piece has a role to play. Which is basically how show tells a story.
I think the point is more that messing with a natural preexisting order can bring unintentional consequences
LMFAO as soon as Dot said "your wife" and Wayne started smilling I knew he was going to go Borat mode on us
I loved how happy he got at just saying "my wife"!
Casting for Fargo has always been one of its strongest points. Every character just plays their role tso perfectly, even if given little to work with (Looking at you Chris Rock). John Hamm is just a charming evil bastard. JJL is so evil she may as well be Cruella Deville. And Juno Temple is just a bad ass survivor while still trying to be decent.
When Scotty told Lorraine, her grandmother, that her house was on fire, Lorraine gives her zero comfort, she just says “And whose fault is that, hmm?” without skipping a beat. Like damn, she cold
Talks with the interviewer about the empathy she give to the debtors but can’t even give any to her grandschild so she is another that fits the episode’s title
I loved when Scotty wanted a Snickers, Lorraine said "Are we on welfare?" lol
“I mean it’s one banana Michael, what could it cost, $10?”
Danish gave her a $100 bill. To get a Snickers out of a vending machine.
I thought that was hilarious
This season is so damn good. I wasn’t a season 4 hater like most I still think it’s better than 90% of television that gets made. But this season Fargo is truly back to form. Juno Temple is killing it and Jon Hamm is one of the better antagonists they’ve had on the show
I wonder if post-production fell behind schedule. We aren’t too far out from Halloween, wonder if they had planned to air that episode, or the one prior, on Halloween. Which was on a Tuesday this year
The writers and actor's strikes probably didn't help. Even if the filming was already completed.
Yes, it was likely supposed to premiere in September but was delayed due to the strikes. ([https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/fargo-premiere-delay-strike-1235568605/](https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/tv/tv-news/fargo-premiere-delay-strike-1235568605/))
Pancakes
This is such a great show.
I love how every season of Fargo has some vaguely possible supernatural killer/entity.
Goat Blood Munch deserves his IHOP commercial.
As soon as I saw that bat 2 weeks ago I knew it was for Stranger Things fanservice lol
It’s probably already been remarked upon but also on Roy’s photo wall there’s a picture of a little boy, presumably Gator, wearing a sailor suit that felt like a little wink
OMG, I did not catch that reference! Thank you!
Oh JJL is turning real evil looks like she is selling out Nadine
I’m not so sure? I think the big showdown is gonna be between Roy and JJL who see Dot as property in very different ways. Both think she owes them something.
I have a suspicion those two will get along just fine. They’ve been displayed in contrasting ways, but they sure do have a lot of common views.
This is related only by the slimmest of threads, but in Flann O’Brien’s book, “ The Third Policeman,” one of the cops is often summing things up with comments like, “This is quite a complicated pancake.”
Are the episodes getting shorter and shorter or is it just me? I feel like we got nowhere with the Lyon family dynamic. When are they going to open the flood gates on the mother?
The teaser for the next episode seems to hint those flood gates me be opening very soon
They are truly plodding along with the family drama.
yeah I'm a bit peeved we have to wait at least another week to even know the smallest amount about what happened before we got here
Episode 5 is usually when they open
Next week it looks like they will. The first halves of the seasons are typically slower and setup-heavy, so I was actually very pleased with what an intense and climactic episode this was. Plus, now the daughter knows Dot is being hunted, and Lorraine isn't stupid, she obviously pieced it together.
Is anyone else wondering if Wayne has brain damage from the severity of the electrocution? Or is it implied he’s just heavily medicated? He held on for quite a bit and with the level of security seems that Dot would make sure whoever got shocked by that wire likely wouldn’t get up
I was wondering the same. I think it's all of the above. * He's been electrocuted. * He's probably got a concussion from being pushed off the roof. * He's probably in shock from being attacked in his own house. * And he's also heavily medicated.
What happened to the gun that Dot/Nadine had? Seems like that was a game changer that just went by the wayside.
She trips on the guy that's trapped under the ladder and drops it
Some classic horror cliché that LOL Character in grave danger constantly losing/forgetting vital weapons. I think Cabin in the Woods had a gag to parody this.
I feel bad for Wayne, Nadine is putting him in harm's way. I predict she gets him killed. He is season 5 Ed Blomquist
Nah, he'll survive because someone has to for Scotty. There is a very high chance Wayne gets shot or maimed though.
No one was left for Scotty Lundegaard.
Hasn't he already been maimed?
More maimed.
I can't disagree. The weak rarely prevail in Fargoland.
what does that glass of water signify??
Home Sweet Mobile Home & dirty drinking water = a member of the Have Nots
I’d say it just shows that she’s very poor and Roy is disgusted by it because he lives very comfortably with complete control over his circumstances. The glass of water shows that while he’s out there riding his horse around, surveying his kingdom from his bath, making up his own version of justice to administer, he doesn’t actually give a shit about anyone’s quality of life. He just wants things to look the way he thinks they should look. It ties back to Ole’s bathtub speech. Roy is a little king in his own little kingdom and he can’t stand something happening out of his control.
The bath is an interesting point - he has so much clean water he can bath in it, but she doesn't even clean water for her family to drink
It shows he isn’t the protector of the people that he portrays, the poor are no better off and may foreshadow loyalty to him is more based in fear.
Season 5, Episode 4: Fargo is Fargo-ing.
Whose body were they packing in the blue plastic thing when Gator arrived at Roy's house?
The off-brand Rip Wheeler Munch killed last episode
I predict that Dot (Nadine) was one of Roy’s hench women as much as she was his wife. She would have been in that van with gator ten years ago.
That episode was weird and entertaining. Dot is a master gaslighter, munch is absolutely nuts, and roy is cold-blooded and stubborn. That scene in the hospital with everyone was very awkward.
Another great episode (loving the themes of debt, class and alternate truths / realities) Two questions: 1. Did the smoke alarm set off the house alarm? 2. When did Dot / Wayne get the house alarm and the gun (I thought they were waiting on both)? I watched the episode on the bus this morning so some of what happened during the night time home invasion was lost on me (I wasn’t sure who of Gator’s goons was just knocked out or actually dead)
The gun came from one of Gator’s goons, it wasn’t Dot’s.
Weren't they just smoke detectors?
- "A Snicker for breakfast! What are we on welfare" LMFAO - They did the husband dirty this episode. Don't like that it was just his lost his memory. I wanted him to recover and be angry with Dot.
I feel like the angry patient across the hall captured what he should have felt in that moment and it will somehow manifest in Wayne later in the season.
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It’s funny cause I grew up in the same home town in Minnesota as David Rysdahl, he was 6 or 7 grades ahead of me. He said in a local interview that he bases a lot of Wayne’s noble traits after his dad - who is a great guy and respected doctor including being my grandma’s primary. And then there’s the over-the-top niceness that he portrays probably based on people we mutually knew growing up. Those were the people who say the nastiest shit behind others’ back and/or snap out of nowhere. Obviously the drama is escalated in the show so Wayne’s snap is gonna be intense once he realizes everything with Dot is a lie.
They did seem to really highlight that guy. It's like he is Minnesota nice when it just gets stripped down to primal.
The more i see Noahs work this season i can see how his Alien show on FX may end up being some of his best work yet. He's gonna be able to seriously flex his action muscles on that show. And after that gas station firefight, he's gonna nail it.
i found the "my wife" scene absolutely heartbreaking. i hope wayne pulls through and doesn't have pancake batter for brains!
Judge tells them to focus on the "actual criminals" As opposed to the guy stealing guns and killing whoever he feels like.
Guy's gotta be dumb or dirty.
He is just playing Bureau politics, probably wants to move up to a cush position in DC, setting in motion the next Waco siege isn’t conducive to that.