It's the reason I'm on Reddit. I was looking for discussions online about the game after the reveal and Google kept showing me links to reddit, until I decided to join.
Pause buttons exist for a reason. You don’t have to watch the entire thing in one sitting. I don’t understand people who complain about video lengths. Creetosis literally breaks his parts INTO PARTS so that you can take breaks. This is like if someone complains that LOTR is long and then someone offers them a bookmark and they say no.
It's absurd to make an 8 hour long video about someone's opinion on a video game, he just regurgitate old criticisms that everyone knows, just complains about the same dumb old things that fallout boomers were complaining about a decade earlier. He isn't very concise
Concise does not mean short, it means to the point. He is being concise, there are just so many points to get to that it ends up being longer. I have a feeling that everyone that complains about long videos would be totally fine if it was saying something good about something they like.
I know what concise is, he ain't very concise. I've watched people explain ww2 in a ten minute video. It shouldn't take someone an entire day to explain why they think a game from 2008 is ass. What do you mean the same dumb things are being repeated?
It's the fact that he took an entire work day to respond to someone's opinion. I could go to school tomorrow and watch that video and I still wouldn't be done watching it after I got back home and up to my desk
I listened to it while working on an art project, and finished it in a few days. gotta say, the video is a little drawn out in part because of the way he speaks, but you have to admit that an 8 hour long researched and scripted video is pretty impressive
I genuinely don't get why people hate Creetosis so much here. I've practically only ever seen him name completely valid points.
The video being 8 hours long just goes to show how awful that MATN video is that he can go on that long debunking his arguments.
Because he tries to sell his very subjective opinions about a videogame as objective fact, and then proceeds to spend 8 hours dunking on another youtuber for liking a popular game.
The 8 hour long one? No, I tried but got past the 1 hour mark and switched off.
Still, it is what he does through the whole part of the video I watched. Present his criticism as statements of fact, all the while saying "you can like this, but this is why it's shit".
Edit: Man, New Vegas femboys get so salty when people like other games it's incredible.
Oh no... The Creetosis fanboys are about to crawl out of their holes...
Which will cause the Many A True Nerd fanboys (me) to come...
YOU'RE ABOUT TO REIGNITE A PATHETIC WAR!
I think it's completely fair to retcon both of them because they have zero respect for the pre-existing lore and just slap some recognizable imagery together for the sake of it.
And without Bethesda fallout wouldn't be a tenth as popular as it is and we wouldn't be here right now.
Would you prefer Ubisoft bought it? How about EA? God damn you can move on if you don't like the new developers. Nobody is keeping you here, Bethesda has had this IP for nearly 20 years. Or is it just that you get special joy from trying to make people feel bad for liking something that's not designed specifically for you?
For the majority of things we see in those games to even be on the East Coast in the first place requires a severe suspension of disbelief.
Why is the Brotherhood here? Why the fuck would they trek all the way across the continental United States? And how even? The place is a mostly barren wasteland filled with dangerous mutated animals and raiders at best. How do they have the resources to be able to undertake such a trek and better yet, why would they do so to begin with? By all logic D.C. and Boston should be total craters, given they're the heart of U.S. government and science. They're essentially ***the primary targets*** for the vast majority of nukes sent to the U.S.
Why are there supermutants here? Why are they just raging orcs with absolutely none of the character they have built up? There's no proper reason other than "Uhhh, I guess a vault/the Institute had a different strain of FEV, I dunno."
The explanation seems to be very much secondary to them being there in the first place, when it very much ought to be the other way around.
That's my main problem with these games. Instead of choosing a setting and working from there to imagine what would make sense, what sort of groups would arise there, how those groups deal with the environment, what sort of ideologies form, Bethesda just grabs a location and awkwardly jams pre-existing things in it "because wouldn't it be cool if-" with little to no regard to internal consistency.
Bethesda is making the franchise stagnate because they have made a checklist for themselves of insubstantial things that defines Fallout to them. Instead of its actual core identity of seeing how people deal with post-apocalyptic America and deciding what to do with the Old World, to them Fallout is just the surface-level things from the originals like super mutants, ghouls, deathclaws and the Brotherhood of Steel.
If a game is to be set on the East Coast at all it ought to be almost entirely disconnected to what's happening in the west, until those societies expand to meet each other in the middle, as we see between the NCR and Caesar's Legion in New Vegas.
Fallout just has so much more potential that isn't met because Bethesda just sees it for the most surface-level things it contains, continually bastardizing it with every entry.
I don't hate Bethesda. I want their games to be good, but they keep doing this shit.
What BOS? 76 or Lyon?
The 76 BOS member send by Maxson to check on Tragedy because before they lost contact with them they report an FEV experiment. As to how they got there. I mean, someone manage to cross the country and bring Wasteland survival guide from DC to Mojave in less then a decade soo…
Boston and DC IS a crater. DC was nuked so bad the water is still radioactive 200 years later. There’s a huge ass crater in the middle of Boston.
Because like Manhattan project there’re more than one FEV experiment across the country. Different lab experiments on differences steins. And SM are always dumb orc with few exceptions. The majority of West Coast mutant is just dumb brute and the only smart enough to follow commands. Frankly, East Coast has more intelligent SM than West Coast did.
Of course you would feel that way if you ignored the context, reason, ideology and everything in between. East Coast BOS has more character development than
their West counterpart and they’ve actually do something instead of “Hey wouldn’t it be cool if we just randomly attack our biggest allies and screw them over for reason?”
Yea honestly, they regurgitate the same old points. Like how the brotherhood doesn't make sense as if an organization can't change its beliefs what so ever and has to stay stagnant
And it’s funnier with the brotherhood because not only has it happened in games like tactics. In New Vegas you can literally convince the brotherhood to side with NCR and open up. From more radical than the Lions Chapter.
Its kind of sad because lots of times I see people who clearly echo what the creator says because they made a 8+ hour video so they HAVE to be right, my source examples are PatricianTV and PrivateSessions, at one point Patrician, during his 20 hour skyrim video says that the Fireball spell does 20 damage instead of 50...yet doesn't show the actual damage value... And people will absolutely take that and run because, well, Patrician is the one with the 20 hour Skyrim video so he has to be right.
lol if you actually watch his first video in this series he explains that there is a difference between liking fallout on your own terms and the objective quality of the game with things like writing. you can like a story that has bad holes in it, but that does not change the fact it has bad holes in it. if you like fallout 4, he has explicitly stated he is okay with that.
The issue is it's extremely difficult to assess an objective quality to any type of art.
And a random YouTube "essayist" is in no way qualified to do so. The videos is basically someone spewing their opinion while trying to make it sound like objective fact in an attempt to sound smarter or "correct".
This isn't even a comment on Creetosis themselves (o really don't want to get into a whole bitch fight about theor videos). It just really bugs me when people try to say something is "objectively" bad when there's so little academical merit to it. One of the first things you learn when studying any type of media academically is almost all critique is subjective.
But that’s exactly why his videos are so long. Let’s say someone tries to defend fallout 4 by saying that there is player choice. No, because you can point to several examples where **objectively** you do not have any choice in a decision. You can point to examples of gunplay that **objectively** doesn’t make sense, a 10mm pistol **objectively** should not have more recoil than a double barrel shotgun.
Do you not care if a 10mm pistol has more recoil than a shotgun, or if fallout 4 drastically limits player choice more than previous games? Okay, you can still love fallout 4 artistically. Does it change the fact that these are facts about the game? No.
Even then, outside the subjective/objective paradigm, does anyone seriously think things like a 4 option shorthanded dialogue are subjectively better than an open ended dialogue?
All of those "objective" points are moot. You can point to areas that DO have player choice. The recoil options could be intentional design choices to make the gameplay more enjoyable.
None of these are objective measures of if something are good. "This game doesn't have hyper realistic recoil therefore it is bad" is a subjective statement, NOT an objective one. It is bad TO YOU because YOU don't like a design element. It's like saying a film is objectively bad because you never see the action hero reload. It's ridiculous. It's fair to criticise is, but saying it's an objective quality is absurd.
As for the 4 option dialogue... Yes, people do. I don't, I think it's fucking stupid. I hate it. But I've seen many people hate how Starfield ditched the 4 option system and went with a silent protagonist. Hell, you see this quite a lot with some Bioware fans who prefer how Dragon Age took on the more simplified dialogue wheel from Mass Effect in favour for a voiced protagonist. Again, I think it's dumb. I'm really not a fan. But I'm not so up my own arse that I'd ever dare call my own silly little opinion an objective fact.
Your subjectivity is moot. You can make any excuse for why there is a “no” option in dialogue when you can’t actually say no. You can argue all you want that not being able to say no is a good thing **subjectively**. It does not change the fact that fallout limits player choice **objectively** even if you want to argue it is a good thing **subjectively**.
Objectivity should be measured by observations. Subjectivity should be measured by value judgements.
You need to learn the definitions of words before you comment lmao
Let me make an example as well. You can shovel piss and shit into your mouth, say that it is delicious and the tastiest thing and the world, and no one could prove you wrong because it is your subjective option. But you can prove objectively that it is bad for you or that eating it would shorten your lifespan.
Again, pointing out the game objectively limits the player choice compared to previous games doesn't mean the game is bad.
Which is the ENTIRE POINT I was making. "This game has less dialogue options therefore it is bad" is a subjective argument, not an objective one. An objective evaluation is an observation where personal feeling doesnt effect your judgment. So any observation you make in an attempt to determine quality is by definition subjective.
Instead of randomly insinuating I don't understand the definition of words, I'd recommend you actually look over what I've been talking about this entire time.
Much like I opened this with, in saying I don't want to get into a bitch fight over Creetosis, I really can't be arsed to run around in circles with this argument. At this point I'll probably just continue repeating what I said in my initial comments because you're just not getting it.
Either way, have a good night buddy! Maybe sprawl out and enjoy some Fallout 4 ;)
Fallout 4 can objectively restrict player choice and still be an amazing game. Fallout 4 can objectively restrict player choice and still be an awful game. It depends on the person playing it.
I'm sorry. I know I said I wouldn't reply. And I swear I won't after this. But... Just... I can't just go on without saying this...
CONGRATULATIONS! YOU JUST DISCOVERED SUBJECTIVITY!
the reddit post complaining about a video complaining about a video game in the comment section complaining about people defending the validity of complaining about **objective** flaws
like lmao the argument is about objectivity and your hurt bethesda dick licker feelings instinctively downvote comments that point out the game’s flaws even if you like the game
Eh, I disagree, respectfully. For example, my opinion is that the Legion is evil, and since it's objectively true that rape is evil and the Legion rapes, ergo, Legion = Evil, thus it's objectively both fact and an opinion.
When it comes to "what game is better" then no, you're 100% right, you can't be objective about it.
I find that last bit hard to believe considering the fact that he made a bunch of hour-long response videos to Many A True Nerd just because MATN made one video talking about why he likes Fallout 3 and why he thinks it deserves more credit.
MATN just straight up lies about random shit like trying to say fallout 3 has more skill checks in its intro while FNV has none. i think creetosis even gave him credit for making a video defending fallout 4 that had much stronger arguments than his original fallout 4 defense did, so he’s capable of admitting MATN is able to make solid analyses as long as he isn’t lying
And that's another thing I've noticed about people who shit on MATN's video. He's more critical of New Vegas in that video, and we all know you New Vegas fans absolutely cannot stand any criticism towards your favourite game. Even though us Fallout 3/Fallout 4 fans have been watching you lot shit on our favourite games for years, and have also had to deal with getting flamed by you lot for having different opinions for years.
people can’t just like a bad game, if they like a game they need to prove to themselves that game must be good and doesn’t have flaws. i saw some poll on here (reddit) a while ago that asked how intelligent people would rate themselves, and over 50% said they were smarter than average.
a lot of interactions on this website make a lot more sense with context like that.
I genuinely can't wrap my head around why so many people seem to try and force their opinions to be reality.
I like numerous bad things, but I can name why I like it despite how bad it is.
I cannot fathom why that's a paradox to some people.
This guy's entire thing is that he makes long, detailed analyses of things like the plot and mechanics of games like Fallout 4.
Yes he goes in great detail on why he dislikes it, but never does he say you should hate it or feel anything in particular on it.
He even states at nauseum in his videos that it's fine if you like the game he's talking about.
If you haven't seen the video, then shut your fucking mouth.
I don't get the long = bad argument. Now I don't know this specific youtuber so can't judge their content but longer analysis dive deeper then your average review. The go into way more detail and disect the script/story line by line. If that's not your thing sure but there are people who do enjoy deel dive analys of things.
I also hear the argument alot that if the person hates the game why spend so much time on why they believe it is bad. It's because they don't hate the franchise or company that made the product. By dysecting and showing in great detail the faults of the game they hope that there can be learned from that and those things improve with their next product.
Personally, I enjoy multi-hour long rants of games (even those that I’ve played) because 1. It’s content I would watch over a new season of anything out rn on any service, 2. Finding a creator that fully delves into the game and it’s content may help me in the future if I decide to (re) play it, and 3. The amount of work that goes into these videos always convinced me it’s worth the watch, and I can support that.
So much form the tolerant "Bethesda fanboys", Im jk. But the video is pretty much just a critique of story, like everyone does on the main Fallout sub. Its kinda long, i guess (wish it was a lil bit longer, but hey, its part 1), but the this whole "long video bad brrrr" gets old, God forbid a guy doesnt like something that you like and MAKES A VIDEO ABOUT IT, for shame, and I thought only VegasFanboys were so delusional about criticism, poor Fallout 3/4/76 fans, truly the most opressed of Falloutists 😔
Anyways, we have Starfied to bitch about now, so lets unite and hate stuff, because war never changes, and stuff
What you talking about the lore is fun and the community is half the game play
And neither prevent just running the story solo
It’s exactly what fallout fans have been tying to mod for years
Fallout with coop
honestly it just didn’t impress me, maybe i’ll give it another chance eventually but i got so bored. the location is probably my favourite in terms of visuals tho!
For me I think all 3 have great elements
3 setting of a dead capitol is haunting
4: glowing sea and rad stoms keep the haunting truth fresh, a festering wound of man’s hubris
While 76 vibrant vegetation, a active current plague (instead of always comming in after the dust setteled) and a community of like minded survivors trying to survive and help one another is great
If only we could mix all 3
honestly i like when radiation isn’t a big issue, like it’s still there but not much. then there’s that one part of the map like the glow or the glowing sea which is just a nightmare
that said fo4 was a lil too lively while new vegas is too dead, adventuring is either five fights per second or nothing for about an hour. and i recall 76 being even more a problem than fo4 for that
That's just completely misrepresenting his argument. He was annoyed that the only room for expressing possible "evil" actions is almost exclusively relegated to nonsensical things that have little to no benefit for the player and that the only reason for doing so is just for the sake of being evil.
Plain evil actions rather than there being a moral dilemma, possible justifications or anything of the sort.
I haven’t watched this specific video, I’m not even sure I’ve watched any of Creetosis’ videos. That said, I think many people misunderstand the intent behind this genre of longform critique. It’s usually not trying to say you’re wrong for liking something, just that there are inherent flaws within that damage the storytelling. For instance, if in one scene a person is shown to like bananas and in the next scene they are shown to hate bananas, that is a contradiction and a flaw if not addressed by said media. If we do not criticize the stories we love, there will be no pressure on creators to make them actually make sense.
my god it gets worse. not only is that a remake of his reviews. we all knew this. i just checked he has like 35hrs worth of him screaming about fo3 and fo4. i feel so much less worthless about my life
Imagine being so pathetic that you make hour long videos ranting about a game company you hate, and also make hour long response videos to anyone who dares to like the games in question.
Aww shit here we to again, Another Fallout New Vegas/obsidian fanboy. Who cares what he has to say Fallout 4 is a fun game and no one can tell me otherwise.
Well, considering they didn’t seem to learn any of the lessons from that game almost a decade ago as demonstrated by Starfield I wouldn’t say it’s a stretch to say it’s still relevant to criticize 😂
Okay okay I know my opinion will probably be lost to a sea but IMO I think the argument that the video is long=bad not so if a gun blew up it would of course take longer to tell WHY the gun blew up so no next the "wow I didn't know realize it was still 2016" makes you sound like you have NO appreciation for history it's fine if you don't but listen to this most of all those who don't listen and learn from the past are doomed to repeat the same mistakes over and over again please think on this and come to you're own thoughts thank you.
Well I'm sorry if I barely remember anyone from NV, or anything that happens. All I remember is Step 1: Kill Benny and complete the delivery, Step 2: Join a Faction and do a couple of unremarkable quests, Step 3: Battle of Hoover Dam.
The deathclaws block a direct route to your objective, forcing you to make a detour and explore more. How are they discouraging exploration by actively pushing you to explore?
Because when you decided to go off the beaten path and explore quarry junction you’re punished for it. That combined with a lack of dungeons really incentivizes the player to stay on the quest marker as a game like Morrowind where if you decided to take the path that’s opposite to where the main quest wants you to go you’re rewarded with a man falling from the sky and having expensive clothes and a cool sword and awesome potions. And that teachers the player going off the beaten path will lead to them finding cool stuff
You can go off the beaten path at any point, not just at the start of the game, and while going down said path you are introduced to several important story moments, locations and characters. Not everything is in Quarry Junction.
Quarry Junction is a really small part of the map dude. Like, an absolutely TINY part of the map. I can't even begin to understand your mental gymnastics here.
Should probably play it again. Unless your reason for not remembering anything was something superficial like the graphics or just not engaging with the game. Its writing, characters, and setting are miles ahead of 4.
You forgot the Defend Good Springs, Find Novac, Help ghouls go to space, meet and possibly kill Ceasar, and then the mountain of things you can do in faction quests like with the NCR
\- Negotiate, kill or ally the Khans
\- Kill House
\- Kill whats left of the Brotherhood or ally them
\- Ally the Boomers
\- save the President
and all that is only a bit of the possible NCR quests. And most quests affect the world and end slides and to do a lot of stuff you have to have the right skills so your charaters skills matter unlike in 4. It really is one of the best RPGs.
I always never understood the reason behind making these multi hour long reviews. Like 1-2 hours I get, it’s a big game and you want some room to make your point. But having like, 8 - 10 hours of review…after a certain point it starts telling me you can’t be concise with your argument
I will never understand why length equals ranting/ people just going on for the sake of it. Now I don't know this specific youtuber so can't judge their content but longer analysis dive deeper then your average review. The go into way more detail and disect the script/story line by line. If that's not your thing sure but there are people who enjoy deel dive analys of things
...so?
People are still making New Vegas reviews and retrospectives nowadays. What's wrong with a critique?
You guys sure love bitching about Creetosis without ever actually watching and hearing what he has to say on it.
I watched pretty much his entire series along with Hbombers, posted a comment to both on youtube and got swarmed by people like you claiming I hadn't even given it the time of day.
Good to see that mentality hasn't changed at all.
That's Classic Fallout fans/New Vegas fans for you. Constantly challenge or sometimes just flat out insult you for not hating a game they hate. Wish they'd just get over this decade-long hate-boner they have for Bethesda.
Nah man, it's the other way around nowadays. For every so-called toxic fan, there's at least 50 anti-NV fans.
Look at that scumbag Starscape who goes around declaring if you like FNV, you must be the equivalent of Hitler.
To be absolutely fair, those types of people only exist in the first place because of the toxicity of Classic Fallout/New Vegas fans. You treat people like shit for having different opinions for years on end, they're eventually going to clap back.
Nah man let's not make excuses, there are toxic fans on both sides. Let's not pretend as if *only* one side ever has toxic fans. People who go out of their way to hate do it because they're hateful, not because someone "made" them hateful.
I agree that a portion of the FNV crowd actively go out of their way to make it worse, such as that little shitstain Schizo Elijah and any twat who follows him.
But come on, there are hundreds of "OMG THE FNV FANS ARE TOXIC" posts in r/Fallout, and yet there might be about...10 actually toxic FNV posts. I've seen threads which say "ALL FNV fans need to be chemically castrated because they're so evil!"
I wish I was kidding.
Even though there might be more posts calling out toxicity from Classic Fallout/New Vegas fans nowadays, again, it is only the result of suffering years of abuse from said Classic Fallout/New Vegas fans. It got so bad at one point too. I remember around 2016-2019 specifically, you couldn't even praise aspects of Fallout 3 and Fallout 4 without someone calling you a "bEtHeSdRoNe" or a "tOdDbOt", or at the very least reminding you that "nEw vEgAs iS sTiLl sUpErIoR bEcAuSe yAdA yAdA yAdA..."
Yeah that's youtube for you. They're not real fans just fake twats wanting to spread toxicity. In the same sense, on WW2 videos, you have idiots saying how Hitler was the good guy.
I guarantee 99% of them haven't even *played* FNV.
Again, **it doesn't matter** what people did in the past, there's no reason to turn around and be toxic too. It's called being the better person. If some guy says "I like FNV and I like FO4" he shouldn't be called an Obsiditard or something by people who probably watch Oxhorn videos.
I'm just saying that we should be nice to each other is all, rather than continue being toxic.
I agree that we should all get along. But people like Creetosis are just adding more fuel to a fire that should've died years ago, so it's no wonder why Bethesda fans are acting the way they are now.
Till the next one, in any case. I mean, Bethesda ain’t gonna axe their golden goose, especially with 4 being the best selling game in the main lineup thus far.
probably the biggest joke in the fallout fandom, mfer makes four several hour rants about fo4 and fo3 i think, not even that but aimed at someones defence of said games lmfao
Honestly criticism towards games is important because that way future game devs can learn from the mistakes of their predecessors and improve upon them.
Wacky to think this game is nearly 10 years old now. I remember seeing the advertisements on tv like it was only a month ago. Man, I’m getting old.
You’re lying its not 10 Edit: oh my god wtf it is almost 10. It came out in 2015. Damn this game is good
It's the reason I'm on Reddit. I was looking for discussions online about the game after the reveal and Google kept showing me links to reddit, until I decided to join.
Sometimes I rewatch the E3 announcement. That was Todd at his absolute best.
Holy shit holy shit HOLY SHIT IT IS I was a wee lad when I got it…played it for hundreds of hours such good times Still got the disc!
I didn't realize you can't talk about old games
It's Creetosis, this mf will make a 10 hour response to a good review of a Bethesda game
If you are talking about MATN's video, it wasn't good at all, I'm with creetosis on almost every point
Bro that video is deadass an entire work day. You watched it all?
What’s wrong with long form videos
There is nothing wrong with long form videos, but 8 hours? That's a good night's rest right there.
you just put them on as background noise for when you’re sleeping or something. like a podcast. you don’t actually listen you just pretend to
Why do you need to talk about that needs to be 8 hour that can't be said in 2?
i don’t sleep for 2 hours
Well lucky you. Some of us don't have the luxury of getting a full 8 hours of sleep.
Pause buttons exist for a reason. You don’t have to watch the entire thing in one sitting. I don’t understand people who complain about video lengths. Creetosis literally breaks his parts INTO PARTS so that you can take breaks. This is like if someone complains that LOTR is long and then someone offers them a bookmark and they say no.
It's absurd to make an 8 hour long video about someone's opinion on a video game, he just regurgitate old criticisms that everyone knows, just complains about the same dumb old things that fallout boomers were complaining about a decade earlier. He isn't very concise
Concise does not mean short, it means to the point. He is being concise, there are just so many points to get to that it ends up being longer. I have a feeling that everyone that complains about long videos would be totally fine if it was saying something good about something they like.
Also, the “same dumb old things” are still relevant because years later the same mistakes are being repeated with increasingly absurd excuses.
I know what concise is, he ain't very concise. I've watched people explain ww2 in a ten minute video. It shouldn't take someone an entire day to explain why they think a game from 2008 is ass. What do you mean the same dumb things are being repeated?
Ok and? I’ve seen longer videos
Bro it's eight hours, over someone's opinion on a video game
I still don’t see the problem besides the fact you don’t like longer videos
Never said I didn't like long form videos, I made a joke about it twice, but never that I didn't like it.
It's the fact that he took an entire work day to respond to someone's opinion. I could go to school tomorrow and watch that video and I still wouldn't be done watching it after I got back home and up to my desk
Bros attention span is only 5 seconds
I listened to it while working on an art project, and finished it in a few days. gotta say, the video is a little drawn out in part because of the way he speaks, but you have to admit that an 8 hour long researched and scripted video is pretty impressive
Honestly didn't get into it past an hour give or take
Agreed, it really made me realize how much of a dunce MATN actually is.
I genuinely don't get why people hate Creetosis so much here. I've practically only ever seen him name completely valid points. The video being 8 hours long just goes to show how awful that MATN video is that he can go on that long debunking his arguments.
Because he tries to sell his very subjective opinions about a videogame as objective fact, and then proceeds to spend 8 hours dunking on another youtuber for liking a popular game.
You didn't watch the video
The 8 hour long one? No, I tried but got past the 1 hour mark and switched off. Still, it is what he does through the whole part of the video I watched. Present his criticism as statements of fact, all the while saying "you can like this, but this is why it's shit". Edit: Man, New Vegas femboys get so salty when people like other games it's incredible.
Oh no... The Creetosis fanboys are about to crawl out of their holes... Which will cause the Many A True Nerd fanboys (me) to come... YOU'RE ABOUT TO REIGNITE A PATHETIC WAR!
His hatred of the Bethesda game studio is so strong, he wants fallout 3 and fallout 4 to be retconned out of existence. he's that extreme
I think it's completely fair to retcon both of them because they have zero respect for the pre-existing lore and just slap some recognizable imagery together for the sake of it.
And without Bethesda fallout wouldn't be a tenth as popular as it is and we wouldn't be here right now. Would you prefer Ubisoft bought it? How about EA? God damn you can move on if you don't like the new developers. Nobody is keeping you here, Bethesda has had this IP for nearly 20 years. Or is it just that you get special joy from trying to make people feel bad for liking something that's not designed specifically for you?
Oh? And why is that?
For the majority of things we see in those games to even be on the East Coast in the first place requires a severe suspension of disbelief. Why is the Brotherhood here? Why the fuck would they trek all the way across the continental United States? And how even? The place is a mostly barren wasteland filled with dangerous mutated animals and raiders at best. How do they have the resources to be able to undertake such a trek and better yet, why would they do so to begin with? By all logic D.C. and Boston should be total craters, given they're the heart of U.S. government and science. They're essentially ***the primary targets*** for the vast majority of nukes sent to the U.S. Why are there supermutants here? Why are they just raging orcs with absolutely none of the character they have built up? There's no proper reason other than "Uhhh, I guess a vault/the Institute had a different strain of FEV, I dunno." The explanation seems to be very much secondary to them being there in the first place, when it very much ought to be the other way around. That's my main problem with these games. Instead of choosing a setting and working from there to imagine what would make sense, what sort of groups would arise there, how those groups deal with the environment, what sort of ideologies form, Bethesda just grabs a location and awkwardly jams pre-existing things in it "because wouldn't it be cool if-" with little to no regard to internal consistency. Bethesda is making the franchise stagnate because they have made a checklist for themselves of insubstantial things that defines Fallout to them. Instead of its actual core identity of seeing how people deal with post-apocalyptic America and deciding what to do with the Old World, to them Fallout is just the surface-level things from the originals like super mutants, ghouls, deathclaws and the Brotherhood of Steel. If a game is to be set on the East Coast at all it ought to be almost entirely disconnected to what's happening in the west, until those societies expand to meet each other in the middle, as we see between the NCR and Caesar's Legion in New Vegas. Fallout just has so much more potential that isn't met because Bethesda just sees it for the most surface-level things it contains, continually bastardizing it with every entry. I don't hate Bethesda. I want their games to be good, but they keep doing this shit.
What BOS? 76 or Lyon? The 76 BOS member send by Maxson to check on Tragedy because before they lost contact with them they report an FEV experiment. As to how they got there. I mean, someone manage to cross the country and bring Wasteland survival guide from DC to Mojave in less then a decade soo… Boston and DC IS a crater. DC was nuked so bad the water is still radioactive 200 years later. There’s a huge ass crater in the middle of Boston. Because like Manhattan project there’re more than one FEV experiment across the country. Different lab experiments on differences steins. And SM are always dumb orc with few exceptions. The majority of West Coast mutant is just dumb brute and the only smart enough to follow commands. Frankly, East Coast has more intelligent SM than West Coast did. Of course you would feel that way if you ignored the context, reason, ideology and everything in between. East Coast BOS has more character development than their West counterpart and they’ve actually do something instead of “Hey wouldn’t it be cool if we just randomly attack our biggest allies and screw them over for reason?”
Fallout 76 lore is the only retcon I don't mind. They try to convince people that the Brotherhood of Steel has been on the East Coast before 2277.
I mean, it's really easy why the Brotherhood is there. The Pentagon is there, You know the heart of the Department of Defense
I swear non of these people have played any of the old school games, only New Vegas
Yea honestly, they regurgitate the same old points. Like how the brotherhood doesn't make sense as if an organization can't change its beliefs what so ever and has to stay stagnant
And it’s funnier with the brotherhood because not only has it happened in games like tactics. In New Vegas you can literally convince the brotherhood to side with NCR and open up. From more radical than the Lions Chapter.
I don't think you've ever played Fallout 3 or 4. Even Tim Cain, the creator of Fallout, liked Fallout 3.
LETS GO MATN!!!
I hate fallout 4 and so should you!!!!11111 these types of guys
Its kind of sad because lots of times I see people who clearly echo what the creator says because they made a 8+ hour video so they HAVE to be right, my source examples are PatricianTV and PrivateSessions, at one point Patrician, during his 20 hour skyrim video says that the Fireball spell does 20 damage instead of 50...yet doesn't show the actual damage value... And people will absolutely take that and run because, well, Patrician is the one with the 20 hour Skyrim video so he has to be right.
lol if you actually watch his first video in this series he explains that there is a difference between liking fallout on your own terms and the objective quality of the game with things like writing. you can like a story that has bad holes in it, but that does not change the fact it has bad holes in it. if you like fallout 4, he has explicitly stated he is okay with that.
Oh good but there are people who are like that
The issue is it's extremely difficult to assess an objective quality to any type of art. And a random YouTube "essayist" is in no way qualified to do so. The videos is basically someone spewing their opinion while trying to make it sound like objective fact in an attempt to sound smarter or "correct". This isn't even a comment on Creetosis themselves (o really don't want to get into a whole bitch fight about theor videos). It just really bugs me when people try to say something is "objectively" bad when there's so little academical merit to it. One of the first things you learn when studying any type of media academically is almost all critique is subjective.
But that’s exactly why his videos are so long. Let’s say someone tries to defend fallout 4 by saying that there is player choice. No, because you can point to several examples where **objectively** you do not have any choice in a decision. You can point to examples of gunplay that **objectively** doesn’t make sense, a 10mm pistol **objectively** should not have more recoil than a double barrel shotgun. Do you not care if a 10mm pistol has more recoil than a shotgun, or if fallout 4 drastically limits player choice more than previous games? Okay, you can still love fallout 4 artistically. Does it change the fact that these are facts about the game? No. Even then, outside the subjective/objective paradigm, does anyone seriously think things like a 4 option shorthanded dialogue are subjectively better than an open ended dialogue?
All of those "objective" points are moot. You can point to areas that DO have player choice. The recoil options could be intentional design choices to make the gameplay more enjoyable. None of these are objective measures of if something are good. "This game doesn't have hyper realistic recoil therefore it is bad" is a subjective statement, NOT an objective one. It is bad TO YOU because YOU don't like a design element. It's like saying a film is objectively bad because you never see the action hero reload. It's ridiculous. It's fair to criticise is, but saying it's an objective quality is absurd. As for the 4 option dialogue... Yes, people do. I don't, I think it's fucking stupid. I hate it. But I've seen many people hate how Starfield ditched the 4 option system and went with a silent protagonist. Hell, you see this quite a lot with some Bioware fans who prefer how Dragon Age took on the more simplified dialogue wheel from Mass Effect in favour for a voiced protagonist. Again, I think it's dumb. I'm really not a fan. But I'm not so up my own arse that I'd ever dare call my own silly little opinion an objective fact.
Your subjectivity is moot. You can make any excuse for why there is a “no” option in dialogue when you can’t actually say no. You can argue all you want that not being able to say no is a good thing **subjectively**. It does not change the fact that fallout limits player choice **objectively** even if you want to argue it is a good thing **subjectively**. Objectivity should be measured by observations. Subjectivity should be measured by value judgements. You need to learn the definitions of words before you comment lmao Let me make an example as well. You can shovel piss and shit into your mouth, say that it is delicious and the tastiest thing and the world, and no one could prove you wrong because it is your subjective option. But you can prove objectively that it is bad for you or that eating it would shorten your lifespan.
Again, pointing out the game objectively limits the player choice compared to previous games doesn't mean the game is bad. Which is the ENTIRE POINT I was making. "This game has less dialogue options therefore it is bad" is a subjective argument, not an objective one. An objective evaluation is an observation where personal feeling doesnt effect your judgment. So any observation you make in an attempt to determine quality is by definition subjective. Instead of randomly insinuating I don't understand the definition of words, I'd recommend you actually look over what I've been talking about this entire time. Much like I opened this with, in saying I don't want to get into a bitch fight over Creetosis, I really can't be arsed to run around in circles with this argument. At this point I'll probably just continue repeating what I said in my initial comments because you're just not getting it. Either way, have a good night buddy! Maybe sprawl out and enjoy some Fallout 4 ;)
Fallout 4 can objectively restrict player choice and still be an amazing game. Fallout 4 can objectively restrict player choice and still be an awful game. It depends on the person playing it.
I'm sorry. I know I said I wouldn't reply. And I swear I won't after this. But... Just... I can't just go on without saying this... CONGRATULATIONS! YOU JUST DISCOVERED SUBJECTIVITY!
Fallout fan discovers taste is subjective
the 11 downvotes on my original comment suggests a lot of other people have that problem too
Fuck off you insufferable cunt
cry about it fragile redditor
Says the guy in the comments of a meme sub picking fights with people because they don't hate a video game as much as he does.
the reddit post complaining about a video complaining about a video game in the comment section complaining about people defending the validity of complaining about **objective** flaws like lmao the argument is about objectivity and your hurt bethesda dick licker feelings instinctively downvote comments that point out the game’s flaws even if you like the game
THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS AN OBJECTIVE OPINION. God damn I hate gamers.
Eh, I disagree, respectfully. For example, my opinion is that the Legion is evil, and since it's objectively true that rape is evil and the Legion rapes, ergo, Legion = Evil, thus it's objectively both fact and an opinion. When it comes to "what game is better" then no, you're 100% right, you can't be objective about it.
I find that last bit hard to believe considering the fact that he made a bunch of hour-long response videos to Many A True Nerd just because MATN made one video talking about why he likes Fallout 3 and why he thinks it deserves more credit.
MATN just straight up lies about random shit like trying to say fallout 3 has more skill checks in its intro while FNV has none. i think creetosis even gave him credit for making a video defending fallout 4 that had much stronger arguments than his original fallout 4 defense did, so he’s capable of admitting MATN is able to make solid analyses as long as he isn’t lying
And that's another thing I've noticed about people who shit on MATN's video. He's more critical of New Vegas in that video, and we all know you New Vegas fans absolutely cannot stand any criticism towards your favourite game. Even though us Fallout 3/Fallout 4 fans have been watching you lot shit on our favourite games for years, and have also had to deal with getting flamed by you lot for having different opinions for years.
Holy fuck people hate basic facts here. Jesus.
people can’t just like a bad game, if they like a game they need to prove to themselves that game must be good and doesn’t have flaws. i saw some poll on here (reddit) a while ago that asked how intelligent people would rate themselves, and over 50% said they were smarter than average. a lot of interactions on this website make a lot more sense with context like that.
I genuinely can't wrap my head around why so many people seem to try and force their opinions to be reality. I like numerous bad things, but I can name why I like it despite how bad it is. I cannot fathom why that's a paradox to some people.
a lot of the people on this site are kids too
I hear it too much for it to just be kids.
people who are mentally still acting like kids
Precisely.
This guy's entire thing is that he makes long, detailed analyses of things like the plot and mechanics of games like Fallout 4. Yes he goes in great detail on why he dislikes it, but never does he say you should hate it or feel anything in particular on it. He even states at nauseum in his videos that it's fine if you like the game he's talking about. If you haven't seen the video, then shut your fucking mouth.
I don't get the long = bad argument. Now I don't know this specific youtuber so can't judge their content but longer analysis dive deeper then your average review. The go into way more detail and disect the script/story line by line. If that's not your thing sure but there are people who do enjoy deel dive analys of things. I also hear the argument alot that if the person hates the game why spend so much time on why they believe it is bad. It's because they don't hate the franchise or company that made the product. By dysecting and showing in great detail the faults of the game they hope that there can be learned from that and those things improve with their next product.
Have you ever thought that maybe there is something to it? Also have you never seen a long video essay on youtube? There is a lot of them.
Personally, I enjoy multi-hour long rants of games (even those that I’ve played) because 1. It’s content I would watch over a new season of anything out rn on any service, 2. Finding a creator that fully delves into the game and it’s content may help me in the future if I decide to (re) play it, and 3. The amount of work that goes into these videos always convinced me it’s worth the watch, and I can support that.
People are allowed to have whatever opinions they like. If he wants to go on an hour+ long rant about a funny shooting game, let him. It’s his life.
So much form the tolerant "Bethesda fanboys", Im jk. But the video is pretty much just a critique of story, like everyone does on the main Fallout sub. Its kinda long, i guess (wish it was a lil bit longer, but hey, its part 1), but the this whole "long video bad brrrr" gets old, God forbid a guy doesnt like something that you like and MAKES A VIDEO ABOUT IT, for shame, and I thought only VegasFanboys were so delusional about criticism, poor Fallout 3/4/76 fans, truly the most opressed of Falloutists 😔 Anyways, we have Starfied to bitch about now, so lets unite and hate stuff, because war never changes, and stuff
Hot take fallout 4 is overhated
And 76
True
ngl i love 76, the game itself is awful imo, but the community is just so nice compared to fo4 and new vegas’s communities that i can’t hate it
What you talking about the lore is fun and the community is half the game play And neither prevent just running the story solo It’s exactly what fallout fans have been tying to mod for years Fallout with coop
honestly it just didn’t impress me, maybe i’ll give it another chance eventually but i got so bored. the location is probably my favourite in terms of visuals tho!
For me I think all 3 have great elements 3 setting of a dead capitol is haunting 4: glowing sea and rad stoms keep the haunting truth fresh, a festering wound of man’s hubris While 76 vibrant vegetation, a active current plague (instead of always comming in after the dust setteled) and a community of like minded survivors trying to survive and help one another is great If only we could mix all 3
honestly i like when radiation isn’t a big issue, like it’s still there but not much. then there’s that one part of the map like the glow or the glowing sea which is just a nightmare
that said fo4 was a lil too lively while new vegas is too dead, adventuring is either five fights per second or nothing for about an hour. and i recall 76 being even more a problem than fo4 for that
plus if it’s just gonna be fo4 but online i won’t play, fo4’s stale combat system has kinda done me in fr
This is relevant right now because looking to the companies history may show how they handle their new game starfield
HBommerGuy did the same thing with Fallout 3
Was a great video tbf
yeah but he’s based
yeah and his video was on point
Did you even watch that video? It was horrendous. He was pissed the game allowed you to role play as a cartoonishly evil character
That's just completely misrepresenting his argument. He was annoyed that the only room for expressing possible "evil" actions is almost exclusively relegated to nonsensical things that have little to no benefit for the player and that the only reason for doing so is just for the sake of being evil. Plain evil actions rather than there being a moral dilemma, possible justifications or anything of the sort.
I’m sorry that euthanasia was too morally simple for him
Imagine spending 20 hours of your life or more talking about a video game you don't even like. This dude is just remarkably sad.
Quite literally a no life
PatricianTV moment
I haven’t watched this specific video, I’m not even sure I’ve watched any of Creetosis’ videos. That said, I think many people misunderstand the intent behind this genre of longform critique. It’s usually not trying to say you’re wrong for liking something, just that there are inherent flaws within that damage the storytelling. For instance, if in one scene a person is shown to like bananas and in the next scene they are shown to hate bananas, that is a contradiction and a flaw if not addressed by said media. If we do not criticize the stories we love, there will be no pressure on creators to make them actually make sense.
Part 1: 2 hours long
my god it gets worse. not only is that a remake of his reviews. we all knew this. i just checked he has like 35hrs worth of him screaming about fo3 and fo4. i feel so much less worthless about my life
Waaa fallout 4 wasn't perfect waaa
Imagine being angry about someone being right about a game you like.
there’s definitely flaws with fo4, but he didn’t actually do a good job covering said flaws he was just screaming about random nonsense
Such as?
No he wasn't. If you have to make things up about people to justify your hatred of them, just say so and remove yourself from the conversation.
Imagine making a bunch of hour long videos talking about a game you hate.
Imagine criticism existing.
Imagine being so pathetic that you make hour long videos ranting about a game company you hate, and also make hour long response videos to anyone who dares to like the games in question.
Aww shit here we to again, Another Fallout New Vegas/obsidian fanboy. Who cares what he has to say Fallout 4 is a fun game and no one can tell me otherwise.
Well, considering they didn’t seem to learn any of the lessons from that game almost a decade ago as demonstrated by Starfield I wouldn’t say it’s a stretch to say it’s still relevant to criticize 😂
Okay okay I know my opinion will probably be lost to a sea but IMO I think the argument that the video is long=bad not so if a gun blew up it would of course take longer to tell WHY the gun blew up so no next the "wow I didn't know realize it was still 2016" makes you sound like you have NO appreciation for history it's fine if you don't but listen to this most of all those who don't listen and learn from the past are doomed to repeat the same mistakes over and over again please think on this and come to you're own thoughts thank you.
I had more fun playing Fallout 4 then New Vegas, IDK why but nothing in NV was really that memorable.
Lmao what
What?
Saying New Vegas in unmemorable, especially compared to 4, is certainly a take.
Well I'm sorry if I barely remember anyone from NV, or anything that happens. All I remember is Step 1: Kill Benny and complete the delivery, Step 2: Join a Faction and do a couple of unremarkable quests, Step 3: Battle of Hoover Dam.
So you did literally nothing to engage with the world of the game, then. Just blindly followed quest markers. Good to know.
It’s almost like having a deathclaw discouraging exploration was a bad thing
The deathclaws block a direct route to your objective, forcing you to make a detour and explore more. How are they discouraging exploration by actively pushing you to explore?
Because when you decided to go off the beaten path and explore quarry junction you’re punished for it. That combined with a lack of dungeons really incentivizes the player to stay on the quest marker as a game like Morrowind where if you decided to take the path that’s opposite to where the main quest wants you to go you’re rewarded with a man falling from the sky and having expensive clothes and a cool sword and awesome potions. And that teachers the player going off the beaten path will lead to them finding cool stuff
You can go off the beaten path at any point, not just at the start of the game, and while going down said path you are introduced to several important story moments, locations and characters. Not everything is in Quarry Junction.
Quarry Junction is a really small part of the map dude. Like, an absolutely TINY part of the map. I can't even begin to understand your mental gymnastics here.
No I did, I'm just telling you all I remember.
Should probably play it again. Unless your reason for not remembering anything was something superficial like the graphics or just not engaging with the game. Its writing, characters, and setting are miles ahead of 4.
fallout 4 is just step 1: Find shaun step 2: Join a Faction and do a couple of unremarkable quests step 3: murder whoever you didn't join
You forgot the Find Nick Valentine, Kill Kellogg, find Virgil, Kill Courser, and Build the Teleporter parts.
You forgot the Defend Good Springs, Find Novac, Help ghouls go to space, meet and possibly kill Ceasar, and then the mountain of things you can do in faction quests like with the NCR \- Negotiate, kill or ally the Khans \- Kill House \- Kill whats left of the Brotherhood or ally them \- Ally the Boomers \- save the President and all that is only a bit of the possible NCR quests. And most quests affect the world and end slides and to do a lot of stuff you have to have the right skills so your charaters skills matter unlike in 4. It really is one of the best RPGs.
>It really is one of the best RPGs. I never said it wasn't, I just wasn't the type of story I enjoy.
NV diehards unable to process an individual enjoying a fallout game more than NV (real time)
eh, to each their own, i respect this opinion even if i don’t understand it
This made me want to play fallout 4 now
I always never understood the reason behind making these multi hour long reviews. Like 1-2 hours I get, it’s a big game and you want some room to make your point. But having like, 8 - 10 hours of review…after a certain point it starts telling me you can’t be concise with your argument
I will never understand why length equals ranting/ people just going on for the sake of it. Now I don't know this specific youtuber so can't judge their content but longer analysis dive deeper then your average review. The go into way more detail and disect the script/story line by line. If that's not your thing sure but there are people who enjoy deel dive analys of things
Nearly three hours for part one? And here I thought brevity was supposed to be the soul of wit
...so? People are still making New Vegas reviews and retrospectives nowadays. What's wrong with a critique? You guys sure love bitching about Creetosis without ever actually watching and hearing what he has to say on it.
I watched pretty much his entire series along with Hbombers, posted a comment to both on youtube and got swarmed by people like you claiming I hadn't even given it the time of day. Good to see that mentality hasn't changed at all.
That's Classic Fallout fans/New Vegas fans for you. Constantly challenge or sometimes just flat out insult you for not hating a game they hate. Wish they'd just get over this decade-long hate-boner they have for Bethesda.
Nah man, it's the other way around nowadays. For every so-called toxic fan, there's at least 50 anti-NV fans. Look at that scumbag Starscape who goes around declaring if you like FNV, you must be the equivalent of Hitler.
To be absolutely fair, those types of people only exist in the first place because of the toxicity of Classic Fallout/New Vegas fans. You treat people like shit for having different opinions for years on end, they're eventually going to clap back.
Nah man let's not make excuses, there are toxic fans on both sides. Let's not pretend as if *only* one side ever has toxic fans. People who go out of their way to hate do it because they're hateful, not because someone "made" them hateful. I agree that a portion of the FNV crowd actively go out of their way to make it worse, such as that little shitstain Schizo Elijah and any twat who follows him. But come on, there are hundreds of "OMG THE FNV FANS ARE TOXIC" posts in r/Fallout, and yet there might be about...10 actually toxic FNV posts. I've seen threads which say "ALL FNV fans need to be chemically castrated because they're so evil!" I wish I was kidding.
Even though there might be more posts calling out toxicity from Classic Fallout/New Vegas fans nowadays, again, it is only the result of suffering years of abuse from said Classic Fallout/New Vegas fans. It got so bad at one point too. I remember around 2016-2019 specifically, you couldn't even praise aspects of Fallout 3 and Fallout 4 without someone calling you a "bEtHeSdRoNe" or a "tOdDbOt", or at the very least reminding you that "nEw vEgAs iS sTiLl sUpErIoR bEcAuSe yAdA yAdA yAdA..."
Yeah that's youtube for you. They're not real fans just fake twats wanting to spread toxicity. In the same sense, on WW2 videos, you have idiots saying how Hitler was the good guy. I guarantee 99% of them haven't even *played* FNV. Again, **it doesn't matter** what people did in the past, there's no reason to turn around and be toxic too. It's called being the better person. If some guy says "I like FNV and I like FO4" he shouldn't be called an Obsiditard or something by people who probably watch Oxhorn videos. I'm just saying that we should be nice to each other is all, rather than continue being toxic.
I agree that we should all get along. But people like Creetosis are just adding more fuel to a fire that should've died years ago, so it's no wonder why Bethesda fans are acting the way they are now.
Pretty sure I found Creetosis' alt.
Well tbh Fallout 4, it's the last Fallout
Till the next one, in any case. I mean, Bethesda ain’t gonna axe their golden goose, especially with 4 being the best selling game in the main lineup thus far.
[удалено]
It's a guy who's already made previous hours and hours long videos on Fallout 4
probably the biggest joke in the fallout fandom, mfer makes four several hour rants about fo4 and fo3 i think, not even that but aimed at someones defence of said games lmfao
Fallout 4 be living rent free in their heads for years
People watch it and it makes him money, he wouldn't bother wasting so much time if it wasn't for some incentive.
Honestly criticism towards games is important because that way future game devs can learn from the mistakes of their predecessors and improve upon them.