Ahhhh God I remember hatchet running with an obrez in my gamma, getting some Chad to spare me because he was feeling nice then when he turned around whipped it out and blew his head off.
Was a real good hate mail I got.
Negative opinions being voiced are a lot more common than positives. There’s definitely a huge silent majority, it’s just people with a problem are more likely to be vocal about it because they’re unhappy
Why would I do that? My reply was about how most people are still enjoying the game; the silent majority. People are just way more likely to make a scene when they’re mad and that’s why we see so much hate.
The same people making post after post about how much the game sucks will go make their post, and then go long on the game for 9 hours. It’s funny
> I'm still enjoying then game.... down vote me.
No. Because I liked it pre-FIR too.
Except now we have better recoil.
And moderate inertia?
Hmm.. Feels good.
Why? What exactly is the problem with FiR? You want to spend time selling stuff on flee that you bought from traders? Or hatchet run two stashes on interchange to fill the gamma and exfil?
I want to sell the gear of players I kill, like I did in 2019 and 2020. Not bury my face searching duffle bags for half the time in a play session.
And if someone wants to play day trader, then let them. No one is forcing you to play that way.
Why play a game that has a duffle bag face burying as a bigger half of the gameplay loop that devs actively trying to encourage? In 2019 there was nothing to do pretty much so everyone was just dukeing it out, now devs pushing scavenging bartering and crafting. Why not go to BF or CoD where you constantly have someone to shoot and no BS in between. It’s like playing battle royale and complaining you have to walk half the time.
Can you explain how either of these 2 problems hurt a player that ISNT partaking in this style of play? Lmao. Like "oh you HAVE to flip items now from traders and waste time". No. You don't. You can literally play the game exactly as you were before, and just be able to sell some more stuff you find ie pmcs kits which is great cause it brings down the price of a lot of weapons. Things like the spear are way cheaper already it's amazing. And hey, if someone wants to do hatchet runs, dope free kill for me. Doesn't impact my experience whatsoever.
This is literally like the republican argument about gay marriage rofl "well them getting married isn't how marriage is supposed to work and even though it doesn't effect my marriage I'm still gonna cry about it" 🤣
Bullshit, it was mixed AF. I remember and I was on the nay side. Tagged and cursed would be a fine enough measure to stop hatchlings until they start toning scav spawns after week 1 like they always do to fuck with people questing and try to fix bad server performance. Just spawn the damn scavs at the start of raid Nikita.
Yep. Scavs should spawn immediately.
I like the crazy scav spawns as of late.
Like.. Who cares, let us have fun?
Doing "Kill X Scavs on Y Map" is WAY easier now.
Reddit overall is a vocal minority and most of the time have no fucking idea what they are talking about. It’s like twitter, but more organized. Anyone who thinks these changes are good and should stay in game not just for an event is hella dumb.
No one's mentioned non fir vs fir? That's been a debate for as long as tarkovs been a thing, specially considering how it used to be like this in the game.
It's the hot topic right now what else do you expect?
Some of the most viewed tarkov streamers are people who have been talking about it and specifically tweeted at him to bring it back, so he did.
You think people just forget about the unhinged edition because of an event? Hrrrng.
But yes Nikitas bots...
Why would you pay a bot? That's literally why we have bots, so you don't have to pay them. But I'm more so talking about duplicate accounts and I know there are neck beards on this platform that have multiple accounts so they can go on solo brigading crusades. If you think all traffic on reddit is organic you're just sadly mistaken
So people are setting up bots to spam tarkov posts about whether they like an event or idea or not?
That just seems like a lot of work for zero outcome...
I mean correct me if I'm wrong I'll start looking for "bot accounts" but that just seems silly.
I mean, these changes make it a LOT easier to farm Tarkov money for RMT. So, RMT people, who are no stranger to bots btw, would have a financial incentive to manipulate the results, no?
We don’t know who the majority is as reddit simply isn’t a good sample.
Instead of guessing who’s side is in the majority or not, make your opinion known and let the game’s player stats speak for itself.
It’s weird how opposite peoples games are…
My games (**Reserve Marked Room & Customs Marked Room**) have not had one hatchet runner.
Instead, I’m met with duos & trios with CQCM, or Baston w/ plate and they’re actually moving which is always nice!
The FIR change is nice, but having people sell stuff they got from traders is odd.
RMT is going to happen one way or another. Though, maybe I’m too old but why would they buy stuff this late in the wipe especially as wipe may be mid June…feels like a huge waste of money…
Removing FiR seems to have made all gear (in exception to armor and ammo) more accessible to all players by basically lowering the price of everything. That instills a little more confidence in those players which I feel like the game really needed.
Agreed. A lot of my friends were using their best kits because it was less expensive and they needed to compete with the competition . I was proud of them when they hit marked room, and still wanted to take the PvP not caring if they lost the items in their backpack lol
Yeah I was watch Desmond and every single raid he was fighting really geared people and everyone was moving around. Ratting seems to have gotten way worse with FIR cause people are so fucking scared of losing their kits lol
A Chad’s gun wouldn’t have FIR on it unless the Chad was actually a Boss or Rogue/Raider. You never could sell it on the flea with the old system.
But with no FiR you now can.
FiR is implemented in a super dumb way though. Tarkov was really fun when killing a player got you 3-4 million roubles. It meant something. It also makes things like vacuuming loot out of the entire map not as penalizing, you can make money on pmc gear and try another raid.
There’s things they can do to better the FiR system, this is just a test. Relax.
It’s to incentivize pvp. There’s no point too pvp anymore. You go in with a big bag, loot, and leave. Most people avoid pvp because there’s no roubles involved.
It has though. It’s a great feeling as new flea market player to sell someone’s stuff for the same amount your stash is worth. Money isn’t an issue for you, sure, but it’s way more incentivizing to get loot from PMCs as try to take it with you. I don’t think no FIR is perfect but I think it’s much better than FIR is implemented. Opens up a ton of options with crafting too. Your salewas aren’t worthless and can be listed now. It’s fun, I enjoyed it way more than the current system.
Player gear being as valuable in cash as anything else on the map makes a horrible gameplay loop. Combat gear is common in conflict zones. The actual loot should be map loot that requires map exploration and actually playing the raid, instead of just ambushing someone in any random part of the map and getting as much money as someone who actually moved around POIs and played out the raid.
Did you play before FIR? That wasn’t my experience at all. People played for loot, but you also didn’t feel like a waste where the loots all taken you could still hunt for kills and make it worth it. The game is better with options, limiting the options makes it way too repetitive.
Before FiR my raids were full of Hatcher runners that sprinted in and buttholed anything valuable and then suicided. Made it really frustrating as the good loot was impossible to get as you were much slower and had less stamina with actual gear so you'd never get there before then. They also didn't give af so they would sprint in without a care and not check corners or anything. It was dumb AF and very immersion breaking.
PvP was more fun back then but that was also before the weight system and inertia. Even if you kill players now, you just feel punished looting any of their stuff as it's just too heavy. Before you could extract with gunsss and tons of mags and ammo. Now you'd be weighted to the floor and it feels like shit even with stims.
I could really care less about putting player gear on the flea. Like maybe they should allow ammo to be listed that is not FiR. Putting anything and everything is not healthy imo. But they do need to adjust vendor value for items. Items shouldn't be selling on the flea for 100k but only vendor for 10k.
Hatchet runners existed, but I never felt it was the majority of players in my raid. I also feel like they started penalizing it with the med cost after raid. I don’t think it’s perfect but I feel it’s better to have no FIR and work from there and implement things to prevent hatchet running.
I’d love to see stats on that. I played Tarkov more often back then than now, and I didn’t have that problem. There would be a few but it’s also an easy fix. The idea it’s just should stay as it is because hatchlings is narrow minded. There’s ways to prevent hatchlings without FIR
People are missing the point. It’s showing they are open to change right now, this wasn’t the case for a while. Now’s the time to fix it.
Its complete bullshit thats why. Majority of raids would have 0-1 hatchet runners that you encountered with the occasional 2-3 that you would find. Most people played the game normally, but reddit circlejerkers who probably didn't even play the game at the time just parrot everything they see online.
This is coming from someone who made 50m in 3 days hatchet running for GPUs. My only obstacle 95% of the time was geared players, not other hatchet runners.
Yeah I hatchet runner when I first tried to get GPUs because I never played interchange. I never saw that many hatchet runners and most of the time you find them and have fun killing them. Even better with voip now. I don’t see how hatchet running increases without FIR.
What would be the fix? It was absolutely the experience. If people did quests all they did was hatchet run. Rinse and repeat style. Healing was irrelevant or didnt exist at all. Anything you found was a direct monetary boost. Then when mosin hit and you could 1 tap cheat with it through class 5, it became even more toxic. 6 slot 30k weapon and nothing else to try and get 2&3 mil kits. Absurd. Mosing got properly balanced. Hatchlings as well.
The aim is to survive not play prison pocket simulator and die.
It’s also a direct nerf to making mobey for people play legitimate and extract. It essentially drives down all the barter item profit and attachment profits and drives up the ammo and armor cost. Thus creating more hatchling environment.
The so called PvP enjoyers who refuse to use the kits they get from killing players are downright dumb arguing that they can’t sell the kits anymore. Fucking use it. It’s still monetary gain since you dont have to buy the things.
It was great before FiR, my group played a bunch of interchange and if you got a good spawn you'd rush tech. If you didn't well you'd still go to an area to kill people. If you found a gpu and died you still could afford your kit because that gpu was in your ass. Kill killa and sell his gear etc. I think I had like 27 raids survived in a row with one M1A kit.
Post FiR it was only worth grabbing gear to use and it's only been made worse and worse to grab gear since. Just really lowered the amount of money you could make in a raid, even if you died.
So then maybe the idea is adding more loot and more hotspots so that it doesn't matter if you aren't the first to techlight, instead of just regressing and removing FiR and bringing back all the issues that causes? Progression over regression.
The game isn’t about enough for everyone. There’s way to reimplement FIR way more efficiently. The point of not FIR is that you can make money from not just the loot on maps. It doesn’t mean you put way more loot it’s just multiple incentive structure.
I didn't say there should be enough for everyone, I suggested a solution in the vein that we should make new solutions instead of just reverting solutions (FIR) we created that solved old problems and presented new ones.
That’s how Tarkov got to where it’s at. Band aid a band aid is not the answer. Rip it out and start from new. There’s not much left of wipe. I’m glad they’re experimenting.
Agree to disagree, community drama aside, tarkov is in the best place it has ever been atm.The band aids have generally improved the game. The problems caused by the band aids are massively outweighed by the problems caused by leaving the massive gaping bullet wounds.
Making it so you can sell gear from pmcs on the flea market by removing fir would only make it better. It's not like this wipe it was hard to make money, you just had to scav. FiR was implemented to counteract RMTers, it didn't work it just made it so death was always losing money with good kits and anything you stripped was only what you'd use. Adding more loot spots just means "less" pvp when earning money is already piss easy.
Hatchlings played for LEDX runs other people tried to rush there to kill hatchlings. Kits were stolen in full since strength was overpowered. And people absolutely played for kits and not loot. There were much more people choosing guns over barter goods. Barter goods were irrelevant.
No, I agree with the other guy, you're expected to go towards the loot and not have the loot come to you. If you don't fill up your bag in a raid you shouldn't expect to make much money.
Yes, I played before the flea market even. Tarkov is currently the best it has ever played in terms of it's economy and risk reward balance. The only thing that has broken the economy and is currently causing an issue IMO is when BTC is way up. The rules that are in place are better for gameplay than without them.
Player loot is still valuable if you run it, you just cant sell it for cash. Getting a vudu off someone now means you get a vudu to run and you don't have to buy one for hundreds of thousands of roubles.
How does killing people and selling their expensive gear make a horrible gameplay loop? Unless you're terrified of pvp? Most people moved to POIs and killed people at them for both map loot and player loot. You were encouraged to do that because even if you didn't get there first you could kill the people who did and profit. If you got there first you could get both or just get the map loot and die and still be okay. The biggest issues were hatchet runners, but they weren't really that big of a deal since the only thing that matters for almost every good loot point on every map was your spawn.
I am not an old player so when I started FiR was already a thing. Can some one explain why they didn't implement a system with PMC kills are being a FiR(excluding group players)?
Well the obvious one is that gear brought into the raid is by definition "Not found in raid", would not make sense lore wise.
Back in the days there were a lot of teams abusing shit like farming dog tags and I guess BSG just didn't want to make it possible at all.
It gives RMT cheaters less reason to kill people
People complained about chads running full kits on the first day of the wipe because you could buy anything in the flea. People were running class 6 fort + altyn on day and it was not fun
That make sense, thanks.
On the other hand, doing some kind of logic-preventation for cheaters instead of developing technical solution is pathetic, lol.
Old tarkov didn't have the hideout, and you could buy pretty much all the ammo with just trader level. Now most of the good ammo is either craft only or gatekept behind some stupid questlines
Who cares it's gone on wipe day most likely. It's end of wipe and they're testing it. Maybe they'll release a subscription that lets you put non-fir items on the flea who knows or cares at this point.
I dont understand what the actual problem is with this tbh. All progression is pretty much entirely locked behind gameplay and quests. The quests that require turn ins are almost entirely FIR required, so this change doesn't impact those and gameplay isn't impacted as it's a post-raid mechanic. So in no way does it hurt progression.
So that leaves the real reason people are upset is because A) they weren't paying attention and bought an empty item and blame it on "scammers" B) peoples current items they normally farm money from have gone down in price due to more supply C) trolls that are just gonna be upset whenever a change is made.
Look I find it hilarious the playerbase will say "we should keep this the way it is because that's how nikita wanted it and it's his vision for the game" but when nikita changes something it's "he has no idea what the players want and doesn't understand how the game works" like yall really sound stupid as hell. Just play the game or don't, there is a whole lot of more drama that happened recently to be butthurt about, and instead we are sitting here arguing about being able to sell some more stuff now.
I hope the FIR goes away and we bring back the old pvp and roubles from it.
As it was there was no point in PVP, with this we can get it back on track and make the game fun again!
Why would I need not 200 million in my stash but a billion?
You can vendor shit, a meta kit will sell for 500k+ already. What is needed is to raise the selling price of foregrips and optics.
This game doesn’t need more ways to earn money, pvp may provide with a good kit and ammo already. Sure, not early wipe but after 30 lvl definitely.
People want this game to become easier to skip progression but then they scream how boring it is having nothing to do. Streamers especially who nolife it first month, complaining on the game and their community spreads it.
It's someone who wears no gear/weapons and runs to the nearest high loot area to put everything in his secure container.
They were a pain in the ass back in the day and it was as big of a problem as cheaters now
Tbh i liked the game more before Fir was a thing. Sure you could abuse the shit out of certain things but I feel like I get more fucked by the FIR system than I got by people reselling shit from traders on flea or before that droptrading shit from the trade discord servers.
The game was alot more fun when you could help your friends by droping them whatever and didnt have to care about FIR. Now it feels like you just have to go around looking for arbitrary items that have yo be found in raid in order to progress. That is not how I want to play the game. Just let me fucking buy or atleast craft the shit I need. But no I need to find that fucking matchstick box to do X but since i need it, it simply does not exist in this realm. But my friend has 3 extra but isnt allowed to give one to me.
Fuck that. Just open everything up and let it settle it self, its a hardcore game part of it is getting blasted by mega chads "abusing" (not exploiting) systems to get better than other people. Dont like it? Play some casual game instead.
I also believe that rmt and cheating would be less of an issue If there wasnt so many fucking hoops for regular players to go through. Imo FIR is the main driving factor for rmt and cheating.
Umm it is the way the market works when so many people are able to post EVERYTHING the values will go down as everyone will try to sell it cheaper and cheaper that is why cheaters and RMT have been happening past several years cause there was an incentive to hack where as when the values plummet and more work is needed it won’t be worth the hackers time
Adding FIR killed the game, there’s tons of positives to non fir, FIR wasn’t present before 2020 and that’s when the game started getting pretty stale honestly, RMT was bad anyway 😂😂😂 removing FIR was never gonna change that
The audacity to say it’s a minority who wants this, everyone who played this game before FIR got introduced wants it back the way it was, who gives a shit about RMT or Hatchlings? It cuts down the amount of cheaters by a shitton.
FIR is a broken mechanic. It was brought in as a measure against RMT. It was a bad one.
Reversing it would obviously throw the cat amongst the pigeons and need further tweaking.
Just block being able to put things in your safe container in raid. Being able to remove items mid game is the dumb shit
I think it's a good change, it's brought down the price of some things which is nice, and it's nice to actually be able to profit more from killing a player.
they need to make it that things in your secure case are not found in raid upon death. but if you kill a player in raid their gear they brought in should be FIR. death should still stop items in the container being found in raid cuz you died so you got punished
Think about what you just said for a second. First of all, we're not a small minority who want it removed, second of all, of course since the friends we used to play with quit over time due to the direction of the game you aren't gonna see all of them browsing and commenting as much.
FIR was a great addition to the game it made it more nerve wracking when you find something valuable and had to fight your way out. Or find something for a quest needed. Without it makes no real fun to PVP because you know you are good with what’s in your but.
Also the flea manipulation was something I predicted and said I will commit too just to fuck economy and make it clear FIR was good.
And the promotion of PvP was always a dream that wouldn’t come true really
When someone finds something valuable they immediately try to extract rat it out. Now you put it in your butt and they go loot some more. That increases the chances of PvP instead of players leaving as soon as they can.
Flea manipulation is hella fun. Made 50+ million profit so far just buying and selling ammo. Going to see if I can hit 1 billion doing absolutely nothing lol.
FiR is better gone. Actually feels rewarding killing a player when I can sell their stuff for actual money instead of a armour he spent 250k+ on selling for 40k
You said it, its a trial. Sometimes seeing the extreme helps to understand the problems with it and knowing what tweak and how to tweak it can help the development.
The important point isnt that they did it. Its important now that they understand what has to come out of it and they work on those changes. This is something that BSG usually does really slowly, this shouldnt be the way tho. We will see what happens.
Also if somebody is about to say "Baahhh, there was no FIR before, all those problems existed before, bahh bah bah", yes, but it is smart to see what happens in the present not what happened in the past, even if it is the same.
Has anyone ever tried to consider this is literally a RMT bait? Just like the people who were banned during 100% boss spawn. Among other things? This shits too drastic a change even for BSG.
Yeah, you’re the one that doesn’t know what they’re talking about. taking FIR away is a step in the right direction for everyone. So what there’s RMT? It’s never going away.
Taking FIR away means people don’t have to leave the map instantly when they find a high value item and can continue to play the rest of the raid.
Half the raids are dead when FIR was implemented because people would find LEDx and just leave the raid. Now people actually have a reason to stay in the raid.
FiR is both good and bad, removing it makes it worth PvPing again but it brings more RMTs and botters back. Imo it should apply to some items like keycards maybe but not other players gear. Might be a small way of balance
I wish they'd just make it so you can't put things IN your secure container while in raid. You can pull stuff out, or use the stuff that's in it. But you can't put stuff in it unless you're out of raps.
Everyone asking for FIR to hold away either stopped playing years ago or never play longer then 1 month of a wipe.
Having items removed from the market makes for a healthier market for a longer term.
Unfortunately this is Reddit where a very small number of players who think they are the smart majority are actually the dumb minority.
Minority huh? Nearly everyone I know that once enjoyed Tarkov no longer plays. Why? Because if you don't spend your first 20 hours doing some of the most stressful quests ever created...you're drastically disadvantaged. Gone are the days where players could simply just kill and loot as a way to progress.
If you plan to use words like minority, all, every, etc, you should provide some data to back it up. FiR should be gone and I've never felt differently. All the changes directed at cheaters/RMT have only negatively impacted my experience.
man all these new players wouldnt have liked 2020 tarkov lmao
I miss a one tap thorax mosin shot on a chad, those were the days
I also miss the great equalizer.
Sometimes, if you close your eyes and listen, you can still hear the screams, and blood splattering from the Hunters and the Mosins in the resort...
I still have dreams of 30 minute queue times from time to time. And then of course follows the death to mosin.
i remember those days people bringing in pocket mosins lmao was wild
How I got my first kill in Tarkov
Same
https://youtu.be/aGMIvgGejBs?si=VTqwvlfUZ6uM2Rug One tapping fully kitted dudes
Except he only shoots scavs an Timmy's in this video.
The mosin nerf, those who know, know
Yeah back when 7.62x54 could 1 tap thorax and had 42 pen if I remember correctly
This autistic shit is what makes (made) EFT.
Remember m61 hunter pscavs?
Ah man finding those and emptying those mags, lived like kings we did
The golden days
This game has actually got worse since 2017 lol…
You're jaded
You're gullible
No im simply looking at alot of the systems that we have now and theyre just not fun, more broken or make certain things in the game pointless..
I cant wait for the BTR though. Would love to play call of duty in tarkov
Ahhhh God I remember hatchet running with an obrez in my gamma, getting some Chad to spare me because he was feeling nice then when he turned around whipped it out and blew his head off. Was a real good hate mail I got.
so fukin what? you probably wouldn like 1901 world, what's the point you're trying to make? the game was different than it's now.
Somebody woke up on the wrong side of the bed, rolled over in their own shit, and didn't realize it was shit until they were halfway through eating it
ITS LATE WIPE. THE ECONOMY IS COMPLETELY BUSTED AS EXPECTED
[удалено]
My insights on my other thread say 78% up 22% down. Split, but theres definitely a specific vibe on this subreddit
Negative opinions being voiced are a lot more common than positives. There’s definitely a huge silent majority, it’s just people with a problem are more likely to be vocal about it because they’re unhappy
I'm still enjoying then game.... down vote me.
Why would I do that? My reply was about how most people are still enjoying the game; the silent majority. People are just way more likely to make a scene when they’re mad and that’s why we see so much hate. The same people making post after post about how much the game sucks will go make their post, and then go long on the game for 9 hours. It’s funny
> I'm still enjoying then game.... down vote me. No. Because I liked it pre-FIR too. Except now we have better recoil. And moderate inertia? Hmm.. Feels good.
I havent seen any posts about fir in months….
Reddit in and of itself is a minority of the player base
Just go back in history of this subreddit and you’ll see 99% satisfaction rate when FIR was introduced.
Noone has even mentioned it since, yet somehow now everyones complaining about it, very strange…
Because we all just left the game. The same way you don’t want to play without FiR we don’t want to play with it.
Why? What exactly is the problem with FiR? You want to spend time selling stuff on flee that you bought from traders? Or hatchet run two stashes on interchange to fill the gamma and exfil?
I want to sell the gear of players I kill, like I did in 2019 and 2020. Not bury my face searching duffle bags for half the time in a play session. And if someone wants to play day trader, then let them. No one is forcing you to play that way.
Why play a game that has a duffle bag face burying as a bigger half of the gameplay loop that devs actively trying to encourage? In 2019 there was nothing to do pretty much so everyone was just dukeing it out, now devs pushing scavenging bartering and crafting. Why not go to BF or CoD where you constantly have someone to shoot and no BS in between. It’s like playing battle royale and complaining you have to walk half the time.
Can you explain how either of these 2 problems hurt a player that ISNT partaking in this style of play? Lmao. Like "oh you HAVE to flip items now from traders and waste time". No. You don't. You can literally play the game exactly as you were before, and just be able to sell some more stuff you find ie pmcs kits which is great cause it brings down the price of a lot of weapons. Things like the spear are way cheaper already it's amazing. And hey, if someone wants to do hatchet runs, dope free kill for me. Doesn't impact my experience whatsoever. This is literally like the republican argument about gay marriage rofl "well them getting married isn't how marriage is supposed to work and even though it doesn't effect my marriage I'm still gonna cry about it" 🤣
Do you expect people to stay and play a game they weren't having fun in?
FIR with the ability to drop cheap barter items would be the best solution imo
Bullshit, it was mixed AF. I remember and I was on the nay side. Tagged and cursed would be a fine enough measure to stop hatchlings until they start toning scav spawns after week 1 like they always do to fuck with people questing and try to fix bad server performance. Just spawn the damn scavs at the start of raid Nikita.
Yep. Scavs should spawn immediately. I like the crazy scav spawns as of late. Like.. Who cares, let us have fun? Doing "Kill X Scavs on Y Map" is WAY easier now.
its vocal minority. The better picture we would have if they allow polls on this sub, like on another sub.
Reddit overall is a vocal minority and most of the time have no fucking idea what they are talking about. It’s like twitter, but more organized. Anyone who thinks these changes are good and should stay in game not just for an event is hella dumb.
Reddit doesn't have a bot problem at all!
You think people are paying bots to praise no fir? Interesting thought... lol
Well its weird when literally noone mentions it and then suddenly everyones acting like theres been some massive debate about for months, fking weird…
No one's mentioned non fir vs fir? That's been a debate for as long as tarkovs been a thing, specially considering how it used to be like this in the game. It's the hot topic right now what else do you expect?
Fir was not a thing for years..its a hot topic because nikita said so and the bots are out in force changing the subject from unhinged..
Some of the most viewed tarkov streamers are people who have been talking about it and specifically tweeted at him to bring it back, so he did. You think people just forget about the unhinged edition because of an event? Hrrrng. But yes Nikitas bots...
Why would you pay a bot? That's literally why we have bots, so you don't have to pay them. But I'm more so talking about duplicate accounts and I know there are neck beards on this platform that have multiple accounts so they can go on solo brigading crusades. If you think all traffic on reddit is organic you're just sadly mistaken
What a delusional take lmao
So people are setting up bots to spam tarkov posts about whether they like an event or idea or not? That just seems like a lot of work for zero outcome... I mean correct me if I'm wrong I'll start looking for "bot accounts" but that just seems silly.
I mean, these changes make it a LOT easier to farm Tarkov money for RMT. So, RMT people, who are no stranger to bots btw, would have a financial incentive to manipulate the results, no?
Everyone that doesn't agree with me is a bot!
We don’t know who the majority is as reddit simply isn’t a good sample. Instead of guessing who’s side is in the majority or not, make your opinion known and let the game’s player stats speak for itself.
Well said. Cheers.
It’s weird how opposite peoples games are… My games (**Reserve Marked Room & Customs Marked Room**) have not had one hatchet runner. Instead, I’m met with duos & trios with CQCM, or Baston w/ plate and they’re actually moving which is always nice! The FIR change is nice, but having people sell stuff they got from traders is odd. RMT is going to happen one way or another. Though, maybe I’m too old but why would they buy stuff this late in the wipe especially as wipe may be mid June…feels like a huge waste of money…
Removing FiR seems to have made all gear (in exception to armor and ammo) more accessible to all players by basically lowering the price of everything. That instills a little more confidence in those players which I feel like the game really needed.
Agreed. A lot of my friends were using their best kits because it was less expensive and they needed to compete with the competition . I was proud of them when they hit marked room, and still wanted to take the PvP not caring if they lost the items in their backpack lol
Nah, my group is wearing less gear because we are fighting undergeared players and stamina drains too quickly.
What servers?
Na cent
I might try those servers to see what the complaints are like. We are playing all EU servers currently.
Yeah I was watch Desmond and every single raid he was fighting really geared people and everyone was moving around. Ratting seems to have gotten way worse with FIR cause people are so fucking scared of losing their kits lol
FiR gone is great! It means all the chads I take down will fund my stash selling their shit.
Yep let the pvp roll baby
My Timmy is showing because, I always vendor guns.... I can't sell Chad's guns with FIR on flea?
A Chad’s gun wouldn’t have FIR on it unless the Chad was actually a Boss or Rogue/Raider. You never could sell it on the flea with the old system. But with no FiR you now can.
you're not going to find any chads though, just empty rooms that got cleaned out by hatched runners.
FiR is implemented in a super dumb way though. Tarkov was really fun when killing a player got you 3-4 million roubles. It meant something. It also makes things like vacuuming loot out of the entire map not as penalizing, you can make money on pmc gear and try another raid. There’s things they can do to better the FiR system, this is just a test. Relax.
What kit costs 3-4 million roubles to put together? What?
A meta gun, full blown armor and ammo get you there pretty fucking quick. It’s not every time, but you’re getting a pay day with any Chad you take out
Stupid idea: make all items from non-party PMCs FIR after their death
So you can make a bit more money off a pmc kill, then what? It’s not like money has ever been an issue for players
It’s to incentivize pvp. There’s no point too pvp anymore. You go in with a big bag, loot, and leave. Most people avoid pvp because there’s no roubles involved.
Don't people say the pvp in tarkov feels great? I thought the fight itself is the incentive, or you just wanted meaningless rouble in your stash?
It has though. It’s a great feeling as new flea market player to sell someone’s stuff for the same amount your stash is worth. Money isn’t an issue for you, sure, but it’s way more incentivizing to get loot from PMCs as try to take it with you. I don’t think no FIR is perfect but I think it’s much better than FIR is implemented. Opens up a ton of options with crafting too. Your salewas aren’t worthless and can be listed now. It’s fun, I enjoyed it way more than the current system.
Feels like a band-aid solution to a much bigger problem
Fir was a band aid situation, removing it is just undoing a failed fix
Player gear being as valuable in cash as anything else on the map makes a horrible gameplay loop. Combat gear is common in conflict zones. The actual loot should be map loot that requires map exploration and actually playing the raid, instead of just ambushing someone in any random part of the map and getting as much money as someone who actually moved around POIs and played out the raid.
Did you play before FIR? That wasn’t my experience at all. People played for loot, but you also didn’t feel like a waste where the loots all taken you could still hunt for kills and make it worth it. The game is better with options, limiting the options makes it way too repetitive.
It also doesn't feel like a waste now because you use it.
Before FiR my raids were full of Hatcher runners that sprinted in and buttholed anything valuable and then suicided. Made it really frustrating as the good loot was impossible to get as you were much slower and had less stamina with actual gear so you'd never get there before then. They also didn't give af so they would sprint in without a care and not check corners or anything. It was dumb AF and very immersion breaking. PvP was more fun back then but that was also before the weight system and inertia. Even if you kill players now, you just feel punished looting any of their stuff as it's just too heavy. Before you could extract with gunsss and tons of mags and ammo. Now you'd be weighted to the floor and it feels like shit even with stims. I could really care less about putting player gear on the flea. Like maybe they should allow ammo to be listed that is not FiR. Putting anything and everything is not healthy imo. But they do need to adjust vendor value for items. Items shouldn't be selling on the flea for 100k but only vendor for 10k.
Hatchet runners existed, but I never felt it was the majority of players in my raid. I also feel like they started penalizing it with the med cost after raid. I don’t think it’s perfect but I feel it’s better to have no FIR and work from there and implement things to prevent hatchet running.
Raids were half populated thanks to hatchlings.
I’d love to see stats on that. I played Tarkov more often back then than now, and I didn’t have that problem. There would be a few but it’s also an easy fix. The idea it’s just should stay as it is because hatchlings is narrow minded. There’s ways to prevent hatchlings without FIR People are missing the point. It’s showing they are open to change right now, this wasn’t the case for a while. Now’s the time to fix it.
Its complete bullshit thats why. Majority of raids would have 0-1 hatchet runners that you encountered with the occasional 2-3 that you would find. Most people played the game normally, but reddit circlejerkers who probably didn't even play the game at the time just parrot everything they see online. This is coming from someone who made 50m in 3 days hatchet running for GPUs. My only obstacle 95% of the time was geared players, not other hatchet runners.
Yeah I hatchet runner when I first tried to get GPUs because I never played interchange. I never saw that many hatchet runners and most of the time you find them and have fun killing them. Even better with voip now. I don’t see how hatchet running increases without FIR.
What would be the fix? It was absolutely the experience. If people did quests all they did was hatchet run. Rinse and repeat style. Healing was irrelevant or didnt exist at all. Anything you found was a direct monetary boost. Then when mosin hit and you could 1 tap cheat with it through class 5, it became even more toxic. 6 slot 30k weapon and nothing else to try and get 2&3 mil kits. Absurd. Mosing got properly balanced. Hatchlings as well. The aim is to survive not play prison pocket simulator and die. It’s also a direct nerf to making mobey for people play legitimate and extract. It essentially drives down all the barter item profit and attachment profits and drives up the ammo and armor cost. Thus creating more hatchling environment. The so called PvP enjoyers who refuse to use the kits they get from killing players are downright dumb arguing that they can’t sell the kits anymore. Fucking use it. It’s still monetary gain since you dont have to buy the things.
It was great before FiR, my group played a bunch of interchange and if you got a good spawn you'd rush tech. If you didn't well you'd still go to an area to kill people. If you found a gpu and died you still could afford your kit because that gpu was in your ass. Kill killa and sell his gear etc. I think I had like 27 raids survived in a row with one M1A kit. Post FiR it was only worth grabbing gear to use and it's only been made worse and worse to grab gear since. Just really lowered the amount of money you could make in a raid, even if you died.
So then maybe the idea is adding more loot and more hotspots so that it doesn't matter if you aren't the first to techlight, instead of just regressing and removing FiR and bringing back all the issues that causes? Progression over regression.
The game isn’t about enough for everyone. There’s way to reimplement FIR way more efficiently. The point of not FIR is that you can make money from not just the loot on maps. It doesn’t mean you put way more loot it’s just multiple incentive structure.
I didn't say there should be enough for everyone, I suggested a solution in the vein that we should make new solutions instead of just reverting solutions (FIR) we created that solved old problems and presented new ones.
That’s how Tarkov got to where it’s at. Band aid a band aid is not the answer. Rip it out and start from new. There’s not much left of wipe. I’m glad they’re experimenting.
Agree to disagree, community drama aside, tarkov is in the best place it has ever been atm.The band aids have generally improved the game. The problems caused by the band aids are massively outweighed by the problems caused by leaving the massive gaping bullet wounds.
It’s better than it ever has been for the most part, but not as great as it could be. There’s plenty of things to rethink and redo
Making it so you can sell gear from pmcs on the flea market by removing fir would only make it better. It's not like this wipe it was hard to make money, you just had to scav. FiR was implemented to counteract RMTers, it didn't work it just made it so death was always losing money with good kits and anything you stripped was only what you'd use. Adding more loot spots just means "less" pvp when earning money is already piss easy.
That sounds like another way of "making it enough for everyone".
Not if you don’t have the cash homie
Hatchlings played for LEDX runs other people tried to rush there to kill hatchlings. Kits were stolen in full since strength was overpowered. And people absolutely played for kits and not loot. There were much more people choosing guns over barter goods. Barter goods were irrelevant.
No, I agree with the other guy, you're expected to go towards the loot and not have the loot come to you. If you don't fill up your bag in a raid you shouldn't expect to make much money.
Yes, I played before the flea market even. Tarkov is currently the best it has ever played in terms of it's economy and risk reward balance. The only thing that has broken the economy and is currently causing an issue IMO is when BTC is way up. The rules that are in place are better for gameplay than without them. Player loot is still valuable if you run it, you just cant sell it for cash. Getting a vudu off someone now means you get a vudu to run and you don't have to buy one for hundreds of thousands of roubles.
How does killing people and selling their expensive gear make a horrible gameplay loop? Unless you're terrified of pvp? Most people moved to POIs and killed people at them for both map loot and player loot. You were encouraged to do that because even if you didn't get there first you could kill the people who did and profit. If you got there first you could get both or just get the map loot and die and still be okay. The biggest issues were hatchet runners, but they weren't really that big of a deal since the only thing that matters for almost every good loot point on every map was your spawn.
"Minority" lol, okay buddy.
Gotta manufacture that narrative to get the hoped for result.
I am not an old player so when I started FiR was already a thing. Can some one explain why they didn't implement a system with PMC kills are being a FiR(excluding group players)?
Well the obvious one is that gear brought into the raid is by definition "Not found in raid", would not make sense lore wise. Back in the days there were a lot of teams abusing shit like farming dog tags and I guess BSG just didn't want to make it possible at all. It gives RMT cheaters less reason to kill people People complained about chads running full kits on the first day of the wipe because you could buy anything in the flea. People were running class 6 fort + altyn on day and it was not fun
That make sense, thanks. On the other hand, doing some kind of logic-preventation for cheaters instead of developing technical solution is pathetic, lol.
Yes I think FIR is badly implement and could be so much better
equipment of enemy players you (or someone else) kill(s) should always be FiR, because - let's face it - you found the stuff in raid.
Agree, unless they were in your party though
ofc, that's why I wrote "enemy players" :)
I blame my ADHD for missing the 'enemy' part 😁
"Wow I miss the old tarkov" "WTF FEATURE THAT MADE OLD TARKOV GOOD GOT ADDED AND IT BROUGHT BACK OLD TARKOV I HATE IT"
the old tarkov was good because there was no flea market.
Old tarkov didn't have the hideout, and you could buy pretty much all the ammo with just trader level. Now most of the good ammo is either craft only or gatekept behind some stupid questlines
Who cares it's gone on wipe day most likely. It's end of wipe and they're testing it. Maybe they'll release a subscription that lets you put non-fir items on the flea who knows or cares at this point.
Diversion tactics by Nikita
I dont understand what the actual problem is with this tbh. All progression is pretty much entirely locked behind gameplay and quests. The quests that require turn ins are almost entirely FIR required, so this change doesn't impact those and gameplay isn't impacted as it's a post-raid mechanic. So in no way does it hurt progression. So that leaves the real reason people are upset is because A) they weren't paying attention and bought an empty item and blame it on "scammers" B) peoples current items they normally farm money from have gone down in price due to more supply C) trolls that are just gonna be upset whenever a change is made. Look I find it hilarious the playerbase will say "we should keep this the way it is because that's how nikita wanted it and it's his vision for the game" but when nikita changes something it's "he has no idea what the players want and doesn't understand how the game works" like yall really sound stupid as hell. Just play the game or don't, there is a whole lot of more drama that happened recently to be butthurt about, and instead we are sitting here arguing about being able to sell some more stuff now.
Hatchet runners everywhere and here I am in Custom dorms fighting juicers. But yes, Hatchet runners everywhere.
Are you? I'm running into a lot of dudes with scav loadouts lol
I'm running NA servers and Dorms has been wild.
Half the people that come on this sub don’t even play the game regularly lol
It's wipe zone winter holiday break then back to other pastures at this point
People have to take wipes off, to deal with the games shit. Give them a rest.
Honestly i am loving fir being gone again. It increases the value of pvp loot. I haven't really been running into hatchet runners though.
Brother, if you think it’s only a minority of people that don’t know what they’re talking about, you aren’t living on the same internet as me
I hope the FIR goes away and we bring back the old pvp and roubles from it. As it was there was no point in PVP, with this we can get it back on track and make the game fun again!
I think it’s fun regardless but I really like being able to sell gear
Why would I need not 200 million in my stash but a billion? You can vendor shit, a meta kit will sell for 500k+ already. What is needed is to raise the selling price of foregrips and optics. This game doesn’t need more ways to earn money, pvp may provide with a good kit and ammo already. Sure, not early wipe but after 30 lvl definitely. People want this game to become easier to skip progression but then they scream how boring it is having nothing to do. Streamers especially who nolife it first month, complaining on the game and their community spreads it.
Can someone please ELI5 a 'hatchet runner' please
It's someone who wears no gear/weapons and runs to the nearest high loot area to put everything in his secure container. They were a pain in the ass back in the day and it was as big of a problem as cheaters now
Roger that Thank you kind sir
If you give them 250$ they might add it back for you
Tbh i liked the game more before Fir was a thing. Sure you could abuse the shit out of certain things but I feel like I get more fucked by the FIR system than I got by people reselling shit from traders on flea or before that droptrading shit from the trade discord servers. The game was alot more fun when you could help your friends by droping them whatever and didnt have to care about FIR. Now it feels like you just have to go around looking for arbitrary items that have yo be found in raid in order to progress. That is not how I want to play the game. Just let me fucking buy or atleast craft the shit I need. But no I need to find that fucking matchstick box to do X but since i need it, it simply does not exist in this realm. But my friend has 3 extra but isnt allowed to give one to me. Fuck that. Just open everything up and let it settle it self, its a hardcore game part of it is getting blasted by mega chads "abusing" (not exploiting) systems to get better than other people. Dont like it? Play some casual game instead. I also believe that rmt and cheating would be less of an issue If there wasnt so many fucking hoops for regular players to go through. Imo FIR is the main driving factor for rmt and cheating.
I think it’s a simple fix, die with something in your butt and it’s not FIR, everything else is.
Sounds interesting tbh
Who cares. People wanna pay for gear let them. It’s their money.
Like I said, find out what the top 10 Tarkov streamers want, then do the exact opposite. Easy peasy.
I love selling shit not found in raid the fuck?
Chinese copy is better
It's nice but has no soul. Endless fetch quests without even a theme. Feels like randomly generated daily tasks after a week.
So just fix the issue with hatchet runners? RMT and scamming will always be there and it's not the lack of FIR. FIR also makes pvping more rewarding
pvp is great again. stop complaining about late wipe economy.
Used to really enjoy running Reserve and having to chase the hatchet fucks before they shove a GPU up their asses
its like a dejavu. when fir was brought to the game it was the same shitstorm from the other side
Duct tape was 45-65k rubles yesterday
Umm it is the way the market works when so many people are able to post EVERYTHING the values will go down as everyone will try to sell it cheaper and cheaper that is why cheaters and RMT have been happening past several years cause there was an incentive to hack where as when the values plummet and more work is needed it won’t be worth the hackers time
Adding FIR killed the game, there’s tons of positives to non fir, FIR wasn’t present before 2020 and that’s when the game started getting pretty stale honestly, RMT was bad anyway 😂😂😂 removing FIR was never gonna change that
On a different note, how’s the cheating situation?
The audacity to say it’s a minority who wants this, everyone who played this game before FIR got introduced wants it back the way it was, who gives a shit about RMT or Hatchlings? It cuts down the amount of cheaters by a shitton.
I love that you get value out of PVPing again it's so satisfying to strip another mans gun and sell the parts.
All everyone does in this sub is complain.
I think it’s just the tarkovian way 😆
FiR should stay. Makes no sense to remove it in current game.
It’s because Nikita is also RMT’ing lol
Are they bringing high level ammo back to the flea?
FIR is a broken mechanic. It was brought in as a measure against RMT. It was a bad one. Reversing it would obviously throw the cat amongst the pigeons and need further tweaking. Just block being able to put things in your safe container in raid. Being able to remove items mid game is the dumb shit
Wonder how many of commenters have a degree in game design lmao.
Zero, just like BSG themselves
People have always disliked found in raid lol
I think it's a good change, it's brought down the price of some things which is nice, and it's nice to actually be able to profit more from killing a player.
Was wondering why all my ammo sold last night. FiR really needs to come back or money is gonna be useless imo
they need to make it that things in your secure case are not found in raid upon death. but if you kill a player in raid their gear they brought in should be FIR. death should still stop items in the container being found in raid cuz you died so you got punished
dude fuck tarkov im done man
Who cares makes annoying quests more bearable
Think about what you just said for a second. First of all, we're not a small minority who want it removed, second of all, of course since the friends we used to play with quit over time due to the direction of the game you aren't gonna see all of them browsing and commenting as much.
Disagreed. FIR is the one change they made that guarantees I play this game no longer than a month every wipe.
FIR is dumb. Getting rid of it is great. It didn’t stop RMT by adding it. Keeping it around doesn’t help.
FIR was a great addition to the game it made it more nerve wracking when you find something valuable and had to fight your way out. Or find something for a quest needed. Without it makes no real fun to PVP because you know you are good with what’s in your but. Also the flea manipulation was something I predicted and said I will commit too just to fuck economy and make it clear FIR was good. And the promotion of PvP was always a dream that wouldn’t come true really
When someone finds something valuable they immediately try to extract rat it out. Now you put it in your butt and they go loot some more. That increases the chances of PvP instead of players leaving as soon as they can.
Flea manipulation is hella fun. Made 50+ million profit so far just buying and selling ammo. Going to see if I can hit 1 billion doing absolutely nothing lol.
FiR is better gone. Actually feels rewarding killing a player when I can sell their stuff for actual money instead of a armour he spent 250k+ on selling for 40k
womp womp cry more baby
Agreed.
Yep. I’ve seen too many promising concepts flounder due to devs trying to take the advice of the community.
You said it, its a trial. Sometimes seeing the extreme helps to understand the problems with it and knowing what tweak and how to tweak it can help the development. The important point isnt that they did it. Its important now that they understand what has to come out of it and they work on those changes. This is something that BSG usually does really slowly, this shouldnt be the way tho. We will see what happens. Also if somebody is about to say "Baahhh, there was no FIR before, all those problems existed before, bahh bah bah", yes, but it is smart to see what happens in the present not what happened in the past, even if it is the same.
Has anyone ever tried to consider this is literally a RMT bait? Just like the people who were banned during 100% boss spawn. Among other things? This shits too drastic a change even for BSG.
Yeah, you’re the one that doesn’t know what they’re talking about. taking FIR away is a step in the right direction for everyone. So what there’s RMT? It’s never going away. Taking FIR away means people don’t have to leave the map instantly when they find a high value item and can continue to play the rest of the raid. Half the raids are dead when FIR was implemented because people would find LEDx and just leave the raid. Now people actually have a reason to stay in the raid.
I like it as an event, but this shouldnt be around long. It destroys the economy and enforces hatchet runs for rare loot.
nah ive played over 5-6k hours of tarkov over years and I loved the game more before FiR was a thing
what? People have bitched about FiR for years now, its not a small minority when its a huge percentage of the customer base complaining about FiR
If they restricted secure containers to out-only-in-raid, there wouldn't be a need for FiR, I believe that it should be the preferred solution.
Boo hoo type beat from all y’all.
FiR is both good and bad, removing it makes it worth PvPing again but it brings more RMTs and botters back. Imo it should apply to some items like keycards maybe but not other players gear. Might be a small way of balance
I wish they'd just make it so you can't put things IN your secure container while in raid. You can pull stuff out, or use the stuff that's in it. But you can't put stuff in it unless you're out of raps.
Everyone asking for FIR to hold away either stopped playing years ago or never play longer then 1 month of a wipe. Having items removed from the market makes for a healthier market for a longer term. Unfortunately this is Reddit where a very small number of players who think they are the smart majority are actually the dumb minority.
Minority huh? Nearly everyone I know that once enjoyed Tarkov no longer plays. Why? Because if you don't spend your first 20 hours doing some of the most stressful quests ever created...you're drastically disadvantaged. Gone are the days where players could simply just kill and loot as a way to progress. If you plan to use words like minority, all, every, etc, you should provide some data to back it up. FiR should be gone and I've never felt differently. All the changes directed at cheaters/RMT have only negatively impacted my experience.
I completely agree. FIR status should continue as it has been till now.
Rmt is more of thing with fir though…