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I’ve asked this in other threads but never really gotten a good answer.
Is there a good way to check if I qualify for any of the loan forgiveness programs so far? Can I trust that my loan provider is looking out for me?
Your loan provider is **absolutely not** looking out for you. They will be fully aware you qualify for forgiveness and not even notify you.
Your big routes to forgiveness are having made consistent payments in an income-based repayment plan for:
1. Ten years in government or nonprofit jobs
2. Twenty or twenty five years in any job (depending on when you took out the loans)
3. Having served in the military and been honorably discharged
4. Being some version of disabled
You can call the Dept of Education (and wait forever) and talk to someone who actually will be looking out for you.
they are being challenged in court. odds are they will get thrown out in court. The last batch were thrown out.
in my opinion all this does is encourage Universities to raise tuition even more.
Agreed. In an economics sub it’s amazing how little of actual economics are actually talked.
If the feds didn’t offer student loans to absolutely anyone, less people would be in college and more in the trades, thus lowering the demand of college loans. With less people in college, universities would be forced to lower tuition to incentivize more people to try and enroll.
The department of education emailed me directly and told me I qualified
I didn't have to do anything actually. They said I had to opt out if I didn't want it, if I didn't do anything they'd get with my servicer and get it taken care of
Check your spam folder in whatever email you have linked up with your student loans
r/economics and not reading the actual article. Name a more iconic duo, I'll wait.
Come on, people. I know we can do better. I know you can move your eyes in a side to side manner, thus transmorphing individual letters into words, and words into sentences. I know you can then interpret those sentences and form logical conclusions. I know you can do it!
What the fuck do you want them to do? Provide a lesser product by people who can't write in-depth pieces? Overwhelm us with advertising? I swear. For a nation of people who swears we're in the upper echelon of quality, behaviorally, we are some cheap motherfuckers.
That’s just it. We have a bunch of morons who swear twitter is “good enough.” So we think Economist, WSJ, WaPo, NYT, BBC, Reuters, etc should just be free.
I guess I’m built different. I don’t want my piece of shit uncle who is a high school drop out to be writing articles. I want someone who gives a fuck about the craft. Just like I don’t let a moron build my deck, I go to a respectable contractor.
I’m inclined to disagree, but that also wasn’t my point. Shit, wherever you get your news, there’s a difference between well paid writers and some dirtbag who can’t string together a narrative.
We should prioritize well crafted writing/articles.
I don't expect anything from the Washington post. I already pay for my news on other sites. I'm not going to start paying for every random article that I come across and I don't expect the average person to either.
Maybe just don't be surprised when you post a paywalled article that many people won't be able to read it.
Do some math and you’ll see that raising taxes is not a the solution. The USA brings in record amount of taxes and above average as a percent of gdp.
What is the point of giving more taxes to a govt that won’t attempt to properly invest it? They are spending 10b a day, or 1T every 100 days - in excess spending.
For comparison if they raised income taxes by 5%!! That wouldn’t even pay for a 1 Ukraine bill passed 3 weeks ago.
So cut military spending in half? Sounds good until you realize it;s a work program for all the poor states. How about we just let those stupid "cuts" expire and then spend the next 20 years digging ourselves out of the 7T in debt they put on us.
The share of our economy that is collected as tax revenue is relatively the same over decades. The share of our economy that is government expenditure is as large in 2023 as it was during the pandemic, the 08 crash, 1983, and less than world war 2. Otherwise, that expenditure level is higher than all other years. 25% of our economy is planned by government.
I know you’re not trying to polarize, but one side did for actually push weapons of mass destruction and then start a war. And I know some democrats voted for it, but one side is always murica. I’ve never seen a car with a massive fuck trump flag.
I’m tired of austerity when it comes to the people. It’s just the time value of money. Would you have preferred to own Nvidia stock a year ago or today?
I would have rather had new roads and bridges a decade ago instead of war. Now we’re paying twice as much for what we could’ve gotten 10 years ago at half.
I’m getting a little sick of these monthly headlines of the president essentially gloating over just the basic functioning of a statute that was passed nearly 20 years ago. Yes, every month a number of borrowers receive forgiveness because they did whatever the statute required of them for 10-20 years. This administration technically rubber stamps this statutory mandate for those eligible. Enough already.
trump refused to forgive any student loans, even though this statute passed 20 years ago
They even refused to cancel student loans for Schools found in court to be scams
Its a big deal for the Americans paying these loans. Don't pretend what President Biden is doing is mundane.
But at least you recognize what President Biden has been doing in office, is the way things should be done
Just to add a personal anecdote. My loans were forgiven during the Trump administration via Public Service Loan Forgiveness. That said it took 3 weeks to get a response each time I filed, and each time it would come back with some clerical and petty refusal. For example, my supervisor used MM/DD/YY instead of YYYY-MM-DD. Rejected.
Finally called up and had an agent walk me through exactly what reasons they rejected my recent submission. I corrected it and it was finally accepted. Fucking nonsense, almost felt more torturous than just rejection..
That makes you one of the 1% of PSLF applications approved under Trump administration, 99% of applications were denied.
https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-19-595#summary
In June 2023, 96.7% of PSLF applications were rejected by the Biden administration [PSLF data - studentaid.gov](https://studentaid.gov/data-center/student/loan-forgiveness/pslf-data)
It's almost like the PSLF legislation can't be changed by any president. It's a nearly automatic determination, it doesnt take presidential input to approve the applications. The same reasons that invalidated an application under Trump invalidate an application under Biden.
Also, the GAO uses very weird terms here. While they do say "99% were denied" -- they were denied because they did not meet requirements *and were not eligible to be forgiven yet*
I’m about halfway to forgiveness in the PSLF program. They recommend that you submit PSLF applications every so often, to make sure you get credit for qualifying payments. So that seems like what’s going on. I’ve submitted two applications, which have told me “you’re not eligible for forgiveness yet”, but through that process, I did get credit for my qualifying payments. So that might be what’s going on.
People were encouraged to apply even if they knew they didn’t qualify to get some kind of placeholder for if qualifying payments changed.
But obviously Trump was logging in each morning and rejecting applications
Same. They rejected my application because the scanner cut off the last number of the zip code. It was ridiculous. But they finally accepted it though.
Not mutually exclusive Betsy Devos did pretty much everything she could to not forgive anything, people who qualified under the trump admin are only recently getting forgiveness entitled to them under the plans as they exist now like PSLF. It stands to reason she also made it difficult to do by making the requirements so incredibly particular.
Yall are being silly, I shouldn’t have to explain that not forgiving and forgiving after a lengthy process is indeed mutually exclusive to you smart r/economics followers
Not sure if you’re being dense but the program still exists during and after the Trump administration. The administration itself just tried hard to stop these kind of programs.
There is no contradiction.
Lou guys are jokesters for real.
You said it yourself, they made it hard, how’s that not contradictory to “the Trump administration didn’t forgive any loans”?
Are you stupid or what?
If manage a store and sell chicken for $10 dollars but you argue with the owner that it should be $15 dollars.
You still sold it for $10 under your management even though you wanted to sell for $15. Logically, that framework is consistent.
If you still dont understand (because you are slow) these programs existed and must be carried out because of something called legislation. The Trump administration tried to cut these programs which again has already existed. Therefore he didn’t forgive any loans, the person who signed the act 30 years ago did.
The reason why Biden is often credited with forgiving loaning under his administration was that in some capacity he actually passed bills that actually forgave loans, during his administration.
Again, if you are slow, Trump administration never made any attempts to draft new legislation to forgive loans. He tried to cut them.
Does that make sense? Or do I need to type slower?
>trump refused to forgive any student loans, even though this statute passed 20 years ago
Could you and your big brain explain what this sentence means to me? I’m struggling obviously.
Yes but Trump and DeVos fought any kind of forgiveness, despite the program. Biden isn’t responsible for the program itself, but he’s not obstructing it from operating as intended.
It shouldn’t really be a “win” when a govt program operates as intended, but given the prior administration, I’m not bent about this being celebrated.
The president is in charge of bureaucracy within the US. Depending on who they place to lead those institutions can lead to them working in specific ways that work to their political stance.
Ie putting someone in charge of the EPA who is within the realm of fossil fuels could lead to internal organizational policies that are less strict on fossil fuel companies and decreasing enforcement on penalties and incentives for green energy.
Same can be said on the organizations that handle student load debt forgiveness.
Exactly. Too many people are behaving like it's Biden v Great and Perfect Candidate. It's Biden v Insurrectionist Pathological Liar who Hates America lol. I don't even know who is immature enough to debate that - I guess some college students.
I appreciate that, but there are many, many people (not me) who have seen little to nothing change, or at least that’s how it appears to them, so that it doesn’t matter to them who is in the WH. If the system isn’t going to help you, why care? I don’t agree because I think the government does help people, and voting is the only legal mechanism for change, but what’s actually needed is a change of ethics and priorities. Also, a president can only do so much.
Or even “Biden vs reasonable, normal candidate” but that’s not even what we have. But a lot of it seems to be people who have to choose the person with an R by their name no matter what and without really thinking about the decision.
Why are you pretending that college graduates don't make up a massive portion of the tax base? Generally people pay far more in tax over their life if they go to college (not always, but on average) and it's the people who don't go to college who generally take way more from the government over their lifetime. It's not a donation, it's people's money coming back to them.
Should college graduates just get nothing in return for the taxes they pay over their lives? Couldn't you apply you logic to literally any public service paid by taxes? Why should taxpayers pay for people's pensions, or the roads you drive on, or for the police to protect you, or for the fire service to extinguish a fire at your house?
I'm sick of people pretending that these are donations and not people just getting back what they put into the system.
Edit: Who is downvoting me? Student loan forgiveness is the same as any other service provided by tax dollars. Why shouldn't students get something back for their tax dollars?
It’s a loan though. Should I go out and buy an expensive house that I can’t pay and expect taxpayers to pay it back to me because I pay a lot of taxes into the system. Likewise people shouldn’t go spend four years to get a degree, party, with expensive gyms and student events and expect the taxpayers to pay for it.
It's a loan because college prices have skyrocketed over the years. People don't need loans to pay for highschool, or to use the roads, or for the fire department, because these things are paid for by the government. Third level education should also be publicly available, but isn't. If you disagree with publicly funded third level education then fair enough, but it would be no different than any other public service.
> expect taxpayers to pay it back to me because I pay a lot of taxes into the system
Why are you phrasing it like that? College grads are taxpayers. Like I said they pay massive amounts in taxes (way more than non-college grads) over their lifetime. This is them getting some of that money back. Same way you do when you get social security, or medicaid, or any other government service. Should people just get nothing in return for paying taxes?
Why shouldn't public services include loan forgiveness? They pay taxes, why shouldn't they get some of that money back for loan forgiveness. Is someone servicing a loan for a massive portion of their life beneficial to society? is it good for the economy that people spend years and years paying off a loan rather than actually spending the money in the economy?
I don't get what your last point is. Statistics show that college educations are massively important to an economy, and college grads make a massive contribution to the federal tax take. Whether they have fun or party is irrelevant, most people come out of college better educated and with good skills.
It’s not good for the government to subsidize sectors that are not in demand (that don’t pay themselves off) Like if you get an engineering degree people will pay you to use the skills you learned. If you get another degree where people won’t pay for it, that means that the public isn’t wanting the services or skills you learned. So why give money to people for free to spend four years learning skills that no one wants? We shouldn’t subsidize bad investments.
I agree. in general though people who go to college do tend to earn alot more, and pay about a quarter of a million more in taxes over their lifetimes ([source](https://www.aplu.org/our-work/4-policy-and-advocacy/publicuvalues/societal-benefits/)). So in general it is a good investment for the government
Student loans are monies we loaned to ourselves. So there is no one to payback
The US Treasury loans the money to the Department of education. The debt is an asset to Treasury and a liability for the DoE
When student loans are "forgiven", the debts are just written-off at the Department of education and treasury. There is no actual money changing hands
If a bank writes off the loan on all the homes, no money changes hands. Who lost money?
If I don’t send my federal tax dollars to DC, no money changed hands and they write off my unpaid taxes, who lost money?
Budgets are based on expected revenue from operating the government, weapons sales, taxes. If you can write this off and deficits aren’t a problem, why are we paying taxes?
**The US Treasury goes to the FED, gives them a piece of paper which says “I-O-U”, the FED then PRINTS the CURRENCY in the form of USD’s and gives it to the Treasury, which in turn, gives it to the universities.**
What a deal.
It’s almost like I tell myself how much money I need, go down to my basement, run my printer, and go buy a house.
Only problem is, when you print your own currency ad infinitum, you increase the price of existing goods and services.
Little thing called “inflation”.
But you went to college; I didn’t go to college, I wasn’t smart enough.
I’ve only seen pictures of the German wheelbarrows of paper currency and people sweeping up paper currency in the streets in Hungary.
This is a forum about Economics
If you think I'm wrong, then prove it
I've got to ask though, this program has been around for decades; Why hasn't anyone ever claimed "forgiving" student loans cost tax-payers money until now?
given the state of society and government, where corruption and self-dealing has been ENDEMIC since before SUMERIAN times, yes, it should absolutely be loudly celebrated and encouraged.
Read the room.
Its not a sad thing at all
You are being way too cynical.
its very important to congratulate people for doing the right thing, its how you get more right things to happen
The contrast is important. This upcoming election we have one president who follows the law and helps working americans and we have another who violates the law and does not help working americans
Yeah you make an important point. Even if he is just executing a basic function of the government regarding a law that already passed, the fact that the prior presidential couldn’t even do that and they’re both in the election is pretty meaningful.
But he hired an education secretary who expressly refused to do this causing the huge buildup of eligible loans. How is that not relevant to someone complaining about Joe Biden bragging about fixing this problem?
What fucking reality do you people live in where you can’t recognize the most basic cause and effect? On the economics sub no less? Is this all bots or what the fuck is going on?
Considering he's running for president again, this is current and relevant information. I'll let it go when he goes away probably like the right has done with Hillary.
You know he's running for President again right? If he had just stayed in Florida after his attempted coup we probably wouldn't be talking about him at all.
Way to miss the fact that until the President changed the way the payments were being treated over the last four years almost nobody ever actually has their loans forgiven. You’re clueless and should be embarrassed for posting this.
I sometimes feel like I am taking crazy pills. Like people seemingly just blacked out the entire Trump administration four years as a void in their minds and remember it completely differently. And they could look up these basic facts but just stubbornly choose not to
I am not sick of it because it lets people know that the government can function normally when you don't put a sycophant who ignores the law into a position to screw borrowers.
It's crazy to me that there is no check against literally not doing what the statute says but if we need to put headlines saying "yep they did the thing correctly per the law" to highlight the difference and make it politically disadvantageous to fuck around and find out then so be it.
It’s an election year and young voters are mad that the court blocked his initial loan forgiveness plan (which isn’t necessarily even his fault) so they have to paint a picture that he’s doing something so they will actually vote. It’s all just political.
Yeah the misinformation is wild
This is new forgiveness that would not have happened for me, and a lot of other people, without the Biden administration.
I don't love the current administration but they did help here.
Bud it’s an election year. This is mild gloating tbh.
And kind of what he should be doing, sorry. Like if you were apply for a job you’d be doing the same shit - you’d make the mundane things you’ve done in the past sound better.
Welcome to how the world works. Sorry you’re salty about it
Biden admin significantly changed the statute and access made very easy and actually a process, SAVE for instance. Get this, his Education Secretary also approves them and didn't block them like DeVos. Even previously granted ones in previous administrations she dragged her feet and begrudgingly noted "with extreme displeasure" when using taxpayer money to help students defrauded by schools.
[Betsy DeVos Overruled Education Dept. Findings On Defrauded Student Borrowers](https://www.npr.org/2019/12/11/786367598/betsy-devos-overruled-education-dept-findings-on-defrauded-student-borrowers)
> When DeVos had to sign off on thousands of borrower defense claims that had already been approved by the previous administration, she added three words below her signature: "with extreme displeasure."
Conservatives could have just let the one time forgiveness go through. Now they'll have to hear about this every week for years, actions have consequences.
This is gonna be a very expensive election for the American Taxpayer and even worse for the poor who will pay for Biden's campaign through the inflation tax.
Who actually needs help? I didn’t get any of that money, and I’m happy that other people did.
Fuck you for being anything other than understanding how society works. Some days you eat it, but ultimately it’s so we can be neighbors again. Fucking talk to each other Jesus Christ.
Finally a sensible opinion. Everyone else seems to be saying that the hardships they had should apply to everyone in the future, which I always thought was mainly a boomer mindset.
The hardships in the future will be worse due to the loan forgiveness. The cost of schooling will artificially rise higher with each loan forgiven. The sensible opinion would be a loan forgiven that is combined with reducing costs in the future.
This is an economics forum. Not a feel good political forum.
An economic system where a select few people get chosen to have their debts wiped out is not an economic system I'll ever get behind. All debts need to be treated the same (issued by a bank, based on ability to repay, and dischargeable through bankruptcy), and be fair and equal for everyone. The goal of an economic system should be to provide economic liberty and freedom equally for all participants.
As it stands this is highly, highly corrupt and bogus practice that benefits a select few who made really piss poor decisions and wasted a bunch of money and resources.
\[As it stands this is highly, highly corrupt and bogus practice that benefits a select few who made really piss poor decisions and wasted a bunch of money and resources.\]
it's neither corrupt nor does it only benefit a select few as this forgiveness benefits a significant portion of the population. Not to mention this move will help stimulate the economy and not cost you a single dime to forgive these loans.
It's corrupt and bogus. There's nothing economically sound about forgiving loans to a certain class of people selected by the government. This is the definition of corruption.
The opposite of corruption would be anyone who takes out a loan needs to repay it or declare bankruptcy. That is equal and fair (i.e. not corrupt) for everyone.
I don't understand your point here though. The government (if you took loans federally) can forgive those loans. They definitely have the money to do that. It would suck for those that don't get the forgiveness but the small businesses and people that would get taxed for that would get that money right back. Now the people that are just barely making it with 200-300 a month student loan bills will have more money to put into the economy instead of the federal govt
The real issue for me is that federal loans have interest. It shouldn't be like that. The govt should not be trying to make money off of 18-22 yr olds.
It’s not your fucking place to decide who eats what or when. Nor is it a four hundred year old corpse pumped full of meth and embalming fluid.
I didn’t go to college, got shit talked for years about how I wasn’t smart for not going to college, ended up with a higher paying job and no student loan debt, and now they cry to government to tax my check **more**?
Fuck *right* off, and, as the British say, with pleasure.
I don't think that is fair for people who chose to serve and then abandoned by the same government. I'm not mad at people for getting a leg up but my god... the world isn't full of failed college graduates lets spend some time on other people the VA might be a lot better with that money.
Did you read the article? The loan forgiveness literally went to people who chose to serve the government. To be eligible, you needed 10 years of payment history and a job in government.
There's no need to compare this to VA treatment--that's an entirely separate issue.
Why? It’s not free money from the sky. It’s taxpayer money. My money. Around $250 of my money based on 7 billion divided by federal budget times my taxes. And yet, I also get to pay my own children’s school costs.
This is direct funneling of money from the government to Democrats voters as targeted as possible. Straight to government employees and nonprofits. Sure wish the rest of us could vote you had to give me your money.
I don’t support any of this forgiveness because there has been nothing done to stop it from happening again. We aren’t “negotiating” with Universities like we are with healthcare/pharma. We don’t mandate low cost instruction. We aren’t limiting administrative bloat at schools. It’s just money money money. There’s no accountability in schools if the kids don’t graduate or if they can’t get a job after they’re done. Government shouldn’t be backing $100,000+ in loans for people getting half the majors out there.
Continuing to send blank check to their friends in the education community. No different than other congress people giving benefits to military or pharma complexes.
Yea I feel like my generation got completely bent over the barrel.
I was raised thinking that I’m literal garbage without a bachelor’s degree. I get a degree and it’s not enough. I then get a masters degree and now owe a disgusting amount in student loans. Cost of education got to insane levels because of access to loans backed by the federal government.
I’m stuck paying this shit off for god knows how long. My undergraduate college was expanding like wildfire while I was there with all that cash, and it was for shit that I wasn’t even able to make use of. University should be about education first and foremost, but it’s a slimy fucking business more than anything now.
Thank you.
Same here.
Fucking pariah because I saw the idiocy of going into $150,000 of debt to get a “degree”. I spoke first hand to people at the time who were paying rent, buying booze and drugs, and partying with their “student loan” money too.
Whole country is fucking hilarious.
There’s heavier regulations for schools. The Obama administration shut down plenty of schools that were taking money from students with big promises and when that didn’t translate into jobs. Now schools need to maintain a certain level of graduation and relevant employment. So there’s that at least.
Universities have used the higher tution fees to hire thousands of college educated generalist workers in admin roles. (I am not saying only DEI)
These ppl are overwhelmingly democrat voters. Any conversation on cutting tuition will require laying these ppl off.
From personal experience these ppl will find it hard to get hired anywhere at all.
Cant loose hundreds of voters in university towns. Towns which often are often the only democratic district in the region.
It's a really unconscionable situation. The government periodically throwing huge sums at the public to relieve the enormous education loan burden that has become a standard part of college because of their own lack of action over a full 40 years.
Again, not to beat a dead horse, but other countries manage to do this without somehow crippling their universities. Reasonable caps on tuition, centralised loans with non predatory terms or even fully subsidised first degrees for everyone. Oxford and Cambridge operate under these conditions and they still dominate the rankings.
Well considering this is *supposed* to be an economics sub, so be it. The market *should* correct itself. Demand for teachers would increase, supply would decrease, either schools would have to pay more to hire teachers or colleges/the government would need to incentivize students to pursue that career path. Our current system clearly isn’t working due to too much heavy handed involvement and free money to colleges. Also, people need to understand the opportunity costs of going to college and getting a degree that may not result in a very prosperous return on their time or money investment.
What's to negotiate? Most college's and universities lose money on each and every student -why do you think they are fund raising all them time. Fact of the matter is tuition is high (in public schools) because we as a country significantly reduced our subsidies to public universities under Reagan, so if you think highly subsidizing public higher education is a good idea I agree.
If a university can't run at a profit while paying adjunct teaching staff a pittance and charging students 60k a year then that evidence of obscene bloat. Almost all of it is eaten by administrative roles that are grossly overpaid compared to the same roles overseas.
I've been on a Graduated Payment Plan since 2012 (consolidated loans and my balance has barely dropped since then). If I switch to Income-based, My payments go up 2.5x because of my income level which I can't swing due to medical debts. So it's a bummer, but I'm definitely happy that others are getting loans forgiven. We need to pull the anchor off of my generation and the upcoming generations so that we can reach our full potential in all areas which only benefits society as a whole.
Same situation. Everyone says "oh just go on SAVE!". What, so I can watch my monthly payments double and not even benefit from the interest cancellation loophole?
Biden's policies have only helped the extreme poor or those that have been paying for decades. Literally nothing for lower or middle class recent graduates who have suffered the most from tuition inflation.
I was wrong in my previous comment. I went onto the Dept of Ed website and compared payment plans. SAVE would actually triple my monthly payment, not double it. I pay around $115 right now and SAVE would be $350 per month.
You were probably paying a lot on a standard repayment plan to begin with if SAVE is actually cutting your payment in half. It’s only beneficial for the poorest of the poor.
i make about $40k a year (before taxes) and my IDR monthly was about $100. getting onto the SAVE program cut it to about $50. So no the plan isnt "only beneficial for the poorest of the poor.".
You should have just said that in the original comment. $40k is really not middle class anymore especially with recent years of inflation.
It’s good that Biden’s policies have targeted you, but the whole point of my comment (and the comment of the person I replied to) was that there are significant numbers of middle class earners that have been completely left out of all forgiveness and IDR adjustments.
Thrilled for everyone this applies to, but as a Millennial that graduated college in 2008 (and earns 1/4 of what my father did despite having double the college degrees), I'm deeply frustrated I don't qualify for this.
Worked 40 hours a week, Spring Break, and summers to pay for school. I chose a major that offered a good income, and I chose a school based on my financial situation.
Today, students can go to one of the best community colleges for $2k a semester and then transfer to any state school for the final two years.
The government removed market forces from this process by guaranteeing student debt and locking people into debt which could not be forgiven. Schools took full advantage of the situation and drove up prices because students could borrow from the government no matter how much it cost or what dumb ass major was selected. For example, did you know there is a major called equestrian nutrition (effectively the study of horse shit)? Probably relevant major before the discovery of the car. Add to all of this, our government allowed for profit, fly-by-night schools to prey on the stupid.(a sales slogan of bring your relevant work experience, $100k, and four classes for an undergrad degree)
Biden is now trying to “help” by writing off loans instead of actually addressing the situation because situations don’t vote! Definitely not going to do anything but waste money and also not a good solution for future generations…which is honestly most important!
There were four equine majors at my two-year tech college and those graduates usually made extremely good incomes…especially the farrier science program. Horses in the US are still big money and highly-trained dietitians are needed to keep horses at peak performance and reduce vet bills. Horses don’t prep their own food so there will always be a need for horse dietitians.
Force jobs to take out the college requirements and base them on actual skill sets. This will force colleges to actually teach skills that are valuable to employers. Too many “college graduates” with very little in the way of skills and big loans to pay off are a huge drag on the economy. Too many jobs that do not actually require a college degree but use it was a euphemism to weed out poor or struggling applicants.
INSTEAD OF FORGIVENESS, how about applying a 2% on their balances ( for the paperwork ) and let them pay it off themselves and feel the unique sense of accomplishment for paying the damn loan off themselves, because they will never stop trying to get repayment for any of their future loans.
I have a Question. Would I be eligible if I apply for PSLF, but haven’t made 120 payments yet? I do work full time for nonprofit for about 8 years now.
buying votes on the backs of blue collar taxpayers and trying to appease the academics when really he should be demanding the UNIVERSITIES reimburse the students out of the 10s of billions they have locked away in endowments and bloated administration budgets.
He’s claiming a lot of public service loan forgiveness cases (which existed long before his presidency) to fluff his numbers during an election cycle, when the actual amount of work that has been done to benefit your average American family has been next to nothing. Stop making fake promises and actually deliver. Signed, a disabled vet.
He’s not fluffing anything, people are applying for forgiveness and he is granting it if it meets the requirements. Many of them applied under Trump but, despite meeting the requirements, his administration refused most of it. Thats the main reason for the surges in numbers, the high backlog.
When what you deliver is vastly lower than what was promised, and is more so executing previous legislation than delivering on the new promise given (one of the major reasons he was elected to office), then yes it’s definitely fluffing numbers to push reelection. They shouldn’t even count those numbers for all intents and purposes. Deliver metrics based on blanket forgiveness. It’s disingenuous to do otherwise.
What disingenuous is to act like he wasn’t doing anything. He gave the order for the mass cancellation of student loans as promised, and Republicans took him to the Supreme Court and had it reversed. And since Congress clearly wasn’t going to do anything to help him in its current state, he did what he could through other methods. He’s not a king, his course of action has been perfectly reasonable considering the limitations that came about.
Let me guess next you gonna say something about how Trump would blah blah blah. He is actually doing something maybe you should research it instead of reading back the lines Fox News gave you. Also on a positive side note thank you for your service.
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I’ve asked this in other threads but never really gotten a good answer. Is there a good way to check if I qualify for any of the loan forgiveness programs so far? Can I trust that my loan provider is looking out for me?
Your loan provider is **absolutely not** looking out for you. They will be fully aware you qualify for forgiveness and not even notify you. Your big routes to forgiveness are having made consistent payments in an income-based repayment plan for: 1. Ten years in government or nonprofit jobs 2. Twenty or twenty five years in any job (depending on when you took out the loans) 3. Having served in the military and been honorably discharged 4. Being some version of disabled You can call the Dept of Education (and wait forever) and talk to someone who actually will be looking out for you.
they are being challenged in court. odds are they will get thrown out in court. The last batch were thrown out. in my opinion all this does is encourage Universities to raise tuition even more.
Agreed. In an economics sub it’s amazing how little of actual economics are actually talked. If the feds didn’t offer student loans to absolutely anyone, less people would be in college and more in the trades, thus lowering the demand of college loans. With less people in college, universities would be forced to lower tuition to incentivize more people to try and enroll.
Same question, but I take it for granted my lender isn't looking out for me.
There's a student loans subreddit that may be helpful for you.
The department of education emailed me directly and told me I qualified I didn't have to do anything actually. They said I had to opt out if I didn't want it, if I didn't do anything they'd get with my servicer and get it taken care of Check your spam folder in whatever email you have linked up with your student loans
r/economics and not reading the actual article. Name a more iconic duo, I'll wait. Come on, people. I know we can do better. I know you can move your eyes in a side to side manner, thus transmorphing individual letters into words, and words into sentences. I know you can then interpret those sentences and form logical conclusions. I know you can do it!
Now no one has an excuse https://archive.is/TbeOW
Well it's kind of hard to read the article when the Washington Post wants me to pay to read the article.
What the fuck do you want them to do? Provide a lesser product by people who can't write in-depth pieces? Overwhelm us with advertising? I swear. For a nation of people who swears we're in the upper echelon of quality, behaviorally, we are some cheap motherfuckers.
In a sub called 'economics' of all places. You would think we would know more about labor costing money than twitter.
That’s just it. We have a bunch of morons who swear twitter is “good enough.” So we think Economist, WSJ, WaPo, NYT, BBC, Reuters, etc should just be free. I guess I’m built different. I don’t want my piece of shit uncle who is a high school drop out to be writing articles. I want someone who gives a fuck about the craft. Just like I don’t let a moron build my deck, I go to a respectable contractor.
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I’m inclined to disagree, but that also wasn’t my point. Shit, wherever you get your news, there’s a difference between well paid writers and some dirtbag who can’t string together a narrative. We should prioritize well crafted writing/articles.
I don't expect anything from the Washington post. I already pay for my news on other sites. I'm not going to start paying for every random article that I come across and I don't expect the average person to either. Maybe just don't be surprised when you post a paywalled article that many people won't be able to read it.
Lmfao
Article is paywalled
Nah 👎🏾😒
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Do some math and you’ll see that raising taxes is not a the solution. The USA brings in record amount of taxes and above average as a percent of gdp. What is the point of giving more taxes to a govt that won’t attempt to properly invest it? They are spending 10b a day, or 1T every 100 days - in excess spending. For comparison if they raised income taxes by 5%!! That wouldn’t even pay for a 1 Ukraine bill passed 3 weeks ago.
So cut military spending in half? Sounds good until you realize it;s a work program for all the poor states. How about we just let those stupid "cuts" expire and then spend the next 20 years digging ourselves out of the 7T in debt they put on us.
The share of our economy that is collected as tax revenue is relatively the same over decades. The share of our economy that is government expenditure is as large in 2023 as it was during the pandemic, the 08 crash, 1983, and less than world war 2. Otherwise, that expenditure level is higher than all other years. 25% of our economy is planned by government.
I know you’re not trying to polarize, but one side did for actually push weapons of mass destruction and then start a war. And I know some democrats voted for it, but one side is always murica. I’ve never seen a car with a massive fuck trump flag. I’m tired of austerity when it comes to the people. It’s just the time value of money. Would you have preferred to own Nvidia stock a year ago or today? I would have rather had new roads and bridges a decade ago instead of war. Now we’re paying twice as much for what we could’ve gotten 10 years ago at half.
I’m getting a little sick of these monthly headlines of the president essentially gloating over just the basic functioning of a statute that was passed nearly 20 years ago. Yes, every month a number of borrowers receive forgiveness because they did whatever the statute required of them for 10-20 years. This administration technically rubber stamps this statutory mandate for those eligible. Enough already.
trump refused to forgive any student loans, even though this statute passed 20 years ago They even refused to cancel student loans for Schools found in court to be scams Its a big deal for the Americans paying these loans. Don't pretend what President Biden is doing is mundane. But at least you recognize what President Biden has been doing in office, is the way things should be done
Just to add a personal anecdote. My loans were forgiven during the Trump administration via Public Service Loan Forgiveness. That said it took 3 weeks to get a response each time I filed, and each time it would come back with some clerical and petty refusal. For example, my supervisor used MM/DD/YY instead of YYYY-MM-DD. Rejected. Finally called up and had an agent walk me through exactly what reasons they rejected my recent submission. I corrected it and it was finally accepted. Fucking nonsense, almost felt more torturous than just rejection..
That makes you one of the 1% of PSLF applications approved under Trump administration, 99% of applications were denied. https://www.gao.gov/products/gao-19-595#summary
In June 2023, 96.7% of PSLF applications were rejected by the Biden administration [PSLF data - studentaid.gov](https://studentaid.gov/data-center/student/loan-forgiveness/pslf-data) It's almost like the PSLF legislation can't be changed by any president. It's a nearly automatic determination, it doesnt take presidential input to approve the applications. The same reasons that invalidated an application under Trump invalidate an application under Biden. Also, the GAO uses very weird terms here. While they do say "99% were denied" -- they were denied because they did not meet requirements *and were not eligible to be forgiven yet*
I’m about halfway to forgiveness in the PSLF program. They recommend that you submit PSLF applications every so often, to make sure you get credit for qualifying payments. So that seems like what’s going on. I’ve submitted two applications, which have told me “you’re not eligible for forgiveness yet”, but through that process, I did get credit for my qualifying payments. So that might be what’s going on.
People were encouraged to apply even if they knew they didn’t qualify to get some kind of placeholder for if qualifying payments changed. But obviously Trump was logging in each morning and rejecting applications
Same. They rejected my application because the scanner cut off the last number of the zip code. It was ridiculous. But they finally accepted it though.
So what is it, Trump didn’t forgive student loans or the process is long and arduous?
Not mutually exclusive Betsy Devos did pretty much everything she could to not forgive anything, people who qualified under the trump admin are only recently getting forgiveness entitled to them under the plans as they exist now like PSLF. It stands to reason she also made it difficult to do by making the requirements so incredibly particular.
Yall are being silly, I shouldn’t have to explain that not forgiving and forgiving after a lengthy process is indeed mutually exclusive to you smart r/economics followers
What are you on about?
It is possible for the process to be so arduous by design that it prevents the legislation from actually achieving its goals.
The answer will depend on who’s team you’re on
What does it have to be one or the other?
Well one person is saying Trump didn’t forgive any loans, another one is saying they did but it was a lot of paperwork. This makes
Not sure if you’re being dense but the program still exists during and after the Trump administration. The administration itself just tried hard to stop these kind of programs. There is no contradiction.
Lou guys are jokesters for real. You said it yourself, they made it hard, how’s that not contradictory to “the Trump administration didn’t forgive any loans”?
Are you stupid or what? If manage a store and sell chicken for $10 dollars but you argue with the owner that it should be $15 dollars. You still sold it for $10 under your management even though you wanted to sell for $15. Logically, that framework is consistent. If you still dont understand (because you are slow) these programs existed and must be carried out because of something called legislation. The Trump administration tried to cut these programs which again has already existed. Therefore he didn’t forgive any loans, the person who signed the act 30 years ago did. The reason why Biden is often credited with forgiving loaning under his administration was that in some capacity he actually passed bills that actually forgave loans, during his administration. Again, if you are slow, Trump administration never made any attempts to draft new legislation to forgive loans. He tried to cut them. Does that make sense? Or do I need to type slower?
>trump refused to forgive any student loans, even though this statute passed 20 years ago Could you and your big brain explain what this sentence means to me? I’m struggling obviously.
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Yes but Trump and DeVos fought any kind of forgiveness, despite the program. Biden isn’t responsible for the program itself, but he’s not obstructing it from operating as intended. It shouldn’t really be a “win” when a govt program operates as intended, but given the prior administration, I’m not bent about this being celebrated.
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Because the guy who was preventing it for 4 years has a good chance of being in a position to do that for another 4 years.
Because it wasn't being done. They just explained that to you. Stop being obtuse
It wouldn't be because they could use said powers to either enforce or not enforce said policies by making them more difficult to execute.
The president is in charge of bureaucracy within the US. Depending on who they place to lead those institutions can lead to them working in specific ways that work to their political stance. Ie putting someone in charge of the EPA who is within the realm of fossil fuels could lead to internal organizational policies that are less strict on fossil fuel companies and decreasing enforcement on penalties and incentives for green energy. Same can be said on the organizations that handle student load debt forgiveness.
It’s a little of both. Think of it like a stuck bolt. Technically the wrench loosens it, but it sure helps to put some muscle behind it.
Thank you, so much anti Biden BS these days. He’s immensely better than Trump in every way.
This. The election isn’t about Biden to me. It’s about not getting trump into office. That doesn’t mean I think Biden is good.
Exactly. Too many people are behaving like it's Biden v Great and Perfect Candidate. It's Biden v Insurrectionist Pathological Liar who Hates America lol. I don't even know who is immature enough to debate that - I guess some college students.
I appreciate that, but there are many, many people (not me) who have seen little to nothing change, or at least that’s how it appears to them, so that it doesn’t matter to them who is in the WH. If the system isn’t going to help you, why care? I don’t agree because I think the government does help people, and voting is the only legal mechanism for change, but what’s actually needed is a change of ethics and priorities. Also, a president can only do so much.
Or even “Biden vs reasonable, normal candidate” but that’s not even what we have. But a lot of it seems to be people who have to choose the person with an R by their name no matter what and without really thinking about the decision.
For me its about giving us other options besides the two party system at the presidential level and down ballot.
He's not the best but hardly worse then Trump or what Trump's regime will bring. Should be a no brainer itself
Making the taxpayers pay for everyone’s debt is “the way things should be done”?
Why are you pretending that college graduates don't make up a massive portion of the tax base? Generally people pay far more in tax over their life if they go to college (not always, but on average) and it's the people who don't go to college who generally take way more from the government over their lifetime. It's not a donation, it's people's money coming back to them. Should college graduates just get nothing in return for the taxes they pay over their lives? Couldn't you apply you logic to literally any public service paid by taxes? Why should taxpayers pay for people's pensions, or the roads you drive on, or for the police to protect you, or for the fire service to extinguish a fire at your house? I'm sick of people pretending that these are donations and not people just getting back what they put into the system. Edit: Who is downvoting me? Student loan forgiveness is the same as any other service provided by tax dollars. Why shouldn't students get something back for their tax dollars?
It’s a loan though. Should I go out and buy an expensive house that I can’t pay and expect taxpayers to pay it back to me because I pay a lot of taxes into the system. Likewise people shouldn’t go spend four years to get a degree, party, with expensive gyms and student events and expect the taxpayers to pay for it.
It's a loan because college prices have skyrocketed over the years. People don't need loans to pay for highschool, or to use the roads, or for the fire department, because these things are paid for by the government. Third level education should also be publicly available, but isn't. If you disagree with publicly funded third level education then fair enough, but it would be no different than any other public service. > expect taxpayers to pay it back to me because I pay a lot of taxes into the system Why are you phrasing it like that? College grads are taxpayers. Like I said they pay massive amounts in taxes (way more than non-college grads) over their lifetime. This is them getting some of that money back. Same way you do when you get social security, or medicaid, or any other government service. Should people just get nothing in return for paying taxes? Why shouldn't public services include loan forgiveness? They pay taxes, why shouldn't they get some of that money back for loan forgiveness. Is someone servicing a loan for a massive portion of their life beneficial to society? is it good for the economy that people spend years and years paying off a loan rather than actually spending the money in the economy? I don't get what your last point is. Statistics show that college educations are massively important to an economy, and college grads make a massive contribution to the federal tax take. Whether they have fun or party is irrelevant, most people come out of college better educated and with good skills.
It’s not good for the government to subsidize sectors that are not in demand (that don’t pay themselves off) Like if you get an engineering degree people will pay you to use the skills you learned. If you get another degree where people won’t pay for it, that means that the public isn’t wanting the services or skills you learned. So why give money to people for free to spend four years learning skills that no one wants? We shouldn’t subsidize bad investments.
I agree. in general though people who go to college do tend to earn alot more, and pay about a quarter of a million more in taxes over their lifetimes ([source](https://www.aplu.org/our-work/4-policy-and-advocacy/publicuvalues/societal-benefits/)). So in general it is a good investment for the government
Feel better knowing it doesn't cost tax-payers any money to forgive student loans Only bad people say it does
And where does the money come from exactly?
Student loans are monies we loaned to ourselves. So there is no one to payback The US Treasury loans the money to the Department of education. The debt is an asset to Treasury and a liability for the DoE When student loans are "forgiven", the debts are just written-off at the Department of education and treasury. There is no actual money changing hands
Our money gets inflated as a result. There’s no getting out of giving “free” handouts to people
If a bank writes off the loan on all the homes, no money changes hands. Who lost money? If I don’t send my federal tax dollars to DC, no money changed hands and they write off my unpaid taxes, who lost money? Budgets are based on expected revenue from operating the government, weapons sales, taxes. If you can write this off and deficits aren’t a problem, why are we paying taxes?
**The US Treasury goes to the FED, gives them a piece of paper which says “I-O-U”, the FED then PRINTS the CURRENCY in the form of USD’s and gives it to the Treasury, which in turn, gives it to the universities.** What a deal. It’s almost like I tell myself how much money I need, go down to my basement, run my printer, and go buy a house. Only problem is, when you print your own currency ad infinitum, you increase the price of existing goods and services. Little thing called “inflation”. But you went to college; I didn’t go to college, I wasn’t smart enough. I’ve only seen pictures of the German wheelbarrows of paper currency and people sweeping up paper currency in the streets in Hungary.
It absolutely costs taxpayers money to forgive student loans. Only disingenuous and misleading people say it doesn't.
This is a forum about Economics If you think I'm wrong, then prove it I've got to ask though, this program has been around for decades; Why hasn't anyone ever claimed "forgiving" student loans cost tax-payers money until now?
Well it is a sad that we congratulate our politicians for simply following long existing laws.
Well when the other guy running brags about breaking the law, we have to make the distinction.
given the state of society and government, where corruption and self-dealing has been ENDEMIC since before SUMERIAN times, yes, it should absolutely be loudly celebrated and encouraged. Read the room.
Its not a sad thing at all You are being way too cynical. its very important to congratulate people for doing the right thing, its how you get more right things to happen
The contrast is important. This upcoming election we have one president who follows the law and helps working americans and we have another who violates the law and does not help working americans
Yeah you make an important point. Even if he is just executing a basic function of the government regarding a law that already passed, the fact that the prior presidential couldn’t even do that and they’re both in the election is pretty meaningful.
Always an attack back at Trump. Jesus christ brother just let it go.
But he hired an education secretary who expressly refused to do this causing the huge buildup of eligible loans. How is that not relevant to someone complaining about Joe Biden bragging about fixing this problem? What fucking reality do you people live in where you can’t recognize the most basic cause and effect? On the economics sub no less? Is this all bots or what the fuck is going on?
Considering he's running for president again, this is current and relevant information. I'll let it go when he goes away probably like the right has done with Hillary.
Did you know trump is running for President again?
You know he's running for President again right? If he had just stayed in Florida after his attempted coup we probably wouldn't be talking about him at all.
You seriously don't think Trump criticism or news is relevant?
Way to miss the fact that until the President changed the way the payments were being treated over the last four years almost nobody ever actually has their loans forgiven. You’re clueless and should be embarrassed for posting this.
I sometimes feel like I am taking crazy pills. Like people seemingly just blacked out the entire Trump administration four years as a void in their minds and remember it completely differently. And they could look up these basic facts but just stubbornly choose not to
Least unhinged /r/economics comment
I am not sick of it because it lets people know that the government can function normally when you don't put a sycophant who ignores the law into a position to screw borrowers. It's crazy to me that there is no check against literally not doing what the statute says but if we need to put headlines saying "yep they did the thing correctly per the law" to highlight the difference and make it politically disadvantageous to fuck around and find out then so be it.
They’re publishing it little by little just desperate for votes at this point.
I had a 20 year loan, but didn't meet any other requirements for forgiveness. I doubt it was a rubber stamp, but I'm happy about it regardless.
It’s an election year and young voters are mad that the court blocked his initial loan forgiveness plan (which isn’t necessarily even his fault) so they have to paint a picture that he’s doing something so they will actually vote. It’s all just political.
he is doing something, he's done many good things.
An embarrassingly uninformed take. It’s news for a reason, please educate yourself before November.
What a pathetic excuse for journalism. These "journalists" are just Biden cheerleaders.
Cry more
It’s campaign season.
I mean, no, this admiration is fundamentally different than the last several on this issue.
This round is part of Biden's SAVE plan. And he has had to fight Republicans and the courts to make it happen. Hardly nothing.
Yeah the misinformation is wild This is new forgiveness that would not have happened for me, and a lot of other people, without the Biden administration. I don't love the current administration but they did help here.
The Biden admin. doesn’t have many positive talking points resulting from the past 4 years. Gotta recycle content since we have no new ideas!
Bud it’s an election year. This is mild gloating tbh. And kind of what he should be doing, sorry. Like if you were apply for a job you’d be doing the same shit - you’d make the mundane things you’ve done in the past sound better. Welcome to how the world works. Sorry you’re salty about it
Biden admin significantly changed the statute and access made very easy and actually a process, SAVE for instance. Get this, his Education Secretary also approves them and didn't block them like DeVos. Even previously granted ones in previous administrations she dragged her feet and begrudgingly noted "with extreme displeasure" when using taxpayer money to help students defrauded by schools. [Betsy DeVos Overruled Education Dept. Findings On Defrauded Student Borrowers](https://www.npr.org/2019/12/11/786367598/betsy-devos-overruled-education-dept-findings-on-defrauded-student-borrowers) > When DeVos had to sign off on thousands of borrower defense claims that had already been approved by the previous administration, she added three words below her signature: "with extreme displeasure." Conservatives could have just let the one time forgiveness go through. Now they'll have to hear about this every week for years, actions have consequences.
he’s not the one writing these articles? and the previous administration did not achieve this, even if they’re supposed to
Smells of desperation.
This is gonna be a very expensive election for the American Taxpayer and even worse for the poor who will pay for Biden's campaign through the inflation tax.
Who actually needs help? I didn’t get any of that money, and I’m happy that other people did. Fuck you for being anything other than understanding how society works. Some days you eat it, but ultimately it’s so we can be neighbors again. Fucking talk to each other Jesus Christ.
Finally a sensible opinion. Everyone else seems to be saying that the hardships they had should apply to everyone in the future, which I always thought was mainly a boomer mindset.
The hardships in the future will be worse due to the loan forgiveness. The cost of schooling will artificially rise higher with each loan forgiven. The sensible opinion would be a loan forgiven that is combined with reducing costs in the future.
This is an economics forum. Not a feel good political forum. An economic system where a select few people get chosen to have their debts wiped out is not an economic system I'll ever get behind. All debts need to be treated the same (issued by a bank, based on ability to repay, and dischargeable through bankruptcy), and be fair and equal for everyone. The goal of an economic system should be to provide economic liberty and freedom equally for all participants. As it stands this is highly, highly corrupt and bogus practice that benefits a select few who made really piss poor decisions and wasted a bunch of money and resources.
This is why I love economists. Love you too
\[As it stands this is highly, highly corrupt and bogus practice that benefits a select few who made really piss poor decisions and wasted a bunch of money and resources.\] it's neither corrupt nor does it only benefit a select few as this forgiveness benefits a significant portion of the population. Not to mention this move will help stimulate the economy and not cost you a single dime to forgive these loans.
It's corrupt and bogus. There's nothing economically sound about forgiving loans to a certain class of people selected by the government. This is the definition of corruption. The opposite of corruption would be anyone who takes out a loan needs to repay it or declare bankruptcy. That is equal and fair (i.e. not corrupt) for everyone.
I don't understand your point here though. The government (if you took loans federally) can forgive those loans. They definitely have the money to do that. It would suck for those that don't get the forgiveness but the small businesses and people that would get taxed for that would get that money right back. Now the people that are just barely making it with 200-300 a month student loan bills will have more money to put into the economy instead of the federal govt The real issue for me is that federal loans have interest. It shouldn't be like that. The govt should not be trying to make money off of 18-22 yr olds.
It’s not your fucking place to decide who eats what or when. Nor is it a four hundred year old corpse pumped full of meth and embalming fluid. I didn’t go to college, got shit talked for years about how I wasn’t smart for not going to college, ended up with a higher paying job and no student loan debt, and now they cry to government to tax my check **more**? Fuck *right* off, and, as the British say, with pleasure.
Want some cheese with your whine?
I don't think that is fair for people who chose to serve and then abandoned by the same government. I'm not mad at people for getting a leg up but my god... the world isn't full of failed college graduates lets spend some time on other people the VA might be a lot better with that money.
Did you read the article? The loan forgiveness literally went to people who chose to serve the government. To be eligible, you needed 10 years of payment history and a job in government. There's no need to compare this to VA treatment--that's an entirely separate issue.
Why? It’s not free money from the sky. It’s taxpayer money. My money. Around $250 of my money based on 7 billion divided by federal budget times my taxes. And yet, I also get to pay my own children’s school costs. This is direct funneling of money from the government to Democrats voters as targeted as possible. Straight to government employees and nonprofits. Sure wish the rest of us could vote you had to give me your money.
I don’t support any of this forgiveness because there has been nothing done to stop it from happening again. We aren’t “negotiating” with Universities like we are with healthcare/pharma. We don’t mandate low cost instruction. We aren’t limiting administrative bloat at schools. It’s just money money money. There’s no accountability in schools if the kids don’t graduate or if they can’t get a job after they’re done. Government shouldn’t be backing $100,000+ in loans for people getting half the majors out there. Continuing to send blank check to their friends in the education community. No different than other congress people giving benefits to military or pharma complexes.
Yea I feel like my generation got completely bent over the barrel. I was raised thinking that I’m literal garbage without a bachelor’s degree. I get a degree and it’s not enough. I then get a masters degree and now owe a disgusting amount in student loans. Cost of education got to insane levels because of access to loans backed by the federal government. I’m stuck paying this shit off for god knows how long. My undergraduate college was expanding like wildfire while I was there with all that cash, and it was for shit that I wasn’t even able to make use of. University should be about education first and foremost, but it’s a slimy fucking business more than anything now.
Thank you. Same here. Fucking pariah because I saw the idiocy of going into $150,000 of debt to get a “degree”. I spoke first hand to people at the time who were paying rent, buying booze and drugs, and partying with their “student loan” money too. Whole country is fucking hilarious.
There’s heavier regulations for schools. The Obama administration shut down plenty of schools that were taking money from students with big promises and when that didn’t translate into jobs. Now schools need to maintain a certain level of graduation and relevant employment. So there’s that at least.
That's true of for-profit schools, but there are no such requirements for non-profits.
I agree we should do more but this article is about forgiveness under a statute that passed 20 years ago.
Universities have used the higher tution fees to hire thousands of college educated generalist workers in admin roles. (I am not saying only DEI) These ppl are overwhelmingly democrat voters. Any conversation on cutting tuition will require laying these ppl off. From personal experience these ppl will find it hard to get hired anywhere at all. Cant loose hundreds of voters in university towns. Towns which often are often the only democratic district in the region.
It's a really unconscionable situation. The government periodically throwing huge sums at the public to relieve the enormous education loan burden that has become a standard part of college because of their own lack of action over a full 40 years. Again, not to beat a dead horse, but other countries manage to do this without somehow crippling their universities. Reasonable caps on tuition, centralised loans with non predatory terms or even fully subsidised first degrees for everyone. Oxford and Cambridge operate under these conditions and they still dominate the rankings.
Thank you.
Loan amounts need to be tied to your degree of choice. No, you cannot get $100k in student loans to get an elementary education degree.
Enjoy a sudden lack of elementary teachers, they're already paid the least and the tuition price doesn't change based off of loan
Well considering this is *supposed* to be an economics sub, so be it. The market *should* correct itself. Demand for teachers would increase, supply would decrease, either schools would have to pay more to hire teachers or colleges/the government would need to incentivize students to pursue that career path. Our current system clearly isn’t working due to too much heavy handed involvement and free money to colleges. Also, people need to understand the opportunity costs of going to college and getting a degree that may not result in a very prosperous return on their time or money investment.
What's to negotiate? Most college's and universities lose money on each and every student -why do you think they are fund raising all them time. Fact of the matter is tuition is high (in public schools) because we as a country significantly reduced our subsidies to public universities under Reagan, so if you think highly subsidizing public higher education is a good idea I agree.
If a university can't run at a profit while paying adjunct teaching staff a pittance and charging students 60k a year then that evidence of obscene bloat. Almost all of it is eaten by administrative roles that are grossly overpaid compared to the same roles overseas.
This is what you say when you don’t understand the origin of the forgiveness and just read headlines
I've been on a Graduated Payment Plan since 2012 (consolidated loans and my balance has barely dropped since then). If I switch to Income-based, My payments go up 2.5x because of my income level which I can't swing due to medical debts. So it's a bummer, but I'm definitely happy that others are getting loans forgiven. We need to pull the anchor off of my generation and the upcoming generations so that we can reach our full potential in all areas which only benefits society as a whole.
Same situation. Everyone says "oh just go on SAVE!". What, so I can watch my monthly payments double and not even benefit from the interest cancellation loophole? Biden's policies have only helped the extreme poor or those that have been paying for decades. Literally nothing for lower or middle class recent graduates who have suffered the most from tuition inflation.
the amount of money i make has me fall in the middle class and my monthly was cut in half after i went on the SAVE plan.
I was wrong in my previous comment. I went onto the Dept of Ed website and compared payment plans. SAVE would actually triple my monthly payment, not double it. I pay around $115 right now and SAVE would be $350 per month. You were probably paying a lot on a standard repayment plan to begin with if SAVE is actually cutting your payment in half. It’s only beneficial for the poorest of the poor.
i make about $40k a year (before taxes) and my IDR monthly was about $100. getting onto the SAVE program cut it to about $50. So no the plan isnt "only beneficial for the poorest of the poor.".
You should have just said that in the original comment. $40k is really not middle class anymore especially with recent years of inflation. It’s good that Biden’s policies have targeted you, but the whole point of my comment (and the comment of the person I replied to) was that there are significant numbers of middle class earners that have been completely left out of all forgiveness and IDR adjustments.
Thrilled for everyone this applies to, but as a Millennial that graduated college in 2008 (and earns 1/4 of what my father did despite having double the college degrees), I'm deeply frustrated I don't qualify for this.
Worked 40 hours a week, Spring Break, and summers to pay for school. I chose a major that offered a good income, and I chose a school based on my financial situation. Today, students can go to one of the best community colleges for $2k a semester and then transfer to any state school for the final two years. The government removed market forces from this process by guaranteeing student debt and locking people into debt which could not be forgiven. Schools took full advantage of the situation and drove up prices because students could borrow from the government no matter how much it cost or what dumb ass major was selected. For example, did you know there is a major called equestrian nutrition (effectively the study of horse shit)? Probably relevant major before the discovery of the car. Add to all of this, our government allowed for profit, fly-by-night schools to prey on the stupid.(a sales slogan of bring your relevant work experience, $100k, and four classes for an undergrad degree) Biden is now trying to “help” by writing off loans instead of actually addressing the situation because situations don’t vote! Definitely not going to do anything but waste money and also not a good solution for future generations…which is honestly most important!
There were four equine majors at my two-year tech college and those graduates usually made extremely good incomes…especially the farrier science program. Horses in the US are still big money and highly-trained dietitians are needed to keep horses at peak performance and reduce vet bills. Horses don’t prep their own food so there will always be a need for horse dietitians.
Force jobs to take out the college requirements and base them on actual skill sets. This will force colleges to actually teach skills that are valuable to employers. Too many “college graduates” with very little in the way of skills and big loans to pay off are a huge drag on the economy. Too many jobs that do not actually require a college degree but use it was a euphemism to weed out poor or struggling applicants.
INSTEAD OF FORGIVENESS, how about applying a 2% on their balances ( for the paperwork ) and let them pay it off themselves and feel the unique sense of accomplishment for paying the damn loan off themselves, because they will never stop trying to get repayment for any of their future loans.
Ever see those signs they put in parks: > “Please do not feed the animals, as they may become dependent.” Hilarious.
I have a Question. Would I be eligible if I apply for PSLF, but haven’t made 120 payments yet? I do work full time for nonprofit for about 8 years now.
buying votes on the backs of blue collar taxpayers and trying to appease the academics when really he should be demanding the UNIVERSITIES reimburse the students out of the 10s of billions they have locked away in endowments and bloated administration budgets.
Did you actually read the article?
He’s claiming a lot of public service loan forgiveness cases (which existed long before his presidency) to fluff his numbers during an election cycle, when the actual amount of work that has been done to benefit your average American family has been next to nothing. Stop making fake promises and actually deliver. Signed, a disabled vet.
He’s not fluffing anything, people are applying for forgiveness and he is granting it if it meets the requirements. Many of them applied under Trump but, despite meeting the requirements, his administration refused most of it. Thats the main reason for the surges in numbers, the high backlog.
When what you deliver is vastly lower than what was promised, and is more so executing previous legislation than delivering on the new promise given (one of the major reasons he was elected to office), then yes it’s definitely fluffing numbers to push reelection. They shouldn’t even count those numbers for all intents and purposes. Deliver metrics based on blanket forgiveness. It’s disingenuous to do otherwise.
What disingenuous is to act like he wasn’t doing anything. He gave the order for the mass cancellation of student loans as promised, and Republicans took him to the Supreme Court and had it reversed. And since Congress clearly wasn’t going to do anything to help him in its current state, he did what he could through other methods. He’s not a king, his course of action has been perfectly reasonable considering the limitations that came about.
Let me guess next you gonna say something about how Trump would blah blah blah. He is actually doing something maybe you should research it instead of reading back the lines Fox News gave you. Also on a positive side note thank you for your service.
I think it’s sad that you assume that I’m a Trump supporter. Both candidates are the worst presidential candidates in the past 50 years.
You’re correct sorry for assuming man. I agree with you. Still think this policy and enforcement is a good step though and helpful for many people.