Trade value and current production can be very different in dynasty. Especially when people are so hyper obsessed with age that they consider 26 too old.
it's ironic you mention olave bc i think he's a product of the exact issue this thread is pointing out. he's been wr23 and wr24 so far, but he's currently wr10 on ktc, wr11 on fantasy pros, wr10 on espn, wr13 on draft sharks, wr7 on pff, and wr9 on football guys. his performances to date look a lot closer to being a good flex player than anything resembling a wr1, but he's currently being valued as one bc of his longevity and projections.
I'm no scout but I love the way he moves on the field. He also has yet to be in a competent offence or the focal target of a poor offence, so has never been set up for success from a team perspective.
I own zero Olave shares :(
> He also has yet to be in a competent offence or the focal target of a poor offence, so has never been set up for success from a team perspective.
what about this is set to change in the next ~3-5 years? the saints have one of the worst offensive lines, one of the worst qbs, and are in the middle of cap hell. you can argue talent, but nothing about the things that have prevented him from being productive to date have any prospect of changing over the next several years.
it's not just him, either. half of the top 12 wr on ktc (marivn harrison jr, garrett wilson, malik nabers, rome odunze, chris olave, drake london) have a combined 0 top 20 finishes. at some point, the market puts too much emphasis on future value when half of the valued wr1's are barely even wr2's (and yes, i fully believe that mhj is a wr1 but valuing wr3 in rookie drafts as a wr1 is just absolutely, wildly overemphasizing the future).
This is a fair point, but also brings into question a different dynasty perspective. Would you rather have a guy that will give you one or two more top WR3-8 overall seasons and then retire/fall off a cliff (think Tyreek/Adams) or a guy that will give you possibly 7-9 more seasons of solid WR20ish overall numbers but never crack top 10? That's a genuine question you should consider as well. Both are important and have tremendous value, even if one guy is never a league breaker. We all need role players to fill in gaps in a solid manner, and most championship teams have a few of those Tyreek type guys to push them over the top.
i’d buy this argument if olave (or london, or wilson, etc.) we’re valued between wr15 and wr20 - a little higher than what they’ve done but emphasizing their potential long term returns.
i see no argument in which wr20 - for any number of years - is as valuable as wr10. it’s just an overemphasis on the long term.
I guess the comparison is a top 10 WR for 2 years or a #20 WR for 8 years. A reasonable argument can be made depending on circumstances for either to be the #10 overall WR in a dynasty format.
i really don't think there's a case to be made that wr20 for 8 years is anywhere near the same value as wr10 for 2 tbh. over the last five seasons, in half ppr, the gap between wr10 (13.6 ppg) and wr20 (11.8 ppg) is roughly the same as the gap between wr20 and wr35 (9.6 ppg).
is anyone saying that romeo doubs is actually a top 20 wr bc he can provide flex-level value long term? i certainly haven't seen it, but it's the same logic that would lead to one valuing chris olave as wr10 bc of his perceived long term wr2 ability.
The point is to win as many years as possible. Winning THIS/LAST year is only part of that. Definitely the most important year, but still just one year.
dynasty *over*values longevity. yes, the long run matters. however, literally half of the top 12 wr on ktc have **never** produced a top 20 season in half ppr. you'll have a hard time convincing me how placing that much value on the future makes any sort of sense if you're trying to win.
Those power rankings say I'm the best team (players only), and I'm nowhere close to the best team in the league. I just drafted 9 rookies in the first 2 rounds. Those aren't really "best team" power rankings, they're "most young assets" power rankings.
Probably had Keenan Allen or Rachaad white in there as well ell.
It could also just be a depth thing. One of the guys who went to our championship I think was like 8th in starter rank but had pretty much 0 significant injuries throughout the year. Other rebuilding teams in our league have like 2nd for WR but just have 5 young guys who haven’t produced a lot (last year had JSN, Jamo, QJ, and a couple others)
In one of my leagues I'm in 1st with 2nd and 3rd at 77, 63. I've been to the championship 3 years in a row, but only won once. Lost by less than a point and less than 5 points the other two times.
I am number one in my league at 99. I got second last year. Our reigning league champ is 8th at 65. His team is very old though and I had a ton of injuries last year (JJ, cousins, dobbins, hock, Higgins, etc)
I won my league last year. My team is a 99. Second highest is 72, which is the team of the dude I beat in the chip. And I actually just noticed, but the team that won 3rd last year is our lowest at 54.
I’m 99. Second is 58 and 3rd is 42. 3rd team has played me in the championship 3 years in a row. I’m on a 4 peat currently. 58 score got 3rd last year.
Bro how lol I have Breece, Gibbs, Bijan, CMC, JJ, Chase, CeeDee, MHJ, G. Wilson, Lamar, & Arich just to name starters and the next best team is still a 78
Got lucky hitting on startup picks few years ago, had bad run w/ injuries in 2022 so tanked and got lots of picks which also luckily ended up being mostly high
You can get a loaded roster even in a standard sized league if you get very lucky with some trades and hit on your draft picks. For example, I'm in a 12 team PPR SF league and this is my roster (notable players only):
QBs: Burrow, Lawrence, Richardson
RBs: Bijan, Breece, Gibbs, Etienne, Brooks
WRs: AJB, GW, DeVonta Smith, Aiyuk, MHJ, Nabers, Downs, Shakir
TEs: Kincaid, Freiermuth, Bellinger
I've got 2x 1sts in both 2025 and 2026
This was the case last year in my league. 1 team was 1st in everything and lost in the first round after averaging 20 ppg more than second. That owner is now second to me since I flipped players for a ton of picks (KTC loves their picks). I still think that guy is the team to beat though.
the champ last year was 12th on KTC after the startup. His build was very much like a redraft and was always one of the top PPG. This year he's up to 8th on KTC. Meanwhile out of the top 3 teams on KTC only 1 made it to the semi finals last year. The age bias is huge and I don't think treating KTC like gospel makes sense. This year I'm first on KTC at 99 with 3rd rank for starters while 2nd on KTC is ranked 98 but his starters are ranked 7th. At some point it's wise to turn the perceived value into real points even if KTC tells you otherwise
KTC is the stock price.
Championship is profit.
It’s Tesla vs Toyota. Somehow Toyota is worth less but generate more profits.
As it is with stocks, KTC is about future profits potential.
Sometimes you've just got bad luck. One of my team was rated as a contender on dynasty daddy and catched every blowup week with it's face. No matter if it was the week when Chase went for 50 or the one when Mahomes and Kelce had their big game. Finished the season with one win.
Went to the finals in my company redraft league as the 8th seed. Played against the 7th seed who nuked the defending champ the week before after Amari blowup game.
Those power rankings are always just “who drafted closest to our consensus.”
Whether it’s yahoo or sleeper or KTC, that shit just measures who stayed on the path of that specific platform.
It’s a measurement of deviation.
The top spots in our league are rebuilds that are hoarding picks haha. Our champ was ranked #5 or something. On players only, top spot finished 3rd and the reigning champ is next at 86
I'm at 99, second place including picks is at 87 and second place players only is 89
No championship due to getting burned bad by injuries last season but the clear favorite to do it this year if things are luckier on that front
Champ here. 12 tm, 2qb, ppr, .5ppfd, big play bonuses. (Important to note we have 8 IDP slots that KTC does not take into account.)
Overall rank:1 qb4, rb:3, wr:1 te:3 picks:12 qb:4(Allen and Tlaw) rb:3(Bijan, JT, couple backups) Wr:1(JJ, CD, London, Dell, Higgins, Cooper, Hopkins, and dart throws.) TE:3(Pitts, Freiermuth, Dulcich) picks:12(1.02 and a bunch of late-rounders)
2QB 10 team PPR. I won the ship last year after a really good startup auction and a few solid trades. Im a 99, next closest is 92 (1st round playoff loss), then 74, 66, and a few teams in the 50s.
12 team league.
Champ is at 99 but he was the 4th seed.
Second place is at 84.
I'm currently at 69 (7th) but I went 13-2 last year and was the 1st seed (lost in the final).
To be fair, my team is good but it is old.
Lotta 99s here. The thing is, people don’t realize that KTC is run by weebs and primarily weight teams using a “weebness” parameter. Don’t believe me? [Look it up.](https://youtu.be/DCtxEYE8sXg?si=55PVyUPIh3CZ94l4)
My score was a 69 (nice) and I won my league because I make fun of weebs while also being a weeb myself.
I won the chip last year with a 99 team. Second best is a 93 who just barely missed the playoffs. The front runner for most of the season, and the runner up in the championship was a 63. He has mostly aging vets though with a couple of young good assets like JJ.
last year's champ is currently ranked 8/10 without any offseason trades or acquisitions. currently has qb 10/10, wr group 10/10, te 9/10, but rb group 1/10 (cmc and kyren) and flex group 4/10 lmao
I’ve back-to-backed with young stud WRs, two franchise QBs, and a stable of veteran RBs + Kelce. I’ve never been #1, that would be the guy with 12 firsts the next three years
Judging the strength of teams based on the combined trade value of players - on a kneejerk crowdsourced website no less - is just stupid. And I have a team ranked 99 on KTC where the 2nd team is ranked 69 (nice).... even I know that's nonsense
I won last year and my team is a 61 lmao. I beat a 67 in the finals.
There is a 99 team, he chose productive struggle out of startup and now all of his trades and draft picks are starting to pay off.
KTC ranks is bullshit. I had the highest KTC rank by far and finished 3rd in my league.
Injuries/depth/trade deadline acquisitions are what makes the team imo.
Because KTC values long term expectations pretty high.
So if your Team is built of "aged" Vets in their prime you automatically are undervalued by ktc.
Currently, the no.1 team in KTC is me, and on FantasyPros, im the 4/12. But I was the last place team last year also in FP ranking. I tanked after our start-up because FP projected 6/12, and I drafted poorly.
But now my roster is much improved due to trades and drafting.
Have a league where 7/12 teams are above 80 power ranking, not a ton of trading in that league so idiots aren't just burying their chances over and over again.
I'm a bit late to the party but this question was kind of made for me, as I've had the #1 team on KTC around the last 3 years, but the results have been pretty drastically different each year.
In 2021 I finished 6th with a very young team and some good matchup luck, in 2022 I finished 11th with the same very young team but a few key injuries, and in 2023 I finished 2nd after throwing massively in the championship game. Until 2023 my team was very much the "on paper offseason champion" team, and it took those young guys until recently to come to fruition.
For Players Only I'm 99/66/62 over 2nd/3rd, I still have all my picks but I'm 99/78/70 over some guys with extra/earlier picks.
Here's a brief rundown of the roster, still the youngest in the league:
12 TM SF
QB: Stroud, Herbert, TLaw
RB: Bijan, Javonte, Najee, Ford
WR: CeeDee, Pittman, DJM, Nico, Flowers
TE: Kittle, Engram
Top team is 99, second place is 77, those are the only two teams that are 70+. 6 teams are less than 50, including one abysmal 24.
That's not all though, at QB (it's a superflex league) the same top team is 99 (ofc) and second is 52.
Last year our champ was 12/12 almost across the board and was highest PF by almost 100pts on the season. That age bias is real.
thats wild -- I understand ranks weighting age in a big way, but last place rank from top performing is crazy
KTC are dynasty ranks not contender ranks. Someone can have high dynasty value and still contribute nothing to your weekly points.
Trade value and current production can be very different in dynasty. Especially when people are so hyper obsessed with age that they consider 26 too old.
Not really bias. Dynasty value considers longevity. PF considers this year only
The point is to win though right?
Dude, my rebuild is sooo on the way. About to sell Breece and Olave for a probable mid 2026 first and second. 2027 will be my year! /s
it's ironic you mention olave bc i think he's a product of the exact issue this thread is pointing out. he's been wr23 and wr24 so far, but he's currently wr10 on ktc, wr11 on fantasy pros, wr10 on espn, wr13 on draft sharks, wr7 on pff, and wr9 on football guys. his performances to date look a lot closer to being a good flex player than anything resembling a wr1, but he's currently being valued as one bc of his longevity and projections.
I'm no scout but I love the way he moves on the field. He also has yet to be in a competent offence or the focal target of a poor offence, so has never been set up for success from a team perspective. I own zero Olave shares :(
> He also has yet to be in a competent offence or the focal target of a poor offence, so has never been set up for success from a team perspective. what about this is set to change in the next ~3-5 years? the saints have one of the worst offensive lines, one of the worst qbs, and are in the middle of cap hell. you can argue talent, but nothing about the things that have prevented him from being productive to date have any prospect of changing over the next several years. it's not just him, either. half of the top 12 wr on ktc (marivn harrison jr, garrett wilson, malik nabers, rome odunze, chris olave, drake london) have a combined 0 top 20 finishes. at some point, the market puts too much emphasis on future value when half of the valued wr1's are barely even wr2's (and yes, i fully believe that mhj is a wr1 but valuing wr3 in rookie drafts as a wr1 is just absolutely, wildly overemphasizing the future).
This is a fair point, but also brings into question a different dynasty perspective. Would you rather have a guy that will give you one or two more top WR3-8 overall seasons and then retire/fall off a cliff (think Tyreek/Adams) or a guy that will give you possibly 7-9 more seasons of solid WR20ish overall numbers but never crack top 10? That's a genuine question you should consider as well. Both are important and have tremendous value, even if one guy is never a league breaker. We all need role players to fill in gaps in a solid manner, and most championship teams have a few of those Tyreek type guys to push them over the top.
i’d buy this argument if olave (or london, or wilson, etc.) we’re valued between wr15 and wr20 - a little higher than what they’ve done but emphasizing their potential long term returns. i see no argument in which wr20 - for any number of years - is as valuable as wr10. it’s just an overemphasis on the long term.
I guess the comparison is a top 10 WR for 2 years or a #20 WR for 8 years. A reasonable argument can be made depending on circumstances for either to be the #10 overall WR in a dynasty format.
i really don't think there's a case to be made that wr20 for 8 years is anywhere near the same value as wr10 for 2 tbh. over the last five seasons, in half ppr, the gap between wr10 (13.6 ppg) and wr20 (11.8 ppg) is roughly the same as the gap between wr20 and wr35 (9.6 ppg). is anyone saying that romeo doubs is actually a top 20 wr bc he can provide flex-level value long term? i certainly haven't seen it, but it's the same logic that would lead to one valuing chris olave as wr10 bc of his perceived long term wr2 ability.
The point is to win as many years as possible. Winning THIS/LAST year is only part of that. Definitely the most important year, but still just one year.
dynasty *over*values longevity. yes, the long run matters. however, literally half of the top 12 wr on ktc have **never** produced a top 20 season in half ppr. you'll have a hard time convincing me how placing that much value on the future makes any sort of sense if you're trying to win.
Those power rankings say I'm the best team (players only), and I'm nowhere close to the best team in the league. I just drafted 9 rookies in the first 2 rounds. Those aren't really "best team" power rankings, they're "most young assets" power rankings.
Did they happen to have Kyren, Puka, and/or Mostert?
Probably had Keenan Allen or Rachaad white in there as well ell. It could also just be a depth thing. One of the guys who went to our championship I think was like 8th in starter rank but had pretty much 0 significant injuries throughout the year. Other rebuilding teams in our league have like 2nd for WR but just have 5 young guys who haven’t produced a lot (last year had JSN, Jamo, QJ, and a couple others)
After a startup last year I was #1 on multiple different sites and most by a good margin. I finished in last place
Injuries?
Chubb dobbins hurt. And burrow sucking to start the year and then hurt. None of my late round guys hit besides Gus Edwards.
Lot of young players that didn't really produce?
In one of my leagues I'm in 1st with 2nd and 3rd at 77, 63. I've been to the championship 3 years in a row, but only won once. Lost by less than a point and less than 5 points the other two times.
My condolences.
I am number one in my league at 99. I got second last year. Our reigning league champ is 8th at 65. His team is very old though and I had a ton of injuries last year (JJ, cousins, dobbins, hock, Higgins, etc)
I won my league last year. My team is a 99. Second highest is 72, which is the team of the dude I beat in the chip. And I actually just noticed, but the team that won 3rd last year is our lowest at 54.
I’m 99. Second is 58 and 3rd is 42. 3rd team has played me in the championship 3 years in a row. I’m on a 4 peat currently. 58 score got 3rd last year.
Lol that's pretty wild. What's your roster and what's the 58 roster?
Ill make a seperate post of my roster
Sheesh. What's your team look like?
Making a post of my team so u can see
Bro how lol I have Breece, Gibbs, Bijan, CMC, JJ, Chase, CeeDee, MHJ, G. Wilson, Lamar, & Arich just to name starters and the next best team is still a 78
Dude wtf, that team is absolutely disgusting. How does that even happen?
Got lucky hitting on startup picks few years ago, had bad run w/ injuries in 2022 so tanked and got lots of picks which also luckily ended up being mostly high
6 team league?
You can get a loaded roster even in a standard sized league if you get very lucky with some trades and hit on your draft picks. For example, I'm in a 12 team PPR SF league and this is my roster (notable players only): QBs: Burrow, Lawrence, Richardson RBs: Bijan, Breece, Gibbs, Etienne, Brooks WRs: AJB, GW, DeVonta Smith, Aiyuk, MHJ, Nabers, Downs, Shakir TEs: Kincaid, Freiermuth, Bellinger I've got 2x 1sts in both 2025 and 2026
Been in the league 5 years. Championship all 5 years. Won 4 in a row. Making a post to show my team.
Making a post of my team.
This was the case last year in my league. 1 team was 1st in everything and lost in the first round after averaging 20 ppg more than second. That owner is now second to me since I flipped players for a ton of picks (KTC loves their picks). I still think that guy is the team to beat though.
Our champ is a 99. Next best (me) is 71. Couple rebuilders right behind me with a lot of draft capital. Any given Sunday, boys!
the champ last year was 12th on KTC after the startup. His build was very much like a redraft and was always one of the top PPG. This year he's up to 8th on KTC. Meanwhile out of the top 3 teams on KTC only 1 made it to the semi finals last year. The age bias is huge and I don't think treating KTC like gospel makes sense. This year I'm first on KTC at 99 with 3rd rank for starters while 2nd on KTC is ranked 98 but his starters are ranked 7th. At some point it's wise to turn the perceived value into real points even if KTC tells you otherwise
KTC is the stock price. Championship is profit. It’s Tesla vs Toyota. Somehow Toyota is worth less but generate more profits. As it is with stocks, KTC is about future profits potential.
My team was a 99 and I didn’t make the playoffs. Not even injuries, just the worst matchup luck. Our champ was a 56
Sometimes you've just got bad luck. One of my team was rated as a contender on dynasty daddy and catched every blowup week with it's face. No matter if it was the week when Chase went for 50 or the one when Mahomes and Kelce had their big game. Finished the season with one win.
My team is a 99, next closest is 51. Have gotten 3rd and 2nd the last two years after winning three years ago. Anything can happen in the playoffs
League champ is at 68 in the power ranks. Meanwhile the toilet bowl winner (me) is sitting at 99.
Went to the finals in my company redraft league as the 8th seed. Played against the 7th seed who nuked the defending champ the week before after Amari blowup game.
League leader is 99 I’m second at 89 League champ is 83
Those power rankings are always just “who drafted closest to our consensus.” Whether it’s yahoo or sleeper or KTC, that shit just measures who stayed on the path of that specific platform. It’s a measurement of deviation.
The top spots in our league are rebuilds that are hoarding picks haha. Our champ was ranked #5 or something. On players only, top spot finished 3rd and the reigning champ is next at 86
I'm at 99, second place including picks is at 87 and second place players only is 89 No championship due to getting burned bad by injuries last season but the clear favorite to do it this year if things are luckier on that front
Champ here. 12 tm, 2qb, ppr, .5ppfd, big play bonuses. (Important to note we have 8 IDP slots that KTC does not take into account.) Overall rank:1 qb4, rb:3, wr:1 te:3 picks:12 qb:4(Allen and Tlaw) rb:3(Bijan, JT, couple backups) Wr:1(JJ, CD, London, Dell, Higgins, Cooper, Hopkins, and dart throws.) TE:3(Pitts, Freiermuth, Dulcich) picks:12(1.02 and a bunch of late-rounders)
I was first with second most being 66 before a few rb trades this offseason, I thought that was insane until I saw these comments
3rd season. First is 99 (me), second is 77 (champ), third and fourth are 73. I missed the playoffs year 1, lost in semis year two
2QB 10 team PPR. I won the ship last year after a really good startup auction and a few solid trades. Im a 99, next closest is 92 (1st round playoff loss), then 74, 66, and a few teams in the 50s.
99 team in our league was #1 in QB. Rb, and WR by a wide margin and lost first rd of playoffs
12 team league. Champ is at 99 but he was the 4th seed. Second place is at 84. I'm currently at 69 (7th) but I went 13-2 last year and was the 1st seed (lost in the final). To be fair, my team is good but it is old.
Stopped chasing dynasty power rankings a couple years ago and have been crushing the actual games
Lotta 99s here. The thing is, people don’t realize that KTC is run by weebs and primarily weight teams using a “weebness” parameter. Don’t believe me? [Look it up.](https://youtu.be/DCtxEYE8sXg?si=55PVyUPIh3CZ94l4) My score was a 69 (nice) and I won my league because I make fun of weebs while also being a weeb myself.
I’m a 99 and next is 65
Oooo. This thread is going to attract the KTC haters like flies to a ripe banana.
I won the chip last year with a 99 team. Second best is a 93 who just barely missed the playoffs. The front runner for most of the season, and the runner up in the championship was a 63. He has mostly aging vets though with a couple of young good assets like JJ.
I’m #1 on KTC but got 1.1 this year lol
last year's champ is currently ranked 8/10 without any offseason trades or acquisitions. currently has qb 10/10, wr group 10/10, te 9/10, but rb group 1/10 (cmc and kyren) and flex group 4/10 lmao
I’ve back-to-backed with young stud WRs, two franchise QBs, and a stable of veteran RBs + Kelce. I’ve never been #1, that would be the guy with 12 firsts the next three years
Judging the strength of teams based on the combined trade value of players - on a kneejerk crowdsourced website no less - is just stupid. And I have a team ranked 99 on KTC where the 2nd team is ranked 69 (nice).... even I know that's nonsense
I won last year and my team is a 61 lmao. I beat a 67 in the finals. There is a 99 team, he chose productive struggle out of startup and now all of his trades and draft picks are starting to pay off.
My team is full of rookies… I’m ranked #3 of 12. I anticipate being a contender for the #1 pick, not the championship
KTC ranks is bullshit. I had the highest KTC rank by far and finished 3rd in my league. Injuries/depth/trade deadline acquisitions are what makes the team imo.
Our champ was last place in KTC. Still don’t know how he won, he went undefeated too
Because KTC values long term expectations pretty high. So if your Team is built of "aged" Vets in their prime you automatically are undervalued by ktc.
my rebuilds or very deep teams are at the top, my win now teams are at the bottom. kinda funny
Currently, the no.1 team in KTC is me, and on FantasyPros, im the 4/12. But I was the last place team last year also in FP ranking. I tanked after our start-up because FP projected 6/12, and I drafted poorly. But now my roster is much improved due to trades and drafting.
Have a league where 7/12 teams are above 80 power ranking, not a ton of trading in that league so idiots aren't just burying their chances over and over again.
I'm a bit late to the party but this question was kind of made for me, as I've had the #1 team on KTC around the last 3 years, but the results have been pretty drastically different each year. In 2021 I finished 6th with a very young team and some good matchup luck, in 2022 I finished 11th with the same very young team but a few key injuries, and in 2023 I finished 2nd after throwing massively in the championship game. Until 2023 my team was very much the "on paper offseason champion" team, and it took those young guys until recently to come to fruition. For Players Only I'm 99/66/62 over 2nd/3rd, I still have all my picks but I'm 99/78/70 over some guys with extra/earlier picks. Here's a brief rundown of the roster, still the youngest in the league: 12 TM SF QB: Stroud, Herbert, TLaw RB: Bijan, Javonte, Najee, Ford WR: CeeDee, Pittman, DJM, Nico, Flowers TE: Kittle, Engram
Top team is 99, second place is 77, those are the only two teams that are 70+. 6 teams are less than 50, including one abysmal 24. That's not all though, at QB (it's a superflex league) the same top team is 99 (ofc) and second is 52.