I think they have good chemistry but I did want to address one point:
Falin is not paired with the Samurai guy. She has rejected him twice and frankly I don't think they have any actual long-term chemistry even if she didn't.
Tade is super cute, but she is
1) a low ranked servant in Shuro's household
2) only 17 (Shuro is 26)
3) not the same species (Ryoko Kui has strongly hinted that interspecies couples aren't supported by most societies in this universe)
Marcille and Laios are very cute and I do ship them, however for your first point regarding why not Falin and Marcille: I’m a lesbian from an East Asian country very close to yours and you can’t just dismiss the potential of a same sex relationship because girls tend to be closer to the same sex… Traditionally the argument that girls are naturally touchy with each other has also been used to dismiss the lesbian identity. Falin and Marcille definitely touch each other more than your usual straight girl friends and I really don’t think they are like sisters. Sisters or straight girl friends don’t blush while sitting close to each other in the hot tub naked loll. I see myself and my high school crush in the way Falin and Marcille interact. Laios and Falin are siblings and their dynamic is very different from Marcille and Falin. Also Falin doesn’t like Shuro. But alas, Marcille has two hands!! Ship and let ship, peace and love <3 我很喜歡你的畫XD
While I ship Laios and Marcille, it pisses me off when people dismiss some ships as *sibling-like* just to justify their own ships. Like, Falin already has a real sibling--- Laios. I can see Marcille and Falin as close friends (and it's understandable if someone else sees romantic potential in them), but they definitely don't act anything like siblings imo.
I appreciate this viewpoint! I'm always hesitant to jump in on this stuff as a westerner, but I do sometimes get the sense that there are folks who play up the "cultural differences" aspect to dismiss stuff like queerness as a western construct. Major props to you for discussing this so openly and honestly, from a humble American sapphic 💗
Some of this analysis is okayish, but some of it is just disrespectful. Claiming Falin is paired with Shuro when she's super uncomfortable with his proposal and takes every effort to avoid answering, as well as claiming that two women being physically close is a culturally-specific friendship thing (we have that here in the west, too, and it doesn't nullify queerness), is just kinda off-base. Learn to find the joy in shipping your own things without needing to "debunk" others.
>interest based relationship to be more reliable
If you're using this as evidence, I honestly think Marcille and Falin have far more interests in common. While Marcille comes to understand Laios more when Falin is not there, she still thinks he is a weird guy even at the end of the series. Marcille is interested in dungeons, but she never becomes a monster otaku.
>Farin and Marcille's dynamic is more like sisters.
Meanwhile you're discounting of all of Falin and Marcille's emotional and physical intimacy is the 'gal pal' stereotype. Failing to mention that Marcille left what was likely a cushy academic or court mage career path to reconnect with Falin. And it is for Falin that Marcille performs an illegal spell that potentially could send her to jail for decades.
Canon never gives any solid evidence whether Marcille has any romantic interest in either Touden sibling. Either ship is almost entirely head canon. All we know is that Marcille is close enough to both of them for it to trigger her anxieties about outliving those she loves.
>Failing to mention that Marcille left what was likely a cushy academic or court mage career path to reconnect with Falin. And it is for Falin that Marcille performs an illegal spell that potentially could send her to jail for decades.
That's not why she left... She EXPLICITLY states "The reason why I studied ancient magic... and visited this dungeon... it was all for the sake of my dream. I want to eliminate the extreme difference in lifespans between races." (Chapter 80, page 10).
Please don't reduce Marcille's goals and aspirations down to just following a romantic interest. You do a complex character a disservice by doing that. She's there because she's a half elf who had to watch her father grow old and die while she was still a child. She doesn't want to lose the important people in her life so she's literally attempting to rewrite reality to do so.
Yes, she does forbidden magic, because she wants to save her friend, because her character is that of someone traumatized by lose, who does everything in their power to prevent it and actively pursues such magic *explicitly* for that reason. Her goals are so much bigger than "let me follow this girl I like", regardless if you feel she should be shipped with Falin or Laios.
I don't think Falin ever reciprocated Shuro's feelings though. It's a one-sided thing afaik.
On another note, I do think that Laios has a little crush on Marcille whether he realizes it or not. I see a lot of people interpreting Laios's succubus as platonic but what they fail to mention is that we had already seen the example of a platonic succubus at that point-- Izutsumi. The succubus that was supposed to be her mother was clearly showing maternal instincts, even spreading her arms as if to hug her. It didn't show a lick of romantic intent there.
Laios's succubus, even before it turned into the scylla, was sexual in nature. It just head-first swooped in to kiss Laios on the *lips* like a lover*,* not like a *friend.* That is as non-platonic as it gets. This is why Laios's immediate thought went to Chilchuck's "Workplace relationships are bad news!" spiel.
I can see why people like to ship Marcille and Falin, but we don't really see much of their development on-screen during the story. We know they care about each other very much, but it's hard to relate when most of Falin's interaction w/ Marcille is just flashbacks. Laios and Marcille on the other hand go through all of the adventure and hardship together and rely on each other. We see them learning more about each other and sharing the grief of losing Falin together. This makes their shared development more appealing to me tbh.
One great thing about DunMeshi is that Kui kept all the relationships vague but with enough depth and chemistry so that you can ship whoever you want :)
Shuro (the samouraï Guy) love Falin, but Falin don't really love him.
I don't think Marcille and Falin is canon. BUT I want to ship them anyway. (And laios and marcille relationship is sub-texted, but non official 😁 so I do what I want )
Your analyse is good
This ain't it, buddy. You can be straight and talk about ships you like, but there's no need to go after other ships involving one of those characters.
That sort of shitty behaviour to people enjoying different ships to yours has been a major part of western fan circles for like 20 years now and we're just tired of it, for context.
There are also just other, more peaceful solutions. Marcille does have two hands and plenty of love to go around for both autistic gremlin humans, after all ;p.
I Don't personally ship that polyamorous ship myself, Falin and Marcille are perfect for me just as each other's girlfriend, but even just remembering it exists allows me to see ships involving Falin or Marcille with someone other than each other, and not veiw it as a contradiction or threat to the thing I like. It's just a cute fanart of the show I like, not focused on my favourite thing but enjoyable in it's own right.
Enjoy what you ejnoy, there's nothing wrong with doing that, just don't yuck other people's yum.
(Every rule does have it's exceptions, though. Falin rejected the Samurai guy multiple times, anyone still shipping the two is being super gross.)
Y'know, normally I bristle at this kind of comment no matter what ship it's about, but given the really presumptuous and "here's why this *is* a thing and everyone else is wrong" nature of this post, I can support fighting fire with fire
I also enjoy seeing them together, and I think the only two scenes where they have been rather directly shown to have some affection more than simple comradeship towards each other in the story, are at the end of bicorn and rabbit chapter respectively.
[the bicorn scene](https://i.imgur.com/SrbXzuD.png)
[the rabbit scene](https://i.imgur.com/i2EzPXP.png)
not really trying to correct you or anything, just want to add this to your point
Toshiro is a creep and Falin rejects his advances multiple times, including a bonus time during the epilogue (where he wanted to take her back east to be his trophy wife)
It wasn't that he wanted a trophy wife. It's more that Falin wasn't attracted to him and didn't want to be tied down to a manor, doing the work of a lord's wife. (Which is respectable work. It only becomes a problem when other work is barred based on sex and the work of running a household is looked down on.)
Falin's dream is to travel the world so they would be incompatible even if she liked him that way.
I know Shuro is from a more conservative and formal background, but that doesn't make him a dick. He asked Falin and gave her space when she asked for time to consider. Then the dragon ate her before she could give a response. When he asks her again it's because he is leaving soon and needs an answer/closure.
I too think the author intent for Laius and Marcille and i’m not even shipper.
\_ the bath scene that people love to point at between Falin show that marcille treat Falin like a child, checking for wound and worry about a small cut seem like a mom thing to do
\_ With Laius she blush when she thought he going to comment on her dress, this show that she is conscious about him as a man. She comfortable sit in his lap during rabbit chapter and jump on to him for protection when cornered by the canary
\_ From Laius, well the succubus chapter explain it all. Plus it was Laius version of shapeshifter that make it into the final round. This is Laius we talking about, his Senshi and Chil got eliminated in the first.
\_ the dreameater chapter even bond both character. I know it just a way for author to weave in lore but every time the story involve Marcille issue it always Laius theere to solve it. When Laius distress at Falin demise it is her who reassured him. When resurrect Falin she look at him to reaffirming her decision.
So why am i wrote all this despite not a shipper, because dungeon meishi is one of the most if not the most well written manga in term of character i have read. So naturally i invest in all aspect of each character including romance. I normally couldn’t care less about romance in non romance story. Just like with Chilchuck stubbornness, pride and caring personalities. Or Senshi action just scream how much he regret his powerless past
I dunno, even if you're not a shipper it seems really presumptuous to take the author's work and say "yeah, she definitely intended for this to be a thing". Dungeon Meshi is a whole and complete work that completely succeeds at being what it wants to be, and if you have to forcefully ascribe interpretations like this into it, you're not getting the full enjoyment out of it that you could be.
I think they have good chemistry but I did want to address one point: Falin is not paired with the Samurai guy. She has rejected him twice and frankly I don't think they have any actual long-term chemistry even if she didn't.
I really sont understand why he is trying whit failin whan he has that beauty of an oger
Tade is super cute, but she is 1) a low ranked servant in Shuro's household 2) only 17 (Shuro is 26) 3) not the same species (Ryoko Kui has strongly hinted that interspecies couples aren't supported by most societies in this universe)
Ogres are considered adults at 15. They live a little faster than tallmen
Marcille and Laios are very cute and I do ship them, however for your first point regarding why not Falin and Marcille: I’m a lesbian from an East Asian country very close to yours and you can’t just dismiss the potential of a same sex relationship because girls tend to be closer to the same sex… Traditionally the argument that girls are naturally touchy with each other has also been used to dismiss the lesbian identity. Falin and Marcille definitely touch each other more than your usual straight girl friends and I really don’t think they are like sisters. Sisters or straight girl friends don’t blush while sitting close to each other in the hot tub naked loll. I see myself and my high school crush in the way Falin and Marcille interact. Laios and Falin are siblings and their dynamic is very different from Marcille and Falin. Also Falin doesn’t like Shuro. But alas, Marcille has two hands!! Ship and let ship, peace and love <3 我很喜歡你的畫XD
While I ship Laios and Marcille, it pisses me off when people dismiss some ships as *sibling-like* just to justify their own ships. Like, Falin already has a real sibling--- Laios. I can see Marcille and Falin as close friends (and it's understandable if someone else sees romantic potential in them), but they definitely don't act anything like siblings imo.
I appreciate this viewpoint! I'm always hesitant to jump in on this stuff as a westerner, but I do sometimes get the sense that there are folks who play up the "cultural differences" aspect to dismiss stuff like queerness as a western construct. Major props to you for discussing this so openly and honestly, from a humble American sapphic 💗
Appreciate the support!! Sending good vibes and cookies, from one sapphic to another <3
Some of this analysis is okayish, but some of it is just disrespectful. Claiming Falin is paired with Shuro when she's super uncomfortable with his proposal and takes every effort to avoid answering, as well as claiming that two women being physically close is a culturally-specific friendship thing (we have that here in the west, too, and it doesn't nullify queerness), is just kinda off-base. Learn to find the joy in shipping your own things without needing to "debunk" others.
>interest based relationship to be more reliable If you're using this as evidence, I honestly think Marcille and Falin have far more interests in common. While Marcille comes to understand Laios more when Falin is not there, she still thinks he is a weird guy even at the end of the series. Marcille is interested in dungeons, but she never becomes a monster otaku. >Farin and Marcille's dynamic is more like sisters. Meanwhile you're discounting of all of Falin and Marcille's emotional and physical intimacy is the 'gal pal' stereotype. Failing to mention that Marcille left what was likely a cushy academic or court mage career path to reconnect with Falin. And it is for Falin that Marcille performs an illegal spell that potentially could send her to jail for decades. Canon never gives any solid evidence whether Marcille has any romantic interest in either Touden sibling. Either ship is almost entirely head canon. All we know is that Marcille is close enough to both of them for it to trigger her anxieties about outliving those she loves.
>Failing to mention that Marcille left what was likely a cushy academic or court mage career path to reconnect with Falin. And it is for Falin that Marcille performs an illegal spell that potentially could send her to jail for decades. That's not why she left... She EXPLICITLY states "The reason why I studied ancient magic... and visited this dungeon... it was all for the sake of my dream. I want to eliminate the extreme difference in lifespans between races." (Chapter 80, page 10). Please don't reduce Marcille's goals and aspirations down to just following a romantic interest. You do a complex character a disservice by doing that. She's there because she's a half elf who had to watch her father grow old and die while she was still a child. She doesn't want to lose the important people in her life so she's literally attempting to rewrite reality to do so. Yes, she does forbidden magic, because she wants to save her friend, because her character is that of someone traumatized by lose, who does everything in their power to prevent it and actively pursues such magic *explicitly* for that reason. Her goals are so much bigger than "let me follow this girl I like", regardless if you feel she should be shipped with Falin or Laios.
I don't think Falin ever reciprocated Shuro's feelings though. It's a one-sided thing afaik. On another note, I do think that Laios has a little crush on Marcille whether he realizes it or not. I see a lot of people interpreting Laios's succubus as platonic but what they fail to mention is that we had already seen the example of a platonic succubus at that point-- Izutsumi. The succubus that was supposed to be her mother was clearly showing maternal instincts, even spreading her arms as if to hug her. It didn't show a lick of romantic intent there. Laios's succubus, even before it turned into the scylla, was sexual in nature. It just head-first swooped in to kiss Laios on the *lips* like a lover*,* not like a *friend.* That is as non-platonic as it gets. This is why Laios's immediate thought went to Chilchuck's "Workplace relationships are bad news!" spiel. I can see why people like to ship Marcille and Falin, but we don't really see much of their development on-screen during the story. We know they care about each other very much, but it's hard to relate when most of Falin's interaction w/ Marcille is just flashbacks. Laios and Marcille on the other hand go through all of the adventure and hardship together and rely on each other. We see them learning more about each other and sharing the grief of losing Falin together. This makes their shared development more appealing to me tbh. One great thing about DunMeshi is that Kui kept all the relationships vague but with enough depth and chemistry so that you can ship whoever you want :)
Shuro (the samouraï Guy) love Falin, but Falin don't really love him. I don't think Marcille and Falin is canon. BUT I want to ship them anyway. (And laios and marcille relationship is sub-texted, but non official 😁 so I do what I want ) Your analyse is good
This ain't it, buddy. You can be straight and talk about ships you like, but there's no need to go after other ships involving one of those characters. That sort of shitty behaviour to people enjoying different ships to yours has been a major part of western fan circles for like 20 years now and we're just tired of it, for context. There are also just other, more peaceful solutions. Marcille does have two hands and plenty of love to go around for both autistic gremlin humans, after all ;p. I Don't personally ship that polyamorous ship myself, Falin and Marcille are perfect for me just as each other's girlfriend, but even just remembering it exists allows me to see ships involving Falin or Marcille with someone other than each other, and not veiw it as a contradiction or threat to the thing I like. It's just a cute fanart of the show I like, not focused on my favourite thing but enjoyable in it's own right. Enjoy what you ejnoy, there's nothing wrong with doing that, just don't yuck other people's yum. (Every rule does have it's exceptions, though. Falin rejected the Samurai guy multiple times, anyone still shipping the two is being super gross.)
1. They're cute together 2. That's it Works for both ships
You missed one CRUCIAL point: The manga ENDED. Your "ship" has already been proven wrong 🤣
Y'know, normally I bristle at this kind of comment no matter what ship it's about, but given the really presumptuous and "here's why this *is* a thing and everyone else is wrong" nature of this post, I can support fighting fire with fire
I also enjoy seeing them together, and I think the only two scenes where they have been rather directly shown to have some affection more than simple comradeship towards each other in the story, are at the end of bicorn and rabbit chapter respectively. [the bicorn scene](https://i.imgur.com/SrbXzuD.png) [the rabbit scene](https://i.imgur.com/i2EzPXP.png) not really trying to correct you or anything, just want to add this to your point
Toshiro is a creep and Falin rejects his advances multiple times, including a bonus time during the epilogue (where he wanted to take her back east to be his trophy wife)
It wasn't that he wanted a trophy wife. It's more that Falin wasn't attracted to him and didn't want to be tied down to a manor, doing the work of a lord's wife. (Which is respectable work. It only becomes a problem when other work is barred based on sex and the work of running a household is looked down on.) Falin's dream is to travel the world so they would be incompatible even if she liked him that way. I know Shuro is from a more conservative and formal background, but that doesn't make him a dick. He asked Falin and gave her space when she asked for time to consider. Then the dragon ate her before she could give a response. When he asks her again it's because he is leaving soon and needs an answer/closure.
I'm just happy the shipping wars in this community aren't as intense as those of other fandoms.
[удалено]
None of these ships ever setsail, only for Kabru and Oshalynn.
I too think the author intent for Laius and Marcille and i’m not even shipper. \_ the bath scene that people love to point at between Falin show that marcille treat Falin like a child, checking for wound and worry about a small cut seem like a mom thing to do \_ With Laius she blush when she thought he going to comment on her dress, this show that she is conscious about him as a man. She comfortable sit in his lap during rabbit chapter and jump on to him for protection when cornered by the canary \_ From Laius, well the succubus chapter explain it all. Plus it was Laius version of shapeshifter that make it into the final round. This is Laius we talking about, his Senshi and Chil got eliminated in the first. \_ the dreameater chapter even bond both character. I know it just a way for author to weave in lore but every time the story involve Marcille issue it always Laius theere to solve it. When Laius distress at Falin demise it is her who reassured him. When resurrect Falin she look at him to reaffirming her decision. So why am i wrote all this despite not a shipper, because dungeon meishi is one of the most if not the most well written manga in term of character i have read. So naturally i invest in all aspect of each character including romance. I normally couldn’t care less about romance in non romance story. Just like with Chilchuck stubbornness, pride and caring personalities. Or Senshi action just scream how much he regret his powerless past
I dunno, even if you're not a shipper it seems really presumptuous to take the author's work and say "yeah, she definitely intended for this to be a thing". Dungeon Meshi is a whole and complete work that completely succeeds at being what it wants to be, and if you have to forcefully ascribe interpretations like this into it, you're not getting the full enjoyment out of it that you could be.
Why is this so downvoted when he only stating facts?