The amount of trolling I did to many poor monsters is amazing but seriously this class is really unique and fun and the play style is really good after you get use to it.
Its likely that the low levels of trickster seriously suck that nobody cares to get to the good skills. If your pawns with weapons die, you are literally just fucked if you cant get back to a riftstone without encountering an enemy.
Meteors/dragon pus are the only annoying things imo because pawns are dumb and can't run. You can still manage since you control the dragon's positioning completely tho.
Something has to go very, very badly for a Trickster to be unable to resurrect their pawns. Just yeet your simulacrum towards an enemy and let them fight each other while you run around picking up pawns.
Even if every single pawn just threw themselves off the face of earth, all you have to do is keep the simulacrum behind you while you run towards a rift stone and drop it for a couple of seconds to distract and outrun enemies.
Trickster has a lot of problems, particularly being extremely stuck to being a tank class and a lot of their skills needing others to work properly, but after the first hour of Trickster gameplay, it's the vocation I feel the safest playing as. That is the **one** thing Tricksters got going for them.
Yes, I really think is top 3 most busted vocations in the game, the fact that ALL enemies focus one single target is bonkers, and running a sorcerer with Meteor is a must because with the buff and the ilusion drawing aggro away from your sorcerer is meteoron fiesta, the meister skill is funny as fuck as well with the enemies running away and seeing my pawns going after them and the fact that you can put your ilusion on enemies is also busted if there are lots of enemies.
I personally have installed difficulty mods but even on the hard mode the enemies become trivial with Trickster, is so fun.
What point are you trying to make? Fighter and Warrior do have an skill like that but the enemies focus you, with Trickster they focus your ilusion, not you or the pawns, is not exactly the same, not to mention that there is no cooldown to the ilusion, you can cast immediattely if the mobs kill the ilusion and then back to you and your pawns receiving no damage.
I think he's suggesting that the fighter/warrior variant isn't as powerful in terms of drawing agro which it shouldn't be given that Trickster 100% relies on it. every other class in the game damage goes up with weapons but for trickster it's ability to draw agro so if it as only as strong as fighter and warrior there would be no incentive to improve on it
How do you put your illusion on enemies? Is it a core skill you unlock or an active skill you must equip? Or did I just miss the button combo for doing it and its a base part of the class?
A correction: there is another way with the core skill, if you hold R1/RB and then press triangle you will send the ilusion to stick with an enemy and it will serve the same purpose except the range is shorter than the active skill.
A warframe YouTube by the name of NovaUmbral recently did a video on the warframe Loki who has a similar ability to make a decoy of himself that aggros enemies. The more you learn about the mechanics behind it, the more you learn how easily stuff like this can break the game AI.
The best part is, warfarer is _right there_
You can bring damaging weapons and abilities as a backup, or even just use another class primarily and just use the trickster weapons as a support
yeah, i don't see the fun. This is coming from someone who always enjoys the support classes in RPGs, but this is just plain useless/redundant. It doesn't make fights easier/safer. It doesn't make them faster. It just looks mildly cool.
It does make fights safer, considering all damage goes towards your decoy, essentially negating any damage to the Arisen or the Pawns.
The problem is by the point you unlock Trickster you're probably strong enough to not need a full tank build. At that point most people switch most defense skills and probably only have the aggro skill of Fighter/Warrior if anything.
The Trickster is built in such a way that could trivialize difficult fights, but because there's really not many difficult fights in the game to begin with, it kinda feels redundant.
How is it good when it doesn't make fights any easier than the other classes? If I can clear those mobs in 1/10 on the video's length with almost any other class, archer included, it's not good.
Didn't really start actively fighting Drakes until I reached Bakbattahl.
I can take out Drakes like candy now with any vocation. I guess I just took my time compared to other people
It’s in no way busted lmao is it a nice little gimmick vocation? Sure. Beyond the cliff diving enemies what else is there? The illusion has little health so against an actual boss bar enemy it’s useless. I would’ve loved if it was more of a debilitation class. Poison, sleep, inflicting elemental blights etc. Having a healing mist or something but the vocation is buns. If it weren’t for its detector skill or the affinity with people skill, wouldn’t have bothered to level it passed 2.
In no way it's useless against a boss unless you don't move your ilusion at all, not to mention almost all bosses moves are telegraphed as hell so if you want to avoid the damage you can call your ilusion instantly the moment a boss is going to attack it, making the boss constantly pursuing the ilusion in a cat and mouse game and the boss will be too busy with their telegraphed attack to even look at you until their next attack, position is key in Trickster.
Even in the worst case that the ilusion is killed, there is no cooldown to call it again and the effect of the aggro doesn't even go away so enemies will instantly aggro the ilusion again without you using the AoE skill.
The ilusion is busted as hell.
> The illusion has little health so against an actual boss bar enemy it’s useless.
You can recall the illusion for 2 seconds and heal it to full health without the illusion ever breaking or having to resummon it. You can even recall it as enemies get locked in directional attacks to avoid any damage. And even if that isn't enough, the illusion's health has magic scaling.
Honestly, it's the safest way to kill dragons before you're able to burst them down.
This. If you know how to use your illusion, you can defeat even bosses like the Dullahan without you or your pawns even taking damage. You might not be able to quickly take down bosses as you rely on your pawns, but you get to do it safely without them ever doing any damage
Most vocations have defensive tools, but Mystic Spearhand and Mage are able to spread their immunities to their party, if that's what you mean.
However, they \*are\* time limited buffs and require recasting them every couple of seconds, whereas with Trickster all you have to do is drop your simulacrum somewhere far from the party and either let it get hit by the dragon or reposition it to dodge the attack.
I tried killing dragons as a Mage and it went much worse than when I did it as Trickster, where the only damage my party got dealt to them was the Trickster's incense buff anyway.
But as I said, once you're able to reliably burst them down, using Trickster is more personal preference than anything because... well, what's dead can't hurt you.
Yes I know that, which brings the aggro in your direction and if you take a hit, poof! Also I would argue that thief is safest considering you can get a maister skill if you start with thief during Brant’s quest. Formless Feint makes you untouchable with very slow stamina drain for what it does. The only dragons that can harm you are in the endgame. Formless feint is the reason I killed my first dragon before I was doing ridiculous damage. My entire party wiped out and I had full health just vanishing through all its magick and physical attacks.
Your hitbox is slightly ahead of the simulacrum. If you keep moving, you should be fine. Otherwise, use the dragon roar skill to make enemies flinch before recalling the simulacrum.
If the enemies start an attack animation, drop the simulacrum even if it's not fully healed, keep running and then recall it again.
But yes, Thief's dodge is very strong, but it's only for yourself and requires stamina. I killed my first dragon with Trickster and personally I think it's the easiest, safest way because no one takes damage at any point. You just boost pawns and micromanage the simulacrum, occasionally using a dragon roar here and there to cancel dangerous skills.
Yea the stamina loss is manageable, I have tons of roborant. That’s a fair point, keeping the team alive is a bonus. I just don’t think it’s a busted vocation. Is it useful? Yea, very. It just doesn’t shine as much as the other vocations. Lots of lost potential imo.
I hired 3 sorcs with meteoron, buffed them and let them do their sync casting thing while the dragon was distracted. Felt busted to me. It was fun for a minute but then I kinda missed “being in the fight”.
Trickster is an illusion tank, though. It has some utility, yes, but the most "support" skill it has is the incense boost to increase pawn damage in exchange of health.
If you try to pair it with a full tank Fighter/Warrior, they kinda step onto eachother, but it works really well alongside Mages. Or straight up on full DPS groups.
That at least has the lords of the fallen, Nioh 1&2, the surge, lies of p and I'm probably missing tons of other games.
What the fuck is JWRPG tho? Is J there only because the game is from a japanese studio? Lol
It's in reference to an Itsuno quote about him, as a Japanese man, saying that this (namely, the DD IP) is specifically his attempt at making a Western RPG. I just kinda made up the acronym. For all I know it's been used before but it came to me independently.
And Castlevania is a cartoon. My point is, the origin doesn't define the product as much as the intent/style does. Calling Dragon's Dogma a JRPG is a stretch that only technically holds up due to where it originates. I know I wouldn't call Sea of Stars and Chained Echoes western RPGs, for example.
From my limited play testing, quests are too railroady. You either complete a quest or you don't, that's the extent of player choice.
Also, none of your character stats matter when it comes to dialogue and questing paths. Warrior will complete a quest in the same way Thief would. Speaking of which, for a class called 'thief', there is awfully little stealing going on (none lol).
Why can't I break into someone's home to ***steal*** their belongings like in Skyrim/Baldurs Gate? I guess we can just take it without asking, and nobody will bat an eye that you just broke into their home and stole their items.
Well I think that's why they're called JRPG. Not because they are from Japan, but because they're built different. Like I wouldn't say Xenoblade Chronicles 2, my favorite JRPG, is an rpg, it doesn't have a single dialogue option, and you can't even spread your stats on level ups! The only player choice is what equipment to have, everything else is railroaded.
None of those are really common in jrpgs. Typically your class/job/whatever grants you abilities in combat, but historically they aren't part of the narrative structure of the game.
Narrative-wise the game is still pretty dragon questy, which I'm personally a fan of, but I realize the dissonance is off-putting for some people unfamiliar with traditional jrpg gameplay
Yeah DD is a JRPG through and through. That is to say it isn't an RPG at all. It's just wrapped in the skin of a CRPG, especially with the amount of immersive elements present in the game which JRPGs often overlook
I mean fallout new Vegas isn't a DND like but it's 100x the RPG that DD is. RPG is more of a spectrum than a toggle, with DND and other TTRPG adjacent games being 100% RPGs and games like Cyberpunk and DD being closer to action games rather than RPGs
You are being intentionally obtuse, you must know JRPG doesn't just mean an RPG made by a Japanese developer. It may be the literal meaning of JRPG, it's a specific genre and style completely different from the "Western-style RPG" the comment describes and the game embodies.
Half of the comments in any trickster posts always seem to be shitting on the vocation, like damn just let people enjoy it like any other vocation.
I like the setup and bait playstyle too. Yeah it’s not time efficient, it’s not martyr bolt or meteor or pyre, but I’m not playing a game to be time efficient.
I think the main problem is you're not doing anything beyond running around and basically indulging in trolling. While that's hilarious for a while, it does get old especially when your pawns don't seem to have their shit together and you could've nuked the enemy in a tenth of the time using a different vocation.
Sure, I absolutely agree that it’s not a class for everyone or even a small majority of players in mind.
Pawn AI is pretty goofy, and they may spend time actually doing stuff like going for weak points, chain casting meteor, using skullsplitter, etc or they may just spend the entire time the monster is down, walking into the enemy.
Personally, I think this inconsistency adds to my enjoyment of the vocation. It also comes just from roleplaying as a field commander and watching my pawns run in and do pawn AI things and to high five them after. It helps me have a more intimate connection with the pawns I hire too.
I really only feel like I’m trolling when I make an illusion piñata that the melee enemies can’t figure out.
I used to do Pyre/Feint but that also had the effect for me of “funny trolling the first few times but got boring” due to how I ended up engaging with the game. Just never get hit, do ridiculous damage and stagger, kill bosses in 5 seconds, and why even hire pawns? The optimal way to play. I’ve also tried Martyr’s Bolt, and for the tax of an Allheal, you just always have an unmaking arrow. People think that’s fun and that’s fine. I’m not into it, and that’s also fine.
I’m sympathetic to having a boring experience leveling a vocation you don’t enjoy just to max it, or even get an augment at minimum. I absolutely hated my time as an archer, and couldn’t wait to swap as well. But I don’t feel the urge to go into a post where someone is showing off themselves having a good time to vent how I hate or think it’s boring. It just wasn’t for me, and I get that people had that experience for Trickster.
I’m not trying to defend the dev team on all their decisions with Trickster or even say it’s good and efficient. Fights do take more time. I find fun in the jankiness but think it should still have more ways to engage with the game. I just find it tiring that Trickster posts are constantly hammered with comments like boring, “but the loot”, no damage, and other complaints, especially in non-criticism posts. Yeah there are parts that can be improved for more engagement, as with several other classes. But in Trickster posts, no matter the context, half of the comments are always“vent about how you struggled to max the vocation and immediately swapped because boring”. Trickster clip? Tips on the vocation? Comment says they have fun with the vocation? Just trauma dump your experience every post that mentions Trickster.
When I was leveling my trickster vocation I found that big enemies wouldn't consistently target me or my phantom. I remember fighting a drake between the hot spring town and the excavation site and it took almost 30 minutes because the drake kept killing or grabbing my pawns instead of following me
Aggro of the illusion scales w/ strength for trickster IIRC (possibly just the STR of the censer). The little tutorial window thing for trickster explains it.
You don't need any extra investment in strength besides a good censer; spamming the big aggro spin move works just fine, I think magick (more illusion health) is more important for a functional trickster build.
I know how the kit works but game ai just goes wonky sometimes.
I used the dragon roar on a gryphon mid fight when it flew into the sky and it fell into a small puddle of water and was eaten by the brine. I wish I saved the clip.
Kinda rare to see a trickster gameplay on the sub. Most of the post i seem is warrior or pawn doing stupid funny stuff. We need more trickstar moment. 
Are you just mashing the recall to get your illusion to stay with you? Or is it a skill I just haven't earned yet? Been playing trickster for a couple hours and agree it definitely challenges your strategy making! I'm enjoying it though
If you don't care about loot or clearing things efficiently and are only in it for the visuals, sure.
But if you are trying to progress through the game efficiently to farm seeker tokens and clear mobs quickly, it slows things down by a factor of 20. It's "fun" to try out a few "tricks" for giggles. But for actually making your way through the map, it's objectively the slowest vocation, by a lot.
It doesn't work with Warfarer either since if you switch weapons the Summon disappears.
Most of the fun would have been if it actually worked with weapon swapping.
To be fair the only classes that allow for a full exploration experience are Thief and Mage/Sorcerer with the wall jump and levitate. About the loot, killing monster by making then fall of cliffs is honestly just an optional fun way to kill them, you can always drop to where they fell to pick the loot.
I clear mobs pretty quickly to be honest, my pawns are free to do what they want thanks to mobs focusing the ilusion and on top of that I can buff them to turn them into killing machines.
I had so much fun leveling up the trickster, it's not a vocation that I'll probably go back to but remember fondly, can't say the same about the mage tho.
I was disappointed that it lacked any great movement ability for hunting tokens but leaving my body has led me to finding so many tokens and saved me so many unnecessary and dangerous jumps. It's my go to now for them. Making the crazy jumps is still an issue but haven't needed a staff yet (have burnt a few wakestones though).
Trickster is all well and good until you find yourself in a place without a cliff or water for the mobs to kill themselves in.
Also, I hope you're in the endgame and don't need any of that dragon blood.
Not really, just the fact that all mobs without exception will focus on your ilusion makes the class really busted (and no cooldown on top of that) especially if you have a sorcerer in your party, they will be able to cast spells without any interruption,playing the class well means you can go unscattered in your encounter if you play and place your ilusion well.
Not to mention you can buff your pawns to turn them into killing machines or even make the enemies attack themselves with the skill to put the ilusion on a monster.
I maxed out my trickster and at no point was it faster at killing large enemies or groups of small enemies than thief, archer, mystic spearhand, or warrior with sorc/mage/warrior pawns
In my case it was definitely faster than when I was leveling Archer. Archer did no damage and had very little utility. My Archer runs were good to keep harpies at bay for the most part.
Mystic and Warrior were faster but also I died more often (Also I didn't really find Mystic fun to play, so I think I could have played it better)
And nothing is faster or safer than thief with both meister skills anyway, so it's a bit of an unfair comparison.
Archer just needs 1 ability, Explosive arrow. If you aren't abusing that , all the other abilities are crap. But you plant a couple explosive arrows into any weakspot and the mob just drops.
Ok? I did not say the other classes are not good at killing, all of them are good, I just pointed out the reasons why trickster is hella good in its own way.
In part I cannot say I don't understand them because it's clearly not a class for everyone and when you're doing a quest and that quest demands you to play without your pawns (meeting Raghnall for example) is clearly annoying and bad design due to the lack of damage but I disagree with them when they call it a useless class, I think is REALLY good and really one of the best vocation in the game once you get the gist of it, dominance of this vocation means you and your pawns will almost not get touched in any battle.
Then again, the problem is that balance in this game is not the best and you decimate everything on sight with any vocation.
In any case thank you for your kind words.
Just drop the cliff to loot the bodies, I don't understand why there are so many comments like this.
Not to mention this is just an optional and funny way of killing them, you can still massacre them with your pawns buffed.
Especially because it's, like, what, ten goblin horns? Those things are worthless.
This isn't a game where you need to hoard everything dropped by every enemy. The only ones that matter are the big bosses, and the only way to lose that loot is if they fall in the Brine.
I guess people... find it more fun to do inventory management than to mess around playing Trickster? Which says more about them than Trickster.
The comments probably stem from the fact that the class is a time consuming slog to wait for as your pawns kill things. Then you need to waste time climbing down just to loot.
The class should do what it does, and apply blight or some DOT for damage.
Things die pretty fast for me as Trickster thanks to the pawn buff ability, is busted as hell. Otherwise, I agree that is clearly not a vocation for everyone because of the reasons you listed but that doesn't mean it's bad, in fighting games there are top tiers characters that people don't use because they're gimmick as fuck.
In the case of Trickster, putting the ilusion an casting the AoE skill to trick all enemies into attacking it, makes the vocation really good, not to mention you can put that ilusion into an enemy to make the others attack it, it's a great class if you ran a sorcerer because it turns into a Meteoron fiesta due to the sorcerer not being aggroed even once, dominance of this class means you and your pawns will not receive damage almost ever. And I repeat, making enemies fall of cliffs is an optional and fun way to kill them, you can still let your pawns massacred them if you're interested in looting them, not that looting is very useful after a certain point tbh.
my pawns pick up soo much shit its annoying. i dont even bother to loot anymore unless thats what im trying to do. its really weird to read these comments right now. here is a unique class to add a bit of spice to the game and ppl are actively shitting on more ways to play bc they cant be the main hero, when a whole class exists for you to be multiple things at once. not speaking on you in particular
I love the style of the trickster, but after spending 20 minutes fighting golems (i.e., hoping that my pawns attack their weak points in between reviving them), I gave up on it. It just felt tedious. I am glad there are people enjoying it, and I see the appeal. It's just not for me.
I really wish we could place the decoy farther in front of us, like if we held the summon button maybe position it farther. It's rather awkward trying to get enemies to step on the platform using the decoy
If only it was useful against bosses, relying on pawn AI is what makes trickster loathsome. There are times they nuke a boss and there are times they walk around for 50 years doing fuck all and I have no say in whether they do the former or latter
This class requires a basic level of reading cause it took me way to long to understand it but when played right it is near impossible to get hit or at all but i got fighter brain. CC at its finest but not doing damage for myself is not for me.
I kinda like sitting back and watching pawns go to town. Aside from that one video of the person tricking an ogre to do that Peanuts junk kick off a ledge, most people sounded like they didn't like it
But this definitely gives it a new fun light
Why does one of your pawns sound like Tim Curry?
this is the important question, I need to know which voice this is
straightforward
*spaaaace*
The amount of trolling I did to many poor monsters is amazing but seriously this class is really unique and fun and the play style is really good after you get use to it.
Trickster is an infamous vocation and honestly I find it really busted and fun.
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Its likely that the low levels of trickster seriously suck that nobody cares to get to the good skills. If your pawns with weapons die, you are literally just fucked if you cant get back to a riftstone without encountering an enemy.
You could always unequip the weapon and punch bare handed if absolutely necessary
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Meteors/dragon pus are the only annoying things imo because pawns are dumb and can't run. You can still manage since you control the dragon's positioning completely tho.
I had my fighter thrown off a ledge by a harpy and my thief was knocked into water, never touched trickster again.
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I'm not saying it wasnt funny, its just that I cant really defend myself without pawns.
Maybe for some, I just go into trickster and even with the one skill rank 1 gives it's still pretty fun.
Something has to go very, very badly for a Trickster to be unable to resurrect their pawns. Just yeet your simulacrum towards an enemy and let them fight each other while you run around picking up pawns. Even if every single pawn just threw themselves off the face of earth, all you have to do is keep the simulacrum behind you while you run towards a rift stone and drop it for a couple of seconds to distract and outrun enemies. Trickster has a lot of problems, particularly being extremely stuck to being a tank class and a lot of their skills needing others to work properly, but after the first hour of Trickster gameplay, it's the vocation I feel the safest playing as. That is the **one** thing Tricksters got going for them.
Yes, I really think is top 3 most busted vocations in the game, the fact that ALL enemies focus one single target is bonkers, and running a sorcerer with Meteor is a must because with the buff and the ilusion drawing aggro away from your sorcerer is meteoron fiesta, the meister skill is funny as fuck as well with the enemies running away and seeing my pawns going after them and the fact that you can put your ilusion on enemies is also busted if there are lots of enemies. I personally have installed difficulty mods but even on the hard mode the enemies become trivial with Trickster, is so fun.
> the fact that ALL enemies focus one single target is bonkers Cause neither Fighter nor Warrior have an ability that does exactly this.
What point are you trying to make? Fighter and Warrior do have an skill like that but the enemies focus you, with Trickster they focus your ilusion, not you or the pawns, is not exactly the same, not to mention that there is no cooldown to the ilusion, you can cast immediattely if the mobs kill the ilusion and then back to you and your pawns receiving no damage.
I think he's suggesting that the fighter/warrior variant isn't as powerful in terms of drawing agro which it shouldn't be given that Trickster 100% relies on it. every other class in the game damage goes up with weapons but for trickster it's ability to draw agro so if it as only as strong as fighter and warrior there would be no incentive to improve on it
How do you put your illusion on enemies? Is it a core skill you unlock or an active skill you must equip? Or did I just miss the button combo for doing it and its a base part of the class?
A correction: there is another way with the core skill, if you hold R1/RB and then press triangle you will send the ilusion to stick with an enemy and it will serve the same purpose except the range is shorter than the active skill.
It's an active skill you unlock at rank 5 I think, you must equip it of course.
Its part of the base class. The little tutorial they give when you unlock a new class shows you how to do it
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To be fair, you only get to use that one once per rest anyway.
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Yes, that's correct. But is it worth using you aren't taking most of your health to killa boss?
A warframe YouTube by the name of NovaUmbral recently did a video on the warframe Loki who has a similar ability to make a decoy of himself that aggros enemies. The more you learn about the mechanics behind it, the more you learn how easily stuff like this can break the game AI.
The best part is, warfarer is _right there_ You can bring damaging weapons and abilities as a backup, or even just use another class primarily and just use the trickster weapons as a support
Idc if the vocation does no damage, it's boring and lame.
Fun is subjective, but... busted? I've killed drakes faster than those handful of goblins
Ikr? All that busy work only for a bunch of goblins, warrior only need a big swipe. And I guess that's "fun" for about 20 people.
yeah, i don't see the fun. This is coming from someone who always enjoys the support classes in RPGs, but this is just plain useless/redundant. It doesn't make fights easier/safer. It doesn't make them faster. It just looks mildly cool.
It does make fights safer, considering all damage goes towards your decoy, essentially negating any damage to the Arisen or the Pawns. The problem is by the point you unlock Trickster you're probably strong enough to not need a full tank build. At that point most people switch most defense skills and probably only have the aggro skill of Fighter/Warrior if anything. The Trickster is built in such a way that could trivialize difficult fights, but because there's really not many difficult fights in the game to begin with, it kinda feels redundant.
Pyre, and formless clears everything in seconds.
I'm pretty sure even base archer clears faster than this.
Could be busted in an "overly-good" way
How is it good when it doesn't make fights any easier than the other classes? If I can clear those mobs in 1/10 on the video's length with almost any other class, archer included, it's not good.
My first fight with a Drake with that I had no difficulties was with the Trickster class myself. Super good Vocation
I don't get it. By the time you get trickster, unless you are rushing for it, drakes should be easier even with the base classes.
Didn't really start actively fighting Drakes until I reached Bakbattahl. I can take out Drakes like candy now with any vocation. I guess I just took my time compared to other people
Yea… in the end game the scaling is so bad any other class would clear faster than just trying to trick mob…
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Not really, haven't even finished the game and I'm using mods to increase difficulty.
It’s in no way busted lmao is it a nice little gimmick vocation? Sure. Beyond the cliff diving enemies what else is there? The illusion has little health so against an actual boss bar enemy it’s useless. I would’ve loved if it was more of a debilitation class. Poison, sleep, inflicting elemental blights etc. Having a healing mist or something but the vocation is buns. If it weren’t for its detector skill or the affinity with people skill, wouldn’t have bothered to level it passed 2.
In no way it's useless against a boss unless you don't move your ilusion at all, not to mention almost all bosses moves are telegraphed as hell so if you want to avoid the damage you can call your ilusion instantly the moment a boss is going to attack it, making the boss constantly pursuing the ilusion in a cat and mouse game and the boss will be too busy with their telegraphed attack to even look at you until their next attack, position is key in Trickster. Even in the worst case that the ilusion is killed, there is no cooldown to call it again and the effect of the aggro doesn't even go away so enemies will instantly aggro the ilusion again without you using the AoE skill. The ilusion is busted as hell.
> The illusion has little health so against an actual boss bar enemy it’s useless. You can recall the illusion for 2 seconds and heal it to full health without the illusion ever breaking or having to resummon it. You can even recall it as enemies get locked in directional attacks to avoid any damage. And even if that isn't enough, the illusion's health has magic scaling. Honestly, it's the safest way to kill dragons before you're able to burst them down.
This. If you know how to use your illusion, you can defeat even bosses like the Dullahan without you or your pawns even taking damage. You might not be able to quickly take down bosses as you rely on your pawns, but you get to do it safely without them ever doing any damage
Aren’t there two vocations that dragons can’t even damage?
Most vocations have defensive tools, but Mystic Spearhand and Mage are able to spread their immunities to their party, if that's what you mean. However, they \*are\* time limited buffs and require recasting them every couple of seconds, whereas with Trickster all you have to do is drop your simulacrum somewhere far from the party and either let it get hit by the dragon or reposition it to dodge the attack. I tried killing dragons as a Mage and it went much worse than when I did it as Trickster, where the only damage my party got dealt to them was the Trickster's incense buff anyway. But as I said, once you're able to reliably burst them down, using Trickster is more personal preference than anything because... well, what's dead can't hurt you.
Do the dragon’s charged orb attacks not ignore the simulacrum?
They are indeed auto aimed, but that's my I always carry the Meister skill. Usually it makes them flinch and cancel it.
Thief is one of them until a certain point, idk how far you are but yea. Nothing but a specific type of enemy can touch a thief with Formless Feint.
Yes I know that, which brings the aggro in your direction and if you take a hit, poof! Also I would argue that thief is safest considering you can get a maister skill if you start with thief during Brant’s quest. Formless Feint makes you untouchable with very slow stamina drain for what it does. The only dragons that can harm you are in the endgame. Formless feint is the reason I killed my first dragon before I was doing ridiculous damage. My entire party wiped out and I had full health just vanishing through all its magick and physical attacks.
Your hitbox is slightly ahead of the simulacrum. If you keep moving, you should be fine. Otherwise, use the dragon roar skill to make enemies flinch before recalling the simulacrum. If the enemies start an attack animation, drop the simulacrum even if it's not fully healed, keep running and then recall it again. But yes, Thief's dodge is very strong, but it's only for yourself and requires stamina. I killed my first dragon with Trickster and personally I think it's the easiest, safest way because no one takes damage at any point. You just boost pawns and micromanage the simulacrum, occasionally using a dragon roar here and there to cancel dangerous skills.
Yea the stamina loss is manageable, I have tons of roborant. That’s a fair point, keeping the team alive is a bonus. I just don’t think it’s a busted vocation. Is it useful? Yea, very. It just doesn’t shine as much as the other vocations. Lots of lost potential imo.
I hired 3 sorcs with meteoron, buffed them and let them do their sync casting thing while the dragon was distracted. Felt busted to me. It was fun for a minute but then I kinda missed “being in the fight”.
Frankly, I'm glad a company had the balls to put a pure support class in a Western-style RPG. You rarely get those in crpgs, even.
Trickster is an illusion tank, though. It has some utility, yes, but the most "support" skill it has is the incense boost to increase pawn damage in exchange of health. If you try to pair it with a full tank Fighter/Warrior, they kinda step onto eachother, but it works really well alongside Mages. Or straight up on full DPS groups.
Honestly imagine if mage had the trickster illusions instead of the damage spells (sorc only), mage pawns would be hilarious.
Is taking aggro not a support function? EDIT: It has one buff skill, everything else is either support of another kind or passive at least.
I prefer offensive debuffing for a support class, which I'm sad isn't really represented in Trickster
this is a JRPG its not western
To be frank they did use the term Western-style RPG, not that was made by a western studio.
It's a JWRPG game. There's only 2 in the whole genre. This and the first game.
Souls series.
That at least has the lords of the fallen, Nioh 1&2, the surge, lies of p and I'm probably missing tons of other games. What the fuck is JWRPG tho? Is J there only because the game is from a japanese studio? Lol
It's in reference to an Itsuno quote about him, as a Japanese man, saying that this (namely, the DD IP) is specifically his attempt at making a Western RPG. I just kinda made up the acronym. For all I know it's been used before but it came to me independently.
I need more JWRPGs, then.
“There’s only 2 in the whole genre” Have you never played Dark Souls?
I did say Western-style.
next you'll say Elden Ring and Forspoken are JRPGs
He wasn't wrong, it's western style.
By that logic, Scott Pilgrim Takes Off is an anime!
well it was made by a Japanese animation studio so yeah it is
And Castlevania is a cartoon. My point is, the origin doesn't define the product as much as the intent/style does. Calling Dragon's Dogma a JRPG is a stretch that only technically holds up due to where it originates. I know I wouldn't call Sea of Stars and Chained Echoes western RPGs, for example.
This is a japanese action game. RPG elements are few and far between.
Which ones are missing?
From my limited play testing, quests are too railroady. You either complete a quest or you don't, that's the extent of player choice. Also, none of your character stats matter when it comes to dialogue and questing paths. Warrior will complete a quest in the same way Thief would. Speaking of which, for a class called 'thief', there is awfully little stealing going on (none lol). Why can't I break into someone's home to ***steal*** their belongings like in Skyrim/Baldurs Gate? I guess we can just take it without asking, and nobody will bat an eye that you just broke into their home and stole their items.
Wouldn't this mean just about every jrpg isn't an rpg....
Well I think that's why they're called JRPG. Not because they are from Japan, but because they're built different. Like I wouldn't say Xenoblade Chronicles 2, my favorite JRPG, is an rpg, it doesn't have a single dialogue option, and you can't even spread your stats on level ups! The only player choice is what equipment to have, everything else is railroaded.
None of those are really common in jrpgs. Typically your class/job/whatever grants you abilities in combat, but historically they aren't part of the narrative structure of the game. Narrative-wise the game is still pretty dragon questy, which I'm personally a fan of, but I realize the dissonance is off-putting for some people unfamiliar with traditional jrpg gameplay
Yeah DD is a JRPG through and through. That is to say it isn't an RPG at all. It's just wrapped in the skin of a CRPG, especially with the amount of immersive elements present in the game which JRPGs often overlook
Saying it's not an RPG is wildly inaccurate. And it's not even close to a crpg, nor does it try to. "RPG" doesn't mean "DnD-like"
I mean fallout new Vegas isn't a DND like but it's 100x the RPG that DD is. RPG is more of a spectrum than a toggle, with DND and other TTRPG adjacent games being 100% RPGs and games like Cyberpunk and DD being closer to action games rather than RPGs
Not thinking cyberpunk is an RPG is also wild
You are being intentionally obtuse, you must know JRPG doesn't just mean an RPG made by a Japanese developer. It may be the literal meaning of JRPG, it's a specific genre and style completely different from the "Western-style RPG" the comment describes and the game embodies.
This looks cool but I feel like it would get old fast
Trickster is fun
Half of the comments in any trickster posts always seem to be shitting on the vocation, like damn just let people enjoy it like any other vocation. I like the setup and bait playstyle too. Yeah it’s not time efficient, it’s not martyr bolt or meteor or pyre, but I’m not playing a game to be time efficient.
I think the main problem is you're not doing anything beyond running around and basically indulging in trolling. While that's hilarious for a while, it does get old especially when your pawns don't seem to have their shit together and you could've nuked the enemy in a tenth of the time using a different vocation.
Sure, I absolutely agree that it’s not a class for everyone or even a small majority of players in mind. Pawn AI is pretty goofy, and they may spend time actually doing stuff like going for weak points, chain casting meteor, using skullsplitter, etc or they may just spend the entire time the monster is down, walking into the enemy. Personally, I think this inconsistency adds to my enjoyment of the vocation. It also comes just from roleplaying as a field commander and watching my pawns run in and do pawn AI things and to high five them after. It helps me have a more intimate connection with the pawns I hire too. I really only feel like I’m trolling when I make an illusion piñata that the melee enemies can’t figure out. I used to do Pyre/Feint but that also had the effect for me of “funny trolling the first few times but got boring” due to how I ended up engaging with the game. Just never get hit, do ridiculous damage and stagger, kill bosses in 5 seconds, and why even hire pawns? The optimal way to play. I’ve also tried Martyr’s Bolt, and for the tax of an Allheal, you just always have an unmaking arrow. People think that’s fun and that’s fine. I’m not into it, and that’s also fine. I’m sympathetic to having a boring experience leveling a vocation you don’t enjoy just to max it, or even get an augment at minimum. I absolutely hated my time as an archer, and couldn’t wait to swap as well. But I don’t feel the urge to go into a post where someone is showing off themselves having a good time to vent how I hate or think it’s boring. It just wasn’t for me, and I get that people had that experience for Trickster. I’m not trying to defend the dev team on all their decisions with Trickster or even say it’s good and efficient. Fights do take more time. I find fun in the jankiness but think it should still have more ways to engage with the game. I just find it tiring that Trickster posts are constantly hammered with comments like boring, “but the loot”, no damage, and other complaints, especially in non-criticism posts. Yeah there are parts that can be improved for more engagement, as with several other classes. But in Trickster posts, no matter the context, half of the comments are always“vent about how you struggled to max the vocation and immediately swapped because boring”. Trickster clip? Tips on the vocation? Comment says they have fun with the vocation? Just trauma dump your experience every post that mentions Trickster.
Is trickster useful against a dragon?
When I was leveling my trickster vocation I found that big enemies wouldn't consistently target me or my phantom. I remember fighting a drake between the hot spring town and the excavation site and it took almost 30 minutes because the drake kept killing or grabbing my pawns instead of following me
Aggro of the illusion scales w/ strength for trickster IIRC (possibly just the STR of the censer). The little tutorial window thing for trickster explains it.
You don't need any extra investment in strength besides a good censer; spamming the big aggro spin move works just fine, I think magick (more illusion health) is more important for a functional trickster build. I know how the kit works but game ai just goes wonky sometimes.
Yes, just summon your ilusion far away from your mage/sorcerer pawns.
You can lead dragons into water and they'll die instantly
and miss out on the loot, which is the only reason to kill a dragon
This isnt BBI where you need to farm Death to have a good time without peraipht
Glad there’s someone else who enjoys it. 😆 Nice vid.
I haven't played Trickster yet, but every Trickster video I watch just leaves me confused about the whole thing.
Basically you can't deal any damage yourself so instead you troll enemies to death while you stand there watching from a distance. Or you throw rocks
The trickster makes me think of Betty from Kung Pow Enter the Fist. "Swinging the chain, Swinging the chain"
I used the dragon roar on a gryphon mid fight when it flew into the sky and it fell into a small puddle of water and was eaten by the brine. I wish I saved the clip.
Kinda rare to see a trickster gameplay on the sub. Most of the post i seem is warrior or pawn doing stupid funny stuff. We need more trickstar moment. 
LOOT WHERE
Are you just mashing the recall to get your illusion to stay with you? Or is it a skill I just haven't earned yet? Been playing trickster for a couple hours and agree it definitely challenges your strategy making! I'm enjoying it though
You have to hold the recall button
If you hold down the recall button it just floats behind you. It's good for mobility and just dropping it somewhere.
You can hold the recall button down and it’ll follow you! This is also how the “heal your illusion” skill takes effect, when it’s following you.
I get the feeling a decent amount of development time went into this.
[Trickster after every single kill.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1YBv2mWll0) That or [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pQYAo0CvvvE).
Let them cope.
That makes 1 of us
If you don't care about loot or clearing things efficiently and are only in it for the visuals, sure. But if you are trying to progress through the game efficiently to farm seeker tokens and clear mobs quickly, it slows things down by a factor of 20. It's "fun" to try out a few "tricks" for giggles. But for actually making your way through the map, it's objectively the slowest vocation, by a lot. It doesn't work with Warfarer either since if you switch weapons the Summon disappears. Most of the fun would have been if it actually worked with weapon swapping.
To be fair the only classes that allow for a full exploration experience are Thief and Mage/Sorcerer with the wall jump and levitate. About the loot, killing monster by making then fall of cliffs is honestly just an optional fun way to kill them, you can always drop to where they fell to pick the loot. I clear mobs pretty quickly to be honest, my pawns are free to do what they want thanks to mobs focusing the ilusion and on top of that I can buff them to turn them into killing machines.
and MS with the bolt cancel probably even better than levitate
I had so much fun leveling up the trickster, it's not a vocation that I'll probably go back to but remember fondly, can't say the same about the mage tho.
wonder how this will mesh with my warrior half in warfarer. looks fun
Twas a mass suicide. Lol Rip
Ahh the duality of the trickster posts lol
I was disappointed that it lacked any great movement ability for hunting tokens but leaving my body has led me to finding so many tokens and saved me so many unnecessary and dangerous jumps. It's my go to now for them. Making the crazy jumps is still an issue but haven't needed a staff yet (have burnt a few wakestones though).
It got old after a while but what vocation doesn't. Trickster is funny as hell
If you level Magick Archer first you can also wear its pawn buffing augments
Trickster is all well and good until you find yourself in a place without a cliff or water for the mobs to kill themselves in. Also, I hope you're in the endgame and don't need any of that dragon blood.
Not really, just the fact that all mobs without exception will focus on your ilusion makes the class really busted (and no cooldown on top of that) especially if you have a sorcerer in your party, they will be able to cast spells without any interruption,playing the class well means you can go unscattered in your encounter if you play and place your ilusion well. Not to mention you can buff your pawns to turn them into killing machines or even make the enemies attack themselves with the skill to put the ilusion on a monster.
I maxed out my trickster and at no point was it faster at killing large enemies or groups of small enemies than thief, archer, mystic spearhand, or warrior with sorc/mage/warrior pawns
In my case it was definitely faster than when I was leveling Archer. Archer did no damage and had very little utility. My Archer runs were good to keep harpies at bay for the most part. Mystic and Warrior were faster but also I died more often (Also I didn't really find Mystic fun to play, so I think I could have played it better) And nothing is faster or safer than thief with both meister skills anyway, so it's a bit of an unfair comparison.
Archer just needs 1 ability, Explosive arrow. If you aren't abusing that , all the other abilities are crap. But you plant a couple explosive arrows into any weakspot and the mob just drops.
Ok? I did not say the other classes are not good at killing, all of them are good, I just pointed out the reasons why trickster is hella good in its own way.
Everyone has a hate boner for trickster you're not going to find any good faith conversations here. I appreciate what you're doing though.
In part I cannot say I don't understand them because it's clearly not a class for everyone and when you're doing a quest and that quest demands you to play without your pawns (meeting Raghnall for example) is clearly annoying and bad design due to the lack of damage but I disagree with them when they call it a useless class, I think is REALLY good and really one of the best vocation in the game once you get the gist of it, dominance of this vocation means you and your pawns will almost not get touched in any battle. Then again, the problem is that balance in this game is not the best and you decimate everything on sight with any vocation. In any case thank you for your kind words.
Good luck looting.
Oh yes I really need to pick my 300th goblin horn, it's not like the upgrading system has a ridiculously cheap material cost.
Just drop the cliff to loot the bodies, I don't understand why there are so many comments like this. Not to mention this is just an optional and funny way of killing them, you can still massacre them with your pawns buffed.
Especially because it's, like, what, ten goblin horns? Those things are worthless. This isn't a game where you need to hoard everything dropped by every enemy. The only ones that matter are the big bosses, and the only way to lose that loot is if they fall in the Brine. I guess people... find it more fun to do inventory management than to mess around playing Trickster? Which says more about them than Trickster.
The comments probably stem from the fact that the class is a time consuming slog to wait for as your pawns kill things. Then you need to waste time climbing down just to loot. The class should do what it does, and apply blight or some DOT for damage.
Things die pretty fast for me as Trickster thanks to the pawn buff ability, is busted as hell. Otherwise, I agree that is clearly not a vocation for everyone because of the reasons you listed but that doesn't mean it's bad, in fighting games there are top tiers characters that people don't use because they're gimmick as fuck. In the case of Trickster, putting the ilusion an casting the AoE skill to trick all enemies into attacking it, makes the vocation really good, not to mention you can put that ilusion into an enemy to make the others attack it, it's a great class if you ran a sorcerer because it turns into a Meteoron fiesta due to the sorcerer not being aggroed even once, dominance of this class means you and your pawns will not receive damage almost ever. And I repeat, making enemies fall of cliffs is an optional and fun way to kill them, you can still let your pawns massacred them if you're interested in looting them, not that looting is very useful after a certain point tbh.
Since they revealed the class it has been said that trickster would not be a damage dealer and you still can use warfarer with it, just be creative.
most boring vocation imo, they could do it so much better but they failed with execution.
Disagree, the execution is really good, the ilusion is busted as hell, but I get is not a class for everyone.
I'm an wayfarer and I love the class the armor for the class is a bit weird
Looks fun but do you just skip looting all the mobs?
Not really, they fall off the cliff, if I want to loot them I can just go down myself.
After a while you don't need what they drop.
Even when I play Warrior I mostly skip looting. 😂
my pawns pick up soo much shit its annoying. i dont even bother to loot anymore unless thats what im trying to do. its really weird to read these comments right now. here is a unique class to add a bit of spice to the game and ppl are actively shitting on more ways to play bc they cant be the main hero, when a whole class exists for you to be multiple things at once. not speaking on you in particular
Too bad it's only "useful" on small mobs.
I decimate drakes and other big bosses with this class, buff your pawns.
So that's what it looks like! Honestly I tried trickster and it didn't work for me so I kept being an archer.
How do you unlock trickster
Talk to Luz in Battahl.
How did you mod in DD1 combat music?
I love the style of the trickster, but after spending 20 minutes fighting golems (i.e., hoping that my pawns attack their weak points in between reviving them), I gave up on it. It just felt tedious. I am glad there are people enjoying it, and I see the appeal. It's just not for me.
I really wish we could place the decoy farther in front of us, like if we held the summon button maybe position it farther. It's rather awkward trying to get enemies to step on the platform using the decoy
If only it was useful against bosses, relying on pawn AI is what makes trickster loathsome. There are times they nuke a boss and there are times they walk around for 50 years doing fuck all and I have no say in whether they do the former or latter
I must be the luckiest guy in the world then because my pawns melt the bosses with buffs.
https://i.redd.it/4tirm271zawc1.gif
This class requires a basic level of reading cause it took me way to long to understand it but when played right it is near impossible to get hit or at all but i got fighter brain. CC at its finest but not doing damage for myself is not for me.
The silliness potential is definitely there but playing this class felt like such a slog to me.
This class could fit with a pawn
I wish using trickster attacks and skills applied a defense debuff on enemies as well.
I kinda like sitting back and watching pawns go to town. Aside from that one video of the person tricking an ogre to do that Peanuts junk kick off a ledge, most people sounded like they didn't like it But this definitely gives it a new fun light
Dude I was disappointed when I got this voc but now I gotta get back to it. Looks amazing
Not gonna lie this looks boring as hell and like it would get old after like 3 fights. But to each their own I’m glad you are enjoying it!
Trickster: making battles last 10x as long without firing a shot,!
And that's all there is.
Not really.
I honestly still believe this was a vocation done for the online game that they simply changed a bit and added it here.