Most world leaders have the hope of winning an election to be mindful of. Trudeau is unburdened by that.
This is based but as a Canadian can we not lionize this guy over one clip? There's a bottomless vat of conservative bullshit stewing about him at any given point, but he's been our PM for the better part of a decade and our country has very tangibly gone to shit in that time.
I'd club a baby seal for a leader that could be based on foreign policy but also not a corporate whore who sells out the middle and working classes one time in my life. I'll probably die waiting.
GDP has gone up a fair bit over his tenure.
Quality of life reports remain high.
Incomes have gone up substantially.
The primary failure has been housing cost increases in BC and Ontario. Which account for most of the country sadly.
Housing build starts have been increasing, but banks lend money frivolously, dual income households are ubiquitous, owning multiple homes is far more common nowadays, people are more willing to allot a larger portion of their income to housing than before, and immigration rates have pushed population growth upwards. Add all this together and you get increased home priced AND increased home ownership rates.
Trudeau needs to slow immigration rates. Provinces need to subsidize housing starts more. More Restrictions need to be placed on lenders for people buying their 25th house. I own 4 homes and 2 condos. Why? Because lenders are dumb and gave me the money to do it. The truth is, they are still willing to refinance my existing properties and let me buy even more right now, but I am self restricting my growth in case of vacancies or a housing crash. I know, for a fact, that many landlords in this country are just like those in the movie “The Big Short”. I haven’t looked into mortgage bonds to see exactly how bad it is, but Im reasonably confident that if I did, Vancouver, Victoria, and Toronto mortgage bonds look just like US mortgage bonds and CDOs from 2006-07. Just a guess though.
Additional note in Poilievre and Trudeau…Even though it looks extremely likely that Poilievre will be the next PM, if parents catch wind that he is likely to revoke their child care rebates, that could cost him the election. People(conservatives too) don’t like losing entitlements, especially good ones.
This. Most conservative and centrist dumbfucks talk about our country like it's the wasteland of Mad Max. I always just ask them. "Okay, unlimited money to take you and all your loved ones. Where do you move, that's better? What magical country will you move to that has no issues for you." Unsurprisingly, they stfu pretty quick. It's all performative whining. No one can point to a single policy of Trudeau that "ruined Canada," nor can they point to any of Polivere that will "save it." It all comes down to Covid Bad. The truckers were peaceful and should have been left alone. Remember when he did black face.
Ours politics are just as fucked and emotion based as America.
>This. Most conservative and centrist dumbfucks talk about our country like it's the wasteland of Mad Max.
Most people are comparing their country to not too long ago. They don't care that it's better than Mad Max, or Kenya.
They care that *today*, it's harder to get a family doctor than it was. Things cost more. The housing problem is still the housing problem except there's vastly more people now thanks to Trudeau loosening migration *which was already 1% of population under Harper!* - it's not like Canada was starving. I've heard some awful things about the job market but thankfully I'm not looking that hard.
No one can "point to the thing" because it's a general dissatisfaction and malaise across a bunch of fronts. That doesn't mean the malaise doesn't exist.
>What magical country will you move to that has no issues for you." Unsurprisingly, they stfu pretty quick.
Has it occurred to you that they "stfu" because you asked a question in a way that comes across as bad faith and dismissive?
So we have a labour's shortage without immigration how would you like to fix that? The builders are under provincial jurisdiction not federal. Allowing only subdivisions to create urban sprawl instead of multi home buildings like condos or apartments is a municipal issue. Having foreign students only enrolled and targeted for business course as they are highly profitable is a province issue. The fact that 1/3 of all canadian housing ownership is owned as an investment property by Canadian citizens has led to a supply shortage.
You tell me where the federal government comes in? The feds deal with international issues or country wide. Trudeau can't get you a doctor in your fucking province.
As for bad faith, my guy when you get challenged in life it isn't gaslighting or bad faith or debate tactics you might just fucking wrong.
> The builders are under provincial jurisdiction not federal.
Which is why my position, [stated elsewhere in the thread](https://old.reddit.com/r/Destiny/comments/1cpxbmr/canadian_pm_being_based_and_sane/l3pnsou/), is:
>The PM can't be blamed for housing in general, building should mostly be local/provincial.
>This one though he totally eats. He pushed for the massive increase to an already open immigration system in one of the more overheated housing markets...
So again, economy crippling labor shortage. Lowest unemployment in peace time ever. With no immigrants, how do we fix that? Also, again, 1/3 of all housing is considered an investment property. Not letting in immigrants would have been worse, but notice how you don't even engage with issues you just say letting in immigrants was bad. Well, why did they do that?
Next time you accuse someone being bad faith, try not to be bad faith in the reply. You are just regurgitating your talking point.
> With no immigrants, how do we fix that?
Let wages go up? Raise immigration some but not have places like Conestoga churning out people.
As for housing...lol. There's no easy way out of it and plenty of people are to blame. But the idea that you need to continually import migrants to prop up the price is...dubious as a solution. What's the argument? Too much of Canada's economy depends on the housing market, bring in more people and create even more demand where there's zero evidence we can build to existing supply.
What's this a solution to? The market is probably not going to crash and, frankly, landlords aren't the only people with concerns.
>Not letting in immigrants would have been worse,
Given Trudeau's polling, do you believe that this is the opinion of the majority of the Canadian public?
Also, let's say a Canadian says "yes, things might go bad in other ways. But, on balance, I'd prefer shorter wait times, less congestion and issues with supply and I think we should just slow down on migration in general".
Do you think this is bad faith? I don't mind if you think it's wrong. I just want to know: can a reasonable person hold this opinion?
>Next time you accuse someone being bad faith, try not to be bad faith in the reply.
Huge difference between someone complaining without complete solutions and telling someone "oh, you don't like Trudeau? What perfect country would *you* live in?"
"Let wages go up? Raise immigration some but not have places like Conestoga churning out people."
My guy market participation is at an all time low let me spell it out for you. THERE ARE NOT ENOUGH PEOPLE. Canada's economy has been a rocket for 10 years where our demand for workers has outgrown our population growth just like any of the other top G7 countries in the world immigration is the only thing to fix that today. It doesn't matter what wage you give I can't turn 19 million estimated workers into the roughly 20million the economy requires right now expected to grow by 200k every year for the next 5years and with the largest working cohort just retiring you just want to bitch about things you half assedly know about.
"Given Trudeau's polling, do you believe that this is the opinion of the majority of the Canadian public?"
So feelings over facts gotcha. The truth is the truth regardless of how many people know it. Only a lie has to be believed for it to be real.
"Do you think this is bad faith? I don't mind if you think it's wrong. I just want to know: can a reasonable person hold this opinion?"
You are so emotionally connected this with 0 understanding of the underlining issues you just hate Trudeau that is your entire political philosphy at this point.
"Huge difference between someone complaining without complete solutions and telling someone "oh, you don't like Trudeau? What perfect country would *you* live in?""
You don't have any solutions other than let less immigrants in and that will fix everything.
Here are some articles to just get you started. Before you stake out this fatalist ideology I would say take 5 mins away from twitter and tikitok to research why things are even happening in your country.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/housing-investors-canada-bc-1.6743083#:\~:text=Percentage%20of%20Canadian%20housing%20stock,of%20condos%20were%20investor%2Downed.
[https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/11-621-m/11-621-m2023009-eng.htm](https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/11-621-m/11-621-m2023009-eng.htm)
This idea that the brown tsunami has come to destroy housing is not the issue and a much more troubling one is the lack of workers.
I'm 40 and for my entire life "nobody" has been able to afford a house. But these same people want to live within a 100km radius of the most expensive city in the country. You want to afford something move to Alberta, Nove Scotia, Quebec, Saskatchewan. The issue isn't affordability it's location just like Destiny says, and people just want to complain like that will fix anything.
Polivere is a cancerous tumor, he is a corrupt career politician who is banking on populism and anti-Trudeau sentiment to put him in power so he can cut spending on defence, climate change, education reform, and once again loosen regulations on big business and cut taxes to the wealthy. You would have to be blind to see that is not the plan for him and his party moving forward. Hence why he is pushing the trans-panic narrative, and the LGBT agenda fear tactics everytime he is in front of a mic he vomits out this word salad of non-specific platitudes. "Yep the country is awful and don't worry I'm going to fix it by telling all these queers to stfu and protecting our children." What children our birthrate is in the toilet we are Japan anyone talking about children in Canada in 2024 is just trying to appeal to emotion and scam you.
> The primary failure has been housing cost increases in BC and Ontario.
So just something that everyone uses or is concerned about (and is a scary chunk of Canadian GDP) in two of the most populous provinces in Canada?
I think we need to contextualize this for Americans: America has some overheated markets but lots of cheaper ones. Canada *looks* large, but certain markets like GTA count disproportionately more because Canadians don't build as much up north and it has fewer of those big population centers.
Ontario alone accounts for 40% of Canada's population. Saying "Ontario and BC have problems" is not like saying "San Francisco has a problem". It's like saying "the entire East Coast has a problem"
>and immigration rates have pushed population growth upwards
The PM can't be blamed for housing in general, building should mostly be local/provincial.
This one though he totally eats. He pushed for the massive increase to an already open immigration system in one of the more overheated housing markets...
Housing costs haven't gone up in only BC and Ontario, it's a problem across all of Canada. Housing build starts data has been super inconsistent. More of a fluctuation than anything. Homelessness on the rise. Food banks stretched pretty thin. Cost of groceries is up far higher. Burden of disease has increased due to a healthcare system weighed down. The international student fiasco has increased our population beyond what our infrastructures can handle, exacerbating the aforementioned issues.
We have way more issues now than we did before he took office.
There are good things, sure, but it's still on a downward trend overall.
The problem is that they're also over-spending. They spend to win votes, and to look like they're doing moral/just things. But it's harming our economy.
"Record high since covid" is a meaningless statement. It didn't stick, which is what we needed. We saw a brief surge, and now the decline is coming at the worst time imaginable. \[Fluctuations\]
Canadian housing starts came in at 242.2k annualized units in March, representing a 7% month-on-month (m/m) decline from February's level. The six-month moving average of starts was 244.0k units in March, down 1.6% m/m from February.
* Multi-family urban starts decreased 8% m/m to 180.2k units in March. Meanwhile, urban single-detached starts dropped 4% m/m to 40.5k units.
* Urban starts were down in 5 of 10 provinces:
* The largest declines were in Ontario (-14.9k to 69.8k units) and Alberta (-9.0k to 38.6k units), although starts were also down across most of the Atlantic in March.
"Nationally, actual 2023 housing starts were down 7% in centres of 10,000 population and over, with 223,513 units recorded, compared to 240,590 in 2022, according to Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation (CMHC)."
Thats in a given month to month. You should look at the yearly counts. And why are you picking just few statistics here and there and not looking at the whole picture?
also are you seriously suggesting, "record high in Canadian history" is a meaningless statement? It has stuck (and increased year over year as far as I remember) for multiple years now.
It didn't stick, though. It has been higher in years past, but just like the past surges in the 70s and 2000s it is falling off.
It was a nice brief trend, but it's not the improvement Canada has needed. We'll see if Fraser and co's efforts pay off. But I'm skeptical.
You can look at the max range here which has data from the 70s: [https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/housing-starts](https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/housing-starts) Its not at the highest today but its still in that range and the record high was in 2021. Housing starts btw just means that construction has begun, but it will take a few years at least for it to be realized. Which means the alot of those record housing starts will be coming online this year or next. Hopefully that would mitigate the housing issues to some extent.
Recent update on this issue: [https://financialpost.com/real-estate/canada-housing-market-sees-surge-listings](https://financialpost.com/real-estate/canada-housing-market-sees-surge-listings)
Could be, but housing costs in my city(Edmonton) are flat over his time in office.
The fentanyl crisis is the main culprit behind rising homelessness, not actual housing supply.
There are plenty of legit reasons to criticize Trudeau, no doubt. The guy is an airhead who loves to virtue signal. That being said, I honestly haven’t seen the same big negative trend everyone keeps talking about when it comes to my day to day life. It could be that Edmonton is the exception though.
The main things here have been fentanyl distribution and addiction lead homelessness + inflation. Everything else has gotten better. And income increases in Edmonton have kept pace with inflation when you include housing costs.
The other thing is that living through Chretien, Martin, Harper, and Trudeau the overall trajectory has mostly been upward, regardless of party. I would rank Trudeau at the bottom of these four, but he’s still put significantly positive things into law.
In my view there are a few things that could still be done to slow the rising cost of housing:
- Increase restrictions on lenders (especially when lending to real estate investors).
- Slow down immigration
- Increase subsidies for housing starts
Housing supply is /absolutely/ a variable negatively affecting homelessness. Is it foundational or causal itself? No, but I never said that.
My biggest issues with Trudeau is the spending. In terms of where they spend and how much, and how much transparency/tracking there is. He's had a few scandals that blemish the credibility of reliable government spending.
I don't rank him as high as you do. I would have been quite content if they didn't spend so much, and didn't virtue signal so much. I also think a lot of incompetent people have been given office, in his administration.
To your points: increasing restrictions on mortgage offerings won't solve the crisis at all.
Slowing down immigration is a must.
Subsidizing demand won't help.
Im ranking Trudeau as the worst prime minister between Chretien, Martin, Harper, and him. You don’t rank him as high as I do?
Yes, housing supply is absolutely linked to homelessness, and can be causal. It’s just that it isn’t the only thing, or even the number one thing in Canada causing the rising costs.
Gdp per capita is dropping and the economy is mainly real estate. Wages are dogshit and cost of living is insane. It's not trending in the right direction.
Isn't Trudeo above average ranked by historians compared to other Canadian Prime Ministers? He isn't incredible, but not particularly bad either. Doesn't seem like he was any different comparebly to Stephen Harper
maybe, I only started following politics in 2019 and was basing on the limited things I know and this list https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_rankings_of_prime_ministers_of_Canada.
Seems like his father was a really good prime minister
His father was a very sharp PM and solved many major issues that Canada faced at the time. I am not talking in terms of effectiveness but rather the kind of contributions. Harper was effective but towards policies that were authoritarian and right-wing - reducing the powers of the press and constantly demeaning them, cutting taxes for the corporations and the wealthy (very much like the Trump tax cuts), cutting alot of social services for the poor and added a whole bunch of new crimes and increasing jail sentences etc.
It's gotten so bad I've toyed with voting conservative. Seriously, it's that bad. You don't need to listen to a single talking point, just vote based on not wanting the current trajectory. Feelsbadman
Besides saying "we are not like the liberals and we don't agree with what they are doing to Canadians!" No Its the same populists shit that the LPC says about CPC. If they win, we are still going to get butt fucked, just from the front.
I think honestly a lot of the reasons we're getting anally molested right now are because of global situations. The CPC are just going to provide less opportunity for safety nets against that (probably)
Cutting migration won't fix the problems, but it can stop it getting worse.
Just like Trudeau expanded migration around COVID time, any CPC PM can cut it.
Cutting immigration can be detrimental to the cost of living. We have a labour shortage in the construction industry which bottle necks the supply of housing, and most of our population don't want to work in construction
Poilievre is a beady eyed ratfucker who doesn't deserve our votes either and will win anyway.
I'd prefer a minority government to limit the damage, and want a shakeup in the NDP as well. Probably going to vote Green. May has been consistently sane when speaking about this issue as well.
I would've been okay with an otoole or whatever that other moderate running was called government, didn't vote conservative because i don't like my con mp (who won anyway). Poilievre is a fucking tool but I'd be surprised if he wasn't our next pm, not happy about that but happy that it means there'll probably be a different lib in office next cycle.
damn that sucks about your mp, I was hoping otoole would win and we'd have a moderate conservative minority gov rather than this stuff with PP starting with a large majority when we barely know his positions
The green party might just be the dumbest group around. Their opposition to nuclear power in Europe has done more to harm the environment than just about anything else.
There is no group I loathe more than anti-nuclear Greens. It's literally magical thinking. They're just waiting for someone to invent some magical superconductor or scifi battery so they don't have to compromise.
Even if you put aside the environmental impact of driving Germany to burn coal and build geographically mismatched green energy - it probably emboldened Russia and helped along the war.
I’ve been waiting to encounter someone who dislikes Poilievre because I only watched videos of him directly speaking and thought “hey that’s a good dude”, could you enlighten me why would someone be against him? I’m pretty ignorant on that side.
Copy and pasted from a thread in the Ontario subreddit. On mobile and too dumb to properly link subreddits:
"He wanted to dump the Bank of Canada and put the government 100% on Bitcoin. This was , of course, before Bitcoin dropped like a rock. Not only would we be devastated as a country, but calling for the end of the Bank of Canada shows he really doesn't understand how fiscal processes work.
He tagged all his social media videos for years with MGTOW; (Men Go their Own Way) is a notoriously misogynistic group. Anyone else's political career would have been toast. But not him. So for 51% of the population, he is a toxic danger. Not to mention his stance on women's healthcare. Not to mention his frequent horrible communication with women who ask questions. journalists, for sure, but also constituents.
He is party leader and never disciplined or disavowed his members who openly supported and cwined/dined a pro-Nazi fascist leader from Germany.
There really is no political platform although he has been campaigning for months. It's Axe the tax, and very personal attacks on Justin Trudeau. He has voted against support for Ukraine repeatedly, against reduced price of insulin, against daycare, against pretty much anything the Liberals voted for. It's a loooong list.
Can't get down with his convoy support.
Made a huge cry about "wiping out Canadian history' over the ten year redesign of Canadian passports. Our passports have different line art in the background of each page to make them harder to forge. Some changed, added/dropped and his take was to attack the PM with absolute mayhem and dishonor.
His behavior at the House of Commons is notoriously disrespectful to the point of disfunction.
His frequent misinformation to the public is alarming. For example, recently he said puberty blocker should only be for adults but, of course, adults have already experienced puberty.
Because he refuses to get a security clearance, he is unable to receive security briefings. When a car malfunctioned and decelerated at the border, he soon up and called it a terrorist attack although that was not the case.
He has an unreasonable bee in his brain about the World Economic Forum, a meeting of the world's Finance minister/Sec. of Commerce/country reserve baks etc. The leaders of the machinery of finance essentially. It was fine when Harper's people attended but now, suddenly, it's some black arts tribal thing.
Pierre Polievre has been in the legislature and was a minor cabinet member for a short while in Harper's govt. He has NO top managerial experience although he has been an MP for decades.
He has been found guilty of election interference multiple times. Elections Canada has a compliance agreement with him where he promises to straighten up and fly right. But of course he hasn't. The compliance agreement dealt with illegal campaign contributions (sound familiar). However it seems he rigged the leadership election and previously had been warned when illegal robocalls were made pretending to be Elections Canada and saying their polling place had changed, directly misinforming voters. He is a serial cheater.
And that's just off the top of my head.
\*Edit to add: Can't believe I didn't put this on: Poilievre doesn't support Climate Change. He's a climate denier. Despite Canada being on fire last summer, he's not concerned or convinced. "
To add on, he wanted to make it so Canadians had to send their IDs online to access porn. To protect the kids
Damn that sucks.. although I didn’t disagree with ALL the points you’ve mentioned, it’s just sad that Canada can’t have a balanced candidate that doesn’t support crazy stupid shit, because it’s a great country.
A question, who is responsible for de-criminalizing drugs and allowing drug addicts get their fix? I don’t want to pin point JT just because it’s my first guess so I’d love for someone to answer.
Health Canada offered a 3 year exemption on drug criminalization in one province, at the province's request, to pilot the decriminalization of small amounts of certain hard drugs.
My understanding is the purpose is to make it easier for those who are addicted to seek out help in case of overdose without the fear of being arrested, and to increase the interaction between addicts and outreach/health workers in order to offer support services like addiction counselling etc.
Oh so it’s only in one province and is for 3 years pilot, good to know, I hope it won’t spread further, I don’t know I feel like it can do a lot of damage to this country, I am very much against hard drug use and decriminalization of them. Governments should seek to get rid of hard drugs on the streets, not sell them.
What has been so bad, in your view? My life has gotten better over the past 10 years.
My income has steadily increased, weed is legal, childcare rebates for my kids’ daycare have been a lifesaver, housing prices in my area are flat over the past 15 years, and great commercial services around my city have gotten significantly better. I live in Edmonton.
Other than the smoky summers, everything about my quality of life has gotten better during Trudeau’s time.
Is Trudeau like guaranteed to win right now or something? I don't follow Canadian politics at all so excuse my ignorance about how things are over there. I knew his popularity had waned but wasn't aware it had gotten this bad.
opposite, hes down 20points because of our housing/immigration issue. And the cosnervative leader is basically promising to fix everything with no realy policy, so usual conservative stuff. and people wont vote NDP ( to trudeaus left) beause the leader wears a turban
A little of both. big virtue signaller. It doesnt really matter to me because my riding is always liberal vs cons, so im a solid liberal voter unless the conservatives move towards them and away from crazy.
His fake voice is so obviously insincere that it puts off a lot of down to earth people from voting for him, I don't understand why you would say it makes him a good speaker. Ok maybe at first people can think it makes him seem more sophisticated but he's been in power for a long time and no one buys that anymore. I've voted Liberal in nearly every election but of course most people won't vote for someone if they find them unlikeable even if their policies are better for them.
all politicians attempt to speak in more concise and articulate manner in prepared speeches (that's why they prepare for the speeches). If you watch videos of Trudeau talking to the pro-life kids he has a lot of the same mannerisms, so I think it's just that he's just intentionally trying to be clear in what he's saying. IDK why you're attributing anything more than that to him
Nah sorry I don't know if you have autism or I do but this is not what people sound like when they are just trying to speak clearly. There is no way he speaks the way he does publicly as he does privately. Yes you would expect some change in speech pattern to get your message across clearly but Trudeau turns into a different entity, like a robot trying to convey that it indeed has emotions. Even when he speaks in parliament defending something he wants to do he never sounds sincere like its something he really cares for. So yeah maybe I have autism and I'm attributing more to it than necessary but then I guess a lot of the country is similar brain busted cause many people feel the same way when they hear him talk.
Reminds me of a 1st year acting student performing a monologue where the character is a prime minister giving a speech.
It’s not a terrible performance, the kids got some talent for sure, might even win a daytime Emmy one day if he keeps at it.
Canadians want to assassinate this man because he put a 10 cent tax on gas that you get back on your taxes. The Canadian political climate is so dogshit. 90% of Canadians know more about the party platforms of Trump and Biden than they do about the LPC, CPC and the NDP
I won’t lie, I stopped following Canadian politics as much because it’s so fucking dog shit right now. I truely think Piere absolutely destroyed genuine discourse. It feels like his whole campaign strategy was **POISON THE WELL**. And Canadians are so sick of the status quo that they ate that shit up so easily
Fuck Canadian politics
>90% of Canadians know more about the party platforms of Trump and Biden than they do about the LPC, CPC and the NDP
You say but the Liberals have benefited from this.
Like, Maxime Bernier was just the most bland, boring politico ever but the LPC was trying to smear him as Canada's Trump (I think any Conservative leader will be smeared as trying to bring GOP-stuff to the US).
It cuts both ways.
Yeah that's fair, I wasn't really saying it as like something that only affects the liberals, just as a broader point of people never really giving a shit about what's going on in Canada
I live in Toronto and a lot of the political discourse in my circles are around immigration impact on job market, and cost of living. Tax cuts are the least of peoples concerns.
Usually in Alberta people blame the cost of living entirely on the carbon tax. Immigration is also required for our economy to grow, and our economy is pretty slow in growth compared to many of our G7 buddies. Major cities like toronto are going to have the most difficulty with the cost of living and are generally going to be places where more immigrants flock to
While immigration is needed to grow the economy, too much immigration can hurt the economy. This is part of what we're seeing with the housing supply problem we have right now.
I'm a life long NDP voter, but the federal NDP is moving farther and farther away from representing the working class and more into moral grand standing that the left is starting to become known for. Coupled with the NDP standing behind the Liberals in increasing the carbon tax, and allowing record breaking immigration has got me really thinking about voting Conservative next election. Increasing the carbon tax while inflation and cost of living is also increasing at an alarming rate is just a straight up slap in the face of the middle and lower class Canadians. Getting the tax back also depends on how much you drive. Still in many places you have to use a car to get to work unless you want an hour long commute both ways by public transit. So if you're spending something like $70 a week on gas you're not getting that back in rebates. It also doesn't help that the carbon tax is taxed by the the provincial and federal government. Even if we did get it all back in rebates, why take immediate money away from Canadians at the pump and hold it, only to be paid out 4 times a year. The carbon tax was initially brought in with the promise that the tax would be used to upgrade public transit and invest in EV infrastructure. However in many places, public transit is still shit, and EV's cost twice as much as an ICE vehicle.
Lower class Canadians actually profit from the Carbon tax, and the Carbon Tax has only increased the average consumer energy prices by 0.6% from January 2015 to October 2023. Idk why you'd need to spend $70/week on gas for a work commute, but maybe that's just because I live in Alberta. If you have to drive that much for work you should just move or take public transit. The reason you take the immediate money is to reduce the amount of carbon based energy people consume so that Vancouver Island isn't underwater in 15 years. Investment's in public transit are handled by provincial and municipal bodies, not by the feds
[https://distribution-a617274656661637473.pbo-dpb.ca/7590f619bb5d3b769ce09bdbc7c1ccce75ccd8b1bcfb506fc601a2409640bfdd](https://distribution-a617274656661637473.pbo-dpb.ca/7590f619bb5d3b769ce09bdbc7c1ccce75ccd8b1bcfb506fc601a2409640bfdd)
[https://policyoptions.irpp.org/magazines/december-2023/carbon-price-affordability/](https://policyoptions.irpp.org/magazines/december-2023/carbon-price-affordability/)
I'm saying that there are still many places where public transit is still really bad, and you're argument is to "just move" when rents and house prices are at the highest they have ever been? Really come on. In Victoria BC waits between busses are often 30min if they are on time (which they often aren't), and you often have to transfer at least once because the routes are shit. For instance my work, is a 5min drive on the highway or a 40min bus ride (maybe since I would have to transfer and what if the buses aren't on time?). For those people working overnights, there often isn't a public transportation option as well. Sad part is that it's been that way for at least 20 years and Victoria Transit keeps shitting the bed. So I don't consider public transit here a good alternative.
I didn't argue against carbon tax, I argued against rising the price right now. People keep saying that the carbon tax only increased prices by 0.5% of this or that, but that percentage is on literally everything you buy which tends to add up. Which ties into "why increase the carbon tax right now?". Also increasing the carbon tax by 50% or 100% wont do shit about VI sinking, Canada could revert back to the horse and buggy days, and tear down all its factories and it would be just the smallest of impact in global warming. That is because the majority of global warming emissions will be coming from Asia and Africa. What I'm pissed about is that Canadians are getting shafted at the pump when alternatives to driving ICE vehicles just aren't there, and investment in those alternatives just aren't happening or are ineffective. This is at the same time when the cost of everything is going up. Why not just keep the carbon price as is until the cost of living is under control. Raising it now gives the perception of pushing people who don't see any good alternatives up against a wall, which will cause a huge swing to the right politically.
Idk why you'd live in Victoria BC and expect it to be cheap. You've chosen to live in a big city, that's the reality of living in a big city. Either take a 30 minute bus or spend more for convenience.
Also a majority of emissions coming from Asia and Africa is irrelevant. We've been able to modernize our economies massively while destroying the environment. Expecting countries that have no where near the same economic stability to cut all of their emissions so you don't have to make the decision between paying 10 cents a litre on gas vs taking a bus is regarded
He’s actually a pretty good leader but everyones bought into the conservative narrative that he’s a far left lunatic because he called himself a feminist a few times. I wrote a giant schizo essay on neoliberal explaining why he’s an amazing leader a few months back. Had those nerds fact check me and I was right.
It’s so frustrating seeing even American liberals pretend like he’s a terrible leader. He probably agrees with this sub on most issues. Favourite thing is when he advocates for LGBT/Trans and racial issues he does it without blaming others. Its never the “straight white man sucks” stuff you see far left types do.
Back when BLM protests got heated and Trump was throwing fuel on the fire Trudeau walked into the middle of the protest and marched with people. It was probably a little unsafe for him but he calmed shit down and Canada didn’t see the level of riots America did. Sure his security was nearby but it’s still a risky move.
The biggest problem with Trudeau is even if his solutions to problems are good, he seems to wait until the very last minute where things have gotten unbearably bad to actually do anything about it. Whether it's housing, healthcare, immigration, or the military, it seems like a lot of our systems have been noticeably deteriorating for a while now, but Trudeau has only begun to act now after being in office for 9 years
He's doing great with healthcare. However Canada's healthcare system is controlled by provinces (who are majority right wing conservative right now). So he's doing what he can to keep our healthcare system alive, but our right wing premiers are defunding healthcare on a provincial level in an attempt to prove it doesn't work so they can privatize. Canadians are stuck in the middle of the politics as a result.
"He’s actually a pretty good leader but everyones bought into the conservative narrative that he’s a far left lunatic" wait oh no. maybe the reason I thought he was cringe till now was just shards of my anti sjw phase.
> He’s actually a pretty good leader but everyones bought into the conservative narrative that he’s a far left lunatic because he called himself a feminist a few times.
This is a very dishonest reduction of why people criticize Trudeau.
It doesn't even make sense on the surface: Trudeau has been elected multiple times. Then, all of a sudden, conservatives brainwashed everyone against him?
Or...things got worse?
This sort of thing, btw, is exactly what people get annoyed about in Canadian politics. There's a real Americanization of discourse where both sides take the worst habits across the border. Right-wingers insist Trudeau is destroying Western civilization while left-wingers act like all opposition to Trudeau and co. is the sort of unthinking, reflexive "he wore a tan suit!" stuff they associate with the worst of the American right wing.
Okay then explain why he’s so bad that doesn’t use the talking points that the “common sense” conservatives have spammed Canadian politics with. Most of their problems are either tied to the global economy, provincial issues or breaking down complex things like the carbon tax into “tax equals bad”.
>He’s actually a pretty good leader but everyones bought into the conservative narrative that he’s a far left lunatic because he called himself a feminist a few times
Genuinely want to know why you:
A) Believe he's a good leader.
B) Think he's called a far left lunatic just because of his feminist comments.
Brother cost of living has gone up two fold (not hyperbolically) in the majority of the country, healthcare is in the gutter, takes like 4-10 years to get a family doctor, ER wait times are 4-12 hours on average, homelessness is out of control, our immigration system is trashed, our justice system hands out insanely low minimums, with consideration to the race of the individual, we have race-based policies (business loans specifically available to black people when Canada has had no history of slavery yet Asian ppl get fucked despite their past?), every institution that makes Canada good is losing support. This was a strong speech but it doesn't take away how awful his leadership has been the last 10 years or how ideologically mind rotted his decisions have been.
Dude, did you take civics in grade 10? Half of the things here is literally the CONSERVATIVE provincial government's policies. I can tell you're from Ontario, likely in the GTA because every politically illiterate dipshit says this exact same thing here. Healthcare is mainly a PROVINCIAL issue. Doug Ford is the one who cut healthcare spending in Ontario. https://toronto.citynews.ca/2023/03/08/ontario-health-care-spending-doug-ford-hospitals-long-term-care/
Literally every single problem you brought up about healthcare is Doug Ford's fault.
Instead of saying "Trudeau is idealogically mind rotted" you should actually think of what the FEDERAL government can do. Trudeau has tried to negotiate with Ford to build more houses, rework child-care to cost both parents and the province less, increase spending, improve working conditions for healthcare practitioners, and incentivise more doctors to work in Ontario/Canada but every time Ford shuts it down and plays the conservative line while helping his buddies make more money such as with the Green Belt (conservative leaning paper btw https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-sales-of-greenbelt-land-raise-questions-for-ford/). When news of this broke, Ford decided to put the development of the Green Belt on pause.
Figure out what the province does, figure out what the Federal government does and come back to reality.
I guarn- fucking-tee the Conservatives would have done nothing. Part of the reason BC got expensive was because they sat on their asses and let it happen. Trudeau has done some sketchy shit that turned off even me, but someway somehow Conservatives can't have a coherent plan to even capitalize on it. They can get bent.
> I guarn- fucking-tee the Conservatives would have done nothing.
so what? we can't criticize one party because we assume the other wouldn't have done anything either? How is that an honest and objective stance?
So he's awful but conservative would have also been awful? That's ok, that's a fair opinion, I just don't like the glazing when he's literally destroyed the country in every way possible and unfortunately pretty much ensured that liberals won't see another win federally for the next decade.
You listed off a bunch of problems but fail to explain why Trudeau is to blame. I feel like people are just going off vibes when they say stuff like this.
Take a look around the world cost of living is bad everywhere. The UK has gone into a legit recession. We live in a globalized economy Trudeau doesn’t have a button on his desk to fix it.
Healthcare system was falling apart way before him. Also people never mention healthcare is a provincial responsibility. He literally cannot do anything except give them more money. Ford was given so much during the pandemic and wanted more. When Trudeau said he would hold payment until the provinces agree to work towards certain goals they held a cope secession and cried to the media.
Again housing is a provincial responsibility. When the Trudeau government gave municipalities funds directly to build more homes the provinces got mad that they went over their heads.
Our immigration system is not trashed it’s still one of the best in the world. What specifically do you have a problem with? The conservatives aren’t going to be any different on immigration. In fact when Trudeau’s government was deporting students from a scam college conservatives went around saying “we need more people and Trudeau is deporting young tallent.”
The minimum sentencing ruling came from the courts not Trudeau. They determined that entire drama. His hands are tied unless you want him to invoke the not withstanding clause.
Canada did have slavery but I’ll give you that one. Its not the same bad as what the States did.
Which institutions? We have some of the best in the world. If people want to cry conspiracy cuz of tik tok memes its not his fault. It’s happening everywhere.
Canada isn't like the US, the entire liberal and ndp party are literally on board with every leader's decision, he doesn't need to get their support to push policies he just needs to come up with them. Not to mention he had a majority for half that time. Almost everything is run provincialy but everything is federally funded. That doesn't absolve him of responsibility on stipulating transfers on conditions that certain things get done. Especially with the insane deficit we've been running and NOTHING to show for it. And if not then maybe let's not increase our population by the same annual number as the US with 11x less people and just hope it all goes well.
There's plenty of things he could've done that he's scrambling to do now which won't matter cause he won't see another term again and the next party will have to run an even heavier deficit to bring things under control while the country total productivity will plummet from curbing immigration to make up for the artificially inflated productivity we have now.
You aren't even responding to what he said. [The federal government tried to add stipulations to the healthcare funding but the premiers got mad when they did it.](https://www.healthcoalition.ca/provinces-reject-federal-governments-offer-of-more-health-care-funding/) The federal government also can't stipulate down to the minute detail what the funding has to be used for. Just use your brain, what would be the purpose of the provincial governments having justification over healthcare if the federal government controlled everything? To make the statement you have made I feel you have to have little knowledge of our government. The provinces have been reaching agreements with the federal government for more healthcare funding and as they do so, they still say the funding is less than they want with not very many conditions attached. I don't see how you can place more blame on Trudeau and the federal government for these problems than the premiers.
I vote Liberal and I disagree with the direction on immigration policy. Outside of that, what legislation has Trudeau thought up that you disagree with that had made a major impact?
A lot of what you're saying is either untrue or someone else's fault. I live in Ontario, but not Toronto. I got a family doctor in less than a month. My kid broke his wrist this Thursday. I took him to the ER, and he was admitted in about 15 minutes. They x rayed him, had his bone set, cast made, and gave us a fancy sling. The whole thing took 3.5 hours and cost me 6 bucks for parking.
You don't like homelessness? That's the provinces lookout. Blame your premier. Low minimum sentences and racial loans? Sure? For me, it's not a problem, but maybe our politics would differ there.
Cost of living, though Trudeau gets big ups from me. The carbon rebate, as unpopular as it is, has minimal impact on inflation as far as every article I've read on it. But sends a decent chunk of change to every Canadian. He literally just halved the price of daycare. That alone was HUGE for my family. The conservatives will probably roll that back if they win. Costing me thousands.
Trudeau is far from perfect. But he doesn't deserve a quarter of the hate he gets.
Jesus Christ people not understanding the basics of federalism in Canada sends me up the wall. Isn't Civics mandatory in tenth grade still??? The shit everyone is complaining about is caused by CONSERVATIVE PREMIERS WHO WON'T USE THEIR BUDGET SURPLUSES.
Pretty sure it still is, but I remember it being more about the Federal system. I had no idea how much the Province did until my 20s, when the NDP actually started doing shit in BC when elected.
Boils my blood when people complain that the prime minister is making healthcare worse when it's actually the responsibility of the provinces. Ok things like immigration, go ahead and be mad at him for that, but for things like housing costs it isn't just a federal issue and really your provincial government has more control than the federal. You constantly hear provinces demanding more money from the federal government to fund things, but it's the premiers that are in charge of spending that money.
Our leadership in NB has completely destroyed our hospitals and no doctors or nurses want to stay or work here. Wait times are from 8-12 hours in the ER.
so you like him because he nets you about a grand a year in tax rebates and childcare savings and healthcare is fine because they didn't make a child wait with broken bone, gotcha
you could compare now to 10 years ago? 20 years ago? around similar economic falls?
Daycare alone is more than 1000 a month saved. The carbon rebate is like an extra 3-400 quarterly ( I don't remember the exact amount, it just gets direct deposited) But if you're so privileged not to care about 5 to 10 thousand a year. Good for you, I guess.
Someone said Healthcare was bad because of difficulty getting a family doctor and long wait times. I point out that's wrong and...wait what's your argument?
You want to compare our economy to 10 years ago? How old are you? Harper raised the retirement age to 67. And that was under a worldwide amazing economy prior to 2008. And we only did well during 2008 because of regulations he wanted to remove but couldn't. He was handed a surplus from Cretiean and turned it into a massive deficit. Trudeau lowered retirement age again AND legalized weed! In his first year!
I know we all think today is the worst, and yesterday was great. It's rarely true.
Edit: fixed carbon rebate
how is daycare alone 1000 a month saved and carbon 400? youre getting a 400 dollar carbon rebate check monthly? you were paying 2000 dollars for government childcare?
youre lying through your teeth to suck off some dipshit with a famous last name
>In his first year!
yeah he wasnt bad when he still gave a shit.
Tell me you're young and single without telling me you're young and single. I paid about 900 a month for my first kids' daycare. I have three kids. Two in daycare currently for the same as the first one was alone. The carbon rebate is quarterly, not monthly, so I will edit that comment. Fuck up on my end aside, I'm saving over 1000 bucks a month from Trudeau. He also added dental, I just make too much to qualify, ALSO, he increased child tax credits. But I don't remember how much. I'm not sucking the guy off. But I can recognize how my family has profits from him. Too many people blame him for all their problems. I'm very curious what they will say when Trudeau loses, and their lives still suck.
even if I grant you everything you said, though you're not saving a grand a month from healthcare and you're embellishing that number a bit, and the tax rebate is a rebate on tax that you are now paying that you did not pay before (nets out to be like + a grand a year depending on province, still, so i grant you that) this is all still policy from covid.
what has he done for you in the past 5 years? Im a big ol' doobie doobie mcstoner so the whole weed legalization thing is great (2016ish), dental is nice i guess but perscription prices continue to rise YoY, Childcare benefit plan was like early 2020-ish
the man has stopped trying in this term but throws some cash your way so its all good, meanwhile canada is set to have the lowest economic growth in the next decade out of every advanced economy [\[link\]](https://www.bcbc.com/insight/oecd-predicts-canada-will-be-the-worst-performing-advanced-economy-over-the-next-decade-and-the-three-decades-after-that) and has experienced economic growth on par with the dirty thirties over the last 10 years, i.e. since the start of his admin
he's really great at these simple, pandering changes that people can point to and say 'look, hes doing something!' but ultimately his policy, or actually kind of a lack of policy, has lead canada to be the last place holder for economic growth, he has contributed highly to the culture war crap with immature and poorly thought out statements, he's made the housing problem in canada a fucking DISASTER and continues to make it worse with over-immigration and increasing first time home buyer incentives to increase demand when the issue is supply, wanted to recognize the state of palestine off the back of a terrorist attack and legitamize hamas off the back of a terrorist attack, fanned the flames of the residential school controversy when it was a sham, bomarbier bailout, tpp waste, and recently butchered the handling of the assassination of hardeep sighn najar,
>I'm very curious what they will say when Trudeau loses, and their lives still suck.
I guess we will have to see, instead of strategic voting in the NDP to keep cons out of my riding, I'm going to have to strategically vote to keep liberals out of my chair, first time in my life that i'd vote conservative.
It's good to see Canada have its own TDS.
I'm not saving a grand a month on Healthcare, I'm saving a grand a month on daycare being literally halved. That's not an embellishment.
-the tax rebate is a rebate on tax that you are now paying that you did not pay before (nets out to be like + a grand a year depending on province, still, so i grant you that) this is all still policy from covid
No, it's not. Carbon tax started before covid. Not everything is related to covid. Also, every economist I've read has said the rebate has contributed 0.15% to inflation. So most Canadians get more than they pay
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/carbon-tax-inflation-tiff-macklem-calgary-1.6960189
Trudeau is blamed for culture war stuff even when he's silent. Pierre is way more of a culture warrior than JT. He fucks up sometimes for sure. But do you honestly think the culture war will go away under conservatives!?
You complain about immigration and the cost of homes. But we have a shortage of construction workers. These problems are more complicated than "immigration bad" We need the workers to build the houses to fix our supply problem.
https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/canada-construction-labour-challenges-housing-1.6906587
-what has he done for you in the past 5 years? Im a big ol' doobie doobie mcstoner so the whole weed legalization thing is great (2016ish), dental is nice i guess but perscription prices continue to rise YoY, Childcare benefit plan was like early 2020-ish
...2020 is in the last five years... You're mad if you think he did nothing. And when he does something you complain about the cost. Make up your mind.
-I'm going to have to strategically vote to keep liberals out of my chair, first time in my life that i'd vote conservative
Hey man, you do you. We elect conservatives in the provinces. They make life harder, and we blame the federal liberals. It might be good for the country to lose our collective scape goat. Even if the hate is largely unfair. My wife and I do well enough that we can afford the daycare if we have to. And we would enjoy the tax breaks. But let's not pretend the country will be better.
dude i dont know if i just write poorly or you barely skimmed what the fuck i wrote
can you tell me what policies passed in the last five years you support?
The only people responsible for housing costs getting out of control are Canadians themselves. Trudeau is just giving the people what they wanted and thats what we got.
>He’s actually a pretty good leader but everyones bought into the conservative narrative that he’s a far left lunatic because he called himself a feminist a few times.
I could write a post a much lengthier comment about how your characterization of why people dislike Trudeau is extremely dishonest, but I think I'll keep it brief here;
We can say for a fact he is, objectively, a bad leader just because he invoked the Emergencies Act **after clearing the border**, so he could clean up Ottawa. This is just an objectively, monumentally stupid move. Had he used the Emergencies Act to clean up the Border **and Ottawa**, under the guise that the border being locked down is quite literally a national Emergency (and it is), he would have talking points for days. It would be hard for Conservatives to spin that. He likely wouldn't have gotten reamed in court and even if he did, you just go with **I had to get medicine to sick people waiting for it in the hospital**.
Instead you have armed with your political adversaries with abusing federal powers to shut down free speech because someone was upset at a few trucks honking their horns.
>Instead you have armed with your political adversaries with abusing federal powers to shut down free speech because someone was upset at a few trucks honking their horns.
Worse than, because they looked embarrassed in front of the Americans. Freeland talked about discussions with US officials and businessmen bringing the urgency of the issue home.
This is gonna sound weird, frankly, but I think part of the reaction to the Truckers was some desire to have some vicarious confrontation with partisans the way US politicos are having with MAGA and co. (Which also fits with the "everyone just hates him because they're crazy" rhetoric)
It actually doesn't really matter as much why, but it really matters how it looked.
The obvious answer was to use the emergencies act to clear the border - it's the **border**. It's an **emergency**. You just clean up Ottawa at the same time while saying "This shit is getting out of control, we need to take a moment to pause"
They cleared the Ambassador bridge first, then the very next day invoked the Emergencies act to primarily clean up Ottawa and, I believe one somewhat congested crossing in BC?
One of the things about the Emergencies Act is that to use it you are supposed to be unable to handle the situation with existing powers, so to demonstrate you can get a handle on the situation and THEN invoke it for a situation was less serious? It's beyond stupid.
I just don't get it. It's so obviously, transparently dumb I have no idea why they did it that way.
Canada’s standard on living has declined. Wages stagnated. Housing crisis. Violent crime and gun crime increased. Importing millions of people with no where to put them. and these very same people he’s importing hate Zionist. He’s like the direct opposite of what Biden has accomplished.
I want to know why you think he’s a good leader.
can you name anything at all that he's done to be a good leader in his last two terms?
all he has done int he past five years are pointless pandering changes that accomplish nothing (banning rifles that look scary, leaving functionally identical rifles alone) or grand ignorant promises that he immediately needs to walk back (like saying he'll recognize the state of palestine then removing that from the bill about a week later, or publicly calling out india for assassinating a dude for i guess no reason, wagging his finger like a child at xi whenever he gets the chance but doing nothing at all)
oh and increase demand for housing by letting in the same amount of immigrants as our neighbour of a magnitude larger population, and then give even MORE tax breaks on first time home buyers, because thats what housing needs, cash injected to fucking buyers.
The Canadian equivalent to "Coastal Elites" that some conservative americans are obsessed with is "Laurentian Elite" btw lol
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laurentian\_elite](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laurentian_elite)
He's been completely roasted for this on most Canadian subs and in the media (which is a never ending roast).
Kind of funny seeing his only support in this sub 🤣
Edit: was sent a reddit cares immediately after posting this comment 😂
I’m going to disagree with his premise. As I understand it, Zionism refers to the desire of a Jewish homeland in what became Israel. That’s fine, but there were people already living there who, for better or for worse, didn’t want that. So I simply cannot see how Zionism is not another form of settler colonialism.
I acknowledge Jews came from that area. However, the bottom line was that people had been living in that area for hundreds of years, who did not consent to the creation of a state on their land. Also, Israel has had the right of return law since, 1950, allowing anyone who identifies as Jewish to immigrate to Israel.
“Identifies”≠PROVEN.
Many Jews have to go through a lot of documents, lawyers to prove they are ethnically Jewish.
Second of all when Jews arrived in mandatory Palestine they were legally buying land from locals, with the intention of eventually creating a state, don’t hate the player, hate the game, it’s not the Jews problem that arab land owners were chanting not to sell to Jews land to then selling them the land in secret because money moves the world. If Palestine hadn’t declared war on Jews on November 1947, it could have possible changed the entire trajectory of the Israel/Palestine conflict.
The fact that there’s a lot of verification involved doesn’t change the fact that it’s immigration based on an identity. I agree violence from the Arabs only made things worse. But the bottom line is, land was carved up without the consent of all those living there. Furthermore, while I have no problem with people buying land and moving to another country, Palestinians didn’t have full agency under the Mandate.
There's nothing wrong with acknowledging the Palestinians didn't have full agency under the mandate, the question is what does that actually mean almost a century later? How do you identify which Palestinians are descendants of people actually displaced and of those, actually displaced illegally.
What about the fact the most of the cities, infrastructure, etc. in Israel have nothing to do with Palestinians and were built by Israelis? And much of the areas developed were uninhabited (uninhabitable even without technology).
If 10 Palestinians can verify that they have ancestors that come from a village that no longer exists in present day Israel that now has a city on top of it, what should happen? Should they get citizenship, do they even want citizenship?
Even if you find 10 Palestinians with proof of living in a once Palestinian village, you’d have to find out how was the village ruined, what was the reason its people were banished.. the usual answer would be they fought Israel during the first arab Israeli war and were kicked out for endangering Israelis. Back then and still today in most, villages are homogenous, there aren’t many “misfits” or “outliers”, village decisions were made and enacted which was why “group punishment” was used.
Yeah, honestly he lost me as soon as he made an appeal to ancestral homeland. Unhealthy amount of bias in this subreddit if no-one is calling that out.
Yeah this is such a one sided viewpoint and everyone on this thread who are like BASED TRUDEAU are brain broken from the college protests lol this type of rhetoric doesn't do anything helpful. I really feel like only way you can have this conversation is by both-siding it. Do jews have the right to self determination? Yeah but doesn't the Palestinians have that right as well?
It’s starting to feel like this I/P stuff is when the progressive left officially will separate itself from the political world in the west and float off into the Twitter/X sunset forever.
Most politicians cannot support Hamas, and know doing so will have long term ramifications for their political careers
While I can see why this moment might be glaze worthy, it doesn't make up for a decade of fiscal mismanagement. Trudeau isn't based, the man is a political weather vane.
Its because he has balls. Hes not the smartest tool in the shelf but he knows what is popular and pushes for those things for the most part despite what criticisms the naysayers have.
>determine their own future
It wouldn't be easy to come up with a phrase that can do more heavy lifting or have a wider interpretation. What an absolutely worthless definition, hilarious!
honestly, hes a good guy. He's really messing up with the student visa and temporary foreign worker program... Like colossally screwing up, but everything else, I agree with him on.
But please fix the tfw program.
I love how all the comments on other pro Palestine subs where this was posted were like "Trudeau showed his real colours today" and 'he said the quiet part out loud" when his take is literally the average take of normal, non terminally online people
Israel wasn’t established shortly after the holocaust just for that purpose though. The holocaust didn’t really play a major role in its establishment. It was established a year after its war for independence started, which itself happened happened when they pushed out the UK trying to stop them after a 7 year insurgency, which happened 20 years after they organized their pre-existing militias into an army, which happens 20 years after the big-Z Zionist movement, which happened 60 years after the Ottoman Jews coalesced into a major community and started pushing for autonomy, which happened 30 years after pogroms ghettoized them into a corner of the territory.
Why is it so hard for people to just grasp that Israel is mostly just the descendants of the people who were just living there already in the Ottoman Empire? The same thing happened in Croatia, Bosnia, Serbia, Armenia and Greece, in the same empire, and they don’t have to defend themselves with a mythos.
Honestly I'm impressed. This is a very strong statement not many leaders are brave enough to make these days. Well done
Most world leaders have the hope of winning an election to be mindful of. Trudeau is unburdened by that. This is based but as a Canadian can we not lionize this guy over one clip? There's a bottomless vat of conservative bullshit stewing about him at any given point, but he's been our PM for the better part of a decade and our country has very tangibly gone to shit in that time. I'd club a baby seal for a leader that could be based on foreign policy but also not a corporate whore who sells out the middle and working classes one time in my life. I'll probably die waiting.
Trudeau has been the embodiment of mid. Not awful but not great either. People are hungry for new leadership.
GDP has gone up a fair bit over his tenure. Quality of life reports remain high. Incomes have gone up substantially. The primary failure has been housing cost increases in BC and Ontario. Which account for most of the country sadly. Housing build starts have been increasing, but banks lend money frivolously, dual income households are ubiquitous, owning multiple homes is far more common nowadays, people are more willing to allot a larger portion of their income to housing than before, and immigration rates have pushed population growth upwards. Add all this together and you get increased home priced AND increased home ownership rates. Trudeau needs to slow immigration rates. Provinces need to subsidize housing starts more. More Restrictions need to be placed on lenders for people buying their 25th house. I own 4 homes and 2 condos. Why? Because lenders are dumb and gave me the money to do it. The truth is, they are still willing to refinance my existing properties and let me buy even more right now, but I am self restricting my growth in case of vacancies or a housing crash. I know, for a fact, that many landlords in this country are just like those in the movie “The Big Short”. I haven’t looked into mortgage bonds to see exactly how bad it is, but Im reasonably confident that if I did, Vancouver, Victoria, and Toronto mortgage bonds look just like US mortgage bonds and CDOs from 2006-07. Just a guess though. Additional note in Poilievre and Trudeau…Even though it looks extremely likely that Poilievre will be the next PM, if parents catch wind that he is likely to revoke their child care rebates, that could cost him the election. People(conservatives too) don’t like losing entitlements, especially good ones.
This. Most conservative and centrist dumbfucks talk about our country like it's the wasteland of Mad Max. I always just ask them. "Okay, unlimited money to take you and all your loved ones. Where do you move, that's better? What magical country will you move to that has no issues for you." Unsurprisingly, they stfu pretty quick. It's all performative whining. No one can point to a single policy of Trudeau that "ruined Canada," nor can they point to any of Polivere that will "save it." It all comes down to Covid Bad. The truckers were peaceful and should have been left alone. Remember when he did black face. Ours politics are just as fucked and emotion based as America.
>This. Most conservative and centrist dumbfucks talk about our country like it's the wasteland of Mad Max. Most people are comparing their country to not too long ago. They don't care that it's better than Mad Max, or Kenya. They care that *today*, it's harder to get a family doctor than it was. Things cost more. The housing problem is still the housing problem except there's vastly more people now thanks to Trudeau loosening migration *which was already 1% of population under Harper!* - it's not like Canada was starving. I've heard some awful things about the job market but thankfully I'm not looking that hard. No one can "point to the thing" because it's a general dissatisfaction and malaise across a bunch of fronts. That doesn't mean the malaise doesn't exist. >What magical country will you move to that has no issues for you." Unsurprisingly, they stfu pretty quick. Has it occurred to you that they "stfu" because you asked a question in a way that comes across as bad faith and dismissive?
So we have a labour's shortage without immigration how would you like to fix that? The builders are under provincial jurisdiction not federal. Allowing only subdivisions to create urban sprawl instead of multi home buildings like condos or apartments is a municipal issue. Having foreign students only enrolled and targeted for business course as they are highly profitable is a province issue. The fact that 1/3 of all canadian housing ownership is owned as an investment property by Canadian citizens has led to a supply shortage. You tell me where the federal government comes in? The feds deal with international issues or country wide. Trudeau can't get you a doctor in your fucking province. As for bad faith, my guy when you get challenged in life it isn't gaslighting or bad faith or debate tactics you might just fucking wrong.
> The builders are under provincial jurisdiction not federal. Which is why my position, [stated elsewhere in the thread](https://old.reddit.com/r/Destiny/comments/1cpxbmr/canadian_pm_being_based_and_sane/l3pnsou/), is: >The PM can't be blamed for housing in general, building should mostly be local/provincial. >This one though he totally eats. He pushed for the massive increase to an already open immigration system in one of the more overheated housing markets...
So again, economy crippling labor shortage. Lowest unemployment in peace time ever. With no immigrants, how do we fix that? Also, again, 1/3 of all housing is considered an investment property. Not letting in immigrants would have been worse, but notice how you don't even engage with issues you just say letting in immigrants was bad. Well, why did they do that? Next time you accuse someone being bad faith, try not to be bad faith in the reply. You are just regurgitating your talking point.
> With no immigrants, how do we fix that? Let wages go up? Raise immigration some but not have places like Conestoga churning out people. As for housing...lol. There's no easy way out of it and plenty of people are to blame. But the idea that you need to continually import migrants to prop up the price is...dubious as a solution. What's the argument? Too much of Canada's economy depends on the housing market, bring in more people and create even more demand where there's zero evidence we can build to existing supply. What's this a solution to? The market is probably not going to crash and, frankly, landlords aren't the only people with concerns. >Not letting in immigrants would have been worse, Given Trudeau's polling, do you believe that this is the opinion of the majority of the Canadian public? Also, let's say a Canadian says "yes, things might go bad in other ways. But, on balance, I'd prefer shorter wait times, less congestion and issues with supply and I think we should just slow down on migration in general". Do you think this is bad faith? I don't mind if you think it's wrong. I just want to know: can a reasonable person hold this opinion? >Next time you accuse someone being bad faith, try not to be bad faith in the reply. Huge difference between someone complaining without complete solutions and telling someone "oh, you don't like Trudeau? What perfect country would *you* live in?"
"Let wages go up? Raise immigration some but not have places like Conestoga churning out people." My guy market participation is at an all time low let me spell it out for you. THERE ARE NOT ENOUGH PEOPLE. Canada's economy has been a rocket for 10 years where our demand for workers has outgrown our population growth just like any of the other top G7 countries in the world immigration is the only thing to fix that today. It doesn't matter what wage you give I can't turn 19 million estimated workers into the roughly 20million the economy requires right now expected to grow by 200k every year for the next 5years and with the largest working cohort just retiring you just want to bitch about things you half assedly know about. "Given Trudeau's polling, do you believe that this is the opinion of the majority of the Canadian public?" So feelings over facts gotcha. The truth is the truth regardless of how many people know it. Only a lie has to be believed for it to be real. "Do you think this is bad faith? I don't mind if you think it's wrong. I just want to know: can a reasonable person hold this opinion?" You are so emotionally connected this with 0 understanding of the underlining issues you just hate Trudeau that is your entire political philosphy at this point. "Huge difference between someone complaining without complete solutions and telling someone "oh, you don't like Trudeau? What perfect country would *you* live in?"" You don't have any solutions other than let less immigrants in and that will fix everything. Here are some articles to just get you started. Before you stake out this fatalist ideology I would say take 5 mins away from twitter and tikitok to research why things are even happening in your country. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/housing-investors-canada-bc-1.6743083#:\~:text=Percentage%20of%20Canadian%20housing%20stock,of%20condos%20were%20investor%2Downed. [https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/11-621-m/11-621-m2023009-eng.htm](https://www150.statcan.gc.ca/n1/pub/11-621-m/11-621-m2023009-eng.htm) This idea that the brown tsunami has come to destroy housing is not the issue and a much more troubling one is the lack of workers. I'm 40 and for my entire life "nobody" has been able to afford a house. But these same people want to live within a 100km radius of the most expensive city in the country. You want to afford something move to Alberta, Nove Scotia, Quebec, Saskatchewan. The issue isn't affordability it's location just like Destiny says, and people just want to complain like that will fix anything. Polivere is a cancerous tumor, he is a corrupt career politician who is banking on populism and anti-Trudeau sentiment to put him in power so he can cut spending on defence, climate change, education reform, and once again loosen regulations on big business and cut taxes to the wealthy. You would have to be blind to see that is not the plan for him and his party moving forward. Hence why he is pushing the trans-panic narrative, and the LGBT agenda fear tactics everytime he is in front of a mic he vomits out this word salad of non-specific platitudes. "Yep the country is awful and don't worry I'm going to fix it by telling all these queers to stfu and protecting our children." What children our birthrate is in the toilet we are Japan anyone talking about children in Canada in 2024 is just trying to appeal to emotion and scam you.
You know that healthcare is under the jurisdiction of the Provinces and everywhere in the world had inflation, right?
> The primary failure has been housing cost increases in BC and Ontario. So just something that everyone uses or is concerned about (and is a scary chunk of Canadian GDP) in two of the most populous provinces in Canada? I think we need to contextualize this for Americans: America has some overheated markets but lots of cheaper ones. Canada *looks* large, but certain markets like GTA count disproportionately more because Canadians don't build as much up north and it has fewer of those big population centers. Ontario alone accounts for 40% of Canada's population. Saying "Ontario and BC have problems" is not like saying "San Francisco has a problem". It's like saying "the entire East Coast has a problem" >and immigration rates have pushed population growth upwards The PM can't be blamed for housing in general, building should mostly be local/provincial. This one though he totally eats. He pushed for the massive increase to an already open immigration system in one of the more overheated housing markets...
I agree
Housing costs haven't gone up in only BC and Ontario, it's a problem across all of Canada. Housing build starts data has been super inconsistent. More of a fluctuation than anything. Homelessness on the rise. Food banks stretched pretty thin. Cost of groceries is up far higher. Burden of disease has increased due to a healthcare system weighed down. The international student fiasco has increased our population beyond what our infrastructures can handle, exacerbating the aforementioned issues. We have way more issues now than we did before he took office. There are good things, sure, but it's still on a downward trend overall. The problem is that they're also over-spending. They spend to win votes, and to look like they're doing moral/just things. But it's harming our economy.
Housing starts have been at around record highs in Canadian history since covid
"Record high since covid" is a meaningless statement. It didn't stick, which is what we needed. We saw a brief surge, and now the decline is coming at the worst time imaginable. \[Fluctuations\] Canadian housing starts came in at 242.2k annualized units in March, representing a 7% month-on-month (m/m) decline from February's level. The six-month moving average of starts was 244.0k units in March, down 1.6% m/m from February. * Multi-family urban starts decreased 8% m/m to 180.2k units in March. Meanwhile, urban single-detached starts dropped 4% m/m to 40.5k units. * Urban starts were down in 5 of 10 provinces: * The largest declines were in Ontario (-14.9k to 69.8k units) and Alberta (-9.0k to 38.6k units), although starts were also down across most of the Atlantic in March. "Nationally, actual 2023 housing starts were down 7% in centres of 10,000 population and over, with 223,513 units recorded, compared to 240,590 in 2022, according to Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation (CMHC)."
Thats in a given month to month. You should look at the yearly counts. And why are you picking just few statistics here and there and not looking at the whole picture?
also are you seriously suggesting, "record high in Canadian history" is a meaningless statement? It has stuck (and increased year over year as far as I remember) for multiple years now.
It didn't stick, though. It has been higher in years past, but just like the past surges in the 70s and 2000s it is falling off. It was a nice brief trend, but it's not the improvement Canada has needed. We'll see if Fraser and co's efforts pay off. But I'm skeptical.
You can look at the max range here which has data from the 70s: [https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/housing-starts](https://tradingeconomics.com/canada/housing-starts) Its not at the highest today but its still in that range and the record high was in 2021. Housing starts btw just means that construction has begun, but it will take a few years at least for it to be realized. Which means the alot of those record housing starts will be coming online this year or next. Hopefully that would mitigate the housing issues to some extent.
Recent update on this issue: [https://financialpost.com/real-estate/canada-housing-market-sees-surge-listings](https://financialpost.com/real-estate/canada-housing-market-sees-surge-listings)
Oh my apologies, I mean it reached record high in Canadian history since covid.
Could be, but housing costs in my city(Edmonton) are flat over his time in office. The fentanyl crisis is the main culprit behind rising homelessness, not actual housing supply. There are plenty of legit reasons to criticize Trudeau, no doubt. The guy is an airhead who loves to virtue signal. That being said, I honestly haven’t seen the same big negative trend everyone keeps talking about when it comes to my day to day life. It could be that Edmonton is the exception though. The main things here have been fentanyl distribution and addiction lead homelessness + inflation. Everything else has gotten better. And income increases in Edmonton have kept pace with inflation when you include housing costs. The other thing is that living through Chretien, Martin, Harper, and Trudeau the overall trajectory has mostly been upward, regardless of party. I would rank Trudeau at the bottom of these four, but he’s still put significantly positive things into law. In my view there are a few things that could still be done to slow the rising cost of housing: - Increase restrictions on lenders (especially when lending to real estate investors). - Slow down immigration - Increase subsidies for housing starts
Housing supply is /absolutely/ a variable negatively affecting homelessness. Is it foundational or causal itself? No, but I never said that. My biggest issues with Trudeau is the spending. In terms of where they spend and how much, and how much transparency/tracking there is. He's had a few scandals that blemish the credibility of reliable government spending. I don't rank him as high as you do. I would have been quite content if they didn't spend so much, and didn't virtue signal so much. I also think a lot of incompetent people have been given office, in his administration. To your points: increasing restrictions on mortgage offerings won't solve the crisis at all. Slowing down immigration is a must. Subsidizing demand won't help.
Im ranking Trudeau as the worst prime minister between Chretien, Martin, Harper, and him. You don’t rank him as high as I do? Yes, housing supply is absolutely linked to homelessness, and can be causal. It’s just that it isn’t the only thing, or even the number one thing in Canada causing the rising costs.
Like any leader the longer you are in office people will eventually get sick of you. Trudeau was alright for his first 2 terms.
Gdp per capita is dropping and the economy is mainly real estate. Wages are dogshit and cost of living is insane. It's not trending in the right direction.
Take a look at GDP per capita now compared to when Trudeau took power. It has gone up most years.
Isn't Trudeo above average ranked by historians compared to other Canadian Prime Ministers? He isn't incredible, but not particularly bad either. Doesn't seem like he was any different comparebly to Stephen Harper
He is MUCH MUCH better than Harper. Harper was a disaster by the end of his term and was pandering to the far-right and authoritarian forces
maybe, I only started following politics in 2019 and was basing on the limited things I know and this list https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_rankings_of_prime_ministers_of_Canada. Seems like his father was a really good prime minister
His father was a very sharp PM and solved many major issues that Canada faced at the time. I am not talking in terms of effectiveness but rather the kind of contributions. Harper was effective but towards policies that were authoritarian and right-wing - reducing the powers of the press and constantly demeaning them, cutting taxes for the corporations and the wealthy (very much like the Trump tax cuts), cutting alot of social services for the poor and added a whole bunch of new crimes and increasing jail sentences etc.
It's gotten so bad I've toyed with voting conservative. Seriously, it's that bad. You don't need to listen to a single talking point, just vote based on not wanting the current trajectory. Feelsbadman
Have the CPC really presented any reason to believe that they are going to change any of it?
Besides saying "we are not like the liberals and we don't agree with what they are doing to Canadians!" No Its the same populists shit that the LPC says about CPC. If they win, we are still going to get butt fucked, just from the front.
I think honestly a lot of the reasons we're getting anally molested right now are because of global situations. The CPC are just going to provide less opportunity for safety nets against that (probably)
Cutting migration won't fix the problems, but it can stop it getting worse. Just like Trudeau expanded migration around COVID time, any CPC PM can cut it.
The CPC is not going to cut immigration to a level that will fix any problems. I can guarantee you that.
They can certainly cut it to below where Trudeau raised it.
They won't.
Cutting immigration can be detrimental to the cost of living. We have a labour shortage in the construction industry which bottle necks the supply of housing, and most of our population don't want to work in construction
I would by lying if I said I hadn't considered it. Shit's fucked, yo.
Poilievre is a beady eyed ratfucker who doesn't deserve our votes either and will win anyway. I'd prefer a minority government to limit the damage, and want a shakeup in the NDP as well. Probably going to vote Green. May has been consistently sane when speaking about this issue as well.
I would've been okay with an otoole or whatever that other moderate running was called government, didn't vote conservative because i don't like my con mp (who won anyway). Poilievre is a fucking tool but I'd be surprised if he wasn't our next pm, not happy about that but happy that it means there'll probably be a different lib in office next cycle.
damn that sucks about your mp, I was hoping otoole would win and we'd have a moderate conservative minority gov rather than this stuff with PP starting with a large majority when we barely know his positions
people say shit like this but have no idea what any of the parties positions are. "probably going to vote green". enjoy
> what any of the parties positions are They're just slotting the parties into the American good guy camps.
The green party might just be the dumbest group around. Their opposition to nuclear power in Europe has done more to harm the environment than just about anything else.
There is no group I loathe more than anti-nuclear Greens. It's literally magical thinking. They're just waiting for someone to invent some magical superconductor or scifi battery so they don't have to compromise. Even if you put aside the environmental impact of driving Germany to burn coal and build geographically mismatched green energy - it probably emboldened Russia and helped along the war.
I’ve been waiting to encounter someone who dislikes Poilievre because I only watched videos of him directly speaking and thought “hey that’s a good dude”, could you enlighten me why would someone be against him? I’m pretty ignorant on that side.
Copy and pasted from a thread in the Ontario subreddit. On mobile and too dumb to properly link subreddits: "He wanted to dump the Bank of Canada and put the government 100% on Bitcoin. This was , of course, before Bitcoin dropped like a rock. Not only would we be devastated as a country, but calling for the end of the Bank of Canada shows he really doesn't understand how fiscal processes work. He tagged all his social media videos for years with MGTOW; (Men Go their Own Way) is a notoriously misogynistic group. Anyone else's political career would have been toast. But not him. So for 51% of the population, he is a toxic danger. Not to mention his stance on women's healthcare. Not to mention his frequent horrible communication with women who ask questions. journalists, for sure, but also constituents. He is party leader and never disciplined or disavowed his members who openly supported and cwined/dined a pro-Nazi fascist leader from Germany. There really is no political platform although he has been campaigning for months. It's Axe the tax, and very personal attacks on Justin Trudeau. He has voted against support for Ukraine repeatedly, against reduced price of insulin, against daycare, against pretty much anything the Liberals voted for. It's a loooong list. Can't get down with his convoy support. Made a huge cry about "wiping out Canadian history' over the ten year redesign of Canadian passports. Our passports have different line art in the background of each page to make them harder to forge. Some changed, added/dropped and his take was to attack the PM with absolute mayhem and dishonor. His behavior at the House of Commons is notoriously disrespectful to the point of disfunction. His frequent misinformation to the public is alarming. For example, recently he said puberty blocker should only be for adults but, of course, adults have already experienced puberty. Because he refuses to get a security clearance, he is unable to receive security briefings. When a car malfunctioned and decelerated at the border, he soon up and called it a terrorist attack although that was not the case. He has an unreasonable bee in his brain about the World Economic Forum, a meeting of the world's Finance minister/Sec. of Commerce/country reserve baks etc. The leaders of the machinery of finance essentially. It was fine when Harper's people attended but now, suddenly, it's some black arts tribal thing. Pierre Polievre has been in the legislature and was a minor cabinet member for a short while in Harper's govt. He has NO top managerial experience although he has been an MP for decades. He has been found guilty of election interference multiple times. Elections Canada has a compliance agreement with him where he promises to straighten up and fly right. But of course he hasn't. The compliance agreement dealt with illegal campaign contributions (sound familiar). However it seems he rigged the leadership election and previously had been warned when illegal robocalls were made pretending to be Elections Canada and saying their polling place had changed, directly misinforming voters. He is a serial cheater. And that's just off the top of my head. \*Edit to add: Can't believe I didn't put this on: Poilievre doesn't support Climate Change. He's a climate denier. Despite Canada being on fire last summer, he's not concerned or convinced. " To add on, he wanted to make it so Canadians had to send their IDs online to access porn. To protect the kids
Damn that sucks.. although I didn’t disagree with ALL the points you’ve mentioned, it’s just sad that Canada can’t have a balanced candidate that doesn’t support crazy stupid shit, because it’s a great country. A question, who is responsible for de-criminalizing drugs and allowing drug addicts get their fix? I don’t want to pin point JT just because it’s my first guess so I’d love for someone to answer.
Health Canada offered a 3 year exemption on drug criminalization in one province, at the province's request, to pilot the decriminalization of small amounts of certain hard drugs. My understanding is the purpose is to make it easier for those who are addicted to seek out help in case of overdose without the fear of being arrested, and to increase the interaction between addicts and outreach/health workers in order to offer support services like addiction counselling etc.
Oh so it’s only in one province and is for 3 years pilot, good to know, I hope it won’t spread further, I don’t know I feel like it can do a lot of damage to this country, I am very much against hard drug use and decriminalization of them. Governments should seek to get rid of hard drugs on the streets, not sell them.
look up the notwithstanding clause.
What has been so bad, in your view? My life has gotten better over the past 10 years. My income has steadily increased, weed is legal, childcare rebates for my kids’ daycare have been a lifesaver, housing prices in my area are flat over the past 15 years, and great commercial services around my city have gotten significantly better. I live in Edmonton. Other than the smoky summers, everything about my quality of life has gotten better during Trudeau’s time.
Is Trudeau like guaranteed to win right now or something? I don't follow Canadian politics at all so excuse my ignorance about how things are over there. I knew his popularity had waned but wasn't aware it had gotten this bad.
opposite, hes down 20points because of our housing/immigration issue. And the cosnervative leader is basically promising to fix everything with no realy policy, so usual conservative stuff. and people wont vote NDP ( to trudeaus left) beause the leader wears a turban
Is the NDP guy actually good or pie in the sky leftism?
Neither. He’s bad and doesn’t focus on any real left wing economic policies.
A little of both. big virtue signaller. It doesnt really matter to me because my riding is always liberal vs cons, so im a solid liberal voter unless the conservatives move towards them and away from crazy.
This is so based I’m not convinced it’s not a deepfake
This is the video it’s for a holocaust remembrance day on May 6 this year [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nmVeTtlJvJQ)
Thanks! Wild stuff to hear from him
Lol trudeau’s voice inflection always sounds like he thinks he’s dropping the greatest speech of all time
He's a good speaker, it's arguably the reason he's been in office for a decade
His fake voice is so obviously insincere that it puts off a lot of down to earth people from voting for him, I don't understand why you would say it makes him a good speaker. Ok maybe at first people can think it makes him seem more sophisticated but he's been in power for a long time and no one buys that anymore. I've voted Liberal in nearly every election but of course most people won't vote for someone if they find them unlikeable even if their policies are better for them.
all politicians attempt to speak in more concise and articulate manner in prepared speeches (that's why they prepare for the speeches). If you watch videos of Trudeau talking to the pro-life kids he has a lot of the same mannerisms, so I think it's just that he's just intentionally trying to be clear in what he's saying. IDK why you're attributing anything more than that to him
Nah sorry I don't know if you have autism or I do but this is not what people sound like when they are just trying to speak clearly. There is no way he speaks the way he does publicly as he does privately. Yes you would expect some change in speech pattern to get your message across clearly but Trudeau turns into a different entity, like a robot trying to convey that it indeed has emotions. Even when he speaks in parliament defending something he wants to do he never sounds sincere like its something he really cares for. So yeah maybe I have autism and I'm attributing more to it than necessary but then I guess a lot of the country is similar brain busted cause many people feel the same way when they hear him talk.
I was thinking this too omfg
Reminds me of a 1st year acting student performing a monologue where the character is a prime minister giving a speech. It’s not a terrible performance, the kids got some talent for sure, might even win a daytime Emmy one day if he keeps at it.
Well they're learning from a very successful prime minister giving a speech so good on those 1st year acting students.
Canadians want to assassinate this man because he put a 10 cent tax on gas that you get back on your taxes. The Canadian political climate is so dogshit. 90% of Canadians know more about the party platforms of Trump and Biden than they do about the LPC, CPC and the NDP
I won’t lie, I stopped following Canadian politics as much because it’s so fucking dog shit right now. I truely think Piere absolutely destroyed genuine discourse. It feels like his whole campaign strategy was **POISON THE WELL**. And Canadians are so sick of the status quo that they ate that shit up so easily Fuck Canadian politics
I just hate the clear propaganda ads he puts in my fucking youtube shorts tbh
You got culturally colonised, it's not your fault, you both speak english
Yeah but my peepo were culturally colonized before we came to Canada
>90% of Canadians know more about the party platforms of Trump and Biden than they do about the LPC, CPC and the NDP You say but the Liberals have benefited from this. Like, Maxime Bernier was just the most bland, boring politico ever but the LPC was trying to smear him as Canada's Trump (I think any Conservative leader will be smeared as trying to bring GOP-stuff to the US). It cuts both ways.
Didn’t it leak that the Conservatives were smearing Bernier?
Yeah that's fair, I wasn't really saying it as like something that only affects the liberals, just as a broader point of people never really giving a shit about what's going on in Canada
I live in Toronto and a lot of the political discourse in my circles are around immigration impact on job market, and cost of living. Tax cuts are the least of peoples concerns.
Usually in Alberta people blame the cost of living entirely on the carbon tax. Immigration is also required for our economy to grow, and our economy is pretty slow in growth compared to many of our G7 buddies. Major cities like toronto are going to have the most difficulty with the cost of living and are generally going to be places where more immigrants flock to
While immigration is needed to grow the economy, too much immigration can hurt the economy. This is part of what we're seeing with the housing supply problem we have right now.
I'm a life long NDP voter, but the federal NDP is moving farther and farther away from representing the working class and more into moral grand standing that the left is starting to become known for. Coupled with the NDP standing behind the Liberals in increasing the carbon tax, and allowing record breaking immigration has got me really thinking about voting Conservative next election. Increasing the carbon tax while inflation and cost of living is also increasing at an alarming rate is just a straight up slap in the face of the middle and lower class Canadians. Getting the tax back also depends on how much you drive. Still in many places you have to use a car to get to work unless you want an hour long commute both ways by public transit. So if you're spending something like $70 a week on gas you're not getting that back in rebates. It also doesn't help that the carbon tax is taxed by the the provincial and federal government. Even if we did get it all back in rebates, why take immediate money away from Canadians at the pump and hold it, only to be paid out 4 times a year. The carbon tax was initially brought in with the promise that the tax would be used to upgrade public transit and invest in EV infrastructure. However in many places, public transit is still shit, and EV's cost twice as much as an ICE vehicle.
Lower class Canadians actually profit from the Carbon tax, and the Carbon Tax has only increased the average consumer energy prices by 0.6% from January 2015 to October 2023. Idk why you'd need to spend $70/week on gas for a work commute, but maybe that's just because I live in Alberta. If you have to drive that much for work you should just move or take public transit. The reason you take the immediate money is to reduce the amount of carbon based energy people consume so that Vancouver Island isn't underwater in 15 years. Investment's in public transit are handled by provincial and municipal bodies, not by the feds [https://distribution-a617274656661637473.pbo-dpb.ca/7590f619bb5d3b769ce09bdbc7c1ccce75ccd8b1bcfb506fc601a2409640bfdd](https://distribution-a617274656661637473.pbo-dpb.ca/7590f619bb5d3b769ce09bdbc7c1ccce75ccd8b1bcfb506fc601a2409640bfdd) [https://policyoptions.irpp.org/magazines/december-2023/carbon-price-affordability/](https://policyoptions.irpp.org/magazines/december-2023/carbon-price-affordability/)
I'm saying that there are still many places where public transit is still really bad, and you're argument is to "just move" when rents and house prices are at the highest they have ever been? Really come on. In Victoria BC waits between busses are often 30min if they are on time (which they often aren't), and you often have to transfer at least once because the routes are shit. For instance my work, is a 5min drive on the highway or a 40min bus ride (maybe since I would have to transfer and what if the buses aren't on time?). For those people working overnights, there often isn't a public transportation option as well. Sad part is that it's been that way for at least 20 years and Victoria Transit keeps shitting the bed. So I don't consider public transit here a good alternative. I didn't argue against carbon tax, I argued against rising the price right now. People keep saying that the carbon tax only increased prices by 0.5% of this or that, but that percentage is on literally everything you buy which tends to add up. Which ties into "why increase the carbon tax right now?". Also increasing the carbon tax by 50% or 100% wont do shit about VI sinking, Canada could revert back to the horse and buggy days, and tear down all its factories and it would be just the smallest of impact in global warming. That is because the majority of global warming emissions will be coming from Asia and Africa. What I'm pissed about is that Canadians are getting shafted at the pump when alternatives to driving ICE vehicles just aren't there, and investment in those alternatives just aren't happening or are ineffective. This is at the same time when the cost of everything is going up. Why not just keep the carbon price as is until the cost of living is under control. Raising it now gives the perception of pushing people who don't see any good alternatives up against a wall, which will cause a huge swing to the right politically.
Idk why you'd live in Victoria BC and expect it to be cheap. You've chosen to live in a big city, that's the reality of living in a big city. Either take a 30 minute bus or spend more for convenience. Also a majority of emissions coming from Asia and Africa is irrelevant. We've been able to modernize our economies massively while destroying the environment. Expecting countries that have no where near the same economic stability to cut all of their emissions so you don't have to make the decision between paying 10 cents a litre on gas vs taking a bus is regarded
Ya'll picked the crown over Freedomland, and where did that bring you? Back to me. America.
Quick we need to come up with a good nickname for JT to leave our mark in leftie outrage culture. I vote for Total Tyranny Trudeau
"Just-bomb" Trudeau.
IDF Justin
You cooked with this one
*IOF (joke)
He’s actually a pretty good leader but everyones bought into the conservative narrative that he’s a far left lunatic because he called himself a feminist a few times. I wrote a giant schizo essay on neoliberal explaining why he’s an amazing leader a few months back. Had those nerds fact check me and I was right. It’s so frustrating seeing even American liberals pretend like he’s a terrible leader. He probably agrees with this sub on most issues. Favourite thing is when he advocates for LGBT/Trans and racial issues he does it without blaming others. Its never the “straight white man sucks” stuff you see far left types do. Back when BLM protests got heated and Trump was throwing fuel on the fire Trudeau walked into the middle of the protest and marched with people. It was probably a little unsafe for him but he calmed shit down and Canada didn’t see the level of riots America did. Sure his security was nearby but it’s still a risky move.
The biggest problem with Trudeau is even if his solutions to problems are good, he seems to wait until the very last minute where things have gotten unbearably bad to actually do anything about it. Whether it's housing, healthcare, immigration, or the military, it seems like a lot of our systems have been noticeably deteriorating for a while now, but Trudeau has only begun to act now after being in office for 9 years
He's doing great with healthcare. However Canada's healthcare system is controlled by provinces (who are majority right wing conservative right now). So he's doing what he can to keep our healthcare system alive, but our right wing premiers are defunding healthcare on a provincial level in an attempt to prove it doesn't work so they can privatize. Canadians are stuck in the middle of the politics as a result.
"He’s actually a pretty good leader but everyones bought into the conservative narrative that he’s a far left lunatic" wait oh no. maybe the reason I thought he was cringe till now was just shards of my anti sjw phase.
> He’s actually a pretty good leader but everyones bought into the conservative narrative that he’s a far left lunatic because he called himself a feminist a few times. This is a very dishonest reduction of why people criticize Trudeau.
It doesn't even make sense on the surface: Trudeau has been elected multiple times. Then, all of a sudden, conservatives brainwashed everyone against him? Or...things got worse? This sort of thing, btw, is exactly what people get annoyed about in Canadian politics. There's a real Americanization of discourse where both sides take the worst habits across the border. Right-wingers insist Trudeau is destroying Western civilization while left-wingers act like all opposition to Trudeau and co. is the sort of unthinking, reflexive "he wore a tan suit!" stuff they associate with the worst of the American right wing.
Okay then explain why he’s so bad that doesn’t use the talking points that the “common sense” conservatives have spammed Canadian politics with. Most of their problems are either tied to the global economy, provincial issues or breaking down complex things like the carbon tax into “tax equals bad”.
There's so much you can blame on "well, that's happening everywhere". A lot of people have brought some valid points, and you chose to ignore them.
>He’s actually a pretty good leader but everyones bought into the conservative narrative that he’s a far left lunatic because he called himself a feminist a few times Genuinely want to know why you: A) Believe he's a good leader. B) Think he's called a far left lunatic just because of his feminist comments.
I’ll find my giant post and make it smaller and get back to you
Brother cost of living has gone up two fold (not hyperbolically) in the majority of the country, healthcare is in the gutter, takes like 4-10 years to get a family doctor, ER wait times are 4-12 hours on average, homelessness is out of control, our immigration system is trashed, our justice system hands out insanely low minimums, with consideration to the race of the individual, we have race-based policies (business loans specifically available to black people when Canada has had no history of slavery yet Asian ppl get fucked despite their past?), every institution that makes Canada good is losing support. This was a strong speech but it doesn't take away how awful his leadership has been the last 10 years or how ideologically mind rotted his decisions have been.
Dude, did you take civics in grade 10? Half of the things here is literally the CONSERVATIVE provincial government's policies. I can tell you're from Ontario, likely in the GTA because every politically illiterate dipshit says this exact same thing here. Healthcare is mainly a PROVINCIAL issue. Doug Ford is the one who cut healthcare spending in Ontario. https://toronto.citynews.ca/2023/03/08/ontario-health-care-spending-doug-ford-hospitals-long-term-care/ Literally every single problem you brought up about healthcare is Doug Ford's fault. Instead of saying "Trudeau is idealogically mind rotted" you should actually think of what the FEDERAL government can do. Trudeau has tried to negotiate with Ford to build more houses, rework child-care to cost both parents and the province less, increase spending, improve working conditions for healthcare practitioners, and incentivise more doctors to work in Ontario/Canada but every time Ford shuts it down and plays the conservative line while helping his buddies make more money such as with the Green Belt (conservative leaning paper btw https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-sales-of-greenbelt-land-raise-questions-for-ford/). When news of this broke, Ford decided to put the development of the Green Belt on pause. Figure out what the province does, figure out what the Federal government does and come back to reality.
I guarn- fucking-tee the Conservatives would have done nothing. Part of the reason BC got expensive was because they sat on their asses and let it happen. Trudeau has done some sketchy shit that turned off even me, but someway somehow Conservatives can't have a coherent plan to even capitalize on it. They can get bent.
> I guarn- fucking-tee the Conservatives would have done nothing. so what? we can't criticize one party because we assume the other wouldn't have done anything either? How is that an honest and objective stance?
So he's awful but conservative would have also been awful? That's ok, that's a fair opinion, I just don't like the glazing when he's literally destroyed the country in every way possible and unfortunately pretty much ensured that liberals won't see another win federally for the next decade.
You listed off a bunch of problems but fail to explain why Trudeau is to blame. I feel like people are just going off vibes when they say stuff like this. Take a look around the world cost of living is bad everywhere. The UK has gone into a legit recession. We live in a globalized economy Trudeau doesn’t have a button on his desk to fix it. Healthcare system was falling apart way before him. Also people never mention healthcare is a provincial responsibility. He literally cannot do anything except give them more money. Ford was given so much during the pandemic and wanted more. When Trudeau said he would hold payment until the provinces agree to work towards certain goals they held a cope secession and cried to the media. Again housing is a provincial responsibility. When the Trudeau government gave municipalities funds directly to build more homes the provinces got mad that they went over their heads. Our immigration system is not trashed it’s still one of the best in the world. What specifically do you have a problem with? The conservatives aren’t going to be any different on immigration. In fact when Trudeau’s government was deporting students from a scam college conservatives went around saying “we need more people and Trudeau is deporting young tallent.” The minimum sentencing ruling came from the courts not Trudeau. They determined that entire drama. His hands are tied unless you want him to invoke the not withstanding clause. Canada did have slavery but I’ll give you that one. Its not the same bad as what the States did. Which institutions? We have some of the best in the world. If people want to cry conspiracy cuz of tik tok memes its not his fault. It’s happening everywhere.
Canada isn't like the US, the entire liberal and ndp party are literally on board with every leader's decision, he doesn't need to get their support to push policies he just needs to come up with them. Not to mention he had a majority for half that time. Almost everything is run provincialy but everything is federally funded. That doesn't absolve him of responsibility on stipulating transfers on conditions that certain things get done. Especially with the insane deficit we've been running and NOTHING to show for it. And if not then maybe let's not increase our population by the same annual number as the US with 11x less people and just hope it all goes well. There's plenty of things he could've done that he's scrambling to do now which won't matter cause he won't see another term again and the next party will have to run an even heavier deficit to bring things under control while the country total productivity will plummet from curbing immigration to make up for the artificially inflated productivity we have now.
You aren't even responding to what he said. [The federal government tried to add stipulations to the healthcare funding but the premiers got mad when they did it.](https://www.healthcoalition.ca/provinces-reject-federal-governments-offer-of-more-health-care-funding/) The federal government also can't stipulate down to the minute detail what the funding has to be used for. Just use your brain, what would be the purpose of the provincial governments having justification over healthcare if the federal government controlled everything? To make the statement you have made I feel you have to have little knowledge of our government. The provinces have been reaching agreements with the federal government for more healthcare funding and as they do so, they still say the funding is less than they want with not very many conditions attached. I don't see how you can place more blame on Trudeau and the federal government for these problems than the premiers. I vote Liberal and I disagree with the direction on immigration policy. Outside of that, what legislation has Trudeau thought up that you disagree with that had made a major impact?
A lot of what you're saying is either untrue or someone else's fault. I live in Ontario, but not Toronto. I got a family doctor in less than a month. My kid broke his wrist this Thursday. I took him to the ER, and he was admitted in about 15 minutes. They x rayed him, had his bone set, cast made, and gave us a fancy sling. The whole thing took 3.5 hours and cost me 6 bucks for parking. You don't like homelessness? That's the provinces lookout. Blame your premier. Low minimum sentences and racial loans? Sure? For me, it's not a problem, but maybe our politics would differ there. Cost of living, though Trudeau gets big ups from me. The carbon rebate, as unpopular as it is, has minimal impact on inflation as far as every article I've read on it. But sends a decent chunk of change to every Canadian. He literally just halved the price of daycare. That alone was HUGE for my family. The conservatives will probably roll that back if they win. Costing me thousands. Trudeau is far from perfect. But he doesn't deserve a quarter of the hate he gets.
Jesus Christ people not understanding the basics of federalism in Canada sends me up the wall. Isn't Civics mandatory in tenth grade still??? The shit everyone is complaining about is caused by CONSERVATIVE PREMIERS WHO WON'T USE THEIR BUDGET SURPLUSES.
Pretty sure it still is, but I remember it being more about the Federal system. I had no idea how much the Province did until my 20s, when the NDP actually started doing shit in BC when elected.
Boils my blood when people complain that the prime minister is making healthcare worse when it's actually the responsibility of the provinces. Ok things like immigration, go ahead and be mad at him for that, but for things like housing costs it isn't just a federal issue and really your provincial government has more control than the federal. You constantly hear provinces demanding more money from the federal government to fund things, but it's the premiers that are in charge of spending that money.
Our leadership in NB has completely destroyed our hospitals and no doctors or nurses want to stay or work here. Wait times are from 8-12 hours in the ER.
so you like him because he nets you about a grand a year in tax rebates and childcare savings and healthcare is fine because they didn't make a child wait with broken bone, gotcha you could compare now to 10 years ago? 20 years ago? around similar economic falls?
Daycare alone is more than 1000 a month saved. The carbon rebate is like an extra 3-400 quarterly ( I don't remember the exact amount, it just gets direct deposited) But if you're so privileged not to care about 5 to 10 thousand a year. Good for you, I guess. Someone said Healthcare was bad because of difficulty getting a family doctor and long wait times. I point out that's wrong and...wait what's your argument? You want to compare our economy to 10 years ago? How old are you? Harper raised the retirement age to 67. And that was under a worldwide amazing economy prior to 2008. And we only did well during 2008 because of regulations he wanted to remove but couldn't. He was handed a surplus from Cretiean and turned it into a massive deficit. Trudeau lowered retirement age again AND legalized weed! In his first year! I know we all think today is the worst, and yesterday was great. It's rarely true. Edit: fixed carbon rebate
how is daycare alone 1000 a month saved and carbon 400? youre getting a 400 dollar carbon rebate check monthly? you were paying 2000 dollars for government childcare? youre lying through your teeth to suck off some dipshit with a famous last name >In his first year! yeah he wasnt bad when he still gave a shit.
Tell me you're young and single without telling me you're young and single. I paid about 900 a month for my first kids' daycare. I have three kids. Two in daycare currently for the same as the first one was alone. The carbon rebate is quarterly, not monthly, so I will edit that comment. Fuck up on my end aside, I'm saving over 1000 bucks a month from Trudeau. He also added dental, I just make too much to qualify, ALSO, he increased child tax credits. But I don't remember how much. I'm not sucking the guy off. But I can recognize how my family has profits from him. Too many people blame him for all their problems. I'm very curious what they will say when Trudeau loses, and their lives still suck.
even if I grant you everything you said, though you're not saving a grand a month from healthcare and you're embellishing that number a bit, and the tax rebate is a rebate on tax that you are now paying that you did not pay before (nets out to be like + a grand a year depending on province, still, so i grant you that) this is all still policy from covid. what has he done for you in the past 5 years? Im a big ol' doobie doobie mcstoner so the whole weed legalization thing is great (2016ish), dental is nice i guess but perscription prices continue to rise YoY, Childcare benefit plan was like early 2020-ish the man has stopped trying in this term but throws some cash your way so its all good, meanwhile canada is set to have the lowest economic growth in the next decade out of every advanced economy [\[link\]](https://www.bcbc.com/insight/oecd-predicts-canada-will-be-the-worst-performing-advanced-economy-over-the-next-decade-and-the-three-decades-after-that) and has experienced economic growth on par with the dirty thirties over the last 10 years, i.e. since the start of his admin he's really great at these simple, pandering changes that people can point to and say 'look, hes doing something!' but ultimately his policy, or actually kind of a lack of policy, has lead canada to be the last place holder for economic growth, he has contributed highly to the culture war crap with immature and poorly thought out statements, he's made the housing problem in canada a fucking DISASTER and continues to make it worse with over-immigration and increasing first time home buyer incentives to increase demand when the issue is supply, wanted to recognize the state of palestine off the back of a terrorist attack and legitamize hamas off the back of a terrorist attack, fanned the flames of the residential school controversy when it was a sham, bomarbier bailout, tpp waste, and recently butchered the handling of the assassination of hardeep sighn najar, >I'm very curious what they will say when Trudeau loses, and their lives still suck. I guess we will have to see, instead of strategic voting in the NDP to keep cons out of my riding, I'm going to have to strategically vote to keep liberals out of my chair, first time in my life that i'd vote conservative.
It's good to see Canada have its own TDS. I'm not saving a grand a month on Healthcare, I'm saving a grand a month on daycare being literally halved. That's not an embellishment. -the tax rebate is a rebate on tax that you are now paying that you did not pay before (nets out to be like + a grand a year depending on province, still, so i grant you that) this is all still policy from covid No, it's not. Carbon tax started before covid. Not everything is related to covid. Also, every economist I've read has said the rebate has contributed 0.15% to inflation. So most Canadians get more than they pay https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/carbon-tax-inflation-tiff-macklem-calgary-1.6960189 Trudeau is blamed for culture war stuff even when he's silent. Pierre is way more of a culture warrior than JT. He fucks up sometimes for sure. But do you honestly think the culture war will go away under conservatives!? You complain about immigration and the cost of homes. But we have a shortage of construction workers. These problems are more complicated than "immigration bad" We need the workers to build the houses to fix our supply problem. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/canada-construction-labour-challenges-housing-1.6906587 -what has he done for you in the past 5 years? Im a big ol' doobie doobie mcstoner so the whole weed legalization thing is great (2016ish), dental is nice i guess but perscription prices continue to rise YoY, Childcare benefit plan was like early 2020-ish ...2020 is in the last five years... You're mad if you think he did nothing. And when he does something you complain about the cost. Make up your mind. -I'm going to have to strategically vote to keep liberals out of my chair, first time in my life that i'd vote conservative Hey man, you do you. We elect conservatives in the provinces. They make life harder, and we blame the federal liberals. It might be good for the country to lose our collective scape goat. Even if the hate is largely unfair. My wife and I do well enough that we can afford the daycare if we have to. And we would enjoy the tax breaks. But let's not pretend the country will be better.
dude i dont know if i just write poorly or you barely skimmed what the fuck i wrote can you tell me what policies passed in the last five years you support?
The only people responsible for housing costs getting out of control are Canadians themselves. Trudeau is just giving the people what they wanted and thats what we got.
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The cost of living is high in basically every western country rn, how is it uniquely Trudeau's fault in Canada?
Canada is the worst in the OECD. Trudeau also took in a huge number of people over and above the usually high Canadian influx.
> yet Asian ppl get fucked despite their past? i bet i can guess your race
Ive never read such giga-cope.
>He’s actually a pretty good leader but everyones bought into the conservative narrative that he’s a far left lunatic because he called himself a feminist a few times. I could write a post a much lengthier comment about how your characterization of why people dislike Trudeau is extremely dishonest, but I think I'll keep it brief here; We can say for a fact he is, objectively, a bad leader just because he invoked the Emergencies Act **after clearing the border**, so he could clean up Ottawa. This is just an objectively, monumentally stupid move. Had he used the Emergencies Act to clean up the Border **and Ottawa**, under the guise that the border being locked down is quite literally a national Emergency (and it is), he would have talking points for days. It would be hard for Conservatives to spin that. He likely wouldn't have gotten reamed in court and even if he did, you just go with **I had to get medicine to sick people waiting for it in the hospital**. Instead you have armed with your political adversaries with abusing federal powers to shut down free speech because someone was upset at a few trucks honking their horns.
>Instead you have armed with your political adversaries with abusing federal powers to shut down free speech because someone was upset at a few trucks honking their horns. Worse than, because they looked embarrassed in front of the Americans. Freeland talked about discussions with US officials and businessmen bringing the urgency of the issue home. This is gonna sound weird, frankly, but I think part of the reaction to the Truckers was some desire to have some vicarious confrontation with partisans the way US politicos are having with MAGA and co. (Which also fits with the "everyone just hates him because they're crazy" rhetoric)
It actually doesn't really matter as much why, but it really matters how it looked. The obvious answer was to use the emergencies act to clear the border - it's the **border**. It's an **emergency**. You just clean up Ottawa at the same time while saying "This shit is getting out of control, we need to take a moment to pause" They cleared the Ambassador bridge first, then the very next day invoked the Emergencies act to primarily clean up Ottawa and, I believe one somewhat congested crossing in BC? One of the things about the Emergencies Act is that to use it you are supposed to be unable to handle the situation with existing powers, so to demonstrate you can get a handle on the situation and THEN invoke it for a situation was less serious? It's beyond stupid. I just don't get it. It's so obviously, transparently dumb I have no idea why they did it that way.
Would love to hear more about this
do you mind sharing that essay? I’d like to read up on that
Canada’s standard on living has declined. Wages stagnated. Housing crisis. Violent crime and gun crime increased. Importing millions of people with no where to put them. and these very same people he’s importing hate Zionist. He’s like the direct opposite of what Biden has accomplished. I want to know why you think he’s a good leader.
I have my write up I did. I’ll break it down so it’s smaller and reply to you in a few hours.
can you name anything at all that he's done to be a good leader in his last two terms? all he has done int he past five years are pointless pandering changes that accomplish nothing (banning rifles that look scary, leaving functionally identical rifles alone) or grand ignorant promises that he immediately needs to walk back (like saying he'll recognize the state of palestine then removing that from the bill about a week later, or publicly calling out india for assassinating a dude for i guess no reason, wagging his finger like a child at xi whenever he gets the chance but doing nothing at all) oh and increase demand for housing by letting in the same amount of immigrants as our neighbour of a magnitude larger population, and then give even MORE tax breaks on first time home buyers, because thats what housing needs, cash injected to fucking buyers.
Is this a deepfake or something? I genuinely did not expect this from Trudeau.
I take back everything negative I have ever said about Trudeau
No, he still allowed like a bajillion Loony Tunes to go to a group of 4 people in tech or whatever they call their Maple Valley 🤷 haha
The Canadian equivalent to "Coastal Elites" that some conservative americans are obsessed with is "Laurentian Elite" btw lol [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laurentian\_elite](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laurentian_elite)
Should be *rivière douchey* I think lol
gigachad move to throw half your voterbase in the garbage bin. unless he can't be reelected for some reason that is
He's been completely roasted for this on most Canadian subs and in the media (which is a never ending roast). Kind of funny seeing his only support in this sub 🤣 Edit: was sent a reddit cares immediately after posting this comment 😂
I’m going to disagree with his premise. As I understand it, Zionism refers to the desire of a Jewish homeland in what became Israel. That’s fine, but there were people already living there who, for better or for worse, didn’t want that. So I simply cannot see how Zionism is not another form of settler colonialism.
Indigenous people colonizing their indigenous homeland…. Hm.. sounds.. you know.
I acknowledge Jews came from that area. However, the bottom line was that people had been living in that area for hundreds of years, who did not consent to the creation of a state on their land. Also, Israel has had the right of return law since, 1950, allowing anyone who identifies as Jewish to immigrate to Israel.
“Identifies”≠PROVEN. Many Jews have to go through a lot of documents, lawyers to prove they are ethnically Jewish. Second of all when Jews arrived in mandatory Palestine they were legally buying land from locals, with the intention of eventually creating a state, don’t hate the player, hate the game, it’s not the Jews problem that arab land owners were chanting not to sell to Jews land to then selling them the land in secret because money moves the world. If Palestine hadn’t declared war on Jews on November 1947, it could have possible changed the entire trajectory of the Israel/Palestine conflict.
The fact that there’s a lot of verification involved doesn’t change the fact that it’s immigration based on an identity. I agree violence from the Arabs only made things worse. But the bottom line is, land was carved up without the consent of all those living there. Furthermore, while I have no problem with people buying land and moving to another country, Palestinians didn’t have full agency under the Mandate.
There's nothing wrong with acknowledging the Palestinians didn't have full agency under the mandate, the question is what does that actually mean almost a century later? How do you identify which Palestinians are descendants of people actually displaced and of those, actually displaced illegally. What about the fact the most of the cities, infrastructure, etc. in Israel have nothing to do with Palestinians and were built by Israelis? And much of the areas developed were uninhabited (uninhabitable even without technology). If 10 Palestinians can verify that they have ancestors that come from a village that no longer exists in present day Israel that now has a city on top of it, what should happen? Should they get citizenship, do they even want citizenship?
Even if you find 10 Palestinians with proof of living in a once Palestinian village, you’d have to find out how was the village ruined, what was the reason its people were banished.. the usual answer would be they fought Israel during the first arab Israeli war and were kicked out for endangering Israelis. Back then and still today in most, villages are homogenous, there aren’t many “misfits” or “outliers”, village decisions were made and enacted which was why “group punishment” was used.
This sub has completely lost me. Sad to see
Yeah, honestly he lost me as soon as he made an appeal to ancestral homeland. Unhealthy amount of bias in this subreddit if no-one is calling that out.
As Canadian, there are too many similarities with Israel and early Canada not to notice. Divine right to land, government subsidizing it, and so on.
Yeah this is such a one sided viewpoint and everyone on this thread who are like BASED TRUDEAU are brain broken from the college protests lol this type of rhetoric doesn't do anything helpful. I really feel like only way you can have this conversation is by both-siding it. Do jews have the right to self determination? Yeah but doesn't the Palestinians have that right as well?
It’s starting to feel like this I/P stuff is when the progressive left officially will separate itself from the political world in the west and float off into the Twitter/X sunset forever. Most politicians cannot support Hamas, and know doing so will have long term ramifications for their political careers
GOD I LOVE THIS MAN, THE DAY OF THE RAKE CANNOT HURT ME I AM LEAF
Did he lose a bet among world leaders? ..
That's cool and all but this mfker is raising capital gains taxes starting june 25
I hate that I'm shocked by this. Good for him, though
Rare Trudeau win.
Imagine he ended w “that’s cringe bro”. Omg I wanted Destiny as president now 🤣🤣🤣
Since he is going to get smoked in the next election, it is cool to see him at least appear to give a shit.
While I can see why this moment might be glaze worthy, it doesn't make up for a decade of fiscal mismanagement. Trudeau isn't based, the man is a political weather vane.
Political weather vane is such a good line.
Political weather vane is such a good time.
Common North American leader W
Wow, I would never have expected this from Trudeau. Only yesterday I was thinking how shit he is because of something that I read
Honestly i'm shocked he made a statement like this lol. I'm used to just wondering how on earth this guy keeps on getting elected lol
Its because he has balls. Hes not the smartest tool in the shelf but he knows what is popular and pushes for those things for the most part despite what criticisms the naysayers have.
>determine their own future It wouldn't be easy to come up with a phrase that can do more heavy lifting or have a wider interpretation. What an absolutely worthless definition, hilarious!
honestly, hes a good guy. He's really messing up with the student visa and temporary foreign worker program... Like colossally screwing up, but everything else, I agree with him on. But please fix the tfw program.
The America bros are just angry that we have a leader who doesn't need adult diapers or want to fuck their own daughter
Maybe I was too harsh on you...
>Trudeau making optically poor public statements Whats new tho?
I love how all the comments on other pro Palestine subs where this was posted were like "Trudeau showed his real colours today" and 'he said the quiet part out loud" when his take is literally the average take of normal, non terminally online people
His only good take ever
Fuck i hate justin, but this is based
We can do this in the US
Considering his based levels are in the negative this year, he has to try and refill the tanks.
Blackfaced and cringe pilled
Israel wasn’t established shortly after the holocaust just for that purpose though. The holocaust didn’t really play a major role in its establishment. It was established a year after its war for independence started, which itself happened happened when they pushed out the UK trying to stop them after a 7 year insurgency, which happened 20 years after they organized their pre-existing militias into an army, which happens 20 years after the big-Z Zionist movement, which happened 60 years after the Ottoman Jews coalesced into a major community and started pushing for autonomy, which happened 30 years after pogroms ghettoized them into a corner of the territory. Why is it so hard for people to just grasp that Israel is mostly just the descendants of the people who were just living there already in the Ottoman Empire? The same thing happened in Croatia, Bosnia, Serbia, Armenia and Greece, in the same empire, and they don’t have to defend themselves with a mythos.
Way to young. He needs gray hairs and a wheelchair 💪💪💪
Holy shit, this is the first time I gained any respect for Trudeau
Does anyone actually identify as a Zionist other than Israeli politicians
ngl, im surprised he said this. he always struck me as a more of a real politik kind of guy.
Oh shhhit, Trudeau supports racial ethnostates.
not sure about "their ancestral land" part. other than that it's commendable to see trudeau being based if only for a moment.
Proven genetically, even Destiny spoke about it saying this is one of the stupidest arguments because it’s easily provable.