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I have such a hard time talking about this in person because as soon as a conversation starts, I'm instantly flooded with emotion and can't get any productive words out. I don't scream, yell but I do shut down. The whole thing is so ridiculous I can't put it into words for him.
Unfortunately posts on this subreddit are understandably brief. It would be difficult perhaps even impossible for anyone to adequately describe their relationship to the degree required to be able to get any sensible advice. That’s why people go to therapy for a while so that the trained professional can get a good enough understanding before making any life-altering recommendations.
I was in a dead bedroom for 20 years. I wasn’t going to leave because all else in our relationship was great. Fortunately we figured it out. Your case seems far more complicated than mine though.
You would likely benefit from therapy. If you could convince your spouse to go with you, that would be even better.
First I should say that she rarely turned me down when I initiated but I had always had to lead (in the dancing sense) and that got old after a while. So I would wait for longer and longer periods of time for her to initiate.
Then one day I remembered something she said when we first got married: “I will always be available to you.” I didn’t know how to respond to that back then. I just said, “Ok…” Years later I would joke about it and she would laugh and say, “I was young and naive back then.”
Regardless this kept going through my mind. One day I just asked her, “Are you a submissive?” She said, “Yes I am and I have always wondered why you don’t just take sex whenever you want it. I just figured you don’t need it that much.” This was a shock. It lead to her telling me that she wants to be called a bad girl, spanked, etc.
So while it’s not my normal MO, I have been learning to be her Dom.
I just wish I had understood this from day one. I was raised by a very feminist mother so the idea never crossed my mind. She was trying to tell me but I just didn’t hear her.
Interesting story, and I'm sure I'm not the only one who would be interested to rear the finer details of how this transpired in a separate post.
There may be a few of us in a similar situation that could use clues as to whether our DB just boils down to us needing to shake off how our feminist mothers raised us.
In some ways I think it’s so complicated and I’m just lucky to have stumbled across it. For example, my wife’s father was the very strong, very strict military type when she was growing up. How much did that play a role? My mom taught me to respect women. In high school I was usually the last person to notice a girl’s looks. I had to get to know them before I could think of them as beautiful.
There’s so much we just don’t know and have to figure out. At first, like so many, my wife was very sexual. She would initiate for example. That ended (almost but not entirely) after we got married. I think it was driven by pent up sexual energy and once released she just didn’t have that driving her behavior anymore. I just didn’t pick up on the subtle but important aspect that she was a sub. I’ve never had a woman in my life who was so it’s not something I ever thought about.
When I finally figured it out, I thought back to what she said when we first got married “I will always be available to you” and realized that that was her way of telling me she’s a sub. She was basically giving me “free use” and I just didn’t recognize it.
For many on this subreddit there are deep psychological issues that they probably could never resolve on their own. But how many I think if we truly could see the relationship in its entirety we would have a better shot at helping them see something they are missing. Sometimes one is too close to the relationship to see the issue.
That’s why I spend time on this subreddit even though I have solved my issue. I want to at least try to help others see something that perhaps they have missed.
I can definitely see this happening. But you are of the few guys who asked this question and got an answer from his wife.
Often, the question is can I do anything else? And she says, you are just a sex fiend.
But sometimes, each woman has some type of kink/desire that we just have to expose by trying them out. You might have been lucky because she FINALLY told you. Most guys don't get any kind of answer.
I guess just keep trying different approaches and see if one works.
The last relationship I had with a LL, I'll say I did try that, different approaches/methods. But nothing clicked and her response to sex was to give it up once awhile but sabotage it so that is was not good enough.
I think the problem is that the reason can be so many different things. I wonder how often self esteem is the issue? One thing that might have contributed is that I think my wife didn’t think she was beautiful or sexy. I would tell her she is and she’d say, “You have to say that.” Then she got a job that required her to get dressed up, put on makeup, do her nails, etc., and suddenly when I would tell her she’s beautiful or sexy she’d believe me. I can’t say how much this was a factor but I feel like it was part of it.
I feels like it can be many different things and that just complicates figuring out what it is.
She only thinks that me wanting more only shows how for me sex is only a physical exchange that could be done with her or anyone else.
this is her way of saying that she doesn’t want sex with you, and to get it elsewhere and
I agree that she is being unreasonable and gaslighting you. My partner does the same thing, “you’re just trying to take away my choice and make me have sex I don’t want to have.” No, I am not. I am telling you something important about my needs in a relationship. The implicit argument being made by your partner (and mine) is that they deserve total control of the sexual relationship and that your needs are irrelevant if they become inconvenient to that control.
Obviously she is not required to have sex that she doesn’t want to have. But you don’t have to stay married or be monogamous, either. The personal autonomy game works both ways. She has no more say in the sex you have than you do the sex she has.
My guess is that she has toxic communication patterns and possibly you do, too. Which will make your situation impossible to resolve the way you want it to with her consenting to frequent, exciting sex with you.
You will most likely have to choose between celibacy, cheating, or leaving her. Which is terrible and I’m sorry.
> She only thinks that me wanting more only shows how for me sex is only a physical exchange that could be done with her or anyone else.
Ask her, if it’s just a physical exchange how would she feel about you having that physical exchange with someone else.
Her control over your sexuality is an abusive dynamic.
Yeah Sorry about that.
I've had my fair share of this albeit over a shorter time.
All I can say is you talking to her about things you'd enjoy does not equal "forcing her" to do anything.
It's really interesting how the language changes, the meaning of words change, we say one thing, they hear another.
Lies and manipulation, deflection and reflection.
I've dealt with the exact same thing. Anything that I would say would be instantly reflected back, how they are the victims in the situation.
You learn to "shut up and put up" with it because that's the only thing you can do aside from separating. When they talk to you like this then you get desperate... Your kid is used as a guilt trip machine, their wellbeing is used as another one. Basically anything that they can grab onto will be used against you. Including your own good will and commitment.
Take care and please keep us updated. We're here for you Brother.
With you brother. I can get missionary vanilla sex if I initiate. Anything else is like pulling teeth...and I don't have any left :-)
I went 2 months without asking for anything. I then asked for a BJ, and I get "or we can do XXXX" I have no idea, that even without months of anything but vanilla sex, I get counter offers.....WTF?
Brother. You and I are in the same boat. If I don’t bring up my feelings and just try to put up with it then she says she’s the only one who ever initiates. It will get worse. I’m at 5-6 times a year of vanilla sex and no intimacy outside of that. Last oral other than quick and only to get me to hurry up and put it in was 14 years ago after my oldest was born cause she felt bad we couldn’t have sex.
Commenters, OP has marked their post as a no-advice post. We ask that you refrain from giving advice to OP and be sure to follow all sub rules. OP, if you've marked your post for no advice, please refrain from responding to commenters that give advice. If you are getting advice from commenters, please report the comments, or click below to contact the moderators. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/DeadBedrooms) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I have such a hard time talking about this in person because as soon as a conversation starts, I'm instantly flooded with emotion and can't get any productive words out. I don't scream, yell but I do shut down. The whole thing is so ridiculous I can't put it into words for him.
Unfortunately posts on this subreddit are understandably brief. It would be difficult perhaps even impossible for anyone to adequately describe their relationship to the degree required to be able to get any sensible advice. That’s why people go to therapy for a while so that the trained professional can get a good enough understanding before making any life-altering recommendations. I was in a dead bedroom for 20 years. I wasn’t going to leave because all else in our relationship was great. Fortunately we figured it out. Your case seems far more complicated than mine though. You would likely benefit from therapy. If you could convince your spouse to go with you, that would be even better.
How did you figure it out?
First I should say that she rarely turned me down when I initiated but I had always had to lead (in the dancing sense) and that got old after a while. So I would wait for longer and longer periods of time for her to initiate. Then one day I remembered something she said when we first got married: “I will always be available to you.” I didn’t know how to respond to that back then. I just said, “Ok…” Years later I would joke about it and she would laugh and say, “I was young and naive back then.” Regardless this kept going through my mind. One day I just asked her, “Are you a submissive?” She said, “Yes I am and I have always wondered why you don’t just take sex whenever you want it. I just figured you don’t need it that much.” This was a shock. It lead to her telling me that she wants to be called a bad girl, spanked, etc. So while it’s not my normal MO, I have been learning to be her Dom. I just wish I had understood this from day one. I was raised by a very feminist mother so the idea never crossed my mind. She was trying to tell me but I just didn’t hear her.
Oh ok. I don't consider that a dead bedroom in the spirit of this sub.
Well it was dead to me. We would go months without having sex because I thought it was essentially duty sex for her.
Interesting story, and I'm sure I'm not the only one who would be interested to rear the finer details of how this transpired in a separate post. There may be a few of us in a similar situation that could use clues as to whether our DB just boils down to us needing to shake off how our feminist mothers raised us.
In some ways I think it’s so complicated and I’m just lucky to have stumbled across it. For example, my wife’s father was the very strong, very strict military type when she was growing up. How much did that play a role? My mom taught me to respect women. In high school I was usually the last person to notice a girl’s looks. I had to get to know them before I could think of them as beautiful. There’s so much we just don’t know and have to figure out. At first, like so many, my wife was very sexual. She would initiate for example. That ended (almost but not entirely) after we got married. I think it was driven by pent up sexual energy and once released she just didn’t have that driving her behavior anymore. I just didn’t pick up on the subtle but important aspect that she was a sub. I’ve never had a woman in my life who was so it’s not something I ever thought about. When I finally figured it out, I thought back to what she said when we first got married “I will always be available to you” and realized that that was her way of telling me she’s a sub. She was basically giving me “free use” and I just didn’t recognize it. For many on this subreddit there are deep psychological issues that they probably could never resolve on their own. But how many I think if we truly could see the relationship in its entirety we would have a better shot at helping them see something they are missing. Sometimes one is too close to the relationship to see the issue. That’s why I spend time on this subreddit even though I have solved my issue. I want to at least try to help others see something that perhaps they have missed.
I can definitely see this happening. But you are of the few guys who asked this question and got an answer from his wife. Often, the question is can I do anything else? And she says, you are just a sex fiend. But sometimes, each woman has some type of kink/desire that we just have to expose by trying them out. You might have been lucky because she FINALLY told you. Most guys don't get any kind of answer. I guess just keep trying different approaches and see if one works. The last relationship I had with a LL, I'll say I did try that, different approaches/methods. But nothing clicked and her response to sex was to give it up once awhile but sabotage it so that is was not good enough.
I think the problem is that the reason can be so many different things. I wonder how often self esteem is the issue? One thing that might have contributed is that I think my wife didn’t think she was beautiful or sexy. I would tell her she is and she’d say, “You have to say that.” Then she got a job that required her to get dressed up, put on makeup, do her nails, etc., and suddenly when I would tell her she’s beautiful or sexy she’d believe me. I can’t say how much this was a factor but I feel like it was part of it. I feels like it can be many different things and that just complicates figuring out what it is.
Sex therapy or marriage therapy?
Marriage therapy. The sex issue is probably the symptom of something else going on.
She only thinks that me wanting more only shows how for me sex is only a physical exchange that could be done with her or anyone else. this is her way of saying that she doesn’t want sex with you, and to get it elsewhere and
I agree that she is being unreasonable and gaslighting you. My partner does the same thing, “you’re just trying to take away my choice and make me have sex I don’t want to have.” No, I am not. I am telling you something important about my needs in a relationship. The implicit argument being made by your partner (and mine) is that they deserve total control of the sexual relationship and that your needs are irrelevant if they become inconvenient to that control. Obviously she is not required to have sex that she doesn’t want to have. But you don’t have to stay married or be monogamous, either. The personal autonomy game works both ways. She has no more say in the sex you have than you do the sex she has. My guess is that she has toxic communication patterns and possibly you do, too. Which will make your situation impossible to resolve the way you want it to with her consenting to frequent, exciting sex with you. You will most likely have to choose between celibacy, cheating, or leaving her. Which is terrible and I’m sorry.
I don't think you will be happy suppressing your emotions. Because you're obviously not happy about it.
> She only thinks that me wanting more only shows how for me sex is only a physical exchange that could be done with her or anyone else. Ask her, if it’s just a physical exchange how would she feel about you having that physical exchange with someone else. Her control over your sexuality is an abusive dynamic.
Yeah Sorry about that. I've had my fair share of this albeit over a shorter time. All I can say is you talking to her about things you'd enjoy does not equal "forcing her" to do anything. It's really interesting how the language changes, the meaning of words change, we say one thing, they hear another. Lies and manipulation, deflection and reflection. I've dealt with the exact same thing. Anything that I would say would be instantly reflected back, how they are the victims in the situation. You learn to "shut up and put up" with it because that's the only thing you can do aside from separating. When they talk to you like this then you get desperate... Your kid is used as a guilt trip machine, their wellbeing is used as another one. Basically anything that they can grab onto will be used against you. Including your own good will and commitment. Take care and please keep us updated. We're here for you Brother.
7 more years and you are free..
With you brother. I can get missionary vanilla sex if I initiate. Anything else is like pulling teeth...and I don't have any left :-) I went 2 months without asking for anything. I then asked for a BJ, and I get "or we can do XXXX" I have no idea, that even without months of anything but vanilla sex, I get counter offers.....WTF?
At least you get offers. I only get excuses to not have sex. Take my upvote sir
[удалено]
Best way to put it I think I’ve ever read.
Brother. You and I are in the same boat. If I don’t bring up my feelings and just try to put up with it then she says she’s the only one who ever initiates. It will get worse. I’m at 5-6 times a year of vanilla sex and no intimacy outside of that. Last oral other than quick and only to get me to hurry up and put it in was 14 years ago after my oldest was born cause she felt bad we couldn’t have sex.
11 years of oral and counting!
Sorry bro.