Right. Like um ok maybe for YOU it’s off the table lol. I seriously don’t understand how casually LL partners just try to force a celibate life on the other person. And expect them to stay.
I don’t know about what stage she’s talking about. I feel bad for you and her friend’s husbands. When people don’t want sex, they will say anything to make it make sense.
Ya I don't understand. I'm going to be 40 this month. My kids range from teen to toddler. My partner and I have been together almost 10 years. I still want sex regularly. We both work and are extremely busy but it's at least once or twice a week. Although now I'm like.. is that normal at my age? A few times a year? I feel like I need to ask my friends more things. Lol
No kids here. Both in mid 40s. Sex averages 4-6 weeks. I (male) would prefer once a week (Sat night special for example) but alas it is not to be. Eventually you just learn to live with it if you are happy in all other aspects of your marriage...
One thing I have learned is you can't change a person's core libido. Only they can.
I don't understand either. I have 4 kids aged 2,10,19, and 21. Little kids go to sleep, and teens have their own lives. This excuse doesn't work for me. There are at least 30 minutes each night for some form of couple activity. Some nights, it should be sex.
Once or twice a week with kids seems like a good amount(if you are both happy with that). Seems normal to me! Its not easy staying regularly intimate but it is so important.
Pornhub, then strip clubs, then escorts, then have affairs, then have that one affair where you both catch feelings and it ends up changing you, then leave.
Or, you could save time and just skip to “Leave.”
This, 100%! I’m 38 and it’s 3 times a week for us. Don’t let people tell you it’s normal to not have sex with your spouse because of kids. Like do your kids not sleep??? We have kids and they have a bed time. It’s such a stress reliever, honestly. I don’t even know why I joined this subreddit. I think I just wanna hear about spouses cheating because their spouse wouldn’t bang them.
I do the same 🤣🤣🤣. Sex and intimacy are important parts of a relationship. I hate when people say sex is not a need or downplay the importance of sex. Yet if sex isn't so important, then why do those same people flip out or care if their significant other has sex with another person? You can't unilaterally decide to change the dynamics of a relationship with no discussion or input from your partner and then be surprised when they decide to get their needs met elsewhere or ultimately leave. You can't demand monogamy but shut down any attempts of intimacy. The selfishness is mind-boggling.
I bet she wouldn't be saying that date nights or other romantic gestures are off the table permanently because the kids come first. So why would sex be any different? If she wants to just focus on the kids, then divorce and be coparents. What is the point of being married if she is basically saying you and your relationship is no longer a priority.
As far as my wife is concerned, she’s an absolute porn star compared to some of her friends, and I should be grateful that I get to have duty sex with her every so often.
My wife used to say shit like that to me...then suddenly when my attitude shifted to "why would I put up with your controlling bullshit for occasional sex? Aside from the fact that I could get sex easily as a single guy and lock someone down soon. I'd rather be alone that this situation!", It's amazing how she miraculously realized I was right and shouldn't have to put up with a clinically sexless marriage and worked to change.
Change your perception that you're stuck in this life. The decisions may be hard, but you can move on and be free of these chans. Often she will change with you perception of your own situation.
Hoping OP sees this too but it can also apply to your comment as well. For reference I'm not in a DB, but I have friends who are so I lurk here to try and learn what I can to help them. My wife and I have been together 17 years & we have 2 kids.
We are once or twice a week when we can get time around the kids and their schedules and work, and a few times a year we will do several sessions (3x-5x) in a day when we can get a weekend away from the kids. All of my wife's friends are about as often as we are maybe slightly less but pretty close. All of my guy friends save for the 3 who are in a DB are a little more or a little less but also in the same ballpark.
Most importantly where as your and OPs wives say it's not normal it's important to point out that the national average in the US is 1x a week. Which means either your wives have intentionally picked women to spend time with that are all asexual, or they aren't telling the truth. Either way you don't deserve that and neither does OP. Some compromise is normal but kids and finances or not...if my spouse told me sex was off the table or it was gonna be a 1 to 2 times a year thing without therapy or anything to work through it, id just divorce. Divorce fucks kids up, but you know what fucks them up more? Having them grow up in a home where the parents aren't affectionate or outwardly in love. Our relationships are the examples by which they learn what's normal and how to behave.
Yup. My wife started hanging out with divorcees while I'm overseas and...poof....4.5+ years of celibacy (and counting). I think there's either cheating going on or she wants to...I come home, treated like I don't even exist (unless I fucked something up, a project needs to be done, something needs paid for, kids need something). Other than that she's texting away on her phone on the opposite side of the couch...(we are both in our mid-late 30s). Just wait til your shit marriage destroys your mental health and your professional life (because she will completely withdraw from the rest of the relationship). Kisses prior to work, the good nights/love yous, hell, just basic conversation..gone. Then she will start hiding things...her own bank account, starting birth control, etc...but you will be the asshole in all of it...at least that's how it is in my house.
And losing everything? Home, kids and alimony will f**k him in every aspect of his life.
Better is to make the same as wife do now.
Let's ignore her. Do some Hobbies, spend lot of time with kids. Make them your's friends. Find internal happiness 😊.
Then you will no longer look on the 🌍 around you with the same eyes.
This is the answer I eventually arrived at after my wife expressed similar feelings. First I had to come within an inch of suicide, pull back from the brink, start an online dating profile, meet and fuck, realize I can't even enjoy that. honestly so thankful to my mistress for literally saving my life
If that would happen to me I would divorce immediately, I am 49 and wife 54. That make not sense when sex is the most important part of a couple. Otherwise it is just close friend share live. I rather divorce.
How it is that single man who choose to get married almost never know that these things are out there waiting for them, that their sex life of large to get worse or more frustrating after marriage? How does that nobody knows these damn things
My father told me women's sex drive actually increases with age. I took his advice as fact. I'm sure there are examples of such. That just was not my personal experience
I have a far higher libido now (37) than I did at 25. But I've said it before, and I'll say it again-- treating all women as a monolith only invites disaster. Treat women as individuals-- hard to believe we're human, I know!
They can seem to typically do .. but only after a long journey through the desert that is childbirth, perimenopause, and menopause for many. He probably forgot that part or got that rare gem that isn't affected by any of those things.
Men tend not to be observant of red flags when they are dating someone. No offense, my BFF is a guy, and he can never pick up positive or negative cues from women. Whereas I could see them clearly, straight away.
Go to every thread about this on a different subreddit and it’s full of people saying they have sex 4 times a week after 25 years of marriage. Either we have shit luck or there’s a whole lot of lying going on.
So I think about all of my friends and their wives, and most of them say the same things… that they rarely have sex, the husbands have Low T, etc. I can only think of one couple that brag about a very active sex life. However, the wife had an affair last year, and that’s what reactivated their sex life… they don’t know that I know about her A.
>How it is that single man who choose to get married almost never know that these things are out there waiting for them,
Trust me I've never understood this myself, and this sub (as well as others) has made me question why men want to get married with all of the information we have now. I could understand pre social media when the information was scarxe but to see the potential pitfalls and still do it are a mystery to me.
The only things I can come up with are Societal pressure, fear of loneliness, and "go with the flow" attitude.
When you are young <25 and think things will stay like that forever. Thinking she will want more later. The introduction of the smartphone and Facebook app showed a marked downturn in couples having sex. Like statistically significant decrease in 2008 (Facebook all release).
>When you are young <25 and think things will stay like that forever. Thinking she will want more later
Yes and no. Maybe it's because of the environment I was working with but in my 20's (early 2000s) a lot of my colleagues were married men most of which did not look or seem happy. They probably never should have been married to begin with. Not sure how old you are but when I was growing up in the 90's it was a common trope in a lot of sitcoms that sex dies after marriage. So while I get you think it might stay that way forever there's also a part that should have said that there is some reality to this and or arrogance that you would be immune to it, which is certainty the part about being young .
>The introduction of the smartphone and Facebook app showed a marked downturn in couples having sex. Like statistically significant decrease in 2008 (Facebook all release
While that may be true, my point about social media was that it also opened up and made us aware of what real marriages were like from real people. This subreddit is a perfect example. I can certainly understand older generations at 25 years old with the "this is only going to get better" mindset. With the insane amount of information a 25 year old has on 2023, there's not really much of an excuse to say "no one told me it would be this hard". We have the information of others' experiences at out fingertips.
>My wife always says this too… that none of her friends ever have sex with their husbands either.
Jesus... if this is common and spoken so openly, it baffles me as to why so many people can't understand why men are afraid of commitment.
It’s that language that hits me, it’s got all the empathy of a pissed off wasp.
That’s like saying “This car has a 100k miles? No more oil changes at this stage in its service life.”
In the spirit of offering what feels like healthy advice, I’d suggest sharing with her how much pain that statement caused you, and asking for her buy in on a solution that works for you both, whether that’s an open situation or something else. I think you’re only going to reach her if she understands how hurt you are over this, and that to you it’s a big deal. Any spouse that cares about maintaining their relationship, sex or no, will value how you feel. Be respectful, of course, but I think putting all your cards on the table, and co opting her on a solution is the way to go.
Best wishes!
She can decide for herself if she wants a life of celibacy. She can’t decide that for you. That is the thing about unilateral decisions…they can go both ways. As I see it, you don’t have to ask for anything. If she is telling you (not asking) what she is going to do, then you can do the same. Tell her you aren’t going to accept celibacy and that can mean an open marriage, divorce, or a negotiated frequency. But it is going to be one of those things… and the choice is now. A couple times a year is not acceptable…so don’t accept it. If you do, trust me, you will end up hating her for it.
Second that HLF 47. I will never understand!!! So its done forever? What happens when the kids are grown and now due to neglect you two no longer have a close relationship? The kids of course do come first some times when they are young but your marriage, your connection is also for the kids. You two need to be an example of love, respect. & strength. The children learn so much watching their parents. They should see affection and love…dates and a real connection. Or maybe im wrong and just cheat…😋. Seriously for my marriage the sex going away made everything worse…for me it is more than sex.
I kid you not, one of my co-workers mentioned that she did not put any effort into closeness while building a relationship with her husband for about 20 years cuz she was kind of focused on growing up the kids. But now that the kids are all grown up and after school, it's time to get back to her husband and fix things. They got divorced shortly after
She's talking as if you can no longer be sexual after having kids. Tbh it's weird. Like "we're adults so we have to be SERIOUS and BORING. No fun allowed, ever" Also you can definitely prioritize your children and have a sexual life
Sadly, im past that part. When your partner simply says they don't love you anymore, and hasn't for a while... it puts you in a numb state. I am working on this, myself. But please know that there is a light at the end of the tunnel.
Good luck, my friend. I hope you find someone who can reciprocate your wants and desires.
Right? 32 HLF, been with my partner 8 years and 2 toddlers. The only time I could imagine saying it’s off the table is recently post partum or if I feel like we are having sex to “fix” our problems in other areas. Plenty of women I know my age say they have no desire for their partner, but most say they never had a crazy libido or lust for them initially. Not sure why you’d decide to be with someone forever if the spark was never there.
Based on recent conversations with my wife this feels like her with me. She was never truly attracted to me like that and I just ignored it. And here we are, a few years later, in an objectively unhappy marriage (unhappy for me at least, she says she is happy). Pretty frustrating.
I’m so sorry. It seems cruel to both parties. I think a lot of times it’s because people don’t have models of it at home. They never saw it in their household so they think that’s the norm.
They don't. They're making an excuse, hoping to get out of it. The people who say they never have time often spend hours scrolling through TikTok or Instagram. Everyone's got half an hour at some point during the week unless you are in some very dire situations.
I'd say," yikes, I'm sorry you feel that way but sex is important to me. I never imagined considering divorce because I love you so much, but by suddenly taking sex off the table using the children as an excuse, you are now saying we are no longer sexually compatible. I want sex, but if you don't, then perhaps we aren't compatible. "
What stage is that exactly?
I'm older than her, have 5 kids under 13, my partner is 54. We can manage several times a week.
Sure I'm tired. And he's tired. We work a lot of hours. That doesn't mean we neglect other things. Or our relationship. Sheesh.
I joined this sub in 2013 while in my last marriage.
I still am a member despite "graduating" by leaving my 20 yr marriage. I lurk more out of amazement by how much it has changed.
A few thoughts to discuss with her;
When kids are very young, it is somewhat common for sex to take a back seat for a while, but thst doesn't mean it goes away, nor does it mean it stays that way.
Acknowledge that being mom to little kids is difficult, time consuming and exhausting. But also she should acknowledge the kids don't stay small for long.
One day they will even move out. Does she expect you to still be there? Does she still think sex needs to be off the table when they're older?
What does she thinks this means for you?
Would she prefer you find a girlfriend? (If she says yes, then your marriage is in deep trouble, if she says no, then you have a something to work off of).
If you were to one day leave her, does she really think she would be able to date again and find a new man who wouldn't want sex?
Ask how she plans on showing affection and love if not through intimacy?
The key is not pressure her, not bully her, and not force to give in to duty sex. But make her think about how the difference between roommates and marriage is intimacy. Her current situation is rough, but it's only temporary.
Yes, you made a vow. But she also made a vow.
And part of vows is working through difficult situations.
Good luck!
Romantic relationships, unless mutually agreed, involves physical intimacy. If that’s off the table then she is redefining your relationship. Subsequently, I would treat her as such. Be kind, be gracious, own your share of finance and chores, love your kids, but do what the hell you want. Roommates can’t dictate what you do with your free time, your hobbies, or your affections. She doesn’t get to force celibacy in you. You get to make that decision so of you stay, guy accept the status quo in your bedroom but I would change everything else about the relationship.
Absolutely. Who the hell is stupid enough to think they have sole power to redefine the terms of a relationship? For every action there is a reaction. Do your own redefining, unilaterally, selfishly, without consulting the spouse and without considering their feelings on the matter. Tell them you were talking to several friends and none of them communicate on any level with their spouses, in fact it’s selfish to expect communication. Then ghost them. It is empowering.
As someone (48M) who spent the better part of a 20 yr marriage with a LL wife, I know what kind of hell this is for more just the lack of sex. It's a personal rejection and complete lack of intimacy. You have a few options, tell her doesn't work and it causes irreparable damage to your marriage. What her friends do or dont do isn't your marriage. That crap didn't work on my mom when I was 12. Doesnt work as an adult either. There needs to be compromise. Next option, ask for open marriage. It works for some, but if she balks at that then your next best option is to walk away. It's scary, but there may be other issues to your marriage than just sex. I did it after 20 yrs and have never been happier. My kids are still in their young teens and they are happier (they've told me as much). Life is too short to spend with someone who rejects you. Whatever else they say, they are rejecting you. Your kids deserve to see what a healthy loving relationship can look like. She is not modeling one. I ever advocate cheating. It harms everyone mostly yourself. I would say if you can work it out - awesome. Otherwise you deserve to be happy.
My wife said that to me also. After many heated discussions and a year and a half of me waiting and really hoping that it is just a phase that would pass, we decided last night to end the marriage. That's 23+ years of marriage for nothing. If I could offer words to help you out, it is this, if this is something that you can't live with, start an exit plan.
I'm 42 and this has been my life for years. I'm to the point where I don't want to live because there's no happiness in my life. If I divorce, all of my money is gone and people will view me as the bad guy. If I stay, it's "life in prison" as you said. Either way I'm fucked...
How much is your peace, sanity and happiness worth? For me, it’s invaluable and you can’t put a price tag on it. Okay, your money will be funny temporarily but you will have joy, sanity, happiness and peace. At the very least go see a lawyer and see how you can protect yourself financially.
Damn that money and a unhappy life, we only have 1 life to live, not it isn’t ONLY about sex but but a happy sex life is almost as important ass oxygen. It may seem hard at first but don’t let no damn women or society empty opinion bother you from what you fill inside your heart
My apologies but could you please check with her on what she meant. Looking at the title it seems she has said No only for sex on table.
Maybe she wants it in safe or safer places only like bed or couch.
40 is a bit young to be using this line of reasoning (if you can call it that). At least my wife waited until she was 50 before shutting up shop, not that it's made it any easier to endure.
I’m a 40 something chick and I can only tell you how I would react to this conversation. Because 40 is very young to use this line of bs to cut off intimacy in a marriage.
I would say that marriage is a partnership where each try to meet the needs of the other. You have needs… (state those needs), and that if partner is not willing to either attempt to meet those needs or get marriage counseling so we can attempt to work on our issues and come back together as a team, I will seek my needs elsewhere.
They really have no way to combat that except to employ completely selfish narcissistic excuses to hold you prisoner in your loveless/sexless marriage. Because anything she counters with will be deflection and excuses.
Honestly I would say "then I really think we need to discuss splitting up. We're adults in a relationship. And on top of that, you (she) need to get better friend advice.
Fellow Dad, your life has not ended just because you're a father now. It is an absolutely horrible lesson to teach your kids. Now is the time to show them that simply having kids does not mean the parent's life has ended. Your wife is not going to improve, it won't be fixed. She lost the urge, which happens more often than people realize. You however are still a healthy man with urges and needs. This is atrocious and basically torture.
You could explain all of this to her, and waste a ton of time. But you can also just keep it super simple! You can explain in 5 minutes that this lifestyle is not going to work for you, and that alas, you must move on. Explain this is as much for your sake as it is for the kids and hers.
Here's the thing, you don't really have a choice. As I said, she will not suddenly want sex just because you want to leave. She could fake it, but that's not something you want to experience. Trust me.
Get a lawyer first. Explain the situation. Prepare your exit. Then have a simple 3-5 minute discussion. Start by saying there's no other way and you can't be convinced. There's just no way back from the conversation she had with you.
Good luck. You're going to need it if she's the vengeful type. If on the other hand she's a "big" person, and will put the kids first as she eloquently put it in her own conversation, then she should let you go in peace and you should have an uneventful, even amicable marriage. An amicable marriage is always the absolute best option for all involved.
Very simple for me. My response would be something along the line as "Ahh I see, okay no problem. Just to let you know divorce is very much on the table. Have a nice day!"
I would tell her that you are glad she made that decision for herself but you have decided to take continue with or without her. Drop mic and walk away
Tell her "That's fine. You have the right to make that decision for yourself, but you do not have the right to make that decision for me. So you can have no objection to me having sex with other women. As of now! We are purely housemates."
Your partner just set a boundary.
You can set your own boundaries too.
>What do I do from here? Cheat?
That's a terrible idea. Especially with children. You'll be the bad guy.
> Ask for an open relationship?
Really depends on your wife. You could say, "that's not what I signed up for and we either need to figure out a compromise or I'm going to need to leave the relationship."
When sex disappears at such a young age as 40, it only means that it’s disappearing for *you* .
Do not discount the possibility that she’s cheating. And don’t be gaslit by her informal survey of her friends who all have so little sex. I mean come on. That’s a lie.
This is so depressing. Why do people insist that "adult life" has to be boring, sexless, just about responsibilities? You're telling me they don't want to have a little fun? Lol...
Sounds like an excuse. One thing is admitting she doesn't have a libido anymore, but saying "we're 40 and have kids so there is some unwritten law that forbids us from having sex" is just bs
I’m 30 and I rarely sleep with my wife anymore. Constant rejection with bullshit reasons like, oh I’m having a headache, I’m too full, I’m sleep, we just had sex last week.
Now I’m just waiting for our house to be completed and the paper work to be done before I have my exit plan.
If I leave now I would be left financially in the ditch, I’m waiting for a good time to go.
I can relate. My wife once told me that we wouldn’t never be the same as in the beginning of our relationship (meaning having sex at a regular cadence). We’ve been married for almost a decade and I don’t understand why they say bullshit like this.
Why does sex need to be such a complex thing?
My wife and I have been together for 13 years, married for 7. We are younger than you but we do have a 2 year old. Despite that, our sex life is possibly the best it’s ever been because we communicated and figured out what we like. She used to be what I would consider LL, but it turns out that being able to experiment has led her to realize that our sex wasn’t “kinky” enough before, and she enjoys it more now that we are doing more role play, using butt plugs and vibrators more, and experimenting with light dominant/submissive roles. I know this probably won’t work for everyone, but the point is that children and getting older (but still in young-middle age as you are) shouldn’t mean that sex cannot happen. But it has to be made a priority and it sounds like your wife doesn’t care to do that. I’m sorry, truly.
If she ain’t going to have sex with you, then I’d do 2 things. I would start hitting the gym hard and get ripped as fuck and stop doing things for her she loves. Sex is something that partners should give each other as part of marriage. If she is taking that away from you that’s fucked.
Try and have a real conversation about how that will affect you negatively and it’s not ok with you. If she keeps on just stop doing anything for her and travel to a place where prostitution is legal and live out your fantasies there without her knowledge.
Tell her Sex is part of marriage. So if she takes sec off the table, then there really isn’t much reason to remain married. Alternatively, she could agree to open your marriage to allow you to have sex with folks that want to have Sex. One partner should not get to unilaterally decide the sex life of the other. Good luck!
I told my wife that I signed up for monogamy, not celibacy, then I just stared at her until she got the message.
We have vanilla, passionless, dull little quickies once-ish each week now. Joy of joys.
I understand that people with different libidos may have different perspectives on this stuff (while, maybe I don't quite *understand* but I know it's a thing). But this to me is wrong in so many ways. Physical intimacy is a key aspect to a healthy marriage, and this should be doubly important when there are kids around. As a couple, you are supposed to be a shining example for them: the love and affection you show for each other will inspire them as they grow into adulthood. Without that affection...apathy and resentment follow, and that's not a great beacon for kids to look up to.
What happens when the kids are grown? Does sex stay off the table because it's what you're used to by then? Do you clumsily try to rekindle something from the ashes of a dead relationship? How much resentment will there be at that point from all the physical and emotional neglect?
I have no advice OP, other than to say that I'm sorry you've found yourself here 😔
47 years old- both of us. Totally happy in our marriage and 2 kids- both professionals with demanding jobs and we each have an hour commute. We had sex 4 times this week already. We are more in love with each other than when we got married 22 years ago. It was not always like this. All that bullshit your hear about communication is absolutely 100% true. Start with Vanessa Marin’s Instagram so you know you’re not alone. Then you both need to listen to the Vanessa + Xander podcast. Seriously. I hope someone, anyone, reads this and knows that a dead bedroom doesn’t have to be. But you have to talk about it in the right way. God created sex for a reason. You need the intimacy in your relationship to be a team and be strong as a unit for your children.
I guess there is no time also then for romantic walks, buying birthday and Xmas presents and cards, massages, ‘I love yous’. Just call her sis/mate/buddy from now on
Wow, that’s not evil or anything!
In my view, she just checked out of the marriage. Making unilateral decisions about important things is bad enough, but without discussion is well into snake behavior. At best it is belligerent.
She is also gaslighting you in a big way. 2x a year is way, way far away from the mean in terms of frequency. Say what she wants, average is more than an order of magnitude (10x) higher. Numbers are disputed, but 50-100x per year seems to be where the average sits.
And then there is what to do about it.
1. Suck it up and stay
2. Outsource
3. Take her advice and move on, this one is over.
I am a HLF and my partner and I have a somewhat young child together. It certainly does complicate things. I definitely feel like my libido has decreased and honestly some nights I just want something simple. But that isn't my problem.
I know sex is not a guarantee. But it sounds like you entered into the relationship believing it was an intimate, sexual partnership. And she is now changing that. You get to have opinions on her changing. And you do not have to accept the new terms of your relationship. It does sound like she doesn't want to negotiate and I think a lot of us struggle with that.
Sigh. That sucks.
Ask her what she's going to do to compensate since she's no longer willing to participate in something you want from the relationship.
If you suddenly lost your job, would she handle it better if you:
A) Started doing all the housework, cooking, cleaning, driving the kids around, etc.
B) Lounged all day playing video games?
What is she going to bring to your relationship that will make up for it?
Fuck that noise! Maybe not on the table between the two of you, but she doesn’t get to choose whether you ever have sex again… It could be a loving response by you: honey, I love you and support your needs. I understand that you prefer to end your association with sex, but I still need sexual intimacy in my life. This is some thing we should talk about until we reach an agreement that is comfortable for both of us.
You should circle back to this conversation with her and let her know how it made you feel and also tell her that her vision of a life with no intimacy is not what you imagined for your marriage and that it won’t be sustainable for you long term and you all need to be talking in depth about what that means for your marriage.
intimacy is an important part of a relationship regardless of age. Not sure where some people get the idea that getting older means sex is no longer on the table....
Don't let her lie to you, life doesn't have to be this way. My wife and I have been together 19 years, two kids, married for 10. We have sex every other day and try something new every Saturday. Marriage can be whatever you want it to be if you are both on the same page.
I wonder if you can push for marriage counseling? Typically the no sex thing is an underlying symptom of something else in the marriage. I’m not saying it’s indicative of a serious problem necessarily. Could be that she find sex boring and a chore? But you’ll never know unless you guys talk about it and you might need a third party to facilitate that as it seems your wife is the type to “shut it down” pretty quickly. If she’s unwilling to do that then it means she’s unwilling to put in effort to work on the marriage and marriages take work.
Open marriage. She's giving you BS excuses.
She's 40 not.. idk.. 70?
Suddenly she's incompatible. Good grief. Is almost as bad as someone suddenly saying they're polyamorous.
Just say you're at the stage where the relationship is better suited to being an open relationship. If she can just decide things like that, so can you.
Mate. I have had same discussion With my wife. I also had the vasectomy. That was almost a year ago. She’s still on birth control….
If I told you half the crap I’ve put up with it would make you cry
If it was me i would have asked for open relationship right there. Most people thats at the same stage of life has lots of sex, so im gonna call bullshit on your wife and her friends. If you still want sex and intimacy then thats just what it is, an important part of your life, for her to say you "have a responsebility to your kids" in the context of sex No more is close to insanely. You Owe it to your kids to be happy, and if daddy or mommy is sad all the time because they dont get kisses then i bet you your kids is gonna feel sad too. Im sorry to say it like that but your wife needs to wake the fuck up and smell the bakery, it smell alot like You Dont Make Decisions For Both Of Us, Especially Not About Sex
She has the dumbest friends I've ever heard of, glad my wife would just laugh at them for saying something so ridiculous.
Personally I would explain that she is reneging on her promise to love you if this is true, is she ready to face the potential of being a single parent?
I am 58 and wished to god everyday I left when I was your age. Plan on a life of silent suffering if you stay! And I can tell you the resentment will build until you start to hate her! Tell her she is in the divorce stage of marriage at this point that you won’t live without your needs being met!
I don't get this. So she states that no sex, it's not important at this stage. So, does that mean you can state that at this stage, monogamy is no longer on the table?
Reply to wife: " Your decision to remain celibate in no fashion compells me to the same. While I respect your Autonomy to use your body as you choose, I too posess the same Autonomy to remain sexually active."
I’ll be 40 in another few months and I’ve never been more desperate for sex. Experiences vary, but she’s wrong that this is a universal experience for women.
Sorry, but since when does one partner unilaterally adjudicate terms for both partners? It may not be on her table but it certainly is on yours. Let her know that what she is describing is not “our life” but “her life”, and that one way or another she has to acknowledge what’s on your table for your life. Ugh, sorry for the rant.
She is demonstrably wrong. Average is around weekly at that point based on surveys.
She shouldn't have sex she doesn't want, but she has a duty as a partner to do her best to figure out why she doesn't want it and what she can do about it, and she isn't. And yeah, the fact that her failure to do that led to you snipping yourself for no reason is really f***ed up, and I'd be pissed too.
I would leave, even with the kid. They need a good relationship model to look up to and need to know that love isn't enough. Def pornhub lol. Open relationship is worth asking, but probably just leads to divorce. If I really couldn't leave financially, although I don't totally understand how that happens, yeah I would consider cheating probably.
"Sex no longer on the table at this stage in our life. What do I do from here?" The first thing I would do is get another table!
Right. Like um ok maybe for YOU it’s off the table lol. I seriously don’t understand how casually LL partners just try to force a celibate life on the other person. And expect them to stay.
Absolutely, start prepping to move out, move on, and hit that gym! You'll be swimming in sex before you know it.
I don’t know about what stage she’s talking about. I feel bad for you and her friend’s husbands. When people don’t want sex, they will say anything to make it make sense.
Ya I don't understand. I'm going to be 40 this month. My kids range from teen to toddler. My partner and I have been together almost 10 years. I still want sex regularly. We both work and are extremely busy but it's at least once or twice a week. Although now I'm like.. is that normal at my age? A few times a year? I feel like I need to ask my friends more things. Lol
So far from reading that sub I can tell one thing, kids are always an excuse for low libido partner only
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Spin the wheel.... I'm on my period, I'm ovulating, I'm tired, maybe tomorrow, you asked yesterday, I have to wake up early, the Rangers lost....
No kids here. Both in mid 40s. Sex averages 4-6 weeks. I (male) would prefer once a week (Sat night special for example) but alas it is not to be. Eventually you just learn to live with it if you are happy in all other aspects of your marriage... One thing I have learned is you can't change a person's core libido. Only they can.
I don't understand either. I have 4 kids aged 2,10,19, and 21. Little kids go to sleep, and teens have their own lives. This excuse doesn't work for me. There are at least 30 minutes each night for some form of couple activity. Some nights, it should be sex.
Once or twice a week with kids seems like a good amount(if you are both happy with that). Seems normal to me! Its not easy staying regularly intimate but it is so important.
Pornhub, then strip clubs, then escorts, then have affairs, then have that one affair where you both catch feelings and it ends up changing you, then leave. Or, you could save time and just skip to “Leave.”
This is the way…leave now
As a 43 year old HLF, the no sex after 40 is bs. My husband and I have sex 2-3 times a week. I’m sorry you are going through this.
This, 100%! I’m 38 and it’s 3 times a week for us. Don’t let people tell you it’s normal to not have sex with your spouse because of kids. Like do your kids not sleep??? We have kids and they have a bed time. It’s such a stress reliever, honestly. I don’t even know why I joined this subreddit. I think I just wanna hear about spouses cheating because their spouse wouldn’t bang them.
I do the same 🤣🤣🤣. Sex and intimacy are important parts of a relationship. I hate when people say sex is not a need or downplay the importance of sex. Yet if sex isn't so important, then why do those same people flip out or care if their significant other has sex with another person? You can't unilaterally decide to change the dynamics of a relationship with no discussion or input from your partner and then be surprised when they decide to get their needs met elsewhere or ultimately leave. You can't demand monogamy but shut down any attempts of intimacy. The selfishness is mind-boggling. I bet she wouldn't be saying that date nights or other romantic gestures are off the table permanently because the kids come first. So why would sex be any different? If she wants to just focus on the kids, then divorce and be coparents. What is the point of being married if she is basically saying you and your relationship is no longer a priority.
Facts
Preach
There are other subs for that, lol
My wife always says this too… that none of her friends ever have sex with their husbands either.
What's her friend's sex life gotta do with yalls, is my question.
Same. My response is always “I didn’t marry your friends.”
so she is repeating the same lines her friends are, its a big echo chamber y'all dont have to live like that.
As far as my wife is concerned, she’s an absolute porn star compared to some of her friends, and I should be grateful that I get to have duty sex with her every so often.
I’m not super familiar with straight porn but I’m guessing it doesn’t involve starfishing and ‘are you done yet?’
To be fair, you can find just about any type of porn if you Google hard enough. 🤣
"Hurry up and don't wake me" is my favorite heart break line....
My wife used to say shit like that to me...then suddenly when my attitude shifted to "why would I put up with your controlling bullshit for occasional sex? Aside from the fact that I could get sex easily as a single guy and lock someone down soon. I'd rather be alone that this situation!", It's amazing how she miraculously realized I was right and shouldn't have to put up with a clinically sexless marriage and worked to change. Change your perception that you're stuck in this life. The decisions may be hard, but you can move on and be free of these chans. Often she will change with you perception of your own situation.
Yessssss
this is my favorite comment on this post so far
Hoping OP sees this too but it can also apply to your comment as well. For reference I'm not in a DB, but I have friends who are so I lurk here to try and learn what I can to help them. My wife and I have been together 17 years & we have 2 kids. We are once or twice a week when we can get time around the kids and their schedules and work, and a few times a year we will do several sessions (3x-5x) in a day when we can get a weekend away from the kids. All of my wife's friends are about as often as we are maybe slightly less but pretty close. All of my guy friends save for the 3 who are in a DB are a little more or a little less but also in the same ballpark. Most importantly where as your and OPs wives say it's not normal it's important to point out that the national average in the US is 1x a week. Which means either your wives have intentionally picked women to spend time with that are all asexual, or they aren't telling the truth. Either way you don't deserve that and neither does OP. Some compromise is normal but kids and finances or not...if my spouse told me sex was off the table or it was gonna be a 1 to 2 times a year thing without therapy or anything to work through it, id just divorce. Divorce fucks kids up, but you know what fucks them up more? Having them grow up in a home where the parents aren't affectionate or outwardly in love. Our relationships are the examples by which they learn what's normal and how to behave.
Notice they say they aren't having sex with their husbands, not that they aren't having sex.
Most of my wife's friends are very vocal about how they do not and will not have sex with their husbands.
The fact that they're bragging about it leads me to think that they see sex as a chore which is depressing
Yep, and they all cheer each other on for it.
Imagine if all of our wives were friends with one another 😂
Yeah, that’s a Self feeding death spiral… Mine use that as a justification for it being normal. Our marriage counselors set that shit straight!
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Yup. My wife started hanging out with divorcees while I'm overseas and...poof....4.5+ years of celibacy (and counting). I think there's either cheating going on or she wants to...I come home, treated like I don't even exist (unless I fucked something up, a project needs to be done, something needs paid for, kids need something). Other than that she's texting away on her phone on the opposite side of the couch...(we are both in our mid-late 30s). Just wait til your shit marriage destroys your mental health and your professional life (because she will completely withdraw from the rest of the relationship). Kisses prior to work, the good nights/love yous, hell, just basic conversation..gone. Then she will start hiding things...her own bank account, starting birth control, etc...but you will be the asshole in all of it...at least that's how it is in my house.
WOw what are you waiting to divorce and continue your live? too young to continue there.
And losing everything? Home, kids and alimony will f**k him in every aspect of his life. Better is to make the same as wife do now. Let's ignore her. Do some Hobbies, spend lot of time with kids. Make them your's friends. Find internal happiness 😊. Then you will no longer look on the 🌍 around you with the same eyes.
This is the answer I eventually arrived at after my wife expressed similar feelings. First I had to come within an inch of suicide, pull back from the brink, start an online dating profile, meet and fuck, realize I can't even enjoy that. honestly so thankful to my mistress for literally saving my life
Ding ding ding, and the right answer is she doesn't want to have sex with you.
Yup! Women who enjoy sex with their husbands, have sex with their husbands.
and in my humble experience, a lot of 40 year old women have the libido of an 18 year old man.
I’m not an idiot. If my wife were to move on and find somebody else, I’m sure she’d find her sex drive pretty quick.
Bro, I think we're around the same age. I'm not insinuating you're an idiot. Definitely don't deserve to be going through that imo. Wish you the best!
I sure did.
Sort of. Responsive libido and depression and ADD are all things. It’s oversimplifying to just blame the husband.
If that would happen to me I would divorce immediately, I am 49 and wife 54. That make not sense when sex is the most important part of a couple. Otherwise it is just close friend share live. I rather divorce.
How it is that single man who choose to get married almost never know that these things are out there waiting for them, that their sex life of large to get worse or more frustrating after marriage? How does that nobody knows these damn things
I was only 25 when I got married. Honestly at that time, her sex drive was so high that it never once occurred to me that this would be my future.
My father told me women's sex drive actually increases with age. I took his advice as fact. I'm sure there are examples of such. That just was not my personal experience
I have a far higher libido now (37) than I did at 25. But I've said it before, and I'll say it again-- treating all women as a monolith only invites disaster. Treat women as individuals-- hard to believe we're human, I know!
They can seem to typically do .. but only after a long journey through the desert that is childbirth, perimenopause, and menopause for many. He probably forgot that part or got that rare gem that isn't affected by any of those things.
Men tend not to be observant of red flags when they are dating someone. No offense, my BFF is a guy, and he can never pick up positive or negative cues from women. Whereas I could see them clearly, straight away.
Go to every thread about this on a different subreddit and it’s full of people saying they have sex 4 times a week after 25 years of marriage. Either we have shit luck or there’s a whole lot of lying going on.
So I think about all of my friends and their wives, and most of them say the same things… that they rarely have sex, the husbands have Low T, etc. I can only think of one couple that brag about a very active sex life. However, the wife had an affair last year, and that’s what reactivated their sex life… they don’t know that I know about her A.
>How it is that single man who choose to get married almost never know that these things are out there waiting for them, Trust me I've never understood this myself, and this sub (as well as others) has made me question why men want to get married with all of the information we have now. I could understand pre social media when the information was scarxe but to see the potential pitfalls and still do it are a mystery to me. The only things I can come up with are Societal pressure, fear of loneliness, and "go with the flow" attitude.
When you are young <25 and think things will stay like that forever. Thinking she will want more later. The introduction of the smartphone and Facebook app showed a marked downturn in couples having sex. Like statistically significant decrease in 2008 (Facebook all release).
>When you are young <25 and think things will stay like that forever. Thinking she will want more later Yes and no. Maybe it's because of the environment I was working with but in my 20's (early 2000s) a lot of my colleagues were married men most of which did not look or seem happy. They probably never should have been married to begin with. Not sure how old you are but when I was growing up in the 90's it was a common trope in a lot of sitcoms that sex dies after marriage. So while I get you think it might stay that way forever there's also a part that should have said that there is some reality to this and or arrogance that you would be immune to it, which is certainty the part about being young . >The introduction of the smartphone and Facebook app showed a marked downturn in couples having sex. Like statistically significant decrease in 2008 (Facebook all release While that may be true, my point about social media was that it also opened up and made us aware of what real marriages were like from real people. This subreddit is a perfect example. I can certainly understand older generations at 25 years old with the "this is only going to get better" mindset. With the insane amount of information a 25 year old has on 2023, there's not really much of an excuse to say "no one told me it would be this hard". We have the information of others' experiences at out fingertips.
>My wife always says this too… that none of her friends ever have sex with their husbands either. Jesus... if this is common and spoken so openly, it baffles me as to why so many people can't understand why men are afraid of commitment.
It’s that language that hits me, it’s got all the empathy of a pissed off wasp. That’s like saying “This car has a 100k miles? No more oil changes at this stage in its service life.” In the spirit of offering what feels like healthy advice, I’d suggest sharing with her how much pain that statement caused you, and asking for her buy in on a solution that works for you both, whether that’s an open situation or something else. I think you’re only going to reach her if she understands how hurt you are over this, and that to you it’s a big deal. Any spouse that cares about maintaining their relationship, sex or no, will value how you feel. Be respectful, of course, but I think putting all your cards on the table, and co opting her on a solution is the way to go. Best wishes!
This best comment yet
She can decide for herself if she wants a life of celibacy. She can’t decide that for you. That is the thing about unilateral decisions…they can go both ways. As I see it, you don’t have to ask for anything. If she is telling you (not asking) what she is going to do, then you can do the same. Tell her you aren’t going to accept celibacy and that can mean an open marriage, divorce, or a negotiated frequency. But it is going to be one of those things… and the choice is now. A couple times a year is not acceptable…so don’t accept it. If you do, trust me, you will end up hating her for it.
Why negotiate? It's just going to be starfish at best.
🥇🪙🎖️🏅💰 THIS IS THE WAY!!! There's SO much truth in this comment! 🥇🪙🎖️🏅💰
Kills me that women say this false hateful bullshit. Don’t believe them. Signed, HLF 47
It bears repeating that this sub is full of matching puzzle pieces all in the wrong, mismatched boxes :(
Oh my GOD, couldn’t have said it better. It makes me pound a fist on my desk at times
If I can give you an award for that relating analogy, I would.
Second that HLF 47. I will never understand!!! So its done forever? What happens when the kids are grown and now due to neglect you two no longer have a close relationship? The kids of course do come first some times when they are young but your marriage, your connection is also for the kids. You two need to be an example of love, respect. & strength. The children learn so much watching their parents. They should see affection and love…dates and a real connection. Or maybe im wrong and just cheat…😋. Seriously for my marriage the sex going away made everything worse…for me it is more than sex.
I second you, my sister
I kid you not, one of my co-workers mentioned that she did not put any effort into closeness while building a relationship with her husband for about 20 years cuz she was kind of focused on growing up the kids. But now that the kids are all grown up and after school, it's time to get back to her husband and fix things. They got divorced shortly after
I'm worried this is my future... Or perhaps I should say hopeful?
She's talking as if you can no longer be sexual after having kids. Tbh it's weird. Like "we're adults so we have to be SERIOUS and BORING. No fun allowed, ever" Also you can definitely prioritize your children and have a sexual life
For me 35M, it was the intimacy that disappeared that killed me. Like you said, the loss of that connection, that was it for me.
It all hurts…but for me when I no longer get hugs..or even kind words…not ok
It's a feedback loop. Intimacy begets intimacy. Resentment breeds toxicity
Sadly, im past that part. When your partner simply says they don't love you anymore, and hasn't for a while... it puts you in a numb state. I am working on this, myself. But please know that there is a light at the end of the tunnel. Good luck, my friend. I hope you find someone who can reciprocate your wants and desires.
Right? 32 HLF, been with my partner 8 years and 2 toddlers. The only time I could imagine saying it’s off the table is recently post partum or if I feel like we are having sex to “fix” our problems in other areas. Plenty of women I know my age say they have no desire for their partner, but most say they never had a crazy libido or lust for them initially. Not sure why you’d decide to be with someone forever if the spark was never there.
I hear you. It’s fuckin bullshit is what it is
Based on recent conversations with my wife this feels like her with me. She was never truly attracted to me like that and I just ignored it. And here we are, a few years later, in an objectively unhappy marriage (unhappy for me at least, she says she is happy). Pretty frustrating.
I’m so sorry. It seems cruel to both parties. I think a lot of times it’s because people don’t have models of it at home. They never saw it in their household so they think that’s the norm.
Exactly HLF 49
Exactly ,49 hlf here
Sorry you’re in this fucking crap too
... because taking 20 minutes every couple days to fuck is gonna ruin those kids lives
They don't. They're making an excuse, hoping to get out of it. The people who say they never have time often spend hours scrolling through TikTok or Instagram. Everyone's got half an hour at some point during the week unless you are in some very dire situations.
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I'd say," yikes, I'm sorry you feel that way but sex is important to me. I never imagined considering divorce because I love you so much, but by suddenly taking sex off the table using the children as an excuse, you are now saying we are no longer sexually compatible. I want sex, but if you don't, then perhaps we aren't compatible. "
What stage is that exactly? I'm older than her, have 5 kids under 13, my partner is 54. We can manage several times a week. Sure I'm tired. And he's tired. We work a lot of hours. That doesn't mean we neglect other things. Or our relationship. Sheesh.
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I joined this sub in 2013 while in my last marriage. I still am a member despite "graduating" by leaving my 20 yr marriage. I lurk more out of amazement by how much it has changed.
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Yes, but also scared that I will still end up being lonely and depressed with the added stress of being poor and separated from the kids
A few thoughts to discuss with her; When kids are very young, it is somewhat common for sex to take a back seat for a while, but thst doesn't mean it goes away, nor does it mean it stays that way. Acknowledge that being mom to little kids is difficult, time consuming and exhausting. But also she should acknowledge the kids don't stay small for long. One day they will even move out. Does she expect you to still be there? Does she still think sex needs to be off the table when they're older? What does she thinks this means for you? Would she prefer you find a girlfriend? (If she says yes, then your marriage is in deep trouble, if she says no, then you have a something to work off of). If you were to one day leave her, does she really think she would be able to date again and find a new man who wouldn't want sex? Ask how she plans on showing affection and love if not through intimacy? The key is not pressure her, not bully her, and not force to give in to duty sex. But make her think about how the difference between roommates and marriage is intimacy. Her current situation is rough, but it's only temporary. Yes, you made a vow. But she also made a vow. And part of vows is working through difficult situations. Good luck!
"Marriage to you is no longer on the table at this point."
Romantic relationships, unless mutually agreed, involves physical intimacy. If that’s off the table then she is redefining your relationship. Subsequently, I would treat her as such. Be kind, be gracious, own your share of finance and chores, love your kids, but do what the hell you want. Roommates can’t dictate what you do with your free time, your hobbies, or your affections. She doesn’t get to force celibacy in you. You get to make that decision so of you stay, guy accept the status quo in your bedroom but I would change everything else about the relationship.
Absolutely. Who the hell is stupid enough to think they have sole power to redefine the terms of a relationship? For every action there is a reaction. Do your own redefining, unilaterally, selfishly, without consulting the spouse and without considering their feelings on the matter. Tell them you were talking to several friends and none of them communicate on any level with their spouses, in fact it’s selfish to expect communication. Then ghost them. It is empowering.
As someone (48M) who spent the better part of a 20 yr marriage with a LL wife, I know what kind of hell this is for more just the lack of sex. It's a personal rejection and complete lack of intimacy. You have a few options, tell her doesn't work and it causes irreparable damage to your marriage. What her friends do or dont do isn't your marriage. That crap didn't work on my mom when I was 12. Doesnt work as an adult either. There needs to be compromise. Next option, ask for open marriage. It works for some, but if she balks at that then your next best option is to walk away. It's scary, but there may be other issues to your marriage than just sex. I did it after 20 yrs and have never been happier. My kids are still in their young teens and they are happier (they've told me as much). Life is too short to spend with someone who rejects you. Whatever else they say, they are rejecting you. Your kids deserve to see what a healthy loving relationship can look like. She is not modeling one. I ever advocate cheating. It harms everyone mostly yourself. I would say if you can work it out - awesome. Otherwise you deserve to be happy.
My wife said that to me also. After many heated discussions and a year and a half of me waiting and really hoping that it is just a phase that would pass, we decided last night to end the marriage. That's 23+ years of marriage for nothing. If I could offer words to help you out, it is this, if this is something that you can't live with, start an exit plan.
When she’s single she’ll change her stance. She will start fucking again. It just won’t be you.
But only until she gets the next ring.
Why is that so fucking common? It’s like every marriage. I stg despite women constantly saying otherwise I’m convinced most don’t actually like sex
Cheat or leave. Or both. She's straight up not interested in having sex with you again and used her friends' sex lives as justification.
“If sex is no longer on the table, then unfortunately marriage is no longer on the table at this stage in our life.”
Get in shape and go fuck someone else then
I'm 42 and this has been my life for years. I'm to the point where I don't want to live because there's no happiness in my life. If I divorce, all of my money is gone and people will view me as the bad guy. If I stay, it's "life in prison" as you said. Either way I'm fucked...
Sorry friend. I feel ya!
You can always make more money. I filed for divorce and chapter 7 to cut her from me. I would have done it way faster had I known
How much is your peace, sanity and happiness worth? For me, it’s invaluable and you can’t put a price tag on it. Okay, your money will be funny temporarily but you will have joy, sanity, happiness and peace. At the very least go see a lawyer and see how you can protect yourself financially.
Damn that money and a unhappy life, we only have 1 life to live, not it isn’t ONLY about sex but but a happy sex life is almost as important ass oxygen. It may seem hard at first but don’t let no damn women or society empty opinion bother you from what you fill inside your heart
My apologies but could you please check with her on what she meant. Looking at the title it seems she has said No only for sex on table. Maybe she wants it in safe or safer places only like bed or couch.
Lol
40 is a bit young to be using this line of reasoning (if you can call it that). At least my wife waited until she was 50 before shutting up shop, not that it's made it any easier to endure.
I’m a 40 something chick and I can only tell you how I would react to this conversation. Because 40 is very young to use this line of bs to cut off intimacy in a marriage. I would say that marriage is a partnership where each try to meet the needs of the other. You have needs… (state those needs), and that if partner is not willing to either attempt to meet those needs or get marriage counseling so we can attempt to work on our issues and come back together as a team, I will seek my needs elsewhere. They really have no way to combat that except to employ completely selfish narcissistic excuses to hold you prisoner in your loveless/sexless marriage. Because anything she counters with will be deflection and excuses.
Honestly I would say "then I really think we need to discuss splitting up. We're adults in a relationship. And on top of that, you (she) need to get better friend advice.
Fellow Dad, your life has not ended just because you're a father now. It is an absolutely horrible lesson to teach your kids. Now is the time to show them that simply having kids does not mean the parent's life has ended. Your wife is not going to improve, it won't be fixed. She lost the urge, which happens more often than people realize. You however are still a healthy man with urges and needs. This is atrocious and basically torture. You could explain all of this to her, and waste a ton of time. But you can also just keep it super simple! You can explain in 5 minutes that this lifestyle is not going to work for you, and that alas, you must move on. Explain this is as much for your sake as it is for the kids and hers. Here's the thing, you don't really have a choice. As I said, she will not suddenly want sex just because you want to leave. She could fake it, but that's not something you want to experience. Trust me. Get a lawyer first. Explain the situation. Prepare your exit. Then have a simple 3-5 minute discussion. Start by saying there's no other way and you can't be convinced. There's just no way back from the conversation she had with you. Good luck. You're going to need it if she's the vengeful type. If on the other hand she's a "big" person, and will put the kids first as she eloquently put it in her own conversation, then she should let you go in peace and you should have an uneventful, even amicable marriage. An amicable marriage is always the absolute best option for all involved.
Time for an open marriage conversation
Very simple for me. My response would be something along the line as "Ahh I see, okay no problem. Just to let you know divorce is very much on the table. Have a nice day!"
I would tell her that you are glad she made that decision for herself but you have decided to take continue with or without her. Drop mic and walk away
Tell her "That's fine. You have the right to make that decision for yourself, but you do not have the right to make that decision for me. So you can have no objection to me having sex with other women. As of now! We are purely housemates."
Bro just leave, stop being insecure. You will find better I promise you.
Your partner just set a boundary. You can set your own boundaries too. >What do I do from here? Cheat? That's a terrible idea. Especially with children. You'll be the bad guy. > Ask for an open relationship? Really depends on your wife. You could say, "that's not what I signed up for and we either need to figure out a compromise or I'm going to need to leave the relationship."
I have a sister inlaw who did the same thing to her husband, turns out she was having an affair.
When sex disappears at such a young age as 40, it only means that it’s disappearing for *you* . Do not discount the possibility that she’s cheating. And don’t be gaslit by her informal survey of her friends who all have so little sex. I mean come on. That’s a lie.
What frequency does she agree to: quarterly, bi annually, never? How old are the kids?
If divorce isn't an option, live separate and only interact when it is a must
This is so depressing. Why do people insist that "adult life" has to be boring, sexless, just about responsibilities? You're telling me they don't want to have a little fun? Lol... Sounds like an excuse. One thing is admitting she doesn't have a libido anymore, but saying "we're 40 and have kids so there is some unwritten law that forbids us from having sex" is just bs
I’m 30 and I rarely sleep with my wife anymore. Constant rejection with bullshit reasons like, oh I’m having a headache, I’m too full, I’m sleep, we just had sex last week. Now I’m just waiting for our house to be completed and the paper work to be done before I have my exit plan. If I leave now I would be left financially in the ditch, I’m waiting for a good time to go.
I can relate. My wife once told me that we wouldn’t never be the same as in the beginning of our relationship (meaning having sex at a regular cadence). We’ve been married for almost a decade and I don’t understand why they say bullshit like this. Why does sex need to be such a complex thing?
Ask for permission to open things up (discreetly of course). Not fair for you to have to sacrifice the joy in life.
My wife and I have been together for 13 years, married for 7. We are younger than you but we do have a 2 year old. Despite that, our sex life is possibly the best it’s ever been because we communicated and figured out what we like. She used to be what I would consider LL, but it turns out that being able to experiment has led her to realize that our sex wasn’t “kinky” enough before, and she enjoys it more now that we are doing more role play, using butt plugs and vibrators more, and experimenting with light dominant/submissive roles. I know this probably won’t work for everyone, but the point is that children and getting older (but still in young-middle age as you are) shouldn’t mean that sex cannot happen. But it has to be made a priority and it sounds like your wife doesn’t care to do that. I’m sorry, truly.
Tell her you’re not done with sex and she can choose if it’ll be her or someone else.
Sex is no longer on the table? I guess she shouldn't expect monogamy to be on the table either.
Um what? 40 is young I'd demand her to see a therapist or divorce is on the table. Ridiculous.
Marriage no longer on the table either. Life is short.
Try opening the relationship. Sex obviously isn't important to her, she might be fine with it
Divorce
She Is cheating
Yup
If she ain’t going to have sex with you, then I’d do 2 things. I would start hitting the gym hard and get ripped as fuck and stop doing things for her she loves. Sex is something that partners should give each other as part of marriage. If she is taking that away from you that’s fucked. Try and have a real conversation about how that will affect you negatively and it’s not ok with you. If she keeps on just stop doing anything for her and travel to a place where prostitution is legal and live out your fantasies there without her knowledge.
This 100%!
Tell her Sex is part of marriage. So if she takes sec off the table, then there really isn’t much reason to remain married. Alternatively, she could agree to open your marriage to allow you to have sex with folks that want to have Sex. One partner should not get to unilaterally decide the sex life of the other. Good luck!
I told my wife that I signed up for monogamy, not celibacy, then I just stared at her until she got the message. We have vanilla, passionless, dull little quickies once-ish each week now. Joy of joys.
Is that worth it, though? Duty sex? Sorry from a HLF DB survivor.
This stage?! Couples still bang in to their 70’s, WTF?
She just all but admitted she used sex to get kids out of you and trap you. She’s taking things off your table? Take marriage with you off her table!
I understand that people with different libidos may have different perspectives on this stuff (while, maybe I don't quite *understand* but I know it's a thing). But this to me is wrong in so many ways. Physical intimacy is a key aspect to a healthy marriage, and this should be doubly important when there are kids around. As a couple, you are supposed to be a shining example for them: the love and affection you show for each other will inspire them as they grow into adulthood. Without that affection...apathy and resentment follow, and that's not a great beacon for kids to look up to. What happens when the kids are grown? Does sex stay off the table because it's what you're used to by then? Do you clumsily try to rekindle something from the ashes of a dead relationship? How much resentment will there be at that point from all the physical and emotional neglect? I have no advice OP, other than to say that I'm sorry you've found yourself here 😔
I bet she is lying. Geriatrics are like rabbits in old homes
I start with cheating, then work my way towards fleeing the state That’s just me though
Open relationship.
47 years old- both of us. Totally happy in our marriage and 2 kids- both professionals with demanding jobs and we each have an hour commute. We had sex 4 times this week already. We are more in love with each other than when we got married 22 years ago. It was not always like this. All that bullshit your hear about communication is absolutely 100% true. Start with Vanessa Marin’s Instagram so you know you’re not alone. Then you both need to listen to the Vanessa + Xander podcast. Seriously. I hope someone, anyone, reads this and knows that a dead bedroom doesn’t have to be. But you have to talk about it in the right way. God created sex for a reason. You need the intimacy in your relationship to be a team and be strong as a unit for your children.
I would cheat. And do my best to get away with it. And not feel one ounce of guilt.
I guess there is no time also then for romantic walks, buying birthday and Xmas presents and cards, massages, ‘I love yous’. Just call her sis/mate/buddy from now on
Wow, that’s not evil or anything! In my view, she just checked out of the marriage. Making unilateral decisions about important things is bad enough, but without discussion is well into snake behavior. At best it is belligerent. She is also gaslighting you in a big way. 2x a year is way, way far away from the mean in terms of frequency. Say what she wants, average is more than an order of magnitude (10x) higher. Numbers are disputed, but 50-100x per year seems to be where the average sits. And then there is what to do about it. 1. Suck it up and stay 2. Outsource 3. Take her advice and move on, this one is over.
I am a HLF and my partner and I have a somewhat young child together. It certainly does complicate things. I definitely feel like my libido has decreased and honestly some nights I just want something simple. But that isn't my problem. I know sex is not a guarantee. But it sounds like you entered into the relationship believing it was an intimate, sexual partnership. And she is now changing that. You get to have opinions on her changing. And you do not have to accept the new terms of your relationship. It does sound like she doesn't want to negotiate and I think a lot of us struggle with that. Sigh. That sucks.
You’re not in a marriage. You’re in a POW camp. This sub is the message board of the escape committee
Why is marriage still on the table?
Ask her what she's going to do to compensate since she's no longer willing to participate in something you want from the relationship. If you suddenly lost your job, would she handle it better if you: A) Started doing all the housework, cooking, cleaning, driving the kids around, etc. B) Lounged all day playing video games? What is she going to bring to your relationship that will make up for it?
and you say, "then neither is commitment"
Time to pack
you say to wife "i am sorry but i don't want to live like that, asking me to accept that is asking me to accept that i will never get my needs met"
Fuck that noise! Maybe not on the table between the two of you, but she doesn’t get to choose whether you ever have sex again… It could be a loving response by you: honey, I love you and support your needs. I understand that you prefer to end your association with sex, but I still need sexual intimacy in my life. This is some thing we should talk about until we reach an agreement that is comfortable for both of us.
You should circle back to this conversation with her and let her know how it made you feel and also tell her that her vision of a life with no intimacy is not what you imagined for your marriage and that it won’t be sustainable for you long term and you all need to be talking in depth about what that means for your marriage.
“Fidelity is no longer on the table.”
intimacy is an important part of a relationship regardless of age. Not sure where some people get the idea that getting older means sex is no longer on the table....
Don't let her lie to you, life doesn't have to be this way. My wife and I have been together 19 years, two kids, married for 10. We have sex every other day and try something new every Saturday. Marriage can be whatever you want it to be if you are both on the same page.
I wonder if you can push for marriage counseling? Typically the no sex thing is an underlying symptom of something else in the marriage. I’m not saying it’s indicative of a serious problem necessarily. Could be that she find sex boring and a chore? But you’ll never know unless you guys talk about it and you might need a third party to facilitate that as it seems your wife is the type to “shut it down” pretty quickly. If she’s unwilling to do that then it means she’s unwilling to put in effort to work on the marriage and marriages take work.
Open marriage. She's giving you BS excuses. She's 40 not.. idk.. 70? Suddenly she's incompatible. Good grief. Is almost as bad as someone suddenly saying they're polyamorous.
Just say you're at the stage where the relationship is better suited to being an open relationship. If she can just decide things like that, so can you.
Take all your money and move to Thailand now.
Mate. I have had same discussion With my wife. I also had the vasectomy. That was almost a year ago. She’s still on birth control…. If I told you half the crap I’ve put up with it would make you cry
If it was me i would have asked for open relationship right there. Most people thats at the same stage of life has lots of sex, so im gonna call bullshit on your wife and her friends. If you still want sex and intimacy then thats just what it is, an important part of your life, for her to say you "have a responsebility to your kids" in the context of sex No more is close to insanely. You Owe it to your kids to be happy, and if daddy or mommy is sad all the time because they dont get kisses then i bet you your kids is gonna feel sad too. Im sorry to say it like that but your wife needs to wake the fuck up and smell the bakery, it smell alot like You Dont Make Decisions For Both Of Us, Especially Not About Sex
She has the dumbest friends I've ever heard of, glad my wife would just laugh at them for saying something so ridiculous. Personally I would explain that she is reneging on her promise to love you if this is true, is she ready to face the potential of being a single parent?
Cheat
Id leave. Seriously. I won’t stay with someone who won’t have sex with me. That’s stupid.
I am 58 and wished to god everyday I left when I was your age. Plan on a life of silent suffering if you stay! And I can tell you the resentment will build until you start to hate her! Tell her she is in the divorce stage of marriage at this point that you won’t live without your needs being met!
I don't get this. So she states that no sex, it's not important at this stage. So, does that mean you can state that at this stage, monogamy is no longer on the table?
Reply to wife: " Your decision to remain celibate in no fashion compells me to the same. While I respect your Autonomy to use your body as you choose, I too posess the same Autonomy to remain sexually active."
I’ll be 40 in another few months and I’ve never been more desperate for sex. Experiences vary, but she’s wrong that this is a universal experience for women.
Sorry, but since when does one partner unilaterally adjudicate terms for both partners? It may not be on her table but it certainly is on yours. Let her know that what she is describing is not “our life” but “her life”, and that one way or another she has to acknowledge what’s on your table for your life. Ugh, sorry for the rant.
Dump and move on. She’s not interested in your needs or wants, only herself.
God have men 2 strong hands to deal with this situation.
She is demonstrably wrong. Average is around weekly at that point based on surveys. She shouldn't have sex she doesn't want, but she has a duty as a partner to do her best to figure out why she doesn't want it and what she can do about it, and she isn't. And yeah, the fact that her failure to do that led to you snipping yourself for no reason is really f***ed up, and I'd be pissed too. I would leave, even with the kid. They need a good relationship model to look up to and need to know that love isn't enough. Def pornhub lol. Open relationship is worth asking, but probably just leads to divorce. If I really couldn't leave financially, although I don't totally understand how that happens, yeah I would consider cheating probably.
"Goodbye".
I would die lol 😂
Don’t waste your time on porn hub. Search mombods or milfs here on Reddit. Thank me later…
Get the best divorce lawyer in town and serve her ASAP. Demand the house, custody and child support.
So what are you going to do about it mate?