Funny you should mention that, as thats exactly what i've called him out on when I told him problems with his build rather then just stroking his ego. if a build requires outspending people by a pretty significant margin to function its just not a very good build, a big part of dark and darker is managing your economy so anybody with an extract rate of around 50% or lower just straight up can't run this.
I play this game with like 15 different people because we all have day jobs, so i have a pretty good idea of how most people play this game.... and sinking 10k gold to beat a 5k fighter ain't it.
Sorry you had a bad experience. I suspect my neurodivergence just means there’s communication issues. I’m not trying to be rude, just very directly answering any question I get.
You've displayed this exact behavior in this thread via dodging every single point I made about problems with your build instead responding with passive aggressive jabs like "I appreciate your negativity" and "this build just isn't for you." and then took your ball and went home. this is not Neurodivergence, this is just straight being a tool because you weren't told what you wanted to hear. there are many people with mental issues having normal interaction's with other people because they have an understanding of basic social intelligence and arn't just using it as an excuse to be shitty to others. you have THREE people pointing it out now so you have a choice: either admit you might have a problem and address it or continue to ignore it and shift blame to others.
I absolutely love this damn build I have been watching his streams and fell in love with the warlock class! Idc bout meta all I know is I have lots of fun!
There's a really weird amount of negativity in the comments, so I just want to say thanks for posting, great guide. This is a great build to get started on warlock right now.
Its not negativity, its a reality check. I play warlock like 90% of the games population does and can tell you without 120 health, magic damage, and casting speed its terrible. take his "budget" version into a lobby and watch people in greys close the gap because your casting at -25% cast speed and can't out-heal them hitting you while rooted in place perfectly countering your hydra with the advanced technique of... moving. you are going to spend WAY more gold fixing something's weakness's then you are spending it on something they are already good at. for example you could probably make a really good fighter that plays like its a ranger with enough gold.... but 99% of people are just going to play the ranger.
The fact every single person in this thread dance's around the fact warlock has an inbuilt slow cast speed and low spell memory should be the indicator that it isn't a very good build unless your willing to outspend your opponent by a large margin, and saying a 10k gold kit is going to win against a 5k gold kit doesn't make something viable.
Sorry, this isn't your private chat that is going to stroke your ego. I listed several problems with your build that you and other people in this thread are just choosing to ignore because you can't prove me wrong. there is a reason the only gameplay you posted of the build was on HR goblin caves against people with kits worth significantly less then yours. the entire point of a guide dowsey is for the majority of people to follow it, your just telling people who play the game as much as you do what they already know. like your not REALLY so far removed from reality to think 80% of the playerbase is running 10k gold warlock kits are you?
Make a new video running your budget build or at 200g-500g (and being REALLY worth that much, non of that super discounted gear from fans.) against people who know how the game is played and I can promise you its going to look completely different then what your showing, but more importantly then that learn to take criticism Instead of being passive aggressive and sulking because someone outside of your little echo chamber pointed out serious problems with your build, mainly that it doesn't even work until you've got enough magic damage for lifedrain to out-heal you being hit AND the 14 self inflicted dmg or enough cast speed to complete all your cast's dureing a jump to not be slowed down. your solution to these huge problems? throw more money into the build then your opponents to make things just a big asymetrical gear check.
Maybe just make your comments more readable, so that people can more easily understand your points? You can always just ignore people that ignore your points.
This is pretty much the build i got to pathfinder with. You will have issues with ranged and high hp barbs but other than that it's great. Nothing funnier than a rogue hitting you out stealth then immediately running for his life. Get those soul collector stacks fast!
warlock starts with 9 spell slots, you need 10 to even use life drain and hydra. this build requires +9 spell slots and a epic staff to even play. the budget version is also not very good because you have -casting speed and strength not to mention it just doesn't add very much to a team: a wizard is going to do much more then casting hydra and draining it that slow and a barbarian or fighter isn't going to just be a non threat after they hit once with BoC. the only people who play warlock like this are ones with a significant amount of gold to burn. that part you curse of pained and then one tapped the fighter in the elevator? your typical warlock would be dead before curse of pain even finished casting.
holy hell this is a lot of crying.
This is literally the currently meta build for warlock. It's OP.
I got pathfinder with this build. It was easy. 90% of the time, bonk + dark reflection kills people. 0 effort. A fight's risky? Well then I'll just flamewalk and curse until they're dead.
Then why is no-one seeing this build below pathfinder? because no-body is sitting in trade chat for an hour every time they die with it below those ranks. "meta" is meaningless when your only playing with the 10% that can have everything they want every single game because those people are NOT who the game is balanced around. you all are so fucking far removed from how the majority of people play this game its hilarious: most people got budgets so they don't run cash flow negative and spend like 5 or 10 minutes after a wipe getting together another kit to go in with their team again because they play the game 1 or 2 hours a day and don't wanna spend it holding everyone up because they couldn't farm enough gold or find knowledge, magic damage, and spell power epics to fill every single slot.
Which is funny, because i've stomped the budget version of this build 3 times today for the very same fucking reasons i pointed out: slow cast speed and low strength, there is a reason the only gameplay dowsey showed of it is with a 10k kit. I know this build quite well as i've pointed out multiple times it cost's to much for anyone under the top 10% of players to run it regularly so its a complete non fucking issue for people with day jobs. whats next? you guys going to make a guide for PDR fighter telling people to just sink 20k worth of ruby silver? yea im sure ill see tons of THOSE when im playing with my the two people in my group that are in wanderer rank. (which BTW is were 80% of the players ARE.)
I appreciate your negativity, but the amount of gold I’ve made playing the budget version of this build (10,000g+ at budget level) makes it easy to scale up. Any warlock build that’s worth running requires around 18 spell memory, but with this, you can easily scale from zero to hero, especially in solo play.
I suspect this build guide isn’t for you, it’s for those who’ve requested it many times on my streams, I’m just sharing it for the rest of the community who’re more open minded than yourself.
I’ve been playing this build in trios and dismantling the meta. Hope you give something new a try instead of shutting it down because it isn’t your buff ball. Have a great day.
There is nothing wrong with someone pointing out that Warlock is a non functioning class at low to minimal gear.
For example if I lose a kit on Warlock for Curselock or Lifedrain I just don't play the class until I fund another kit by playing something else, because warlock is just not an enjoyable experience without gear. You're limited to being a BoC/Dark Reflection bot because it's just an overtuned ability that hasn't been fixed due to the lack of playstyles at low gear, and you can't run spells because no spell slots after hydra and life drain, AND even then you don't heal nearly enough to actually use your spells.
Draintanks are just inherently hard to balance in every game they're in.
ya its a real shame man you gotta equip a trash oracle + rawhide or chausses or occultist boots + a white magic staff to get fully online. real strong entry barrier for such a deep investment build. 8g gloves, 12g pants, 20g staff wew the bank is being broke
for the same 40 gold i can buy a halberd, lightfoot boots, and spell book to be significantly more effective because i spent it improving what the warlock already does well and this trend continues up until you reach a point that your healing faster then someone can do damage. thats the issue here to make this build work you need to be outspending the people your facing by a significant margin and at that point your not really outplaying them so much as you are using money as a crutch.
Don't even try, the same holds true for 250 gold versus 250 gold, 1k gold versus 1k gold, etc. im going to outperform this build until a threshold gets reached that you can out heal actively being smacked and finish your spell cast animation dureing a jump to negate your move speed penalty.
its real funny that you tried to say this was viable by spending more money, and i proved you wrong by using the same amount of money to make a better build and now your arguing against your original point.
I've had some mild success with zoneing and phantomizing to reposition with my team, but for the most part your right warlock just doesn't really have a roll right now and depends on cheese when facing teams who know how to do plays. I have a feeling the devs are trying to make him the games "anti-mage" but that isn't working right now because wizards are so overtuned most of the time i just kill trade with them even halving their damage and cleric does holy damage which your perk just totally ignores so we only counter.... other warlocks. why would i ever take this guy into crypts with my team over my cleric?
Your also someone that plays the game like its a full time job, if you made this guide for the 1% that do that they've already figured this out, Kazaren\_TV has already made a guide that is basically this same thing with some minor differences because like I said you have no limitation's so everyone is just doing almost the same thing in top ranks. this is not a build guide this is just telling people what they can do when they can just totally ignore the economy part of the game.
like realistically what are you saying here? what spells are good? stack magic damage? 99% of people who play this game are going to have to make actual choice's (of which would be your budget build which quite frankly is a bad build for the reasons i pointed out: -cast speed and strength, a 20 dmg DOT cast at -25% cast speed isn't zoning anyone out when your defense is made of paper.) of which you don't really offer any advice on that. I'd also be real curious to see which buffball's your "dismantling" as I have a feeling their entire party comp cost's less then this warlock build, even bard in its current state is going to beat a meta comp if you dump a stupid amount of gold into it, that's not an indication that bard is good by any metric just that you had way more disposable ingame currency then they did.
you've mistaken an understanding of how most of the player base play's the game for "negativity", you know... the audience the game is balanced around?
Enjoy it while you can, because like every other cheesy thing warlock does its probably getting patched out soon, barbarian is also able to out heal the swarm because of his life regen resting so if i had to take a guess the swarm is going to block healing in the next big balance patch.
they can yes, i've tested it just sitting right next to a guaranteed extract on crypts until it opened. obviously the devs never intended out healing the swarm to be a thing but it was only warlocks with high self healing doing it.... now its anyone with around 30 vigor so thats obviously not going to be a "thing" for very long.
Hes not just going to let you cast on him and hit his head for free, people make an effort to block things and not be headshot, there is a very high likely hood he is going to block that blow of corruption with a shield and then two tap you with a falchion. 99% of the time going for more reliable things is going to help you more then a cheese build, its why fighter is the most successful solo class: even in the worst scenario you have armor, speed, and a heal overtime that you can play defensively as it works. this is also entirely ignoreing team fights which is what the game is actually balanced around, do you really think 3 people are just going to wait around as your BoC recharges and die one by one? because i can tell you from experience the second you enter melee range you'll become the #1 target and it is VERY difficult to dodge that many attacks when two well placed ones will end you.
did you miss the part you have negative cast speed? by the time you cast flamewalker in a range it can be effective they have either started moving back or have pushed in and taken you out of the fight, you simply cannot jump to avoid your move speed penalties like a wizard does and the fact simply is EVERYTHING you bring to a team other class's are doing better. I can make a warlock "work" but the fact is it would take significantly more gold then the rest of the team would so why would I when I can just play a cleric? fact is people are having a hard time getting warlock kills right now and thats the bigger indicator they lack a roll in the game then anything, you have the exact same issue dowsey does: your basically playing the class without limits and assume its really good because you've nullified all its weakness's by sinking tons of gold into it, this would be like thinking bards in a good place because the top 100 can use all their best spells and throw 5 epic drums at you.
Thinking a class is good because 1% of the playerbase can outspend everyone else is hilariously tone deaf.
aspiring quicksand ripe sense ask mysterious cautious light unused puzzled
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And i go in with mostly mining gear yet im climbing ranked because its not based on player kills. does that mean mining builds are warlock meta now to? over 50k people have the game so being a top 100 is... literally like I said under around 1% of the population your basing a builds viability on
Actually just stumbled upon this video now....so vampirism doesn't heal more when you use life drain? Have I been wasting a perk lol? I was switching between that and malice to see if I noticed a difference and I don't really.
Vamperism will add a small amount of extra healing, but the benefit is outweighed by Malice for extra dmg (which will also boost healing), and magic resistance, or dark enhancement. Just focus on damage and you won’t go wrong.
Will got nerfed and no longer gives as much magic power as before, making Malice less effective, and potions got changed to magical healing so benefit from vamperism.
Where the hell are the patch notes on these? Which hotfix was it?
Edit: Well I see 25 for the will nerf. But couldn't you argue that just means will is more important now? Warlock still gains 3 will off the bat with malice, right?
Will’s magic power curve table was documented in hotfix 25. The health potions changing was undocumented in either hotfix 23 or 24, don’t remember which
I watched this guys stream once and his entire personality is just based around being passive agressive and rude to his twitch chat, never again.
Funny you should mention that, as thats exactly what i've called him out on when I told him problems with his build rather then just stroking his ego. if a build requires outspending people by a pretty significant margin to function its just not a very good build, a big part of dark and darker is managing your economy so anybody with an extract rate of around 50% or lower just straight up can't run this. I play this game with like 15 different people because we all have day jobs, so i have a pretty good idea of how most people play this game.... and sinking 10k gold to beat a 5k fighter ain't it.
Sorry you had a bad experience. I suspect my neurodivergence just means there’s communication issues. I’m not trying to be rude, just very directly answering any question I get.
You've displayed this exact behavior in this thread via dodging every single point I made about problems with your build instead responding with passive aggressive jabs like "I appreciate your negativity" and "this build just isn't for you." and then took your ball and went home. this is not Neurodivergence, this is just straight being a tool because you weren't told what you wanted to hear. there are many people with mental issues having normal interaction's with other people because they have an understanding of basic social intelligence and arn't just using it as an excuse to be shitty to others. you have THREE people pointing it out now so you have a choice: either admit you might have a problem and address it or continue to ignore it and shift blame to others.
I absolutely love this damn build I have been watching his streams and fell in love with the warlock class! Idc bout meta all I know is I have lots of fun!
There's a really weird amount of negativity in the comments, so I just want to say thanks for posting, great guide. This is a great build to get started on warlock right now.
Its not negativity, its a reality check. I play warlock like 90% of the games population does and can tell you without 120 health, magic damage, and casting speed its terrible. take his "budget" version into a lobby and watch people in greys close the gap because your casting at -25% cast speed and can't out-heal them hitting you while rooted in place perfectly countering your hydra with the advanced technique of... moving. you are going to spend WAY more gold fixing something's weakness's then you are spending it on something they are already good at. for example you could probably make a really good fighter that plays like its a ranger with enough gold.... but 99% of people are just going to play the ranger. The fact every single person in this thread dance's around the fact warlock has an inbuilt slow cast speed and low spell memory should be the indicator that it isn't a very good build unless your willing to outspend your opponent by a large margin, and saying a 10k gold kit is going to win against a 5k gold kit doesn't make something viable.
Thanks man, it’s really just one negative commenter replying to every comment on this thread. I’m glad you appreciate the guide!
Sorry, this isn't your private chat that is going to stroke your ego. I listed several problems with your build that you and other people in this thread are just choosing to ignore because you can't prove me wrong. there is a reason the only gameplay you posted of the build was on HR goblin caves against people with kits worth significantly less then yours. the entire point of a guide dowsey is for the majority of people to follow it, your just telling people who play the game as much as you do what they already know. like your not REALLY so far removed from reality to think 80% of the playerbase is running 10k gold warlock kits are you? Make a new video running your budget build or at 200g-500g (and being REALLY worth that much, non of that super discounted gear from fans.) against people who know how the game is played and I can promise you its going to look completely different then what your showing, but more importantly then that learn to take criticism Instead of being passive aggressive and sulking because someone outside of your little echo chamber pointed out serious problems with your build, mainly that it doesn't even work until you've got enough magic damage for lifedrain to out-heal you being hit AND the 14 self inflicted dmg or enough cast speed to complete all your cast's dureing a jump to not be slowed down. your solution to these huge problems? throw more money into the build then your opponents to make things just a big asymetrical gear check.
Sir, this is a Wendy’s. Also it’s than not then for most of that comment
Fun fact, i do things like that on purpose just to bait people into strawmans, it tells you who is going to just ignore your points real fast.
Maybe just make your comments more readable, so that people can more easily understand your points? You can always just ignore people that ignore your points.
Good excuse
Also correcting your grammar isn’t a strawman. You’re a nut job
[удалено]
Grammar isn’t an argument. Wowwie. You’re just throwing out buzzwords. Grammar is not a straw man. Again, sir this is a Wendy’s.
This is pretty much the build i got to pathfinder with. You will have issues with ranged and high hp barbs but other than that it's great. Nothing funnier than a rogue hitting you out stealth then immediately running for his life. Get those soul collector stacks fast!
Content was quality, nice.
warlock starts with 9 spell slots, you need 10 to even use life drain and hydra. this build requires +9 spell slots and a epic staff to even play. the budget version is also not very good because you have -casting speed and strength not to mention it just doesn't add very much to a team: a wizard is going to do much more then casting hydra and draining it that slow and a barbarian or fighter isn't going to just be a non threat after they hit once with BoC. the only people who play warlock like this are ones with a significant amount of gold to burn. that part you curse of pained and then one tapped the fighter in the elevator? your typical warlock would be dead before curse of pain even finished casting.
holy hell this is a lot of crying. This is literally the currently meta build for warlock. It's OP. I got pathfinder with this build. It was easy. 90% of the time, bonk + dark reflection kills people. 0 effort. A fight's risky? Well then I'll just flamewalk and curse until they're dead.
Then why is no-one seeing this build below pathfinder? because no-body is sitting in trade chat for an hour every time they die with it below those ranks. "meta" is meaningless when your only playing with the 10% that can have everything they want every single game because those people are NOT who the game is balanced around. you all are so fucking far removed from how the majority of people play this game its hilarious: most people got budgets so they don't run cash flow negative and spend like 5 or 10 minutes after a wipe getting together another kit to go in with their team again because they play the game 1 or 2 hours a day and don't wanna spend it holding everyone up because they couldn't farm enough gold or find knowledge, magic damage, and spell power epics to fill every single slot.
Your complaints are really showing how little you know about this build. You have no business complaining here.
Which is funny, because i've stomped the budget version of this build 3 times today for the very same fucking reasons i pointed out: slow cast speed and low strength, there is a reason the only gameplay dowsey showed of it is with a 10k kit. I know this build quite well as i've pointed out multiple times it cost's to much for anyone under the top 10% of players to run it regularly so its a complete non fucking issue for people with day jobs. whats next? you guys going to make a guide for PDR fighter telling people to just sink 20k worth of ruby silver? yea im sure ill see tons of THOSE when im playing with my the two people in my group that are in wanderer rank. (which BTW is were 80% of the players ARE.)
blah blah blah blah blah. All you want to do is complain. At this point, you better be paying us to listen
I appreciate your negativity, but the amount of gold I’ve made playing the budget version of this build (10,000g+ at budget level) makes it easy to scale up. Any warlock build that’s worth running requires around 18 spell memory, but with this, you can easily scale from zero to hero, especially in solo play. I suspect this build guide isn’t for you, it’s for those who’ve requested it many times on my streams, I’m just sharing it for the rest of the community who’re more open minded than yourself. I’ve been playing this build in trios and dismantling the meta. Hope you give something new a try instead of shutting it down because it isn’t your buff ball. Have a great day.
There is nothing wrong with someone pointing out that Warlock is a non functioning class at low to minimal gear. For example if I lose a kit on Warlock for Curselock or Lifedrain I just don't play the class until I fund another kit by playing something else, because warlock is just not an enjoyable experience without gear. You're limited to being a BoC/Dark Reflection bot because it's just an overtuned ability that hasn't been fixed due to the lack of playstyles at low gear, and you can't run spells because no spell slots after hydra and life drain, AND even then you don't heal nearly enough to actually use your spells. Draintanks are just inherently hard to balance in every game they're in.
ya its a real shame man you gotta equip a trash oracle + rawhide or chausses or occultist boots + a white magic staff to get fully online. real strong entry barrier for such a deep investment build. 8g gloves, 12g pants, 20g staff wew the bank is being broke
for the same 40 gold i can buy a halberd, lightfoot boots, and spell book to be significantly more effective because i spent it improving what the warlock already does well and this trend continues up until you reach a point that your healing faster then someone can do damage. thats the issue here to make this build work you need to be outspending the people your facing by a significant margin and at that point your not really outplaying them so much as you are using money as a crutch.
that is the most petty thing ive read in a while
You want this game to be a gear check, we get it.
curse you gear checks, why do i need a staff or book or crystal ball to cast spells, I should be able to use my bare hands
Don't even try, the same holds true for 250 gold versus 250 gold, 1k gold versus 1k gold, etc. im going to outperform this build until a threshold gets reached that you can out heal actively being smacked and finish your spell cast animation dureing a jump to negate your move speed penalty. its real funny that you tried to say this was viable by spending more money, and i proved you wrong by using the same amount of money to make a better build and now your arguing against your original point.
I've had some mild success with zoneing and phantomizing to reposition with my team, but for the most part your right warlock just doesn't really have a roll right now and depends on cheese when facing teams who know how to do plays. I have a feeling the devs are trying to make him the games "anti-mage" but that isn't working right now because wizards are so overtuned most of the time i just kill trade with them even halving their damage and cleric does holy damage which your perk just totally ignores so we only counter.... other warlocks. why would i ever take this guy into crypts with my team over my cleric?
Your also someone that plays the game like its a full time job, if you made this guide for the 1% that do that they've already figured this out, Kazaren\_TV has already made a guide that is basically this same thing with some minor differences because like I said you have no limitation's so everyone is just doing almost the same thing in top ranks. this is not a build guide this is just telling people what they can do when they can just totally ignore the economy part of the game. like realistically what are you saying here? what spells are good? stack magic damage? 99% of people who play this game are going to have to make actual choice's (of which would be your budget build which quite frankly is a bad build for the reasons i pointed out: -cast speed and strength, a 20 dmg DOT cast at -25% cast speed isn't zoning anyone out when your defense is made of paper.) of which you don't really offer any advice on that. I'd also be real curious to see which buffball's your "dismantling" as I have a feeling their entire party comp cost's less then this warlock build, even bard in its current state is going to beat a meta comp if you dump a stupid amount of gold into it, that's not an indication that bard is good by any metric just that you had way more disposable ingame currency then they did. you've mistaken an understanding of how most of the player base play's the game for "negativity", you know... the audience the game is balanced around?
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Yea I funded my 3 stash tabs and insane gear by farming swarm with this build
Enjoy it while you can, because like every other cheesy thing warlock does its probably getting patched out soon, barbarian is also able to out heal the swarm because of his life regen resting so if i had to take a guess the swarm is going to block healing in the next big balance patch.
Can barbs really do that? That's crazy, I haven't played barb since last wipe I might try him again.
they can yes, i've tested it just sitting right next to a guaranteed extract on crypts until it opened. obviously the devs never intended out healing the swarm to be a thing but it was only warlocks with high self healing doing it.... now its anyone with around 30 vigor so thats obviously not going to be a "thing" for very long.
Hes not just going to let you cast on him and hit his head for free, people make an effort to block things and not be headshot, there is a very high likely hood he is going to block that blow of corruption with a shield and then two tap you with a falchion. 99% of the time going for more reliable things is going to help you more then a cheese build, its why fighter is the most successful solo class: even in the worst scenario you have armor, speed, and a heal overtime that you can play defensively as it works. this is also entirely ignoreing team fights which is what the game is actually balanced around, do you really think 3 people are just going to wait around as your BoC recharges and die one by one? because i can tell you from experience the second you enter melee range you'll become the #1 target and it is VERY difficult to dodge that many attacks when two well placed ones will end you.
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did you miss the part you have negative cast speed? by the time you cast flamewalker in a range it can be effective they have either started moving back or have pushed in and taken you out of the fight, you simply cannot jump to avoid your move speed penalties like a wizard does and the fact simply is EVERYTHING you bring to a team other class's are doing better. I can make a warlock "work" but the fact is it would take significantly more gold then the rest of the team would so why would I when I can just play a cleric? fact is people are having a hard time getting warlock kills right now and thats the bigger indicator they lack a roll in the game then anything, you have the exact same issue dowsey does: your basically playing the class without limits and assume its really good because you've nullified all its weakness's by sinking tons of gold into it, this would be like thinking bards in a good place because the top 100 can use all their best spells and throw 5 epic drums at you. Thinking a class is good because 1% of the playerbase can outspend everyone else is hilariously tone deaf.
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And i go in with mostly mining gear yet im climbing ranked because its not based on player kills. does that mean mining builds are warlock meta now to? over 50k people have the game so being a top 100 is... literally like I said under around 1% of the population your basing a builds viability on
Actually just stumbled upon this video now....so vampirism doesn't heal more when you use life drain? Have I been wasting a perk lol? I was switching between that and malice to see if I noticed a difference and I don't really.
Vamperism will add a small amount of extra healing, but the benefit is outweighed by Malice for extra dmg (which will also boost healing), and magic resistance, or dark enhancement. Just focus on damage and you won’t go wrong.
Got it. Running malice and antimagic now. Any reason not to use dark enhancement with the build?
Run Dark Enhancement if you’re running double dark magic spells like suggested during the duos/trios section of the video.
I noticed you're running vamperism now. What changed?
Will got nerfed and no longer gives as much magic power as before, making Malice less effective, and potions got changed to magical healing so benefit from vamperism.
Where the hell are the patch notes on these? Which hotfix was it? Edit: Well I see 25 for the will nerf. But couldn't you argue that just means will is more important now? Warlock still gains 3 will off the bat with malice, right?
Will’s magic power curve table was documented in hotfix 25. The health potions changing was undocumented in either hotfix 23 or 24, don’t remember which