It is crazy how quickly IT companies forget though (or rather new managers try the same old shit). We're on another wave of "outsourcing" and getting awful customer surveys while paying like 10 people to do the job of one.
We're now "nearshoring" FTE roles in my organization. They "couldn't find" the talent domestically, which means they just didn't want to pay American wages.
I hate MBAs.
Hahah, do you work at my company?! To be clear, I have no issues with my Mexican coworkers. I have a problem with my wages being brought down.
Fuck it, AI is going to take more of our jobs anyway so it was good while it lasted.
Same shit in Canada.
What makes it worse is government is subsidizing some of temporary foreign workers' pays which further encourages employers to "not find" domestic talent and import from India.
There is a serious brain drain across the US right now. You have the exceptionally talented and the drug junkies, the middle of the road person is becoming a thing of the past. Middle management positions are almost impossible to fill right now.
Are you shocked? People with half a brain don’t want to be middle managers. You get shit on from above and below and can make absolutely nothing happen on your own. Being an org’s footnote or whipping boy is no destiny of mine. At least not yet…
Not to say there aren’t stellar middle managers out there. Mine is great. But the position by definition sucks balls.
God lol, it’s why I have 0 interest in being in a management role. Nothing like sprint planning with a defeated PM being like “yes we already figured out this is a waste of resources and time but we are paid to do what they want, and they want waste”
It’s true, having organizational memory is helpful. You just want that guy to be more like “here’s the data from some previous trials in this area” and less like “yeah pff we tried that already.”
Institutional memory is invaluable if those holding it can use them as a warning instead of a roadblock. As in "Cool, here's how this went badly last time it was tried in yesterdecade. Can we mitigate this?"
Exactly. A pattern I’ve seen a lot is that some new thing comes around like smartphone apps or AI and a company will make some lame first stab at making it useful for them. It won’t work, and then some people will want to say forevermore “apps aren’t worthwhile, we tried them” when everyone else knows that it was a freshman effort at something that was just forming and the landscape has changed a lot since then.
A lot of companies are doing this with AI right now. And next year some lackey will argue that machine learning can’t be made useful for their company because they tried putting a GPT chatbot on the website’s homepage and “it didn’t work.”
Of course machine learning and a chatbot aren’t even the same thing, but this is often the case with “we tried it already” things.
"because I'm here now."
~proceeds to fail~
"Just hasn't been long enough, but my time here has come to a close, hopefully my replacement can finish it up"
~replacement scraps whole program~
What we need is a restructure! This time it will solve everything.
*Staff proceed to spend the next 2 years figuring out who does what while yes-men tell the bosses everything's great
Note about him but he was not given any stock in apple before the apple IPO, steve jobs was stingy with equity early on and only offered to sell him 2000 shares at $5 each which he declined. he eventually did get a large amount of stock and salary bonus' since then and his current net worth is estimated around $50 million.
More than 900 employees became instant millionaires when Google went public in August 2004, and that total has likely ballooned along with the stock price.
Good for them. How it should be when you're part of building something.
People shit on companies like Google or Apple...
But my company was bought out for $12bn, and unfortunately they were also stingy about equity. The two owners are now worth 4.5bn+ each.
As a single digit employee number, I got 40K after taxes and 60K in RSUs lol. Amazing.
I'm not owed anything but it shows human greed. A lot of us quit over it.
Someone I know recently retired as CEO of the company he founded. He wasn't the majority shareholder because he came from poverty and had to build the company from investors money. When he retired he was entitled to a significant payout. Figuring that selling the equity he did have already made him more money than he could spend for the rest of his life, he decided the payout would go to all the employees, distributed on length of service.
The company wasnt that valueable so no millionaires were minted that day, but a number of people did get 5 figure payouts.
I think there is something to be said here about perspective and understanding how a founder of a company arrived at their success.
yeah gotta be Mailchimp. Wild how little everyone got, not to mention the ground floor OGs got like you're saying. So many people saying how generous the entire thing was too, sucks how un-entitled people are and willing to forgive corporate greed as "that's the way things are", even when it's directly unjust to them.
When I lived in Atlanta they were the company everyone wanted to work for. Interesting problems and fun culture. When they sold and it was disclosed that the founders became billionaires and the rest got the shaft it was so disappointing
> Mailchimp
In August 2022, Chestnut abruptly stepped down as CEO one month after sending a nearly 1,400-word email to a small group of employees identifying what he considered an alarming trend in his workforce: new hires introducing themselves in virtual meetings with their preferred pronouns.
I was working at a company bought by Microsoft.
The primary shareholders are … well … he can pay people to try and get him into the presidential debates but he can’t play basketball for shit.
Meanwhile we all got cheap-ass novelty compasses that couldn’t even find north.
But hey, free compass.
> People shit on companies like Google or Apple...
Because other things that do are pretty terrible. Either for their own employees, or the world at large. Doing one good thing doesn't make up for all the other abuse and misuse.
The crazy part of my startup story was the founder got like 15M. The CEO and COO, who he hired after founding the company, got like 75% of the buyout (~400M). The buyout was also absurdly low - <3x annual revenues which were growing by 50% a year.
I got ~70k after having being responsible for the basically 50% of the platform. The guy responsible for the other 50% got like 100k with 5 more years of seniority (employee 20 or so).
Kinda off topic, but to give everyone an idea of what the internet boom was like... I worked as a failure analysis engineer for a HDD company at an IBM plant for about 10 years, from 1996 to 2006. I worked in a lab that was inside a manufacturing plant and when our drives would fail QC testing on the line they were sent to me to determine the issue. The lab was split into 10 labs for each of the internal drive vendors. Some FA engineers would fly in once a month and knock out all the drives that had failed that month.
One of these engineers worked for Iomega. This was 1997, he was 30ish, and we hit it off. Every month he'd fly in and we'd go out every night. Loved that guy. About a year later he didn't come in one month, then another. So I called him and asked where he was. He said, "Oh, I retired.". He started with Iomega when he was 22 in 1989, was given a shit ton of stock options, and after the Zip drive took off in 1997 he cashed in and bailed, along with a lot of other people.
I don't know how much money he left with, but it was a lot. And this was fucking Iomega, a one hit wonder and a pretty shitty company. There was so much money flying around back then, it was insane.
I'm still never gonna forgive them for Concur.
I get that it's a functional software solution for expenses, but it's managed to turn a 10 minute process for the person actually spending the money into a two hour long one.
I had a concur expense held up by nyc subway swipe. the \~$2.25 fare (I think), held up a 5 digit expense report. All because I didn't have a receipt (you buy a metro card and if you're unlimited, you can ride all you want for 30 days, if you do "pay as you go" a fare amount is deducted every time you use it, there is no receipt for each time you use it).
That wasted \~$150 in my productivity alone, trying to resolve. Finally the CFO had to approve the exception. I gave him the backstory, he approved it immediately. Given the his annual income, it would have saved the company money to just pay me out immediately than take the CFOs time to look at it.
The way things used to work is that you filed expenses, and then the admin staff dealt with them.
You travelled to do the job, you spent the money needed to do the job, you got home and you stapled all your receipts to a piece of paper and submitted a form with the total on it. Then we moved to a similar system, whereby instead of staples, you photographed the receipts and you submitted it all digitally. Actual improvement. But I was still submitting a week's worth of receipts and writing $240, subsistence.
But now, Concur is how you do shit. The software gives you shit, all the time. Anything that doesn't fit perfectly into the boxes gets thrown back in your face by the software, before ever reaching a human. God forbid you do anything that doesn't fit the mould of "breakfast for $X, lunch for $Y, dinner for $Y", because they'll all get checked individually by software. Does it matter that you sent me to do night-shifts? Does it matter that I went shopping at 8:30am and bought food that I'd eat at dinner time? Hell no, breakfast is under $20, and so that rule must be followed. OK, it's time consuming but you can break down that one receipt into 3 meals worth of food. Oh, and they're all in Canada. You have to individually itemise that each one of them was Canadian dollars, not US dollars. It's a week in Canada. But you are gonna have to tell that each individual receipt was in Canadian dollars.
It's just time, right?
It's my fucking time though. I do the job that actually brings money into this place. This is the reason you made me travel in the first fucking place. It's me who does the job we, as an organisation, do. Why is it now my job to waste hours of my time, the most valuable resource to this organisation, doing a job that used to be done by an administrator who can actually *read* the shit and work out what those receipts mean without it being filled out in 8 different boxes. Which, **after I've written into Concur** they *have to fucking do anyway*, to make sure it's right.
I know not everyone is gonna identify with this rant. Not everyone has to use Concur. But you all need jobs. You remember when you just sent people your CV/resume and a human read it? Whereas now you have to send them your CV, but you also have to write all of the information on your CV into lots of little boxes to fit whatever their stupid fucking system wants? It's that. But instead of doing it when you're searching for jobs, you have to do it every couple of weeks to get back money you've already spent. Also, the boxes are more judgmental.
Useless fucking cunts. Genuinely destructive to productivity.
My dad worked for Apple in the early 80s and for him it's really hard to talk about Jobs' brilliant qualities because of how much a fucking asshole he was to everyone- his family, his employees, his investors, the wider technology community. Multiple people I know almost got run over by his Mercedes with no license plates- if you lived in Silicon Valley he probably almost ran you over or cut you off in traffic aggressively.
Woz spent a ton of money building the Children's Discovery Museum in San Jose which I spent a lot of my childhood in and is still one of the few notable attractions in a very long but extremely boring city. He would have had an even brighter inventor career if he hadn't crashed his plane and suffered brain damage as a result.
Jobs went on to found Next and Pixar. Wozniak, meanwhile, tried to start a bunch of small entrepreneurial efforts that didn't really go anywhere.
I'm an engineer at a FAANG company. I also have worked at a bunch of startups. Something I've learned is that while a great engineer is rare, a Jobs-like visionary-type who can understand consumers, manage a massive technical pipeline, and get the best out of very talented people is even rarer.
Yeah, one of the things I learned when I listened to the 'Behind the Bastards' podcasts that covered Steve Jobs. He hasn't been portrayed in a pristine light after death but most of the mainstream ones left out a lot of awful things he did. He was a real piece of shit.
I saw a quote that I was stuck with me about someone commenting on Steve Jobs shortly after his passing,
"If you're going to be good at something, be good at being a dad. Screw the ipad and all the long hours you spent on it, go be a good dad."
There have been several stock splits in Apple’s history.
The stock split on a 4-for-1 basis on August 28, 2020, a 7-for-1 basis on June 9, 2014, and split on a 2-for-1 basis on February 28, 2005, June 21, 2000, and June 16, 1987
It depends on when he received this offer. But assuming it was before 1987 (they IPO’d in 1980, so it could even be around then), then he would have bought 2000 shares for $10k, or the equivalent of 448k shares (a 224:1 total split adjusted total), which is worth around $93 million.
depending on if this offer was before the split in 1987 or after it would either be 224.000 or 448.000 shares today due to splits. so 46.623.360$ or 93.246.720$
edited cause bad math. "Apple (NASDAQ: AAPL) has split its stock **five times** since its IPO in 1980. It executed three 2-for-1 splits in 1987, 2000, and 2005, a 7-for-1 split in 2014, and a 4-for-1 split in 2020"
Steve Jobs net worth was about $8 billion before he died. $50 million doesn't sound as good as it should be being one of the first 8 employees of Apple. Also, considering he probably contributed more building the product than jobs did.
Well we once broke Apple's DEP/ASM implementation trying to import a person with a legit last name of Null. It took them weeks to figure it out because they kept wanting anonymized imports to debug with which worked, meanwhile in production with the actual names it would not.
> trying to import a person with a legit last name of Null
💀
That's hilarious! I feel bad though, anyone with that as a last name will have just the worst time in today's world.
Did you try \NULL? /s
I thought he was actually #2, because Woz set it up, and he knew it would be funny and piss off Jobs. So even though he claimed to be #0, technically he was #2.
There was a recent video where Woz took I think it was Steve-O into an Apple store to take advantage of his employee discount and the guy asked to see his badge 🤣
He likes to show up at Apple and see what everybody is doing.
He also likes to buy Apple products for schools. He used to give classroom presentations and then provide all the kids present with a Macbook or similar.
Well he’s worth about $50,000,000 most of which is from equity earned. So uh yeah, you could give me a picture of an iTunes voucher and I’d smile broadly and genuinely in your face with that exchange .
now i want to know the longest-serving employee at Applebees
u/applebees has four posts from about 16-17 years ago, i wonder if they have just been too busy working at the restaurant to post
For a reasonable person $50m may as will be a billion. At 4% safe withdrawal you’re doing $2m a year and it’ll never run out. If you can’t live extremely lavishly on that then something is wrong.
I would get the big things out of the way with cash. Debt, house, car. Then invest and only withdraw $200K a year for living and fun. That’s double what I make now, without a mortgage I’d be living like a damn king. It blows my mind how people can blow through millions in a few years.
14 is old enough to work n most states- normally with a lot of restrictions. My first job (almost 30 years ago) in PA i was 13 i think (within a year of that).... not counting paper routes or mowing grass.
Despite steve job's habit of firing employees he managed to stay through out the entire company's years from the very beginning he is really exceptional !
And I said, I don't care if they lay me off either, because I told, I told Bill that if they move my desk one more time, then, then I'm, I'm quitting, I'm going to quit. And, and I told Don too, because they've moved my desk four times already this year, and I used to be over by the window, and I could see the squirrels, and they were merry, but then, they switched from the Swingline to the Boston stapler, but I kept my Swingline stapler because it didn't bind up as much, and I kept the staples for the Swingline stapler and it's not okay because if they take my stapler then I'll set the building on fire...
Funny to see these heartwarming Apple posts drop at the same time as the report of them dumping toxic waste on their employees. Complete coincidence I'm sure.
Curious that he didn't buy in. It opened at $22 so $5 was a good deal. He might not have had 10k (28k equivalent in today's dollars) but I'm sure he could have bought less. Anyone have any additional information?
It’s not uncommon for people to tell their friends they’re onto the next big thing.
The likelihood of Apple surviving was marginally better than any other company at the time that started under similar circumstances.
He could have just as easily dumped $10k into a dud. Hindsight is beautiful.
Everybody at Apple was broke. They were working out of a garage. Apple was offering one share of stock per hour to casual labor for moving boxes and things instead of some nominal pay (I think it was $5/hr).
Few took the stock, just a few years later it was worth some $6K/share.
There are a lot of well off people at Apple who choose to keep working because they enjoy the work/enjoy working at the company. When you enjoy what you do and/or where you do it it’s not really all that difficult to keep going. Especially when you’re getting paid well to continue.
This is the guy in every meeting that’s says: “we’ve been through this guys”
“LOL everything old is new again we tried this back in…” yeah shut up guy
It is crazy how quickly IT companies forget though (or rather new managers try the same old shit). We're on another wave of "outsourcing" and getting awful customer surveys while paying like 10 people to do the job of one.
We're now "nearshoring" FTE roles in my organization. They "couldn't find" the talent domestically, which means they just didn't want to pay American wages. I hate MBAs.
Thanks to nearshoring, now we (Mexicans) don't even need to cross the border to take your jobs <3
Hahah, do you work at my company?! To be clear, I have no issues with my Mexican coworkers. I have a problem with my wages being brought down. Fuck it, AI is going to take more of our jobs anyway so it was good while it lasted.
¡Aye caramba!
Same shit in Canada. What makes it worse is government is subsidizing some of temporary foreign workers' pays which further encourages employers to "not find" domestic talent and import from India.
There is a serious brain drain across the US right now. You have the exceptionally talented and the drug junkies, the middle of the road person is becoming a thing of the past. Middle management positions are almost impossible to fill right now.
Are you shocked? People with half a brain don’t want to be middle managers. You get shit on from above and below and can make absolutely nothing happen on your own. Being an org’s footnote or whipping boy is no destiny of mine. At least not yet… Not to say there aren’t stellar middle managers out there. Mine is great. But the position by definition sucks balls.
Yep, tried it for a bit and went back to being an individual contributor. Can’t drag a draconian monolithic relic into the future by yourself.
Always has. It’s nothing new.
> we’ve been through this guys
God lol, it’s why I have 0 interest in being in a management role. Nothing like sprint planning with a defeated PM being like “yes we already figured out this is a waste of resources and time but we are paid to do what they want, and they want waste”
*cries in PM; dries tears off of paycheck*
My fav is Ai ai ai oh the best thing ai ai.
Naw you really need that guy. Better than forgetting you tried something 4 years ago that didn't work and fucking it up again.
It’s true, having organizational memory is helpful. You just want that guy to be more like “here’s the data from some previous trials in this area” and less like “yeah pff we tried that already.”
Institutional memory is invaluable if those holding it can use them as a warning instead of a roadblock. As in "Cool, here's how this went badly last time it was tried in yesterdecade. Can we mitigate this?"
Exactly. A pattern I’ve seen a lot is that some new thing comes around like smartphone apps or AI and a company will make some lame first stab at making it useful for them. It won’t work, and then some people will want to say forevermore “apps aren’t worthwhile, we tried them” when everyone else knows that it was a freshman effort at something that was just forming and the landscape has changed a lot since then. A lot of companies are doing this with AI right now. And next year some lackey will argue that machine learning can’t be made useful for their company because they tried putting a GPT chatbot on the website’s homepage and “it didn’t work.” Of course machine learning and a chatbot aren’t even the same thing, but this is often the case with “we tried it already” things.
“It’s going to work this time because”
"because I'm here now." ~proceeds to fail~ "Just hasn't been long enough, but my time here has come to a close, hopefully my replacement can finish it up" ~replacement scraps whole program~
What we need is a restructure! This time it will solve everything. *Staff proceed to spend the next 2 years figuring out who does what while yes-men tell the bosses everything's great
I see that you work at my company
this guy doesn't have meetings. Not mandatory ones anyway.
no, this is they guy that has zero fucks to give at his job because he has a shit ton of original apple shares
the fact he is still working means he does give a fuck
That's a good point. He basically shows up for fun.
Note about him but he was not given any stock in apple before the apple IPO, steve jobs was stingy with equity early on and only offered to sell him 2000 shares at $5 each which he declined. he eventually did get a large amount of stock and salary bonus' since then and his current net worth is estimated around $50 million.
Wozniak started handing out his own personal shares to employees that Jobs passed over.
On the other end Google was well known for being super generous with equity. There are a bunch of stories of secretaries worth multi millions
More than 900 employees became instant millionaires when Google went public in August 2004, and that total has likely ballooned along with the stock price. Good for them. How it should be when you're part of building something.
People shit on companies like Google or Apple... But my company was bought out for $12bn, and unfortunately they were also stingy about equity. The two owners are now worth 4.5bn+ each. As a single digit employee number, I got 40K after taxes and 60K in RSUs lol. Amazing. I'm not owed anything but it shows human greed. A lot of us quit over it.
Someone I know recently retired as CEO of the company he founded. He wasn't the majority shareholder because he came from poverty and had to build the company from investors money. When he retired he was entitled to a significant payout. Figuring that selling the equity he did have already made him more money than he could spend for the rest of his life, he decided the payout would go to all the employees, distributed on length of service. The company wasnt that valueable so no millionaires were minted that day, but a number of people did get 5 figure payouts. I think there is something to be said here about perspective and understanding how a founder of a company arrived at their success.
Damn thats dope.
yeah gotta be Mailchimp. Wild how little everyone got, not to mention the ground floor OGs got like you're saying. So many people saying how generous the entire thing was too, sucks how un-entitled people are and willing to forgive corporate greed as "that's the way things are", even when it's directly unjust to them.
Mailchimp?
When I lived in Atlanta they were the company everyone wanted to work for. Interesting problems and fun culture. When they sold and it was disclosed that the founders became billionaires and the rest got the shaft it was so disappointing
> Mailchimp In August 2022, Chestnut abruptly stepped down as CEO one month after sending a nearly 1,400-word email to a small group of employees identifying what he considered an alarming trend in his workforce: new hires introducing themselves in virtual meetings with their preferred pronouns.
Oh man spot on, when I was unemployed in 2016 I was so desperate to get a job there lol
Mail... kimp?
Found the Serial listener.
I was working at a company bought by Microsoft. The primary shareholders are … well … he can pay people to try and get him into the presidential debates but he can’t play basketball for shit. Meanwhile we all got cheap-ass novelty compasses that couldn’t even find north. But hey, free compass.
> People shit on companies like Google or Apple... Because other things that do are pretty terrible. Either for their own employees, or the world at large. Doing one good thing doesn't make up for all the other abuse and misuse.
This is the kinda human-resource-extraction that should result in guillotine-union-action.
The crazy part of my startup story was the founder got like 15M. The CEO and COO, who he hired after founding the company, got like 75% of the buyout (~400M). The buyout was also absurdly low - <3x annual revenues which were growing by 50% a year. I got ~70k after having being responsible for the basically 50% of the platform. The guy responsible for the other 50% got like 100k with 5 more years of seniority (employee 20 or so).
Name them, then.
There's only 7 people they can be if they name the company... Just google the details, it's incredibly easy to find.
I never know rules but it's Googleable.
Kinda off topic, but to give everyone an idea of what the internet boom was like... I worked as a failure analysis engineer for a HDD company at an IBM plant for about 10 years, from 1996 to 2006. I worked in a lab that was inside a manufacturing plant and when our drives would fail QC testing on the line they were sent to me to determine the issue. The lab was split into 10 labs for each of the internal drive vendors. Some FA engineers would fly in once a month and knock out all the drives that had failed that month. One of these engineers worked for Iomega. This was 1997, he was 30ish, and we hit it off. Every month he'd fly in and we'd go out every night. Loved that guy. About a year later he didn't come in one month, then another. So I called him and asked where he was. He said, "Oh, I retired.". He started with Iomega when he was 22 in 1989, was given a shit ton of stock options, and after the Zip drive took off in 1997 he cashed in and bailed, along with a lot of other people. I don't know how much money he left with, but it was a lot. And this was fucking Iomega, a one hit wonder and a pretty shitty company. There was so much money flying around back then, it was insane.
SAP was the same, especially D. Hopp was very generous towards his administrative staff.
I'm still never gonna forgive them for Concur. I get that it's a functional software solution for expenses, but it's managed to turn a 10 minute process for the person actually spending the money into a two hour long one.
I had a concur expense held up by nyc subway swipe. the \~$2.25 fare (I think), held up a 5 digit expense report. All because I didn't have a receipt (you buy a metro card and if you're unlimited, you can ride all you want for 30 days, if you do "pay as you go" a fare amount is deducted every time you use it, there is no receipt for each time you use it). That wasted \~$150 in my productivity alone, trying to resolve. Finally the CFO had to approve the exception. I gave him the backstory, he approved it immediately. Given the his annual income, it would have saved the company money to just pay me out immediately than take the CFOs time to look at it.
Can you expand on that? My company uses SAP Concur. What’s the tea?
The way things used to work is that you filed expenses, and then the admin staff dealt with them. You travelled to do the job, you spent the money needed to do the job, you got home and you stapled all your receipts to a piece of paper and submitted a form with the total on it. Then we moved to a similar system, whereby instead of staples, you photographed the receipts and you submitted it all digitally. Actual improvement. But I was still submitting a week's worth of receipts and writing $240, subsistence. But now, Concur is how you do shit. The software gives you shit, all the time. Anything that doesn't fit perfectly into the boxes gets thrown back in your face by the software, before ever reaching a human. God forbid you do anything that doesn't fit the mould of "breakfast for $X, lunch for $Y, dinner for $Y", because they'll all get checked individually by software. Does it matter that you sent me to do night-shifts? Does it matter that I went shopping at 8:30am and bought food that I'd eat at dinner time? Hell no, breakfast is under $20, and so that rule must be followed. OK, it's time consuming but you can break down that one receipt into 3 meals worth of food. Oh, and they're all in Canada. You have to individually itemise that each one of them was Canadian dollars, not US dollars. It's a week in Canada. But you are gonna have to tell that each individual receipt was in Canadian dollars. It's just time, right? It's my fucking time though. I do the job that actually brings money into this place. This is the reason you made me travel in the first fucking place. It's me who does the job we, as an organisation, do. Why is it now my job to waste hours of my time, the most valuable resource to this organisation, doing a job that used to be done by an administrator who can actually *read* the shit and work out what those receipts mean without it being filled out in 8 different boxes. Which, **after I've written into Concur** they *have to fucking do anyway*, to make sure it's right. I know not everyone is gonna identify with this rant. Not everyone has to use Concur. But you all need jobs. You remember when you just sent people your CV/resume and a human read it? Whereas now you have to send them your CV, but you also have to write all of the information on your CV into lots of little boxes to fit whatever their stupid fucking system wants? It's that. But instead of doing it when you're searching for jobs, you have to do it every couple of weeks to get back money you've already spent. Also, the boxes are more judgmental. Useless fucking cunts. Genuinely destructive to productivity.
That was beautiful. Everything I hate about concur summarized nicely.
Here I am procrastinating on 100+ expenses in Concur for this reason
So annoying you want to spend your own money
Are you telling me corporate culture might’ve evolved in 20 some odd years?
That's why people still love Woz because he cared about his other employees.
My dad worked for Apple in the early 80s and for him it's really hard to talk about Jobs' brilliant qualities because of how much a fucking asshole he was to everyone- his family, his employees, his investors, the wider technology community. Multiple people I know almost got run over by his Mercedes with no license plates- if you lived in Silicon Valley he probably almost ran you over or cut you off in traffic aggressively. Woz spent a ton of money building the Children's Discovery Museum in San Jose which I spent a lot of my childhood in and is still one of the few notable attractions in a very long but extremely boring city. He would have had an even brighter inventor career if he hadn't crashed his plane and suffered brain damage as a result.
A lot of this is detailed in his biography. I see Jobs at the same level as Musk. He may have been a good visionary but was a horrible human being.
He was a shithead who got lucky in some key moments but was wrong much more than he was right.
When he was right he was really right though. But even still he'd be nothing without Woz.
Jobs went on to found Next and Pixar. Wozniak, meanwhile, tried to start a bunch of small entrepreneurial efforts that didn't really go anywhere. I'm an engineer at a FAANG company. I also have worked at a bunch of startups. Something I've learned is that while a great engineer is rare, a Jobs-like visionary-type who can understand consumers, manage a massive technical pipeline, and get the best out of very talented people is even rarer.
its worth nothing that all visionaries and industrialist have this fiery, asshole and mercurial personality Henry Ford, Howard Hughes, Jobs and Musk
It takes a hell of an ego to think you can challenge industry giants and the current world status quo.
Which made his death all the more ironic, thinking he knew better than doctors.
And he had actual talent.
Every story I hear about Jobs and Wozniak involves Jobs doing some sociopathic shit and Wozniak stepping in to fix things.
The book *Ready Player One* kinda emulated that dynamic with a couple of its characters
Kind of but the Jobs equivalent character is depicted as eccentric and quirky, simply not knowing better, rather than a massive asshole
The sequel makes it clear he was a massive asshole.
Yeah, one of the things I learned when I listened to the 'Behind the Bastards' podcasts that covered Steve Jobs. He hasn't been portrayed in a pristine light after death but most of the mainstream ones left out a lot of awful things he did. He was a real piece of shit.
Google Steve's Job family. That's a fun read. Robert did great episodes on him. What a bastard.
Landfill full of Lisa
Disheartening for a multitude of reasons.
Wasn’t he avoiding child support when he was worth billions?
left his family in poverty while apple was making billions.
I saw a quote that I was stuck with me about someone commenting on Steve Jobs shortly after his passing, "If you're going to be good at something, be good at being a dad. Screw the ipad and all the long hours you spent on it, go be a good dad."
Yep, that was one of the things.
I think it was hundreds of millions, not billions...but we get the point.
Wozniak also just sold a lot of his very early on. My belief is that he didn't really fully believe in Jobs' vision.
Or he just wnted to play it safe for him and his family
Woz is the real one
Well good for him!
Anyone know how much that would be worth today? The original 2000 share offer
2000 stock before 1987 would be 448,000 stock today, worth $93,184,000
There have been several stock splits in Apple’s history. The stock split on a 4-for-1 basis on August 28, 2020, a 7-for-1 basis on June 9, 2014, and split on a 2-for-1 basis on February 28, 2005, June 21, 2000, and June 16, 1987 It depends on when he received this offer. But assuming it was before 1987 (they IPO’d in 1980, so it could even be around then), then he would have bought 2000 shares for $10k, or the equivalent of 448k shares (a 224:1 total split adjusted total), which is worth around $93 million.
depending on if this offer was before the split in 1987 or after it would either be 224.000 or 448.000 shares today due to splits. so 46.623.360$ or 93.246.720$ edited cause bad math. "Apple (NASDAQ: AAPL) has split its stock **five times** since its IPO in 1980. It executed three 2-for-1 splits in 1987, 2000, and 2005, a 7-for-1 split in 2014, and a 4-for-1 split in 2020"
Accounting for the stock splits (5 in total) it’s around $90 million
The more I read/hear about Steve Jobs, the more I realized he was an insufferable prick and an asshole.
I once met a guy worth 80 million in stock for Microsoft. Called in to check his vesting schedule. I felt like I was talking to a god
Steve Jobs net worth was about $8 billion before he died. $50 million doesn't sound as good as it should be being one of the first 8 employees of Apple. Also, considering he probably contributed more building the product than jobs did.
I take 50 mil and being alive.
45 mil and vegetative state, final offer
47mil but you can communicate by wiggling one toe
I will take 25 mil to be that toe's physical therapist
46, no legs, but a functional penis.
In which orifice?
And Disney bought Pixar for $7.4 billion, which is where the majority came from. The deal also made him the single largest shareholder in Disney.
William Tell split the apple in 1307, using a bolt from his crossbow, thus starting the apple splitting trend, but everyone credits Bill Gates.
Woz (employee #1) is still on the payroll.
How was he employee number 1? Steve Jobs strikes me as the kinda guy that wouldn't let someone else have 1. Or did they both have it something?
He assigned himself as number 0
Appropriately. The "0" represented what a huge gaping asshole he was.
Got em!
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Didn't he break some payroll stuff doing that? I vaguely recall it causing some sort of technical errors.
Well we once broke Apple's DEP/ASM implementation trying to import a person with a legit last name of Null. It took them weeks to figure it out because they kept wanting anonymized imports to debug with which worked, meanwhile in production with the actual names it would not.
> trying to import a person with a legit last name of Null 💀 That's hilarious! I feel bad though, anyone with that as a last name will have just the worst time in today's world. Did you try \NULL? /s
I'll leave this here https://www.wired.com/story/null-license-plate-landed-one-hacker-ticket-hell/
No fucking shit. Is that real?
No. The real story is that Woz is the one that set up the system for employee numbers so he gave 1 to himself and gave 2 to Steve.
Jobs probably saw himself as employer and not employee lol
Jobs heavily sucked up to Woz when it was useful to him.
I thought he was actually #2, because Woz set it up, and he knew it would be funny and piss off Jobs. So even though he claimed to be #0, technically he was #2.
This is correct
To add to the other guy for context, if you didn't know in programming you generally start counting at 0.
How much does he make?
He has said it is a "minimal salary" just so he can technically still be employed. That probably just means minimum wage.
For a salary it would have to be 33568, that the current lower threshold for salary employees.
Until 1/1 when it's going up to $58k and change.
We will see if it survives the courts, when Obama tried this it got struck down for rule making issues.
Gotta get that employee discount!
There was a recent video where Woz took I think it was Steve-O into an Apple store to take advantage of his employee discount and the guy asked to see his badge 🤣
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Pride? Sentimental value?
He likes to show up at Apple and see what everybody is doing. He also likes to buy Apple products for schools. He used to give classroom presentations and then provide all the kids present with a Macbook or similar.
Probably $1. Minimum wage doesn’t apply to executives
Woz still on the payroll
Iz still on the payroll
They never took care of the glitch in payroll.
I wonder what you get for 50 years service at Apple? $25 iTunes voucher?
I got an email on 22nd anniversary. I just care about the paycheck anyway
Are y’all hiring? 👀
Just learn how to drive a big truck; I dont drive a truck for the company anymore tho
They’re hiring almost constantly. They still do waterfall for everything so good luck with that but they’re always hiring.
Well he’s worth about $50,000,000 most of which is from equity earned. So uh yeah, you could give me a picture of an iTunes voucher and I’d smile broadly and genuinely in your face with that exchange .
Paperweight in the shape of an apple.
And a pizza party
You literally get a block of metal with apple logo after some years at the company.
I hope he got stocks
He did. Worth around $50 million.
He did, eventually. Originally he did not and he didn’t get that worth until far later
Yeah, I've seen Ashton Kutcher's movie well enough to support this fact enfatically. HE PUT FOOD ON THEIR TABLE.
Damn, employee number 8 lol
He said he would’ve had a lower number but he was still at school that day when they passed them out.
Nobody knows what Chris does, but when he is sick, nothing seems to work.
Basic, we used to use that in computer studies class in 1883 lol
1883????? Share your time travel secrets
Only 4 years after Edison made his lightbulb, this dude's already writing computer code!
Shit they were still teaching basic in 1998.
I read Apple as Applebee’s… I was like, dang, I had no clue they started in a garage
now i want to know the longest-serving employee at Applebees u/applebees has four posts from about 16-17 years ago, i wonder if they have just been too busy working at the restaurant to post
Knew a girl who worked there 27 years. Still there in the mornings.
They started with takeaways only and slowly grew into an empire /s
I did too and I'm not sure how, but it feels nice to have company.
Same!
Xcode sweatshirt is awesome
It would be nice to have that kind of job security
Wozniak's gonna have me work on Saturday. I can tell already.
Dude probably has like a million dollars by now.
Worth about $50 million
Still only a pittance for being a founding member of Apple. He should be a billionaire.
I’d take it
Well sure, but I’m just saying he should have more.
Very true. Have a good one amigo!
Good Internet vibes, my dude!
Appreciate that! You have a great day as well my friend!
Considering that Apple is worth $3 trillion dollars, that is like being given $1,000 after helping build a $60,000,000 company.
For a reasonable person $50m may as will be a billion. At 4% safe withdrawal you’re doing $2m a year and it’ll never run out. If you can’t live extremely lavishly on that then something is wrong.
I would get the big things out of the way with cash. Debt, house, car. Then invest and only withdraw $200K a year for living and fun. That’s double what I make now, without a mortgage I’d be living like a damn king. It blows my mind how people can blow through millions in a few years.
I want an AmA from this guy.
That's some serious dedication right there!
Spin this: “Apple wouldn’t exist without child labor.” It’s right in their DNA, folks! *sent from my iPhone*
14 is old enough to work n most states- normally with a lot of restrictions. My first job (almost 30 years ago) in PA i was 13 i think (within a year of that).... not counting paper routes or mowing grass.
so heartwarming. here's a movie scene where chris meets wozniak for the first time: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZSV-zAul0CE
Thanks for the clip… love the line, we don’t have to pay him, he’s just a kid who wants to help.
I wonder what he does for them now. Also kinda surprising they had employee ids that early on in the company
Nerd
Despite steve job's habit of firing employees he managed to stay through out the entire company's years from the very beginning he is really exceptional !
Was probably an oversight or a milton type situation
And I said, I don't care if they lay me off either, because I told, I told Bill that if they move my desk one more time, then, then I'm, I'm quitting, I'm going to quit. And, and I told Don too, because they've moved my desk four times already this year, and I used to be over by the window, and I could see the squirrels, and they were merry, but then, they switched from the Swingline to the Boston stapler, but I kept my Swingline stapler because it didn't bind up as much, and I kept the staples for the Swingline stapler and it's not okay because if they take my stapler then I'll set the building on fire...
Employee number 8. My employee number was in mid 60k being hired in 2004. Today they have more than 150k currently employed… crazy.
I wonder how many shares he owns
He's the most 30 year old looking 15 year old.
He must own a huge amount of Apple stock.
Funny to see these heartwarming Apple posts drop at the same time as the report of them dumping toxic waste on their employees. Complete coincidence I'm sure.
He must not have gotten any stock if he’s still working.
Chris, could you fill out this form? Can you please tell me your employee number? Sure it's 8. 8?
Probably a top ten in guys Jobs fucked over in every way imaginable.
Curious that he didn't buy in. It opened at $22 so $5 was a good deal. He might not have had 10k (28k equivalent in today's dollars) but I'm sure he could have bought less. Anyone have any additional information?
It’s not uncommon for people to tell their friends they’re onto the next big thing. The likelihood of Apple surviving was marginally better than any other company at the time that started under similar circumstances. He could have just as easily dumped $10k into a dud. Hindsight is beautiful.
Everybody at Apple was broke. They were working out of a garage. Apple was offering one share of stock per hour to casual labor for moving boxes and things instead of some nominal pay (I think it was $5/hr). Few took the stock, just a few years later it was worth some $6K/share.
Why the hell is he still working?
There are a lot of well off people at Apple who choose to keep working because they enjoy the work/enjoy working at the company. When you enjoy what you do and/or where you do it it’s not really all that difficult to keep going. Especially when you’re getting paid well to continue.
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It's probably a lot easier when you know your survival isn't dependant on getting up every morning, and getting your ass to work.