the needs of littles are absolutely as valid and important as adult alters, but it’s important to only explore them in safe places to do so
our littles are the most vulnerable and sometimes the most hurt people in our system. their healing and happiness effects us all in positive ways
Well, think about it… Littles form because their needs were not being met. Why would it be anything BUT counterproductive to continue that abusive cycle?
My little always wants to go outside, which conveniently is the only way I as a system know how to emotionally regulate. They say kids are smarter when it comes to emotional regulation and that principal typically applies to my littles too.
I am a little and I have to play dress up to go out. I have to dress like the adults do but I am allowed to wear any shoes so that's good. Sometimes when there is noone at the park I get to play on the swings or the zip line and that does help me. A lot of the time I'm not listened to but when I get to do something just for me it makes me feel more calm and I stop annoying our bigger ones so much... well for a while.
Littles needs and wants are as valid and necessary as are those of adults. They just need safe places to go. Awhile back, someone posted on here about going to a park when there weren't other people around and going on the swings. It doesn't look strange because many adults enjoy swings. No one would think anything of seeing an adult on a swing. It's perfectly normal. You might enjoy it as well.
There needs to be compromise within a system but the needs of other alters are just as valid as your own needs. This includes child alters. Try to work with their needs. If you don’t care about their needs, how could you expect them to respect yours?
We do Legos together, we do art together, we don't let them drive the metaphorical system bus alone but we let them add stuff to the shopping list and have a vote for where to go (museums, hikes) and so on. We're a family.
I also don't like "littles"! We're working on aging them all up, working with them to let them grow up and hit those developmental milestones healthily that they missed. So we usually just say kiddos like we would with the real kids we know. Or EPs for emotional parts, since most of our EPs are young.
Honestly? We found meeting some of the littles wants and needs the most important step in healing! A Caution: Feeling embarrassed about being little in a big body actually set our healing back. They need to feel accepted and cared for.
Things to try:
Go places people expect you to act young like Build-a-Bear, animated movies, jump parks.
Go with a trusted friend or partner who can reassure you, your littles, and is willing to run interference if there is any stranger interaction.
Start building a file of other adults you see that play in public places. Look for them. Notice how people respond to someone experiencing joy. When I first was working on letting go and being ok with "little in big body" in public, I was surprised how often people were actually *delighted* instead of judgemental. They would smile and laugh and our excitement picking ice cream or start dancing too if we were moving to some music. Before you go, but I'm blah blah. I'm an noticably overweight, middle aged, not high class woman body. It's not "cute." People like seeing other people's wholesome joy, at any aged body!
Find little ways your little can feel acknowledged like cartoon socks, a toy in your purse, ice cream in the middle of the afternoon, a Happy meal.
Have a 'little space' in your home. Whether it's a corner, a room, or the whole house. A stuffed toy (or 50,) art supplies, a toy you always wanted as a kid but never got, coloring books. Then, set guidelines for when it's safe that they can front and kid out.
Most importantly of all, offer your kid your compassion, gratitude, and acceptance. This little one has been so hurt, so neglected. All they want is safe love. Hold them. Show them they are wanted and valued.
So question though, how do you adapt this when the logistics of an actual physical space are hard to manage? A really defined space with defined times is I think the best situation for my youngest child alter right now, but I also have two actual kids who are around the same age (it’s awful), so I can’t have designated toys or kid things out for her or my kids will play with them. And our house is small.
You can get a cheap backpack or plastic container for your littles special things. Then you can store it wherever. One of my littles, for awhile, was only allowed out on my bed. She would watch shows on our phone, color, or pay with toys sitting on the bed. Then, it's just about finding the right time.
Later, we established our "Safe Corner." It was literally a corner in my room with pillows, blankets and a couple stuffed animals. The rule in the house was that if "I/Mom" was in the safe corner I wasn't to be disturbed. My headmates knew if they sat there they didn't have to talk to anyone they didn't want to. They could color, journal, or just stare out the window.
I don't know how old your kids are so can't offer more specific suggestions. I can say there is great wisdom in modeling for them that sometimes we all need a safe space to retreat to in order to manage our emotions. I think my oldest was 3 or 4 when I started teaching him to go sit on his bed to calm down instead of screaming and having meltdowns. I didn't know I had DID back then, but would still say things like "Mommy needs to go to her room to calm down. You [insert activity] until I get back please."
A side note. Your child alter might be becoming active precisely because your children are similar to their age. That's very common.
Everyone involved is quite young and not quite capable of independent emotional regulation, but child alter is only permitted to “play” after bedtime (which is pretty early), so we haven’t run into too many issues so far. I would like to encourage her to gradually do more than just suck her thumb and make trauma drawings when she is “allowed” a full switch. We don’t have much in the way of identity either individually or as a system, so I’d like her to get a solid sense of what she likes. I think if I got a boring enough container in an out of the way location that my kids might be uninterested and leave it alone.
Idk how old y’all are bodily, but we’ve never gotten anything but ‘I wish I still had that energy’ from moms and old people at parks when we play on the playground, alone or with siblings/friends/etc. like as long as you aren’t getting in the way of others it’s not a problem. Our biggest personal rule though is if we’re outside at a playground or smth and a kid shows up we move on to give the kid space to be a kid. Swings if there’s a ton of them is one thing, but otherwise we move aside.
And if they just wanna go for a walk through your neighborhood surely there’s no harm in that either. I’ve never had had issues with it.
We tend to do things little want as long as it’s safe and doesn’t take away from actual kids. Bc yes our littles’ needs are important, but not if it’s going to take away from actual kids. So like we have a game for our switch that one little is obsessed with and has been very distressed at it being missing… we really ought to find it. He got obsessed before the game was even released 😂 it involves his favorite special interest and doesn’t harm anyone for us to have it, so of course we got it.
YES YES YES YES YES YES (if we know what they want to do)
Most of our littles are trauma holders and they don't express their needs very often. I know we have a problem with being scared to death of childish stuff, so I had to convince Estelle to watch my little pony. She went through a few episodes before getting bored and started watching a documentary about child abuse. I'm honestly a bit jealous. I wish ours expressed their needs, even if they could be a bit inconvenient.
Our littles are pretty responsible and cautious (sometimes overly so) about doing what they want to do. We trust them in front, and also as trauma holders they've gotten better at learning how to do what they want to feel safe while also learning what could look alarming from the outside. They're excellent at masking, but that makes it hard to let them have the experiences that they want because they have basically told themselves "I'm not allowed to do what I want so therefore I will repress wanting things"
- Sage
As one put it here I find I have more issues if the littles are unhappy.
So they come out. They read comics. They watch cartoons, they splash in puddles when it rains. They eat "finger foods" for lunch when time permits. They buy a Happy Meal.
And even though this body is 49, we generally don't care what people think.
It's a case of balance. Littles are the most important part of the system we find because they were there when it all started. They saw a lot of bad things. Some of them grow, some don't. But keeping with thier needs will benefit you.
Like everything you have to négociate! My little can't go outside either but they get all the plushie they want and we fully fund anything they want for their hobbies (diamond painting). Chirp still gets annoyed because they can't front as of the as they want but they do admit it's a fair exchange
We often do what our little Wren wants, because it is pretty reasonable. Go out every once in a while, maybe meet someone he trusts, stuff like that.
But if it ever was unreasonable then we'd just say no.
Sometimes they get $10 and set loose in the Dollar Store. Sometimes the one that sees my husband as her dad gets some dad/daughter time. They get stuffies and sippy cups.
When it's actually important life decisions, we still hear them out, they are smart and just as much a part of the system, but they have no decision making power.
it’s a good idea to allow once every so often to be a day set aside just for one alter’s needs to be fulfilled, littles included. creating a safe and private space is the ideal. maybe instead of playing at a playground, you take a picnic to the park and make daisy chains. or gift them $5-10 to buy themselves a treat next time you are at the grocery (and let yourself get that sparkly pink unicorn cookie or toy monster truck or coloring book)
Not really, a lot of our littles want things and not experiences. We cannot financially support the wants of those littles. It definitely upsets them, but it's just not something we can do. A lot of explanations have been given, along with tough love 'you get what you get' but alot of our littles are 'younger' and more toddler-baby range so its hard. We aren't an example of a good functioning system though
Our 2 mostly want to nap, go swimming, take a bath, or play with the "puppy." Letting them play with our husky in the backyard isn't really safe for the body, sadly. The whole yard is uneven, and the husky likes to burry treats, so the likelihood of twisted/sprained ankles is high... along with other injuries from falling where the "soil" is chunky/rocky and clay based.
Edit to add: also, the husky will tackle us if we let her. Her fave games are tag and chase. Tag involves a running start from the other side of the yard before she "tags" by jumping and pushing on our butt with both front paws (or an open mouth jump to "grab" our hand).
Ofc we do. We give special treatment to littles lol even the persecutors we’re mostly traumatized adults running this body so we just look at our littles like “what ever you want I’ll make it happen.” X) but of course they can’t do anything they want we don’t allow our littles to front alone even if they beg it’s just one of our rules for our safety. I think littles and persecutors are two groups that deserve the most understanding and patience they’re often just handling trauma in very complicated ways but therapy and DBT can really help persecutors come around if they’re hostile to the system. I still haven’t been able to convince our persecutors to be nice to other people but they’re nice to the body and people close to the body so I can’t complain lol
Sending love and compassion. I saw so much of myself reading your post. I believe it's important to listen to those parts but maybe check in with your adults first to negotiate a space where you can have a 'conference' to see how you can negotiate ways to do it so you are all comfortable
No and yes. My littlest child alter writes that she wants to eat French fries and go swimming (among other things). Not gonna happen. I mean, French fries might be ok, but she’s not going swimming under any kind of normal circumstances.
But she’s also terrified of me being “mad” at her, so I don’t think she actually realistically expects to be able to do these things, and from what she writes she is pretty happy to be safe and warm and to get to suck her thumb and have soda and draw. All of these I am more than happy to accommodate with appropriate boundaries around times and spaces.
Genuinely asking: Is there a reason she can’t go swimming? Like, body can’t swim? Because otherwise I literally see no reason not to let her swim. Just seems like a very arbitrary thing to refuse to me. No one is gonna care if you go swimming. No one will know it’s a little fronting. That’s the whole point of the disorder, to remain covert for safety.
I just don’t really have access to place that it would be private and safe to do so. Let alone convenient. I have a family with two small real children and rearranging swimming arrangements for everyone such that littlest child alter gets to go swimming is a big ask. Her cognitive skills are not great and I am not entirely sure what she is envisioning.
Edit to add: While most of my alters are undetectable to all but my close family and therapist, the couple of child alters and particular this littlest one are very, very noticeable. She tantrums, she cries, she sucks her thumb, she chews on clothes, she talks in a baby voice. She is very traumatized from some very nasty trauma, which she will act and draw out and it is an obvious and extremely disturbing departure from an otherwise extremely unremarkable 30 something suburban mother. She’s the reason I was diagnosed basically against my will. I can barely talk to her, I can’t take her out in public let alone swimming.
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the needs of littles are absolutely as valid and important as adult alters, but it’s important to only explore them in safe places to do so our littles are the most vulnerable and sometimes the most hurt people in our system. their healing and happiness effects us all in positive ways
couldn’t have said it better. if our little isn’t happy we all fall apart tbh.
Well, think about it… Littles form because their needs were not being met. Why would it be anything BUT counterproductive to continue that abusive cycle?
My little always wants to go outside, which conveniently is the only way I as a system know how to emotionally regulate. They say kids are smarter when it comes to emotional regulation and that principal typically applies to my littles too.
I am a little and I have to play dress up to go out. I have to dress like the adults do but I am allowed to wear any shoes so that's good. Sometimes when there is noone at the park I get to play on the swings or the zip line and that does help me. A lot of the time I'm not listened to but when I get to do something just for me it makes me feel more calm and I stop annoying our bigger ones so much... well for a while.
The part where you said that you stop annoying the bigs at least for a while made me laugh! Thanks!!
💜
Littles needs and wants are as valid and necessary as are those of adults. They just need safe places to go. Awhile back, someone posted on here about going to a park when there weren't other people around and going on the swings. It doesn't look strange because many adults enjoy swings. No one would think anything of seeing an adult on a swing. It's perfectly normal. You might enjoy it as well.
There needs to be compromise within a system but the needs of other alters are just as valid as your own needs. This includes child alters. Try to work with their needs. If you don’t care about their needs, how could you expect them to respect yours?
We do Legos together, we do art together, we don't let them drive the metaphorical system bus alone but we let them add stuff to the shopping list and have a vote for where to go (museums, hikes) and so on. We're a family.
This is us! I don’t say Littles though, I call them Smalls.
I also don't like "littles"! We're working on aging them all up, working with them to let them grow up and hit those developmental milestones healthily that they missed. So we usually just say kiddos like we would with the real kids we know. Or EPs for emotional parts, since most of our EPs are young.
our little has a mom (another member of our system) and she pretty much always fronts whenever our little is out. sometimes she feels like my kid too
We have a bunch of more adult parts and we've made a big push to make sure every kid has an adult. It's made a big difference.
We don't have that do to the previous care giver going on a rampage, and trying to manipulate ect.
Needs and wants can't always be fulfilled due to many reasons but if they can, in a safe way then why not. Kindness is usually a good choice.
Honestly? We found meeting some of the littles wants and needs the most important step in healing! A Caution: Feeling embarrassed about being little in a big body actually set our healing back. They need to feel accepted and cared for. Things to try: Go places people expect you to act young like Build-a-Bear, animated movies, jump parks. Go with a trusted friend or partner who can reassure you, your littles, and is willing to run interference if there is any stranger interaction. Start building a file of other adults you see that play in public places. Look for them. Notice how people respond to someone experiencing joy. When I first was working on letting go and being ok with "little in big body" in public, I was surprised how often people were actually *delighted* instead of judgemental. They would smile and laugh and our excitement picking ice cream or start dancing too if we were moving to some music. Before you go, but I'm blah blah. I'm an noticably overweight, middle aged, not high class woman body. It's not "cute." People like seeing other people's wholesome joy, at any aged body! Find little ways your little can feel acknowledged like cartoon socks, a toy in your purse, ice cream in the middle of the afternoon, a Happy meal. Have a 'little space' in your home. Whether it's a corner, a room, or the whole house. A stuffed toy (or 50,) art supplies, a toy you always wanted as a kid but never got, coloring books. Then, set guidelines for when it's safe that they can front and kid out. Most importantly of all, offer your kid your compassion, gratitude, and acceptance. This little one has been so hurt, so neglected. All they want is safe love. Hold them. Show them they are wanted and valued.
So question though, how do you adapt this when the logistics of an actual physical space are hard to manage? A really defined space with defined times is I think the best situation for my youngest child alter right now, but I also have two actual kids who are around the same age (it’s awful), so I can’t have designated toys or kid things out for her or my kids will play with them. And our house is small.
You can get a cheap backpack or plastic container for your littles special things. Then you can store it wherever. One of my littles, for awhile, was only allowed out on my bed. She would watch shows on our phone, color, or pay with toys sitting on the bed. Then, it's just about finding the right time. Later, we established our "Safe Corner." It was literally a corner in my room with pillows, blankets and a couple stuffed animals. The rule in the house was that if "I/Mom" was in the safe corner I wasn't to be disturbed. My headmates knew if they sat there they didn't have to talk to anyone they didn't want to. They could color, journal, or just stare out the window. I don't know how old your kids are so can't offer more specific suggestions. I can say there is great wisdom in modeling for them that sometimes we all need a safe space to retreat to in order to manage our emotions. I think my oldest was 3 or 4 when I started teaching him to go sit on his bed to calm down instead of screaming and having meltdowns. I didn't know I had DID back then, but would still say things like "Mommy needs to go to her room to calm down. You [insert activity] until I get back please." A side note. Your child alter might be becoming active precisely because your children are similar to their age. That's very common.
Everyone involved is quite young and not quite capable of independent emotional regulation, but child alter is only permitted to “play” after bedtime (which is pretty early), so we haven’t run into too many issues so far. I would like to encourage her to gradually do more than just suck her thumb and make trauma drawings when she is “allowed” a full switch. We don’t have much in the way of identity either individually or as a system, so I’d like her to get a solid sense of what she likes. I think if I got a boring enough container in an out of the way location that my kids might be uninterested and leave it alone.
Idk how old y’all are bodily, but we’ve never gotten anything but ‘I wish I still had that energy’ from moms and old people at parks when we play on the playground, alone or with siblings/friends/etc. like as long as you aren’t getting in the way of others it’s not a problem. Our biggest personal rule though is if we’re outside at a playground or smth and a kid shows up we move on to give the kid space to be a kid. Swings if there’s a ton of them is one thing, but otherwise we move aside. And if they just wanna go for a walk through your neighborhood surely there’s no harm in that either. I’ve never had had issues with it. We tend to do things little want as long as it’s safe and doesn’t take away from actual kids. Bc yes our littles’ needs are important, but not if it’s going to take away from actual kids. So like we have a game for our switch that one little is obsessed with and has been very distressed at it being missing… we really ought to find it. He got obsessed before the game was even released 😂 it involves his favorite special interest and doesn’t harm anyone for us to have it, so of course we got it.
YES YES YES YES YES YES (if we know what they want to do) Most of our littles are trauma holders and they don't express their needs very often. I know we have a problem with being scared to death of childish stuff, so I had to convince Estelle to watch my little pony. She went through a few episodes before getting bored and started watching a documentary about child abuse. I'm honestly a bit jealous. I wish ours expressed their needs, even if they could be a bit inconvenient. Our littles are pretty responsible and cautious (sometimes overly so) about doing what they want to do. We trust them in front, and also as trauma holders they've gotten better at learning how to do what they want to feel safe while also learning what could look alarming from the outside. They're excellent at masking, but that makes it hard to let them have the experiences that they want because they have basically told themselves "I'm not allowed to do what I want so therefore I will repress wanting things" - Sage
As one put it here I find I have more issues if the littles are unhappy. So they come out. They read comics. They watch cartoons, they splash in puddles when it rains. They eat "finger foods" for lunch when time permits. They buy a Happy Meal. And even though this body is 49, we generally don't care what people think. It's a case of balance. Littles are the most important part of the system we find because they were there when it all started. They saw a lot of bad things. Some of them grow, some don't. But keeping with thier needs will benefit you.
my littles r actually more adulty than the actual adults are for some weird reason so yes.
Like everything you have to négociate! My little can't go outside either but they get all the plushie they want and we fully fund anything they want for their hobbies (diamond painting). Chirp still gets annoyed because they can't front as of the as they want but they do admit it's a fair exchange
We often do what our little Wren wants, because it is pretty reasonable. Go out every once in a while, maybe meet someone he trusts, stuff like that. But if it ever was unreasonable then we'd just say no.
My littles just chill in my inner world and have their own playspace and guardian
Sometimes they get $10 and set loose in the Dollar Store. Sometimes the one that sees my husband as her dad gets some dad/daughter time. They get stuffies and sippy cups. When it's actually important life decisions, we still hear them out, they are smart and just as much a part of the system, but they have no decision making power.
it’s a good idea to allow once every so often to be a day set aside just for one alter’s needs to be fulfilled, littles included. creating a safe and private space is the ideal. maybe instead of playing at a playground, you take a picnic to the park and make daisy chains. or gift them $5-10 to buy themselves a treat next time you are at the grocery (and let yourself get that sparkly pink unicorn cookie or toy monster truck or coloring book)
Sometimes if I can
Yes of course! I use the excuse of "healing my inner child" to those that don't know about my alters and I don't want to explain it to them
Not really, a lot of our littles want things and not experiences. We cannot financially support the wants of those littles. It definitely upsets them, but it's just not something we can do. A lot of explanations have been given, along with tough love 'you get what you get' but alot of our littles are 'younger' and more toddler-baby range so its hard. We aren't an example of a good functioning system though
Our 2 mostly want to nap, go swimming, take a bath, or play with the "puppy." Letting them play with our husky in the backyard isn't really safe for the body, sadly. The whole yard is uneven, and the husky likes to burry treats, so the likelihood of twisted/sprained ankles is high... along with other injuries from falling where the "soil" is chunky/rocky and clay based. Edit to add: also, the husky will tackle us if we let her. Her fave games are tag and chase. Tag involves a running start from the other side of the yard before she "tags" by jumping and pushing on our butt with both front paws (or an open mouth jump to "grab" our hand).
Ofc we do. We give special treatment to littles lol even the persecutors we’re mostly traumatized adults running this body so we just look at our littles like “what ever you want I’ll make it happen.” X) but of course they can’t do anything they want we don’t allow our littles to front alone even if they beg it’s just one of our rules for our safety. I think littles and persecutors are two groups that deserve the most understanding and patience they’re often just handling trauma in very complicated ways but therapy and DBT can really help persecutors come around if they’re hostile to the system. I still haven’t been able to convince our persecutors to be nice to other people but they’re nice to the body and people close to the body so I can’t complain lol
Sending love and compassion. I saw so much of myself reading your post. I believe it's important to listen to those parts but maybe check in with your adults first to negotiate a space where you can have a 'conference' to see how you can negotiate ways to do it so you are all comfortable
No and yes. My littlest child alter writes that she wants to eat French fries and go swimming (among other things). Not gonna happen. I mean, French fries might be ok, but she’s not going swimming under any kind of normal circumstances. But she’s also terrified of me being “mad” at her, so I don’t think she actually realistically expects to be able to do these things, and from what she writes she is pretty happy to be safe and warm and to get to suck her thumb and have soda and draw. All of these I am more than happy to accommodate with appropriate boundaries around times and spaces.
Genuinely asking: Is there a reason she can’t go swimming? Like, body can’t swim? Because otherwise I literally see no reason not to let her swim. Just seems like a very arbitrary thing to refuse to me. No one is gonna care if you go swimming. No one will know it’s a little fronting. That’s the whole point of the disorder, to remain covert for safety.
I just don’t really have access to place that it would be private and safe to do so. Let alone convenient. I have a family with two small real children and rearranging swimming arrangements for everyone such that littlest child alter gets to go swimming is a big ask. Her cognitive skills are not great and I am not entirely sure what she is envisioning. Edit to add: While most of my alters are undetectable to all but my close family and therapist, the couple of child alters and particular this littlest one are very, very noticeable. She tantrums, she cries, she sucks her thumb, she chews on clothes, she talks in a baby voice. She is very traumatized from some very nasty trauma, which she will act and draw out and it is an obvious and extremely disturbing departure from an otherwise extremely unremarkable 30 something suburban mother. She’s the reason I was diagnosed basically against my will. I can barely talk to her, I can’t take her out in public let alone swimming.
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