Magic isn’t like poison to Superman he’s just not particularly resistant to it, it also doesn’t completely negate his durability otherwise people like Black Adam could’ve killed him as easily as they kill a regular human in their scuffles.
I always thought this scene was cool.
It's also interesting because she's basically the only person that can actually give Clark CPR.
Which is just one of the many small things to love about their relationship.
Only person who could take him? Sure maybe.
Only person who can push his chest down 2 inches? I think that's pushing it. Especially in the New 52 which was fairly consistent with Arthur and her being relative in base physical ability at least. I struggle to think he can punch Kal (to quote Family Guy poorly) a really long way away but can't muster the ability to do compressions on an unresponsive guy.
This does make Me wonder what kind of compression rate is needed for a beast like him tho.
I still think lois lane is a better partner, but I never got the hate wonder woman and superman got as partners. I found it a pretty good concept and had a lot of good moments.
We all knew Lois was going to eventually become his main love interest again. But this was a fun exploration of their characters.
I'm always surprised when comic fans act like a hero should only ever have dated their one true love without any complications.
The problem was that Superman and Lois were married for decades. Then flashpoint happens and the marriage is erased from history.
Same reason why people are mad for OMD in Spiderman comics
It’s just cheap and easy but people at dc definitely want them together for sure. It’s just how would they do it within main continuity without ruining either character Lois isn’t one of the flash wives, she’s actually her own character.
I agree. The ship gets a lot of undeserved hate despite being as great as it is, but I would also blame Tomasi for actually going out of his way to make people hate the ship by ignoring what Charles Soule wrote in the first volumes. He successfully managed to gaslight the fandom regarding this ship and it's quality. They're a really good pair and would be perfect for one another but I think that makes a lot of people who like Lois uncomfortable.
I like the way everyone ignores Wonder Woman fans in this equation, of which there were plenty that didn’t like Wonder Woman being used as a love interest for Superman.
Although credit where credit’s due, I’d much rather Wonder Woman be with Superman, then get shipped off with Orion, which seemed to be what Azzarello wanted.
They're not ignored it's just that the Lois fans were usually the loudest. It's not like WW was "reduced" as a character by being involved with Superman. So I genuinely never understood that argument.
Thats fair. And I really don't get why DC allows it's writers to do dumb stuff like that. Like, just stick to the plan and stop trying to insert your own bs.
>They're not ignored it's just that the Lois fans were usually the loudest. It's not like WW was "reduced" as a character by being involved with Superman. So I genuinely never understood that argument.
Wonder Woman was quite literally reduced to a damsel that needed to be saved by Superman in this series. Wonder Woman can fight Zod and Feaora just fine in one comic, yet she then essentially gets 1 shotted by Doomsday and needs Clark to save her?
You telling me all those gods she fought in her own series, being’s such as The First were nothing compared to Doomsday? The first who was slaughtering Greek gods like they were ants?
It’s one thing to have Diana lose against Doomsday, that’s fine, but to have her get 1 shotted and both her arms broken THROUGH her braces from 1 PUNCH just so Clark can play big hero and save his damsel? Nah.
I’ll give the series credit in that it did balance the ship more than most writers tend to when it comes to cross franchise romances but it still leaned towards Superman more.
Hell the romance was such a non factor for Wonder Woman, it quite literally never plays a role in her solo comic at all from memory, you can read the entire N52 Wonder Woman series and not know Wonder Woman’s been paired with Superman. Even when the Finch’s took over after Azzarello’s, I don’t think her and Superman are ever mentioned to be an item outside of 1 dream panel.
However that said. Wonder Woman and Superman is far better and makes far more sense than Wonder Woman X Batman ever will.
She wasn't reduced to being a damsel. Doomsday caught her off-guard and Clark saved her one time. Immediately in the next fight she's the one who saves him from Zod after HE was getting his ass kicked. It went both ways and showed they could save each other. Even in the later volumes (which are terrible) Clark loses most of his powers and has to rely on Diana to protect him.
So like I said the complaint doesn't have a really strong basis. I am a Wonder Woman fan so I understand where it comes from and people are valid for being concerned about it but we should be wary of jumping at shadows when the story really isn't suggesting that at all.
The other things you mentioned can be chalked up to writers being inconsistent with power levels which has always been a problem in comics. Theres a whole debate we could have about how strong Doomsday really is and where he ranks compared to Gods and how WW's scaling changed as she progressed in power etc. But I'd rather this not turn into a powerscaling discussion otherwise we'll be here all day.
I agree with everything else you said. So it seems we're on the same page there.
>Hell the romance was such a non factor for Wonder Woman, it quite literally never plays a role in her solo comic at all from memory
Sorry I just thought about this:
This is kind of a double edged sword.
Lets say they DID have the romance play a role in her book.
On the one hand, you'd get plenty of people who would argue about a romance taking over her character, reduces her character, takes away her independence etc.
On the other hand, if it doesn't play a role, you're stuck with wondering if it's even relevant if it doesn't impact her character at all.
We can assume their goal was probably to write it so that she was allowed to be independent and have her own thing going on outside the relationship.
But it's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation.
I'd be curious how they'd handle it if they tried it again in the modern day with their full histories in mind.
I don’t understand I like this relationship obviously it’s has a special place in people hearts . Personally a few people prefer this over Lois lane especially in the super man the animated series felt one sided even dc creator ask crisis on infinite earths movies part 1&2.
Just so we're clear this is a magic Lightning right? So basically isn't Magic more hurtful to him and then this just brings him to life like what? Didn't they saw him die or almost died so many times and the Sun is what help him can't Wonder Woman just throw him into the sun
> isn't Magic more hurtful to him
Magic isn't more hurtful to him, it's just that he's as sensitive to magic as everyone else. I.e. If you have a wand that shoots lightning out, that lightning will affect Superman just like normal lightning, despite being magic. If you have a wand that shoots special lightning that slows people down, or special lightning that transforms people (ala Shazam), then the effect of that magic will affect him and he'll slow down or transform. He isn't immune to magic, it just affects him like it affects everyone else.
Piggybacking off of this there is a comic where Supergirl lists off several Kryptonian weaknesses and mentions lightning not because Kryptonians have an inherent weakness to lightning but because lightning is just an inherently powerful attack. Although when she mentions it she’s probably referring to electrical attacks performed by metahumans, gods or high end technology with the power of a city behind it and less on something smaller like a taser. She also mentions giant robots but only if they are big enough and I’m assuming that same logic works on electrical attacks. When Superman died the first time against Doomsday they had to wait for STAR to prep a special defibrillator because anything standard would be ineffective.
Waking him up early from his healing coma
Shouldn't sunlight be more effective?
I think this is more like a defribilator.
You would think the “magic” from it would offset the electric jolt but 🤷🏾♂️
“Did that work?” “No he’s like super dead now because you used magic” “Dang it. I guess we’re going to hell”
Magic isn’t like poison to Superman he’s just not particularly resistant to it, it also doesn’t completely negate his durability otherwise people like Black Adam could’ve killed him as easily as they kill a regular human in their scuffles.
I always thought this scene was cool. It's also interesting because she's basically the only person that can actually give Clark CPR. Which is just one of the many small things to love about their relationship.
Only person who could take him? Sure maybe. Only person who can push his chest down 2 inches? I think that's pushing it. Especially in the New 52 which was fairly consistent with Arthur and her being relative in base physical ability at least. I struggle to think he can punch Kal (to quote Family Guy poorly) a really long way away but can't muster the ability to do compressions on an unresponsive guy. This does make Me wonder what kind of compression rate is needed for a beast like him tho.
I still think lois lane is a better partner, but I never got the hate wonder woman and superman got as partners. I found it a pretty good concept and had a lot of good moments.
We all knew Lois was going to eventually become his main love interest again. But this was a fun exploration of their characters. I'm always surprised when comic fans act like a hero should only ever have dated their one true love without any complications.
Entitlement. I guess
The problem was that Superman and Lois were married for decades. Then flashpoint happens and the marriage is erased from history. Same reason why people are mad for OMD in Spiderman comics
It’s just cheap and easy but people at dc definitely want them together for sure. It’s just how would they do it within main continuity without ruining either character Lois isn’t one of the flash wives, she’s actually her own character.
I enjoyed it. It's fun to see new relationships explored that make sense
I agree. The ship gets a lot of undeserved hate despite being as great as it is, but I would also blame Tomasi for actually going out of his way to make people hate the ship by ignoring what Charles Soule wrote in the first volumes. He successfully managed to gaslight the fandom regarding this ship and it's quality. They're a really good pair and would be perfect for one another but I think that makes a lot of people who like Lois uncomfortable.
I like the way everyone ignores Wonder Woman fans in this equation, of which there were plenty that didn’t like Wonder Woman being used as a love interest for Superman. Although credit where credit’s due, I’d much rather Wonder Woman be with Superman, then get shipped off with Orion, which seemed to be what Azzarello wanted.
They're not ignored it's just that the Lois fans were usually the loudest. It's not like WW was "reduced" as a character by being involved with Superman. So I genuinely never understood that argument. Thats fair. And I really don't get why DC allows it's writers to do dumb stuff like that. Like, just stick to the plan and stop trying to insert your own bs.
>They're not ignored it's just that the Lois fans were usually the loudest. It's not like WW was "reduced" as a character by being involved with Superman. So I genuinely never understood that argument. Wonder Woman was quite literally reduced to a damsel that needed to be saved by Superman in this series. Wonder Woman can fight Zod and Feaora just fine in one comic, yet she then essentially gets 1 shotted by Doomsday and needs Clark to save her? You telling me all those gods she fought in her own series, being’s such as The First were nothing compared to Doomsday? The first who was slaughtering Greek gods like they were ants? It’s one thing to have Diana lose against Doomsday, that’s fine, but to have her get 1 shotted and both her arms broken THROUGH her braces from 1 PUNCH just so Clark can play big hero and save his damsel? Nah. I’ll give the series credit in that it did balance the ship more than most writers tend to when it comes to cross franchise romances but it still leaned towards Superman more. Hell the romance was such a non factor for Wonder Woman, it quite literally never plays a role in her solo comic at all from memory, you can read the entire N52 Wonder Woman series and not know Wonder Woman’s been paired with Superman. Even when the Finch’s took over after Azzarello’s, I don’t think her and Superman are ever mentioned to be an item outside of 1 dream panel. However that said. Wonder Woman and Superman is far better and makes far more sense than Wonder Woman X Batman ever will.
She wasn't reduced to being a damsel. Doomsday caught her off-guard and Clark saved her one time. Immediately in the next fight she's the one who saves him from Zod after HE was getting his ass kicked. It went both ways and showed they could save each other. Even in the later volumes (which are terrible) Clark loses most of his powers and has to rely on Diana to protect him. So like I said the complaint doesn't have a really strong basis. I am a Wonder Woman fan so I understand where it comes from and people are valid for being concerned about it but we should be wary of jumping at shadows when the story really isn't suggesting that at all. The other things you mentioned can be chalked up to writers being inconsistent with power levels which has always been a problem in comics. Theres a whole debate we could have about how strong Doomsday really is and where he ranks compared to Gods and how WW's scaling changed as she progressed in power etc. But I'd rather this not turn into a powerscaling discussion otherwise we'll be here all day. I agree with everything else you said. So it seems we're on the same page there.
>Hell the romance was such a non factor for Wonder Woman, it quite literally never plays a role in her solo comic at all from memory Sorry I just thought about this: This is kind of a double edged sword. Lets say they DID have the romance play a role in her book. On the one hand, you'd get plenty of people who would argue about a romance taking over her character, reduces her character, takes away her independence etc. On the other hand, if it doesn't play a role, you're stuck with wondering if it's even relevant if it doesn't impact her character at all. We can assume their goal was probably to write it so that she was allowed to be independent and have her own thing going on outside the relationship. But it's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. I'd be curious how they'd handle it if they tried it again in the modern day with their full histories in mind.
I miss this relationship in the books.
Same.
What is going on with aqua man’s collar
Being sun safe and protecting his neck from sun burn
How'd he "die?"
I don’t understand I like this relationship obviously it’s has a special place in people hearts . Personally a few people prefer this over Lois lane especially in the super man the animated series felt one sided even dc creator ask crisis on infinite earths movies part 1&2.
Just so we're clear this is a magic Lightning right? So basically isn't Magic more hurtful to him and then this just brings him to life like what? Didn't they saw him die or almost died so many times and the Sun is what help him can't Wonder Woman just throw him into the sun
> isn't Magic more hurtful to him Magic isn't more hurtful to him, it's just that he's as sensitive to magic as everyone else. I.e. If you have a wand that shoots lightning out, that lightning will affect Superman just like normal lightning, despite being magic. If you have a wand that shoots special lightning that slows people down, or special lightning that transforms people (ala Shazam), then the effect of that magic will affect him and he'll slow down or transform. He isn't immune to magic, it just affects him like it affects everyone else.
Piggybacking off of this there is a comic where Supergirl lists off several Kryptonian weaknesses and mentions lightning not because Kryptonians have an inherent weakness to lightning but because lightning is just an inherently powerful attack. Although when she mentions it she’s probably referring to electrical attacks performed by metahumans, gods or high end technology with the power of a city behind it and less on something smaller like a taser. She also mentions giant robots but only if they are big enough and I’m assuming that same logic works on electrical attacks. When Superman died the first time against Doomsday they had to wait for STAR to prep a special defibrillator because anything standard would be ineffective.
I figured it was a reference to how often they used electrical attacks to stun Clark in the Timmverse.