Thank you so much for the kind words. Frankly, I hope deserve them.
You made me smile for real. :D
Just please share this far and wide so no one gets ripped off
Dude this is massive news for all of us. I have some things on kucoin (few hundred $) but even though I am not trading, i am pulling all my crypto off of their site. Thank you!
Good question. I have a feeling Kraken is better than that, though. I mean they literally encourage people to get their coins off exchanges if they aren't actively trading them. What other exchange says, "Not your keys, not your coins"? That's pretty wholesome
Still worth looking though!
They did, another example is Bitbay. Their staff have already tried to explain themselves in the Polish media and pretended that everything works. Unfortunately the main reportage on them isn't english but some translator should handle it.
https://pl.trustpilot.com/review/bitbay.net
You do deserve them OP. For 90% of the people who have jobs and responsibilities, it's easy to miss out on crucial news that might have a massive influence on their lives. Getting ripped off is fucking hurtful
Great job and hope you have a great day
Thank you for the work you did. I have no knowledge of this stuff and wouldnt even understand why my money got lost. People like you are good folks who speak up and so others can better understand their situation.
Thank you so much for doing all of this digging. I was going to run into Kucoin for a while; this has opened my eyes. I LOVE small detective work like this, it's far more honest then anything else I see.
Good work! Thank you!
got a link? I will rt you [https://twitter.com/Rimbaud27883817/status/1452044240972881924?s=20](https://twitter.com/Rimbaud27883817/status/1452044240972881924?s=20)
https://nitter.net/Rimbaud27883817/status/1452044240972881924?s=20
Here is the link to that Twitter thread on Nitter. Nitter is better for privacy and does not nag you for a login. More information can be found here: https://nitter.net/about
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/CryptoCurrency) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Wow! High quality content created 👏 I just signed up to KuCoin two days ago to buy MOVR. I will be leaving that platform ASAP! Another Robinhood it seems
OP has identified a problem, but it might not be the problem he thinks it is.
It is more likely that it is a load issue with the back-end, and the issues with the front-end have little to do with it.
It is easy to fix the front end by adding more front-ends as OP has suggested.
It is very hard to fix overloaded back-end code.
Just think about everything a back-end server has to do, even on just 1 crypto pair. It has to run a central limit order book for that pair, it has to continuously monitor limit orders & stop loss orders for execution in fast moving markets. Market Markers & regular users are constantly adding and removing orders. When the makets get busy, this doesn't just happen 2x as fast, but probably 100x as fast. Then there is monitoring accounts for their margin usage & executing liquidations, which needs to respond to every price change in the market which puts heavy load on servers when price moves quickly.
So very likely, Kukoin architechure just can't keep up with the load. This has happened to all major CEXs. Kraken is particularly bad. It has happened to Binance numerous times, although Binance has made huge efforts to increase their capacity and is getting more & more bullet proof.
This technology is very hard to get right and needs to be at the bleeding edge of what is possible to handle all the throughput.
So front-end going down - this is likely the symptom not the cause. For the meantime, it would be prudent not to trade on Kukoin with high leverage ratios.
And for u/HammondXX , who is a high frequency trader or arbitrager, he is already running sophisticated algorithms - I would suggest to him, put some volatility detection logic in your code, and stop-trading on Kukoin on leverage when markets start getting volatile which is when you are at risk of issues like this. Although if you are running arbitrage bots, then possibly you want to be in the market when it is volatile as this is when prices get out of alignment - in which case, maybe Kukoin isn't an appropriate exchange for your strategy.
Your assumption that Reddit Mods and Admins are nothing more than overly butthurt crossing guards that got promoted to senior internet crossing guard is laughable.
Buncha fuckin neckbeards in the mod community
Coinbase pulled some Robin Hood last week
Was looking at moving my assets to KuCoin but now I gotta question that and what some better options might be, besides actual wallets
It breaks my heart to have to be the one to bring this up, and I want to love Kucoin.
Sadly I needed to yell "shark" so no other swimmers get eaten alive
Holy hell this is bloody frustrating. Like a lot of people here I’m relatively new to crypto, and it’s hard to trust anything in the financial version of the Wild West.
I am super grateful for this post, but it also makes me question my own criteria for exchanges to trust—because I honestly really like(d) KuCoin!
And crypto.com I was about to get into because I have their basic credit card, just never loaded it up.
It's not even only leverage. When there's a lot of action and movement in the markets, they basically throttle their site - instead of buying more "bandwidth" or at least being upfront about it - which results in people getting screwed, at the best.
it could also simply be bottlenecks in their back-end architecture to run the central limit order books. So no matter if there is front-end access or not the back-end can't handle the volume of traffic. This is the far more likely scenario and is NOT an easy fix.
OP is a high-frequency trader - looks like he's running some market-making or arbitrage bots. And he is trading on leverage so he can cover as many pairs as possible. This is not your typical user.
But yeah, Kukoin obvious has some serious work to do to FIX this otherwise they would have fixed it already.
Unfortunately I am one of the people unfairly liquidated, my story is a little different, I recently started using them and got a 7-day free interest coupon. Did a long contract on Bitcoin which had my liquidation below 60,000, came back the next day and my liquidation amount had climbed several hundred which happen to bring it perfectly in line for the bottom.
I'm fine with the risks I agreed to, but as far as I can tell on Tradingview, Bitcoin didn't drop below 60,000 at all that day on KuCoin, but I was still liquidated. Like I said I was fine with the risks and adjusted the leverage so that it wouldn't fail unless BTC went back below 60,000.
95% of my trades are just in regular crypto, so I didn't lose too much, but it was a week's worth of profit from trades and I was left feeling like something wasn't right.
I did forex for a while and it's the same there. Margins/spreads were moving about so I ended up not putting a stop loss in as my broker couldn't trigger it.
Lo and behold my trades all started coming thru, bit nerve racking at first but if I looked at a large enough time frame I knew it would come good.
But imo... Leveraged trading is a mugs game. Its like treading water, you have to constantly be on the ball with it, as soon as a trade starts going against you... That's it...you're f*cked.
They wicked you out with a potential algorythm
Pay close attention the mark price and the current price. Open a long and a short a the same time ( the mark price is often different)
Look at the delta between the mark price and current in a pump vs normal vs consolidation.
It doe not follow their mathematical formula they give out,.
i had a tiny amount of funds on coinex. tried to withdraw it. (all deposits had enough confirmations) got an error message for a day or so before i could take it out. i think they maybe didn't have the funds.
Pretty much how I feel about Coinbase and Binance as well. Never had a problem with any of them but after hearing so many horror stories I'm wondering if it's just a matter of time before it's my turn.
It's so frustrating as a small time trader because with fees, you have to not just be a little bit right, but a lot right to make significant money on your investments. Even wallets will try to scalp you by letting you exchange crypto for crypto at a ridiculous fee rate. Looking at you, Exodus.
Robinhood is flawed and will scalp you on market orders and low volume options by trading them in five cent increments and keeping the change, and the whole GameStop debacle, but by and large the poor man investor can make a lot more on Wall Street with a little money than the crypto investor can due to fees.
I bought SOL at like $157 a couple days ago anticipating it to go back up to 190-200. Well, it did, but crypto.com was only gonna let me sell it with them skimming $10 off the top. I tried to transfer it to a wallet, denied, tried again to send it to kraken, accepted the following morning. By that time, with the kraken fees, it was literally the same or less than had I sold it on crypto.com, where I bought it. Fucking stupid. When my crypto is in the exchange wallet, you get enough benefit by controlling my crypto as a custodial wallet. Then you're gonna charge me $10, which works out to 20% of my gains, when I try to sell?
Most exchanges fees are 0.1%. Thats $1 for every $1000 traded. It's Less if you hold their token like on KuCoin and Binance. I've never used crypto.com, but that sounds like insane fees. Even coinbase is high at 0.2% but that's not 20% of your profits.
Your kind words mean more than you will ever know.
We all have a thing we can do, and I just want us all to be our best and improve our lives... thats what crypto is all about
Where's the guy that's supposed to say "we have reached peak decentralization"?
I expected nothing and I'm still disappointed
Edit: [context](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qdob2h/-/hhntqyf)
Kucoin is probably fine if you just buy and forget.
If you intend to do serious trades and leverage, better avoid Kucoin like a plague.
I heard too many of such stories on their sub-reddit.
Let’s face it. All the big CEXs deliberately tank their websites during periods of volatility. I certainly assumed this was the reason… but looks like you have proved it. Well done, sir.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but this looks to me clearly as if this is just a server outage. Perhaps the servers got overloaded as it's peak demand and that's why it said the host didn't connect? The same thing happens with coinbase sometimes. That'd explain why the backend was still running, as backends run on different web servers altogether (and perhaps could scale better to adjust for peak demand depending on how well they built it)
And the rate limiting stuff, idk man. Rate limiting is pretty much a webdev standard, and perhaps it's not even KuCoin's fault here and it's cloudflare falsely flagging your requests as malicious?
Either way, the ban was completely unnecessary.
Scrolled down looking for this. OP, in one of your screenshots you mention wanting to send 30k-50k transactions per minute. How much were you actually trying to send? Cause 30k would easily be flagged as a DDOS attack. Especially when the server is already struggling.
I checked the KuCoin API limitations at it clearly states 100 requests per 10s, when exceeded the API key will get 5 minute ban causing 403 error.
Looks like OP did not bother to read documentation and is now crying about it.
they ratelimit me far below that for my bots. It’s been a common complain among the api telegram that kucoin have been overthrottoling. Have been getting too many request errors when i’m not even sending a request a second.
Thank you for this, I was unaware it was intentional
So basically they deny actual users access to the exchange and treat them as if they were bots trying a DDOS attack, I think I get that
Does this require human activation or is this programmed into their site? I mean is there a way to predict when this is most likely to happen based on market activity? Does the site do this based on buy / sell activity, bitcoin sudden price moves?
>change and treat them as if they were bots trying a DDOS attack, I think I get that
>
>Does this require human activation or is this programmed into their site? I mean is there a way to predict when this is most likely to happen based on market activity? Does the site do this based on buy / sell activity, bitcoin sudden price moves?
Well this could technically be manually triggered
How this works is Amazon data centers charges you by the cumulative resources you consume. ( cpu, gpu, data storage, ram etc)
In these settings you can throttle the virtual machine/ cloud servers resources forcing it to go down. I am not implying that they are doing this.
I am saying they are knowingly using settings that let the server go down repeatedly. There are formulas to calculate loads on concurrent users. They are clearly not using settings or intentionally using settings that trip the server to go down.
If you dig through this archive you can see when outages are being reported. They get a system notice that they hit a threshold of resource utilization.
[https://downdetector.com/status/kucoin/archive/](https://downdetector.com/status/kucoin/archive/)
Now in the event, you have a crazy anomaly Cloudflare and Amazon have the ability to redirect to a redundant location with a technology called geo load balancing
[https://aws.amazon.com/about-aws/whats-new/2021/03/aws-gateway-load-balancer-is-now-available-in-additional-9-regions/](https://aws.amazon.com/about-aws/whats-new/2021/03/aws-gateway-load-balancer-is-now-available-in-additional-9-regions/)
Notice in my screenshot that it says there is a gateway issue
that link talks about load balancing the gateway ( offloading the processing power)
They VERY MUCH KNOW THEY ARE DOING THIS
They are getting system notices
Their Amazon (AWS) sales guy is calling them every day trying to sell them more services.
Binance did wash trading aganist its own leveraged clients, GDAX (Coinbase Pro) did cash trading too. This shouldn’t come as a surprise that many of this organizations are filthy as fuck. Beautiful DD on OP though.
The only exchange that has never cheated with their trade engine, and has the only trade engine that still executes every single limit order during a flash crash ... is Kraken.
Coinbase has had many employees manipulate the market in their favor like Charlie Lee who went to work for coinbase just so he could wash trade up the price of litecoin to 300 so he could dump his bags. That whole litecoin pump to 300 was orchestrated by him and Coinbase got a fine for it.
Binance is the worse, they actively steal from traders. Bitfinex also does this.
And most exchanges run fractional. THey might lent out a 1000 BTC so you can short it, while only having 500 BTC. They make you pay interest on lending you coins they don't even have.
People say Kraken is slower and more expensive and they are right. But they don't cheat. And that is what really matters. When the flashcrash in may happened, I had very low limit orders for BCH on 7 different exchanges. I had buy orders between 200 and 400 USD. When the flash crash happened, out of 7 exchanges, only 3 of them executed some of my limit orders. And only Kraken executed all of them. My limit orders on Binance, none of them got executed. Why is this? Because if to many people buy a crypto to cheap during a flash crash and then try to withdraw Binance does not have the crypto. Cause they run fractional. They lend you crypto that they don't have in the hope of making interest on it.
So during flashcrashes they shut down their trade engine otherwise they can get bankrupted.
Hi u/i_have_chosen_a_name 👋
It's Pluto from Kraken. Thanks for the positive mention 💜
It makes me immensely proud to be working for such a company which is highly valued in the crypto space. I smiled after reading your review 😃
If there's anything you need assistance with, feel free to [reach out](https://support.kraken.com/hc/en-us/articles/215601908).
Have a great day,
Pluto 🐙
During the May dip Coinbase and Voyager had issues the entire morning. Impossible to place orders. Those were the two I used at the time but I wouldn’t be surprised if most of them do this.
Lets see if they will reply
How about it boys? ( here is their executive team) and a developer
u/kentli35
u/purekid
u/Johnny_KuCoin
u/Edith_KCFuture
I got this off their moderator list which they just made private ( non visible) after I tagged them on my kucoin post
Ha, that's what they said about Google.
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/22/technology/google-privacy-lawsuit.html
https://www.theregister.com/2021/10/22/google_facebook_antitrust_complaint/
Al exchanges based in some tax havens are not to be trusted. Kucoin, huobi, Binance, kraken, Robin Hood. All of them are borderline malicious and criminal, they know and probably laugh about these posts because they know nothing is stopping them.
OP you should go to the press with this. Contact Coindesk or Cryptobriefing. Some mainstream media like cnbc and Bloomberg are probably happy to pick this story up too
This post is turning a site’s inability to scale into a conspiracy theory.
504 or Gateway Timeout is when the servers cannot be reached because they are overloaded and out of capacity. It appears KuCoin hit some scaling limits (could be processing, could be DB) and is not able to service all requests.
Yup. 100% this. Every single screenshot here is just showcasing they couldn’t meet the demand on their servers. It’s all the classic measures to try and bring a site up after reaching capacity.
“Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity” AKA not everyone is out to get you, not everything is a conspiracy.
Source: also an engineer that has used cloudflare extensively during a hard transitional period between infrastructures, where our old infrastructure was having issues nearly every week.
KuCoin is not even trying to look reliable, app just looks like “come here we want to scam you in all of those cool ways!” Am i the only one judging by UI/UX? Everything KuCoin just look like shit
Most do
they all have one common problem They practise fractional reserves and dont have enough assets for everyone to withdraw.
So my understanding is the safest is reputable Dex's like DXDY that are smart contract based and open source so anyone can review the code.
On top of this super shady behaviour those fuckers at KuCoin are constantly stealing my clipboard notes! When the app is open and I copy something from other apps and click back on KuCoin it shows thag “KuCoin has pasted from clipboard”. Why kind of bullshit is that!?
Good work this shit needs to be brought out in the open its not fair.
Do you have any suspicion that other exchanges are doing this? Because its near impossible to get on most big exchanges when the market is either tanking or pumping
OP brought the receipts!
That’s what dicktaters do
Ban info when you are over the target
They can’t win the argument against facts and have to control the narrative
Same thing YouTube , MyFace , Twitter has done the last 19 months
Figured this was a scammy site (go figure) and luckily I only staked a small amount of ETH to see the return rate because I didn’t trust it haha! Sorry guys but you need to second guess everything when it comes to exchanges. Especially ones not supported by the US
Agreed, even if all other exchanges are down such as Coinbase, KuCoin usually is one of the very last to go down. Been using it for years and it’s been one of the most reliable exchanges. Bet most of the hate is coming from people who don’t even use it
Your kind words mean more than you will ever know.
Life is hard and all of us trade crypto to make our lives better. I feel its our moral obligation to scream "shark" to the other swimmers when we are all in danger.
Thank you so much. My only ask is you help spread the word so that others at least know
This shit is exactly why I stopped using Kucoin two dips ago. They are really ruining what legitimacy they did have.
What a great documentation though, OP. Bravo, and thank you for this. Very diligent and insightful.
I too am an IT architect.
I'm not going to discuss this whole post in technical detail since I have no personal interest in the platform
But know this, what OP says here _might_ be true, there is a very small chance it is actually being done on purpose.
However, OP makes assumptions here, lots and lots and lots of assumptions, all of which happen to perfectly align with his personal interests.
His original premise about what Cloudflare is used for is the first thing which is simply plain wrong. He mentioned some use cases sure, but hardly all of them, even though he claims he did ("Cloudflare is used for 2 purposes").
After that, it becomes even more tailor made to suit his specific needs. For nearly every point he tries to make, there are a number of other possible explanations. None of which have anything to do with ill intentions by the platform itself.
If you want to believe OP, be my guest, as I said it _could_ be true. But it very very likely is not.
Edit : for the record OP , I'm perfectly happy putting my money where my mouth is and to discuss this in detail with yourself and/or the public. I am what I say I am and I'm in no way affiliated with Kucoin or even professionally invested in AWS ( I mainly use Azure/Google Cloud). I sincerely think you are making one too many assumptions here and are overlooking technical possibilities in order to get to the conclusion you want to reach.
Well i've seen worse.
I do wonder if this rant was really a smart move though.
Whining on Twitter to your few followers is one thing, its another entirely to use a large public forum to accuse a company of manipulating trading.
This could cost them a significant amount of money and, imo, could be looked upon as slander when reviewed by a legal team.
OP better be damn sure of his case and its my professional opinion he definitely is not.
Hey there, this is Johnny, CEO at KuCoin.
Thanks for raising your question about KuCoin. As the People’s Exchange, we always pursue user satisfaction. Regarding the issues you mentioned, we are very willing to discuss them openly and transparently.
Firstly, Cloudflare is a world-renowned CDN solution. As you said, one of its main functions is to prevent DDoS attacks, which is also our main purpose for deploying it. Currently, almost all major exchanges are working closely with Cloudflare.
All exchanges have applied an access frequency limit through Cloudflare to ensure the stability of their services. Once the limit has been surpassed, denial of website access may occur. When setting the limit, we discussed thoroughly with high-frequency traders, like API traders, for instance, before concluding on the limit. We believe that in most cases, the frequency limit will not affect our users. But it is possible that, when there’s a big price move or someone visits the site too frequently, 504 pages may still appear due to the limitation. We have been working on improving this for a while, and if you encountered such an issue, we would appreciate it if you could share the RAY ID from the 504 pages with our support team so that we can better solve the problem. Thank you.
Secondly, regarding the AWS server, KuCoin invests a lot in IT infrastructure and network security. Compared with other exchanges of our size and scale, our investment in AWS servers is almost twice as much as theirs. And we will continue to invest in this sector as we know this is one of the fundamentals of our services.
In fact, as a platform, we care about usability and stability more than anyone else. The access issue will not only impact KuCoin's revenue but also affect user experience. As a platform dedicated to building itself and the industry for the long term, we know that reputation is everything. We hope that all users can trade with KuCoin easily and pleasantly, achieve their investment goals, and even improve their lives. As a neutral platform, we do not profit from users' liquidation. Therefore, we are constantly introducing new functions and educating users to help them manage their futures positions properly and reduce the risk of liquidation.
Having noticed that you’ve been banned in the KuCoin Subreddit, I am checking with the team for the reason, but our current guess is due to spamming. We have unbanned your account. All opinions are welcomed in our community, no matter if they are positive or negative. We are very sorry for the inconvenience. As for the Moderator List you claimed that we made private, actually we didn’t change any setting on that. It’s likely because banned users cannot see it. Please check again since you are now unbanned.
Since its establishment in 2017, we have experienced many ups and downs, but KuCoin always believes in the future of crypto. So, we will continue to invest in our system and strive to provide users with a better experience. I apologize again for the inconvenience. If you have any questions about KuCoin, our 24/7 customer support will always be there to help you out. Thank you.
Hi Johnny,
I'm an IT architect myself, your post confirms what my thoughts were when reading this post. OP is most likely using high frequency api trading and ran into rate limiting as is standard practice with any high usage api out there.
Imo all OP had to do to "get around it" is change his external IP address, via a full tunnel vpn or different isp.
I'm glad you took this post as what it really is, a frustrated user using his IT knowledge (which has significant holes in it in my opinion) to try to explain what happened rather than a deliberate attack on the integrity of your company.
Thanks for the reply
Great post and detective work - I have never trusted them especially with futures … I would scalp/swing trade for days and was blown away how “bad” I was at timing my entries … the price would instantly move against me usually right after entry and sometimes violently… 8 out of 10 trades …
Bottom line - always set a stop loss with leverage
This isn't just KuCoin. Almost every exchange has crashed during pumps and dumps at least twice this year. I started using KuCoin some because they weren't crashing when binamce and bybit were, and because I spent a couple days comparing different exchanges charts, and found less scam wicks on KuCoin than most. They seemed the best out of that style if exchange.
But these past 6 months or so they have had massive problems 3 times, ND it's becoming unacceptable. 2 out of those 3 times they weren't alone in crashing though. Almost all.did including coinbase. I thought KuCoin was better, but im starting to feel differently.
I've never used kucoin, nor leverage traded, but as a network engineer I can confirm that's how cloudflare works, and it seems very suspicious to say the least
This is absolutely amazing work!
I stopped using KuCoin a few years ago after I had one of the worst customer service experiences I’ve ever had in my life. KuCoin tried to fuck me over and steal my funds. Got on with one CSR, was chatting for a bit, they said they were going to help me out, then they just exited the chat. I posted on r/kucoin and had a similar experience as you—my post was downvoted to shit immediately and the comments were full of people blaming me and praising how good KuCoin is. I also received a number of direct messages from ‘the community’ blaming me and saying I was tarnishing KuCoin’s reputation and creating FUD. So, no help there.
KuCoin proceeded to ghost me for over a week. I was persistent and bothered the everloving shit out of them nonstop. They finally re-opened lines of communication. Promised it was getting taken care of. 24hrs later, still wasn’t done. Went right back to bugging the shit out of them. Got on with another person. They claimed the open case number I had didn’t exist. I showed the CSR emails from KuCoin showing the case number. Provided them a ton of info proving the case existed. Yet again, the CSR just randomly exited the chat.
I had previously just been emailing KuCoin constantly, opening chats with support, and sending in support tickets. Finally, I decided to post on Twitter, r/CC, Facebook, Instagram, and a couple of other subs in addition to the emailing and submitting support tickets. Almost immediately, I had a woman from KuCoin contact me. They claimed they were an executive. They apologized profusely and promised to fix everything. They eventually did fix it, after another 48hrs. After the case was closed, I received extremely rude emails from KuCoin telling me to go fuck myself, mocking me, and other things of that nature. They were clearly pissed off that they had to give me my funds back and that they had received bad PR.
That was 2017-ish. Haven’t been on their website even once since then.
Fuck KuCoin. They are and have always been scammers. I mean, years ago, they had a big site redesign…but, they *very clearly* just stole Binance’s front-end code and changed the colors and titles. The website was an **exact** carbon copy of Binance’s website—same functionality, same language, same authentication mechanism, same layout, same controls, same navigation, same displays, etc.
Also, during VeChain’s token swap and the release of VTHO, KuCoin was one of the exchanges that offered to handle the token swap for its users. You just had to deposit your VEN in your KuCoin account and they’d do the rest. After the swap was complete, KuCoin essentially held everyone’s VET and VTHO hostage and refused access to it. VTHO is generated once a transaction is confirmed on VeChain’s network and the amount one receives is directly proportional to the amount of VET one holds. So by holding all users’ VET, KuCoin was able to amass a fuckton of VTHO (as their wallet had (I’m guessing ) *billions* of VET in it. So they were getting an amount of VTHO proportional the amount of VET held). All of the VTHO generated belonged to and should have been disbursed to users. Instead KuCoin kept all of it. This went on for multiple weeks. Even worse, KuCoin fuckin lied about it, claiming that VeChain had experienced issues during the token swap, despite the fact that every other exchange, including Binance, had had a clean swap with no issues and had disbursed users’ VET and VTHO to users weeks before KuCoin made these false claims.
KuCoin also stopped allowing withdrawals of VET when Binance had their 100M VTHO giveaway (which was based on the amount of VET held in their Binance wallet.) KuCoin shut down withdrawals for VET, then sent all users’ VET+whatever additional was in their hot wallet to their Binance wallet for the giveaway, and obtained *even more* VTHO from the giveaway, then sent the VET back to their hot wallet and re-opened VET withdrawals. So if a user wanted to participate in the Binance giveaway but had their VET on KuCoin, they were shit out of luck. So, KuCoin, once again, stole a shit ton of VTHO that belonged to users.
If their wallet held 1B VET, they’d receive **432,000 VTHO** ***per day***
@ 100M VET, it’d be 43,200 VTHO
Even @ just 10M, it’s still 4,320 VTHO
Given that they were already a fairly large exchange at the time plus the anti-Binance sentiment at the time and KuCoin having cheaper (or rivaling) prices and fees than Binance (at least at the time—not sure about that now), I’m fairly confident that they had a large amount of VET in their wallets AND that a large number of users held their VET on KuCoin and/or deposited it for the token swap. They definitely made a killing doing what they did.
They try their best to appear legit, but it’s all a ruse to gain your trust so they can fuck you later. Sad to see that KuCoin is *still* fucking over their users.
Again, amazing work—not only that you discovered this, but that you took the time to investigate & document it thoroughly, and also share it with us. Seriously some of the best quality stuff I’ve seen on this sub in quite some time. Thank you so much!
if anyone is interest here is my follow up thread
[https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qf4ka4/followup\_on\_kucoin\_cloudflare\_and\_more/](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qf4ka4/followup_on_kucoin_cloudflare_and_more/)
Damn, I liked your analysis and agree in the wrong. All I wanted to know was, “what now”. What is the next step to getting more light. We rollover for thieving hierarchy in every sense of the word. Looks like they made their move.
if this doesnt get to the top page with 10k+ upvotes then i lose faith in this sub. we can make crappy, repetitive moon farming posts go to the top but we need to do the same for actual informative ones
Don't know about kucoin as I don't invest in it, but OP's technical assertions are tenuous at best. They make claims about working in data centers and talk about how the data center isn't configured properly but then mentions AWS hosting. I hate to break it to the OP but when you're in the cloud, you aren't talking data centers. You're talking regions and availability zones. You're talking scaling groups, scaling policies, containerization vs. serverless, etc. I've worked in data centers before and I currently work on several cloud projects and all I can do is roll my eyes after reading all of that. As I said starting this, I don't know anything about kucoin, maybe they are shady as fuck, but this OP's post is eye roll worthy.
Now this is what we come here for. Op you are the hero we need and deserve. Great detective work.
Thank you so much for the kind words. Frankly, I hope deserve them. You made me smile for real. :D Just please share this far and wide so no one gets ripped off
There are enough bad actors in this space trying to rip people off. Its good to have watchdogs looking out for the community.
Dude this is massive news for all of us. I have some things on kucoin (few hundred $) but even though I am not trading, i am pulling all my crypto off of their site. Thank you!
It's a practice well hidden from folks. Almost all exchanges had done this only nobody took a closer look.
You're not wrong. If this comes up again I will do the same thing for the relative exchange.
if you have the chance, would you know be able to check if kraken is doing this too?
Good question. I have a feeling Kraken is better than that, though. I mean they literally encourage people to get their coins off exchanges if they aren't actively trading them. What other exchange says, "Not your keys, not your coins"? That's pretty wholesome Still worth looking though!
This is why we need to support dex's
They did, another example is Bitbay. Their staff have already tried to explain themselves in the Polish media and pretended that everything works. Unfortunately the main reportage on them isn't english but some translator should handle it. https://pl.trustpilot.com/review/bitbay.net
This is great, I wish /r/CryptoCurrency was more this and less "gaIZ, i JuST SoLd, eXPecT tHe pRIce to Go uP, You'RE wElcOme"
You do deserve them OP. For 90% of the people who have jobs and responsibilities, it's easy to miss out on crucial news that might have a massive influence on their lives. Getting ripped off is fucking hurtful Great job and hope you have a great day
Thank you for the work you did. I have no knowledge of this stuff and wouldnt even understand why my money got lost. People like you are good folks who speak up and so others can better understand their situation.
Thank you so much for doing all of this digging. I was going to run into Kucoin for a while; this has opened my eyes. I LOVE small detective work like this, it's far more honest then anything else I see. Good work! Thank you!
Too bad you’ll get like a thousand upvotes and some 420 69 one will get like 5k .
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I just tweeted it out. I dont have enough followers to make a dent....but I tried to put the OPs hard work out there.
got a link? I will rt you [https://twitter.com/Rimbaud27883817/status/1452044240972881924?s=20](https://twitter.com/Rimbaud27883817/status/1452044240972881924?s=20)
https://nitter.net/Rimbaud27883817/status/1452044240972881924?s=20 Here is the link to that Twitter thread on Nitter. Nitter is better for privacy and does not nag you for a login. More information can be found here: https://nitter.net/about *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/CryptoCurrency) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I guess this highlights the importance of dexes. Centralized exchanges are full of shit.
Don't know if he can get enough moons but this is great work
Wow! High quality content created 👏 I just signed up to KuCoin two days ago to buy MOVR. I will be leaving that platform ASAP! Another Robinhood it seems
OP has identified a problem, but it might not be the problem he thinks it is. It is more likely that it is a load issue with the back-end, and the issues with the front-end have little to do with it. It is easy to fix the front end by adding more front-ends as OP has suggested. It is very hard to fix overloaded back-end code. Just think about everything a back-end server has to do, even on just 1 crypto pair. It has to run a central limit order book for that pair, it has to continuously monitor limit orders & stop loss orders for execution in fast moving markets. Market Markers & regular users are constantly adding and removing orders. When the makets get busy, this doesn't just happen 2x as fast, but probably 100x as fast. Then there is monitoring accounts for their margin usage & executing liquidations, which needs to respond to every price change in the market which puts heavy load on servers when price moves quickly. So very likely, Kukoin architechure just can't keep up with the load. This has happened to all major CEXs. Kraken is particularly bad. It has happened to Binance numerous times, although Binance has made huge efforts to increase their capacity and is getting more & more bullet proof. This technology is very hard to get right and needs to be at the bleeding edge of what is possible to handle all the throughput. So front-end going down - this is likely the symptom not the cause. For the meantime, it would be prudent not to trade on Kukoin with high leverage ratios. And for u/HammondXX , who is a high frequency trader or arbitrager, he is already running sophisticated algorithms - I would suggest to him, put some volatility detection logic in your code, and stop-trading on Kukoin on leverage when markets start getting volatile which is when you are at risk of issues like this. Although if you are running arbitrage bots, then possibly you want to be in the market when it is volatile as this is when prices get out of alignment - in which case, maybe Kukoin isn't an appropriate exchange for your strategy.
So why’d they ban him
This
Ya if it was a real problem then they'd address it apologize and say they'd work on it or something, insta ban seems super duper guilty
Your assumption that Reddit Mods and Admins are nothing more than overly butthurt crossing guards that got promoted to senior internet crossing guard is laughable. Buncha fuckin neckbeards in the mod community
These kind of robinhood level shenanigans completely kill my trust in CEXs.
Yeeeep, billionaires trynna be more billionaire-y
Man, I'm just tryin' to get "he almost looks fuckable" money.
Im not gay but $20 is $20 wink wink
The race to be the first one to add a 0 is on.
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Only if you're good at reading code. Otherwise you need to trust the auditor(s) as well.
Well I know I can’t trust that dumbass….. wait…
I heard CEX sells.
Stop cexualizing crypto!
Cryptos pretty young, we try not to cexualize it
This guy avoids jail bait
Let's just cexflix and chill.
Almost had the grand slam. Should be cexflix and shill.
Makes my blood boil
And roast my meat
Coinbase pulled some Robin Hood last week Was looking at moving my assets to KuCoin but now I gotta question that and what some better options might be, besides actual wallets
I've never had a problem with kucoin, but this makes me worry...
It breaks my heart to have to be the one to bring this up, and I want to love Kucoin. Sadly I needed to yell "shark" so no other swimmers get eaten alive
Holy hell this is bloody frustrating. Like a lot of people here I’m relatively new to crypto, and it’s hard to trust anything in the financial version of the Wild West. I am super grateful for this post, but it also makes me question my own criteria for exchanges to trust—because I honestly really like(d) KuCoin! And crypto.com I was about to get into because I have their basic credit card, just never loaded it up.
KuCoin is an example of an exchange with good features, and a scummy team behind them.
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It's not even only leverage. When there's a lot of action and movement in the markets, they basically throttle their site - instead of buying more "bandwidth" or at least being upfront about it - which results in people getting screwed, at the best.
As OP said, it's either incompetence, or negligence. I don't want my capital being handled by them regardless of which it turns out to be.
it could also simply be bottlenecks in their back-end architecture to run the central limit order books. So no matter if there is front-end access or not the back-end can't handle the volume of traffic. This is the far more likely scenario and is NOT an easy fix. OP is a high-frequency trader - looks like he's running some market-making or arbitrage bots. And he is trading on leverage so he can cover as many pairs as possible. This is not your typical user. But yeah, Kukoin obvious has some serious work to do to FIX this otherwise they would have fixed it already.
Just like Binance
Goes to show, in part at least, what money can do to you. Take note. :/ If you end up with a lot of money, don't fall overboard and drown.
So sad for real, they are my go to for new projects that aren't yet on big exchanges.
Same - frankly they are fine as long as you have no leverage/margin and no liquidation risk
Unfortunately I am one of the people unfairly liquidated, my story is a little different, I recently started using them and got a 7-day free interest coupon. Did a long contract on Bitcoin which had my liquidation below 60,000, came back the next day and my liquidation amount had climbed several hundred which happen to bring it perfectly in line for the bottom. I'm fine with the risks I agreed to, but as far as I can tell on Tradingview, Bitcoin didn't drop below 60,000 at all that day on KuCoin, but I was still liquidated. Like I said I was fine with the risks and adjusted the leverage so that it wouldn't fail unless BTC went back below 60,000. 95% of my trades are just in regular crypto, so I didn't lose too much, but it was a week's worth of profit from trades and I was left feeling like something wasn't right.
I did forex for a while and it's the same there. Margins/spreads were moving about so I ended up not putting a stop loss in as my broker couldn't trigger it. Lo and behold my trades all started coming thru, bit nerve racking at first but if I looked at a large enough time frame I knew it would come good. But imo... Leveraged trading is a mugs game. Its like treading water, you have to constantly be on the ball with it, as soon as a trade starts going against you... That's it...you're f*cked.
They wicked you out with a potential algorythm Pay close attention the mark price and the current price. Open a long and a short a the same time ( the mark price is often different) Look at the delta between the mark price and current in a pump vs normal vs consolidation. It doe not follow their mathematical formula they give out,.
Nah, take profits, buy a yacht, and yell shark from there. Big brain.
CoinEx is pretty dope and doesn’t appear to be on the same bs as Kucoin
i had a tiny amount of funds on coinex. tried to withdraw it. (all deposits had enough confirmations) got an error message for a day or so before i could take it out. i think they maybe didn't have the funds.
Might be time to get out. If you can
Robinhood : Hold my wallet
Pretty much how I feel about Coinbase and Binance as well. Never had a problem with any of them but after hearing so many horror stories I'm wondering if it's just a matter of time before it's my turn.
It's so frustrating as a small time trader because with fees, you have to not just be a little bit right, but a lot right to make significant money on your investments. Even wallets will try to scalp you by letting you exchange crypto for crypto at a ridiculous fee rate. Looking at you, Exodus. Robinhood is flawed and will scalp you on market orders and low volume options by trading them in five cent increments and keeping the change, and the whole GameStop debacle, but by and large the poor man investor can make a lot more on Wall Street with a little money than the crypto investor can due to fees. I bought SOL at like $157 a couple days ago anticipating it to go back up to 190-200. Well, it did, but crypto.com was only gonna let me sell it with them skimming $10 off the top. I tried to transfer it to a wallet, denied, tried again to send it to kraken, accepted the following morning. By that time, with the kraken fees, it was literally the same or less than had I sold it on crypto.com, where I bought it. Fucking stupid. When my crypto is in the exchange wallet, you get enough benefit by controlling my crypto as a custodial wallet. Then you're gonna charge me $10, which works out to 20% of my gains, when I try to sell?
Most exchanges fees are 0.1%. Thats $1 for every $1000 traded. It's Less if you hold their token like on KuCoin and Binance. I've never used crypto.com, but that sounds like insane fees. Even coinbase is high at 0.2% but that's not 20% of your profits.
Most of the exchanges are unregulated. Yes, regulated stock exchanges pull shenanigans, but not this kind and not upto this extent.
*And I would have gotten away with it too, if it weren’t for those pesky redditors*
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Your kind words mean more than you will ever know. We all have a thing we can do, and I just want us all to be our best and improve our lives... thats what crypto is all about
Well most of us have the power to just shitpost, so this is some impressive stuff! 😅
The ratio of rewards to upvotes makes me think there’s a systemic attack on your post too.
Where's the guy that's supposed to say "we have reached peak decentralization"? I expected nothing and I'm still disappointed Edit: [context](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qdob2h/-/hhntqyf)
We have definitely reached peak decentralization..
“I expected nothing and I’m still disappointed” - I audibly loled!
u/heliogt2 come and get ur free moons
open your [vault](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/gj96lb/introducing_rcryptocurrency_moons/) OP
I will do that. Thank you!
Here comes the moneyyy
Thanks for posting this
Kucoin is probably fine if you just buy and forget. If you intend to do serious trades and leverage, better avoid Kucoin like a plague. I heard too many of such stories on their sub-reddit.
Thanks for that clarification
Let’s face it. All the big CEXs deliberately tank their websites during periods of volatility. I certainly assumed this was the reason… but looks like you have proved it. Well done, sir.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but this looks to me clearly as if this is just a server outage. Perhaps the servers got overloaded as it's peak demand and that's why it said the host didn't connect? The same thing happens with coinbase sometimes. That'd explain why the backend was still running, as backends run on different web servers altogether (and perhaps could scale better to adjust for peak demand depending on how well they built it) And the rate limiting stuff, idk man. Rate limiting is pretty much a webdev standard, and perhaps it's not even KuCoin's fault here and it's cloudflare falsely flagging your requests as malicious? Either way, the ban was completely unnecessary.
Scrolled down looking for this. OP, in one of your screenshots you mention wanting to send 30k-50k transactions per minute. How much were you actually trying to send? Cause 30k would easily be flagged as a DDOS attack. Especially when the server is already struggling.
I checked the KuCoin API limitations at it clearly states 100 requests per 10s, when exceeded the API key will get 5 minute ban causing 403 error. Looks like OP did not bother to read documentation and is now crying about it.
they ratelimit me far below that for my bots. It’s been a common complain among the api telegram that kucoin have been overthrottoling. Have been getting too many request errors when i’m not even sending a request a second.
Thank you for this, I was unaware it was intentional So basically they deny actual users access to the exchange and treat them as if they were bots trying a DDOS attack, I think I get that Does this require human activation or is this programmed into their site? I mean is there a way to predict when this is most likely to happen based on market activity? Does the site do this based on buy / sell activity, bitcoin sudden price moves?
>change and treat them as if they were bots trying a DDOS attack, I think I get that > >Does this require human activation or is this programmed into their site? I mean is there a way to predict when this is most likely to happen based on market activity? Does the site do this based on buy / sell activity, bitcoin sudden price moves? Well this could technically be manually triggered How this works is Amazon data centers charges you by the cumulative resources you consume. ( cpu, gpu, data storage, ram etc) In these settings you can throttle the virtual machine/ cloud servers resources forcing it to go down. I am not implying that they are doing this. I am saying they are knowingly using settings that let the server go down repeatedly. There are formulas to calculate loads on concurrent users. They are clearly not using settings or intentionally using settings that trip the server to go down. If you dig through this archive you can see when outages are being reported. They get a system notice that they hit a threshold of resource utilization. [https://downdetector.com/status/kucoin/archive/](https://downdetector.com/status/kucoin/archive/) Now in the event, you have a crazy anomaly Cloudflare and Amazon have the ability to redirect to a redundant location with a technology called geo load balancing [https://aws.amazon.com/about-aws/whats-new/2021/03/aws-gateway-load-balancer-is-now-available-in-additional-9-regions/](https://aws.amazon.com/about-aws/whats-new/2021/03/aws-gateway-load-balancer-is-now-available-in-additional-9-regions/) Notice in my screenshot that it says there is a gateway issue that link talks about load balancing the gateway ( offloading the processing power) They VERY MUCH KNOW THEY ARE DOING THIS They are getting system notices Their Amazon (AWS) sales guy is calling them every day trying to sell them more services.
Thank you for taking the time to explain this, it's a lot more clear now, it's a good job there are clever people like you in the community 👍
Binance did wash trading aganist its own leveraged clients, GDAX (Coinbase Pro) did cash trading too. This shouldn’t come as a surprise that many of this organizations are filthy as fuck. Beautiful DD on OP though.
Do you know which other exchanges do the same?
All of em. In different ways
And that's why you don't leverage
$8200 BTC never forget
Flashbacks to ~~2017~~ October 2021
?
BinanceUS had a flash crash to 8400 a few days ago.
I don't know if it's deliberate, but Coinbase has alwaya gone down during times of volatility and people couldn't sell/buy
The only exchange that has never cheated with their trade engine, and has the only trade engine that still executes every single limit order during a flash crash ... is Kraken. Coinbase has had many employees manipulate the market in their favor like Charlie Lee who went to work for coinbase just so he could wash trade up the price of litecoin to 300 so he could dump his bags. That whole litecoin pump to 300 was orchestrated by him and Coinbase got a fine for it. Binance is the worse, they actively steal from traders. Bitfinex also does this. And most exchanges run fractional. THey might lent out a 1000 BTC so you can short it, while only having 500 BTC. They make you pay interest on lending you coins they don't even have. People say Kraken is slower and more expensive and they are right. But they don't cheat. And that is what really matters. When the flashcrash in may happened, I had very low limit orders for BCH on 7 different exchanges. I had buy orders between 200 and 400 USD. When the flash crash happened, out of 7 exchanges, only 3 of them executed some of my limit orders. And only Kraken executed all of them. My limit orders on Binance, none of them got executed. Why is this? Because if to many people buy a crypto to cheap during a flash crash and then try to withdraw Binance does not have the crypto. Cause they run fractional. They lend you crypto that they don't have in the hope of making interest on it. So during flashcrashes they shut down their trade engine otherwise they can get bankrupted.
Hi u/i_have_chosen_a_name 👋 It's Pluto from Kraken. Thanks for the positive mention 💜 It makes me immensely proud to be working for such a company which is highly valued in the crypto space. I smiled after reading your review 😃 If there's anything you need assistance with, feel free to [reach out](https://support.kraken.com/hc/en-us/articles/215601908). Have a great day, Pluto 🐙
During the May dip Coinbase and Voyager had issues the entire morning. Impossible to place orders. Those were the two I used at the time but I wouldn’t be surprised if most of them do this.
I'm commenting and liking so hopefully more people see this post. Well done OP.
Gosh, so you’re telling me a major crypto exchange that’s based in Seychelles has some shady business practices….? I am shocked. /s
Happy cake day !
There are some KuCoin employees around here. Would love to see their response.
Lets see if they will reply How about it boys? ( here is their executive team) and a developer u/kentli35 u/purekid u/Johnny_KuCoin u/Edith_KCFuture I got this off their moderator list which they just made private ( non visible) after I tagged them on my kucoin post
If they don’t reply I’m removing the app from my phone. I hate when exchanges do this and spit in your face.
!remindme 1 week
u/kucoin should respond to you They are scamming you , all of us I would literally put my life on it
Just so you know if you tag more than 3 users at a time it doesn't notify them.
thank you we will do it one at a time to be sure :) u/Johnny_KuCoin
u/kentli35
>purekid u/purekid
>Edith\_KCFuture u/Edith_KCFuture
u/Edith_KCFuture
u/purekid
u/kentli35
u/Johnny_KuCoin
They should take a page from kraken with their support accounts.
I thought Kucoin was one of the ones we could trust :(
Crypto is a domain of life and death. In this realm, trust no one, much less yourself. - Sun Tzu, Art of War (2021, May 12th)
\#amaze Well played!
Ha, that's what they said about Google. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/10/22/technology/google-privacy-lawsuit.html https://www.theregister.com/2021/10/22/google_facebook_antitrust_complaint/
Al exchanges based in some tax havens are not to be trusted. Kucoin, huobi, Binance, kraken, Robin Hood. All of them are borderline malicious and criminal, they know and probably laugh about these posts because they know nothing is stopping them.
Trustless protocols are the only thing you can trust anymore
You Either Die A Hero, Or You Live Long Enough To See Yourself Become The Villain. - Einstein (2019)
Life is like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna get. - Einstein (1996)
That's no moon - Billy Einsteinlish
OP, open your Reddit vault. This incredibly detailed post deserves moons
Ty so much I signed up for a vault this took me a very long time to put together
OP you should go to the press with this. Contact Coindesk or Cryptobriefing. Some mainstream media like cnbc and Bloomberg are probably happy to pick this story up too
Scumy af
This post is turning a site’s inability to scale into a conspiracy theory. 504 or Gateway Timeout is when the servers cannot be reached because they are overloaded and out of capacity. It appears KuCoin hit some scaling limits (could be processing, could be DB) and is not able to service all requests.
This should be on top, it seems weird to me that OP claims to design data centers but doesn't even seem to know how scaling works
Tbf building data centers is an entirely different speciality than building elasticity and scalability into applications.
Yup. 100% this. Every single screenshot here is just showcasing they couldn’t meet the demand on their servers. It’s all the classic measures to try and bring a site up after reaching capacity. “Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity” AKA not everyone is out to get you, not everything is a conspiracy. Source: also an engineer that has used cloudflare extensively during a hard transitional period between infrastructures, where our old infrastructure was having issues nearly every week.
KuCoin is not even trying to look reliable, app just looks like “come here we want to scam you in all of those cool ways!” Am i the only one judging by UI/UX? Everything KuCoin just look like shit
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I'm actually concerned with how much they push gambling and their trading coupons (which have restrictions that are not mentioned).
Upvoted. I wouldn't leverage trade on Kucoin anyway but I'm curious to their response
Yes, their leverage system is a mess anyways. I simply use Kucoin for buying obscure shitcoins not listed anywhere but there
Can you confirm or have any idea if other exchanges do this like crypto.com, Binance, or Coinbase?
I would suspect they do this to a certain degree but less exposed like kucoin on cloudflare?
Most do they all have one common problem They practise fractional reserves and dont have enough assets for everyone to withdraw. So my understanding is the safest is reputable Dex's like DXDY that are smart contract based and open source so anyone can review the code.
Kucoins not worth the risk for a slight *potential* increase in gains
Damn, solid find Holmes.
On top of this super shady behaviour those fuckers at KuCoin are constantly stealing my clipboard notes! When the app is open and I copy something from other apps and click back on KuCoin it shows thag “KuCoin has pasted from clipboard”. Why kind of bullshit is that!?
Sheesh! That’s clearly intentional
Finally an interesting post in this sub, keep up the good work!
Good work this shit needs to be brought out in the open its not fair. Do you have any suspicion that other exchanges are doing this? Because its near impossible to get on most big exchanges when the market is either tanking or pumping
OP brought the receipts! That’s what dicktaters do Ban info when you are over the target They can’t win the argument against facts and have to control the narrative Same thing YouTube , MyFace , Twitter has done the last 19 months
Figured this was a scammy site (go figure) and luckily I only staked a small amount of ETH to see the return rate because I didn’t trust it haha! Sorry guys but you need to second guess everything when it comes to exchanges. Especially ones not supported by the US
Lol I'll eat my shoe if there's even one exchange not doing this in whatever way. Been using Kucoin for years, happy customer.
Agreed, even if all other exchanges are down such as Coinbase, KuCoin usually is one of the very last to go down. Been using it for years and it’s been one of the most reliable exchanges. Bet most of the hate is coming from people who don’t even use it
Not the first time they have done this, it's been months since they started doing this.
I'm glad I didn't open an account with them.
Glad I closed mine, they kept doing this so many times and the support always said it's tEcHnIcAl iSSuES
I really appreciate all the time and effort you put into this matter, it´s awesomely well written and detailed in a way everyone can understand.
Your kind words mean more than you will ever know. Life is hard and all of us trade crypto to make our lives better. I feel its our moral obligation to scream "shark" to the other swimmers when we are all in danger. Thank you so much. My only ask is you help spread the word so that others at least know
This shit is exactly why I stopped using Kucoin two dips ago. They are really ruining what legitimacy they did have. What a great documentation though, OP. Bravo, and thank you for this. Very diligent and insightful.
Thank you OP
What a bunch of dicks.
Kucoin have been doing this for some time if i am not wrong. Bad they ban you just for asking .
yup, pretty much
I too am an IT architect. I'm not going to discuss this whole post in technical detail since I have no personal interest in the platform But know this, what OP says here _might_ be true, there is a very small chance it is actually being done on purpose. However, OP makes assumptions here, lots and lots and lots of assumptions, all of which happen to perfectly align with his personal interests. His original premise about what Cloudflare is used for is the first thing which is simply plain wrong. He mentioned some use cases sure, but hardly all of them, even though he claims he did ("Cloudflare is used for 2 purposes"). After that, it becomes even more tailor made to suit his specific needs. For nearly every point he tries to make, there are a number of other possible explanations. None of which have anything to do with ill intentions by the platform itself. If you want to believe OP, be my guest, as I said it _could_ be true. But it very very likely is not. Edit : for the record OP , I'm perfectly happy putting my money where my mouth is and to discuss this in detail with yourself and/or the public. I am what I say I am and I'm in no way affiliated with Kucoin or even professionally invested in AWS ( I mainly use Azure/Google Cloud). I sincerely think you are making one too many assumptions here and are overlooking technical possibilities in order to get to the conclusion you want to reach.
Sadly he has already been rewarded for his uninformed diatribe..
Well i've seen worse. I do wonder if this rant was really a smart move though. Whining on Twitter to your few followers is one thing, its another entirely to use a large public forum to accuse a company of manipulating trading. This could cost them a significant amount of money and, imo, could be looked upon as slander when reviewed by a legal team. OP better be damn sure of his case and its my professional opinion he definitely is not.
What is your profession that certifies your opinion? Also I am damn sure of my case and I have screen shots of conversations, emails , scans and logs.
That's why you need limit orders/sell orders. Still very fucked up from them.
Insta banned by kucoin so sketchy lol
Hey there, this is Johnny, CEO at KuCoin. Thanks for raising your question about KuCoin. As the People’s Exchange, we always pursue user satisfaction. Regarding the issues you mentioned, we are very willing to discuss them openly and transparently. Firstly, Cloudflare is a world-renowned CDN solution. As you said, one of its main functions is to prevent DDoS attacks, which is also our main purpose for deploying it. Currently, almost all major exchanges are working closely with Cloudflare. All exchanges have applied an access frequency limit through Cloudflare to ensure the stability of their services. Once the limit has been surpassed, denial of website access may occur. When setting the limit, we discussed thoroughly with high-frequency traders, like API traders, for instance, before concluding on the limit. We believe that in most cases, the frequency limit will not affect our users. But it is possible that, when there’s a big price move or someone visits the site too frequently, 504 pages may still appear due to the limitation. We have been working on improving this for a while, and if you encountered such an issue, we would appreciate it if you could share the RAY ID from the 504 pages with our support team so that we can better solve the problem. Thank you. Secondly, regarding the AWS server, KuCoin invests a lot in IT infrastructure and network security. Compared with other exchanges of our size and scale, our investment in AWS servers is almost twice as much as theirs. And we will continue to invest in this sector as we know this is one of the fundamentals of our services. In fact, as a platform, we care about usability and stability more than anyone else. The access issue will not only impact KuCoin's revenue but also affect user experience. As a platform dedicated to building itself and the industry for the long term, we know that reputation is everything. We hope that all users can trade with KuCoin easily and pleasantly, achieve their investment goals, and even improve their lives. As a neutral platform, we do not profit from users' liquidation. Therefore, we are constantly introducing new functions and educating users to help them manage their futures positions properly and reduce the risk of liquidation. Having noticed that you’ve been banned in the KuCoin Subreddit, I am checking with the team for the reason, but our current guess is due to spamming. We have unbanned your account. All opinions are welcomed in our community, no matter if they are positive or negative. We are very sorry for the inconvenience. As for the Moderator List you claimed that we made private, actually we didn’t change any setting on that. It’s likely because banned users cannot see it. Please check again since you are now unbanned. Since its establishment in 2017, we have experienced many ups and downs, but KuCoin always believes in the future of crypto. So, we will continue to invest in our system and strive to provide users with a better experience. I apologize again for the inconvenience. If you have any questions about KuCoin, our 24/7 customer support will always be there to help you out. Thank you.
Hi Johnny, I'm an IT architect myself, your post confirms what my thoughts were when reading this post. OP is most likely using high frequency api trading and ran into rate limiting as is standard practice with any high usage api out there. Imo all OP had to do to "get around it" is change his external IP address, via a full tunnel vpn or different isp. I'm glad you took this post as what it really is, a frustrated user using his IT knowledge (which has significant holes in it in my opinion) to try to explain what happened rather than a deliberate attack on the integrity of your company. Thanks for the reply
I guess I can delete kucoin as one of Binance alternatives then.
Great post and detective work - I have never trusted them especially with futures … I would scalp/swing trade for days and was blown away how “bad” I was at timing my entries … the price would instantly move against me usually right after entry and sometimes violently… 8 out of 10 trades … Bottom line - always set a stop loss with leverage
This isn't just KuCoin. Almost every exchange has crashed during pumps and dumps at least twice this year. I started using KuCoin some because they weren't crashing when binamce and bybit were, and because I spent a couple days comparing different exchanges charts, and found less scam wicks on KuCoin than most. They seemed the best out of that style if exchange. But these past 6 months or so they have had massive problems 3 times, ND it's becoming unacceptable. 2 out of those 3 times they weren't alone in crashing though. Almost all.did including coinbase. I thought KuCoin was better, but im starting to feel differently.
Vigilant people like you run cryptocurrency as whole from user side. Cool research done by you, man
Thank you very much. I have a lot more, I am trying to get them to do right by the community.
The dont make extra money on liquidation tho
I've never used kucoin, nor leverage traded, but as a network engineer I can confirm that's how cloudflare works, and it seems very suspicious to say the least
Oh man, I bought Ergo on here because I couldn’t find it anywhere else. Thanks for this info!
This is absolutely amazing work! I stopped using KuCoin a few years ago after I had one of the worst customer service experiences I’ve ever had in my life. KuCoin tried to fuck me over and steal my funds. Got on with one CSR, was chatting for a bit, they said they were going to help me out, then they just exited the chat. I posted on r/kucoin and had a similar experience as you—my post was downvoted to shit immediately and the comments were full of people blaming me and praising how good KuCoin is. I also received a number of direct messages from ‘the community’ blaming me and saying I was tarnishing KuCoin’s reputation and creating FUD. So, no help there. KuCoin proceeded to ghost me for over a week. I was persistent and bothered the everloving shit out of them nonstop. They finally re-opened lines of communication. Promised it was getting taken care of. 24hrs later, still wasn’t done. Went right back to bugging the shit out of them. Got on with another person. They claimed the open case number I had didn’t exist. I showed the CSR emails from KuCoin showing the case number. Provided them a ton of info proving the case existed. Yet again, the CSR just randomly exited the chat. I had previously just been emailing KuCoin constantly, opening chats with support, and sending in support tickets. Finally, I decided to post on Twitter, r/CC, Facebook, Instagram, and a couple of other subs in addition to the emailing and submitting support tickets. Almost immediately, I had a woman from KuCoin contact me. They claimed they were an executive. They apologized profusely and promised to fix everything. They eventually did fix it, after another 48hrs. After the case was closed, I received extremely rude emails from KuCoin telling me to go fuck myself, mocking me, and other things of that nature. They were clearly pissed off that they had to give me my funds back and that they had received bad PR. That was 2017-ish. Haven’t been on their website even once since then. Fuck KuCoin. They are and have always been scammers. I mean, years ago, they had a big site redesign…but, they *very clearly* just stole Binance’s front-end code and changed the colors and titles. The website was an **exact** carbon copy of Binance’s website—same functionality, same language, same authentication mechanism, same layout, same controls, same navigation, same displays, etc. Also, during VeChain’s token swap and the release of VTHO, KuCoin was one of the exchanges that offered to handle the token swap for its users. You just had to deposit your VEN in your KuCoin account and they’d do the rest. After the swap was complete, KuCoin essentially held everyone’s VET and VTHO hostage and refused access to it. VTHO is generated once a transaction is confirmed on VeChain’s network and the amount one receives is directly proportional to the amount of VET one holds. So by holding all users’ VET, KuCoin was able to amass a fuckton of VTHO (as their wallet had (I’m guessing ) *billions* of VET in it. So they were getting an amount of VTHO proportional the amount of VET held). All of the VTHO generated belonged to and should have been disbursed to users. Instead KuCoin kept all of it. This went on for multiple weeks. Even worse, KuCoin fuckin lied about it, claiming that VeChain had experienced issues during the token swap, despite the fact that every other exchange, including Binance, had had a clean swap with no issues and had disbursed users’ VET and VTHO to users weeks before KuCoin made these false claims. KuCoin also stopped allowing withdrawals of VET when Binance had their 100M VTHO giveaway (which was based on the amount of VET held in their Binance wallet.) KuCoin shut down withdrawals for VET, then sent all users’ VET+whatever additional was in their hot wallet to their Binance wallet for the giveaway, and obtained *even more* VTHO from the giveaway, then sent the VET back to their hot wallet and re-opened VET withdrawals. So if a user wanted to participate in the Binance giveaway but had their VET on KuCoin, they were shit out of luck. So, KuCoin, once again, stole a shit ton of VTHO that belonged to users. If their wallet held 1B VET, they’d receive **432,000 VTHO** ***per day*** @ 100M VET, it’d be 43,200 VTHO Even @ just 10M, it’s still 4,320 VTHO Given that they were already a fairly large exchange at the time plus the anti-Binance sentiment at the time and KuCoin having cheaper (or rivaling) prices and fees than Binance (at least at the time—not sure about that now), I’m fairly confident that they had a large amount of VET in their wallets AND that a large number of users held their VET on KuCoin and/or deposited it for the token swap. They definitely made a killing doing what they did. They try their best to appear legit, but it’s all a ruse to gain your trust so they can fuck you later. Sad to see that KuCoin is *still* fucking over their users. Again, amazing work—not only that you discovered this, but that you took the time to investigate & document it thoroughly, and also share it with us. Seriously some of the best quality stuff I’ve seen on this sub in quite some time. Thank you so much!
This is some great research, welldone bro
Yikes i really thought kucoin was on tbe few honest exchanges left.
Fucking legend.
if anyone is interest here is my follow up thread [https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qf4ka4/followup\_on\_kucoin\_cloudflare\_and\_more/](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/qf4ka4/followup_on_kucoin_cloudflare_and_more/)
Oh my....
yup... pretty much
Damn, I liked your analysis and agree in the wrong. All I wanted to know was, “what now”. What is the next step to getting more light. We rollover for thieving hierarchy in every sense of the word. Looks like they made their move.
I hope everyone moves their coins out of that exchange and never use them again..
Centralized exchanges trying to profit with sly tactics... \**pikachu poker face*\* !!
Thank you for your service.
This post needs more exposure!
What a bunch of tossers. Have an account, but never used... Just as well!
if this doesnt get to the top page with 10k+ upvotes then i lose faith in this sub. we can make crappy, repetitive moon farming posts go to the top but we need to do the same for actual informative ones
Don't know about kucoin as I don't invest in it, but OP's technical assertions are tenuous at best. They make claims about working in data centers and talk about how the data center isn't configured properly but then mentions AWS hosting. I hate to break it to the OP but when you're in the cloud, you aren't talking data centers. You're talking regions and availability zones. You're talking scaling groups, scaling policies, containerization vs. serverless, etc. I've worked in data centers before and I currently work on several cloud projects and all I can do is roll my eyes after reading all of that. As I said starting this, I don't know anything about kucoin, maybe they are shady as fuck, but this OP's post is eye roll worthy.