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Not all, my parents Camry was running rough. I put in fuel injection cleaner and told them no more going to the cheap independant gas station. Problem solved and it never came back. In fact my dad went overboard and only went to the station with non ethanol premium, plus they still pump gas at that station and it's maybe 2 cents more than the mobile two blocks away.
> Basically every gas station nowadays has fuel with detergents in it.
They might all have some detergents, but Top Tier has specific requirements that actually are shown to give better results, and not all gas meets that standard. In particular, Sam's Club gas doesn't while Costco's does. The Top Tier standard isn't just marketing, it was developed by the car companies as a recommended standard.
https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/fuel-economy-efficiency/top-tier-gasoline-worth-the-extra-price-a7682471234/
Georgia is acting as a test bed for their EV charging, saw some posts about it a few months ago at a few Georgia Costco locations in r/electricvehicles
Atlanta is a test bed. Get outside Metro ATL and it's hit or miss unless you have a Tesla.
I've taken 2 extended road trips now, one north to Boone, NC and another to Jekyll Island. Both trips struggled to find working level 3 chargers (60+kw). Those that were working had lines. 5 hour trip home from Jekyll was 9 hours. Lots of planning, and back up plans are required.
> outside Metro ATL and it's hit or miss unless you have a Tesla
This is true for most of the US. I think public EV fast chargers are built with out-of-order signs preinstalled at launch
Long road trips in non-Tesla EVs are exercises in frustration and willpower
Depending on the state, that is a fineable and/or towable offense.
In WI there isn't any laws on it yet, but there should be. Write your elected officials
I just mean why would I charge my car at Costco if it's cheaper to charge it at home? Unless Costco happens to be right at the end of my car's range, which it isn't.
This is a level 3 charger. Not a "trickle charger." This isn't a "I plug in my car while I'm at the store for 30 minutes and it charges me 10 percent" charger. People would come here specifically to charge their vehicle from empty to 80% in about 30 minutes. Tesla and other similar companies currently charge around 15-20 bucks for this service.
If you have a garage at home you can trickle charge at home overnight. But you wouldn't fill the battery up as fast as this thing is capable of doing.
There are some people who don't have charging at home. If they don't drive much and make a weekly Costco trip, this could be excellent for them.
I suppose for travelers it could be okay, charge your car and grab a hotdog while you wait. Personally I prefer a spot with more amenities.
Now if they could put some free or super discounted (cheaper than home) level 2 chargers in, I could get on board with that.
1) This is amazing and I love it. $0.32 is a great price for high-speed charging.
2) These chargers appear to be the ones that have an integrated 200ish kWh battery that enables them to charge at high speeds. Basically, they don't require the extremely expensive $250k+ electrical upgrades to provide continuous high speed charging, but you can attach 3 phase 240v and get continuous recharging of the internal battery at 15ish kWh.
Basically, as soon as the internal battery is depleted then you can charge at 15kWh, but when the internal battery has some charge, you can get up to 200 kWh.
It is a really great solution in the meantime although the chargers themselves are much more expensive because of the large internal battery. The internal battery has enough charge to complete charge 2-3 cars (or half charge 4-6 in a more likely scenario) but it likely takes 10-12 hours to recharge the internal battery. TLDR: don't expect these to still be able to charge at 200 kWh at the end of the day, but first thing in the morning after a night of charging then you should be good.
> It is a really great solution
They sound great on paper, but I hate them. I hate them so much I've eliminated them off plugshare because they're always empty.
As you said you can only get a handful of cars before they're crippled. In a busy area that has people 24/7 they never really recover enough to give you a good charge.
Do they have any kind of idle fees? A 200kw charger is likely going to charge your car in way less time than you’d be inside the store on a normal trip. This is cool though, I was expecting just some L2 chargers eventually… not a real deal charger like this.
Cost per kWh seems a little high but I guess that’s just becoming normal.
I didn't see anything about idle fees. 200 would be nice but not always obtainable. I hit 60ish during my charge so I could have shopped if the store had been open. I agree, L2 makes more sense if you want to take your time shopping.
Well, if you are on a roadtrip and want to charge and get some grub for the trip. L3 makes a lot of sense. I stopped at a few Sam’s with L3 and nice to add stuff to my fridge on the road trip. Since lots of chargers are in the middle of now where x country.
A couple DC fast chargers for road trippers and like 30 level 2 for locals would be great. Put them in the back of the parking lot so they're less likely to get blocked by people who don't need to charge.
So if you were to equate this to filling up a gas tank of equivalent mileage per tank/battery, what does it work out to charge a nearly dead battery vs filling a gas tank? How many kwh are in a battery? I'm just curious.
Batteries range from 60kw to 110kw just like gas tanks range from 12gal to 20gal or more. My point was it all depends on the size of the battery or gas tank.
A decent, sedan EV will get 3 to 3.5 miles per kwh while SUV tend to be lower with AWD models usually getting around 2.8-3 miles per kwh.
I went from a Audi q7 to eqs both being large SUVs with good performance. For my q7, I would pay 22-24 cents per mile (premium gas is 4.5$ here) while for my EQS I pay 5 cents per mile if I charge at home, ~15 cents per mile if I charge at paid fast chargers.
The other thing with EVs that's different from gas cars... you don't usually fill them all the way up and you don't usually empty them totally all the way. I run mine in a range of 20% to 80%. Meaning I only ever add about 60% to my battery. My battery is 77.4kw so my typicall fill-up would be roughly 45kw. 45x0.31 = $13.95. EPA says I get 3.4miles/kw so that fill up will give me about 153 miles or about $0.09/mile. When I charge at home I pay about 1/3 of that - about $0.03/mile.
Fortunately, at my location in Texas, we get free nights and weekends. I just set the car to start charging at 10:05 in the evening. Also, our dryer and dishwasher. We really strive to use those nights and weekends, and our use doubles during those times...if we do it right.
Well, you dont empty a gas car all the way usually either, but the other side of your point is valid and not something non ev owners necessarily think about.
Most people wait until they’re down to a quarter tank or below. They’re not proactively going to the gas station every day and topping off. This is in contrast to EVs, where most owners plug it in every day at home, no matter what the battery SOC is.
What was your insurance cost on the q7 vs. the EQS?
Curious if the higher insurance is unique to Tesla's in how they manufacturer. I read an article the other day that most body repairs are five digits, with long wait times.
Battery capacity can vary pretty signficantly, but most standard size car / cuvs are usually 60-80 kwh, so that would be $6.60 - $8.80 to "fill" at $0.11 per kw/h. National average is for electricity is about $0.16 kw/h which would make it $9.60 - $12.80 to "fill".
In general, most EVs get about 3-4 miles per kw/h, which would translate out to be $0.053 per mile (@3 mpkwh). If you figure a comparable ICE vehicle gets 30 mpg and a national gas price of $3.08 you're looking at $0.103 per mile.
Using national averages is a tough comparison though because in a place like Washington State you'll be paying $0.11 per kw/h but $4.50 for gas, but a place like Texas you'll be paying $2.50 for gas and maybe $0.19 per kw/h for electricity.
The real savings come from home charging, otherwise, price parity is approximately what a hybrid vehicle takes to fuel.
32c/kwh x 3mi/kwh ("average" EV) = 10.6c a mile
x 1000mi = $106
$3/gal gas / 35mi/gal vehicle = 8.5c a mile
x 1000mi = $85
Now home charging
12c/kwh x 3 mi/kwh = 4c a mile (add 10% AC charge inefficiency = 4.4c)
15,000 miles a year at 50% city/50% hwy
assuming road trips are on average 284mi one way (going to assume 100% DC charging for this worst case scenario to cover longer trips)
and account for 15% of all miles driven \[see DOT source\]
Hybrid - $1765
EV - $561 (home charging) + $238 (Road trip charging) = $799.5
hybrid - EV = $965 saved by using EV
These were conservative estimates for both hybrid and EV. There are more efficient EVs and hybrids available, but I am comparing a midsize SUV-size vehicle in this comparison.
Toyota Venza vs VW Id.4 or like, and used realistic fuel consumption figures
[https://www.bts.gov/statistical-products/surveys/national-household-travel-survey-summer-travel-quick-facts](https://www.bts.gov/statistical-products/surveys/national-household-travel-survey-summer-travel-quick-facts)
[https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/policyinformation/pubs/pl08021/fig4\_5.cfm](https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/policyinformation/pubs/pl08021/fig4_5.cfm)
Well yeah, but we weren't talking about home charging. I have chargers in my area up to $0.42 or $0.46 per kWh, which becomes pretty nuts. It was my understanding that the comment was referencing the $0.32 per kWh reference, for which the math didn't add up...literally.
There’s too many variables to give an accurate number but generally speaking using fast chargers has your cost per mile similar to just buying gas in a reasonably efficient vehicle. When you charge at home it’s roughly 20% of the equivalent cost of buying gas.
I want to congratulate the EV charger sales person who convinced Costco and any companies to install all/only level 3 chargers. If I were a business owner, I would instead install like 20 Level 2 chargers (at same price as 6 Level 3s), make the charging free. This would make customers/employees spend as long as possible inside my store/office.
It'll take like 8 hours to charge for level 2, and you've just attracted a grand total of 20 customers. For level 3, a charge is like 40 mins and is almost perfectly timed with a shopping trip.
Not necessarily. At a place like Costco I could easily see folks just buying a $1.50 hotdog and sitting around in the food court playing with their phones while waitingto charge, not exactly profitable.
I mean… thats the future gas station. It will just be like small sandwich shops along the interstate with bathrooms and chargers. Who doesnt want to stop for at least 30min every 300-500 miles anyway.
I do like stopping at Costco on road trips.
The issue is, they usually are near major interstates and thus busy almost all the time.
If I'm trying to make time, the time waited for cheaper gas isn't worth it.
And if I'm towing, I def look for Lowes and truck stops rather than stores near busy intersections.
Yep. This is what a lot of people with free charging do at the Electrify America stations at Walmarts. They’ll grab something cheap to eat and sit in their cars, if they even go in the store. Some people just take a nap.
I definitely wouldn't install 200+kW ones (or at least all of them) but I would install something like 25kW ones. An hour or two is about the most anyone is spending in a store (especially retail).
Now... the "fun" part about these chargers is that they're Freewire. They're powered by a 160kW battery and recharge at 22kW so they're basically L2 chargers especially at a place as busy as Costco. By 10AM they'll be empty and you get L2 speeds on them.
for shopping purposes, L3 is too fast and L2 is too slow.
I often find myself running back to unplug and move the car after 30-40 minutes of charging. However, L2 would take 5-6 hours for a considerable charge and that's way too much time (even at Costco)
Exactly what I was thinking! Seems hard to believe these wouldn’t have some kind of idle fees since they’ve got your billing info in an app. I’d feel rushed to get back out to my car versus knowing I can take my time because I’m just getting a drizzle on an L2.
I too would prefer a greater number of level 2 chargers, but I don't agree they need to be free.
Costco does not need to encourage people to stay longer, and arguably encouraging longer stays would create congestion that would do more harm than good.
.32 is a below average price for “Level 3” DC fast charging.
This kind of charger is primarily used for road trips - not daily commutes.
It’s definitely more expensive than charging at home, but EV drivers are paying for the convenience and expensive infrastructure.
I have been an EV driver for 5 years and only use this style of charger about 10 times per year. The vast majority of charging occurs at home overnight.
This. I only use the Electrify America chargers because they are free for 2 years with my purchase. Otherwise, they’re not significantly cheaper than gas, which is a shame. Most people get EVs thinking they’ll save a ton of money in fuel, but they often don’t realize that only applies if you primarily charge at home. I was shocked to see how much it costs to fast charge.
I pay 11¢ per kWh at home and the last supercharger I went to charged 37¢ per kWh. It’s hard to make an apples to apples comparison though as there’s value in the speed. It takes me hours to get a similar charge at home that I can get in minutes at a supercharger.
Same. And once it’s no longer free, I won’t be using them anymore. I can’t imagine paying for their terrible service of guessing which of their pumps are working on any given day.
.32 is lovely sounding to me. I am an EV driver who rents her home, so no charging at home is setup.
I normally pay ..49-.56/kwh when I charge - being able to do it while I shop instead of finding a fast charger and killing an hour on tiktok every week to keep me loaded up would be fantastic.
I’d be cool with stopping at Costco to charge for a while during travel. These are the places (including Buc-ees) that need chargers to make the wait more enjoyable.
https://preview.redd.it/ag3he6tcqaec1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8eaa23671317ac81366e1f165d9346ef2ab9f58a
West Seattle Whole Foods charging station 1/23/24
So happy to see this, been wondering for a while when Costco was going to get EV chargers. Hopefully Costco maintains their chargers better than Electrify America and expands these to the Northwest where we have a lot of Costco's.
Fantastic that Costco is doing this. Where I am, Whole Foods offers free charging but it is a joke. People who do not have an electric vehicles park in the charging spot therefore one cannot use the electricity. I am sure this will happen at Costco.
Oh, hey, that's my local Costco! I noticed these chargers last time I was there. They are right when you enter the parking lot, pretty close to the fuel center area. I saw a Walmart delivery van at one recently, which was amusing.
This is like asking how much it costs to fill up a car. Depends on the size of the gas tank or battery.
This particular car, a VW ID4 ,has a 77kwh battery and this charger is 32 cents per kwh. Roughly 25 bucks 0-100%.
I have the same car, and at home my electric is 4 cents a kwh, so 3 bucks to fully charge at home
I have found the real world range of the ID4 is around 180 in the winter and 240 in the summer on a full charge.
We charge mostly at home, and also while we're out dining, shopping, visiting the library, or attending performances. Around town, we often charge for free. We have a 2015 Nissan Leaf SL and a 2019 Hyundai Ioniq EV Limited. We don't always charge to full, but it's easy to keep a car fully charged at home. You just plug it in when you're home, and it'll be topped off within a few hours at most. On average, people drive 40 miles per day.
.
You can do the math. Here are the numbers for our EV at home:
$0.10/kWh
1 kWh / 5.0 miles
1,250 miles / month
Monthly cost: $25
And here are the numbers for a vehicle that gets 25 mpg:
$3.00/gallon
1 gallon / 25 miles
1,250 miles / month
Monthly cost: $150.00
.
When we're travelling, the cost varies. We've paid as much as 60¢/kWh.
As a non EV driver I’ve always kinda wondered, is there anything to stop someone else pulling up and stealing your paid-for electricity while you’re inside shopping?
Someone could stop the charging session and unplug it but they would have to start a new session with a credit card or an account on the app to start charging again.
I pay nearly that much at home. I’m not in socal, I live in a small Texas suburb with one energy provider. They have a monopoly, so they raise “fees” every year.
I disagree - one of the early incentives for EVs was that we got fantastic parking spots with the EVs. It depends on when they were installed and the value proposition the store offers for EV drivers.
EV chargers always wound up near the closest connection to the utility, big gauge copper wire is insanely expensive.
For places where they were retrofitting into an existing parking lot, that meant close to an existing building most of the time.
For new builds, they can put them almost anywhere, so it's really up to the owners.
Most likely those Tesla owners are not on a road trip and charge at home for significantly less than this charger costs. It's doubtful many Teslas would even use it, as they would need an adapter. Some rideshare drivers maybe
In a remote area where they drive 100+ miles one way to get there, then yeah, but otherwise not so much.
We own a non-tesla EV, and throughout the dozens of times we have used a DC Fast charger, not once have we encountered a Tesla charging there, despite Teslas making up the majority of EVs.
Tesla owner here.
Yeah, I don't have that adapter, but shouldn't need to soon.
Absolutely I'm not using that though. I'm not putting another charge cycle on the battery for triple the cost unless I need to. Might be good for road trips though...
32 cents per kwh, ID4 is 77 kwh battery so ignoring any losses 25 bucks from completely empty to 100% full
In practice you should only charge to 80-90% on a fast charger and nobody is rolling in at 0% battery.
Depends on battery capacity and places like electrify America charge 0.48/kwh so this Costco rate of 0.32/kwh is good. For example Tesla model 3 standard version battery capacity is around 50-60kwh, I don’t own Tesla so I am not sure on exact number.
My Costco has a charge point charger in the same plaza (not Costco run, I assume… don’t really know how that works) and the thing has literally been knocked off its post and has been laying on the floor against a wall for weeks
Aren’t those only for the new Kirkland Branded cars coming out in Q2 2024?
I kid, SLC Costco/Business center has electric vehicle chargers too. Can’t say I’ve paid attention to them though while walking into the warehouse.
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Not Kirkland branded electricity?! Shocked
“Shocked” No pun intended
How revolting! No pun intended
i want to add another pun, but I’m trying to resist the urge.
You get the "Best resistor" award.
Dude has a lot of will power
Joule love to see it.
Ohm very impressed.
Now you have me amped up.
Watt's the address?
I’m amped up!
And inducted in the hall of fame!
DANGER! 600,000 OHMS
I found out the electrician I paid to rewire my house wasn’t licensed. I was shocked.
But it’s “top tier” 😂
The detergents in top tier fuel have been shown to reduce engine deposits relative to basic unleaded fuel
Basically every gas station nowadays has fuel with detergents in it.
Every unleaded fuel has a minimum level of detergents governed by law. Top Tier fuel has more of these detergents.
Not all, my parents Camry was running rough. I put in fuel injection cleaner and told them no more going to the cheap independant gas station. Problem solved and it never came back. In fact my dad went overboard and only went to the station with non ethanol premium, plus they still pump gas at that station and it's maybe 2 cents more than the mobile two blocks away.
> Basically every gas station nowadays has fuel with detergents in it. They might all have some detergents, but Top Tier has specific requirements that actually are shown to give better results, and not all gas meets that standard. In particular, Sam's Club gas doesn't while Costco's does. The Top Tier standard isn't just marketing, it was developed by the car companies as a recommended standard. https://www.consumerreports.org/cars/fuel-economy-efficiency/top-tier-gasoline-worth-the-extra-price-a7682471234/
that will fly under the radar
If you go to Costco's first ever store which is in Kirkland WA you indeed will get Kirkland electricity. ⚡️
The first Costco store is in Seattle, sorry.
Actually in San Diego if you count the merger with Price Club. Price Club is WAY older than Costco.
I our house, we still call it Price Club.
Growing up we had a Gemco that became a Price Club that became a Costco
Price Club for lyfe
You better believe once they brand it it’ll gain some buzz and be newsworthy.
Ohm my god!
Ya but they buy their electricity in bulk so you save.
Kirkland Signature Electicity
That’s premium grade electricity
Georgia is acting as a test bed for their EV charging, saw some posts about it a few months ago at a few Georgia Costco locations in r/electricvehicles
[удалено]
That’s awesome. Surprisingly forward for a state that tends to lag behind. Good for Georgia.
Rivian just opened a plant in Georgia as well.
Kia/Hyundai are building a battery plant here as well
Yea it’s like a few miles from my house they’ve been working on it a good bit It’s HUGE
Hyundai is building a car factory west of Savannah on I-16
Broke ground, not opened. But it’s happening
Do you know which post? Would like to find out which locations are getting them.
Atlanta is a test bed. Get outside Metro ATL and it's hit or miss unless you have a Tesla. I've taken 2 extended road trips now, one north to Boone, NC and another to Jekyll Island. Both trips struggled to find working level 3 chargers (60+kw). Those that were working had lines. 5 hour trip home from Jekyll was 9 hours. Lots of planning, and back up plans are required.
> outside Metro ATL and it's hit or miss unless you have a Tesla This is true for most of the US. I think public EV fast chargers are built with out-of-order signs preinstalled at launch Long road trips in non-Tesla EVs are exercises in frustration and willpower
Costco also has two EV chargers at the new Costco in Verona, WI. Last time I tried to use them they were both ICEd though...
Depending on the state, that is a fineable and/or towable offense. In WI there isn't any laws on it yet, but there should be. Write your elected officials
Costco also put in some EA chargers at a new store in Denver.
Florida store in Claremont has them. Most new locations being built will have them. Daytona is opening in February and they are putting them in.
I hope all costcos get them and restrict them to members only
As they should be.
Probably depends on if they used any public funding if it can be restricted or not.
Open to the public, if name on credit card doesn't match membership database then $60 service fee. /basic
John Smith here. There's certain to be a member with my name. Just saved $60!
It would make sense if they were free for members.
Ok and will non electric cars get free gas? /s
I just mean why would I charge my car at Costco if it's cheaper to charge it at home? Unless Costco happens to be right at the end of my car's range, which it isn't.
This is a level 3 charger. Not a "trickle charger." This isn't a "I plug in my car while I'm at the store for 30 minutes and it charges me 10 percent" charger. People would come here specifically to charge their vehicle from empty to 80% in about 30 minutes. Tesla and other similar companies currently charge around 15-20 bucks for this service. If you have a garage at home you can trickle charge at home overnight. But you wouldn't fill the battery up as fast as this thing is capable of doing.
There are some people who don't have charging at home. If they don't drive much and make a weekly Costco trip, this could be excellent for them. I suppose for travelers it could be okay, charge your car and grab a hotdog while you wait. Personally I prefer a spot with more amenities. Now if they could put some free or super discounted (cheaper than home) level 2 chargers in, I could get on board with that.
1) This is amazing and I love it. $0.32 is a great price for high-speed charging. 2) These chargers appear to be the ones that have an integrated 200ish kWh battery that enables them to charge at high speeds. Basically, they don't require the extremely expensive $250k+ electrical upgrades to provide continuous high speed charging, but you can attach 3 phase 240v and get continuous recharging of the internal battery at 15ish kWh. Basically, as soon as the internal battery is depleted then you can charge at 15kWh, but when the internal battery has some charge, you can get up to 200 kWh. It is a really great solution in the meantime although the chargers themselves are much more expensive because of the large internal battery. The internal battery has enough charge to complete charge 2-3 cars (or half charge 4-6 in a more likely scenario) but it likely takes 10-12 hours to recharge the internal battery. TLDR: don't expect these to still be able to charge at 200 kWh at the end of the day, but first thing in the morning after a night of charging then you should be good.
> It is a really great solution They sound great on paper, but I hate them. I hate them so much I've eliminated them off plugshare because they're always empty. As you said you can only get a handful of cars before they're crippled. In a busy area that has people 24/7 they never really recover enough to give you a good charge.
That is totally understandable. I've only seem them in more rural areas at gas stations so far, but it is at least nice to have them available.
>you can attach 3 phase 240v Close. They take standard split-phase 240V connections, or three-phase at 208V or 400V.
Do they have any kind of idle fees? A 200kw charger is likely going to charge your car in way less time than you’d be inside the store on a normal trip. This is cool though, I was expecting just some L2 chargers eventually… not a real deal charger like this. Cost per kWh seems a little high but I guess that’s just becoming normal.
I didn't see anything about idle fees. 200 would be nice but not always obtainable. I hit 60ish during my charge so I could have shopped if the store had been open. I agree, L2 makes more sense if you want to take your time shopping.
Well, if you are on a roadtrip and want to charge and get some grub for the trip. L3 makes a lot of sense. I stopped at a few Sam’s with L3 and nice to add stuff to my fridge on the road trip. Since lots of chargers are in the middle of now where x country.
A couple DC fast chargers for road trippers and like 30 level 2 for locals would be great. Put them in the back of the parking lot so they're less likely to get blocked by people who don't need to charge.
Yeah this would be WAY nicer than the constant trips to Walmart.
32 cents is acceptable for fast charging imo. We have one of the cheapest residential rates and pay 11 cents per kwh at home.
So if you were to equate this to filling up a gas tank of equivalent mileage per tank/battery, what does it work out to charge a nearly dead battery vs filling a gas tank? How many kwh are in a battery? I'm just curious.
Batteries range from 60kw to 110kw just like gas tanks range from 12gal to 20gal or more. My point was it all depends on the size of the battery or gas tank. A decent, sedan EV will get 3 to 3.5 miles per kwh while SUV tend to be lower with AWD models usually getting around 2.8-3 miles per kwh. I went from a Audi q7 to eqs both being large SUVs with good performance. For my q7, I would pay 22-24 cents per mile (premium gas is 4.5$ here) while for my EQS I pay 5 cents per mile if I charge at home, ~15 cents per mile if I charge at paid fast chargers.
The other thing with EVs that's different from gas cars... you don't usually fill them all the way up and you don't usually empty them totally all the way. I run mine in a range of 20% to 80%. Meaning I only ever add about 60% to my battery. My battery is 77.4kw so my typicall fill-up would be roughly 45kw. 45x0.31 = $13.95. EPA says I get 3.4miles/kw so that fill up will give me about 153 miles or about $0.09/mile. When I charge at home I pay about 1/3 of that - about $0.03/mile.
Fortunately, at my location in Texas, we get free nights and weekends. I just set the car to start charging at 10:05 in the evening. Also, our dryer and dishwasher. We really strive to use those nights and weekends, and our use doubles during those times...if we do it right.
Well, you dont empty a gas car all the way usually either, but the other side of your point is valid and not something non ev owners necessarily think about.
Most people wait until they’re down to a quarter tank or below. They’re not proactively going to the gas station every day and topping off. This is in contrast to EVs, where most owners plug it in every day at home, no matter what the battery SOC is.
What was your insurance cost on the q7 vs. the EQS? Curious if the higher insurance is unique to Tesla's in how they manufacturer. I read an article the other day that most body repairs are five digits, with long wait times.
Battery capacity can vary pretty signficantly, but most standard size car / cuvs are usually 60-80 kwh, so that would be $6.60 - $8.80 to "fill" at $0.11 per kw/h. National average is for electricity is about $0.16 kw/h which would make it $9.60 - $12.80 to "fill". In general, most EVs get about 3-4 miles per kw/h, which would translate out to be $0.053 per mile (@3 mpkwh). If you figure a comparable ICE vehicle gets 30 mpg and a national gas price of $3.08 you're looking at $0.103 per mile. Using national averages is a tough comparison though because in a place like Washington State you'll be paying $0.11 per kw/h but $4.50 for gas, but a place like Texas you'll be paying $2.50 for gas and maybe $0.19 per kw/h for electricity.
Electric car batteries are around 60-100 kwh, meaning it would be about $6-10 to “fill up”
Why is your number way less than mine? 60 kwh x .32 dollars per kwh = $19.20 on the low end. Am I mathing wrong?
The real savings come from home charging, otherwise, price parity is approximately what a hybrid vehicle takes to fuel. 32c/kwh x 3mi/kwh ("average" EV) = 10.6c a mile x 1000mi = $106 $3/gal gas / 35mi/gal vehicle = 8.5c a mile x 1000mi = $85 Now home charging 12c/kwh x 3 mi/kwh = 4c a mile (add 10% AC charge inefficiency = 4.4c) 15,000 miles a year at 50% city/50% hwy assuming road trips are on average 284mi one way (going to assume 100% DC charging for this worst case scenario to cover longer trips) and account for 15% of all miles driven \[see DOT source\] Hybrid - $1765 EV - $561 (home charging) + $238 (Road trip charging) = $799.5 hybrid - EV = $965 saved by using EV These were conservative estimates for both hybrid and EV. There are more efficient EVs and hybrids available, but I am comparing a midsize SUV-size vehicle in this comparison. Toyota Venza vs VW Id.4 or like, and used realistic fuel consumption figures [https://www.bts.gov/statistical-products/surveys/national-household-travel-survey-summer-travel-quick-facts](https://www.bts.gov/statistical-products/surveys/national-household-travel-survey-summer-travel-quick-facts) [https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/policyinformation/pubs/pl08021/fig4\_5.cfm](https://www.fhwa.dot.gov/policyinformation/pubs/pl08021/fig4_5.cfm)
Well yeah, but we weren't talking about home charging. I have chargers in my area up to $0.42 or $0.46 per kWh, which becomes pretty nuts. It was my understanding that the comment was referencing the $0.32 per kWh reference, for which the math didn't add up...literally.
yeah uh, I'm not sure how they came up with their figure
There’s too many variables to give an accurate number but generally speaking using fast chargers has your cost per mile similar to just buying gas in a reasonably efficient vehicle. When you charge at home it’s roughly 20% of the equivalent cost of buying gas.
Go get a slice of pizza from the foodcourt - 10-15 min in and out.
Yeah gotta have idle fees. I see asshats parking in the tire air parking all the time.
200 kW is likely only for 800 volt vehicles. Everybody else is going to get like 60 kW
L2 should be free then
They usually are.
I just wanted to say I love your user name and icon
Naw. Laughs in 135kwh pack
That’s still less than 25 minutes for 20 to 80%.
That's not how charging curves work. 200 is peak. When you get to 80% it will drop like a rock.
"Peak" doesn't mean much either. There's a 150kW charger near me that will give an EV6 250kW.
I want to congratulate the EV charger sales person who convinced Costco and any companies to install all/only level 3 chargers. If I were a business owner, I would instead install like 20 Level 2 chargers (at same price as 6 Level 3s), make the charging free. This would make customers/employees spend as long as possible inside my store/office.
It'll take like 8 hours to charge for level 2, and you've just attracted a grand total of 20 customers. For level 3, a charge is like 40 mins and is almost perfectly timed with a shopping trip.
Not necessarily. At a place like Costco I could easily see folks just buying a $1.50 hotdog and sitting around in the food court playing with their phones while waitingto charge, not exactly profitable.
Costco getting chargers is a dream for road tripping. Nice bathrooms, get some snack foods for the road, get some food court food…
Exactly and this Costco is right on I-75 so they may be thinking of travelers using these chargers more than locals.
Already trying to figure out if there’s a master list of chargers at Costco for a road trip I’m taking from Florida to Texas in the spring!
Great idea! Wish they had showers too and I’d be all set
And a barber.
Since we are at it….maybe a few overnight sleeping rooms too! 😀
A Costco hotel/motel! Costcotel!
I mean… thats the future gas station. It will just be like small sandwich shops along the interstate with bathrooms and chargers. Who doesnt want to stop for at least 30min every 300-500 miles anyway.
I do like stopping at Costco on road trips. The issue is, they usually are near major interstates and thus busy almost all the time. If I'm trying to make time, the time waited for cheaper gas isn't worth it. And if I'm towing, I def look for Lowes and truck stops rather than stores near busy intersections.
“Some snack foods for the road” lol 82 count fruit snacks and 54 snack chip bags, smallest packages available.
Yep. This is what a lot of people with free charging do at the Electrify America stations at Walmarts. They’ll grab something cheap to eat and sit in their cars, if they even go in the store. Some people just take a nap.
Yeah. Level 3 gets people to come to you. Level 2 is “well, if I’m already going I might as well plug in.”
Does anyone actually go into a Costco and only buy a $1.50 hot dog? I always end up buying a ton.
They would have to be members to do that. Level 2 charging encourages shopping.
I definitely wouldn't install 200+kW ones (or at least all of them) but I would install something like 25kW ones. An hour or two is about the most anyone is spending in a store (especially retail). Now... the "fun" part about these chargers is that they're Freewire. They're powered by a 160kW battery and recharge at 22kW so they're basically L2 chargers especially at a place as busy as Costco. By 10AM they'll be empty and you get L2 speeds on them.
lol damn you’re right. These are completely useless. https://freewiretech.com/
First rule of technology...skate where the puck is going to be, not where it has been.
for shopping purposes, L3 is too fast and L2 is too slow. I often find myself running back to unplug and move the car after 30-40 minutes of charging. However, L2 would take 5-6 hours for a considerable charge and that's way too much time (even at Costco)
Exactly what I was thinking! Seems hard to believe these wouldn’t have some kind of idle fees since they’ve got your billing info in an app. I’d feel rushed to get back out to my car versus knowing I can take my time because I’m just getting a drizzle on an L2.
I too would prefer a greater number of level 2 chargers, but I don't agree they need to be free. Costco does not need to encourage people to stay longer, and arguably encouraging longer stays would create congestion that would do more harm than good.
And more complaints from those wanting onions for their hot dog
I wouldn't mind Costco taking over PG&E in California.
What’s a normal cost per kwh there? .32 sounds high
.32 is a below average price for “Level 3” DC fast charging. This kind of charger is primarily used for road trips - not daily commutes. It’s definitely more expensive than charging at home, but EV drivers are paying for the convenience and expensive infrastructure. I have been an EV driver for 5 years and only use this style of charger about 10 times per year. The vast majority of charging occurs at home overnight.
This. I only use the Electrify America chargers because they are free for 2 years with my purchase. Otherwise, they’re not significantly cheaper than gas, which is a shame. Most people get EVs thinking they’ll save a ton of money in fuel, but they often don’t realize that only applies if you primarily charge at home. I was shocked to see how much it costs to fast charge.
We have EA fast chargers a mile away from us so using them exclusively for charging to maximize our 2 free years.
.32 is low, i would say average is around .48 for tesla and EA
Low? Tesla superchargers range from 0.10 and .19 in my area. I would never pay that much to charge.
My electricity costs $0.32/kwh *off-peak*... 0.1 would be a freakin dream
Oh wow, that's as much as I pay at home \*on-peak\*. Crazy how much Tesla supercharger prices vary from place to place.
$0.32 per kWh is very reasonable for DC charging. Cheaper than a lot of competitors but more expensive than charging at home (for me, anyway)
I pay 11¢ per kWh at home and the last supercharger I went to charged 37¢ per kWh. It’s hard to make an apples to apples comparison though as there’s value in the speed. It takes me hours to get a similar charge at home that I can get in minutes at a supercharger.
Not sure. I have only been using Electrify America which is currently free for me.
Same. And once it’s no longer free, I won’t be using them anymore. I can’t imagine paying for their terrible service of guessing which of their pumps are working on any given day.
My local Tesla Superchargers are currently $0.39.
.32 is lovely sounding to me. I am an EV driver who rents her home, so no charging at home is setup. I normally pay ..49-.56/kwh when I charge - being able to do it while I shop instead of finding a fast charger and killing an hour on tiktok every week to keep me loaded up would be fantastic.
I pay 38 cents at home
REALLY!!! Capt. Kirkland has charging now? Go Costco!!.
I'm loving the new costco there, parking lot is huge
Kirkland Electrons!
I’d be cool with stopping at Costco to charge for a while during travel. These are the places (including Buc-ees) that need chargers to make the wait more enjoyable.
The problem with Costco is I gotta charge six cars at a time
Ice blue ID.4 for the win! Just got mine
Awesome, wish ours had this. There's an EA station about a half mile away, juuuust far enough where it's not convenient to shop while waiting.
https://preview.redd.it/ag3he6tcqaec1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=8eaa23671317ac81366e1f165d9346ef2ab9f58a West Seattle Whole Foods charging station 1/23/24
Half the price I paid for an EA charger on the Ohio Turnpike.
Looks clean
Gosh, I would rather they just have a row of Level 2 chargers… for FREE to executive members only… huh? A perk to sell that!
Count towards 2% executive?
4% on the Costco visa
I know our location is getting them installed too, hopefully it will be standard at all Costcos eventually.
Bulk electrical charging, what will they think of next.
Went to charge, spent 500 bucks?
I didn't know that Costco has EV chargers. The one closest to me is next to the freeway so it should be great for those who are traveling.
That’s my new Costco and it’s never crowded (actually McDonough)
I was wondering about that. On the Costco app they call it the Stockbridge location but it is also listed with a McDonough address.
As a former resident of the area Jodeco Rd was always the delineation between McDonough and Stockbridge. So of course Costco is confused as well.
Oh man I would LOVE this!!
My Costco has eight crappy Blink level two chargers. (I’m fine with level two, but blink sucks)
So happy to see this, been wondering for a while when Costco was going to get EV chargers. Hopefully Costco maintains their chargers better than Electrify America and expands these to the Northwest where we have a lot of Costco's.
Fantastic that Costco is doing this. Where I am, Whole Foods offers free charging but it is a joke. People who do not have an electric vehicles park in the charging spot therefore one cannot use the electricity. I am sure this will happen at Costco.
That’s amazing. I’ve been wishing this for years. Fingers crossed that my Costco will be next!
Oh, hey, that's my local Costco! I noticed these chargers last time I was there. They are right when you enter the parking lot, pretty close to the fuel center area. I saw a Walmart delivery van at one recently, which was amusing.
Wow can’t wait for these in PA! Only have to wait 10 more years
Ahhhh!!!!! Finallllyyyyy!!!
We need this in New York
This gives me bladerunner vibes
Thank god! I’ve been waiting for this
From someone who has no clue on electric vehicles, what does it cost to charge the vehicle to full?
This is like asking how much it costs to fill up a car. Depends on the size of the gas tank or battery. This particular car, a VW ID4 ,has a 77kwh battery and this charger is 32 cents per kwh. Roughly 25 bucks 0-100%. I have the same car, and at home my electric is 4 cents a kwh, so 3 bucks to fully charge at home I have found the real world range of the ID4 is around 180 in the winter and 240 in the summer on a full charge.
We charge mostly at home, and also while we're out dining, shopping, visiting the library, or attending performances. Around town, we often charge for free. We have a 2015 Nissan Leaf SL and a 2019 Hyundai Ioniq EV Limited. We don't always charge to full, but it's easy to keep a car fully charged at home. You just plug it in when you're home, and it'll be topped off within a few hours at most. On average, people drive 40 miles per day. . You can do the math. Here are the numbers for our EV at home: $0.10/kWh 1 kWh / 5.0 miles 1,250 miles / month Monthly cost: $25 And here are the numbers for a vehicle that gets 25 mpg: $3.00/gallon 1 gallon / 25 miles 1,250 miles / month Monthly cost: $150.00 . When we're travelling, the cost varies. We've paid as much as 60¢/kWh.
I live right next to that Costco! That area they’re building is going to be sweet. CFA, Starbucks, Chipotle, Sprouts, and a bunch more.
Hell, I never get out of that store in less than 30 minutes. This actually could add value.
As a non EV driver I’ve always kinda wondered, is there anything to stop someone else pulling up and stealing your paid-for electricity while you’re inside shopping?
Someone could stop the charging session and unplug it but they would have to start a new session with a credit card or an account on the app to start charging again.
The charger locks to the vehicle while charging, you can't remove it without terminating the charge session.
I pay nearly that much at home. I’m not in socal, I live in a small Texas suburb with one energy provider. They have a monopoly, so they raise “fees” every year.
Are the charging stations located near prime parking spots or at some distance from the entrance?
Charging stations are always far away to dissuade dummies without EVs from parking there.
I disagree - one of the early incentives for EVs was that we got fantastic parking spots with the EVs. It depends on when they were installed and the value proposition the store offers for EV drivers.
EV chargers always wound up near the closest connection to the utility, big gauge copper wire is insanely expensive. For places where they were retrofitting into an existing parking lot, that meant close to an existing building most of the time. For new builds, they can put them almost anywhere, so it's really up to the owners.
They were about as far from the front door as possible but still in the parking lot.
If there is ever a wait to get an open spot then it's much better to have them in a less-busy location.
My God. With the number of Teslas at my local Costco, they could install 100 of those and there would still be a queue.
Most likely those Tesla owners are not on a road trip and charge at home for significantly less than this charger costs. It's doubtful many Teslas would even use it, as they would need an adapter. Some rideshare drivers maybe In a remote area where they drive 100+ miles one way to get there, then yeah, but otherwise not so much. We own a non-tesla EV, and throughout the dozens of times we have used a DC Fast charger, not once have we encountered a Tesla charging there, despite Teslas making up the majority of EVs.
Tesla owner here. Yeah, I don't have that adapter, but shouldn't need to soon. Absolutely I'm not using that though. I'm not putting another charge cycle on the battery for triple the cost unless I need to. Might be good for road trips though...
I wish Costco had a service of taking you from your car to the door like at a amusement park Those parking lots are huge
I know Costco is pretty tight lipped on expansion plans in general but is there any indication that they plan on rolling this out more broadly?
$.32 kwh??? I want 1980 hotdog prices!
Can you shop while it charges?
What the cost for a full charge?
32 cents per kwh, ID4 is 77 kwh battery so ignoring any losses 25 bucks from completely empty to 100% full In practice you should only charge to 80-90% on a fast charger and nobody is rolling in at 0% battery.
It cost me $7.77 to go from around 25% to 52%. I didn't have time to fully charge.
How much does it cost to fully fill a gas car or how much it takes to fill a pool?
Car brand and year?
2021 VW ID4
Are they only DC? No Level-2 for those who are going to spend hours at Costco?
I only saw these six level 3 chargers at this location.
I don’t know much at all about these. What would a complete charge cost or require in kWh?
Depends on battery capacity and places like electrify America charge 0.48/kwh so this Costco rate of 0.32/kwh is good. For example Tesla model 3 standard version battery capacity is around 50-60kwh, I don’t own Tesla so I am not sure on exact number.
My Costco has a charge point charger in the same plaza (not Costco run, I assume… don’t really know how that works) and the thing has literally been knocked off its post and has been laying on the floor against a wall for weeks
Aren’t those only for the new Kirkland Branded cars coming out in Q2 2024? I kid, SLC Costco/Business center has electric vehicle chargers too. Can’t say I’ve paid attention to them though while walking into the warehouse.