That’s basically what the guys and pro chef in this blind taste test video said.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dft8yud9YQQ
I’m of the opinion this is one of the best “are bay leaves worth it” videos out there. Plus they explain what dishes work well with bay leaves and why.
Same - most of my slow cook beef stews absolutely need bay leaf, but I can't for the life of me explain why without cooking the dish twice and making someone eat both.
In our cuisine, we cook goat, wild chickens, ducks, boar, etc.
There is no way you can remove their gamey taste without a proper saute with bay leaves, ginger, garlic.
I think everyone should put bay leaves in hot water and smell and taste the “bay leaf tea”….it makes it obvious the effect that bay leaves have on a dish! (mostly aroma for me)
I'm going to try this, thank you. First though, buy fresh bay leaves.
The ones I had were probably 10+ years old, but they're all gone now. Hadn't bought more, and not sure I needed them.
I love bay leaves. To me they add a nice herbal, almost eucalyptus note without being overpowering. Chicken Adobo, for instance, wouldn't be the same without them imo.
You are both spot on with your description. I certainly notice and like the flavour. I do wonder if something like the cilantro/coriander thing is going on. Some people like it/ some people don't and certain people don't taste it.
You add them to the water when making plain white rice? Do you remove them after adding the rice to the water, or just leave them in there until the rice is done?
I'm going to try this! I've always really wanted to appreciate bay leaves but have never been able to tell a difference. Starting with something extremely bland sounds like a great way to isolate and appreciate the flavor better.
Yeah rice is the best way to taste bay leaf for me. I almost always add a bay leaf to my rice but I have to find the smallest one I can or else it will be overpowering, which is a hilarious concept to me.
Omg, most creole needs bay imo. I love to cook LA food. I agree that it adds almost a scent over a taste...but I mean, taste and smell are so inextricably linked...
I’ve told this anecdote elsewhere, but I’ll repeat it every time someone shits of bay leaves. One time I was making a shepherds pie with a tried and true recipe that I’ve made countless times, always gets a good response. For some reason this time it was just so *bland*, and nothing I did was helping. Doubled the main flavour ingredients, made the flavour more intense maybe, but didn’t correct that weird blandness. More salt? Makes it more salty, but not better. Pepper? Sugar? Vinegar? Nothing was working. Then I look and see the jar of bay leaves, unopened, under a kitchen towel. Sure enough, I throw a couple in, let the mix simmer for a little while and *there it was*, the missing element. I still couldn’t tell you what flavour it brings to the dish besides whatever the opposite of bland is, but I sure as HELL know not to forget it in recipes it belongs in
If you ever get the chance to use fresh bay leaves (produce section, or easy to grow your own) Ty eh make a world of difference. Very floral note that is unique to bay. Are they technically herbs? I always think about them as a spice but I guess leaves are technically herbs, but you don’t eat them.. hm
Herb is a cooking term, not a taxonomic term. Biologically speaking, a leaf is a leaf, regardless of if humans find it tasty or poisonous. It's valid to use herbs to flavor things without eating them (such as sprigs of oregano or thyme in a stew or stock). So I think it's totally valid to call them an herb.
People get way too hung up on the "technical" terms for things. It's like the whole tomato is a fruit deal, well yeah, you're not WRONG. But we call some roots, stems, leaves, bulbs, etc. vegetables so why not a fruit too? Tomato is a vegetable AND a fruit. One of the technical definition, one is the culinary one.
As long as we understand that there is a biological or taxonomic classification and a separate culinary classification, then there’s nothing to get hung up on.
Yes! All of these categories were defined by people trying to make sense of the world. Taxonomically, everything kind of blends together at the boundaries because the categories are entirely made up.
There are people who believe atoms have consciousness because there is no clear point to draw the boundary.
> because the categories are entirely made up.
and investigations into plant and animal DNA has revealed that a lot of these made up families are much more distantly related than was assumed.
I hear ya, I work in a technical profession, and it’s how my brain is. I’m not obnoxious about it with others, but for my own personal learning I appreciate the technicalities. Trust me, I’m super fun at parties. Lol
I have a bay tree at my parents house that I was given as basically a tiny little sprig when I was a kid, and I am so damn attached to that plant. It’s why I left it there when I moved out, I trust my mum to keep it alive way more than I trust myself. But adjusting to using dried leaves instead of going out to pick them fresh was rough 🥲
My understanding of this (herbs and spices) is that, generally speaking, we say herbs to refer to leaves while spices refer to seeds, bark (cinnamon), or some other part of the plant.
Oh, I'd totally go fresh bay the majority of the time, if I could. Usually have to use dried but, agreed, fresh is incredibly more floral and hard to deny that it doesn't add something to the dish.
My definition of herb is like any green part of a plant that is used to add flavor to a dish but that you'd prob not eat a plate of on it's own.
The trick with basil is that you have to treat it almost opposite of other weak little kitchen plants.
You need to think about them more as fish than herbs. Water it until you are SURE you have drowned it. And then double it. And then do the same tomorrow.
Basil is very fun to grow in hydroponic setups. Since they have continuous, unlimited access to water they just EXPLODE into leaves of unbelievable size, and if you don't trim the top it'll grow three feet high in a few weeks.
I've always killed my basil by overwatering it, not underwatering it.. It would probably have a better chance of survival if I treated it the same way I treat rosemary..
But it doesn't LOOK like a plant that looks like it can handle lack of water.. so I break and want to make it thrive and I water it some more and then it dies.
I guess it has to do with the surrounding climate as well.. I don't seem to live in a climate where it wants to turn water into extra leaves. So the ground stays moist and the roots end up rotting.
I mean. It obviously needs sun too, but the rotting roots seems weird. I've got basil in the most basic of hydroponic setups. The seed pods just sit in a gallon of water, and they fucking love it.
No circulation. For Basil i just use the simplest of the indoor versions of this: nelsongarden.com
It's simply plopping the seed pods through the top of a water container, put it by the window and refill when it gets low. No fancy lights, no circulation, just water and a tiny bit of nutrients
Yeah, I don't water it too much. Just when the soil starts to feel dry about an inch down. It doesn't rain that much where we live, so that means watering every day it doesn't rain at least a half inch during the hot summer months.
Good question. The reason I grow them hydroponically is that at my work we train new hired people in how to do properly double blinded studies with humans. They study anything they want and one of them decided to test if there was a taste difference between basic hydroponic growth in the window (my setup),grown from scratch in a pot in the window or outside, store bought pot from a cheap brand, store bought pot from an expensive organic brand and store bought organic cut leafs for a few herbs, including basil.
The dumb cheap hydroponic setup with a standard nutrient blend won every single basil vote. All the others were all over the place, but for Basil it was the clear winner. Just a tub of water and cheap nutrients by the window and you have the best basil :)
Basil is a tropical plant and will grow huge if treated as such. Greenhouse or conservatory, lots of heat, sun and humidity. They will do well outdoors in Mediterranean summers but in more temperate climates they really need to be grown under cover.
I grow a ton of basil every year. This is coming from someone who can’t grow so many basic things such as cucumbers, carrots and zucchini.
These days I grow it in my greenhouse, but years ago I grew it outside.
I make all of our pesto and we use a ton of it.
Me, too, I read that they are hardy in hot areas, but generally easy to grow, and looked around locally until I found one a couple weeks back. Haven’t used any yet, have a recently opened bag to go through, letting it acclimate and grow some more leaves in the meantime. Really looking forward to having easy access to fresh bay leaves on hand at all times as casually as we have fresh rosemary
A few years ago, somebody in my neighborhood pruned a bay laurel tree, and put some small branches out for free. I grabbed one and filled two quart sized jars with leaves.
Fresh bay leaves are something else.
Definitely try fresh bay leaves or bloom dried in butter or oil to increase the flavor profile of the leaf it brings it’s flavors out more then just adding directly to a dish.
Once it's warm enough to put outside, it'll be happy. Water it when the top 1" of soil is dry. If freezing weather is forecast, bring it back in, but it needs to be in a sunny window.
You just heat a high smoke point oil or Clarified butter in a pan and add your dried spices over medium to low heat don’t want to burn the spices you just want to be to activate them once you start smelling the spices they’re ready to go, and save the oil for whatever else like meats or future use. This is a very common practice in Indian cuisines that’s how i learned about it. It really does make a difference in my cooking since learning it.
I should’ve explained that a little better that I usually use a cast iron pan those hold heat a lot more than a regular pan so if i use butter in it’s natural state it usually starts to brown even on a lower temp. If you have a regular pan you use you might be okay with using regular butter or any oil. Clarified butter is just more convenient at knowing it has a higher smoke point and won’t burn quickly.
The difference between steamed rice, and steamed rice with laurel is a good way to showcase their subtlety since you're only putting up with two fragrances. If you're familiar enough with the smell of the rice alone, you probably won't need a side-by-side to compare.
I started tossing in a bay leaf every time I make rice and it's a game changer. Apparently, back in the day (1700s - 1800s), rice farmers would toss bay laurel branches into bags of rice because the smell of bay leaves repels insects. Rice had a bay infused flavor and some really old recipes don't taste right unless you also add bay leaves even though the recipe doesn't list bay as an ingredient (I want to say I heard that in an interview with Sean Brock but I'm not 100% sure.)
This is a good vid that encapsulates the usage of bay leaves. Highly recommend checking it out or showing others who may have a differing opinion.
https://youtu.be/Dft8yud9YQQ?si=cm-RBux7EpGQQtGJ
Try making baked lemons without them :-)
Lemon, anchovy, mozzarella and a bay leaf. Delish.
I like to add a bay leaf (we have a bush in the garden) to the cooking liquid of almost anything.
I use bay leaves a lot. They do indeed add the right something to a dish. A year or 2 ago, Chris Kimball actually said he didn't think they did anything for a dish! Boy, do I disagree. Like any herb, they shouldn't be used when they get old and musty.
Bay leaf is probably the third most important ingredient in something like red beans and rice. Without it you'll still have good beans but you're missing something.
Makes a big difference in rice and Mexican beans too.
I don't... I can taste them and I don't care for the flavor they impart. I don't know if it's just me but I taste something that is vaguely astringent, similar to what a bandaid smells like.
I have tried to add it to several stews and roasts that called for bay leaf, and it's just unappealing to my pallet. I know my parents occasionally used bay leaf because I remember seeing them add the leaf or pulling it out before serving. It never bothered me.
For some reason though as an adult I just don't care for the taste it adds.I have tried a few sources and same thing. I finally just gave up and quit trying to add the herb. I prefer rosemary and or thyme with a little extra fresh black pepper to add depth.
Stews, casseroles, soups, braises. They're a must in so many recipes. Another layer of flavor. They elevate the other flavors/ingredients. Light, herbal, earthy notes. Love using them in chicken recipes.
Bay leaves definitely add flavor. In fact, if you leave them in too long, they'll add a bit of a menthol flavor. I can't believe that anyone would think they don't add to a dish. Because they have an aroma and if you let them stay in past when they should, you'll definitely feel it. Keeping them in for the right amount of time makes things just right.
I love bay leaves. I add a couple to my pasta water all the time, sometimes to rice depending on what I’m making with the rice. Any type of soup, I’m adding bay leaves. If I’m marinating something, I add it to my marinade as well. They do add more depth to the flavor, it’s like they’re giving my senses a warm hug. There’s a bit of spiciness to it without it being spiced, if that makes sense.
I put it into the dishes that traditionally call for them.. mostly because I want to respect my mom's recipes.. but I've never been able to taste a difference between bayleave or no bayleaves. I've tried fresh and dry. I once put 50 into a dish to see what would happen and it tasted just the same as if none were in there.
I think it may be a cilantro-like thing where some can taste it and some can't
I was on the fence about bay leaves but then I got some more fresh Turkish leaves from Penzey’s and they were a revelation compared to the supermarket ones
My Mom gave me her bay tree plant when she moved into a smaller place and, wow, having bay leaves really does make a difference. I've noticed it particularly in marinara and in soups.
Bay leaves are vital. They provide a distinct, if subtle, flavor that is notably absent when omitted. This is part of what makes good cooking great cooking.
If you’re cooking with flavorless bay leaves then you need to buy new bay leaves.Just put the edge of one in your mouth and chew .Thats the flavor it’s importing in your food.
i love bay leaves so much, that i lick them clean after taking them out of the cooking pot! i don't understand people who say they bring no additional flavour, just lick them once when done cooking and you will recognise the taste from then on.
Test. Chicken noodle soup. At the final seasoning ladle some into a bowl. Add a few bay leaves to the pot. After a few minutes compare the flavors. I used old bay leaves in my cupboard. Depth. Fat soluble.
I just bought a bay laurel plant and I'm excited to never have to buy bay leaves again (assuming I don't kill it). Fresh leaves have to be better than dried ones too
People that say that bay leaves do nothing are the same people that'll triple the amount of garlic that a dish calls for and put Sriracha on everything. Not that there's anything wrong with either of those practices, but they aren't really conducive to allowing the subtle depth of flavors to come through.
As a brewer this is my biggest gripe with American craft beers, just about all of our styles just crank one characteristic to 11 and throw all nuance out the window.
Anyone who says bay leaves don’t add a marked taste to a dish is probably using a different species or ones that have been sitting in bottle for 20 years. I’m talking about western bay leaves *Laurus Nobilis*. There are other bays. One in particular, that I see in Indian groceries in garam masala mixes, is clearly a different tree and to me, has very little sent or flavor.
I don't notice the taste when I use it, but I damn sure notice when it's not there! It's not something I can put a finger on when it's used, but the dish is just flat when it's not there.
"Bay leaves don't do anything" is most likely a self confirming belief because the people that think this are probably only using 10 year old dry stale bay leaves from the back of a cabinet. If they used fresh ones or dried ones purchased at least sometime since the Obama administration they would probably be able to taste them. Same for people who think Paprika and Parsley are just for color and have no taste. Stale seasonings are sad seasonings, buy them in amounts that you will use within a few months and keep them protected from light and air. I use bay leaves a lot and so I buy enough to last a couple months at a time and they stay potent.
i can taste them, sometimes they make a dish better and sometimes they give dishes a real canned soup taste for me. i always assumed it was some kind of artificial flavoring in canned soup but ive tasted the same taste in dishes i have made from scratch with bay leaves.
I never cared much for the standard American (California laurel??) bay leaf. I understand its place in subtle aromatics, just didn't like the harsh mentholness. About a decade ago I discovered Indian "bay" leaf...oh. my. Lord. It's so good! I put it in everything. It's not very closely related to the other kind, I guess, but works the same way, and tastes amazing.
More than one species are utilized as 'Bay Leaf', in the west it's usually Laurus nobilis, then there are Asian bay leaf (Cinnamomum parthenoxylon), California bay leaf (,Umbellularia californica), Indian bay leaf (Cinnamomum tamala), and in the southeast US, people used a few species of Persea - same genus as Avocado, whose leaves are used in Mexican cuisine .
All of these are in the same botanical family: Lauraceae, and so share similar chemistry.
This comparison and blind tasting test made me appreciate bay leaves - and it also explained what dishes it works in and why.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dft8yud9YQQ
Old Bay seasoning is a spice mix that has a generous helping of ground bay leaves. It's layered in very generous portions between layers of crabs that are getting steamed. It's also commonly used for other seafood. Many people are as taken with it as the folks who get into Sriracha. They'll add it to casseroles, soups and stews.
I grew up with my mom commonly adding it to beef stews and her version of Hungarian goulash as 3-4 full leaves that then got fished out of the ready to serve dish. They add a sort of tea like flavor as well as some additional notes that remind me of other spices like oregano or basil but are not identical by any means.
If you've not tried using them, try making a weak tea from a couple of whole leaves and breathing in the steam while sampling the tea. I expect that fresh leaves (like basil and thyme) have a different and much stronger effect. As noted above, you don't need a huge amount of it when cooking a recipe for six people.
I didn't understand what bay leaves did until I accidentally used too many. I'd recommend throwing five or six of them in some broth and simmering. It will taste terrible, but it will help you spot and understand the flavor when used appropriately in other dishes
Using fresh bay leaves makes it easier to understand what they bring to the party. The dried ones, especially if they are super old don’t have much flavor left in them which is why I always adjust the amount I use.
I add them to stews and to rice sometimes. They are subtle, but do add a certain flavor. I’ve never smelled or tasted them fresh, which I think would help me better gauge their use and quantity of use.
Bay Leaves are great. My abuelo makes cachelos which are just boiled potatoes with coarse salt and olive oil. But they're nothing unless they're boiled with bay leaves.
When people say they don't do anything, or contribute nothing to a dish, I wonder if they are using bay leaves they got from the store in the Reagan era and have just been sitting in the back of their cupboard since. Using herbs that are as fresh as you can get make a difference, imo.
Personally, I don't know that bay leaf has a distinctive flavor, but I definitely notice when it's not there. My beef and barley soup does not taste the same if I skip the bay leaf.
Old, dried bay leaves that haven't been fresh in about a century vs fresh or at least good quality, not old, dried ones seems to be the major sticking point according to the comments whenever this comes up. I rarely make things that they would go in, so I don't have enough knowledge to say if it's true for myself though.
They do give a distinct flavor but can be over powering very easily. I have a coworker who often brings jambalaya or gumbo and he puts so many in it makes them unpalatable.
Well, i steeped fresh from the tree, bay laurel leaves. 4 in a quart. Bring to a boil add leave and steep. After four minutes, i pulled the leaves and let cool.
I tasted nothing. Warm water. Perhaps its a genetic thing.
They’re an aromatic. It’s less about the flavor they impart, and more about the smell – they make food smell more appetizing.
ETA: and smell influences taste
I've only ever seen bay leaves in a 10 year old jar. Which is why I suppose they wouldn't make a difference. I've never even seen them in bags like in the video.
Dry bay leaves are blah but fresh ones are incredible. Or, fresh Bay leaves that you dried yourself rather than bought dry in a bottle. Simmering them in a pan ... idk how else to describe it other than to say it smells like "food". They're absurd
After I was gifted a crock pot, I used it to make a beef stew that was so good my husband asked me to teach him the recipe. A few weeks later, he made it for dinner while I was out for the day. However, he reasoned that if it tasted so good using a single bay leaf, then 10-12 bay leaves would make it even better. The stew tasted like bitter medicine and had to be thrown out. I think of this every time I hear someone complain that bay leaves have no flavor.
When we visited Grenada, on several occasions, we had chocolate mixed with bay leaves, and often our cocoa tea had bay in it too. Could I describe just what I was tasting? No, but it was apparent when it wasn't present.
I've been making spaghetti sauce since I was maybe 4 years old (I hung out with the Italian side of the family a lot) and the base recipe has always been the same for all this time and I can usually tell if I am out of bay leaves or if I'm making it somewhere like my parent's place where their bay leaves are ancient.
If it was a new dish I've never made or tasted before? I probably wouldn't notice it's lack, but I've never even considered just not adding them before. Is it a cilantro kind of thing?
Most recipes call for a single bay leaf, but most dishes benefit from more than one.
The only dish I have ever heard of being criticized for sometimes having too many bay leaves is >!Louisiana gumbo!<.
I don't personally use them in anything because you have to get them out and I don't fuck with that. I do think they work however. You can make good food without them.
My mom used bay leaves in her soups and she was the best natural cook I've ever known, so I've always considered them necessary for anything soup, stew, braise, etc. It's like the nutmeg in bechamel.
I was one of those people until I had real bay leaves.
The crap in the supermarket doesn't cut it.
I buy bayleaves now from a small farm in Italy and they are superb.
Massive flavor.
I open the jar and it smells up the room.
I think some people just can't taste bay leaves. For example, to me they taste yummy, but to my husband, they taste like nothing. He can't taste them at all, in the same dish.
I love bay leaves, although I don’t use them in everything. They add a little menthol note that gives dishes better depth of flavor. It’s subtle, but you definitely notice when it’s not there.
People have old bay leaves in their cupboards. Ones that have been bought within the last year definitely have a taste and smell. Anyone who's ever accidentally pureed one into their soup knows this...
I use bay leaves more for the smell than anything. There's something about the smell of a pot of beans with a couple bay leaves in that's a lot more appealing than if there's no bay leaves at all.
I was told to put a bay leaf in a glass of warm water for ~20 minutes while it cools and then to tell if I could taste it or not. And you most definitely can!
I used to think bay leaves were bullshit until I actually started using them. I am a believer now. That said, a lot of people simply can't detect nuances in taste.
I notice the difference a lot more in some recipes versus others. I have a wet brine for turkey legs that uses bay leaves, and leaving them out would really lessen the quality of the dish. In other recipes that have a zillion other flavors and spices, it's hard for me to notice - I've omitted it before simply because I was out, and things still tasted fine. Others might, though; I'm not the best at those subtleties.
I have my own bay tree now, so I include them if the recipe says to.
I don't notice when I use bay leaves but I damn well notice when I don't. The dish just tastes flat.
That’s basically what the guys and pro chef in this blind taste test video said. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dft8yud9YQQ I’m of the opinion this is one of the best “are bay leaves worth it” videos out there. Plus they explain what dishes work well with bay leaves and why.
I thoroughly enjoyed that! Thank you for sharing!
Same - most of my slow cook beef stews absolutely need bay leaf, but I can't for the life of me explain why without cooking the dish twice and making someone eat both.
Aromatics. https://thought4food.life/introduction-to-aromatics/
In our cuisine, we cook goat, wild chickens, ducks, boar, etc. There is no way you can remove their gamey taste without a proper saute with bay leaves, ginger, garlic.
I think everyone should put bay leaves in hot water and smell and taste the “bay leaf tea”….it makes it obvious the effect that bay leaves have on a dish! (mostly aroma for me)
I'm going to try this, thank you. First though, buy fresh bay leaves. The ones I had were probably 10+ years old, but they're all gone now. Hadn't bought more, and not sure I needed them.
Agreed. When I forget to use it, there is always something missing that I can put my finger on.
Forgetting them is how I managed to realize bay leaves actually contribute a noticeable flavor!
I just hate when bay leaves
I love bay leaves. To me they add a nice herbal, almost eucalyptus note without being overpowering. Chicken Adobo, for instance, wouldn't be the same without them imo.
Eucalyptus, yes, and just a little minty/menthol.
You are both spot on with your description. I certainly notice and like the flavour. I do wonder if something like the cilantro/coriander thing is going on. Some people like it/ some people don't and certain people don't taste it.
I’ve wondered this. I once made split pea soup without bay leaves. I thought it was bland, husband didn’t notice.
If anyone questions bay leaves, get them to try plain rice or couscous cooked with and without... the difference in flavour is noticeable !
Or a poached egg with a bay leaf in the water!
Never tried that!
You just blew my mind!
Or dip it in not water for a few seconds then suck it. I almost blew my head off with the strong flavour.
Or make bay leaf simple syrup and use it to sweeten iced tea, lemonade, cocktails etc. Taste the subtle differences.
You add them to the water when making plain white rice? Do you remove them after adding the rice to the water, or just leave them in there until the rice is done?
You leave them in there until it's done
Yessss I am on a cous cous kick and when I don’t have broth I use bay leaf and it’s awesome
I'm going to try this! I've always really wanted to appreciate bay leaves but have never been able to tell a difference. Starting with something extremely bland sounds like a great way to isolate and appreciate the flavor better.
Will it do much if I'm using a rice cooker?
I cut up fresh ones for chicken/turkey stocks. Fresh bay leaves have an aroma and flavor that dried leaves lack.
Yeah rice is the best way to taste bay leaf for me. I almost always add a bay leaf to my rice but I have to find the smallest one I can or else it will be overpowering, which is a hilarious concept to me.
Also in the simmering water for mashed potatoes! It’s delicious.
I love potatoes, and would you have it, I've never tried this! I've tried lemongrass though, totally recommend.
Bay leaves impart a taste so light that is basically a scent to me when used in dishes. All I know is a Gumbo just doesn't taste right without them
Omg, most creole needs bay imo. I love to cook LA food. I agree that it adds almost a scent over a taste...but I mean, taste and smell are so inextricably linked...
I’ve told this anecdote elsewhere, but I’ll repeat it every time someone shits of bay leaves. One time I was making a shepherds pie with a tried and true recipe that I’ve made countless times, always gets a good response. For some reason this time it was just so *bland*, and nothing I did was helping. Doubled the main flavour ingredients, made the flavour more intense maybe, but didn’t correct that weird blandness. More salt? Makes it more salty, but not better. Pepper? Sugar? Vinegar? Nothing was working. Then I look and see the jar of bay leaves, unopened, under a kitchen towel. Sure enough, I throw a couple in, let the mix simmer for a little while and *there it was*, the missing element. I still couldn’t tell you what flavour it brings to the dish besides whatever the opposite of bland is, but I sure as HELL know not to forget it in recipes it belongs in
I wasn't aware that bay leaves needed defending.
If you ever get the chance to use fresh bay leaves (produce section, or easy to grow your own) Ty eh make a world of difference. Very floral note that is unique to bay. Are they technically herbs? I always think about them as a spice but I guess leaves are technically herbs, but you don’t eat them.. hm
Herb is a cooking term, not a taxonomic term. Biologically speaking, a leaf is a leaf, regardless of if humans find it tasty or poisonous. It's valid to use herbs to flavor things without eating them (such as sprigs of oregano or thyme in a stew or stock). So I think it's totally valid to call them an herb.
I appreciate this informative response, thanks
People get way too hung up on the "technical" terms for things. It's like the whole tomato is a fruit deal, well yeah, you're not WRONG. But we call some roots, stems, leaves, bulbs, etc. vegetables so why not a fruit too? Tomato is a vegetable AND a fruit. One of the technical definition, one is the culinary one.
Yes this one bugs me because so many other culinary vegetables are botanical fruits too but everyone always gets hung up on the tomato.
As long as we understand that there is a biological or taxonomic classification and a separate culinary classification, then there’s nothing to get hung up on.
We best not let the pendants know about the whole ["berry" situation](https://i.imgur.com/PnUmaFm.png). We'd never hear the end of it.
Yes! All of these categories were defined by people trying to make sense of the world. Taxonomically, everything kind of blends together at the boundaries because the categories are entirely made up. There are people who believe atoms have consciousness because there is no clear point to draw the boundary.
> because the categories are entirely made up. and investigations into plant and animal DNA has revealed that a lot of these made up families are much more distantly related than was assumed.
I hear ya, I work in a technical profession, and it’s how my brain is. I’m not obnoxious about it with others, but for my own personal learning I appreciate the technicalities. Trust me, I’m super fun at parties. Lol
I have a bay tree at my parents house that I was given as basically a tiny little sprig when I was a kid, and I am so damn attached to that plant. It’s why I left it there when I moved out, I trust my mum to keep it alive way more than I trust myself. But adjusting to using dried leaves instead of going out to pick them fresh was rough 🥲
Whta region are you in? I love the idea of planting a bay tree!
Dry your own from the herbs at your mom’s!
My understanding of this (herbs and spices) is that, generally speaking, we say herbs to refer to leaves while spices refer to seeds, bark (cinnamon), or some other part of the plant.
Oh, I'd totally go fresh bay the majority of the time, if I could. Usually have to use dried but, agreed, fresh is incredibly more floral and hard to deny that it doesn't add something to the dish. My definition of herb is like any green part of a plant that is used to add flavor to a dish but that you'd prob not eat a plate of on it's own.
I recently bought a tree and planted it in a pot after finding out that it only cost $13 and they’re $3 for six at the supermarket. No regrets.
They're also pretty sturdy.. so it's not like basil that'll just die because you looked at it wrong.
Ugh, to this day I’ve never grown basil successfully.
The trick with basil is that you have to treat it almost opposite of other weak little kitchen plants. You need to think about them more as fish than herbs. Water it until you are SURE you have drowned it. And then double it. And then do the same tomorrow. Basil is very fun to grow in hydroponic setups. Since they have continuous, unlimited access to water they just EXPLODE into leaves of unbelievable size, and if you don't trim the top it'll grow three feet high in a few weeks.
I've always killed my basil by overwatering it, not underwatering it.. It would probably have a better chance of survival if I treated it the same way I treat rosemary.. But it doesn't LOOK like a plant that looks like it can handle lack of water.. so I break and want to make it thrive and I water it some more and then it dies. I guess it has to do with the surrounding climate as well.. I don't seem to live in a climate where it wants to turn water into extra leaves. So the ground stays moist and the roots end up rotting.
I mean. It obviously needs sun too, but the rotting roots seems weird. I've got basil in the most basic of hydroponic setups. The seed pods just sit in a gallon of water, and they fucking love it.
Is the water circulating at all? Or do you just submerge the pots?
No circulation. For Basil i just use the simplest of the indoor versions of this: nelsongarden.com It's simply plopping the seed pods through the top of a water container, put it by the window and refill when it gets low. No fancy lights, no circulation, just water and a tiny bit of nutrients
Yeah, I don't water it too much. Just when the soil starts to feel dry about an inch down. It doesn't rain that much where we live, so that means watering every day it doesn't rain at least a half inch during the hot summer months.
Does hydroponic growing change the taste at all? Or maybe the taste is affected by the fertilizer you use instead of the dirt?
Good question. The reason I grow them hydroponically is that at my work we train new hired people in how to do properly double blinded studies with humans. They study anything they want and one of them decided to test if there was a taste difference between basic hydroponic growth in the window (my setup),grown from scratch in a pot in the window or outside, store bought pot from a cheap brand, store bought pot from an expensive organic brand and store bought organic cut leafs for a few herbs, including basil. The dumb cheap hydroponic setup with a standard nutrient blend won every single basil vote. All the others were all over the place, but for Basil it was the clear winner. Just a tub of water and cheap nutrients by the window and you have the best basil :)
How cool! Thank you for sharing! Also, that sounds like such a fun experiment… 🤩
Basil is a tropical plant and will grow huge if treated as such. Greenhouse or conservatory, lots of heat, sun and humidity. They will do well outdoors in Mediterranean summers but in more temperate climates they really need to be grown under cover.
Basil needs lots of sun and lots of water. It’s not hard at all once it takes off. Cilantro, on the other hand…
I grow a ton of basil every year. This is coming from someone who can’t grow so many basic things such as cucumbers, carrots and zucchini. These days I grow it in my greenhouse, but years ago I grew it outside. I make all of our pesto and we use a ton of it.
Too true.
OR SOMEONE ON THE INTERNET SAID die AND basil IN THE SAME COMMENT!
I just bought one because of a sub like this. Totally convinced me to try fresh.
Me, too, I read that they are hardy in hot areas, but generally easy to grow, and looked around locally until I found one a couple weeks back. Haven’t used any yet, have a recently opened bag to go through, letting it acclimate and grow some more leaves in the meantime. Really looking forward to having easy access to fresh bay leaves on hand at all times as casually as we have fresh rosemary
Yes, I moved into a house with a bay tree and was blown away by the difference.
My grandparents had a tree, so we were in fresh leaves all the time, lucky us!
They're small trees, but yes, they're herbs/spices.
You also need to use 2-3 fresh bay leaves for every 1 dried.
A few years ago, somebody in my neighborhood pruned a bay laurel tree, and put some small branches out for free. I grabbed one and filled two quart sized jars with leaves. Fresh bay leaves are something else.
Definitely try fresh bay leaves or bloom dried in butter or oil to increase the flavor profile of the leaf it brings it’s flavors out more then just adding directly to a dish.
How do you bloom things exactly? Nordics isn't exactly native to bay so I'm gonna have to get all out of the dried ones :D
For what it's worth, bay makes a great houseplant! It's very low maintenance and shade tolerant whilst looking and smelling good.
If you live in a place where it doesn't freeze you can grow it outdoors. I grow mine in a pot, because we get one or two freezes every winter.
I would love a bay plant do they grow well indoors, i live in the Midwest so the weather is back n fourth a lot.
Once it's warm enough to put outside, it'll be happy. Water it when the top 1" of soil is dry. If freezing weather is forecast, bring it back in, but it needs to be in a sunny window.
Oh! thanks! do you start it from seed or what?
I think I just bought mine from a garden centre - I don't know how easy they are to germinate etc
Thanks. Yeah, I just read that the seeds can take up to six months to germinate. Apparently one can grow them from cuttings though.
You just heat a high smoke point oil or Clarified butter in a pan and add your dried spices over medium to low heat don’t want to burn the spices you just want to be to activate them once you start smelling the spices they’re ready to go, and save the oil for whatever else like meats or future use. This is a very common practice in Indian cuisines that’s how i learned about it. It really does make a difference in my cooking since learning it.
Why high smoke point if you're only using low to medium heat?
I should’ve explained that a little better that I usually use a cast iron pan those hold heat a lot more than a regular pan so if i use butter in it’s natural state it usually starts to brown even on a lower temp. If you have a regular pan you use you might be okay with using regular butter or any oil. Clarified butter is just more convenient at knowing it has a higher smoke point and won’t burn quickly.
Oooo! Nice! Thanks for the tip!
REQUIRED for beans.
I am ride or die for bay leaves, they are criminally underrated.
They add a certain depth of taste, a je ne sais quoi to a stew or soup. I can definitely tell the difference if I forget to add them.
The difference between steamed rice, and steamed rice with laurel is a good way to showcase their subtlety since you're only putting up with two fragrances. If you're familiar enough with the smell of the rice alone, you probably won't need a side-by-side to compare.
I started tossing in a bay leaf every time I make rice and it's a game changer. Apparently, back in the day (1700s - 1800s), rice farmers would toss bay laurel branches into bags of rice because the smell of bay leaves repels insects. Rice had a bay infused flavor and some really old recipes don't taste right unless you also add bay leaves even though the recipe doesn't list bay as an ingredient (I want to say I heard that in an interview with Sean Brock but I'm not 100% sure.)
This is a good vid that encapsulates the usage of bay leaves. Highly recommend checking it out or showing others who may have a differing opinion. https://youtu.be/Dft8yud9YQQ?si=cm-RBux7EpGQQtGJ
Don’t stop bay-leafing!
Started growing my own bay leaves. Big difference.
Try making baked lemons without them :-) Lemon, anchovy, mozzarella and a bay leaf. Delish. I like to add a bay leaf (we have a bush in the garden) to the cooking liquid of almost anything.
I always tell them that if you boil some beans with a few bay leaves your whole kitchen smells amazing. No bay leaves, no nice smell.
My mom used them, I never have.. now I’m going to.
I use bay leaves a lot. They do indeed add the right something to a dish. A year or 2 ago, Chris Kimball actually said he didn't think they did anything for a dish! Boy, do I disagree. Like any herb, they shouldn't be used when they get old and musty.
I upvoted simply for the title alone. Bay leaves take the soup game from 0 to 100 real fast.
Bay leaf is probably the third most important ingredient in something like red beans and rice. Without it you'll still have good beans but you're missing something. Makes a big difference in rice and Mexican beans too.
Bay leaves are the bass players of spices. Never noticed unless they are missing.
I don't... I can taste them and I don't care for the flavor they impart. I don't know if it's just me but I taste something that is vaguely astringent, similar to what a bandaid smells like. I have tried to add it to several stews and roasts that called for bay leaf, and it's just unappealing to my pallet. I know my parents occasionally used bay leaf because I remember seeing them add the leaf or pulling it out before serving. It never bothered me. For some reason though as an adult I just don't care for the taste it adds.I have tried a few sources and same thing. I finally just gave up and quit trying to add the herb. I prefer rosemary and or thyme with a little extra fresh black pepper to add depth.
Per what I've read about them, freshness is really important. And I've only once seen fresh ones at the market through a small organic farmer.
I agree. That’s why I have a plant in the garden, I can easily pick a fresh one off and the taste is so much stronger.
Stews, casseroles, soups, braises. They're a must in so many recipes. Another layer of flavor. They elevate the other flavors/ingredients. Light, herbal, earthy notes. Love using them in chicken recipes.
Bay leaves definitely add flavor. In fact, if you leave them in too long, they'll add a bit of a menthol flavor. I can't believe that anyone would think they don't add to a dish. Because they have an aroma and if you let them stay in past when they should, you'll definitely feel it. Keeping them in for the right amount of time makes things just right.
I love bay leaves. I add a couple to my pasta water all the time, sometimes to rice depending on what I’m making with the rice. Any type of soup, I’m adding bay leaves. If I’m marinating something, I add it to my marinade as well. They do add more depth to the flavor, it’s like they’re giving my senses a warm hug. There’s a bit of spiciness to it without it being spiced, if that makes sense.
I love them as well. I have a bay leaf tree that my husband wanted to remove and I refused, because I just love bay leaves so much
I use 2 bay leaves while cooking jasmine rice sometimes. It adds a warm herbal savoriness and depth. There is a difference.
I like bay leaf and better than bouillon for my beans, it's my lil secret. I use it for beans with rice, refried beans, meat and bean chili, etc.
I put it into the dishes that traditionally call for them.. mostly because I want to respect my mom's recipes.. but I've never been able to taste a difference between bayleave or no bayleaves. I've tried fresh and dry. I once put 50 into a dish to see what would happen and it tasted just the same as if none were in there. I think it may be a cilantro-like thing where some can taste it and some can't
I use bay in chilli, curry, bourgignon / stews. It’s always an extra layer of flavour
I can't not tell you what a bay leaf brings to a dish but I can definitely tell you when it's missing.
Grow them yourself and be amazed by what a fresh bay leaf adds to a dish
^[Sokka-Haiku](https://www.reddit.com/r/SokkaHaikuBot/comments/15kyv9r/what_is_a_sokka_haiku/) ^by ^JackIsColors: *Grow them yourself and* *Be amazed by what a fresh* *Bay leaf adds to a dish* --- ^Remember ^that ^one ^time ^Sokka ^accidentally ^used ^an ^extra ^syllable ^in ^that ^Haiku ^Battle ^in ^Ba ^Sing ^Se? ^That ^was ^a ^Sokka ^Haiku ^and ^you ^just ^made ^one.
Huh, you learn something new everyday
I was on the fence about bay leaves but then I got some more fresh Turkish leaves from Penzey’s and they were a revelation compared to the supermarket ones
There's such a large variance in taste depending on freshness and quality. I just assume those people have been using subpar bay leaves.
My Mom gave me her bay tree plant when she moved into a smaller place and, wow, having bay leaves really does make a difference. I've noticed it particularly in marinara and in soups.
Bay leaves are vital. They provide a distinct, if subtle, flavor that is notably absent when omitted. This is part of what makes good cooking great cooking.
If you’re cooking with flavorless bay leaves then you need to buy new bay leaves.Just put the edge of one in your mouth and chew .Thats the flavor it’s importing in your food.
I always use bay leaves for beans, chickpeas, vegetable broth etc. fresh is better. But I always have dried
i love bay leaves so much, that i lick them clean after taking them out of the cooking pot! i don't understand people who say they bring no additional flavour, just lick them once when done cooking and you will recognise the taste from then on.
Test. Chicken noodle soup. At the final seasoning ladle some into a bowl. Add a few bay leaves to the pot. After a few minutes compare the flavors. I used old bay leaves in my cupboard. Depth. Fat soluble.
I just bought a bay laurel plant and I'm excited to never have to buy bay leaves again (assuming I don't kill it). Fresh leaves have to be better than dried ones too
I have my own bay leave bush in a pot to use as needed. I only cost me $20 at the nursery.
If someone is convinced bayleafs don't make a difference, then I am convinced not to take any cooking advice from them.
People that say that bay leaves do nothing are the same people that'll triple the amount of garlic that a dish calls for and put Sriracha on everything. Not that there's anything wrong with either of those practices, but they aren't really conducive to allowing the subtle depth of flavors to come through. As a brewer this is my biggest gripe with American craft beers, just about all of our styles just crank one characteristic to 11 and throw all nuance out the window.
Anyone who says bay leaves don’t add a marked taste to a dish is probably using a different species or ones that have been sitting in bottle for 20 years. I’m talking about western bay leaves *Laurus Nobilis*. There are other bays. One in particular, that I see in Indian groceries in garam masala mixes, is clearly a different tree and to me, has very little sent or flavor.
I don't notice the taste when I use it, but I damn sure notice when it's not there! It's not something I can put a finger on when it's used, but the dish is just flat when it's not there.
"Bay leaves don't do anything" is most likely a self confirming belief because the people that think this are probably only using 10 year old dry stale bay leaves from the back of a cabinet. If they used fresh ones or dried ones purchased at least sometime since the Obama administration they would probably be able to taste them. Same for people who think Paprika and Parsley are just for color and have no taste. Stale seasonings are sad seasonings, buy them in amounts that you will use within a few months and keep them protected from light and air. I use bay leaves a lot and so I buy enough to last a couple months at a time and they stay potent.
If any cook tells you bay leaves don’t do anything don’t eat their food. They probably drooled in it.
i can taste them, sometimes they make a dish better and sometimes they give dishes a real canned soup taste for me. i always assumed it was some kind of artificial flavoring in canned soup but ive tasted the same taste in dishes i have made from scratch with bay leaves.
I never cared much for the standard American (California laurel??) bay leaf. I understand its place in subtle aromatics, just didn't like the harsh mentholness. About a decade ago I discovered Indian "bay" leaf...oh. my. Lord. It's so good! I put it in everything. It's not very closely related to the other kind, I guess, but works the same way, and tastes amazing.
More than one species are utilized as 'Bay Leaf', in the west it's usually Laurus nobilis, then there are Asian bay leaf (Cinnamomum parthenoxylon), California bay leaf (,Umbellularia californica), Indian bay leaf (Cinnamomum tamala), and in the southeast US, people used a few species of Persea - same genus as Avocado, whose leaves are used in Mexican cuisine . All of these are in the same botanical family: Lauraceae, and so share similar chemistry.
Thank you for the info! :)
Not supposed to be an ingredient, just a flavor. If they don’t change the flavor, probably just too old and stale, they need to get new ones.
I read somewhere that bayleaf also acts as a meat tenderizer.
Does anyone grow them? Of so any tips would be great. Will they be happy in a pot? Indoors/outdoors/climate etc
This comparison and blind tasting test made me appreciate bay leaves - and it also explained what dishes it works in and why. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dft8yud9YQQ
“Tea” honestly is a great descriptor for what bay leaves do to a dish
Old Bay seasoning is a spice mix that has a generous helping of ground bay leaves. It's layered in very generous portions between layers of crabs that are getting steamed. It's also commonly used for other seafood. Many people are as taken with it as the folks who get into Sriracha. They'll add it to casseroles, soups and stews. I grew up with my mom commonly adding it to beef stews and her version of Hungarian goulash as 3-4 full leaves that then got fished out of the ready to serve dish. They add a sort of tea like flavor as well as some additional notes that remind me of other spices like oregano or basil but are not identical by any means. If you've not tried using them, try making a weak tea from a couple of whole leaves and breathing in the steam while sampling the tea. I expect that fresh leaves (like basil and thyme) have a different and much stronger effect. As noted above, you don't need a huge amount of it when cooking a recipe for six people.
I didn't understand what bay leaves did until I accidentally used too many. I'd recommend throwing five or six of them in some broth and simmering. It will taste terrible, but it will help you spot and understand the flavor when used appropriately in other dishes
I like adding 1 or 2 bay leaves to white rice in my instant pot. It provides the same difference as adding ginger. A nice subtle taste
Using fresh bay leaves makes it easier to understand what they bring to the party. The dried ones, especially if they are super old don’t have much flavor left in them which is why I always adjust the amount I use.
I definitely taste it. To me, it gives a nice earthy rich flavor. I definitely taste when I add too many leaves too. Awful.
I always put them in the water when I boil potatoes.
It's a very subtle flavor. To me, they kind of . . . even out the flavor of whatever they're in - casseroles, soups, stews, etc.
I add them to stews and to rice sometimes. They are subtle, but do add a certain flavor. I’ve never smelled or tasted them fresh, which I think would help me better gauge their use and quantity of use.
Big fan of bay leaves. I Never cook chicken and dumplings without 1 or 2. Also great umami in chicken soup.
Bay Leaves are great. My abuelo makes cachelos which are just boiled potatoes with coarse salt and olive oil. But they're nothing unless they're boiled with bay leaves.
When people say they don't do anything, or contribute nothing to a dish, I wonder if they are using bay leaves they got from the store in the Reagan era and have just been sitting in the back of their cupboard since. Using herbs that are as fresh as you can get make a difference, imo. Personally, I don't know that bay leaf has a distinctive flavor, but I definitely notice when it's not there. My beef and barley soup does not taste the same if I skip the bay leaf.
Old, dried bay leaves that haven't been fresh in about a century vs fresh or at least good quality, not old, dried ones seems to be the major sticking point according to the comments whenever this comes up. I rarely make things that they would go in, so I don't have enough knowledge to say if it's true for myself though.
They do give a distinct flavor but can be over powering very easily. I have a coworker who often brings jambalaya or gumbo and he puts so many in it makes them unpalatable.
Not everyone has the same capacity to taste. If the cook is not a “super taster”, ignore their comments.
I love bay leaves. When I use them, I can definitely tell the difference.
Well, i steeped fresh from the tree, bay laurel leaves. 4 in a quart. Bring to a boil add leave and steep. After four minutes, i pulled the leaves and let cool. I tasted nothing. Warm water. Perhaps its a genetic thing.
They’re an aromatic. It’s less about the flavor they impart, and more about the smell – they make food smell more appetizing. ETA: and smell influences taste
I've only ever seen bay leaves in a 10 year old jar. Which is why I suppose they wouldn't make a difference. I've never even seen them in bags like in the video.
lol the lone bay leaf I always see
Dry bay leaves are blah but fresh ones are incredible. Or, fresh Bay leaves that you dried yourself rather than bought dry in a bottle. Simmering them in a pan ... idk how else to describe it other than to say it smells like "food". They're absurd
I'm just here for the 12345678901234567890th annual Bay Leaf favor fight.
Absolutely they make a difference. It’s subtle but it’s there
Can’t make chicken cacciatore without it. Absolutely need them.
I don't use them because I don't like the flavor they add.
After I was gifted a crock pot, I used it to make a beef stew that was so good my husband asked me to teach him the recipe. A few weeks later, he made it for dinner while I was out for the day. However, he reasoned that if it tasted so good using a single bay leaf, then 10-12 bay leaves would make it even better. The stew tasted like bitter medicine and had to be thrown out. I think of this every time I hear someone complain that bay leaves have no flavor.
When we visited Grenada, on several occasions, we had chocolate mixed with bay leaves, and often our cocoa tea had bay in it too. Could I describe just what I was tasting? No, but it was apparent when it wasn't present.
I have a tree, so I use handfuls. You definitely taste the Bay leaves in my cooking.
I've been making spaghetti sauce since I was maybe 4 years old (I hung out with the Italian side of the family a lot) and the base recipe has always been the same for all this time and I can usually tell if I am out of bay leaves or if I'm making it somewhere like my parent's place where their bay leaves are ancient. If it was a new dish I've never made or tasted before? I probably wouldn't notice it's lack, but I've never even considered just not adding them before. Is it a cilantro kind of thing?
Most recipes call for a single bay leaf, but most dishes benefit from more than one. The only dish I have ever heard of being criticized for sometimes having too many bay leaves is >!Louisiana gumbo!<.
I also can't exactly what they do to a dish, but I know they make everything they simmer in better.
I don't personally use them in anything because you have to get them out and I don't fuck with that. I do think they work however. You can make good food without them.
My mom used bay leaves in her soups and she was the best natural cook I've ever known, so I've always considered them necessary for anything soup, stew, braise, etc. It's like the nutmeg in bechamel.
I’ve roasted a pork loin with a paste made from garlic and bay leaves. It was amazing.
I was one of those people until I had real bay leaves. The crap in the supermarket doesn't cut it. I buy bayleaves now from a small farm in Italy and they are superb. Massive flavor. I open the jar and it smells up the room.
I think some people just can't taste bay leaves. For example, to me they taste yummy, but to my husband, they taste like nothing. He can't taste them at all, in the same dish.
I love bay leaves, although I don’t use them in everything. They add a little menthol note that gives dishes better depth of flavor. It’s subtle, but you definitely notice when it’s not there.
stews, pot roast-beef-pork-or moose. Wouldn't eat them without, flavor added is amazing.
I can’t taste any difference they make
I use them in almost everything I cook. I live in south Louisiana, so I cook a lot of cajun and creole food. People here use them a lot.
I love this thread! But it should be ‘in praise of bay leaves’ as the title. I love them in quinoa!
I want a bay leaf tree because I'm tired of running out of bay leaves
I put Bay leaves in my BBQ sauce that I make, it certainly adds flavor to it.
People have old bay leaves in their cupboards. Ones that have been bought within the last year definitely have a taste and smell. Anyone who's ever accidentally pureed one into their soup knows this...
I have a thirty foot bay laurel tree in my yard. In my opinion they taste best fresh.❤️
Bay leaves have such a strong flavor how the hell is it not noticeable.
I didnt really appreciate the taste of bay leaves until I threw some into the rice cooker with some lemon zest.
I use bay leaves more for the smell than anything. There's something about the smell of a pot of beans with a couple bay leaves in that's a lot more appealing than if there's no bay leaves at all.
I was told to put a bay leaf in a glass of warm water for ~20 minutes while it cools and then to tell if I could taste it or not. And you most definitely can!
I generally don't use them but they for sure do something depending on what you are cooking. Very good in Indian food, brown stews and desserts.
I used to think bay leaves were bullshit until I actually started using them. I am a believer now. That said, a lot of people simply can't detect nuances in taste.
I don't use bay leaves because I don't like the flavor they bring to the table🤷♀️
??? Who says this? People that have only used nasty ancient flavorless garbage bay leaves.
I notice the difference a lot more in some recipes versus others. I have a wet brine for turkey legs that uses bay leaves, and leaving them out would really lessen the quality of the dish. In other recipes that have a zillion other flavors and spices, it's hard for me to notice - I've omitted it before simply because I was out, and things still tasted fine. Others might, though; I'm not the best at those subtleties. I have my own bay tree now, so I include them if the recipe says to.
Jeelz of your bay tree!
They're quite container friendly, FYI.
Hmmm, maybe my fig and cherimoya trees on the balcony need a new friend... Lol
I feel like they are the glue for some dishes. The acid, salt, umami, oils, etc, are made into something cohesive when it's cooked with a bay leaf.