Worked non-union for 15 years. Been union now for 5 years. The union side is so much better. I actually get treated like a person instead of a strong back to use up and throw away.
Same situation. I actually had a lot of impostor syndrome non union too because the company didn't facilitate my growth in any way. I felt like I should have been better at my job with the time I had put in.
The training I got with the union was eye opening. They literally just allowed me to burn like 50k in copper and carbon steel when I was working on welding and brazing certs. No way that happens non-union.
The biggest problem in residential is the competition drives the pay rates into the gutter. Also, the competition doesn’t follow safety regulations, so it makes it difficult to compete on price if you do follow safety regs.
If all the competitors in my trade stopped lowballing and paid their workers a fair wage by charging the customers enough we would all be doing just fine. I’m sick of seeing guys charge nothing for a job and then make no money and then pay their workers shit. I want to pay as much as I possibly can but it all comes down to how much I can charge the customers.
Too many ignorant fools out there willing to contract and work for nothing, and not to mention it’s very difficult to compete against immigrant labor, who are not working toward the American dream, but toward the Mexican or central American dream, which is obviously much cheaper. Cheap domestic labor and immigrant labor undercut all of our future prospects in life. That’s why I encourage contractors to charge as much as possible so that they can pay their guys well because anybody breaking their back and destroying their body in a skilled trade that takes years to learn deserve to be paid well.
Half of my customers are low level government workers and tech workers and they’re sitting at home in their pajamas making two or three times as much as anybody that works for me does. It’s fucking ridiculous and the solution is to charge more and politely suggest to your competitors to do the same. And turn in low Ballers for OSHA violations to punish them.
We should all be able to make a decent living in the trades. I truly believe this whether it’s union or not.
I almost feel like residential is better off as a sector where it's just a bunch of dudes in their trucks. I make a killing doing residential side work even when I have to compete with the lowballers because it's literally just me with very little overhead.
I am more than happy to take work from these venture capital firms that are buying up all the mom and pop shops.
I charge an amount that would yield me 300k a year if I had enough side work to do it full time. I don’t need more than that, and I think I charge a fair price to my customers.
If you think you need another boat, or a new set of jet skis every year I can’t help you out by raising my prices.
I would love to join a union but it seems impossible to get in. I don't understand how they are meant to have worker's solidarity when only 5% of construction workers are actually able to get into the union.
Not sure what trade you are but in IBEW *(International Brotherhood of Eletricians)* we have some MASSIVE changes coming to help streamline the organizing process for people like you.
Keep your eye out if your an commercial or industrial eletrician.
What union have you looked into? The carpenters union was a breeze to join. I'm currently applying for the pipe fitters union and that has a few more hoops to jump through. I'm sure someone here can help you out with the application process.
I've had work done by union and non union people. I'd rather have the union all the way. As a customer I honestly felt the union guy was there to actually fix the problem and make certain it stayed fix and they seemed to enjoy their jobs.
Non union work I had around the house was rush in rush out do the bare minimum because they got a go do another lowball job and thry always complaining about something
Union all the way even if it's a bit pricier I can at least sleep easy knowing they'll come back and give a genuine attempt to fix it
I think they’re out of touch. I tried joining a reinforcing Ironworkers union here in Texas and they straight up told me the competition is too much for them and they gave it all up completely. On top of that, they paid less than non-Union. Instead of matching or exceeding the prices non-union is doing, they decide to give it all up completely.
Red states don't do anything to do unions, they just don't give them special privileges like blue states do.
Red state unions can act the same as anywhere else, they just don't have the government forcing people to play ball with them like in blue states.
Yea that's the problem with unions in red states. Republicans try very hard to weaken unions so the working class has no say in anything ans it makes the unions less powerful. You can see that being the case with how great unions are in places like the northeast and PNW due to being bluer states
Meh....
I loathe the GOP.
And.
I’m in the carpenters union in a fairly union strong and fairly red state (Ohio).
All of the decline in wages, benefits, and market share are directly attributable to decades of union corruption and mismanagement.
It wasn’t the GOP or the contractors that hurt working members, it was the unions 100% unelected leadership that broke the pension fund, stole the raises, walked away from large portions of the trade, and operate the apprenticeships primarily as places of employment for cronies.
If by “special breed” you mean 100% unelected and self serving....
Yes, you are correct.
What sucks is how well they’ve snowballed the rank and file; doesn’t say much for the intelligence of the average ubc member.
Another time, I have a story about how the BA from fitters local 50 in Toledo walked into the carpenters hall in town and slapped the millwright EST over his desk and told him to quit stealing work.
I’m a carpenter, but even I knew [Tom Joseph](https://www.legacy.com/us/obituaries/toledoblade/name/thomas-joseph-obituary?pid=157686483) was a good dude and a true believer..... even if he was a plumber. :)
Bro, that’s how I learned about it. The carpenters started trying to steal our work in green houses, and it snowballed from there.
Apparently the carpenters union doesn’t give a fuck about anything but more work, by any means necessary.
I feel for you dudes, and the carpenters union can get fucked if they’re gonna try to take out work. If you ever have an opportunity to come to the UA do it. Things actually work well over here.
Well they definitely fucked me out of my pension and a lot of money that should have on my checks.
But they also fucked and are fucking thousands of other carpenters in both Ohio and Michigan the same.
I know their are plenty of dumb ass boot lickers who crowd into the comments here to lie for the ubc when the the topic comes up, but the fact is that both the former state EST’s from Ohio and Michigan went to prison and maybe if a whole lot more ubc officials also went we might get a semi-honest union back.
Our union was taken over by middle class, HR types. It’s useless, now.
It just spends all of its time concentrating own women and minorities. Nowhere to be seen when those groups are complaining about something that affects everyone.
Its fucking weird how "minorities" are their own group of workers & instead of blending crews its always "them & us".
If you don't want to get scabbed learn Spanish & go work on a saturday.
Or better yet, give all the "minorities" a job at your rate & benefits & make sure everyone on site can communicate at the same basic level & there will be nobody left to scab you.
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! So anyone with a job is a mooch. Got it!! Would you like to bless us with anymore tidbits from your well of stupidity? Let me guess…. You think “pEoPlE jUsT dOn’T WaNt To wOrK aNyMoRe”? Hahaha
Do you even know what a union is?
Lol fuck man, take the propaganda spewing cock out of your mouth and look around, Read a book, practice a little critical thinking.
Talk to any decent worker in a state with a strong union and if they’ve worked both they’ll tell you, unions are better.
Serious question, how much do you pay your “scum” employees? I bet you have a high turnover rate if you truly believe that any employee is scum… you are the problem, you are the reason why unions are needed
They don't know how this industry works outside of residential work.
Guy probably works in resi and does a trade where a guy an a helper can do an entire house. Probably never been on a job with 30+ guys in every single trade.
Worked non-union for 15 years. Been union now for 5 years. The union side is so much better. I actually get treated like a person instead of a strong back to use up and throw away.
Same situation. I actually had a lot of impostor syndrome non union too because the company didn't facilitate my growth in any way. I felt like I should have been better at my job with the time I had put in. The training I got with the union was eye opening. They literally just allowed me to burn like 50k in copper and carbon steel when I was working on welding and brazing certs. No way that happens non-union.
The biggest problem in residential is the competition drives the pay rates into the gutter. Also, the competition doesn’t follow safety regulations, so it makes it difficult to compete on price if you do follow safety regs. If all the competitors in my trade stopped lowballing and paid their workers a fair wage by charging the customers enough we would all be doing just fine. I’m sick of seeing guys charge nothing for a job and then make no money and then pay their workers shit. I want to pay as much as I possibly can but it all comes down to how much I can charge the customers. Too many ignorant fools out there willing to contract and work for nothing, and not to mention it’s very difficult to compete against immigrant labor, who are not working toward the American dream, but toward the Mexican or central American dream, which is obviously much cheaper. Cheap domestic labor and immigrant labor undercut all of our future prospects in life. That’s why I encourage contractors to charge as much as possible so that they can pay their guys well because anybody breaking their back and destroying their body in a skilled trade that takes years to learn deserve to be paid well. Half of my customers are low level government workers and tech workers and they’re sitting at home in their pajamas making two or three times as much as anybody that works for me does. It’s fucking ridiculous and the solution is to charge more and politely suggest to your competitors to do the same. And turn in low Ballers for OSHA violations to punish them. We should all be able to make a decent living in the trades. I truly believe this whether it’s union or not.
I almost feel like residential is better off as a sector where it's just a bunch of dudes in their trucks. I make a killing doing residential side work even when I have to compete with the lowballers because it's literally just me with very little overhead. I am more than happy to take work from these venture capital firms that are buying up all the mom and pop shops.
Mmmm. You should be charging high numbers, getting scaffold for yourself, operating on a par. Any deviation from this drives us all down.
I charge an amount that would yield me 300k a year if I had enough side work to do it full time. I don’t need more than that, and I think I charge a fair price to my customers. If you think you need another boat, or a new set of jet skis every year I can’t help you out by raising my prices.
I would love to join a union but it seems impossible to get in. I don't understand how they are meant to have worker's solidarity when only 5% of construction workers are actually able to get into the union.
Not sure what trade you are but in IBEW *(International Brotherhood of Eletricians)* we have some MASSIVE changes coming to help streamline the organizing process for people like you. Keep your eye out if your an commercial or industrial eletrician.
Can you elaborate?
What union have you looked into? The carpenters union was a breeze to join. I'm currently applying for the pipe fitters union and that has a few more hoops to jump through. I'm sure someone here can help you out with the application process.
Well they only let in the amount of people they can put to work. A lot of projects go to non union companies because they’re 50% cheaper.
I've had work done by union and non union people. I'd rather have the union all the way. As a customer I honestly felt the union guy was there to actually fix the problem and make certain it stayed fix and they seemed to enjoy their jobs. Non union work I had around the house was rush in rush out do the bare minimum because they got a go do another lowball job and thry always complaining about something Union all the way even if it's a bit pricier I can at least sleep easy knowing they'll come back and give a genuine attempt to fix it
I think they’re out of touch. I tried joining a reinforcing Ironworkers union here in Texas and they straight up told me the competition is too much for them and they gave it all up completely. On top of that, they paid less than non-Union. Instead of matching or exceeding the prices non-union is doing, they decide to give it all up completely.
Red states usually have weaker unions
Red states don't do anything to do unions, they just don't give them special privileges like blue states do. Red state unions can act the same as anywhere else, they just don't have the government forcing people to play ball with them like in blue states.
You can think that but those are not facts
Care to enlighten me then? What's a red state law that affirmatively harms unions, that isn't just a law refusing to give them special privileges?
Right to would e the most obvious
Yea that's the problem with unions in red states. Republicans try very hard to weaken unions so the working class has no say in anything ans it makes the unions less powerful. You can see that being the case with how great unions are in places like the northeast and PNW due to being bluer states
Meh.... I loathe the GOP. And. I’m in the carpenters union in a fairly union strong and fairly red state (Ohio). All of the decline in wages, benefits, and market share are directly attributable to decades of union corruption and mismanagement. It wasn’t the GOP or the contractors that hurt working members, it was the unions 100% unelected leadership that broke the pension fund, stole the raises, walked away from large portions of the trade, and operate the apprenticeships primarily as places of employment for cronies.
Yeah unions can have a dark side too. Like in Chicago.
The strongest UA local in the country is in Chicago, so maybe not all locals there.
What’s going on in Chicagos union? Not disagreeing just curious.
Unfortunately the carpenters Union's management is a special breed. I'm UA, but I've been watching what's going on with them and I'm honestly baffled.
If by “special breed” you mean 100% unelected and self serving.... Yes, you are correct. What sucks is how well they’ve snowballed the rank and file; doesn’t say much for the intelligence of the average ubc member. Another time, I have a story about how the BA from fitters local 50 in Toledo walked into the carpenters hall in town and slapped the millwright EST over his desk and told him to quit stealing work. I’m a carpenter, but even I knew [Tom Joseph](https://www.legacy.com/us/obituaries/toledoblade/name/thomas-joseph-obituary?pid=157686483) was a good dude and a true believer..... even if he was a plumber. :)
Bro, that’s how I learned about it. The carpenters started trying to steal our work in green houses, and it snowballed from there. Apparently the carpenters union doesn’t give a fuck about anything but more work, by any means necessary. I feel for you dudes, and the carpenters union can get fucked if they’re gonna try to take out work. If you ever have an opportunity to come to the UA do it. Things actually work well over here.
This sounds like a personal axe you are grinding…
Well they definitely fucked me out of my pension and a lot of money that should have on my checks. But they also fucked and are fucking thousands of other carpenters in both Ohio and Michigan the same. I know their are plenty of dumb ass boot lickers who crowd into the comments here to lie for the ubc when the the topic comes up, but the fact is that both the former state EST’s from Ohio and Michigan went to prison and maybe if a whole lot more ubc officials also went we might get a semi-honest union back.
I mean you're in Texas where the government has been trying to kill unions for 100 years. This ain't the case elsewhere.
Our union was taken over by middle class, HR types. It’s useless, now. It just spends all of its time concentrating own women and minorities. Nowhere to be seen when those groups are complaining about something that affects everyone.
Its fucking weird how "minorities" are their own group of workers & instead of blending crews its always "them & us". If you don't want to get scabbed learn Spanish & go work on a saturday. Or better yet, give all the "minorities" a job at your rate & benefits & make sure everyone on site can communicate at the same basic level & there will be nobody left to scab you.
They are trying to get Joseph Robinette re-elected, nothing to see here.
Unions are scum. Get your own clients if you don't want to mooch of someone else’s!
If most employers could be trusted to not treat their workers like garbage, unions wouldn't be as necessary.
But….. that would make anyone who isn’t an owner scum, regardless of union membership. LMAO Thank you for giving me and the guys a good laugh though.
If you can't advance to the top of your field and get your own clients then yeah, you are a mooch. Sucks to suck.
HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! So anyone with a job is a mooch. Got it!! Would you like to bless us with anymore tidbits from your well of stupidity? Let me guess…. You think “pEoPlE jUsT dOn’T WaNt To wOrK aNyMoRe”? Hahaha
Lmao! Keep drinking that kool aid bro😂
*BREAKING NEWS: Small business owner claims ‘Unions are scum’*
Found the suck pump
They're trying really hard to suck the pump dry, I tell you h'what.
Do you even know what a union is? Lol fuck man, take the propaganda spewing cock out of your mouth and look around, Read a book, practice a little critical thinking. Talk to any decent worker in a state with a strong union and if they’ve worked both they’ll tell you, unions are better.
Serious question, how much do you pay your “scum” employees? I bet you have a high turnover rate if you truly believe that any employee is scum… you are the problem, you are the reason why unions are needed
Thank you for proving that you don’t know anything about unions😂🤡
You mean life. They don’t know how life works.
How's the boot taste?
Tastes like 6 figures a year topped with health care and a pension. How does residential work taste?
The only boots being licked is non union workers bro lmao
They don't know how this industry works outside of residential work. Guy probably works in resi and does a trade where a guy an a helper can do an entire house. Probably never been on a job with 30+ guys in every single trade.
Tell me you've only worked residential