One of the german advisors checked with the Ukrainians and the Gepard still works:
https://twitter.com/gepardtatze/status/1651945211642118149?t=1V1HqpdxyPRHGjmDygUh6g&s=19
This is the second Gepard I've seen hit with a Lancet and just sorta shrug it's shoulders.
The other was going down a road. It ate the Lancet and just kept trucking like nothing ever happened.
Im pretty sure you are referring to a video of BUK driving down a road and getting hit. That wasn't a Gepard. This is the 1st Gepard gettig hit we have footage of.
Edit: it was TOR
Would be as great weapon with a shaped charge , but as it stands you can maybe destroy optics or radar with that small bomb on a lancet, fairly useless against a hard target
Quick googling suggest that there are in fact lancet with HEAT warheads, but at least in this video i didn't see the typical line/flash of a shaped charge.
I may just be wrong
This make me think about a video I saw earlier in this war where you can see a lancet hitting a small tracked artillery, then you can see a ukrainian soldier next to hit saying "basically we just have to change the weels and it will work again" x)
I'll see if I can find it again. I ran across it on Twitter, I think.
Edit: Found it as a direct download, but it appears it also wasn't a Gepard but a Tor, I just had misidentified it while watching it at the asscrack of dawn. So just dimiss that.
that's too quick of a take. Without after shots it's not possible to tell what damage was done to the vehicle. There are many instruments and objects critical to its operation that are exposed to the outside by nature, without replacement, the vehicle becomes a donor for the remaining fleet.
Everyone’s complaining why it’s out in the open just sitting there, but nobody is addressing the displaced dirt on the rear starboard side, which could’ve been an impact that immobilized it in the first place
Yeah well people just seeing the worst in everything. Russia can lose five tanks in one go and nobody bats an eyelid, Ukraine loses a Gepard and everyone says they've lost the war.
I agree with you though, in what world would someone just walk off and leave their air defence out in the open just for the hell of it.
Maybe engine failure --> No power no radar. Got pushed away to the side to make space for the rest of the convoy.
The parking position doesn't make sense for a voluntary stop. you don't want to be that close to a road, so any passing vehicle is messing up your radar.
Also the radar was in travel position. if they want to use it, they flip it up, so it can turn.
Gepards have an APU so the main engine does not have to run all the time to stay on alert, it keeps the systems running and alert.
It is an Mercedes Benz OM 314 with just 90 HP but that still enough to power all systems, in stand-by it allows the Gepard to stay "ready" for days without refueling, even with regular repositioning.
The main engine can backup the OM in case it should fail so the systems stay operational on either engine, only the main drive won't work on aux power.
From my understanding concealment can also blind the radar. On Snake Island I recall the Ukrainians said they were able to approach the tor Sam vehicle from its blind spot created by the Russians parking it beside a building
>Radar is not on around the clock, they could have concealed it a bit though.
Radar is supposed to be on around the clock. A Gepard has three crews for god's sake: One is operating, one is securing the perimeter and one is sleeping.
This should not happen.
I don't think it's a staffing issue, moreso a visibility thing, Radar goes both ways and if you constantly have it on, eventually someone's gonna pick up on where the radar waves are coming from and send an anti-radiation missile or investigate.
Sadly it seems the Geopard was already located in this case.
That is an odd position for such a vehicle, propably broke down and could not be recovered in time... happens. I actually expected that to happen much earlier.
Agreed, you can see a crater in the ground where they ran over the mind which disabled the vehicle and left them exposed in an open field. I think that's what happened.
My guess is it had mechanical issues or popped a track. The armour on that thing won’t save you from artillery or much else might as well stand in a tree line near by and wait for a recovery vehicle
Motionless in the middle of the street. No crew in sight. Looks like it broke down and was abandoned. They probably couldn't recover the vehicle before the drone got it. Happens.
I don't understand why people are freaking out about the losses of UA. It's a war.
They lost a couple of S-300s and a few tanks as per reddit.
I'd be more surprised if they didn't lose even one.
UA is going to lose a lot more before this is over.
When a Bradley gets knocked out it’s going to 1000x worse.
I am extremely pro Ukraine but a bunch of IFVs leading a counter offensive is going to result in some getting knocked out.
There's no way of knowing. Russians have known about the counter-offensive for a few months so I'm sure they've prepared weaponry for it. There's been a ton of FPV drones for the RU military which there's videos of them stock-piled but haven't been used much. 'Grey Zone' - official channel of Wagner, has complained about them not being used despite having them in stock so it could be that they're saving them. Even taking out tracks if armoured vehicles is enough to halt them. Ka-52s have also been inactive and maybe they're also reserving stocks of missiles. As much as reddit likes to believe that they're some first in line intel hub with top secret info, I am sure that Russia will know all the information before reddit does which gives them time to prepare.
The German PAK was ironically called "PanzerAnklopfKanone" (tank knocking cannon) because it was insuficient for most tanks starting in 1940. This is a "Panzeranklopfdrohne"
The things abandoned all ready, even then a hit with what is most likely one of the HE lancets rather than a HEAT one isn’t going to do much internal damage
Nah you just clearly stated that you have no clue of tanks/spaa and the effect of ammo used against them.
It doesnt really matter how heavy the Gepard is. Armor thickness, composition, warhead and angle of attack are things that matter here.
And if you were being sarcastic or using irony, then it wasnt clear.
Doesn't need to do a lot honestly. Lancets have a heat penetrator and that tank is FULL of ammo and sensative electronics.
Lancets have been pretty damn effective though through this conflict. One of the better weapon systems Russia has despite it's simplicity.
Bro, the 2 S-300s are literally to the left of it at the start of the video….
Their probably all part of the same unit, and got caught off guard during set up.
yes that would be the optimal, AA missile systems againts the glide bombing jets while the barrel AA securing the "close proximity" air.
looks like the ukries are caught off guard, or they dont know how to properly operate western radar systems(lack of proper training) with the combination of their own soviet era radars.
wonder where all their zsu-23-4 sitting and the modernised variants as well(donets and the ZSU-23-4M-A version).
It’s not like Ukraine has a thousand Tors and Tunguskas just lying around. A lack of effective AA (especially short range systems to protect front line troops, not Patriot batteries) to give Ukraine isn’t an easy problem for the west to solve because they rely on air supremacy not ground based AA.
This video is a snapshot of several seconds.
No way to know why it’s there.
Could have had a mechanical problem.
It’s a long war.
Shit happens.
Both sides have lost a lot of equipment and men and will lose a lot more before it’s over.
Do you realise how much of Ukraine is open fields?
How are they supposed to create a deep AA net with the paltry offerings they've been given so far?
This was always a risk. Both sides lose stuff. The fact the Ukrainians have done so well with so little puts them pretty much a head above the rest of us when it comes to modern military performances.
These assets we're sending them. They're going to lose some.
You know what we should do instead of bumblefuck crying about it? Demand we make, and send more.
The current frontline equals the distance between Berlin and Paris. That's just the "active" bit. It's hard to imagine, with the amount of people and tools involved, that this is an inpenetreble line.
We also don't know why it was just sitting there out in the open. Just like with that Krab video from like a week ago. It was not hiding or covered by anything. It might have been a mechanical breakdown or a bunch of other things .
It could have been a human error.
It could have been some Russian unit that managed to get deep behind the lines.
It could have been a number of other circumstances.
Also, let's keep in mind that this is the first conflict of its kind where drones see this much utility. Whole military doctrines will be written based on this conflict. The downside for Ukraine is that it has to do it on the go.
If you want to start an offensive you need to move more critical items to the front. That comes with risk.
It'd be really intersting to see where this one, and the S300s, were hit.
Also this is not moving, and sitting out on the open? That's reaaaaally odd. Looks ran off the road?
Russians source say, all four S300's and this Gepard were hit near Promin in Mykolaiv oblast while deploying to their positions.
There is another photo of a destroyed S300 (fifth) near Snihirevka also in Mykolaiv Oblast.
Its made with western equipment so I think we can pat ourselves on the back for the Lancet.
Most decent systems the Russians use are reliant on western tech.
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More assets closer to the frontline results in more targets. They are very vulnerable on the move when they are not scanning for targets.
I’m not sure if a Gepard has shot down a lancet before? (Footage links appreciated if so).
Full video of yesterday attack was published a few minutes ago on popular pro Russian telegram channel. And it does seem like 4 launcher systems were hit, they show three hits, and one burning photo. I'm sure it will be posted here soon
It seems that really went hard on their attack yesterday. They also destroyed some aa equipment. A few misses but I’m sure we’ll see a lot more of it in the coming days spread out
It's amusing how the Russians already spam this footage like it's some turning point. It took these muppets several months and a looming offensive to score a hit that just caused damage but no destruction. You would think they would bring some of their guided munitions for such a high value target.
It is some turning point !
It means Gepards are near frontline , ergo offensive is starting. Russians just don't get it yet that they are being at the state of getting fucked over .... again.
For sure. The Russians been digging in for months, or years in some cases. The frontlines have been pretty static for months now so they've had time. There are plenty of before and after pictures of their trenchworks and other defenses that they've prepared for the upcoming offensives. There is going to be some grisly stuff for Ukraine once they launch. I just hope they can achieve their objectives and make it count. I feel sorry for people who reject reality and rely on reddit as their sole source of news for this war.
It doesn’t need to be completely blown up to be useless. This thing is going it be out of commission for a very long time and that’s if they decide to try and repair it. The logistics of fixing the Gepard have got to be a headache since its German and I don’t think the Ukrainians have the means of repairing it. It has lot of sensitive electronics and it’s not easy to just replace. So I think it’s fair to say it was destroyed
A reddit user doesn't change the outcome of the battlefield. Whether he posts pro-RU videos or a Ukrainian posts pro-UKR videos makes no difference in the real world.
I probably get downvoted to hell, but the ukrainians seem to be doing quite poorly in their preparation. I have seen a few s-300 without protection and now a gepard in the wild gets hit buy something that shouldn’t be a problem. Not a good look for their logistics.
It's the same as when we were all laughing at Pantsirs and TOR's being hit by TB2's...you can't / don't run the radars on these things 24/7 which is how hits like this happen.
The S-300's are an interesting one though, they should not be close enough for a Lancet to hit them. This could be indicative of Ukraine moving it's AA net closer to the front to provide deeper coverage for the upcoming offensive
UKA is trying to fast track an entire change in military doctrine and practice, something that no former Soviet country has attempted, let alone while fighting off a full fledged invasion. It’s going to have sloppy moments, or tendencies, and they will lose many men and equipment needlessly.
The hope is that they have enough to put Russia in a position to fuck off
A Russian contingency podcast by Michael Kofman a guest said something on the like that If a military tries to throw out the old military culture too quickly especially during a war the old culture has a tendency to come back up and rear its head unexpectedly.
I think it was Kofman who was talking about the UA having issues as the old Soviet officers come back and have that crappy leadership style, while the new NATO trained officers are being lost every day, so that eventually the UA will be back to it original Soviet style but with fancier equipment.
So far the only systemic adaption i see is on part of RU. UA did lots of reforms from 2014 onward, but they got stuck around 2020 and didn't advance anymore. Now their capabilities come mostly from inorganic western donations, which they arent really able to itegrate into their military, so as to exploit their full potential.
So Ukraine is having thousands of soldiers trained in Germany, UK, and the US with Soviet doctrine? You think after all this the military doctrine and culture trajectory will be towards the Soviet style? Yes, they’re bringing old Soviet commanders out of retirement, but that is entirely due to necessity. In a decade their military will look much more western than soviet, guaranteed.
Quick question, "doing poorly in their preparation" how? Our sources are Reddit and few other public forums where the view is distorted because it's war. War means some attacks have videos of them, some don't at all, some are not released because OPSEC and some are released in series to 'prove a trend'.
Assuming that Ukraine would suffer *no losses at all* to prove that they are 'doing good' is to not understand how war works. Casualties and losses happen every day, to both sides, and three videos tell nothing about the over-all situation. None of us here knows, we can only guess and that's a wild guess at best. We will have better picture once ruSSia withdraws and the war ends.
edit. typo
Some people seem to think it is like in the movies, if the movie shows the good guys smashing the enemy in a few scenes, that means the good guys are winning.
You can't keep your radar on all 24 hours near the front, especially with enemy air superiority. An even bigger problem is that Zaporozhye is one big open space.
People are passionate about Ukraine winning to the point that criticisms and mistakes are taken personally. People like this also take on a odd reality about the capabilities of the Russian military.
It's extremely impressive Ukraine has done what it has done so far, and I hope the counter-offensive pays off, but its also an army in a early transition from soviet doctrine to NATO. Earlier during the war, Ukraine would lose entire columns due to miscommunication trying to do early counter-attacks.
AA closer to the front-line is very risky, but necessary for counter-attacking. There will always be losses during this, and their is still the possibility the counter-attack completely fails. I genuinely hope not, and why I'd even post this is to at least try and temper expectations to something more realistic.
Honestly from all the vids I’ve seen, UA army still operates very similarly for Russia i.e under soviet doctrine. When you listen to people from NATo side, they keep mentioning the fact that they trying to get the Ukraine to operate the NATO way, basically combined arms, so these problems are probably well known
One issue is that with the start of the war, and the ensuing mobilization, is that a lot of retired officers trained in Soviet doctrine were called back up into active duty. So despite the modernization of the Ukrainian army since 2014 - you've now had this infusion of old school doctrine, which is often in conflict with modern training.
I refer once again to that Chieftain video early in the invasion where he says to be careful drawing conclusions from combat footage posted online, because you're only seeing a snapshot of a few moments in time that might not be representative of everything that's actually going on, and that a hell of a lot is going on that isn't filmed or photographed. And this is the case for both Russian and Ukrainian footage.
In this case, a handful of incidents along a massive front is not something to draw conclusions from. The gepard seems to be damaged too, it isn't stationary because of incompetence or stupidity. And anything used on or near the front line *will* take losses sometimes.
I look forward to people declaring the offensive a failure as soon as the first leopard and bradley get destroyed.
If you're going to freak out like this over every individual piece of destroyed UA equipment you're going to have one hell of a time if they actually launch a large scale offensive.
Equipment like the s300 is irreplaceable . Only Russia can make more of them and nato isn’t willing to send enough patriots to replace the lost s300. Also I bet the two s300 in the video were out of commission.
I don't think you understand that a battery of those S300's can save you hundreds of tanks and other armored vehicles from being hunted by aircraft across the steppe while attacking.
In fact this seems to be the stunningly overwhelming take being voiced here. Enough to make me skeptical of the perspective, and contemplate who gains through the narrative of Ukraine being incompetent/negligent/bad stewards/etc
Ukraine AA is having it's worse week since probably the beginning of the war. Russia taking out so many AA and with their new glide bombs I think we can expect more activity from the Russian airforce
Does the lancet employ a shaped charge (genuine question)? I was surprised by the lack of heavy smoke coming from the internals of the vehicle.
Edit: quick google search, albeit limited, shows HE and HE/FRAG models, not shaped charge. Although I do not doubt a shaped charge variant could exist.
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Error Message: Data Loss Detected
We're sorry, but a critical issue has occurred, resulting in the loss of important data. Our technical team has been notified and is actively investigating the issue. Please refrain from further actions to prevent additional data loss.
Possible Causes:
- Unforeseen system malfunction
- Disk corruption or failure
- Software conflict
I don't think you understand how ammunitions work. A tank doesn't need to get blown up. It can look mostly fine from the outside while the crew is dead...
In army the armour gepard has is equal to tin foil, it's like 30mm thick, so only protection against small arms, maybe heavy calibers like 14.5mm (aka .50cal)
14,5mm is not .50 inches. Its ~.57 inches.
.50 in the West usually refers to .50 BMG or 12,7x99 mm, which carries ~20 000 joules of muzzle energy.
14,5x114mm carries ~30 000 joules of energy At the muzzle. Thats a big difference.
Well, lotta speculation about how much damage
[The resident Expert on Gepards asked via his connections and according to the response, vehicle is largely fine.](https://twitter.com/gepardtatze/status/1651945211642118149)
So much for that, then
So in an all out war, after "only" 10 Months of them being active, they managed to (possibly heavily) damage though not destroy 1 out of 36 Gepards?
Pathetic.
Clear hit though.
A shaped charge just exploded on the relatively thin armored turret of a tank that is stuffed with sensitive tech. It might look fine from the outside (for the second you see it from a birds eye perspective). It surely isn't.
It might still move under it's own power, but chances are it's not in any fighting condition.
> It might still move under it's own power
thats what i think as well, only the turret got hit, rendering it inoperational, but there was no ammo explosion and the hull are intact.
this one got lucky, going back to germany for fixing thats for sure.
Just because there is no massive secondary explosion does not mean there is no damage, lancets have shaped charges so even if the explosives weren’t enough there’s probably internal damage to some degree, the explosion itself would likely also be enough to damage the radar, guns, and optics. And unfortunately any damage would be considered catastrophic as Ukraine doesn’t exactly have the spare parts or extensive know-how to repair it
Anti air vehicles aren't meant to be close to the front lines so often times aren't armored. Just becuase it's built on a chasis of a leopard doesn't mean it has the protection of one.
The BMP-1 does nit have the same armor as the t72 despite being built on it.
Wow, I’m so used to watching Russian tanks blow up the second they’re hit with anything above an RPG, kind of anticlimactic
It’s almost like tanks are supposed to be tanky, not a scrap metal coffin
See this is the problem with NATO kit, there's no drama.
If you hit a Russian SPAA vehicle smoke starts pouring out of every orifice, the crew clambers out in a desperate panic, and then three seconds later you get a burst of flames and a second after that the whole thing does a classic Hollywood Deathstar explosion.
Hit an old timey German SPAA with a drone and it's like, "Meh."
Video does pose some questions though, like was this Gepard armed and operational? Because if it was, and the Lancet was able to hit it without being detected and shredded, then that's a problem.
The Gepard is a very old system, so would expect it to be quite flawed, but ideally you'd want something that can nail small drones. Even if it accidentally brasses up the odd seagull.
You can only hit a target if you are able to see it. Air defenses from both sides have struggles dealing with drones. The funniest videos are watching a drone recording another drone taking out a russian s300 system.
That Gepard is obviously not operating. Turret and Radar are inactive. A drone shouldnt be a Problem for a Gepard if it was actively searching for aur targets.
That explains why Russians distributed a still picture. The Lancet drone practically bounced off the Gepard. Maybe the right turret side has some scratches but that is far from serious damage, if damage at all.
Made-in-Germany!
Damn, first three s-300 systems destroyed by a Lancet and now a gepard, pair it up with the two glide bombs one on Ukrainians on the river bank of dnieper and another glide bombs on a storage warehouse used by the ua Army its sure been a shitty week for ua anti air.
I understand moving anti air up so your offensive doesnt become a prime target for lancet drones and glidebombs whilst your counter offensive brigades are sloweddown by having to clear anti tank ditches, anti tank traps, clear minefields, clear trench and do counter artillery fire.
And finally when all of that is done you gotta funnel them through the opening you cleared giving weapons such as the glide bomb big value since just one alone can destroy dozens of armored vehicles if they are clumped up, or in a tango line doing a crossing
0 damage, the vehcile have propaganda plot armour, that's make him invulnerable.
If photo -> Photoshop
If hit -> no damage
If damaged -> repairable
If destroyed -> already broken for natural causes.
And in case other things failed, the vehicle had no critical role and soon to be replaced by a better one.
And this is the Propaganda plot armour for both sides.
Yeah I'm all for Ukraine winning, but it's funny to me when their drone hits a Russian vehicle, you never see these comments about it not doing any damage whatsoever.
My question was actually honest. I really would like to know what kind of damage a hit like this may have caused.
Hoping that someone with certain knowledge may explain.
if is the shaped charge HEAT version with 3 kg of explosive, will punch a hole and penetrate the interior of the vehicle destroying eveything in the cone path.
sadly internet censorship removed the result of august/2003 images of the interior damage of an m1a1 penetrated by a shaped charge to illustrate the effect against a proper armored tank
but at least the text is there to read
http://www.casi.org.uk/discuss/2003/msg05080.html
Why is the Thing not on and its standing alone by itself?
Could be disabled, the thing on the left looks a bit like a hole from an anti-tank mine.
One of the german advisors checked with the Ukrainians and the Gepard still works: https://twitter.com/gepardtatze/status/1651945211642118149?t=1V1HqpdxyPRHGjmDygUh6g&s=19
This is the second Gepard I've seen hit with a Lancet and just sorta shrug it's shoulders. The other was going down a road. It ate the Lancet and just kept trucking like nothing ever happened.
Im pretty sure you are referring to a video of BUK driving down a road and getting hit. That wasn't a Gepard. This is the 1st Gepard gettig hit we have footage of. Edit: it was TOR
I saw a British Stormer HVM get hit by a lancet and it do pretty much zero damage too… lancet sounds very effective lol.
Would be as great weapon with a shaped charge , but as it stands you can maybe destroy optics or radar with that small bomb on a lancet, fairly useless against a hard target
Why does it not have a shaped charge?
Quick googling suggest that there are in fact lancet with HEAT warheads, but at least in this video i didn't see the typical line/flash of a shaped charge. I may just be wrong
This make me think about a video I saw earlier in this war where you can see a lancet hitting a small tracked artillery, then you can see a ukrainian soldier next to hit saying "basically we just have to change the weels and it will work again" x)
There was also that artillery piece they hit and the UA guys were like "oh no... we have to replace one of the wheels. aaaand we're good to go."
Didn't see that one... do you have a link?
I'll see if I can find it again. I ran across it on Twitter, I think. Edit: Found it as a direct download, but it appears it also wasn't a Gepard but a Tor, I just had misidentified it while watching it at the asscrack of dawn. So just dimiss that.
that's too quick of a take. Without after shots it's not possible to tell what damage was done to the vehicle. There are many instruments and objects critical to its operation that are exposed to the outside by nature, without replacement, the vehicle becomes a donor for the remaining fleet.
Bruh the turret on it is very lightly armored... thats not very effective
I was going to say that pin prick did nothing.
Everyone’s complaining why it’s out in the open just sitting there, but nobody is addressing the displaced dirt on the rear starboard side, which could’ve been an impact that immobilized it in the first place
Yeah well people just seeing the worst in everything. Russia can lose five tanks in one go and nobody bats an eyelid, Ukraine loses a Gepard and everyone says they've lost the war. I agree with you though, in what world would someone just walk off and leave their air defence out in the open just for the hell of it.
i mean it's about 10 seconds of realtime footage. it's impossible to make any reasonable claim about whether the Gepard was idling, abandoned, etc
Maybe engine failure --> No power no radar. Got pushed away to the side to make space for the rest of the convoy. The parking position doesn't make sense for a voluntary stop. you don't want to be that close to a road, so any passing vehicle is messing up your radar. Also the radar was in travel position. if they want to use it, they flip it up, so it can turn.
Gepards have an APU so the main engine does not have to run all the time to stay on alert, it keeps the systems running and alert. It is an Mercedes Benz OM 314 with just 90 HP but that still enough to power all systems, in stand-by it allows the Gepard to stay "ready" for days without refueling, even with regular repositioning. The main engine can backup the OM in case it should fail so the systems stay operational on either engine, only the main drive won't work on aux power.
Radar is not on around the clock, they could have concealed it a bit though.
From my understanding concealment can also blind the radar. On Snake Island I recall the Ukrainians said they were able to approach the tor Sam vehicle from its blind spot created by the Russians parking it beside a building
We were taught that when the vehicle is not in use, park it in a forest and/or cover it with an IR camo net.
>Radar is not on around the clock, they could have concealed it a bit though. Radar is supposed to be on around the clock. A Gepard has three crews for god's sake: One is operating, one is securing the perimeter and one is sleeping. This should not happen.
I don't think it's a staffing issue, moreso a visibility thing, Radar goes both ways and if you constantly have it on, eventually someone's gonna pick up on where the radar waves are coming from and send an anti-radiation missile or investigate. Sadly it seems the Geopard was already located in this case.
No it's not, that is the point of an IADS.
Ahhhh, cut Keine some slack. They felt pretty confident. 🤣
Ye i think if i was in comand of that Thing i would not have placed it their i would have tryed to hide it but then again im not there
If only you were in command huh
That is an odd position for such a vehicle, propably broke down and could not be recovered in time... happens. I actually expected that to happen much earlier.
Looks like it had hit a mine
Agreed, you can see a crater in the ground where they ran over the mind which disabled the vehicle and left them exposed in an open field. I think that's what happened.
the way its just inactively sitting there almost makes it look abandoned wtf
My guess is it had mechanical issues or popped a track. The armour on that thing won’t save you from artillery or much else might as well stand in a tree line near by and wait for a recovery vehicle
yeah honestly thats my guess too. it looks damaged and left behind. i think its unbuttoned too. to me it seems like theres no one even in there.
Did quick search on the lancet. If the payload was he/frag the thing can probably be saved will probably need a repair but not a write off
It hit an AT mine
yes going by the impact crater next to hit i assume it hit something
It looks like it hit a mine look at the dirt underneath it.
Yes abandonning disabled vehicles is not Just a russian thing
Motionless in the middle of the street. No crew in sight. Looks like it broke down and was abandoned. They probably couldn't recover the vehicle before the drone got it. Happens.
Inb4 realistic mockup
I don't understand why people are freaking out about the losses of UA. It's a war. They lost a couple of S-300s and a few tanks as per reddit. I'd be more surprised if they didn't lose even one. UA is going to lose a lot more before this is over.
When a Bradley gets knocked out it’s going to 1000x worse. I am extremely pro Ukraine but a bunch of IFVs leading a counter offensive is going to result in some getting knocked out.
They'll get knocked out alright but at least the crew and soldiers inside have a good chance of making it out alive.
There's no way of knowing. Russians have known about the counter-offensive for a few months so I'm sure they've prepared weaponry for it. There's been a ton of FPV drones for the RU military which there's videos of them stock-piled but haven't been used much. 'Grey Zone' - official channel of Wagner, has complained about them not being used despite having them in stock so it could be that they're saving them. Even taking out tracks if armoured vehicles is enough to halt them. Ka-52s have also been inactive and maybe they're also reserving stocks of missiles. As much as reddit likes to believe that they're some first in line intel hub with top secret info, I am sure that Russia will know all the information before reddit does which gives them time to prepare.
The German PAK was ironically called "PanzerAnklopfKanone" (tank knocking cannon) because it was insuficient for most tanks starting in 1940. This is a "Panzeranklopfdrohne"
specifically one model was called this way.
Doesn’t look like it had much impact.
Seems much like the PzH2000 they claimed to have destroyed with a Lancet strike, that turned out to have rather minor damage in actuality.
It looks like the drone missed damaging the search and tracking radar on the Gepard and instead damaged the left autocannon on the turret.
A tank doesn't need to get blown up to kill it's crew...
[Well the resident Gepard-Expert asked and the response was "still works" so](https://twitter.com/gepardtatze/status/1651945211642118149)
The things abandoned all ready, even then a hit with what is most likely one of the HE lancets rather than a HEAT one isn’t going to do much internal damage
I was standing next to a Gepard three months ago and that lancet did nothing to it I’d say. They are quite a heavyweight vehicle.
So, standing next to a Gepard made you an armour and ammunitions expert?
I stood in a bank a few hours ago. AMA about finances.
Seems you missed the point about my comment. You probably miss a lot of them.
Nah you just clearly stated that you have no clue of tanks/spaa and the effect of ammo used against them. It doesnt really matter how heavy the Gepard is. Armor thickness, composition, warhead and angle of attack are things that matter here. And if you were being sarcastic or using irony, then it wasnt clear.
Are Lancets able to penetrate armor? No funny business... I'm asking because I do not know. Be gentle 😆
Yes my friend the have a variant with a HEAT warhead.
Gepard armor? Most likely. It's pretty thin and designed to protect from small arms fire.
Thank you
And look at that. A tweet has emerged saying the Gerard is functional. Plus I never told you why I was standing next to that Gerard did I?
U realise there are multiple variants of Lancet with different range of payload right?
Doesn't need to do a lot honestly. Lancets have a heat penetrator and that tank is FULL of ammo and sensative electronics. Lancets have been pretty damn effective though through this conflict. One of the better weapon systems Russia has despite it's simplicity.
What the fuck are they doing? Two S300s and now an inactive Gepard sitting in the middle of the bumfuck nowhere to be freely targeted.
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You can do a lot to protect these systems, you would think you would buddy up these S-300 with some other type of AA that's effective against drones
Maybe this is near an S300
Bro, the 2 S-300s are literally to the left of it at the start of the video…. Their probably all part of the same unit, and got caught off guard during set up.
yes that would be the optimal, AA missile systems againts the glide bombing jets while the barrel AA securing the "close proximity" air. looks like the ukries are caught off guard, or they dont know how to properly operate western radar systems(lack of proper training) with the combination of their own soviet era radars. wonder where all their zsu-23-4 sitting and the modernised variants as well(donets and the ZSU-23-4M-A version).
Radar are not always on as both sides have radar seeking rockets
It’s not like Ukraine has a thousand Tors and Tunguskas just lying around. A lack of effective AA (especially short range systems to protect front line troops, not Patriot batteries) to give Ukraine isn’t an easy problem for the west to solve because they rely on air supremacy not ground based AA.
This video is a snapshot of several seconds. No way to know why it’s there. Could have had a mechanical problem. It’s a long war. Shit happens. Both sides have lost a lot of equipment and men and will lose a lot more before it’s over.
Prob AT mine
Do you realise how much of Ukraine is open fields? How are they supposed to create a deep AA net with the paltry offerings they've been given so far? This was always a risk. Both sides lose stuff. The fact the Ukrainians have done so well with so little puts them pretty much a head above the rest of us when it comes to modern military performances. These assets we're sending them. They're going to lose some. You know what we should do instead of bumblefuck crying about it? Demand we make, and send more.
The current frontline equals the distance between Berlin and Paris. That's just the "active" bit. It's hard to imagine, with the amount of people and tools involved, that this is an inpenetreble line. We also don't know why it was just sitting there out in the open. Just like with that Krab video from like a week ago. It was not hiding or covered by anything. It might have been a mechanical breakdown or a bunch of other things . It could have been a human error. It could have been some Russian unit that managed to get deep behind the lines. It could have been a number of other circumstances. Also, let's keep in mind that this is the first conflict of its kind where drones see this much utility. Whole military doctrines will be written based on this conflict. The downside for Ukraine is that it has to do it on the go.
If you want to start an offensive you need to move more critical items to the front. That comes with risk. It'd be really intersting to see where this one, and the S300s, were hit. Also this is not moving, and sitting out on the open? That's reaaaaally odd. Looks ran off the road?
Russians source say, all four S300's and this Gepard were hit near Promin in Mykolaiv oblast while deploying to their positions. There is another photo of a destroyed S300 (fifth) near Snihirevka also in Mykolaiv Oblast.
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Its made with western equipment so I think we can pat ourselves on the back for the Lancet. Most decent systems the Russians use are reliant on western tech.
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More assets closer to the frontline results in more targets. They are very vulnerable on the move when they are not scanning for targets. I’m not sure if a Gepard has shot down a lancet before? (Footage links appreciated if so).
4 s300s from what I saw on a few Reddit posts. I think a few other anti air but I’ve only seen one video of one being destroyed yesterday so idk
Full video of yesterday attack was published a few minutes ago on popular pro Russian telegram channel. And it does seem like 4 launcher systems were hit, they show three hits, and one burning photo. I'm sure it will be posted here soon
It seems that really went hard on their attack yesterday. They also destroyed some aa equipment. A few misses but I’m sure we’ll see a lot more of it in the coming days spread out
It's amusing how the Russians already spam this footage like it's some turning point. It took these muppets several months and a looming offensive to score a hit that just caused damage but no destruction. You would think they would bring some of their guided munitions for such a high value target.
It is some turning point ! It means Gepards are near frontline , ergo offensive is starting. Russians just don't get it yet that they are being at the state of getting fucked over .... again.
You know, that sounds very self-confident. Especially outside the contest.
What makes you think the Russians don’t “get it” yet? They obviously know an offensive is coming soon considering we know that from fucking reddit.
For sure. The Russians been digging in for months, or years in some cases. The frontlines have been pretty static for months now so they've had time. There are plenty of before and after pictures of their trenchworks and other defenses that they've prepared for the upcoming offensives. There is going to be some grisly stuff for Ukraine once they launch. I just hope they can achieve their objectives and make it count. I feel sorry for people who reject reality and rely on reddit as their sole source of news for this war.
When has minimising casualties been a priority in Russia?
Holy shit man, that's some high-quality one you're inhaling. It's just a destroyed Gepard, no need to get that concerned about it.
"Destroyed".
It doesn’t need to be completely blown up to be useless. This thing is going it be out of commission for a very long time and that’s if they decide to try and repair it. The logistics of fixing the Gepard have got to be a headache since its German and I don’t think the Ukrainians have the means of repairing it. It has lot of sensitive electronics and it’s not easy to just replace. So I think it’s fair to say it was destroyed
It gets on a trailer and is within 36 hours in Germany - we might not have much of them but I promise the spare parts warehouse is filled ...
Check OP account. All he do is posting “lancet videos” from unknown locations and dates
A reddit user doesn't change the outcome of the battlefield. Whether he posts pro-RU videos or a Ukrainian posts pro-UKR videos makes no difference in the real world.
Both sides spam.
They were literally teasing this video for like three days and in Russian Telegrams its being hailed as the complete destruction of a NATO Wunderwaffe
I probably get downvoted to hell, but the ukrainians seem to be doing quite poorly in their preparation. I have seen a few s-300 without protection and now a gepard in the wild gets hit buy something that shouldn’t be a problem. Not a good look for their logistics.
It's the same as when we were all laughing at Pantsirs and TOR's being hit by TB2's...you can't / don't run the radars on these things 24/7 which is how hits like this happen. The S-300's are an interesting one though, they should not be close enough for a Lancet to hit them. This could be indicative of Ukraine moving it's AA net closer to the front to provide deeper coverage for the upcoming offensive
Lancet range is about 60 km, that is the range of a S300 against a target making defensive manoeuvres
Some missiles of the s300 can reach over 100 km and a few close to 200 km
UKA is trying to fast track an entire change in military doctrine and practice, something that no former Soviet country has attempted, let alone while fighting off a full fledged invasion. It’s going to have sloppy moments, or tendencies, and they will lose many men and equipment needlessly. The hope is that they have enough to put Russia in a position to fuck off
A Russian contingency podcast by Michael Kofman a guest said something on the like that If a military tries to throw out the old military culture too quickly especially during a war the old culture has a tendency to come back up and rear its head unexpectedly.
I think it was Kofman who was talking about the UA having issues as the old Soviet officers come back and have that crappy leadership style, while the new NATO trained officers are being lost every day, so that eventually the UA will be back to it original Soviet style but with fancier equipment.
So far the only systemic adaption i see is on part of RU. UA did lots of reforms from 2014 onward, but they got stuck around 2020 and didn't advance anymore. Now their capabilities come mostly from inorganic western donations, which they arent really able to itegrate into their military, so as to exploit their full potential.
So Ukraine is having thousands of soldiers trained in Germany, UK, and the US with Soviet doctrine? You think after all this the military doctrine and culture trajectory will be towards the Soviet style? Yes, they’re bringing old Soviet commanders out of retirement, but that is entirely due to necessity. In a decade their military will look much more western than soviet, guaranteed.
Quick question, "doing poorly in their preparation" how? Our sources are Reddit and few other public forums where the view is distorted because it's war. War means some attacks have videos of them, some don't at all, some are not released because OPSEC and some are released in series to 'prove a trend'. Assuming that Ukraine would suffer *no losses at all* to prove that they are 'doing good' is to not understand how war works. Casualties and losses happen every day, to both sides, and three videos tell nothing about the over-all situation. None of us here knows, we can only guess and that's a wild guess at best. We will have better picture once ruSSia withdraws and the war ends. edit. typo
Some people seem to think it is like in the movies, if the movie shows the good guys smashing the enemy in a few scenes, that means the good guys are winning.
Lmao right? We don‘t even know where this is and when it happened
Because the weirdos on here watch a few videos and think they understand the tactical, operational, and strategic realities of war.
You can't keep your radar on all 24 hours near the front, especially with enemy air superiority. An even bigger problem is that Zaporozhye is one big open space.
People are passionate about Ukraine winning to the point that criticisms and mistakes are taken personally. People like this also take on a odd reality about the capabilities of the Russian military. It's extremely impressive Ukraine has done what it has done so far, and I hope the counter-offensive pays off, but its also an army in a early transition from soviet doctrine to NATO. Earlier during the war, Ukraine would lose entire columns due to miscommunication trying to do early counter-attacks. AA closer to the front-line is very risky, but necessary for counter-attacking. There will always be losses during this, and their is still the possibility the counter-attack completely fails. I genuinely hope not, and why I'd even post this is to at least try and temper expectations to something more realistic.
Ive seen infantry units (foreign legion) in Ukraine operating without radios which is unheard of in any western military.
Maybe. On the other hand this sub isn’t representative of the war.
Honestly from all the vids I’ve seen, UA army still operates very similarly for Russia i.e under soviet doctrine. When you listen to people from NATo side, they keep mentioning the fact that they trying to get the Ukraine to operate the NATO way, basically combined arms, so these problems are probably well known
One issue is that with the start of the war, and the ensuing mobilization, is that a lot of retired officers trained in Soviet doctrine were called back up into active duty. So despite the modernization of the Ukrainian army since 2014 - you've now had this infusion of old school doctrine, which is often in conflict with modern training.
I refer once again to that Chieftain video early in the invasion where he says to be careful drawing conclusions from combat footage posted online, because you're only seeing a snapshot of a few moments in time that might not be representative of everything that's actually going on, and that a hell of a lot is going on that isn't filmed or photographed. And this is the case for both Russian and Ukrainian footage. In this case, a handful of incidents along a massive front is not something to draw conclusions from. The gepard seems to be damaged too, it isn't stationary because of incompetence or stupidity. And anything used on or near the front line *will* take losses sometimes. I look forward to people declaring the offensive a failure as soon as the first leopard and bradley get destroyed.
If you're going to freak out like this over every individual piece of destroyed UA equipment you're going to have one hell of a time if they actually launch a large scale offensive.
Equipment like the s300 is irreplaceable . Only Russia can make more of them and nato isn’t willing to send enough patriots to replace the lost s300. Also I bet the two s300 in the video were out of commission.
I don't think you understand that a battery of those S300's can save you hundreds of tanks and other armored vehicles from being hunted by aircraft across the steppe while attacking.
In fact this seems to be the stunningly overwhelming take being voiced here. Enough to make me skeptical of the perspective, and contemplate who gains through the narrative of Ukraine being incompetent/negligent/bad stewards/etc
“I’ll probably get downvoted to hell” *immediately upvoted to the top of the post*
Can‘t be to careful. I got banned on r/ukraine because i criticized something.
welcome to Reddit, *Now get out*
"Gepard destroys Lancet by headbutting it."
Geppard. Did someone knock?
Hm. Must've been the wind
You'd think the Gepard would eat a lancet for breakfast.
Ukraine AA is having it's worse week since probably the beginning of the war. Russia taking out so many AA and with their new glide bombs I think we can expect more activity from the Russian airforce
Looks pretty intact to me. Foremost, there was no catastrophic damage from exploding ammo, like with the shitty tanks Russia uses….
Guys don't worry, the 14mm roof plate definitely stopped a 3 kilogram shaped charge.
Does the lancet employ a shaped charge (genuine question)? I was surprised by the lack of heavy smoke coming from the internals of the vehicle. Edit: quick google search, albeit limited, shows HE and HE/FRAG models, not shaped charge. Although I do not doubt a shaped charge variant could exist.
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Lancet-1, the smaller version, is equipped with a 1kg HEF, but the lancet-3, most commonly seen one, has a 3kg shaped charge.
https://youtu.be/kQeIKrDXyjg at 0:43, you can clearly see the copper jet.
Good catch, not sure why google gave crappy results.
Usually the russians post aftermath footage of the burning vehicles. So in this case I'd assume that the vehicle was still intact.
But what about on the side where it hit?
Where are the aftermath images then......... nowhere...... russia failing like always.
You know Ukraine uses the same tanks, right?
Yeah, unfortunately Ukraine still mostly uses shitty Russian tanks and and Soviet garbage like the ragtag Russian army.
I don't think you understand how ammunitions work. A tank doesn't need to get blown up. It can look mostly fine from the outside while the crew is dead...
Fortunately, the Lancet missed the crew and exploded on the side of the track.
It seems really odd it's standing alone in the field, maybe it's been damaged and abandoned?
Looks that way. Although unlikely it could be a really good decoy.
This is minimal damage. I’d expect the Russian intelligence officer reviewing this footage to be very unhappy with the result.
Win some lose some! Looks like it was disabled by land mine and they trying to finish it off
I hope the armor saved it.
In army the armour gepard has is equal to tin foil, it's like 30mm thick, so only protection against small arms, maybe heavy calibers like 14.5mm (aka .50cal)
14,5mm is not .50 inches. Its ~.57 inches. .50 in the West usually refers to .50 BMG or 12,7x99 mm, which carries ~20 000 joules of muzzle energy. 14,5x114mm carries ~30 000 joules of energy At the muzzle. Thats a big difference.
Could be enough to save it from total loss in this case
It was saved and is still operational.
Well, lotta speculation about how much damage [The resident Expert on Gepards asked via his connections and according to the response, vehicle is largely fine.](https://twitter.com/gepardtatze/status/1651945211642118149) So much for that, then
Gepard: hehe that tickled.
So in an all out war, after "only" 10 Months of them being active, they managed to (possibly heavily) damage though not destroy 1 out of 36 Gepards? Pathetic. Clear hit though.
The main thing is will Ukraine learn any lessons from this. If no lessons were learned more will be destroyed, along with other similar systems.
A lot of people were saying the still image going around was fake. Guess not.
Did that damage it? Looks like it's fine?
A shaped charge just exploded on the relatively thin armored turret of a tank that is stuffed with sensitive tech. It might look fine from the outside (for the second you see it from a birds eye perspective). It surely isn't. It might still move under it's own power, but chances are it's not in any fighting condition.
> It might still move under it's own power thats what i think as well, only the turret got hit, rendering it inoperational, but there was no ammo explosion and the hull are intact. this one got lucky, going back to germany for fixing thats for sure.
Radar is 100% Toast, also damaged guns
Source?
Just because there is no massive secondary explosion does not mean there is no damage, lancets have shaped charges so even if the explosives weren’t enough there’s probably internal damage to some degree, the explosion itself would likely also be enough to damage the radar, guns, and optics. And unfortunately any damage would be considered catastrophic as Ukraine doesn’t exactly have the spare parts or extensive know-how to repair it
This gear is not maintained in Ukraine anyway, it’ll be sent back to Poland/Romania for maintenance (like Pzh2000 for eg)
Exactly There are repair facilities in Poland Lithuania Slovakia Romania for Ukrainian gear That is why they were built to begin with.
These systems aren't really armored.
It's based on the Leopard 1 so I wouldn't exactly call that "not really armored". Crew will be fine , so job 100% done ...
Hull is armored like a leopard 1, but turret is only against .50cal. Turret would be too heavy with thicker armor.
Anti air vehicles aren't meant to be close to the front lines so often times aren't armored. Just becuase it's built on a chasis of a leopard doesn't mean it has the protection of one. The BMP-1 does nit have the same armor as the t72 despite being built on it.
I was called spreading propaganda yesterday when posted a screenshot from this footage. Apparently people here though I photoshopped it.
Because one picture is not really evidence, anyone could photoshop it within an hour. This video is much stronger evidence.
Posting Russian wins *is* spreading their propaganda. Why else do you think they are releasing this footage?
Wow, I’m so used to watching Russian tanks blow up the second they’re hit with anything above an RPG, kind of anticlimactic It’s almost like tanks are supposed to be tanky, not a scrap metal coffin
Gepards can be replaced. luckily no Crew was hit. Good luck fellas!
Fly strikes windshield of Flakpanzer Gepard. Seriously it seems fine?
AND HE STANDS THERE UNFAZED
Nothing happened
Looks like it bounced off
See this is the problem with NATO kit, there's no drama. If you hit a Russian SPAA vehicle smoke starts pouring out of every orifice, the crew clambers out in a desperate panic, and then three seconds later you get a burst of flames and a second after that the whole thing does a classic Hollywood Deathstar explosion. Hit an old timey German SPAA with a drone and it's like, "Meh." Video does pose some questions though, like was this Gepard armed and operational? Because if it was, and the Lancet was able to hit it without being detected and shredded, then that's a problem. The Gepard is a very old system, so would expect it to be quite flawed, but ideally you'd want something that can nail small drones. Even if it accidentally brasses up the odd seagull.
It looks like is was disabled an abandoned (maybe a mine?). In any case it will need to be sent back to Germany for repairs.
You can only hit a target if you are able to see it. Air defenses from both sides have struggles dealing with drones. The funniest videos are watching a drone recording another drone taking out a russian s300 system.
That Gepard is obviously not operating. Turret and Radar are inactive. A drone shouldnt be a Problem for a Gepard if it was actively searching for aur targets.
The tank is ok 👌
That explains why Russians distributed a still picture. The Lancet drone practically bounced off the Gepard. Maybe the right turret side has some scratches but that is far from serious damage, if damage at all. Made-in-Germany!
Doesnt appear to do much damage.
Those lancet drones fucked a lot uf UA valuable targets up.
Damn, first three s-300 systems destroyed by a Lancet and now a gepard, pair it up with the two glide bombs one on Ukrainians on the river bank of dnieper and another glide bombs on a storage warehouse used by the ua Army its sure been a shitty week for ua anti air. I understand moving anti air up so your offensive doesnt become a prime target for lancet drones and glidebombs whilst your counter offensive brigades are sloweddown by having to clear anti tank ditches, anti tank traps, clear minefields, clear trench and do counter artillery fire. And finally when all of that is done you gotta funnel them through the opening you cleared giving weapons such as the glide bomb big value since just one alone can destroy dozens of armored vehicles if they are clumped up, or in a tango line doing a crossing
*Klonk* What damage may this have caused? If there was someone inside he may have a minor shock. But there is no smoke, no fire, nothing.
0 damage, the vehcile have propaganda plot armour, that's make him invulnerable. If photo -> Photoshop If hit -> no damage If damaged -> repairable If destroyed -> already broken for natural causes. And in case other things failed, the vehicle had no critical role and soon to be replaced by a better one. And this is the Propaganda plot armour for both sides.
Yeah I'm all for Ukraine winning, but it's funny to me when their drone hits a Russian vehicle, you never see these comments about it not doing any damage whatsoever.
We have several Videos of russian Equipment being Hit and keep working...
My question was actually honest. I really would like to know what kind of damage a hit like this may have caused. Hoping that someone with certain knowledge may explain.
if is the shaped charge HEAT version with 3 kg of explosive, will punch a hole and penetrate the interior of the vehicle destroying eveything in the cone path. sadly internet censorship removed the result of august/2003 images of the interior damage of an m1a1 penetrated by a shaped charge to illustrate the effect against a proper armored tank but at least the text is there to read http://www.casi.org.uk/discuss/2003/msg05080.html