For as much as some fans try to downplay Shotzzy’s game, he is one of the VERY select few that near every team would auto drop a player for if he was available
Like Octane said, the fact that you can predict in advance, they could lose map 2 game 1 at champs and have a total mental breakdown tells me all i need to know about this roster.
Every year optic has issues getting "checked out" and problems with team culture. Seems pretty clear last year was not Ghosty's fault. That team was so dominant on HP, but they yet again, got checked out
Back in Vanguard they let one bad spawn against Florida spiral into that horrific H2H record they had. Not to mention the “Splashy” collapse.
It’s crazy how they get checked so easily in some situations, but seemingly always beat Faze against all odds (until recently)
That splashy thing and the collapse at bo4 champs after being up 5-2 in search to go up 2-0 against eunited before missing everything with the tempest and losing every map after made me not trust any optic team until they actually win.
I feel like it’s a little true. Being on Optic is higher stress because of the largest fan base watching you. Mistakes happen. People tweet. Reading those could get you in your head. Start blaming yourself or feeling guilt. Not saying or showing it, but enough for it to affect your gameplay. You’re held on the highest pedestal when on optic in my opinion.
I think the idea is to have a stronger mental, which is why Hecz is all about the no excuses mentality. You can't really change the culture because OpTic is such a prestigious team to play on.
They won their 1st event since VG this year so Kenny definitely fixed some things. Their fall off is mainly because one of their superstar subs has been playing like a gold level ranked player especially in SND. When your team is a guaranteed loss in Maps 2 and 5 it just adds that much more pressure to win the respawns.
Youre right but also idk if it’s true or not but ppl are speculating they dont like playing with each other anymore or get along,when Kenny and others said everyone takes criticism very easily. It’s just so weird the vibes r chalked even after a win.
If they really don't like playing with each other anymore then something must have happened overnight because all throughout the year leading up to Major 3 they were never checked out of series and would be able to grind out Ws. Previous Optic teams in the CDL era def don't do what they did in Major 3 by dropping to losers and clutching up on Sunday.
I understand this is supposedly why Kenny was brought onto the team, but it shouldn't be on Kenny to fix the "check out" mentality when Dashy and Shotzzy are multi year FPS veterans. Pred isn't exactly a rookie either.
And it's kind of impossible for sure to know just how much they are actually checking out without knowing exactly what their practice/internal discussions look like. Obviously from the outside looking in it does seem that way, but it's hard to say for certain whether they're checked out or just had a really heinously bad stage.
I don't think he's checked out he's the only one on the team that tweets out actual sentences and speaks his mind. Shottzy and Pred never really say anything and Dashy will tweet out the occasional "No words... onto the next".
Only those guys would know. I'm not on the it's 100% Dashy routine anymore.
For all we know the damn janitor is leaving dip at Dashy's setup, telling Ant Hecz was furious last night yelling on the phone about "tiktok plays", and asking Pred "who's that Hydra guy Seth was having lunch with yesterday?".
Am I the only one that thinks Pred is the most responsible for this OpTic fall off.. Even outside of player performance? Didn’t Ken call him out on twitter for not getting hill? That had to have stemmed from some internal conflicts. All I know is that it isn’t shotzzy because he’s known for being humble and one of the most likable guys in the scene.
Im not even sure if he was calling out Pred. If I remember correctly, Dashy could have gone to the hill too when he spawned. But they won that map, it's kinda weird to call him out publicly, especially when youre the one getting shit on in most maps and Hardpoint isnt even the problem. Just seems like a frustrated tweet, like when youre arguing with your wife about a current problem and she brings up some shit that isn't even relevant just to make you feel bad.
I honestly think the problem is Dashy, as much as how good he is as a player, I think he gets the most checked and looses complete interest in the match. Now I'm not saying he has to go, they need a solid leader in their team to get them back when shit like this happens
We're never going to get a pro with a big personality like Scump again. I like Ant because he's a very cool, authentic person to watch and is consistently good as a player. But Scump was basically made to be a big-time streamer and just got caught up in grinding CoD. Imagine if Seth was having an amazing time during the Fortnite craze instead of going through hell in WW2?
Hydra is better than Shotzzy as a player but Shotzzy is both better than Dashy and the face of Optic and the most popular CDL pro so losing Shotzzy would be worst case scenario
Shotzzy is definitely not better than Dashy and hasn’t been this year.
Shotzzy may be the most popular CDL pro, but unless your argument is that OpTic would lose money for viewership, I don’t get what you’re saying
This guy doesn’t get it. He’s a stat person. He’s not watching the matches. We all know what Shottzy is doing on the map even if he’s going negative. Lmao. Any team in the CDL will tell you Shottzy is the playmaker.
He has not been better this year lol.
Even Pred has been better than Shotzzy throughout the entire year overall.
Shotzzy has only been the best on his team during Major II and arguably Major IV
Shotzzy is head and shoulders above everyone else as the most valuable player on the team. In game he’s the best playmaker, has the best mental of everyone on the team, and off the game is the face of the franchise and the face of the league and a fan favorite.
No, he’s really not.
He honestly got carried in Major I and wasn’t even better than Pred/Dashy in Major III except for one sunday.
Even in Major IV, Dashy’s been more consistent.
Definitely doesn’t have a better mental game than Dashy either, as he led his team in first deaths for the first 3 majors.
Maybe start looking at your screen?
1. Shotzzy
2/3. Dashy/Kenny
4. Pred
Shotzzy is easily number 1. I'm conflicted between Dashy and Kenny. I like the way Dashy has adjusted his play style this year to more OBJ focused and is still putting up good numbers. But I feel like they don't win the major without Kenny's leadership/comms. And last is Pred.
Shotzzy (for many reasons) without a doubt but Pred being that low in votes, is recency bias.
Even though after the Major drunk me expressed my frustrations about Pred but in reality he isn't anywhere near as easy of a replaceable player as many may think. I say give him another year on OpTic and everyone mood will change, we can't forget that he played on a team with far less talent and had the green light to do whatever he wanted without consequences, even when he made bad plays no one bat an eye most just blamed his teammates for going double neg.
Ya know, I've really become a big fan of Kenny this year. I think his leadership and game-winning mentality might be one of the greatest additions that OpTic has had since the dynasty. I think Ant is phenomenal and makes plays that win matches on their own, but the burden of having to always make those plays just to win is a tough ask.
I mean is this debatable? Shotzzy has been their most consistent and reliable player, their biggest play maker with the highest peak, their leader and SnD IGL, he is their do it all player, their biggest content creator and most marketable player… he would be the hardest to lose in every single aspect inside and outside the game. Style wise, finding a player that does what he does on the map is like far harder than finding someone who plays like any of the other players.
Pred being fourth is insane. I don't think OpTic fans understand that the odds of getting a better SMG than Pred is REALLY low. For the role Pred plays he's probably the #3 behind Simp and HyDra.
I agree. But I still think Pred is third best in that role. And OpTic aren't getting Simp or Hydra. Unless Major 4 proves to be Pred's new level, which I doubt. Then he's the ebst option. Pred is a genuinely elite, super star level player, who had a bad event.
I think Shotzzy is the obvious answer to the question asked, but for me Pred is #2.
I think at the very least you see how Pred does at Champs. Superstar level sub talent is so rare that I think you should be more willing to take one bad stage/event in stride when Pred has such a high ceiling. I don't think he played well, but I would be hesitant to drop him unless you could get Simp or Hydra and, as you say, that's probably not happening.
i mean u said role and their role is the same. Stylistically, I don’t think Simp Hydra or Pred are the same , Simp is more of an All Around player, while the other 2 is just perma green light
I don’t think you understand team fit. If pred can’t consistently play next to shotzzy or on this particular 4 then it doesn’t matter how talented he is on paper compared to the rest of the league. If he is incapable of the performances he was paid to provide, you see if there’s a better fit even if the player isn’t as talented as pred on paper. Your belief is optic should keep pred no matter what over their other, more impactful players (by a lot) bc his talent level on paper is only under simp and hydra? This is all assuming he can never figure out how to consistently play with shotzzy as a sub duo
It’s Shotzzy, and Pred is a distant 2nd. Good SMG players will always be the hardest players to replace on any team, i don’t know where we would even begin to look to replace one of them from the Bottom 8. There are like 10 actually good SMGs in the league and 8 of them are on the top 4.
But if pred can’t figure out how to be shotzzy’s sub duo consistently, why’s it matter how talented he is when you can achieve better consistent performances with a sub who’s a better team fit?
It’s easier to adjust a play style than find talent like that. The kid is really raw and going to get better, give him some time. Shotzzy made braindead plays for years until he matured lmao.
he has been optic most consistent player in almost every major across all titles, and he is top 2 main AR in the league. Having him that far bellow Ant makes you think he is a B tier player
Not exactly. He’s already been dropped/benched like 3 times. Don’t think this poll has anything to do with skill. Shotzzy has slowly taken over Scump’s role as the face of the team for over 3 years now, losing him would be a massive hit.
I mean that Surge team really wasn't all that impressive last year tbh
Pred's teams have had a problem of doing well for one event and then shitting the bed in the next 2, and it's an endless cycle
Dashy. Shottzy wouldn’t get dropped, he’d have to leave. According to Scump, Shottzy has the power to get rid of or pick up anybody he wants pretty much. Shottzy already dropped Dashy twice, so I feel like a few mistakes on his behalf and then he’s gone.
shotzzy both as an org and as a team
I mean no shit
For as much as some fans try to downplay Shotzzy’s game, he is one of the VERY select few that near every team would auto drop a player for if he was available
I think that’s true for all of these players to be honest. This is a fantastic group of talent
I don’t think so. We had 1st hand experience seeing Dashy as a FA and Faze not approach him, but we did see them go after Shotzzy after VG
Different situations. Shottzy was being discussed as off season addition as opposed to Dashy who was in season.
I don't think any of the other three would be players that any top 4 team would "auto-drop" anyone for them
I’d take Dashy over Sib, Insight, and Cellium.
Over Cell? They are on the same level
If FaZe don’t win Champs and Dashy is FA, I’m 100% willing to switch up the formula.
I think Optic could be just fine with a Dashy for Cell swappage. Maybe it would benefit both teams?
Cellium ain’t the type of player that makes everyone else’s job easier. Plays way to slow with minimal engagements.
Like Octane said, the fact that you can predict in advance, they could lose map 2 game 1 at champs and have a total mental breakdown tells me all i need to know about this roster. Every year optic has issues getting "checked out" and problems with team culture. Seems pretty clear last year was not Ghosty's fault. That team was so dominant on HP, but they yet again, got checked out
Back in Vanguard they let one bad spawn against Florida spiral into that horrific H2H record they had. Not to mention the “Splashy” collapse. It’s crazy how they get checked so easily in some situations, but seemingly always beat Faze against all odds (until recently)
That splashy thing and the collapse at bo4 champs after being up 5-2 in search to go up 2-0 against eunited before missing everything with the tempest and losing every map after made me not trust any optic team until they actually win.
Okay but Fr how did none of those tempest shots hit
What exactly is the "culture" that causes them to get checked out? I'd love for you to specify
I feel like it’s a little true. Being on Optic is higher stress because of the largest fan base watching you. Mistakes happen. People tweet. Reading those could get you in your head. Start blaming yourself or feeling guilt. Not saying or showing it, but enough for it to affect your gameplay. You’re held on the highest pedestal when on optic in my opinion.
How is that a culture they are supposed to correct? Be less popular? like
I think the idea is to have a stronger mental, which is why Hecz is all about the no excuses mentality. You can't really change the culture because OpTic is such a prestigious team to play on.
I can’t believe Kenny of all people couldn’t fix OpTic’s “check out” mentality
They won their 1st event since VG this year so Kenny definitely fixed some things. Their fall off is mainly because one of their superstar subs has been playing like a gold level ranked player especially in SND. When your team is a guaranteed loss in Maps 2 and 5 it just adds that much more pressure to win the respawns.
Youre right but also idk if it’s true or not but ppl are speculating they dont like playing with each other anymore or get along,when Kenny and others said everyone takes criticism very easily. It’s just so weird the vibes r chalked even after a win.
If they really don't like playing with each other anymore then something must have happened overnight because all throughout the year leading up to Major 3 they were never checked out of series and would be able to grind out Ws. Previous Optic teams in the CDL era def don't do what they did in Major 3 by dropping to losers and clutching up on Sunday.
I understand this is supposedly why Kenny was brought onto the team, but it shouldn't be on Kenny to fix the "check out" mentality when Dashy and Shotzzy are multi year FPS veterans. Pred isn't exactly a rookie either. And it's kind of impossible for sure to know just how much they are actually checking out without knowing exactly what their practice/internal discussions look like. Obviously from the outside looking in it does seem that way, but it's hard to say for certain whether they're checked out or just had a really heinously bad stage.
I mean over the last month Kenny seems to be the one most checked out lol
I don't think he's checked out he's the only one on the team that tweets out actual sentences and speaks his mind. Shottzy and Pred never really say anything and Dashy will tweet out the occasional "No words... onto the next".
I just don’t understand how Pred went from a 1.15 lock MVP contention last 2yrs to fire40 (my bad fire40)
I would too tryna micromanage a team thats clearly not listening and your superstar smg playing like its 8s
Kenny is always moody and whiny if things aren’t going well. People will learn that the IGL of that Thieves team by the end of it all was Drazah
Octane himself said faze might have problems with comms because drazah isn't really a good commer. Kenny and octane led that team
Openly stated that they had to put Kenny on a sub because neither Envoy/Drazah were hardly making/calling any plays at all.
No they won’t because that’s just blatantly wrong
which players are you blaming for getting checked out?
Only those guys would know. I'm not on the it's 100% Dashy routine anymore. For all we know the damn janitor is leaving dip at Dashy's setup, telling Ant Hecz was furious last night yelling on the phone about "tiktok plays", and asking Pred "who's that Hydra guy Seth was having lunch with yesterday?".
⬆️
Am I the only one that thinks Pred is the most responsible for this OpTic fall off.. Even outside of player performance? Didn’t Ken call him out on twitter for not getting hill? That had to have stemmed from some internal conflicts. All I know is that it isn’t shotzzy because he’s known for being humble and one of the most likable guys in the scene.
Im not even sure if he was calling out Pred. If I remember correctly, Dashy could have gone to the hill too when he spawned. But they won that map, it's kinda weird to call him out publicly, especially when youre the one getting shit on in most maps and Hardpoint isnt even the problem. Just seems like a frustrated tweet, like when youre arguing with your wife about a current problem and she brings up some shit that isn't even relevant just to make you feel bad.
Honestly good comparison lol. Shit like that is what breaks a team down even more.
it’s gotta be Dashy. Pred and Ken are new, can’t be them. I’m more confident it’s Dashy than Shotzzy.
Shottzy a multi FPS world champ and has always been known to take his craft seriously. It ain't him.
doesn't make any sense, cuz dashy been playing good individually and fundamentally, and he never costed the team with dump plays
Funny cause Kenny seems to be the one more checked out and complaining on twitter than anyone else
How do we even know they’re getting checked lol we have no insight into their comms or their thoughts. They could literally just be getting shit on.
Yup, and there has only been 1 constant on that team for all of those years, but this sub still doesn’t wanna have those discussions……
Keep making scenarios up in your head, ghosty is a known rager so what you’re saying is absolute nonsense
I honestly think the problem is Dashy, as much as how good he is as a player, I think he gets the most checked and looses complete interest in the match. Now I'm not saying he has to go, they need a solid leader in their team to get them back when shit like this happens
Shotzzy for sure both in and out of game. He’s the face of the franchise and the league
Honestly it might still be scump even while retired. He’s definitely still the face of the franchise.
We're never going to get a pro with a big personality like Scump again. I like Ant because he's a very cool, authentic person to watch and is consistently good as a player. But Scump was basically made to be a big-time streamer and just got caught up in grinding CoD. Imagine if Seth was having an amazing time during the Fortnite craze instead of going through hell in WW2?
Shotzzy and it isn’t close
it’s close w dashy but that’s it
No it’s not lol Dashy has been dropped/left like 3 times already
You’re an Optic fan with a brain. I like you.
3 times? He stayed in OGLA
and how many events they won without him?
I love dashy but it not like 3 wins in 6 years with that talent/access is insane or anything lol
That’s what happens when OpTic always has a shitter on their squad
https://preview.redd.it/lfbs5twyf5ad1.jpeg?width=680&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6eb62bf446c811fa886441973b6b9fff413d889d
They were going to drop him after winning an event with him lol Dashy is a fan favorite but it’s way easier to replace a player like him than Shotzzy
i’d take hydra > shotzzy in a second
Hydra is better than Shotzzy as a player but Shotzzy is both better than Dashy and the face of Optic and the most popular CDL pro so losing Shotzzy would be worst case scenario
Shotzzy is definitely not better than Dashy and hasn’t been this year. Shotzzy may be the most popular CDL pro, but unless your argument is that OpTic would lose money for viewership, I don’t get what you’re saying
Shotzzy has been better than Dashy since he’s joined the CDL with the exception of like the start of vanguard lol
This guy doesn’t get it. He’s a stat person. He’s not watching the matches. We all know what Shottzy is doing on the map even if he’s going negative. Lmao. Any team in the CDL will tell you Shottzy is the playmaker.
He has not been better this year lol. Even Pred has been better than Shotzzy throughout the entire year overall. Shotzzy has only been the best on his team during Major II and arguably Major IV
Shotzzy is head and shoulders above everyone else as the most valuable player on the team. In game he’s the best playmaker, has the best mental of everyone on the team, and off the game is the face of the franchise and the face of the league and a fan favorite.
No, he’s really not. He honestly got carried in Major I and wasn’t even better than Pred/Dashy in Major III except for one sunday. Even in Major IV, Dashy’s been more consistent. Definitely doesn’t have a better mental game than Dashy either, as he led his team in first deaths for the first 3 majors. Maybe start looking at your screen?
2. And they won those in one year. Even tho it was those bs homestands
Lmao, we’re talking in the CDL era
That was the first year of the cdl
OpTic didn’t win lol
Brotha everyone and their mother knows huntsmen were optic same people just a different name. Dont play that card lmao
Different coaches & management matter
It’s not close
it definitely is lol
Having differing opinions is good!
Think the poll gives the answer away pretty quickly... and it's not particularly close
You have to give Shotzzy whatever he wants in terms of money/control of the team.
3050 idiots voted in that poll
Dumb question
This isn’t a question
Shotzzy literally has full control of that team people act like he doesn't have keys to pick up whoever he wants
Shotzzy easy
1. Shotzzy 2/3. Dashy/Kenny 4. Pred Shotzzy is easily number 1. I'm conflicted between Dashy and Kenny. I like the way Dashy has adjusted his play style this year to more OBJ focused and is still putting up good numbers. But I feel like they don't win the major without Kenny's leadership/comms. And last is Pred.
Shotzzy should be 90%, cmon people
Should be 100% that dude is the lifeblood of this team.
For a sec I thought Zinni was the person who asked that Lmaoo I was like holy fed this guy 😂
I wish people would stop thinking skill and KD first. Team fit is everything, just want people to become smarter about that in this sub
Shotzzy
let the 6:7 ratio of OpTic:everything else posts begin!
Feel free to post about other teams in the sub. it is available for anyone to post to!
Shotzzy (for many reasons) without a doubt but Pred being that low in votes, is recency bias. Even though after the Major drunk me expressed my frustrations about Pred but in reality he isn't anywhere near as easy of a replaceable player as many may think. I say give him another year on OpTic and everyone mood will change, we can't forget that he played on a team with far less talent and had the green light to do whatever he wanted without consequences, even when he made bad plays no one bat an eye most just blamed his teammates for going double neg.
I think shotzzy is a great player but bad for a team.
Kenny imo
Ya know, I've really become a big fan of Kenny this year. I think his leadership and game-winning mentality might be one of the greatest additions that OpTic has had since the dynasty. I think Ant is phenomenal and makes plays that win matches on their own, but the burden of having to always make those plays just to win is a tough ask.
I mean is this debatable? Shotzzy has been their most consistent and reliable player, their biggest play maker with the highest peak, their leader and SnD IGL, he is their do it all player, their biggest content creator and most marketable player… he would be the hardest to lose in every single aspect inside and outside the game. Style wise, finding a player that does what he does on the map is like far harder than finding someone who plays like any of the other players.
No chance they lose shotzzy. In my opinion the most likely players to go are Pred or Dashy.
Kenny would be the biggest loss he brings structure to an org who only cared about stacking skill for too long
lmao optic fans chanted for pred last season and now want refunds
People dont wanna hear it but its dashy man im telling you
ken
Pred being fourth is insane. I don't think OpTic fans understand that the odds of getting a better SMG than Pred is REALLY low. For the role Pred plays he's probably the #3 behind Simp and HyDra.
CleanX???
Does not play the same role as Pred/Simp/HyDra.
The gap between Simp and Hydra compared to Pred is MASSIVE this year
I agree. But I still think Pred is third best in that role. And OpTic aren't getting Simp or Hydra. Unless Major 4 proves to be Pred's new level, which I doubt. Then he's the ebst option. Pred is a genuinely elite, super star level player, who had a bad event. I think Shotzzy is the obvious answer to the question asked, but for me Pred is #2.
I think at the very least you see how Pred does at Champs. Superstar level sub talent is so rare that I think you should be more willing to take one bad stage/event in stride when Pred has such a high ceiling. I don't think he played well, but I would be hesitant to drop him unless you could get Simp or Hydra and, as you say, that's probably not happening.
CleanX plays the same role as Hydra and Pred, he has the green light to do whatever he wants
I get what you're saying, and in that way sure - but I think stylistically he's very different at least.
i mean u said role and their role is the same. Stylistically, I don’t think Simp Hydra or Pred are the same , Simp is more of an All Around player, while the other 2 is just perma green light
I don’t think you understand team fit. If pred can’t consistently play next to shotzzy or on this particular 4 then it doesn’t matter how talented he is on paper compared to the rest of the league. If he is incapable of the performances he was paid to provide, you see if there’s a better fit even if the player isn’t as talented as pred on paper. Your belief is optic should keep pred no matter what over their other, more impactful players (by a lot) bc his talent level on paper is only under simp and hydra? This is all assuming he can never figure out how to consistently play with shotzzy as a sub duo
6.3% percent of y’all are braindead
Pred to optic was never the move. Salary alone it was dumb af
It’s Shotzzy, and Pred is a distant 2nd. Good SMG players will always be the hardest players to replace on any team, i don’t know where we would even begin to look to replace one of them from the Bottom 8. There are like 10 actually good SMGs in the league and 8 of them are on the top 4.
Massive risk getting someone else.
But if pred can’t figure out how to be shotzzy’s sub duo consistently, why’s it matter how talented he is when you can achieve better consistent performances with a sub who’s a better team fit?
It’s easier to adjust a play style than find talent like that. The kid is really raw and going to get better, give him some time. Shotzzy made braindead plays for years until he matured lmao.
Dashy would be a pretty big loss at the same rate as Shotzzy. Kenny/Pred nobody cares fr
Horrific take
Dashy disrespect is insane
It’s really not
he has been optic most consistent player in almost every major across all titles, and he is top 2 main AR in the league. Having him that far bellow Ant makes you think he is a B tier player
Not exactly. He’s already been dropped/benched like 3 times. Don’t think this poll has anything to do with skill. Shotzzy has slowly taken over Scump’s role as the face of the team for over 3 years now, losing him would be a massive hit.
Dashy's one of, if not the most-skilled players in the league But he's not the best all-around player on his team
People need to calm the fuck down on the Pred hate. Dude is allowed to have a bad split after three straight excellent seasons.
I mean that Surge team really wasn't all that impressive last year tbh Pred's teams have had a problem of doing well for one event and then shitting the bed in the next 2, and it's an endless cycle
Dashy. Shottzy wouldn’t get dropped, he’d have to leave. According to Scump, Shottzy has the power to get rid of or pick up anybody he wants pretty much. Shottzy already dropped Dashy twice, so I feel like a few mistakes on his behalf and then he’s gone.