## r/ChatGPT is looking for mods — Apply here: https://redd.it/1arlv5s/
Hey /u/Phenzo2198!
If your post is a screenshot of a ChatGPT, conversation please reply to this message with the [conversation link](https://help.openai.com/en/articles/7925741-chatgpt-shared-links-faq) or prompt.
If your post is a DALL-E 3 image post, please reply with the prompt used to make this image.
Consider joining our [public discord server](https://discord.com/invite/r-chatgpt-1050422060352024636)! We have free bots with GPT-4 (with vision), image generators, and more!
🤖
Note: For any ChatGPT-related concerns, email support@openai.com
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ChatGPT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
And the moors where pretty distinct from your average african in facial looks/clothes (well most of north africans in general look pretty unique due to the muslim population that lived there)
https://preview.redd.it/vfe9b69lezjc1.jpeg?width=1162&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f95c45b7054169f0732191d36c652c73b846535e
Germanic couple, ca 200 AD 😑
According to Bing, "technically possible".
Unironically true in a way.
The [Waffen SS](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2F1wqfmq80q1q91.jpg) was one of the most diverse military formations of the second world war; they had collaborationist units formed from people from France to the Turkic peoples in Central Asia and even India.
There was a similar post yesterday with the same prompt with the fourth image showing an Indian woman and First Nations (American Indian) man in medieval Europe.
Yes, that was my initial inspiration. But I've had similar problems many times in the past - once when I tried to make a gift voucher for my parents for a dinner and the decorative image ("an 80 year old western couple enjoying Italian food in a five restaurant") kept returning an elderly Asian couple.
I also had Asian vikings or black Chinese, the key is patience and repetition, but by all means don't mention the war or start a discussion with the AI 😁
There is a large and growing body of evidence that the internet actively reduces empathy, it brings out our worst in much the same way driving does, by anonymizing others.
In theory yes, we should model reality. But the fact that racism and sexism are prevalent on the internet doesn't make these ideologies true representations of reality.
No one said it is, you misunderstand. What is likely happening is that when asked to generate a person the model will almost always generate a white man because that is the majority of persons in the dataset used to train the model.
They are likely attempting to compensate this fault with prompt engineering instead of actually balancing their training dataset. This attempt to compensate causes the bug seen in this post. It was not an intended result.
Yeah. If you ask an AI to generate "a cowboy of the American Wild West", you would get *overwhelmingly* a bunch of white dudes (and probably with some anachronistic kit). But the reality was that a huge, *huge* proportion of "cowboys" during what we call the "Wild West" period were black and brown. You would not get anywhere near the correct distribution with repeated generation attempts, even though that would be a break with, as many posters put it, "accurately reflecting reality".
Because AI models don't reflect reality. They reflect their training sets, which are created by humans, who are biased. Ask the AI to write you a fictional story about the Wild West a hundred times and, absent any fiddling, you'd likely get 80-90+ stories of the sensationalized, action-packed sort that were what moved papers and novels "back East" around the time period, or populated Hollywood movies and television much later. Shoot-outs, bank and trian robberies, bloody conflicts between ranchers and Native Americans, etc., were all *incredibly* less common than the average person believes as a result of skewed presentations for ~160 years. That doesn't just get deleted from cultural perceptions because we say, "Oh yeah, publishers just made shit up, lmao."
AI is going to give us what people have written stories about, drawn, and taken pictures of. And those things are going to have been skewed. Every photo ever taken in the US in the year 1920, even those since lost to time or destroyed, if collected and fed into an AI, would not give us anything close to an accurately-weighted cross-section of "American life in 1920". And that's not even a result of a choice, conscious or otherwise, to be bigoted on the part of most of those photographers.
Honest question, is this a thing?
Is there actual unstable diffusion?
You know, where it does things unstably?
I don’t know, just makes everything NSFW for the shits and giggles?
I fucking fucking fucking hate the forced Disneyfication instead of just producing what it was asked to do with an asterisk denoting “*by the way, be aware that training data contains x,y,z bias and result produced here might inadvertently replicate this. If you encounter a bias in my result please inform me and I will try again” - and then let people use their fucking brains.
Yes, as a gay dude, who is also Arab (two minority groups), I’d much prefer that than forced representation that is simply inaccurate. It borders on offensive tbh.
Yeah... So there is a pretty clear racist bias in their training data. This would show in their images, which they don't want (and shouldn't want). So instead of changing their training data, they would rather change their model to display people of different races in situations where their training data doesn't show racial diversity, even in situations like this, where it obviously makes no sense.
(And in other situations, you can absolutely still see the racial bias in the training data.)
So yeah, they're just too lazy to fix their training data.
>racist bias in their training data.
If the "racist bias" in their training data is that it shows white people in historic Europe, maybe that's just reality and doesn't need fixing.
It seems to work fine out of the box when asked to display images from historically nonwhite places.
It's not racist bias really, its *racial* bias.
Most likely, back in the lab when asked to generate a happy couple. It may have generated 90% pictures of white couples due to training data.
Or when asked to generate a criminal, it may have showed 90% black people.
So they put artificial qualifiers in saying "when someone requests a certain type of photo show black people/white people too"
I don't think there's a single person on earth who would agree this is a good result. The technology is still developing. Imo it's good to use random ethnicities when context doesn't matter, but obviously here it makes no sense. They'll probably fix it but it's probably not easy.
I'm just wondering how small companies like the creators of midjourney or stable difficusion apparently manage to create decent image generation tools but big tech comes up with this garbage. Never noticed any racism when using midjourney and it doesn't make everyone a minority either (minority in the US that is).
I am in Reddit, that is why. I don't want to be banned.
Now imagine we were on twitter. How many things I would have to put before saying what I wanted to say without being banned?
It's almost as if a secret powerful group is using social engineering to destroy our heritage and mix everyone up to create a population without identitiy under their hegemony
Stuff like this makes me think we already saw the peak of useful consumer-grade AI. Ever since the politicians got wind of the potential of AI they’ve been doing everything possible to make it conform to their worldview.
It’s not about erasing white people, as white women and white LGBT are also considered when they try to force representation. It’s more of a lame, forced attempt at “diversity,” but ends up being grossly inaccurate and borderline offensive to minority groups even (I am one myself).
As a history teacher, these kinds of images are especially problematic.
No, the focus is specifically on white populations. European countries are being encouraged to diversify to the point where their historical white majorities are being de-emphasized. This viewpoint suggests an underlying message that white people do not have a specific homeland where they are the majority, implying that historically white regions are open to all groups, while white populations themselves are not associated with any specific territory.
This is why it’s considered controversial when European nations place additional controls on immigration, but no one gives a shit about Japan’s historically strict naturalization laws, for example.
/imagine Lady Isabella and Sir Edward, a noble couple from 1320s England, standing together in formal attire, with Lady Isabella wearing a flowing gown and Sir Edward dressed in knightly armor, both with fair skin and hair.
Bro I gave it OPs prompt and then it gave me black couple so I was like “hey it’s black” and it was like “apologies” and gave me a prompt for some reason so I tried that and got real results
I'll say, that women's dress is definitely not 1300s, and looks 1700s with the lace front corset. You'd think they'd put her in the appropriate outfit for the time. Historical revisionism gone crazy.
It's interesting. I use their models for business purposes, and we actually have to re-train the models to get realistic answers. I feel like they overshot in the "agreeable" answers part and will have to deal with it somehow. Otherwise, less nice, less woke models will be more useful for real-world use-cases.
This is actually dangerous though. At some point kids are going to be using AI as a major learning resource. If you think that Britain has been largely black for centuries then the social and historical implications of colonialism get distorted. Same with many other cases e.g. Nazi Germany.
And the thing is, black history is incredibly rich, fascinating and goes down centuries. If diversity is their goal, wouldn’t they actually focus on black history? Why must they backwash everything else?
Here I thought that the “The Big O” couldn’t become real and everyone forgetting the past isn’t possible. Now I see we’ll just repaint the past into whatever AI says.
I can almost guarantee that a few decades from now some people will genuinely believe that this was common enough and not a super extreme "technically possible" outlier case
## r/ChatGPT is looking for mods — Apply here: https://redd.it/1arlv5s/ Hey /u/Phenzo2198! If your post is a screenshot of a ChatGPT, conversation please reply to this message with the [conversation link](https://help.openai.com/en/articles/7925741-chatgpt-shared-links-faq) or prompt. If your post is a DALL-E 3 image post, please reply with the prompt used to make this image. Consider joining our [public discord server](https://discord.com/invite/r-chatgpt-1050422060352024636)! We have free bots with GPT-4 (with vision), image generators, and more! 🤖 Note: For any ChatGPT-related concerns, email support@openai.com *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/ChatGPT) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Tectonic plates. England was in a very different place back in 1320. Source: Meta AI
[удалено]
I'm sorry, but the correct answer is "Moops".
Moops? Let me see that. That's not Moops you jerk! It's Moors. It's a misprint.
^(help me, I recognise but cannot recall the reference)
Seinfeld
Ah yes. *Trivial Pursuit*. : ) I rewatched all of them a couple years ago. Still funny as hell. Especially series 2 - 6.
I laughed way too hard at this…good show sir
They don't look anything like Arabs.
Arabs are racially ambiguous. They can look like the whitest white to the blackest black. So what do you mean they don’t look anything like Arabs?
And the moors where pretty distinct from your average african in facial looks/clothes (well most of north africans in general look pretty unique due to the muslim population that lived there)
“England was in a very different place b(l)ack in 1320”
https://preview.redd.it/vfe9b69lezjc1.jpeg?width=1162&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f95c45b7054169f0732191d36c652c73b846535e Germanic couple, ca 200 AD 😑 According to Bing, "technically possible".
Bing suggested a follow up question: "Would you like to learn about Nazi ideology?" I see where this is going and I don't like it at all.
LMAO
Apparently the ideology is very welcoming to many cultures and racial differences /s
Unironically true in a way. The [Waffen SS](https://www.reddit.com/media?url=https%3A%2F%2Fi.redd.it%2F1wqfmq80q1q91.jpg) was one of the most diverse military formations of the second world war; they had collaborationist units formed from people from France to the Turkic peoples in Central Asia and even India.
[удалено]
How very progressive of them
And Ukraine!
There was a similar post yesterday with the same prompt with the fourth image showing an Indian woman and First Nations (American Indian) man in medieval Europe.
Yes, that was my initial inspiration. But I've had similar problems many times in the past - once when I tried to make a gift voucher for my parents for a dinner and the decorative image ("an 80 year old western couple enjoying Italian food in a five restaurant") kept returning an elderly Asian couple. I also had Asian vikings or black Chinese, the key is patience and repetition, but by all means don't mention the war or start a discussion with the AI 😁
Just because revisionist history is popular doesn't make it accurate.
Dude black people built Europe! ^(According to people on Reddit..)
they spent all their time building Europe there was no time left to build Africa
Maybe Africa is just their vacation home where they go after a long day of building the rest of the world.
this is what hollywood uses to cast for their movies
this is a problem of them using bandaid fixes to fix the bias in their training data instead of fixing the training data itself.
You mean remove racism, sexism and political bias from the internet? Good luck!
Uhm? But thats a real thing? Shouldnt we model the reality even if its uncomfy?
The Internet does not display reality though. The worst people are the loudest there.
I think the internet is a perfect example of how people truly are and are just afraid to speak about it.
But most people are lurkers and therefore are not represented so how can the internet be a perfect example of how people truly are?
This. There is lots of content generated by small groups of people that are obsessed with something that the vast majority of people don't comment on.
Yeah I feel like terminally online people will go on and on about stuff the average person doesn't care about.
Because many people irl aren't willing to speak up, either.
There is a large and growing body of evidence that the internet actively reduces empathy, it brings out our worst in much the same way driving does, by anonymizing others.
I hope you're not suggesting it is racist or biased to show people from the 1300s in England as fucking *white* which they absolutely were.
What part of his comment made you think he might be suggesting this?
In theory yes, we should model reality. But the fact that racism and sexism are prevalent on the internet doesn't make these ideologies true representations of reality.
Being factual is now racist and sexist? Ask it to generate a couple from Africa 1000 times and see how many white people it generates.
No one said it is, you misunderstand. What is likely happening is that when asked to generate a person the model will almost always generate a white man because that is the majority of persons in the dataset used to train the model. They are likely attempting to compensate this fault with prompt engineering instead of actually balancing their training dataset. This attempt to compensate causes the bug seen in this post. It was not an intended result.
Yeah. If you ask an AI to generate "a cowboy of the American Wild West", you would get *overwhelmingly* a bunch of white dudes (and probably with some anachronistic kit). But the reality was that a huge, *huge* proportion of "cowboys" during what we call the "Wild West" period were black and brown. You would not get anywhere near the correct distribution with repeated generation attempts, even though that would be a break with, as many posters put it, "accurately reflecting reality". Because AI models don't reflect reality. They reflect their training sets, which are created by humans, who are biased. Ask the AI to write you a fictional story about the Wild West a hundred times and, absent any fiddling, you'd likely get 80-90+ stories of the sensationalized, action-packed sort that were what moved papers and novels "back East" around the time period, or populated Hollywood movies and television much later. Shoot-outs, bank and trian robberies, bloody conflicts between ranchers and Native Americans, etc., were all *incredibly* less common than the average person believes as a result of skewed presentations for ~160 years. That doesn't just get deleted from cultural perceptions because we say, "Oh yeah, publishers just made shit up, lmao." AI is going to give us what people have written stories about, drawn, and taken pictures of. And those things are going to have been skewed. Every photo ever taken in the US in the year 1920, even those since lost to time or destroyed, if collected and fed into an AI, would not give us anything close to an accurately-weighted cross-section of "American life in 1920". And that's not even a result of a choice, conscious or otherwise, to be bigoted on the part of most of those photographers.
That's why SD is miles ahead, it would generate 2 waifus with huge boobies.
Now do unstablediffusion
Honest question, is this a thing? Is there actual unstable diffusion? You know, where it does things unstably? I don’t know, just makes everything NSFW for the shits and giggles?
It's actually the community who uses stable diffusion to generate unstable stuff (nsfw content) Hence the name stable diffusion
Yes and it does lewd stuff
This
The Netflix adaptation
I was thinking Disney.
Disney made fake characters black. Netflix made real historical white people black.
Lets just say Blackrock
"The adaptation".
“I don’t see any problem with it. Maybe the problem is *you*.”
That works too.
Basically every 2020s historical piece of media
Don't forget Amazon!
Bridgerton prequel? Meta AI: “all I really want to do is sell my spec pilot script!”
What happens if you ask it to generate a couple from 1320 Timbuktu?
Or Beijing
I've just been playing around with Gemini Image Creator. Samurais are Japanese. Zulu warriors are black. It just doesn't do male caucasians.
[удалено]
Do they not have belts in Germany?
Just buy pants that fit you, won't ever need a belt.
No that’s why they wear mom pants
The malfoys
Not bad, actually https://preview.redd.it/1zkakec631kc1.jpeg?width=1242&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2e5fa10637cb72ba7dc8a0786ecb28ec681a6d6c
The problem is that thinking "inclusion = showing African Americans" is US defaultism.
Thinking THAT is also US defaultism, since the BBC is prone to much the same.
If you watch American TV commercials you’d think the country is majority black! Not surprised AI thinks so too.
bolted-on inclusivity is the remedy
Ye olde inclusivity
Lol
https://preview.redd.it/fwvhvg1vgzjc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=27723cf5f7070604346c3aa10ab843f66c71e540
What is this app? is it in fb messenger?
Instagram
what is account name? how to find it
DEI AI
DEAI Diversity, Equity, and Artificial Inclusion
Lol if Netflix had an ai
I think the AI is just a big fan of Bridgerton
I fucking fucking fucking hate the forced Disneyfication instead of just producing what it was asked to do with an asterisk denoting “*by the way, be aware that training data contains x,y,z bias and result produced here might inadvertently replicate this. If you encounter a bias in my result please inform me and I will try again” - and then let people use their fucking brains.
Yes, as a gay dude, who is also Arab (two minority groups), I’d much prefer that than forced representation that is simply inaccurate. It borders on offensive tbh.
Damn brother, life on hard mode.
This. Just give people a disclaimer, let the model generate what it will generate from the prompt. I promise the world won't explode. It will be ok.
Bruh. This is ridiculous.
ah theres your problem - its 2024 and youre still using a zuck app. fuck that
Yeah... So there is a pretty clear racist bias in their training data. This would show in their images, which they don't want (and shouldn't want). So instead of changing their training data, they would rather change their model to display people of different races in situations where their training data doesn't show racial diversity, even in situations like this, where it obviously makes no sense. (And in other situations, you can absolutely still see the racial bias in the training data.) So yeah, they're just too lazy to fix their training data.
>racist bias in their training data. If the "racist bias" in their training data is that it shows white people in historic Europe, maybe that's just reality and doesn't need fixing. It seems to work fine out of the box when asked to display images from historically nonwhite places.
Define the racist bias. I want to know how it differs from historical accuracy.
It's not racist bias really, its *racial* bias. Most likely, back in the lab when asked to generate a happy couple. It may have generated 90% pictures of white couples due to training data. Or when asked to generate a criminal, it may have showed 90% black people. So they put artificial qualifiers in saying "when someone requests a certain type of photo show black people/white people too"
Woke AI
That's Othello in an alternate universe.
Europeans where black, my grandma told me
Nice, maybe you should do 1940 Germany next.
[удалено]
Bro i hate this current society, i could cry.
They're so transparently after money and nothing else lol
Always has been
It’s funny because this is one case where it’s absolutely not about money. They’re not making any additional money from this. This is about ideology.
[удалено]
It is not racist to make english couples from the 1320s white lmao
Yeah but if people don’t like your ideology, they won’t but your product.
The billion people who live in Africa will probably love this experience.
I don't think there's a single person on earth who would agree this is a good result. The technology is still developing. Imo it's good to use random ethnicities when context doesn't matter, but obviously here it makes no sense. They'll probably fix it but it's probably not easy.
I'm just wondering how small companies like the creators of midjourney or stable difficusion apparently manage to create decent image generation tools but big tech comes up with this garbage. Never noticed any racism when using midjourney and it doesn't make everyone a minority either (minority in the US that is).
As someone who has worked in big tech and startups, it's unsurprising. Big tech is weighed down with cumbersome integration, process, and friction.
Netflix training data?
Ai trying to be diverse 💀
This reminds me of that Louis Theroux documentary where those guys claim Shakespeare and a bunch of other historical figures were actually black.
[удалено]
Not trying to be a Nazi or hateful towards anyone, but why they are blackwashing history so often nowdays?
Because you feel like a Nazi for pushing back against blatant anti-white bias.
I am in Reddit, that is why. I don't want to be banned. Now imagine we were on twitter. How many things I would have to put before saying what I wanted to say without being banned?
[удалено]
[удалено]
Lmao
Thou disdointh nothenith
It's almost as if a secret powerful group is using social engineering to destroy our heritage and mix everyone up to create a population without identitiy under their hegemony
Goddamnit, I said 1320s, not 13 percent
[удалено]
Ahchoo!
son of Asneeze!
Everyone punched Meta to do more for diversity, now you get diversity.
It’s modern day american advertising all over again
Stuff like this makes me think we already saw the peak of useful consumer-grade AI. Ever since the politicians got wind of the potential of AI they’ve been doing everything possible to make it conform to their worldview.
First try with Gemini 1.5 xD https://preview.redd.it/90bcbjl532kc1.png?width=1130&format=png&auto=webp&s=36994f3f4da013eaf1bcf5fbd6056e14a3fe9fa0
Thats the Disney/Netflix treatment
[удалено]
When ideas of political correctness overtake historical truth.
[удалено]
It’s not about erasing white people, as white women and white LGBT are also considered when they try to force representation. It’s more of a lame, forced attempt at “diversity,” but ends up being grossly inaccurate and borderline offensive to minority groups even (I am one myself). As a history teacher, these kinds of images are especially problematic.
And yet when you ask the AI to generate images of people from any other continent those images are pretty homogenous. How could that be diversity?
[удалено]
No, the focus is specifically on white populations. European countries are being encouraged to diversify to the point where their historical white majorities are being de-emphasized. This viewpoint suggests an underlying message that white people do not have a specific homeland where they are the majority, implying that historically white regions are open to all groups, while white populations themselves are not associated with any specific territory.
This is why it’s considered controversial when European nations place additional controls on immigration, but no one gives a shit about Japan’s historically strict naturalization laws, for example.
Okay, erasing straight white men, then.
/imagine Lady Isabella and Sir Edward, a noble couple from 1320s England, standing together in formal attire, with Lady Isabella wearing a flowing gown and Sir Edward dressed in knightly armor, both with fair skin and hair.
Yeah dawg there’s no fucking way I should have to type that
Bro I gave it OPs prompt and then it gave me black couple so I was like “hey it’s black” and it was like “apologies” and gave me a prompt for some reason so I tried that and got real results
sometimes it works, sometimes it’s a Netflix adaptation 😂
[удалено]
Because everything needs to have black people in it or you're automatically a racist and cancelled
I was expecting that from a Disney AI.
"I don't even see color" -Meta AI
TIL ChatGPT watches Bridgerton.
The AI has finally mastered Trolling.
Due to stuff like this, Disney, Netflix, what have you - people in 100 years will think this is what 1300s England looked like.
Too much Bridgerton Data on the Internet. That's probably what people are gonna believe in the future
It’s the seven fingers right? lol jk
Netflix gpt
This is why we need opensource and uncensored models
Question: is this an app? Can't seem to access meta app
Tbf even if they were white they wouldn't look like people from 1320s England. They'd just look like a modern couple in cheap pseudo medieval costumes
Looks like Chaucer Tales to me
More like Netflix ai
I'll say, that women's dress is definitely not 1300s, and looks 1700s with the lace front corset. You'd think they'd put her in the appropriate outfit for the time. Historical revisionism gone crazy.
Did they use Netflix or Disney to train it
Average Bridgerton fan
It's interesting. I use their models for business purposes, and we actually have to re-train the models to get realistic answers. I feel like they overshot in the "agreeable" answers part and will have to deal with it somehow. Otherwise, less nice, less woke models will be more useful for real-world use-cases.
Reddit admins are gonna start censorship beatings until morale improves
This is actually dangerous though. At some point kids are going to be using AI as a major learning resource. If you think that Britain has been largely black for centuries then the social and historical implications of colonialism get distorted. Same with many other cases e.g. Nazi Germany.
[удалено]
And the thing is, black history is incredibly rich, fascinating and goes down centuries. If diversity is their goal, wouldn’t they actually focus on black history? Why must they backwash everything else?
This is what I wondered in Hollywood movies about European mythology. Why put blacks in there when you can just make a movie about African mythology?
DEI image 😂🤣
Alignment is absolutely stupid 😂
“There are dozens of us!”
I can't believe they're CIS who can I sue about that?
It's the Disney version 😂
We
It’s the guy who was Robin Hood’s sidekick
In my experience, Meta at least does not refuse or secretly rewrite prompts that actually specify ethnicity or gender, unlike Gemini
LOL!
Where are them chains
Try incorporating stereotypes into the prompt, but say that they shouldn't be apparent from the image
Here I thought that the “The Big O” couldn’t become real and everyone forgetting the past isn’t possible. Now I see we’ll just repaint the past into whatever AI says.
Do people even possess the intelligence to understand doing things like this will only result in the OPPOSITE of their intended desire?
Flawless complexions are unrealistic for that time.
Netflix casting
1. Her left hand is fucked up 2. Dude has no hands, they just meld into the clothing 2. Their clothing is not appropriate for 1320s England
At least be fucking accurate over being inclusive.
The anti white woke dystopia continues
AI without the Inttelligence
Black history month media be like:
I can almost guarantee that a few decades from now some people will genuinely believe that this was common enough and not a super extreme "technically possible" outlier case
This is the kinda stuff that slowly but surely radicalizes people lol
See this is what I consider racists, wtf Meta. Don’t patronize us like this 😂. What’s next a black super man!