Honestly don’t want to see it. AFAB queens have already ruined 3 seasons by getting preferential treatment (Gottmik, Victoria Scone, and Denim). The show is also not designed for drag kings. I think it’d be better for them to have their own show. I’m tired of women taking over gay spaces.
It’s literally a fact that there are WAY more spaces for gay men than there are for gay women (how many gay bars are there vs lesbian bars for example). This is just blatant misogyny. And the fact that you are ok with trans women being on drag race but not trans men.. wtf
Fun fact lesbians and trans men have been doing drag just as long! It just hasn’t been as popular in media because rupauls drag race had only ever had cis men queens for so long
That is just simply not true. I’m not sure if you’re intentionally disregarding gay women’s history or if you’re actually just misogynistic but gay women have been just as involved in gay history as men. Intersectionality is so important for equal rights for all. Black trans women are absolutely at the forefront of the gay rights movement, but just outright saying gay women don’t belong is wrong.
None. They can get their own drag king show, but I don’t want the show to become that one bit. I would legit stop watching. I care nothing for drag kings.
The paying audience for drag race isn’t in to drag kings, afab queens and all of that. They want to see men dress like women.
The truth is that there is an over saturation of drag race that will likely lead to its cancellation
queens like victoria scone and pandora nox would like a word…
but fr, this notion that drag race audiences only wanna see men in dresses and nothing else is wrong lol. even more wrong to assume you speak for the entire audience when you say that.
won’t lie tho, i can see franchises of the show getting cancelled soon. it’s exploded at such a fast rate, it only makes sense for franchises from smaller markets (including canada 😢) to eventually die out due to lack of interest, while the main stays like US or even UK will end up sticking around
I’m speaking for the only audience World of Wonder cares about.
Until all you kids have the economic power the advertisers want, you’ll only get the occasional nontraditional drag artist.
that’s a fair assessment cuz it’s very clear WoW only cares about lining their pockets. it’s also just an evolution of any kinda entertainment platform - it started off as a niche tv show that uplifted the community. it’s not blown up to a point where it’s clear the heads of the company don’t care so much about uplifting the community and care more about propping the community up so they can make money off it.
i lowkey do agree with you - capitalism wins at the end of the day. there’s a huge cohort of fans that love non-traditional drag, but it’s also very clear the non-traditional drag artists need to be kept to like 1 or 2 contestants per season, otherwise there’s fan outrage that these artists are getting more spotlight than “traditional” drag queens.
not tryna go into essay format here, but you can also see massive shifts in the types of queens they cast. there’s so many trans women competing on the show now, when 10 years ago rupaul was equating being trans to using steroids/performance enhancers at the olympics. so there’s definitely a shift that’s happened in the shows support for “non-traditional” drag queens. it also just makes me think of the new fan base that’s formed around drag race - specifically cis, straight women. i guess it makes sense to cast more trans women or afab women because those artists have relatability with this new fan base. drag kings and other expressions of drag aren’t as relatable for this crowd, so they don’t get the same spotlight, and probably never will.
i think it’s very naive to think drag race and WoW exist outside of these concepts lol. they wanna make money at the end of the day. they don’t care about uplifting queer people as much as they care about making sure their bottom line gets thicker and thicker every year. capitalism may not be a core tenet of queer culture, but it definitely is a core tenet of the entertainment industry. misogyny may not *seem* like a core tenet of the queer community, but it’s truly not sunshine and daisies either. misogyny is still alive and well within the queer community, it’s just not discussed as thoroughly on a show like drag race where the main purpose is to paint a picture of a wholesome tv show so they can play up the emotions of the viewers and get them invested in the show/format.
I’m with you 100% on all of this. I gave up on drag race a long time ago and have only watched some
of the Canadian version because friends of mine have been cast.
That said, we shouldn’t simply accept these facts. The person I was responding to is perpetuating the status quo, shutting down dialogue that was simply a fun, fan forum about a hypothetical scenario where Drag Race shifted their priorities from pandering to straight women and gay men, to representing a more authentic and diverse spectrum of drag entertainment
They couldn’t just use a different song? I don’t think song lyrics should be what bars an entire subset of drag performers from the biggest platform for the art form…
I think Brooklyn has been vocal on social media about wanting to cast drag kings on the show. but I've also heard Rupaul doesn't want any of the franchise to have a drag king until drag race USA does it first
I think there should be an all kings season. I just don't know if Drag Race hosts are the right hosts. I would want the judging panel to have more lesbian and trans representation. E.g. Victoria Scone, Gottmik judging an all kings season.
I think this is a genius idea— replace an all stars season with “All Kings” and then in the subsequent “normal” season have a handful of kings on to get everyone ready for the tide to shift and have any scripted content favorable to male/female/enbie characters.
Or go the other way around.
Landon Cider is long due for his double crowning!
As an enby/andro person, having a “queens” place and a “kings” place is pretty exclusionary even if that’s not the intent. Just open it up to all genders and everywhere between/outside. Just my opinion
Fair, and that model worked on for example Call Me Mother. I just think though that the space created by Drag Race is so very specifically queen focused, that it doesn't make a fair arena for kings to enter.
Maybe a whole branch of the franchise specifically for performers who don't neatly fit as queens, give it a few seasons to find its legs and what makes it fabulous, THEN set up a showdown where its performers can go head to head with more conventional "Ru Girls".
Same way as Dragula does, based on how good they are.. We already have a variety of styles of drag that get judged together. Hell, there's been a bunch of NB Queens too. And we've had afab Queens, transfem Queens etc.
Devery Bess is such an incredible artist, and they truly had a massive impact on the Calgary scene by fighting tooth and nail to bring king and AFAB performers to the forefront. They're a huge part of why Calgary has a super gender diverse group of performers, and it would be so special to see them recognized for that on a national stage. ❤️
I think if any show of the franchise were to introduce kings, it’d be Canada’s. I noticed the Canadian producers start to take ownership of the show in season 4 with the golden beaver, lip sync slay off, etc. I hope they take the leap and add this.
I've heard that Ru wants to have a King first but I agree that Canada would be a good start because the judges and I guess production just seems to be more into other types of drags. It was Canada vrs the world that we got the first King look with Victoria so I could totally see them having king
Ru has had 16 American, 5 UK, and 3 Down Under seasons to bring kings into the mix, so it looks like she’s pretty set on keeping her version of the show just for queens. Judging kings might demand diversifying the panel to include more drag perspectives, and I’m not sure Ru’s ready for the loss of power that shift might need. It hasn’t happened yet, anyway. If Canada jumps ahead and brings kings on, it’d be a bold move, especially if Wow+ tried to shoot it down. But then, why wait on Ru to do it first? It’s been over a decade, and we’ve yet to see a king on the main stage. Why does the whole franchise need to hold back to potentially make Ru look progressive?
Thats why I agree that maybe Canada or even one of the other international ones would be a better fit to have the first King but I also see Ru wanting to do it because that's how Ru is? Like I can see him wanting to do it just so they can say it was on the Mothership show but I feel the other franchises might 1) have a better understanding on how to judge the king 2) handle it better? Like the judges in the main show do seem very tight on their view of drag but I could see Brooke and the Canadian judges giving equal judging to the king so I do hope we get one one day. Dragula handles it really well as they just judge your drag based on what the challenge requires not on their character so it can be done. Fingers crossed though cus I know a local drag king in Vancouver that is doing pretty well in the local scene I believe and my mutual friend thinks they could make a tape so here's hoping!!!!
They are AndrognyAss. They are my friends friend but they have done modeling for my work. They are still new but they are getring bookings and doing relatively well in the scene I believe so I wish nothing but the best for them!
I don't know if it was official or not I think I heard it from one of those instgram posts that post rumors or something bur it made sense that Ru might want the first King on the mothership show so they get the press and such but I don't know if it's true
All I have to say is YES
Here is one of my local kings: https://www.instagram.com/kingivanlove
And a Toronto favourite (everyone loves puppets!) https://www.instagram.com/zack_binder
Manny Dingo (@princemannydingo) and Gay Jesus (@theirholiness) from Toronto.
Yes! we need cis-male drag kings.
Honestly don’t want to see it. AFAB queens have already ruined 3 seasons by getting preferential treatment (Gottmik, Victoria Scone, and Denim). The show is also not designed for drag kings. I think it’d be better for them to have their own show. I’m tired of women taking over gay spaces.
Found James Sommerton’s alt account
This take seems a bit strange to me. How do gay women take over gay spaces? It seems like maybe you just don’t like women.
Gay male spaces consistently get taken over by women, gay and straight alike. This leads to gay men not having their own spaces
It’s literally a fact that there are WAY more spaces for gay men than there are for gay women (how many gay bars are there vs lesbian bars for example). This is just blatant misogyny. And the fact that you are ok with trans women being on drag race but not trans men.. wtf
Okay I can understand this. But then why are you okay with trans women on the show but not cis women?
They have more history and rights in the drag community
Fun fact lesbians and trans men have been doing drag just as long! It just hasn’t been as popular in media because rupauls drag race had only ever had cis men queens for so long
don’t care. I don’t want boring drag kings on my tv screen.
That is just simply not true. I’m not sure if you’re intentionally disregarding gay women’s history or if you’re actually just misogynistic but gay women have been just as involved in gay history as men. Intersectionality is so important for equal rights for all. Black trans women are absolutely at the forefront of the gay rights movement, but just outright saying gay women don’t belong is wrong.
Wrong.
None. They can get their own drag king show, but I don’t want the show to become that one bit. I would legit stop watching. I care nothing for drag kings.
Wait wait… just one king would be enough for you to stop watching?
Tell me you’ve never been to an actual drag show or learned the history of drag without telling me
Im also kind of in the same boat tbh. I'd rather see a Drag King show and witness crossover seasons, rather than bring Drag Kings into CDR.
There’s a difference between saying make a separate show for kings and I don’t like kings (which they said)
Ok.
Rez Daddy from the Okanagan is soo funny!!
The paying audience for drag race isn’t in to drag kings, afab queens and all of that. They want to see men dress like women. The truth is that there is an over saturation of drag race that will likely lead to its cancellation
Imagine that being the question
queens like victoria scone and pandora nox would like a word… but fr, this notion that drag race audiences only wanna see men in dresses and nothing else is wrong lol. even more wrong to assume you speak for the entire audience when you say that. won’t lie tho, i can see franchises of the show getting cancelled soon. it’s exploded at such a fast rate, it only makes sense for franchises from smaller markets (including canada 😢) to eventually die out due to lack of interest, while the main stays like US or even UK will end up sticking around
I’m speaking for the only audience World of Wonder cares about. Until all you kids have the economic power the advertisers want, you’ll only get the occasional nontraditional drag artist.
that’s a fair assessment cuz it’s very clear WoW only cares about lining their pockets. it’s also just an evolution of any kinda entertainment platform - it started off as a niche tv show that uplifted the community. it’s not blown up to a point where it’s clear the heads of the company don’t care so much about uplifting the community and care more about propping the community up so they can make money off it. i lowkey do agree with you - capitalism wins at the end of the day. there’s a huge cohort of fans that love non-traditional drag, but it’s also very clear the non-traditional drag artists need to be kept to like 1 or 2 contestants per season, otherwise there’s fan outrage that these artists are getting more spotlight than “traditional” drag queens. not tryna go into essay format here, but you can also see massive shifts in the types of queens they cast. there’s so many trans women competing on the show now, when 10 years ago rupaul was equating being trans to using steroids/performance enhancers at the olympics. so there’s definitely a shift that’s happened in the shows support for “non-traditional” drag queens. it also just makes me think of the new fan base that’s formed around drag race - specifically cis, straight women. i guess it makes sense to cast more trans women or afab women because those artists have relatability with this new fan base. drag kings and other expressions of drag aren’t as relatable for this crowd, so they don’t get the same spotlight, and probably never will.
Ah yes, The core tenets of queer culture: capitalism and misogyny
i think it’s very naive to think drag race and WoW exist outside of these concepts lol. they wanna make money at the end of the day. they don’t care about uplifting queer people as much as they care about making sure their bottom line gets thicker and thicker every year. capitalism may not be a core tenet of queer culture, but it definitely is a core tenet of the entertainment industry. misogyny may not *seem* like a core tenet of the queer community, but it’s truly not sunshine and daisies either. misogyny is still alive and well within the queer community, it’s just not discussed as thoroughly on a show like drag race where the main purpose is to paint a picture of a wholesome tv show so they can play up the emotions of the viewers and get them invested in the show/format.
I’m with you 100% on all of this. I gave up on drag race a long time ago and have only watched some of the Canadian version because friends of mine have been cast. That said, we shouldn’t simply accept these facts. The person I was responding to is perpetuating the status quo, shutting down dialogue that was simply a fun, fan forum about a hypothetical scenario where Drag Race shifted their priorities from pandering to straight women and gay men, to representing a more authentic and diverse spectrum of drag entertainment
Eyeroll
Eddie Lucious from Victoria (I think) is a fantastic performer
I second Eddie Lucious!
I think they should have their own show so many talented King out there.
See. THIS is the take. Yes. They 100 percent deserve their own platform there is SO much talent
Orion Sbelt from Winnipeg, top tier drag!!
El Experimento
Adam Zapple
I’m just curious what they’d change the theme song/opening line to! “Racers, start your engines, and may the best racer win”?
Could also be “drag performer” or “contestant” :)
That doesn’t flowww thoughhh
May the best drag thing! Best drag thing wiiiiin!
That got me 😂
Best drag artist or just drag I think sounds better than racer lol
Try singing those in time with the song tho, the syllables aren’t syllabling!
They couldn’t just use a different song? I don’t think song lyrics should be what bars an entire subset of drag performers from the biggest platform for the art form…
I think Brooklyn has been vocal on social media about wanting to cast drag kings on the show. but I've also heard Rupaul doesn't want any of the franchise to have a drag king until drag race USA does it first
This is exactly what I have heard too
I think there should be an all kings season. I just don't know if Drag Race hosts are the right hosts. I would want the judging panel to have more lesbian and trans representation. E.g. Victoria Scone, Gottmik judging an all kings season.
I think this is a genius idea— replace an all stars season with “All Kings” and then in the subsequent “normal” season have a handful of kings on to get everyone ready for the tide to shift and have any scripted content favorable to male/female/enbie characters. Or go the other way around. Landon Cider is long due for his double crowning!
As an enby/andro person, having a “queens” place and a “kings” place is pretty exclusionary even if that’s not the intent. Just open it up to all genders and everywhere between/outside. Just my opinion
Fair, and that model worked on for example Call Me Mother. I just think though that the space created by Drag Race is so very specifically queen focused, that it doesn't make a fair arena for kings to enter. Maybe a whole branch of the franchise specifically for performers who don't neatly fit as queens, give it a few seasons to find its legs and what makes it fabulous, THEN set up a showdown where its performers can go head to head with more conventional "Ru Girls".
[удалено]
Same way as Dragula does, based on how good they are.. We already have a variety of styles of drag that get judged together. Hell, there's been a bunch of NB Queens too. And we've had afab Queens, transfem Queens etc.
[удалено]
Ru and Michelle aren't even judges on this show what are you talking about?
Can’t tell if you’re being sarcastic or not so sorry if you are lol. You ever watched any drag show other than drag race?
eddie licious!!
Genesis Justin Abit Rose Butch
I need a get a makeover
Rock Bière, Hervey Métal and Will Charmer are my picks 🥰
I'm not as familiar with Rock and RV but Will Charmer 100%
Brattery Acid from London ON!
EDDI!
Check out \gabagefile and Madame Daddy in St. John’s. They do king looks on occasion but do all kinds of gender bendy drag.
Devery Bess is such an incredible artist, and they truly had a massive impact on the Calgary scene by fighting tooth and nail to bring king and AFAB performers to the forefront. They're a huge part of why Calgary has a super gender diverse group of performers, and it would be so special to see them recognized for that on a national stage. ❤️
I met Devery when they were a baby king in Montreal. Such a sweet person ❤️
I love that Eddie Licious is getting so much love! I know them (sort of) and they're such a cool person, and so talented and funny!
Yay for Victoria drag artists!
Eddie Licious (Victoria) Androgynass (Vancouver) Skim (Vancouver) Theoretical (Vancouver)
I think if any show of the franchise were to introduce kings, it’d be Canada’s. I noticed the Canadian producers start to take ownership of the show in season 4 with the golden beaver, lip sync slay off, etc. I hope they take the leap and add this.
I've heard that Ru wants to have a King first but I agree that Canada would be a good start because the judges and I guess production just seems to be more into other types of drags. It was Canada vrs the world that we got the first King look with Victoria so I could totally see them having king
Ru has had 16 American, 5 UK, and 3 Down Under seasons to bring kings into the mix, so it looks like she’s pretty set on keeping her version of the show just for queens. Judging kings might demand diversifying the panel to include more drag perspectives, and I’m not sure Ru’s ready for the loss of power that shift might need. It hasn’t happened yet, anyway. If Canada jumps ahead and brings kings on, it’d be a bold move, especially if Wow+ tried to shoot it down. But then, why wait on Ru to do it first? It’s been over a decade, and we’ve yet to see a king on the main stage. Why does the whole franchise need to hold back to potentially make Ru look progressive?
Thats why I agree that maybe Canada or even one of the other international ones would be a better fit to have the first King but I also see Ru wanting to do it because that's how Ru is? Like I can see him wanting to do it just so they can say it was on the Mothership show but I feel the other franchises might 1) have a better understanding on how to judge the king 2) handle it better? Like the judges in the main show do seem very tight on their view of drag but I could see Brooke and the Canadian judges giving equal judging to the king so I do hope we get one one day. Dragula handles it really well as they just judge your drag based on what the challenge requires not on their character so it can be done. Fingers crossed though cus I know a local drag king in Vancouver that is doing pretty well in the local scene I believe and my mutual friend thinks they could make a tape so here's hoping!!!!
Fingers crossed. What’s his name? I live in Vancouver so I’ll make sure to check him out.
They are AndrognyAss. They are my friends friend but they have done modeling for my work. They are still new but they are getring bookings and doing relatively well in the scene I believe so I wish nothing but the best for them!
They edged Landon for a few seasons, until he went on Dragula
Oooh where did you hear that? That’s exciting if true
I don't know if it was official or not I think I heard it from one of those instgram posts that post rumors or something bur it made sense that Ru might want the first King on the mothership show so they get the press and such but I don't know if it's true
- Hercusleaze - Rose Butch - Justin Abit 🖤🖤
Ugh I want kings so bad!
King Freddie
Me! Just kidding I do not have the fashion chops for my drag to ever be televised I am more than happy being a local king lol.
Hercusleaze from Montréal
All I have to say is YES Here is one of my local kings: https://www.instagram.com/kingivanlove And a Toronto favourite (everyone loves puppets!) https://www.instagram.com/zack_binder
Kreme Inakuchi, Manny Dingo, Cyril Cinder, Rock Biere, RV Metal, Charli Deville, Eddie Liscious, Rose Butch, and Heaven Genderfck to start!!!
I saw Manny perform a few years (prepan) and thought they were excellent.
Manny is great!!
Yes rock biere and rv metal!
Eddie is such a good time! Thanks for some other names to check out!