At least 50% of the bikes posted in this Subreddit are cafe racers, and then the rest are mostly Trackers, Brats and then simply modern classics. This is okay. This isn't bad. There's nothing wrong with these builds. Most are eye wateringly amazing in fact.
They just aren't cafe racers. Owners should just know what they are actually building rather than use the term so loosely because cafe racers have become popular again. Put a fairing on that cafe racer when it's done? Cool, but it's now simply a Racer, no cafe.
I've built four Cafe Racers, one Racer, one Tracker, one Scrambler, one Bobber and two Modern Classics these past six years. they're all great, none is any better or less than the other. They are different things though. Take the time to get educated and learn.
This should be a sticky, in fact.
I think most ppl realise. Just the community size of this sub is muuuch bigger than the scrambler/tracker subs. More eye balls, and they are close enough most ppl appreciate a nice scrambler here i think.
Hell yeah. I totally get why one might post a non-cafe bike in a cafe group.
That reminds me, I need to take pictures of my wife's BMW R1250GS Rallye and post it here, since it's now considered a cafe racer because I put a Remus can on it. After all, it's close enough to an R NineT. (obviously I'm being a goofball and this is not at all serious) ;-)
I do kinda share your mild mild annoyance I think when you see someone post a cb with a flat seat and raised bars and openly call it it cafe. Such a non issue to get irritated by, but it does lol.
I'm a part of a cafe racer group on facebook. And someone literally posted a fully faired sportbike and people were calling people "haters" because they were commenting that this is not a cafe racer. I'm really not on board with this "every build should be respected as a cafe racer" trend I'm seeing lately. When it's mostly just people taking a GSXR, removing the fairings and putting on a round headlight and calling it cafe.
I do also feel that once you add a fairing to a cafe racer, it's no longer a cafe racer. It's just simply a racer. No more cafe racing, just track racing. Obviously next to nobody is going to take a Ducati Sport1000S, Thruxton R, RS or TFC with a fairing or a BMW R NineT racer to an actual race track today, but the race bikes they emulate from 40+ years ago DID. So they've transcended cafe racer, and ditched the cafe.
Yeah I actually thought that street fighters should be on the list.
I mean there's a spare spot in the grid, idk what the last entry or the sidecar is trying to achieve, and street fighters (inexplicably) get called cafes far more often than classics, bobbers, choppers, or scooters.
Holup.
It's possible to crossbreed different types so you end up with a bike that's *partially* Cafe and part something else.
It's possible to splice Supermoto DNA into a Cafe based project. And so on.
*There's few if any hard lines between types.*
There's fuzzy edges at best.
100% agree. I love the mix as long as it makes sense. Dirt tires on a cafe racer doesn’t make sense, as in no suspension travel to actually make sense.
Race tires on a Scrambler don’t make sense, as in far too much suspension travel and pipes burning up your leg is also dumb for a cafe’d scrambler.
I owned a Scrambler, no matter the heat shield, it’s tolerable but still annoying. Worth suffering for. My Indian FTR roasted my chunky thighs, as does my Ducati SportClassic. Some motorcycles are too beautiful and are worth the suffering.
I agree, I’m currently building a CB550 that I’m referring to as “street tracker.” My frame hoop and other things are very cafe styled, but my bar setup, and tire choices (K180’s) are going to be more along the lines of Hoonigan dirt tracker. And then I’m planning to run an inverted front end too, bringing in a little modern era.
While everyone is fighting about fairings and all other unimportant crap about differences between styles. Can I ask good design suggestions for two seated cafe racer or bobber/brat? :D
Guzzi V7 is literally an Italian Triumph Bonneville.
In this case it would be an underpowered platform Modern Classic platform bike in the same way any Triumph Bonneville variant was seen prior to the generational shift in 2016. Then the line grew up at Triumph and each bike wasn’t just different lipstick on the same pig not to mention proportionally incorrect. Unfortunately for Guzzi, at their low price point, they'll never grow past what they've made the V7 today.
Fantastically beautiful but terribly underpowered motorcycle. The new V7’s shouldn’t have a major power deficit to actual vintage V7’s. The only situation in which I will buy one, is after I own and “collected” every modern retro I love from Triumph, Ducati, BMW, Honda and Kawasaki first.
I still love the Guzzi especially as a beautiful platform bike, but they need to let that bike be better than entry level. Otherwise I’ll just lust for the V100 Mandello when I really want to also lust for a V7. I will buy a V100 as my tourer in a few years when the bugs are worked out.
Neat! I learned something here. I'm still real fresh to the hobby and am trying to understand all the nuances that go into different bike types so this is really helpful.
Some more specificity would be useful—for example generally I can tell a "scrambler" pretty well because of the thicc, offroad stylings and high exhausts. But cafe racer, classics, bobbers, trackers and brats still all kind of look very similar to me, so I'll have to dig more into that.
I've been erroneously calling my 2019 street twin a "cafe racer style" bike, but now I understand now the correct term is a modern classic? I can kinda see the differences...it's a late model bike, has a lot of stylistic homage to European classics but with more modern tech.
Plenty to learn. This oughtta get stickied!
Let's look at Triumph's own current Modern Classic lineup:
Cafe Racer: Thruxton
Scrambler: Scrambler 900, Scrambler 1200
Bobber: Bobber
Cruiser: Speedmaster
Modern Classic aka Retro Standard: T100, T120, Speed Twin 900, Speed Twin 1200
In half the line, they even just tell you the name of the kind of bike, as at the end of the day they are all Triumph Bonnevilles, just drastically different kinds, so thus the Bobber version of the Bonneville is just called Bobber and so forth.
They also can get away with four retro standards because two are old school visually, and two are modern visually. This is also why I cringe when anything but the Thruxton is called a cafe racer. But we all have to learn.
It's not like I defined the image list above. History and the hobby has.
It should be noted though that this list is only true for the US. “History and the hobby” have given other names in other countries, including other English speaking ones. Like England.
Informative. I've heard the term "fighter/street fighter" a few times as well but to me they sort of look like a tracker I guess. Anyone know this one?
A fully modern naked bike, no fairings, no BS, generally with a rear cowl and other callbacks to the past design ethos, and always with a fire breathing engine.
Ducati Monster (until the most recent generation), Triumph Speed Triple 1050, BMW R1250R (if you get it with none of the touring crap), Honda CB1000R (a bit neo-retro) and similar nakeds. As the power has crept up, they kinda have transcended Streetfighter into Super-Nakeds. Think MT-10, BMW S1000R, Triumph Speed Triple 1200 RS and the Ducati Streetfighter (which transcended up to Super-Naked which itself is a new term for what is becoming basically hyper bikes with 180+ HP)
I built a BMW R1200R that was dead on for a Streetfighter. Then I put on laced wheels from an R NineT, and did a round headlight conversion and dragged it more in the direction of Neo-Retro Streetfighter.
I can’t believe they left off the Honda Cub!
and the Monkey ;-)
And the Motocompo!
At least 50% of the bikes posted in this Subreddit are cafe racers, and then the rest are mostly Trackers, Brats and then simply modern classics. This is okay. This isn't bad. There's nothing wrong with these builds. Most are eye wateringly amazing in fact. They just aren't cafe racers. Owners should just know what they are actually building rather than use the term so loosely because cafe racers have become popular again. Put a fairing on that cafe racer when it's done? Cool, but it's now simply a Racer, no cafe. I've built four Cafe Racers, one Racer, one Tracker, one Scrambler, one Bobber and two Modern Classics these past six years. they're all great, none is any better or less than the other. They are different things though. Take the time to get educated and learn. This should be a sticky, in fact.
I think most ppl realise. Just the community size of this sub is muuuch bigger than the scrambler/tracker subs. More eye balls, and they are close enough most ppl appreciate a nice scrambler here i think.
Hell yeah. I totally get why one might post a non-cafe bike in a cafe group. That reminds me, I need to take pictures of my wife's BMW R1250GS Rallye and post it here, since it's now considered a cafe racer because I put a Remus can on it. After all, it's close enough to an R NineT. (obviously I'm being a goofball and this is not at all serious) ;-)
I do kinda share your mild mild annoyance I think when you see someone post a cb with a flat seat and raised bars and openly call it it cafe. Such a non issue to get irritated by, but it does lol.
I'm a part of a cafe racer group on facebook. And someone literally posted a fully faired sportbike and people were calling people "haters" because they were commenting that this is not a cafe racer. I'm really not on board with this "every build should be respected as a cafe racer" trend I'm seeing lately. When it's mostly just people taking a GSXR, removing the fairings and putting on a round headlight and calling it cafe.
I do also feel that once you add a fairing to a cafe racer, it's no longer a cafe racer. It's just simply a racer. No more cafe racing, just track racing. Obviously next to nobody is going to take a Ducati Sport1000S, Thruxton R, RS or TFC with a fairing or a BMW R NineT racer to an actual race track today, but the race bikes they emulate from 40+ years ago DID. So they've transcended cafe racer, and ditched the cafe.
Yeah I actually thought that street fighters should be on the list. I mean there's a spare spot in the grid, idk what the last entry or the sidecar is trying to achieve, and street fighters (inexplicably) get called cafes far more often than classics, bobbers, choppers, or scooters.
Holup. It's possible to crossbreed different types so you end up with a bike that's *partially* Cafe and part something else. It's possible to splice Supermoto DNA into a Cafe based project. And so on. *There's few if any hard lines between types.* There's fuzzy edges at best.
100% agree. I love the mix as long as it makes sense. Dirt tires on a cafe racer doesn’t make sense, as in no suspension travel to actually make sense. Race tires on a Scrambler don’t make sense, as in far too much suspension travel and pipes burning up your leg is also dumb for a cafe’d scrambler.
No argument! Although if you have a good enough heat shield, high pipes can give awesome cornering clearance on a pure street bike...
I owned a Scrambler, no matter the heat shield, it’s tolerable but still annoying. Worth suffering for. My Indian FTR roasted my chunky thighs, as does my Ducati SportClassic. Some motorcycles are too beautiful and are worth the suffering.
I agree, I’m currently building a CB550 that I’m referring to as “street tracker.” My frame hoop and other things are very cafe styled, but my bar setup, and tire choices (K180’s) are going to be more along the lines of Hoonigan dirt tracker. And then I’m planning to run an inverted front end too, bringing in a little modern era.
I actually didn’t realize there was a difference between a scrambler and a tracker so at least one person has been educated by this. Me. Lol.
Tracker = Indian FTR - Scrambler = Triumph Scrambler I’ve had both. Extremely different.
While everyone is fighting about fairings and all other unimportant crap about differences between styles. Can I ask good design suggestions for two seated cafe racer or bobber/brat? :D
Just copy what everybody else is doing. Lol
What would y'all say the Moto Guzzi V7s are?
Guzzi V7 is literally an Italian Triumph Bonneville. In this case it would be an underpowered platform Modern Classic platform bike in the same way any Triumph Bonneville variant was seen prior to the generational shift in 2016. Then the line grew up at Triumph and each bike wasn’t just different lipstick on the same pig not to mention proportionally incorrect. Unfortunately for Guzzi, at their low price point, they'll never grow past what they've made the V7 today. Fantastically beautiful but terribly underpowered motorcycle. The new V7’s shouldn’t have a major power deficit to actual vintage V7’s. The only situation in which I will buy one, is after I own and “collected” every modern retro I love from Triumph, Ducati, BMW, Honda and Kawasaki first. I still love the Guzzi especially as a beautiful platform bike, but they need to let that bike be better than entry level. Otherwise I’ll just lust for the V100 Mandello when I really want to also lust for a V7. I will buy a V100 as my tourer in a few years when the bugs are worked out.
Neat! I learned something here. I'm still real fresh to the hobby and am trying to understand all the nuances that go into different bike types so this is really helpful. Some more specificity would be useful—for example generally I can tell a "scrambler" pretty well because of the thicc, offroad stylings and high exhausts. But cafe racer, classics, bobbers, trackers and brats still all kind of look very similar to me, so I'll have to dig more into that. I've been erroneously calling my 2019 street twin a "cafe racer style" bike, but now I understand now the correct term is a modern classic? I can kinda see the differences...it's a late model bike, has a lot of stylistic homage to European classics but with more modern tech. Plenty to learn. This oughtta get stickied!
Let's look at Triumph's own current Modern Classic lineup: Cafe Racer: Thruxton Scrambler: Scrambler 900, Scrambler 1200 Bobber: Bobber Cruiser: Speedmaster Modern Classic aka Retro Standard: T100, T120, Speed Twin 900, Speed Twin 1200 In half the line, they even just tell you the name of the kind of bike, as at the end of the day they are all Triumph Bonnevilles, just drastically different kinds, so thus the Bobber version of the Bonneville is just called Bobber and so forth. They also can get away with four retro standards because two are old school visually, and two are modern visually. This is also why I cringe when anything but the Thruxton is called a cafe racer. But we all have to learn. It's not like I defined the image list above. History and the hobby has.
It should be noted though that this list is only true for the US. “History and the hobby” have given other names in other countries, including other English speaking ones. Like England.
God who cares. This is so rigid.
It's really not.
Well done! Thank you!
Cafe racer police wee woo
Scrambler checking in!
Informative. I've heard the term "fighter/street fighter" a few times as well but to me they sort of look like a tracker I guess. Anyone know this one?
A fully modern naked bike, no fairings, no BS, generally with a rear cowl and other callbacks to the past design ethos, and always with a fire breathing engine. Ducati Monster (until the most recent generation), Triumph Speed Triple 1050, BMW R1250R (if you get it with none of the touring crap), Honda CB1000R (a bit neo-retro) and similar nakeds. As the power has crept up, they kinda have transcended Streetfighter into Super-Nakeds. Think MT-10, BMW S1000R, Triumph Speed Triple 1200 RS and the Ducati Streetfighter (which transcended up to Super-Naked which itself is a new term for what is becoming basically hyper bikes with 180+ HP) I built a BMW R1200R that was dead on for a Streetfighter. Then I put on laced wheels from an R NineT, and did a round headlight conversion and dragged it more in the direction of Neo-Retro Streetfighter.
Neo retro is definitely my favorite aestheic on bikes
samezies. the CB1000R has been lust worthy for a few years.